Akshon Esports it really depends on how they will push Valorant. Will the devs support the community, how will the whole market develop, nobody can predict this, but what is certain is that games like LoL and CS: GO can‘t be just replaced by it
It's not the most beautiful game out there, but the abilities look fun. Hope the OW devs are watching and take notes. Might be time to add someone who can use smokes to the game.
7 minute video and you didn't answer the question at all, just alluded to them "countering it" somehow without providing any specifics. Good ping and high tick servers aren't novel at all and certainly aren't unique to Valorant. "A good connection is only one half of the equation"; gee I'd love to know what the other half is.
He literally said that it is impossible to solve the problem, but how they wanna solve it, is with their own servers and 128tr because 70% of the players have 35ms. He said it is impossible and he also said the other part, the other oart youre looking for, is the impossible side.
Did you miss the part where they are setting up custom priority routers across the US to keep latency at a minimum? That was the whole point.. something that no other FPS games do.
Don’t quote me on this but I remember hearing on of the streamers say that they’ve worked out some optimization strategy that averages out latency for all players so that people with lag don’t have an advantage. That may be the other half of the equation since that is traditionally a client side issue not a server side one. Again don’t quote me lol
Me too. I hoped that valorant would be better than counter shite. but it will not solve nothing to me meanwhile people with 1000000000000hz monitors will shit on me.
@@XTheConX actually, Linus Tech Tips did a video on it. Turns out, yep, better hardware makes you a better player by reducing your effective reaction times to everything from enemy player movement to crosshair placement. As a matter of fact, in the video, professionals suffered worse than more casual when forced to play with worse hardware due to noticing the discrepancy between the screen and their muscle memory. Not to discredit the enormous amount of work that an esports player puts in to be good, or gloss over map knowledge and game sense, but their hardware is a definite advantage.
3:53 This man really just pulled footage from a video arguing tickrate doesn't give a gameplay advantage, to push tickrate giving a gameplay advantage.
People boast higher tickrate because it's a buzzword that makes 14 year olds excited. If you go on community server browser FFA matches on csgo and play a 120 tic server with 50 ping, vs a 64 tick with 20 ping. It's not even a joke HOW MUCH better the 64 tick will feel. Tick doesn't mean Jack when compared to ping. In league I get 70 MS because California is screwed by riot servers, they say you cant feel the difference, but it's huge. In DotA I get a smooth 30 and if it goes to 70-80 i don't want to play because of the latency. This FPS better actually have 35 ping, because that's the only thing that matters
Philip didn't say it did or didn't give players an advantage. He literally said throughout the entire video he doesn't know. He just said it's not the only factor in gameplay performance.
Arda Agaik Not always the case, for example if the Hanzo has a widow maker ult then any good Hanzo player will be able to jump around the corner and headshot the target before they dodge, and then there’s also the sonic arrow which when used properly can be used for the same purpose as the widow ult, and in certain circumstances it can be hidden if used carefully.
Tracking in overwatch is god awful tho due to the fact that overwatch dose not use proper raw mouse input. Also peekers advantage is live and well in overwatch and valorant as well not sure what he's on about. Maybe it's a little better but still exist clearly.
Riot keeps listing 'anti-peekers advantage' as a feature next to their tick rate and low latency, but literally no one has actually said what that means. If you're saying the low latency and tick rate are effective in limiting peeker's advantage, then this was a poor way of stating it. But if there's actually a third legitimate factor in limiting peeker's advantage, I'd like to hear more about that. Also, CS:GO has had 120+ tick servers and lower latency for a long time. None of that is new with Valorant.
@@jesusa.garciasanchez3798 Yeah but the game itself supports 128 tick since forever. Also the netcode for Valorant is much worse than in CS GO, the amount of issues ive had since Competitive mode released in Valorant is insane. When I used to play Faceit games in CSGO Ive had no issues whatsoever with the netcode.
The measurement for ping is "ms", for yall imperials thats called miliseconds because thats the time it takes to transport information to and from the server. After mili there is micro so 0.005ms would equal 5micro seconds which is way more convinient to say
1:10 thats not peakers advantage at all, thats just simple geometry you ape, the closer you are to an angle the more they see of you and the less you see of them
@@meowthecat8476 stick your finger out an arms length away from your face, make sure you can see the finger and its either on the right side of your vision or the left side, not in the middle. Now, put your hand in front of your eyes so you can just barely not see it and then start moving the hand covering your eyes further away from you. What you will see is that it suddenly appears in your vision because thats how angles work, the closer you are to something the more of your vision it blocks. You pure fucking degenerate anime weeb
@@meowthecat8476 no, you're wrong. your camera is in the center of the player model, so your character's shoulder can be seeable around a corner, while you cannot. Warowl has a good video about explaining it, with the jist being that the person farther away from the corner has the advantage of seeing the opponent first
@@meowthecat8476 you are very wrong here. watch war owls video for perspective in counterstrike i used to think the same way what he says for csgo applies to other games as well
To be fair, latency of around 100 milliseconds is only an issue because of ridiculously high movement speed. If characters moved sideways at realistic speed, the time between seeing an enemies shoulder coming around a corner and thier head/gun rounding the corner and being able to shoot you would be higher than the lag, and thus would give the advantage to the person holding the angle. 'quick peeking' could also be removed by slowing acceleration of movement and leaning, if it exists. Since milsims and more 'realistic' shooters do both these things, peeker's advantage just isn't a thing. Sure, it has to do with latency, but it's also entirely a problem due to high movement speed.
Even if you might be right, this hypothetical game would feel slow and clunky and not be fun. I'd rather die unfairly occasionally than play as a character with slow or delayed reactions
Every hero is basically balanced right now except for raze. Breach is kinda weak. Jett is weak for low skill but an insane high level ult. Raze is broken and breach is weak but everything else is pretty even
@@sergeantrainstorm1269 I am Breach main btw. And can say that it is good in 5 premades team but not very much in soloQ because you need teamplay. Breach is all about teamplay and timing.
In your example clip the peeker was able to see the stationary dude first, because he was a lot farther away from the corner. With a normal ping the peekers advantage shouldn't be more than a 20th of a second.
A lot of the peelers advantage has to do with who’s closer to the angle. Watch WarOwl’s video, he explains it very well. For example, if someone’s hugging the wall, the person who’s peaking from afar will see him before.
What you said at the end about servers reminds me of cod war zone 1 in every 50 or so games you will get a very laggy server where every other minute your ruberbanding back a few feet
@@ChayChay0510 Pssst... If the ticks are less frequent than your frame renders, the game will still look equally smooth. Ticks have nothing to do with visual data.
So, considering ticks are how you get your visual data in the first place, saying they're totally unrelated just proves your lack of information behind your statements. Fear not though, I found this cool reddit post that explains it, so here you go: www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/1n0uor/newbie_tuesday_september_24th_2013_your_weekly/ccemqyh/
@@ChayChay0510 Nothing in that Reddit post was new to me. The visual data (Models, map, textures, FX programming) comes from your harddrive, and it's getting rendered by your GPU and CPU. Only the translation of the models, your health, and a few other things are bound up to ticks, but even that server info is preempted and interpolated by your computer. He shows two examples, both in which a guy is walking and turning his camera, neither of these two actions are made smoother by higher tick rates. In the second example, the video's framerate is halved. This makes it look like half the tick rate = half the framerate, which is not at all the case. Walking and turning will look just as good with a tick rate of 10 as it will with one of 300.
