A in depth look into the Benjamin Trail PART 1
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- Опубликовано: 10 сен 2024
- Part 1
I found four things that could be causing bad groups on this outstanding rifle !
Also I show how to disassemble the wood stock, receiver and trigger with tips to get you back again with no problems
Long time no post Mike. Excellent job man. Glad to see all is well. Keep it up and thank you very much
Thanks Rich
It's great to see you back on video. Your instructional tips and videos are great. Thanks for all the effort to bring them to the air gun community.
Thank you !
I believe this was the best and most informative video as it relates to air rifle tuning I’ve ever watched. 1st the clarity or resolution and angle it was shot at was perfect! Very easy to hear as well. You covered everything really well. Some one on the air rifle forums had a link to this. So glad they did that! Love those guy’s!
You have a gift Mike at making things understandable and not over complicating it! A lot of people can tune these air rifles but it may be a lot harder to follow for one reason or another when they are making a video. I still appreciate what they do but this was top notch! Thank you for sharing your knowledge and ideas to the AR community!
You have to see part two its a game changer
A master class. wow. thank you for a GREAT video. any guy that ever turned a wrench is now able to work on their crosman. Best video ever !
Hi Mike, good to see you again with these excellent videos. Thanks and have a nice weekend.
Thank You , I took a air gun break for a good while
@@MrSteppingstone888 there’s good money in custom rimfire rifles
@@lucabrasi5070 Yes there would be, the rim fire guns I have no interest in , not a hunter either so air rifles was what interest me .
keep it up mate thats a nice effort in explaining the airgun.
Thank you !
Good entertainment! I love the pro tips. I'll have to keep an eye out for one of those. You inspired me to get an HW95 2 years ago. Now I know why they are so loved.
Yes a hw 95 from Weihrauch a wonderful made balanced gun
It was good to watch you work again Mike. Thanks for sharing.
Thank you ! Yeah I took a much needed air gun break
@@MrSteppingstone888 good for you! When I heard you talk about barrel harmonics I thought I better ask if I should replace a set screw that seems to have gone missing from the barrel break. I don't remember if it had two in it when you balanced it. It only has the end one now.
@@desertfox3860 It wont hurt to have a 2nd screw that's probably why I did two screws lol
@@desertfox3860 Your Shroud is not set up like the benjamin shroud , its pretty much set and the screws are a extra help
Missed your video's Mike, glad to see you back at it.
Thanks Rob Yeah I had to take a air gun break
A great video. You explained everything so succinctly.
Check out part two has more issues found with the gun
This rifle is almost the same design as a gamos hunter 440, 220 , even though gamos are spring powered, but I like that design, thank you for the info 👍👍
I just picked this up at a pawn shop and am looking into guides to make sure everything tip top.
This video is incredibly in depth, well explained, and entertainingly explained. Subscribed
Thanks for letting me know.
Don't know if I mentioned but the front shroud cap pulls off you may need to use the allen wrench to help twist as you pull, but there are 4 small holes in the cap drill those out larger so more air can enter the shroud tube when the gun is fired/ and I believe the rear screw on cap should have two thin washers / the parts list said two when I was on line looking them over
@@MrSteppingstone888
Thanks so much! how much additional power would drilling the holes provide?
@@darthvader6533 the holes in the piston would ease some piston slam
bigger holes in the front cap on inside would hopefully allow the shroud tube to work better, I still need to complete that shroud mod with bigger holes.
far as fps I don't think it will give any more just reduce the piston slam some
@@MrSteppingstone888 thank you very much!
Super informative! Thanks for sharing!
Thanks Steve 👍
I used my Hatsan seal which made it move more smoothly through the firing cycle. Thank you for the refresher on this truly great rifle.
I am surprised it worked the piston buttons are shaped different . this would look amazing if she was blued like a Air Arms rifle
Luv the workshop.
Best air gun video ever
Hi Ben
I have a part two coming out soon
I would not buy one if you were thinking of it if you have well that's a different
story.
