funny thing is. most of lovecrafts entities are not even villains, their goals and morals are just so far beyond us that its like an ant trying to understand what is our thought pattern when we place poison traps for them when we spot them in our kitchen. they just think they found a stable food source and this god like being has decided to punish them for their mere existence.
Lovecraft is good because he actually introduces us to "villains" who can actually threaten us , unlike a lot of movies nowdays where the villain is only a mere obstacle.
By “nowadays” you basically mean “all other fiction” There are very few actual exceptions, based on the premise “Lovecraft creates actual villains whom the Heroes have no actual hope of defeating” 💙 To represent this, we have some fiction where the Heroes … don’t succeed in “defeating” the antagonist. Their world changes and the end of the story is merely them adapting to the new state of things Of course, this consideration gets more complicated when we start to differentiate between Heroes with “a hope” of defeating their antagonist and those Heroes who must go on some type of journey or quest to obtain the necessary “level up” to achieve their victory 💙💙
That's not Lovecraftian at all. Lovecraft isn't about "overwhelming forces" or "sanity unraveling". It's about how in the grand scheme of the universe the human is inconsequential.
A villain in the story I’m writing is evil itself. It’s an ancient being, a manifestation of ill will, greed and corruption. The people of the world like to blame the entity for influencing them, that this creature brought evil to the world, when in reality it is a manifestation of people’s evil doings. It was created by human greed, violence and corruption etc. Instead of being the cause of evil, it’s the result, and it can never truly be killed, because people will always keep doing horrible things to each other.
This is exactly what my story needed. I already had a hero slowly succumbing to a insidious alien horror but this video has added that layer of immersion I was looking for. Thank you so much! SUBSCRIBED!
I would also say that focus here usually shouldn't be killing the being, or even affecting it in important way. I think if in the story we start noticing that the only way is to get out of the way, it gives another dimension to the horror, especially if the protagonist is competent. Also slaying incomperhensible horrors might potentially take away from the fear of unimportance. Unless statement that we are important is the goal.
Great point, yes. While you certainly can pull off "kill that being" resolutions here, it does add another dimension of tension/horror when finding a solution to "getting out of the way" is the only option.
Agreed, it's like trying to slap back a tidal wave. Reality is you run for dear life and get as high up as you can and then just wait. It's all the more terrifying because of that.
I prefer the careless touch approach to cosmic horror. The sentient wildfire could be close, but more like "Evolution" the movie. Something arrives and starts changing the world irrevocably. Great video.
That one word changed an idea I had in my story that was just okay to feeling pretty compelling: "Incomprehensible." Powerful concept. Thank you for this video.
Excellent video! I've written some D&D campaigns with lovecraftian/ cosmic horror premises, but they have never felt full and "real". This video is a great help, and I think it'll help my writing :D
I recommend "Shards of Earth" for a good sci-fi example. I just finished the first book. Spoiler-free synopsis: In the book, moon-sized crystaline-mountain-range-covered beings start showing up randomly above inhabited planets. Using unimaginably powerful gravitational manipulations, they sculpt inhabited worlds- precise down to the molecular level - into alien sculptures. They are known as Architects for that reason. They only ever appear over inhabited worlds, and all of humanity is forced to live with the knowledge that at any moment they may need to evacuate the planet, leaving behind their homes and all their possessions. Architects are completely incomprehensible and ridiculously powerful. The first book is about a crew on a scavenger vessel, a discovery they make, and the ramifications of that discovery as it pulls them into conflict with the most powerful factions in the human galaxy. I want to say more because there is so much excellent world building and an amazing plot, but I don't want to spoil a single thing. Every revelation is so satisfying. The world building is seamlessly integrated into the plot. It gives the book's universe an incredible depth.
The Tyranids are a great example of eldritch monsters. They are essentially a singular organism split into horde of snapping jaws and ripping talons and claws, all purposely designed to devour, consume and assimilate all biomass in its way. They are entirely alien, unreasonable and totally relentless, and yet despite all of that there is an uncanny, possibly even recognisable sentience somewhere deep within its hivemind. It is a force of nature that does not care about art and games or war or diplomacy or good and evil, love or pain, nor does it even have a concept of those things. It is hungry and you will be devoured. I love 'Nids
When I first saw Jurassic Park, back in the day, I remember most of the women, and some guys too, lifting their legs to the seat when the raptors first appeared. It was a primal reaction, akin to that of cosmic horror.