@@ChayChay0510 even if your monitor cant display more than 60Hz you still profit from the higher server tickrates. You wouldnt profit from the extra smoothness but you would still see a "newer" image. It might sound complicated but basically when the server sends its data it needs to be buffered at the client side and of that data the frame is gonna get rendered. The rendering of the frame and the sending of the data arent synchronised which is why that buffering adds a tiny bit of extra delay in there. That buffer-delay gets shortened when the servertickrate is higher so you theoretically have an advantage. But do i think its worth it? Not at all. There are so many other factors that come to play and would help so much more (like a high refresh rate monitor). I just wanted to help with some of that technical stuff🙂
In the peeking "demonstrations" you showed, you didn't talked about the fact that if you are close to the corner, you'll see the enemy last, if you are far away and the peeker close to the corner, you'll see him before
This is true, and peeker's advantage is a hard party about transitioning to competition e-sports since they tend to be LAN and the latency is even lower so the advantage switches and can be hard to adjust to.
exactly, that MW "peekers advantage" clip at the start was not peekers advantage at all. It was basic geometry and LOS since he was mounted on that corner like an idiot.
@@pogdan7966 That hasn't stopped people from playing it - people are still playing the original Wii U title to this day. You haven't heard about the game for numerous reasons, mostly because the game's no longer updating, and additionally because if you don't choose to hear about it, you won't. Fortnite is still kicking pretty well and I haven't heard anything from it in almost a year now.
@@quicktoreason2722 if it was 4th world, India would not have helped other countries in this dark age of global pandemic. Many countries are begging india for help instead of superpowers like China, USA
There is a mistake on 1:07 Maybe there was peeker advantage but the main reason is a close angle: while u can't see enemy, enemy can already see your body.
@@albertrenell6535 no I'm not. Overwatch is client based whereas most of these other games are server sided (which is why lag can be an issue). I have never noticed someone teleporting all over the place in overwatch because it doesn't happen, all of the lag just occurs for the one lagging not everyone in the game. He might just be looking up in the sky if he lags out or something lol. Anyway, the camper always has the advantage in widow duels unless you grapple to a spot they wouldn't suspect
@@666narutomanfan Being client-based is exactly what gives you the advantage. The one you're peeking is at the mercy of your connection to ther server (and also their own interpolation)
@@Kiba114 It does. Movements you make are client side. What do you think happens when you move around a corner for a peek? Happens for you immediately but your opponent has to wait for that movement data to reach them so even if they're looking right where you'll be they're at the mercy of latency. You WILL see them before they see you. That's a product of having client side movement.
Eric Burnett I think Ponder (the guy who invented GGPO, the golden standard of FG netcode) is on the Riot Fighting Game dev team, so I have faith that the netcode will be good. If combined with Riot Direct, it could be really good.
In high level (global elite) CSGO, in the mid to late round periods of the game, it is essential that all players are able to make full use of peeker's advantage when entering, exiting or retaking a bomb site. High level CSGO players are able to peek a corner, line a crosshair up with the right spot, stop, shoot and go back behind cover well before the defender has any chance to respond. This technique is called "prefiring". In mid difficulty CSGO matches, prefiring also helps at the start of the round. In high level play, when T's throw utility (smokes, molotovs, flashbangs) all the CT's will move around to some extent, either to avoid the effects of the utility or to better prevent being prefired, which means that a successful site take is a beautiful orchestration which combines individual skill and death Match ability with the team's ability to coordinate, the team that is better able to do this generally is the winner. If neither side wins, or one person is left to clutch then prior information about a particular team will be important in order to remember bad or even good habits of opposing players and potholes that can be utilised, such as knowing where on the opposition's favoured map the opposition will stand, and practicing ahead of time to prefired that position in case any player encounters a clutch scenario. Prefire is essentially a game mechanic - almost a feature that needs to be used to balance the odds and turn the tide in the case of a 1v5, with the opposition far better off financially. If this was not the case, then you wouldn't have the stress and pressure and mind games of a clutch scenario, and instead be left with the disadvantaged giving up so they do not lose precious material (weapons, armour, utility etc.) To the enemy and fight another round after losing.
I can't believe I just wasted 7 minute listening to "How to solve peeker's advantage? Just get better servers lel" "Oh, and also increase TTK. That will make people notice the ping less." Like, I was hoping to hear something unique, like favor the shooter kind of refreshing system. Welp.
I feel peakers advantage is actually good for a game as it gives attackers an actual chance to take a new angle rather then typical defence just holding an angle and always having you in there sights instantly
Some of those frags were prefires and while yes, peeker's advantage does get in the way in such situations, those are also situations where the peeker IS supposed to have a better reaction time than someone who is holding the angle because the peeker is not waiting for a visual queue to react. So, ye.
This makes me really excited for their fighting game Holy heck if they set a gold standard for net code in. Fighting games It'll be huge Cause man some games in 2020 are still unplayable online
Not many people really talk about TF2 comp that much, however, peekers advantage is that makes a good sniper destroy lobbies. The one shot kill potential mixed with 100% accuracy whilst moving is so terrifying, it is not uncommon for good snipers to get hackuacations due to shitty ping or hitboxes. This is on top of actual hackers going years without bans due to Valve's lack of intervention. P.s. sorry for the rant towards the end.
Personally I think that peekers advantage is important to have in a game like CS:GO and valorant because its needed to counteract the better positioning the defenders or CTs have. It's one of the major problems I've noticed with valorant which is unless they change the maps in pretty drastic ways the defenders are always going to have the upper hand unless someone on your team makes a really good play early in the round. Also compared to CS holding angles in valorant feels wrong because theres almost no peekers advantage.
An official statement by Riot Games on peeker's advantage in VALORANT and how they calculate it: "Until humanity learns to move faster than the speed of light, peeker's advantage is never going away. It’s something that exists for all games. That being said, our goal is to minimize it as much as possible in VALORANT. Philosophically, we believe the less peeker's advantage there is, the more tactical the game's meta becomes." beta.playvalorant.com/en-us/news/game-updates/04-on-peeker-s-advantage-ranked/
ive been playing csgo for about 5 days and Ive already found that even on defense if you want to "hold a spot" its better to constantly peak the angle ur trying to hold rather than just hold the spot. I always thought this was because my concentration was shit after more than 5 seconds but this is probably a big part of it. nice video
1:08 That's just how angles work, nothing to do with so-called 'peeker's advantage'. The peeker was further from the corner then the defender, that's why they couldn't see it coming. DevinDTV debunked this crap ages ago. For someone who actually knows what they're talking about when it comes to networking in video games, check out Battle(non)sense. P.S. This video might have the dubious distinction of being an even worse gross misunderstanding and misexplanation of science and technology than Knowing Better's video on why 4k is a scam.
Honestly I don't think OW has too many issues with peaking due to most peaks being from around shields. But I do think I've seen similar issues with tick rate, like extremely fast cast ults going off on my side (Reinhardt for example) but on the enemy side they don't see anything.
Overwatch combats this with a different strategy. Until this game gets past the beta we won’t know if they did it better, but Overwatch has a lot of designs that don’t care about this issue too. Instant kills typically only occur due to your own poor positioning, not an attacker’s quick reflexes on a poor connection.
Overwatch has an even worse system in place. It's called favor the lagger and server prediction. Not to mention they use low tickrate servers and only host out of LA and Chicago. Valorant is literally showing Blizzard everything they did wrong with Overwatch. I'm genuinely impressed with Riot here and might give their game a shot now.