Awesome and educational video👍 always enjoy your videos have a great weekend Mike
Thank you !
Nice to see you back Mike!
Thanks !
I ordered more parts for a 2nd caliber barrel set up / this is built the old school way heavy duty solid steel
bank vault fit !
When putting the piston back in, I might have missed this part, but aren't you supposed to put some kind of lubrication on the outside of the piston? I slathered on Crosman break-barrel oil for my 'F11 NP' Canadian version (wimpy one @ 495 fps, but really around 430 fps with 14.3 gr pellets).
Some people suggest "Molly", is that something you'd lube the exterior of the piston with?
I know this video's old, but it covers a lot.
the air chamber at front of receiver gets burnished molly into its walls or I tend to use Super Tech Multi-Duty Complex Hi-Temp Grease/ its not really grease as its a synthetic there is no petroleum in it so you burnish the air chamber walls and receiver walls after you cleaned out the tube. then swipe with your finger what ever your using around the piston seal sides close to the face edge of the piston but not the face of the piston.
after you insert the piston wipe lube on the piston slot and end of the piston then use a wood dowel to push the piston into the air chamber carefully watching and protecting the piston seal edge as it enters thru a cut out or new area its going into with a screw driver or something else to help tuck it down
once the piston is down at the bottom of air chamber then go back in and apply a little more lube onto the receiver walls do not over do it
also take note just before the piston enters the air chamber area at the cocking slot entrance and see if any build up of lube gathered in front of the seal if it did use a Q tip to wipe it away then push it into the air chamber if you did it correct you should not see anything but if you do just wipe it away
Hey I have a Benjamin Titan Gp. It was my father’s but he later gave it to me so it’s very sentimental to me. The safety stopped working on it so I decided to tinker with it and took apart the whole trigger but unfortunately I can put it back together now. I really need help putting it either back together or help finding a trigger for it so someone could install it. Can anyone help me please?
I knew I should have bought one of them. The Hatsin 25 nitro crapped out on me & it's going to cost more to fix it the it did to buy it new.
Hatsin 25 for sale... cheep.
Very well done man.
Brian are you able to work on your gun, I rebuild those gas rams properly
@@MrSteppingstone888 I am not able to work on it where I am. i have contacted you before & you emailed what it needed.
It was my 1st purchase & the gun's to big for me/trigger pull. Cutting the butt seems ridiculous to me.
@@sapshootervt Well if it makes you feel better I have a "TON " of money wasted and invested in this air gun sport / hobby / what was the hatsan rifle that gave out on you and what caliber
@@MrSteppingstone888 I have emailed you before . So I will again.
Hatsan 125 nitro piston.
Thank you for all your help.
hi looks straight forward enough and given me confidence to tackle and build a spring compessor.
my benjamin trail i believe was made with a faulty nitro piston . i would like to do the trigger upgrade too.
could you messege me where in the US I could send off for the stuff. A web site im in the uk
I have them I doubt if you could buy one usually I have to call to order stuff with part numbers go to my channel look in banner at the top for where it says
Sharing my passion for air guns, work done ,mods, re barreling, lathe work etc. > ( see the small arrow) click on it it will open up my contact info
I would like to see more on this rifle, I have done alot of modifications over the years and did try out different weight pistons in different rifles, recently I have been fighting with a Stoeger air rifle I tried ever trick in the book to improve the shot cycle, new stock made from maple a little heavier than originally, tried different barrels, weights on barrel, different length and weight pistons, different caliber barrels and standard length but still couldn't come up with the right combination, I only seen moderate improvements in accuracy. As a last ditch effort I started cutting the barrel back a half inch at a time, recrowning and shooting groups. At 13 inches the air rifle transformed into an absolute tack driver. I am sure you have probably done this before but if you have another barrel it might be something to consider Mike
Hi Jim
not sure what power level your stogger model rifle is compared to the Benj XL ? On stronger magnums bigger cal like .25 & longer barrels help improve the shot cycle ( like a hatsan 125 - 135 ) and the Ben XL
Then there's accuracy which is a separate issue. I have not been able to get back to the Benjamin Xl but cutting the barrel and checking results like you did is definitely on the list as crosman / Benjamin have available parts and barrels you can buy.