Well said, one issue I think writers face regarding a series (like Buffy) is having to create something more powerful or stronger than the last villian. Understandably why, but, it creates the challenge of having to come up with something so powerful that it takes the audience out of their disbalivability. Interestingly, Netflix's Sabrina tended to keep the villains generally on the same playing field. Just altered the type of villain. It did end with the Eldrich Horrors, but each of them had a paramount weakness to exploit, so the good guys victory was still plausible but not handed to them on a silver platter. So, circling back to your video, the villain, while important, can be anything great or small. But, it is their influence and the adaptability of the hero that play one of the more crucial parts.
I had the problem with the show "Supernatural" myself. Loved the early seasons like crazy but they went up the power-ladder too quickly and eventually it just became too much of an over-the-top "god vs devil with tons of protagonist resurrections" for me.
@@TheTaleTinkerer I was about to talk about that show too. When Kripke left the series, the new producers literally remade his formula over and over again. They were good technicians but not artists, as they tried to insert their leviathan storyline in s7 and... well.
Good observation. I think that writers, especially on TV, should think about weakening the characters sometimes instead of buffing the villains. One of the characters could be traumatized and trying to avoid the fight, giving the villain the upper hand. Or the next villain simply has more information about the hero, because the last villain passed that information on. Or the hero no longer has their special weapon. Or no one will believe the hero, so he isn't able to receive as much support this time. I think this is good to think about even within one book. It's easy to fall into a very predictable structure: characters face a cart boy, then a cashier, then a department manager, then a store manager, then the store owner, then a corporate guy in a cubicle, and finally a CEO. The hero should be growing and evolving, but there should also be setbacks and defeats. The story can start with the hero losing to the manager, then almost losing to the cart boy. Then the hero can find a way to manipulate the CEO, weilding the CEO as a weapon against all of his underlings, and then finally once the villain's forces have been weakened the hero can finally face them.
Anytime someone takes the time to explain the Void, and the ancients who roil and toil beyond the veil, I hear you, Lovecraft for all his quirks gave us the unfathomable......Great video
@@TheTaleTinkerer Thanks! This is one of the bosses in the game that we've gotten many cosmic horror/lovecraftian interpretations from: ruclips.net/user/shorts-d87IBf4QF4?feature=share and this is our latest trailer showing some of the worlds ruclips.net/video/uhkBJS_n7Qc/видео.html
Hey you made the video! It turned out great! I appreciated the example you gave about interweaving the conflict of human characters and cosmic antagonists. Even many of the classic Lovecraftian stories are focused on the cosmic and less on the human details, and I think a balance between the two can amplify both and make for interesting storytelling. Some of the best stories I’ve read have an overarching force that effects the setting and world, and when the characters interact with it, and further become tied to it somehow, it raises the stakes in new ways and creates cool and original ideas. I hadn’t really considered just how much of the scare or enormity if the antagonist comes from just seeing it’s effect on things. I’m definitely going to favorite this one. Thanks again!
Great comment. I love the 3 Body Problem series. Not going to spoil anything other than to say that we don't physically see cosmic horror, and yet it is the most terrifying book I've ever read. I got chills a hundred times.
How do you capture this in a visual medium such as manga? Considering given example around 10min of "stilness in the air", I just dunno how to capture it. Sure peopel being angsty or birds fleeing is possible but that alone doesnt inflict the dread of cosmic horror.
Hmm….I've never been a fan of Lovecraft but I can understand the appeal. Still, this gives me a lot of ideas for what is in my setting is called the Remnants of the Void in which the essence of the Void that preceded the Creation of Universe tries to undo all of Creation. So this is actually a treasure trove of good ideas for this villain.