Peekers advantage is a huge part of apex legends. I’m not gonna hold my breath expecting EA to attempt to combat the issue, especially in that game. Hopefully Riot just shames them all into requiring action
I feel like riot is doing the thing that happened with anthem and fallout 76: promising the world. Are we really sure that all of these features are even in the scope of things that they can pull off?
You are doubting riot, and you I think you shouldn't; the power they have on multiplayer games this year is something no one has seen before so get ready
@@symbolitical4158 40k average viewers on twitch and still being played a shit ton? The servers literally crashed globally for around an hour because there were too many players online.
I’m just saying that almost every time we have been promised the world we have gotten little to nothing. I’m not saying that it will fail or that I think it will fail, I don’t, I think it will do great. But people with more recourses and time then riot have tried and failed to fix this problem. Yes riot has been amazing with the games that they made so far but so did EA and bathesda. I’m not doubting riot’s ability to make games. I’m doubting riot’s executive team’s ability to not take our money and run.
In my opinion peekers advantage balances out the fact that camper can just pre-aim at peekers head level while peeker needs to guess where the defender is, this will just encourage angle holding and will lead to rock paper scissors if you have utility to counter that camper or not
I wish they would change how jumping works. Since jumping makes you slow when you land you can’t use it to dodge bullets, so that’s why people play the stealthy game usually. And if you get in a fight you’re dead if you reload
Yeah let's show a clip from a video that literally proves that the difference between 64 and 128 tick servers is unnoticeable and not even credit them.
I am so sorry for nitpicking. Ok this sounds great the tick and all.... for people who live nearby a server. Here in African, there are many people who play mobas and fps but the ping even with a real great connexion can be at 150. I'd play this game if this technology can really lower my ping here, but until then I still don't think that this would be my priority. But I totally understand why people are so hyped. Right now I still am really curious about how they want to compete with CSGO in the west and Crossfire in the east, which are huge fps titan right now. With a huge fanbase and million of concurent player. And not forgeting that in CSGO there are the workshop, you can sell skin and all.
Other ways to mitigate peeker's advantage besides improved servers and network connectivity include either limiting the information sent to clients to exclude entities out of line-of-sight... or sending it with predictions so that the other players see the player break cover sooner, possibly with a delayed execution of the movement by the client that initiated it. Either way, the goal is for the two players to see each other at effectively the same time, if they're both looking at each other. And if the server knows the ping for each client, it can send updates at staggered intervals, tuned so that the information arrives at each client at the same time, so if one client has 20ms ping (10ms each way) and the other has 30ms ping (15ms each way), the server would state info gets to the 30ms-ping client 5 ms before sending it to the 20ms-ping client, with both messages arriving 15ms after the first one is sent and 10ms after the second. (In theory this could risk a type of cheating where someone finds a way to convince the server that their client has worse ping than it actually does, but there are ways to counter that as well, or at least catch it when they leverage it.) On a streamed-display platform like Stadia, the player's actions aren't displayed on their own screen until after they're processed by the server, so that effectively combines both the exclusion of out-of-LoS entities with the delayed execution of movement. This not only solves peeker's advantage but also the wallhack class of cheats. Unfortunately, it means the responsiveness of controls is completely dependent on how low the server ping is.
Let's be honest here..... that vast majority of gamers arent losing gunfights because of milliseconds. Either your reaction time, game sense, or general skill level is just lower than the enemies.
Even the first example in this video is bad. That is not peekers advantage but rather simple geometry. The peeker has an easier time spotting him since he is further away from the edge and your vision comes from the middle of your model. The person peeking actually never sees his head.
Maybe just don't make it so that a less than a tenth of a second delay equates to instant death and instead make it so you actually have to fight your opponent to kill them.
I have experienced the shitty end of the stick when it comes to peeker's advantage, my friends never believe me that it exists surprisingly, they just claim I'm bad, its so hard to play games that have peeker's advantage and be called trash even though I'd beat that same player in a scenario without peeker's advantage being possible.
Back when Black ops two had just came out I had a computer that was pretty much top of the line, I also paid for great internet. Obviously this was several years ago so I can't recall exact stats. But anyways according to my opponents I would effectively teleport around randomly. I imagine that this was part of peekers advantage. I just never stopped moving and would just circle left or right for a second and than reverse and throw in a jump or crouch.
Man... Playing ghost recon on pc with 56k modem at the start of the century. use to change weapon to fully auto, side shift around a corner pre shooting. Impossible to stop.
Even the first example in this video is bad. That is not peekers advantage but rather simple geometry. The peeker has an easier time spotting him since he is further away from the edge and your vision comes from the middle of your model. The person peeking actually never sees his head.
Yes and no. Considering that esport games are light to run games, the client has more fps than the server has ticks per second. If your client renders 300 frames per second but the server doesnt update 300 times per second then there will be many identical frames not giving you any information. So when the server updates twice as fast and your fps at least match the servers ticks per second and your monitor can display it you will get a smoother, better experience. The demo did show how ticks influence the gameplay with consistent fps
@@anonymouscommentator The frames won't be identical. That would make for a horrible gameplay experience. The information between ticks is interpolated and predicted by your computer. And most things in the game don't use ticks to update, such as your player's view, and position. Your position is only verified after the fact to be within a margin of error by using ticks. Even if the TR the server runs at is literally 10, if you turn 360° in one second (without ramping speed), with your game running at 180 FPS, each new frame will have you rotated 2° further than the last. Those frames *are not identical.* If a character walks through the Y dimensions from loc. 4 to loc. 6 in one tick, your computer will render the movement inbetween 4 and 6 using some regression model. When the frames are rendered, it will render (with a TR to FPS ratio of 1:4) 4, 4.5, 5 and 5.5 before landing on 6. Each of those frames have new information. In conclusion, no matter the TR, your computer will still render new unique frames at it's own rate. Obviously I'm not saying faster TR isn't conducive to a smooth gameplay experience, I'm saying that TR and your FPS are two completely independent numbers, and his example showing lowered FPS as an example of lower TR is completely misleading.
@@sanjacobs6261 Sorry, i will have to correct myself. Of course user input will change the camera position and rotation thus resulting in a different frame. My example is from a still perspective and with "identical" i mean that the same (important) information is shown. Sorry for using a wrong term on that (im not a native english speaker). Even though something like an idle weapon animation will still technically change the picture, you dont gain any valuable information out of that. Interpolation is used to counteract jiggerey movement and rotation of other players so it artificially increases the buffertime to smooth out the gameplay (I think you know that). So in a way it does change the frame and for the player it is new information, however for the client pc it is not. So yes you are correct in that the frames will not be identical, however a higher tps will still make the client update position and rotation of others faster. (As i said not by much and i dont think its worth it) And for the example he didnt lower the fps to show that a lower tps would make your frames go down too, that is a slow-motion to help you see the differences between the player positions.
Riot seems to be one of the few who understands whats really important to a competitive and smooth experience. Which makes me pretty hopeful for that fighting game they also have in the works.
NOW I FINALLY UNDERSTAND WHY oml I keep holding angles in COD and I get oneshot by ARs and pistols and I'm always like WTF?? BUT 50-120ms ping and this thingo explains it perfectly oh my lordy this is such an epiphany @_@
Peekers advantage was the whole reason I was good at CoD back in the day. I could pop around a corner and kill people before they had a chance to even see me. I was the bane of corner campers as I knew where they hide so I'd just prefire their spots.
@@BS-qe3wc I think when you want to give credit it should easily visible for everyone. They could've just added their names in the description and keep the pastebin.