I wanted to mod the shrod and front adapter when I do get back to it and then the Barrel length would be next.
Also on the barrel I always clean the bore then do the pellet to bore test to let me know what's going on with the barrel
by slowly pushing the pellet thru the bore with a skinny smoothed over rod that way you know if the bore is over sized or rough or snug then loose etc, Your a true air gunner enthusiast willing to find it out by doing it a lot wont because it cost them time and money 👍👍
@@MrSteppingstone888 it just a B18/19 platform, just a thought, it was my last kick at the cat so to speak, but as I said a incredibly accurate air rifle now
@@MrSteppingstone888 thanks man I don't know how I missed this message my sincere apologies, yes I found a passion at the age of 9 and I am approaching 60. Just can't get enough I love to problem solving
do you find all crosman nitro pistons from the past few years have the exact same internals ? so the F4 has the same guts as the benjamin if its a nitro piston ? is there any quality difference between a cheaper crosman nitro and a more expensive one ? I figure they would all be the same to lessen the parts inventory at the factory
Iam not even up on all that stuff I generally get into what I bought or comes in to the shop
I seen good while back crosman came out with a new ram which is also part of the piston but far as I am concerned they may of discontinued that ( I do not know but I rather have the basic gas ram and separate piston that way the gas ram if ever failed would be inexpensive rather than one that did double duty being the piston also
marketing is deigned to act like they have something new to catch the one's who is unaware in the end its not all that honestly
I see that the trigger is one of Charlie da tuner ,is this the same as that used in the Stoeger RX40 andare they still available ? Thanks
Hi John
It came with the rifle, not sure what the stoeger RX40 trigger is.
there will be a part two coming in a couple of weeks where the guns been re barreled and rebuilt and even cerakoted
Hello, maybe you can help me with some information. I have a hatsan 125 which has a broken gas cylinder. I want to convert it to a spring gun. I cannot find a spring guide anywhere on the Internet. Hatsan USA is no help. Do you know of any sources that would be of help to me? Thanks
Frank I can help you. I make custom spring guides and have the proper vortek aftermarket springs I also rebuild the hatsan gas rams and you wont have that failing on you again reach me. no spaces no caps use @ sign use . instead of dot (see next line down)
aways mike at hot mail dot com
Frank read previous message I sent you I can take care of your gun see info
Can you tell how much newton in gas ram
I just googled searched from Bar to Newtons here is that link
put in 140 Bar when you get to that conversion link / you may need to copy and paste the link in your browser if its not a live link
www.unitjuggler.com/convert-pressure-from-bar-to-Nm-2.html
A very good and informative video 🙂👍. I have a Benjamin Black Lightning 177, basically the Benjamin Trail NP2. I don't know if you have any piston seal for that. I drilled out the little holes on the end of the barrel shroud and that tighten up the groups. I also took the spring out, that is directly under the trigger/sear area and crushed it down a bit with a pliers and that made a very big improvement in the trigger.
BTW did you do a before and after chronograph and accuracy test, and get better results?
No all that follow up will be when the weather breaks lol
yes those small holes on that front shroud adapter definitely can use a enlargement / I had suspected that and was going to block them of to see what changes it makes & then enlarge them. You did a awesome job 👍👍
@@MrSteppingstone888 Thank you.
@@springpistonriflefeverlone9611
Piston seal wise, I don't have any crosman seals laying around I would see what the tube diameter is and see what other guns are built the same and see if parts are available for the model & get the part number and call crosman
Hi Mike, what gas ram goes in trail xl 22 and where can i get one.