I always appreciate a lovecraftian villain. My favorite would be the Absolute Solver from Murder Drones. I have a few of my own planned. One which is literally just a primordial shadow. I have an abyssal serpent that wants to eat the world. And I have a matter manipulating mass of silver water the size of a planet adrift in space. The only issue is, how would a mortal defeat such an entity? Well, with the Primordial Shadow, the protagonist used the power of its twin entity, the Primordial Luminescent. For the mass of living, matter manipulating, silver water, (it’s not actually hostile, but for the sake of being hypothetical) the entity would die if its mortal host died with it trapped inside, so there would need to be a very strong-willed sacrifice who is able to keep his wits about him for a few seconds under the strain of an immensely powerful, (and immensely pissed) entity trying to destroy him. For the abyssal serpent (Apophis), it can only escape from the abyss from a few specific points on Earth, and the gateway that allows the serpent to escape is extremely unstable, so it can easily be collapsed. But if it escapes, basically, the world is doomed. There is one shot to kill it, but it’s at the core of the abyssal pocket dimension that acted as its prison. There is a strange mass of tissue with tendrils that extent outwards. Destroy the mass, and you will have a shot as the serpent’s null essence. Destroy that, and the snake will be sucked back into the void and the pocket dimension will implode (with whoever destroyed the core along with it)
@@stanleyholmes1266 whoops, forgot to finish my comment, lol. Even still, that’s a nice one, I’ll remember that. However, if the entity was intelligent, chances are it knows the value of earth outweighs the value of a decoy.
I don't see an issue. Why should a cosmic horror have to lose? Every major Lovecraftian story ends in disaster and tragedy for good reason. Hope extinguished is a literary spice. Just wait till the end to sprinkle it on. 😈
@@MichaelSplatkins true, but it’s a fun and interesting writing exercise to find ways for an immortal, immense being of incredible power to be defeated.
I actually have it to where three cosmic beings while two support life as a whole and one is against it. One of the ones that support it was born of the other two and a key part in the creation of life and balance. These beings will be mentioned and revered as gods throughout the story with only their influence being seen except for a few special occasions where their attention is drawn to the planet between the constant struggle between their influences. With the three of them I was able to form how everything came to be, the world religions and certain cultures as well as eventually creating a political structure around how certain circumstances are treated like magic, race, and how villians come to be in the world I've made.
For me, a cosmic horror that makes you feel insignificant from the beginning is not as effective as a cosmic horror that makes your best effort to stop it feel insignificant. Imagine you believe, even hope, you have a chance at stopping a descending, uncaring and indifferent being from destroying everything you know. In the final moment, when it's time to end it, you realize you never really stood a chance. Your long and arduos struggle to save everything was for nothing. Your effort means nothing in the end. That's far more effective than making me feel small compared to the incomprehensible size of the universe.
You mean the examples such as Callum investigating his home town? These type of examples are usually something I make up for the videos. In terms of worldbuilding, sometimes I include things from my own world but most of the times - at least currently - it is exclusively for each video 🙂
Why not go beyond? Make the unknowable entity incompressible in nature but mentally human. Perhaps the embodiment of death is scared of getting to know mortals because it's scared of caring about them. The fire that burns away at magic itself is only doing this because it blames the god of magic for the loss of a loved one. The entity doesn't even understand itself and is going through an identity crisis, causing ruin to the mortal realm. What if everyone knew about the Lovecraftian being? There could be a culture around worshiping it, protecting one's self from it, or studding it. Then you can reveal that everything they thought they knew about was false and everything they were doing to appease it was merely superstition. Cosmic horror is all about feeling small, that you don't everything about the world you live it, but more accurately... that you are an ant in someone's backyard, living for 7 years doing hard labor to serve your colony while never thinking about stuff like cars, rent, or climate change. No, that is what the humans know about and are effect by. They are immortal compared to you, the size of mountains compared to you, could destroy your entire colony because you were in the way of their new garden. To you, how are they not unknowable, all powerful, cosmic being?
"Perhaps the embodiment of death is scared of getting to know mortals because it's scared of caring about them." That certainly would be an interesting take, yeah 🙂
The story of lovecraftian horror starts off good but the intrigue peters out as the story progresses to mid to late mid section. Also trying to justify the incomprehension aspect of lovecraftian horror in story telling is like explaining 4D concepts which bores out the reader. The incomprehension part of lovecraftian horror is illogical and it driving out people insane when you view it is also a cop out. It is equivalent to performing mental gymnastics trying to explain the biblical gad which was seen by hagar, the slve of abrahm then turned into angel. As you see in horror movies where the character makes idotic decisions because plot, this is where you notice plot dictates the decision thereby showing you how illogical they are.