The one big issue here is that all gaming developers are going down the route of hardware over software development, this is the IBM failure all over again. Sooner or later a company will start releasing brand new never heard of software that will out date any new hardware system. History repeats itself and it seems that's where we're going once again.
It's nice that they care to set up proper infrastructure as an attempt to address the issue, but it's not impressive considering that without these improvements, the advantage would still be reduced just because of how slowly players strafe into sight-lines and how wild aiming is at full strafe speed. I won't be excited about FPS games until a fast-paced game with amazing net code is launched. Ultimately peeker's advantage will never be actually "solved" until we get some sci-fi quantum internet regardless, Valorant isn't actually solving the issue, they are just looking at other problems that shine a spot light on the issue like high ping and general game design.
As an old school R6 player, the mentioning of peekers advantage makes me angry to even think about. I’m glad that riot is doing their best to mitigate such a huge issue, but this video didn’t properly explain how the steps they’re taking directly correlate to the reduction of PA.
1:08 this is literally not an example of peakers advantage. this is just angles. plain and simple. stationary player will never see the moving player because he’s close to the angle. even if the moving player ran out and then stopped, the stationary player still wouldn’t see him. terrible example.
uJEREXbEAST I agree with bad example but explanation is wrong. If the enemy can see him clear as day and even jumped out so far, he should be able to see the enemy peaking like that
I mean the example at 1:09 is not a good one, this is just basic geometrical optics, because the player who is holding this angle is so close to the "pivot" point that it's logic the peeker will see him before the other one sees him, this is not a latency problem at all...
Ye there is a problem where my game just freezes to 15-20 seconds and one time the game went “wobbly” it kinda looked like the old static thing except you could clearly see that there was something going on in the game and there was no sound. I live in Ireland so that could be a problem any Irish people please speak up so I know if it’s a me problem or a them problem
1:07 I play this game and the reason he didn’t see him was because he was mounted on that angle not cuz of Parker’s advantage lol. Just wasn’t in his field of view.
Was going to say the same thing, of course he wasnt on the screen, he wasnt supposed to be on the screen in that clip but it was used to strengthen his cause.
No, they spoke of how Riot is actively looking at the issue as a result of internet and latency problems. The 'bandaid' was changing gameplay mechanics.
This is really only a problem in close quarters sweaty competitive games tbh. In Battlefield no one really talks about this nor is this really an issue even thought it probably exists. I don't really think this is an issue in Team Fortress 2 either.
What are your initial impressions of VALORANT? Will it be a game you see yourself playing in the long-run or will you be sticking other FPS titles?
Akshon Esports it really depends on how they will push Valorant. Will the devs support the community, how will the whole market develop, nobody can predict this, but what is certain is that games like LoL and CS: GO can‘t be just replaced by it
It's not the most beautiful game out there, but the abilities look fun. Hope the OW devs are watching and take notes. Might be time to add someone who can use smokes to the game.
How did you get these valorant motion graphics
Don't like it
Hell no, not my kind of game. I prefer more realistic nice looking shooters
Akshon : "Valorant is pretty goo..."
Overwatch league : "You're fired"
Akshon : "Valorant won't succeed"
924 likes but no reply so here's one
here's one too
Poop
minecwaft
Kek
7 minute video and you didn't answer the question at all, just alluded to them "countering it" somehow without providing any specifics. Good ping and high tick servers aren't novel at all and certainly aren't unique to Valorant. "A good connection is only one half of the equation"; gee I'd love to know what the other half is.
Rusty Orpheus this 100%. I like this channel, but this video didn’t really explain anything lol
He literally said that it is impossible to solve the problem, but how they wanna solve it, is with their own servers and 128tr because 70% of the players have 35ms. He said it is impossible and he also said the other part, the other oart youre looking for, is the impossible side.
This is just a promotional video for valorant, thats why
Did you miss the part where they are setting up custom priority routers across the US to keep latency at a minimum? That was the whole point.. something that no other FPS games do.
Don’t quote me on this but I remember hearing on of the streamers say that they’ve worked out some optimization strategy that averages out latency for all players so that people with lag don’t have an advantage. That may be the other half of the equation since that is traditionally a client side issue not a server side one. Again don’t quote me lol
Didnt credit my boy 3kliks for the 128tick vs 64 tick comparison
Warowl too
they did but it's in a pastebin that's in the description
@@itsjustJex but it's such a bad way to credit someone.. not even in description, in a freaking link to pastebin..
@@TheMrInadecuada the ironic part is, that video from 3kliks is talking about how unnoticable the difference between 64 and 128 ticks is
Phillip is the real deal here
"those without 128hz monitors will not see the difference"
"oh look that's me"
Me too. I hoped that valorant would be better than counter shite. but it will not solve nothing to me meanwhile people with 1000000000000hz monitors will shit on me.
David Iuga most people have 60hz monitors
David Iuga imagine thinking that having a more hz monitor will make the player better. Smh
@@XTheConX idk dude I guess
@@XTheConX actually, Linus Tech Tips did a video on it. Turns out, yep, better hardware makes you a better player by reducing your effective reaction times to everything from enemy player movement to crosshair placement. As a matter of fact, in the video, professionals suffered worse than more casual when forced to play with worse hardware due to noticing the discrepancy between the screen and their muscle memory. Not to discredit the enormous amount of work that an esports player puts in to be good, or gloss over map knowledge and game sense, but their hardware is a definite advantage.
3:53 This man really just pulled footage from a video arguing tickrate doesn't give a gameplay advantage, to push tickrate giving a gameplay advantage.
People boast higher tickrate because it's a buzzword that makes 14 year olds excited.
If you go on community server browser FFA matches on csgo and play a 120 tic server with 50 ping, vs a 64 tick with 20 ping. It's not even a joke HOW MUCH better the 64 tick will feel. Tick doesn't mean Jack when compared to ping.
In league I get 70 MS because California is screwed by riot servers, they say you cant feel the difference, but it's huge. In DotA I get a smooth 30 and if it goes to 70-80 i don't want to play because of the latency.
This FPS better actually have 35 ping, because that's the only thing that matters
Philip didn't say it did or didn't give players an advantage. He literally said throughout the entire video he doesn't know.
He just said it's not the only factor in gameplay performance.
@@geograymon55 he said that regardless of tickrate, people would be on equal ground, and that higher tickrate servers would not be that much of a help
Zane Tausworthe feelsbadman. Fellow Californian here. We used to get 20 ping before they moved the servers to Chicago.
@@zanetausworthe9434 they're not saying you'll get 35ms ping. That's just the average 70% players have, not a promise.
Unfair advantages due to unfair advantages? That description is Hella spicy
It sounds weird but it is accurate.
Ah yes.the floor here is made out of floor.
"There is no peekers advantage in Overwatch."
*laughs in Hanzo*
Adnan Talla he might shoot it unreactably fast but you see him and it doesn't count
Arda Agaik Not always the case, for example if the Hanzo has a widow maker ult then any good Hanzo player will be able to jump around the corner and headshot the target before they dodge, and then there’s also the sonic arrow which when used properly can be used for the same purpose as the widow ult, and in certain circumstances it can be hidden if used carefully.
@@UNSC_AlexanderSteel the thing is, in overwatch you are not sitting around a corner alone waiting. At least ideally not.
they just did what Overwatch did with client priority
@StenXa game with hot gorls
Tracking in overwatch is god awful tho due to the fact that overwatch dose not use proper raw mouse input. Also peekers advantage is live and well in overwatch and valorant as well not sure what he's on about. Maybe it's a little better but still exist clearly.