Thank you
I have them click my name so it takes you to my channel then read in the banner where it says
Sharing my passion for airguns, work done ,mods, re barreling, lathe work etc. > at the end click that small arrow it will open up more info
hay mike the benjamin trail 1500 .177cal is on sale for $210 at amazon 2 left and hatsan 125 .22cal black for $153 same at amazon
I bought a 2nd barrel & linkage set up for mine, I am good on the hatsans too Thanks for letting me know👍
I can see a hatsan vortex ram sitting next to those cross man rams, they look really close in size. Do you think you can swap one into a hatsan? Since those vortex rams are not the most reliable?
Hi Mike YES you can But first off I rebuild those vortex rams properly!
If you need that let me know. Now if you use a gas ram in a hatsan vortex model you would need to get the end plug from a springer version of that gun, then you would need to make two adapters to center the ram and position it in place which I can make, its a lot cheaper just to send me the original and have me re build it properly its 50.00 shipped back filled to `150 bar fill
Mike your last post I don't see it on my you tube I got it in my email. my contact no spaces no caps , replace at with @ and dot with .
aways mike at hot mail dot com
Got mine xl .22 chrony
14.66 gr ftt pellet made 25.2 fpe
the front insert part of the shroud crown end has four tiny holes , I am going to enlarge those so more air can fill into the tube when fired you may want to try it.
I have more to try out with the gun , did you install the replacement gold trigger on yours , ?
Yes im install that gold trigger.
Do you still working on it ?
Looks a good base for a .25 smooth shooter
Hey Mike been a few weeks i was wondering if you are still going to do the follow up
Yes Iam waiting on the new stock and receiver tube from Crossman
should be here next Tuesday/ I was all done then decided to re cerakote the receiver tube in a different color
I would like to see an update, I had a crosman steel eagle I could never get to shoot straight, tried everything always thought it was so well built it should shoot better.
Hi Jim
I am working on part two, I found so many things wrong with the gun its ridiculous, your not going to want to miss part two / hopefully by Saturday fingers crossed
@@MrSteppingstone888 I look forward to it
@@MrSteppingstone888 I am guessing you are on the right track with the pistons weight, I have nothing to base my opinion on other than the fact it just seemed to be extremely heavy, but I often wonder if it had something to do with poor machining at the pivot point, unfortunately that rifle went to the dump after sitting against a wall mocking me for 3 years lol
@@jimstewart5008
I wound up using the piston with no holes drilled but I did machine the middle down so it would just ride on the ends, reason was I made the button wider to expand the piston seal the other was done to factory.
Bingo" the jam is skinny and the jam spring is weak
I had a jam from another model that was big so I drilled out the jam hole made a new jam spring and that still did not give me the lock up I wanted / I had to use another barrel block to be able to use the original jam with my stronger spring which means I had to pull the barrel etc etc and what a PIA and the block has a 15 thou gap which I fixed
That's awesome great work
Enjoy watching all you're videos. I have ? Need a breach seal for a diana 430l maybe factory stock if possible, I knew or hope you would know. Keep them coming and thanks.
Contact Hector here is his website www.ctcustomairguns.com/
if that fails try the others listed
Call pyramid air and see if they have something and call air guns of Arizona they sold those Diana 430l I wish I still had mine and call Umarex usa
TW Chambers does not have the breech seal
long time sinds the last vid . greets
just recently deleted a entire Turkish tomahawk project. Next time I go that far I will see what the fps are first, I thought the receiver was good but found out it was restricting the piston towards the very end, the rifle was 70 fps short because of it. I made a new spring jam new barrel pivot bolt I re barreled it, had several
O ring piston caps and two different gas ram configuration's, made a custom hand break & cerakoted it, gets 730 fps at my high elevation so maybe 20 more at a lower elevation, I still need to sight her in and possibly adjust the barrel I may do the short video after all thats done. I have one Turkish tomahawk left if that gets proper fps then I will work that one when I get back in the mood lol
Great video! Best description of work on a springer/gas ram rifle I’ve ever seen. New subscriber now!