That is a huge over generalization imo. 3 Body Problem and Shards of Earth (the latter of which is absolutely lovecraftian) are both great sci-fi examples of cosmic horror with excellent endings. As with all stories it can be done well, or it can be done terribly, or it can be somewhere in the middle. I disagree that an incomprehensible antagonist is illogical or a copout. To an ant, we are incomprehensible with our poison traps, or our ant-colony sized can of poison spray. I was hiking recently and sat on their mound. Thousands came out, confused, running around trying to see what happened. They could not possibly comprehend that a giant ape carrying complex plastic hiking gear sat down to eat and unknowingly collapsed all of the tunnels leading into their nurseries, causing incaclulable losses to the colony just because I tired and hungry and wanted to eat a sandwich. It's easy for me to feel sympathy for them, tossed about by the force of a being who came from 1,000 miles away- without warning- and devastated their whole world. The characters are where the logic can be found. Trying to tease apart the mystery where they can, drawing flawed conclusions with limited information, picking up disparate puzzle pieces that seem contradictory until more is revealed. Trying to understand the motivations of such an entity, trying to cope and maintain hope in the face of it. I'd love to ask if you have an example of a puttering "copout" lovecraftian cosmic horror? I think a lot of Lovecraft reads that way today because the genre has continued to improve and evolve.
@@samus598 Thank you for replying. BTW did you spoil Shards of Earth? I actually happened to make a much more precise argument during my first comment but apparently it did not get posted so I made a haphazard oversimplified post here. Motivation of such an entity is not always important, because it can just be a being of pure malice. 'drawing flawed conclusions with limited information, picking up disparate puzzle pieces that seem contradictory until more is revealed.. ' - This is part of the Detective intrigue this is what keeps the audience engaged. But I am talking about the main threat. BTW you see when you mentioned Ants, the ants are still able to know you because they have pheromones sensors small hairs and antennae and eyes, you are still within the Edge of their Comprehension. Because we know some ants/insects were able to develop defense mechanism they are able to affect you by biting or injecting poison/ac1d. Why were you affected? Because you and the ants are bound by Logic of Universe. The ants are still able to form large colonies with huge Ant Hills. For them a human destroying their colonies is equivalent to a storm or earthquake destroying their colony. They die out or able to create a colony somewhere if they can save the queen. And storms/earthquake also destroy even human settlements. IMO you cannot equate ants with humans, Because self-awareness, reasoning, intellect,logic grants humans certain comprehension faculties that are not available to ants. Even the Sun and even bigger stars(even galaxies) are within the realm of comprehension even though you feel insignificant in front of it but there is a point where for you where you brain notices it realizes it and just accepts it and you move one. Man will eventually through iteration, recording, development of knowledge system will be able to explain the chaos. So unless you are telling me lovecraftian horror is beyond chaos? Then that is like trying to create an image of stuff that existed before BigBang. You can speculate but it won't drive everyone who thinks about it to become insane. Hope you understand why driven insane is a cop out because it underestimates and trivializes human mind and comprehension as horror movies undermine their audience's intelligence. I think this insanity idea stems from the ancient j0daic notion that when anyone sees the biblical gad Yahweh, that person d1es so to explain the inconsistency the later authors changed gad to angel of gad when Hagar meets gad in forest.
I was born in Germany but grew up speaking both German and Danish, and now I've had English as part of my daily life for about 20 years as well. So it's a mix of all that somehow I guess 🙂
Forces of Nature as antagonists are mostly boring. They have no goal, the hero cannot argue with them and they cannot be stopped. So what's the use trying?
Stories like that focus on the efforts of people to overcome hardship. You can have protagonists gather resources, argue over approaches to a solution, win allies, defeat opposition with different ideas or who might seek to gain from others' misfortune, suffer losses, struggle, and overcome. Personification of opposition isn't particularly necessary.