@@OrganicGreens Yes but far less obnoxious than in CS.
@@OrganicGreens overwatch has raw input in game. It doesn't use raw input while using the cursor like in menus or in hero select.
Sesses OMEGALUL W
Dust 2 doorway is 💀
its fucking bullshit ... i cant hold it as defensive side at all and ye i suck too :)
@@simonzhang3D
I quit playing semen-go like 4 years ago
@@RawrOmfgDayum ed edd and eddy sucks ass
Yea why does that primitive fucking game not die
Sarang Deshpande because it’s still kinda fun even with all the flaws and hackers
Riot keeps listing 'anti-peekers advantage' as a feature next to their tick rate and low latency, but literally no one has actually said what that means. If you're saying the low latency and tick rate are effective in limiting peeker's advantage, then this was a poor way of stating it. But if there's actually a third legitimate factor in limiting peeker's advantage, I'd like to hear more about that.
Also, CS:GO has had 120+ tick servers and lower latency for a long time. None of that is new with Valorant.
Nope. Faceit or ESEA have it. Not mm. MM is in 64 tick.
@@jesusa.garciasanchez3798 Yeah but the game itself supports 128 tick since forever. Also the netcode for Valorant is much worse than in CS GO, the amount of issues ive had since Competitive mode released in Valorant is insane. When I used to play Faceit games in CSGO Ive had no issues whatsoever with the netcode.
@hanibal Played the game recently and it works just the same. Ive got no internet issues, stable ping ( jitter
2050: Damn I’m on 0.0050 ping I’m lagging
That's physically impossible.
Yikes true but virtually its possible
Well, not impossible, but that is the time it takes for light to travel one mile in a vacuum, so pretty close.
The measurement for ping is "ms", for yall imperials thats called miliseconds because thats the time it takes to transport information to and from the server. After mili there is micro so 0.005ms would equal 5micro seconds which is way more convinient to say
@@anonymouscommentator seconds are universal between metric and imperial??
1:10
thats not peakers advantage at all, thats just simple geometry you ape, the closer you are to an angle the more they see of you and the less you see of them
lol. if they can see you. you can see them. thats geometry for you
@@meowthecat8476 stick your finger out an arms length away from your face, make sure you can see the finger and its either on the right side of your vision or the left side, not in the middle. Now, put your hand in front of your eyes so you can just barely not see it and then start moving the hand covering your eyes further away from you. What you will see is that it suddenly appears in your vision because thats how angles work, the closer you are to something the more of your vision it blocks. You pure fucking degenerate anime weeb
@@meowthecat8476 no, you're wrong. your camera is in the center of the player model, so your character's shoulder can be seeable around a corner, while you cannot. Warowl has a good video about explaining it, with the jist being that the person farther away from the corner has the advantage of seeing the opponent first
@@meowthecat8476 you are very wrong here.
watch war owls video for perspective in counterstrike
i used to think the same way
what he says for csgo applies to other games as well
To be fair, latency of around 100 milliseconds is only an issue because of ridiculously high movement speed. If characters moved sideways at realistic speed, the time between seeing an enemies shoulder coming around a corner and thier head/gun rounding the corner and being able to shoot you would be higher than the lag, and thus would give the advantage to the person holding the angle. 'quick peeking' could also be removed by slowing acceleration of movement and leaning, if it exists.
Since milsims and more 'realistic' shooters do both these things, peeker's advantage just isn't a thing. Sure, it has to do with latency, but it's also entirely a problem due to high movement speed.
Movement speed affects the advantage but the FOV on the reciever of the peek also affects it.
u should design a shooter
In a game without the ability to lean, it just wouldn't feel good to play with slower sideways movement.
Mostly true. There is still a peakers advantage in games like squad, but it is much, much lower.
Even if you might be right, this hypothetical game would feel slow and clunky and not be fun. I'd rather die unfairly occasionally than play as a character with slow or delayed reactions
I think a huge contributor to this is the fact that Valorant's movement speed is very slow when compared to CS.
Really? I didnt notice that. Furthermore, someone like jett can just dash around which basically makes it to an extreme.
$10 says they wont be able to balance the abilities just like almost everyy other damn hero shooter.
Mr Meh Nah Raze’s Ult
Every hero is basically balanced right now except for raze. Breach is kinda weak. Jett is weak for low skill but an insane high level ult. Raze is broken and breach is weak but everything else is pretty even
Saihaan Syed Breach is not weak, you’re out of your mind
@@sergeantrainstorm1269 I am Breach main btw. And can say that it is good in 5 premades team but not very much in soloQ because you need teamplay. Breach is all about teamplay and timing.
"have you abused peekers advantage?"
*Laughs in rainbow six siege*
Haha! Never have I abused peekers advantage..
Anyways, here is a montage of me abusing peekers advantage
In your example clip the peeker was able to see the stationary dude first, because he was a lot farther away from the corner.
With a normal ping the peekers advantage shouldn't be more than a 20th of a second.
Title: HOW VALORANT IS SOLVING THE GREATEST FLAW IN FPS. “Solution”: The dame thing that most FPS do.
Not true. AAA companies are lazy with efficiency so it’s good to see a company finally address the issue
A lot of the peelers advantage has to do with who’s closer to the angle. Watch WarOwl’s video, he explains it very well. For example, if someone’s hugging the wall, the person who’s peaking from afar will see him before.
What you said at the end about servers reminds me of cod war zone 1 in every 50 or so games you will get a very laggy server where every other minute your ruberbanding back a few feet
9/10 games in apex tho.
>Tries to educate the world about tick rates and server infrastructure
>Thinks tick rate is related to frames-per-second
Bruh
pssst....if the visual data is sent faster than your monitor can process, it's actually useless in terms of competitive advantage...
@@ChayChay0510 Pssst... If the ticks are less frequent than your frame renders, the game will still look equally smooth. Ticks have nothing to do with visual data.
So, considering ticks are how you get your visual data in the first place, saying they're totally unrelated just proves your lack of information behind your statements.
Fear not though, I found this cool reddit post that explains it, so here you go: www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/1n0uor/newbie_tuesday_september_24th_2013_your_weekly/ccemqyh/
@@ChayChay0510 Nothing in that Reddit post was new to me.
The visual data (Models, map, textures, FX programming) comes from your harddrive, and it's getting rendered by your GPU and CPU. Only the translation of the models, your health, and a few other things are bound up to ticks, but even that server info is preempted and interpolated by your computer.
He shows two examples, both in which a guy is walking and turning his camera, neither of these two actions are made smoother by higher tick rates. In the second example, the video's framerate is halved. This makes it look like half the tick rate = half the framerate, which is not at all the case. Walking and turning will look just as good with a tick rate of 10 as it will with one of 300.
@@ChayChay0510 even if your monitor cant display more than 60Hz you still profit from the higher server tickrates. You wouldnt profit from the extra smoothness but you would still see a "newer" image. It might sound complicated but basically when the server sends its data it needs to be buffered at the client side and of that data the frame is gonna get rendered. The rendering of the frame and the sending of the data arent synchronised which is why that buffering adds a tiny bit of extra delay in there. That buffer-delay gets shortened when the servertickrate is higher so you theoretically have an advantage.