I was wondering if you have ever worked on or have any opinion of the Sig Sauer ASP20? I ordered one and waited over half a year to get it. I’ve only shot it a couple times so I really don’t have a feel for it yet and then Sig got out of the Airgun business! I’m interested if you have any insight into that rifle? Or if you know of any upgrades for it…
Thank you!
Hi Rolf,
I still need to drill out the four holes larger on the front insert part of the shroud that may help with better groups.
also magnums need a tough air gun rated scope and its just difficult for scope to hold the reticle so I may zero the scope and see how far off the point of impact is at the bulls eye target and if its to much I will bend the barrel so its closer to hitting the bulls eye using a zeroed scope.
I may mod the piston and install a full face piston seal for extra cushion. but for now I have yet gotten back to it
Were can I buy a replacement barrel for a benjamin trail np xl
go to crosman .com website they are called by a different name now but that will get you there once there get the number call it and go thru the tele prompt and choose the one to get parts that's it/ barrels/ you need to order the collar that goes in the block for the pivot bolt they should come with the jam though but check order a breecj seal and some thin breech seal shims I dont thin it comes with a breech seal or cocking arm and pin/ so think about what you need
@@MrSteppingstone888 thanks
Have you tried a spring in the trail ?
Please see part two on this trail I was satisfied with the build with the ram, the spring would be good with a custom made delrin spring guide but the ram was the way
I went with/ I do love springers when they are set up right
What should I do if I can't get the barrel to Crack open ? I was out shooting targets and after I shot I couldn't get it to crack open. Its my buddy's pellet gun
what model air rifle is it
If its the Benjamin trail then watch the video to see how to work on the gun sounds like your cocking arm is not proper and wont allow movement
@MsSteppingstone it's the Benjamin trail nitro piston bt5m22snp. I think the piston is done in it.
@MsSteppingstone yeah I think that's what's happen maybe! It's never been taking apart or maintained from what I know
@@namehere1369 thats a easy fix I have the gas rams if you want one or you can get one thru crosman
I'm having shroud issues with mine as well. I was wondering if there was any harm in just removing the darn thing and installing a barrel tuner in it's place. Just subbed to you, great job with this video!
the barrels are on the thin side I dont know if you could keep cocking the barrel with out it possibly flexing the barrel / try enlarging the four holes on the front cap then see if anything is different also try snugging the tube to see where it give the best groups then maybe blue lock tite it at that spot
Part two is in the works , I found more issue with the gun
but also clean the bore really well they usually are filthy I use a new brass bore brush and soaked patches with goo gone but go in and all the way out with the bore brush before bring it back out/ I soak the barrel first and let it sit to penetrate
I watched this video again and noticed that you mentioned "your seals" when describing the seals you used. I know it's over due to change my piston seal and was wondering if you were a supplier. The problem I'm having is finding a reputable supplier here in Canada. Patiently waiting for part 2, thanks again for your help. Merry Christmas!!
Great channel you have . Just subbed ! How did the grizzly mill hold up after the gear mod ? Just picked one up for $500 and it works fine but I wanted to know if the upgrade worked & held up for you .. Thanks!
I collect air guns as well as .22 rim fire .. Enjoy the channel !
Hi Shawn
The new gears worked great, I still have the one plastic gear on the very top and bought a spare but so far I have not broken it since I replaced it along with the new metal gears. This mill is slow going and you cant push it.
its irritating because everything takes to long , I don't use it much but when I do I know its going to take time
@@MrSteppingstone888 How many tooth is that top gear , Grizzly says 38 tooth but Little machine shop says 30 tooth .. Not sure ? Thanks for the info to man !