Find even more videos to transform your storytelling and fantasy writing here: ruclips.net/p/PLDpOcpMPZP3D-KapKbtwA5mjPlEon9rad
funny thing is. most of lovecrafts entities are not even villains, their goals and morals are just so far beyond us that its like an ant trying to understand what is our thought pattern when we place poison traps for them when we spot them in our kitchen. they just think they found a stable food source and this god like being has decided to punish them for their mere existence.
Lovecraft is good because he actually introduces us to "villains" who can actually threaten us , unlike a lot of movies nowdays where the villain is only a mere obstacle.
Super easy, barely an inconvenience
By “nowadays” you basically mean “all other fiction”
There are very few actual exceptions, based on the premise “Lovecraft creates actual villains whom the Heroes have no actual hope of defeating” 💙
To represent this, we have some fiction where the Heroes … don’t succeed in “defeating” the antagonist. Their world changes and the end of the story is merely them adapting to the new state of things
Of course, this consideration gets more complicated when we start to differentiate between Heroes with “a hope” of defeating their antagonist and those Heroes who must go on some type of journey or quest to obtain the necessary “level up” to achieve their victory
💙💙
That's not Lovecraftian at all. Lovecraft isn't about "overwhelming forces" or "sanity unraveling". It's about how in the grand scheme of the universe the human is inconsequential.
A villain in the story I’m writing is evil itself. It’s an ancient being, a manifestation of ill will, greed and corruption. The people of the world like to blame the entity for influencing them, that this creature brought evil to the world, when in reality it is a manifestation of people’s evil doings. It was created by human greed, violence and corruption etc. Instead of being the cause of evil, it’s the result, and it can never truly be killed, because people will always keep doing horrible things to each other.
This is exactly what my story needed. I already had a hero slowly succumbing to a insidious alien horror but this video has added that layer of immersion I was looking for. Thank you so much!
SUBSCRIBED!
I would also say that focus here usually shouldn't be killing the being, or even affecting it in important way. I think if in the story we start noticing that the only way is to get out of the way, it gives another dimension to the horror, especially if the protagonist is competent. Also slaying incomperhensible horrors might potentially take away from the fear of unimportance. Unless statement that we are important is the goal.
Great point, yes. While you certainly can pull off "kill that being" resolutions here, it does add another dimension of tension/horror when finding a solution to "getting out of the way" is the only option.
Agreed, it's like trying to slap back a tidal wave. Reality is you run for dear life and get as high up as you can and then just wait. It's all the more terrifying because of that.
I prefer the careless touch approach to cosmic horror. The sentient wildfire could be close, but more like "Evolution" the movie. Something arrives and starts changing the world irrevocably. Great video.
Evolution was such a good movie
That one word changed an idea I had in my story that was just okay to feeling pretty compelling: "Incomprehensible." Powerful concept. Thank you for this video.
I'm glad to hear that the video was helpful for you. Thank you for leaving the feedback 🙂
Unfathomable
Excellent video! I've written some D&D campaigns with lovecraftian/ cosmic horror premises, but they have never felt full and "real". This video is a great help, and I think it'll help my writing :D
Thank you for the positive feedback - always so wonderful to hear when a video of mine is able to help someone in some ways :)
Lovecraftian horror is my favorite antagonist with D&D games! As a DM, I consider it my specialty
Not so much my fantasy series. But i have an idea like this for my Sci Fi
At risk of you feeling your idea isn’t unique, there are some of these in the deep space on Star Wars legends. Super cool.
I recommend "Shards of Earth" for a good sci-fi example. I just finished the first book.
Spoiler-free synopsis:
In the book, moon-sized crystaline-mountain-range-covered beings start showing up randomly above inhabited planets. Using unimaginably powerful gravitational manipulations, they sculpt inhabited worlds- precise down to the molecular level - into alien sculptures. They are known as Architects for that reason.
They only ever appear over inhabited worlds, and all of humanity is forced to live with the knowledge that at any moment they may need to evacuate the planet, leaving behind their homes and all their possessions.
Architects are completely incomprehensible and ridiculously powerful.
The first book is about a crew on a scavenger vessel, a discovery they make, and the ramifications of that discovery as it pulls them into conflict with the most powerful factions in the human galaxy.