But do i think its worth it? Not at all. There are so many other factors that come to play and would help so much more (like a high refresh rate monitor). I just wanted to help with some of that technical stuff🙂
In the peeking "demonstrations" you showed, you didn't talked about the fact that if you are close to the corner, you'll see the enemy last, if you are far away and the peeker close to the corner, you'll see him before
This is true, and peeker's advantage is a hard party about transitioning to competition e-sports since they tend to be LAN and the latency is even lower so the advantage switches and can be hard to adjust to.
exactly, that MW "peekers advantage" clip at the start was not peekers advantage at all. It was basic geometry and LOS since he was mounted on that corner like an idiot.
1:59
"this issue is in virtually every shooter o the market"
me:...are their clips of this happening n Splatoon as well?
Lmao there's prolly no clips, but it does happen
Do people still play splatoon?
@@pogdan7966 yes lmao
@@mollypolly8631 that game hasnt been intresting for like 2 years, i stoped hearing about it. In plus you can only play it on one console
@@pogdan7966 That hasn't stopped people from playing it - people are still playing the original Wii U title to this day. You haven't heard about the game for numerous reasons, mostly because the game's no longer updating, and additionally because if you don't choose to hear about it, you won't. Fortnite is still kicking pretty well and I haven't heard anything from it in almost a year now.
"35ms " - laughs in India / any 3rd world country.
Not "any".
Republic of Moldova (250$/month average salary) - 35-45 ms to most EU servers.
@@igorthelight *most then.
Only for local servers it's less than 50ms. Any other country and it's like 150, 200, 300...
@@quicktoreason2722 if it was 4th world, India would not have helped other countries in this dark age of global pandemic. Many countries are begging india for help instead of superpowers like China, USA
Anyone from Australia having like 300-400 ping.
There is a mistake on 1:07
Maybe there was peeker advantage but the main reason is a close angle: while u can't see enemy, enemy can already see your body.
No such thing as peeker's advantage in OW, people standing still ALWAYS see my hitbox before I go around a corner particularly as widow
I can't tell if you are being ironic or not, pls tell me if
@@albertrenell6535 no I'm not. Overwatch is client based whereas most of these other games are server sided (which is why lag can be an issue). I have never noticed someone teleporting all over the place in overwatch because it doesn't happen, all of the lag just occurs for the one lagging not everyone in the game. He might just be looking up in the sky if he lags out or something lol. Anyway, the camper always has the advantage in widow duels unless you grapple to a spot they wouldn't suspect
you clearly don't play widowmaker
@@666narutomanfan Being client-based is exactly what gives you the advantage. The one you're peeking is at the mercy of your connection to ther server (and also their own interpolation)
@@Kiba114 It does. Movements you make are client side.
What do you think happens when you move around a corner for a peek? Happens for you immediately but your opponent has to wait for that movement data to reach them so even if they're looking right where you'll be they're at the mercy of latency.
You WILL see them before they see you. That's a product of having client side movement.
5:38 isnt peekers advantage its a prefire. very common use of movement speed and keyboard hand skill
I am so excited to see how the netcode is on riot's fighting game
Eric Burnett I think Ponder (the guy who invented GGPO, the golden standard of FG netcode) is on the Riot Fighting Game dev team, so I have faith that the netcode will be good. If combined with Riot Direct, it could be really good.
Dude I'm so fucking excited, imagine a world with rollback netcode and good netcode as a standard for fighting game online experiences
To answer the video title: Valorant is following what other games already did.
In high level (global elite) CSGO, in the mid to late round periods of the game, it is essential that all players are able to make full use of peeker's advantage when entering, exiting or retaking a bomb site. High level CSGO players are able to peek a corner, line a crosshair up with the right spot, stop, shoot and go back behind cover well before the defender has any chance to respond. This technique is called "prefiring". In mid difficulty CSGO matches, prefiring also helps at the start of the round. In high level play, when T's throw utility (smokes, molotovs, flashbangs) all the CT's will move around to some extent, either to avoid the effects of the utility or to better prevent being prefired, which means that a successful site take is a beautiful orchestration which combines individual skill and death Match ability with the team's ability to coordinate, the team that is better able to do this generally is the winner. If neither side wins, or one person is left to clutch then prior information about a particular team will be important in order to remember bad or even good habits of opposing players and potholes that can be utilised, such as knowing where on the opposition's favoured map the opposition will stand, and practicing ahead of time to prefired that position in case any player encounters a clutch scenario. Prefire is essentially a game mechanic - almost a feature that needs to be used to balance the odds and turn the tide in the case of a 1v5, with the opposition far better off financially. If this was not the case, then you wouldn't have the stress and pressure and mind games of a clutch scenario, and instead be left with the disadvantaged giving up so they do not lose precious material (weapons, armour, utility etc.) To the enemy and fight another round after losing.
I can't believe I just wasted 7 minute listening to "How to solve peeker's advantage? Just get better servers lel"
"Oh, and also increase TTK. That will make people notice the ping less."
Like, I was hoping to hear something unique, like favor the shooter kind of refreshing system.
Welp.
This sounds like an ad, 60ms is still a lot, and most people don’t have 144hz monitor so this is irrelevant
Peeker’s advantage was there to unintentionally nerf camping
That's a way to look at at it
I feel peakers advantage is actually good for a game as it gives attackers an actual chance to take a new angle rather then typical defence just holding an angle and always having you in there sights instantly
Looking back at it, it’s funny how they claimed to fix peekers advantage despite it being one of the biggest problems in the game.
Some of those frags were prefires and while yes, peeker's advantage does get in the way in such situations, those are also situations where the peeker IS supposed to have a better reaction time than someone who is holding the angle because the peeker is not waiting for a visual queue to react. So, ye.
If I'm cloning a game, I'll make sure to make it as pingless as possible. That works for Riot, it seems :v
its 128 tick so yeah
Lmao
Kimeki this isn’t a clone you cs fanboy
@@xcy7240 For the record, I don't even like CS :v
@@Kimeki00 Then what game is it cloning lmfao, its very unique
Let’s go! There’s a riot server in my city, mmm this gonna be juicy
"server quality" Why havent they given that to EuW yet
*sad south hemisphere noises*
All the servers got clash while we on EUW just got crash.
Never seen flanked get that angry
This game actually has the worst peakers advantage I’ve ever seen in an fps. Very very flawed ironically
This makes me really excited for their fighting game
Holy heck if they set a gold standard for net code in. Fighting games
It'll be huge
Cause man some games in 2020 are still unplayable online
Not many people really talk about TF2 comp that much, however, peekers advantage is that makes a good sniper destroy lobbies. The one shot kill potential mixed with 100% accuracy whilst moving is so terrifying, it is not uncommon for good snipers to get hackuacations due to shitty ping or hitboxes. This is on top of actual hackers going years without bans due to Valve's lack of intervention.
P.s. sorry for the rant towards the end.
Personally I think that peekers advantage is important to have in a game like CS:GO and valorant because its needed to counteract the better positioning the defenders or CTs have. It's one of the major problems I've noticed with valorant which is unless they change the maps in pretty drastic ways the defenders are always going to have the upper hand unless someone on your team makes a really good play early in the round. Also compared to CS holding angles in valorant feels wrong because theres almost no peekers advantage.