@@shawnmrfixitlee6478 My spare top plastic gear came from Grizzly
I just counted the teeth from the spare gear it is 38 teeth
I did have to replace my rpm reader with the two small screws it was damaged by the screws on the side of the spindle
@@MrSteppingstone888 Perfect thank You ! .. Can you tell me the OD & ID of that gear ? I really don't want to take this mill appart till I get the parts in hand . Also saw the belt drive setup but they want $175.00 ..OUCH !!
@@shawnmrfixitlee6478 Grizzly should have the parts list for that machine to get the gear info. The O.D. is 1-15/16" The I.D. is 1/2"
Nice to be back Mike, it that a trail np xl ?
Looks same swept volume as h 125
29x120mm.
Thank You
Yes a Benjamin trail XL - 29mm tube X 120mm swept volume
I ordered a .22 cal barrel set up, now I have .22 and .25
@@MrSteppingstone888 thanks im just buy one a very nice used one in perfect condition it .22.
like you im have years spend to make the h 125 -135 shooting beter than new, the all out steel qualty of these trail np xl im find it way beter then hatsan.
the barels are decent to. the hatsan are a hit of miss most of them way over sized.
whats youre opion on this ?
also the np xl use a 75kg ram 150bar.
did you weight the piston ? the hatsans are about 400 grams.
what chrony numbers you get on .22 .25 use FTT pellets
@@bernardvanderveen7656
I have not been back to the Benjamin trail since the video but the new barrel cocking assembly and parts arrived so now I have two barrels set ups for it.
You are absolutely correct Hatsans are hit & miss and often the bore is over sized, The xl gas rams I believe when I tested them were around 140 / 145 bar which actually is fine it will produce the proper feet per second. yes the Benjamin trail is good solid steel and machined very nicely, and most of the time you will get a good barrel, I bought a bunch of the barrels off crosman several years ago but now they cost more, I was using them on test projects.
I still need to mod the front shroud insert by enlarging those air holes , they are to small and may even help with groups / Hatsan guns have taught me tons
and tons of things by working on them / because I never gave up on trying to make them shine so I owe those guns my learning experience
BENJAMIN TRAIL with a replacement gold trigger blade is the winner in my book / a lot of hatsan barrel forks are to far spread also I saw new pics outside of usa where they changed the lock up almost to a wedge type/ I was going to try to mod some type of better lock up so its not just the pivot washers holding the barrel but have yet to get to it
@@MrSteppingstone888 yes im think you seen the hatsan mod 99 with a wedge barrel lock like walther lgv.
Hello Mike, Love your vids!! I have a Gamo GR .25 cal. magnum jungle. I want to convert it to a gas ram. Can you tell me the correct length ram I would need to replace the spring? I also have the Benjamin np xl .25 magnum. Excellent vid, !!
Thanks Boe
Hi Merton
Benjamin
@@MrSteppingstone888 mike, are we talking about the gas ram from a Trail np xl 25 cal? What is the length of this ram? If it is 11.5" I think I have a 160 bar in my box . Thanks Merton
@@mertonjones8017 gamo mite have a odd size ram. but the Benjamin XL rams Full length is 11-7/8" the rod is 1/4" thick and it is 5-1/8" long
the Body is 5/8" round and it is 6-3/4" long
@@MrSteppingstone888 Mike , You are the best!! My 160 bar ram measures exactly 11-5/8 " . I have to make an end cap for the ram to stay centered ,so Im going to ad 1/8" to the thickness for the preload . Should work??? You have the BEST video's I've ever seen and your rated #1 in my book. If I screw things up , can I send my Gamo GR .25 to you for the spring to ram conversion? Also, I think I might up from 140bar to 160 bar in my XL. In my XL I shoot H&N crow magnums with a BB crazy glued in the hollow and let me tell ya, they are deadly accurate and crazy knock down power but I think I could use more bar to send them faster because they are quite heavy. Thanks again
@@mertonjones8017 yes you can send it. how are you making the adapter ?
do you have a lathe
Love my Trails.
Find a way for another 5-7 fpe would be badass.
Lethal inside 40yds,just needs more grunt on the top end