An official statement by Riot Games on peeker's advantage in VALORANT and how they calculate it:
"Until humanity learns to move faster than the speed of light, peeker's advantage is never going away. It’s something that exists for all games. That being said, our goal is to minimize it as much as possible in VALORANT. Philosophically, we believe the less peeker's advantage there is, the more tactical the game's meta becomes."
beta.playvalorant.com/en-us/news/game-updates/04-on-peeker-s-advantage-ranked/
ive been playing csgo for about 5 days and Ive already found that even on defense if you want to "hold a spot" its better to constantly peak the angle ur trying to hold rather than just hold the spot. I always thought this was because my concentration was shit after more than 5 seconds but this is probably a big part of it. nice video
1:08 That's just how angles work, nothing to do with so-called 'peeker's advantage'. The peeker was further from the corner then the defender, that's why they couldn't see it coming. DevinDTV debunked this crap ages ago. For someone who actually knows what they're talking about when it comes to networking in video games, check out Battle(non)sense.
P.S. This video might have the dubious distinction of being an even worse gross misunderstanding and misexplanation of science and technology than Knowing Better's video on why 4k is a scam.
Wtf I don't think that's in OW is it. At Least I don't think I'd ever been victim to it
Honestly I don't think OW has too many issues with peaking due to most peaks being from around shields.
But I do think I've seen similar issues with tick rate, like extremely fast cast ults going off on my side (Reinhardt for example) but on the enemy side they don't see anything.
Overwatch combats this with a different strategy. Until this game gets past the beta we won’t know if they did it better, but Overwatch has a lot of designs that don’t care about this issue too. Instant kills typically only occur due to your own poor positioning, not an attacker’s quick reflexes on a poor connection.
I tend to agree. It’s more a problem in games like CS or COD
Ow doesnt have this issue commonly bc the only common hitscan oneshot is Widow and she doesn’t peek most of the time.
Overwatch has an even worse system in place. It's called favor the lagger and server prediction. Not to mention they use low tickrate servers and only host out of LA and Chicago. Valorant is literally showing Blizzard everything they did wrong with Overwatch. I'm genuinely impressed with Riot here and might give their game a shot now.
Peekers advantage is a huge part of apex legends. I’m not gonna hold my breath expecting EA to attempt to combat the issue, especially in that game. Hopefully Riot just shames them all into requiring action
“Low quality servers simply don’t cut it any more in competitive games”
Psyonix: Wait wut...
so true
Psyonix is not a 3A dev
ITapMIlk tru but they do got Epic Games backing them up now. So they do have a triple a studio behind them.
Peekers advantage isn't only about networking though, in csgo, it's essentially a gameplay mechanic
I feel like riot is doing the thing that happened with anthem and fallout 76: promising the world. Are we really sure that all of these features are even in the scope of things that they can pull off?
You are doubting riot, and you I think you shouldn't; the power they have on multiplayer games this year is something no one has seen before so get ready
@@iDrKx *teamfight tactics failure hides in the corner* sure :)
@@symbolitical4158 40k average viewers on twitch and still being played a shit ton? The servers literally crashed globally for around an hour because there were too many players online.
Joseph Daiber yes let’s compare two games rushed out the market by two studios who couldn’t give two fucks to a game with no release date makes sense
I’m just saying that almost every time we have been promised the world we have gotten little to nothing. I’m not saying that it will fail or that I think it will fail, I don’t, I think it will do great. But people with more recourses and time then riot have tried and failed to fix this problem. Yes riot has been amazing with the games that they made so far but so did EA and bathesda. I’m not doubting riot’s ability to make games. I’m doubting riot’s executive team’s ability to not take our money and run.
In my opinion peekers advantage balances out the fact that camper can just pre-aim at peekers head level while peeker needs to guess where the defender is, this will just encourage angle holding and will lead to rock paper scissors if you have utility to counter that camper or not
I wish they would change how jumping works. Since jumping makes you slow when you land you can’t use it to dodge bullets, so that’s why people play the stealthy game usually. And if you get in a fight you’re dead if you reload
Yeah let's show a clip from a video that literally proves that the difference between 64 and 128 tick servers is unnoticeable and not even credit them.
I am so sorry for nitpicking. Ok this sounds great the tick and all.... for people who live nearby a server. Here in African, there are many people who play mobas and fps but the ping even with a real great connexion can be at 150. I'd play this game if this technology can really lower my ping here, but until then I still don't think that this would be my priority. But I totally understand why people are so hyped.
Right now I still am really curious about how they want to compete with CSGO in the west and Crossfire in the east, which are huge fps titan right now. With a huge fanbase and million of concurent player. And not forgeting that in CSGO there are the workshop, you can sell skin and all.
Tell me about it, I live in Latin America and playing any game online here suckssssss
Middle East player here. I wish more companies would add servers nearby so I can stop throwing games in Europe on 150 ping :(
Yeah I can feel how great the League servers are whenever clash starts.
Other ways to mitigate peeker's advantage besides improved servers and network connectivity include either limiting the information sent to clients to exclude entities out of line-of-sight... or sending it with predictions so that the other players see the player break cover sooner, possibly with a delayed execution of the movement by the client that initiated it. Either way, the goal is for the two players to see each other at effectively the same time, if they're both looking at each other.
And if the server knows the ping for each client, it can send updates at staggered intervals, tuned so that the information arrives at each client at the same time, so if one client has 20ms ping (10ms each way) and the other has 30ms ping (15ms each way), the server would state info gets to the 30ms-ping client 5 ms before sending it to the 20ms-ping client, with both messages arriving 15ms after the first one is sent and 10ms after the second. (In theory this could risk a type of cheating where someone finds a way to convince the server that their client has worse ping than it actually does, but there are ways to counter that as well, or at least catch it when they leverage it.)
On a streamed-display platform like Stadia, the player's actions aren't displayed on their own screen until after they're processed by the server, so that effectively combines both the exclusion of out-of-LoS entities with the delayed execution of movement. This not only solves peeker's advantage but also the wallhack class of cheats. Unfortunately, it means the responsiveness of controls is completely dependent on how low the server ping is.
Let's be honest here..... that vast majority of gamers arent losing gunfights because of milliseconds. Either your reaction time, game sense, or general skill level is just lower than the enemies.
5:38 thats a bad example for peekers advantage, since it was a prefire
its misleading
Even the first example in this video is bad. That is not peekers advantage but rather simple geometry. The peeker has an easier time spotting him since he is further away from the edge and your vision comes from the middle of your model. The person peeking actually never sees his head.
@@Hannwes Right, first clip is just a matter of perspective, not picker's advantage
But that's not the only bullshit in this video
It is prefire, but the person holding the angle never saw the peeker’s full body, only shoulder
Maybe just don't make it so that a less than a tenth of a second delay equates to instant death and instead make it so you actually have to fight your opponent to kill them.
I have experienced the shitty end of the stick when it comes to peeker's advantage, my friends never believe me that it exists surprisingly, they just claim I'm bad, its so hard to play games that have peeker's advantage and be called trash even though I'd beat that same player in a scenario without peeker's advantage being possible.
So basically instead of coding in a band-aid to cover up the problem, they build physical structure to fix the actual issue. Nice.
You didn't understand the problem... If you did you would see that it's not possible
Back when Black ops two had just came out I had a computer that was pretty much top of the line, I also paid for great internet. Obviously this was several years ago so I can't recall exact stats. But anyways according to my opponents I would effectively teleport around randomly. I imagine that this was part of peekers advantage. I just never stopped moving and would just circle left or right for a second and than reverse and throw in a jump or crouch.
Man... Playing ghost recon on pc with 56k modem at the start of the century. use to change weapon to fully auto, side shift around a corner pre shooting. Impossible to stop.
Even the first example in this video is bad. That is not peekers advantage but rather simple geometry. The peeker has an easier time spotting him since he is further away from the edge and your vision comes from the middle of your model. The person peeking actually never sees his head.
ok
The first comment to not say first
3:53 is FPS, NOT TICK. Ticks occur on a server, and don't have anything to do with your FPS. YOU CAN'T SEE TICKS!
Yes and no. Considering that esport games are light to run games, the client has more fps than the server has ticks per second. If your client renders 300 frames per second but the server doesnt update 300 times per second then there will be many identical frames not giving you any information. So when the server updates twice as fast and your fps at least match the servers ticks per second and your monitor can display it you will get a smoother, better experience. The demo did show how ticks influence the gameplay with consistent fps
@@anonymouscommentator The frames won't be identical. That would make for a horrible gameplay experience. The information between ticks is interpolated and predicted by your computer. And most things in the game don't use ticks to update, such as your player's view, and position. Your position is only verified after the fact to be within a margin of error by using ticks.
Even if the TR the server runs at is literally 10, if you turn 360° in one second (without ramping speed), with your game running at 180 FPS, each new frame will have you rotated 2° further than the last. Those frames *are not identical.*
If a character walks through the Y dimensions from loc. 4 to loc. 6 in one tick, your computer will render the movement inbetween 4 and 6 using some regression model. When the frames are rendered, it will render (with a TR to FPS ratio of 1:4) 4, 4.5, 5 and 5.5 before landing on 6. Each of those frames have new information.
In conclusion, no matter the TR, your computer will still render new unique frames at it's own rate. Obviously I'm not saying faster TR isn't conducive to a smooth gameplay experience, I'm saying that TR and your FPS are two completely independent numbers, and his example showing lowered FPS as an example of lower TR is completely misleading.
@@sanjacobs6261 Sorry, i will have to correct myself. Of course user input will change the camera position and rotation thus resulting in a different frame. My example is from a still perspective and with "identical" i mean that the same (important) information is shown. Sorry for using a wrong term on that (im not a native english speaker). Even though something like an idle weapon animation will still technically change the picture, you dont gain any valuable information out of that. Interpolation is used to counteract jiggerey movement and rotation of other players so it artificially increases the buffertime to smooth out the gameplay (I think you know that). So in a way it does change the frame and for the player it is new information, however for the client pc it is not. So yes you are correct in that the frames will not be identical, however a higher tps will still make the client update position and rotation of others faster. (As i said not by much and i dont think its worth it)
And for the example he didnt lower the fps to show that a lower tps would make your frames go down too, that is a slow-motion to help you see the differences between the player positions.
Knowing have a advantage while peeking is even good mentally
Peekers advantage is also question of focus, the peeler knows when they are going, the holder just has the wait
I remember when this was called broken camera angles in black ops 2
Riot seems to be one of the few who understands whats really important to a competitive and smooth experience. Which makes me pretty hopeful for that fighting game they also have in the works.
NOW I FINALLY UNDERSTAND WHY oml I keep holding angles in COD and I get oneshot by ARs and pistols and I'm always like WTF?? BUT 50-120ms ping and this thingo explains it perfectly oh my lordy this is such an epiphany @_@
Other players : my ping is high (30 ms)
**Me with 150+ms ping randomly teleporting ** : bruu...
Plz do more overwatch on this Chanel and not only on overwatch league
Also congrats to the collaboration
Peekers advantage was the whole reason I was good at CoD back in the day. I could pop around a corner and kill people before they had a chance to even see me. I was the bane of corner campers as I knew where they hide so I'd just prefire their spots.
Akshon should give some credits to Drift0r and JackFrags for using their Valorant clips.
@@BS-qe3wc I mean, linking to a pastebin that doesn't even include the names is pretty low effort.
@@BS-qe3wc I think when you want to give credit it should easily visible for everyone. They could've just added their names in the description and keep the pastebin.
I like how you put so many rainbow six gameplay. That game has so much issues with peeker's advantage
The one big issue here is that all gaming developers are going down the route of hardware over software development, this is the IBM failure all over again. Sooner or later a company will start releasing brand new never heard of software that will out date any new hardware system. History repeats itself and it seems that's where we're going once again.
It's nice that they care to set up proper infrastructure as an attempt to address the issue, but it's not impressive considering that without these improvements, the advantage would still be reduced just because of how slowly players strafe into sight-lines and how wild aiming is at full strafe speed. I won't be excited about FPS games until a fast-paced game with amazing net code is launched. Ultimately peeker's advantage will never be actually "solved" until we get some sci-fi quantum internet regardless, Valorant isn't actually solving the issue, they are just looking at other problems that shine a spot light on the issue like high ping and general game design.
Ive been victim of peekers advantage thousands of times, i just didn't know that was the name of it
Ah okay thanks
I don't know. Peekers advantage gives attackers a chance against camping players. I don't think it's too bad
As an old school R6 player, the mentioning of peekers advantage makes me angry to even think about. I’m glad that riot is doing their best to mitigate such a huge issue, but this video didn’t properly explain how the steps they’re taking directly correlate to the reduction of PA.
The actual way the countered it is making everyone slow as hell. It’s impossible to not tag someone when they try and shoulder peek or anything
1:08 this is literally not an example of peakers advantage. this is just angles. plain and simple. stationary player will never see the moving player because he’s close to the angle. even if the moving player ran out and then stopped, the stationary player still wouldn’t see him. terrible example.
uJEREXbEAST I agree with bad example but explanation is wrong. If the enemy can see him clear as day and even jumped out so far, he should be able to see the enemy peaking like that
There is definitely a peeker's advantage in Valorant which is obvious from any testing. Riot is not solving anything in this regard.
I mean the example at 1:09 is not a good one, this is just basic geometrical optics, because the player who is holding this angle is so close to the "pivot" point that it's logic the peeker will see him before the other one sees him, this is not a latency problem at all...
Ye there is a problem where my game just freezes to 15-20 seconds and one time the game went “wobbly” it kinda looked like the old static thing except you could clearly see that there was something going on in the game and there was no sound. I live in Ireland so that could be a problem any Irish people please speak up so I know if it’s a me problem or a them problem
nah mate no problems in Ireland for me
Neil Joshy rip
there is a downside for peeking which is the time for brain to locate the enemy.
1:07 I play this game and the reason he didn’t see him was because he was mounted on that angle not cuz of Parker’s advantage lol. Just wasn’t in his field of view.
Was going to say the same thing, of course he wasnt on the screen, he wasnt supposed to be on the screen in that clip but it was used to strengthen his cause.
With Valorant the only Peakers Advantage is that it advantages certain people who want to Peek at your files.
All this time I thought I was just good at coming around corners, now I know
No one here understands what snapshot interpolation is and how you can never truly eliminate peakers advantage, even with 5ms ping.
People: complain about peekers advantage Me with my 3ds xl: *laughs in touch pen*
This is a very common occurance in Rainbow 6
This video: "but that's not a fix, just a bandaid"
Also this video: "but riots bandaid is awesome" 😑
No, they spoke of how Riot is actively looking at the issue as a result of internet and latency problems. The 'bandaid' was changing gameplay mechanics.
This is really only a problem in close quarters sweaty competitive games tbh. In Battlefield no one really talks about this nor is this really an issue even thought it probably exists. I don't really think this is an issue in Team Fortress 2 either.
This is one of the least important issues facing good fps games...
Riot is an indie company. And in Europe The Servers are burning on a daily Basis.
I LOVE YOUR RUclips CHANNEL! 💓 Can you do more Overwatch vids?
Yeah pls overwatch😊