I want to say more because there is so much excellent world building and an amazing plot, but I don't want to spoil a single thing. Every revelation is so satisfying. The world building is seamlessly integrated into the plot. It gives the book's universe an incredible depth.
The Tyranids are a great example of eldritch monsters. They are essentially a singular organism split into horde of snapping jaws and ripping talons and claws, all purposely designed to devour, consume and assimilate all biomass in its way. They are entirely alien, unreasonable and totally relentless, and yet despite all of that there is an uncanny, possibly even recognisable sentience somewhere deep within its hivemind.
It is a force of nature that does not care about art and games or war or diplomacy or good and evil, love or pain, nor does it even have a concept of those things. It is hungry and you will be devoured.
I love 'Nids
Rejoice for you shall join the star children.
Love your videos. Keep them coming!
Thank you for the positive feedback - lots more to come 🙂
When I first saw Jurassic Park, back in the day, I remember most of the women, and some guys too, lifting their legs to the seat when the raptors first appeared. It was a primal reaction, akin to that of cosmic horror.
Well said, one issue I think writers face regarding a series (like Buffy) is having to create something more powerful or stronger than the last villian.
Understandably why, but, it creates the challenge of having to come up with something so powerful that it takes the audience out of their disbalivability.
Interestingly, Netflix's Sabrina tended to keep the villains generally on the same playing field. Just altered the type of villain.
It did end with the Eldrich Horrors, but each of them had a paramount weakness to exploit, so the good guys victory was still plausible but not handed to them on a silver platter.
So, circling back to your video, the villain, while important, can be anything great or small. But, it is their influence and the adaptability of the hero that play one of the more crucial parts.
And power of friendship!
I had the problem with the show "Supernatural" myself. Loved the early seasons like crazy but they went up the power-ladder too quickly and eventually it just became too much of an over-the-top "god vs devil with tons of protagonist resurrections" for me.
@@TheTaleTinkerer I was about to talk about that show too. When Kripke left the series, the new producers literally remade his formula over and over again. They were good technicians but not artists, as they tried to insert their leviathan storyline in s7 and... well.
Good observation. I think that writers, especially on TV, should think about weakening the characters sometimes instead of buffing the villains.
One of the characters could be traumatized and trying to avoid the fight, giving the villain the upper hand. Or the next villain simply has more information about the hero, because the last villain passed that information on. Or the hero no longer has their special weapon. Or no one will believe the hero, so he isn't able to receive as much support this time.
I think this is good to think about even within one book. It's easy to fall into a very predictable structure: characters face a cart boy, then a cashier, then a department manager, then a store manager, then the store owner, then a corporate guy in a cubicle, and finally a CEO.
The hero should be growing and evolving, but there should also be setbacks and defeats. The story can start with the hero losing to the manager, then almost losing to the cart boy. Then the hero can find a way to manipulate the CEO, weilding the CEO as a weapon against all of his underlings, and then finally once the villain's forces have been weakened the hero can finally face them.
Anytime someone takes the time to explain the Void, and the ancients who roil and toil beyond the veil, I hear you, Lovecraft for all his quirks gave us the unfathomable......Great video
Thank you for leaving that positive feedback. Glad to hear the video was useful/interesting for you 🙂
What about a villain who's intentionally crazy, mad and chaotic just because he's bored? Poweful but playful as pitbull with a meat pinata.
Great reflection as we deepen our understanding of the bosses in our video game. Thanks for a compelling video!
Glad to hear it was helpful, and even more if it was helpful for a video game 🙂
@@TheTaleTinkerer Thanks! This is one of the bosses in the game that we've gotten many cosmic horror/lovecraftian interpretations from: ruclips.net/user/shorts-d87IBf4QF4?feature=share and this is our latest trailer showing some of the worlds ruclips.net/video/uhkBJS_n7Qc/видео.html
Hey you made the video! It turned out great! I appreciated the example you gave about interweaving the conflict of human characters and cosmic antagonists. Even many of the classic Lovecraftian stories are focused on the cosmic and less on the human details, and I think a balance between the two can amplify both and make for interesting storytelling. Some of the best stories I’ve read have an overarching force that effects the setting and world, and when the characters interact with it, and further become tied to it somehow, it raises the stakes in new ways and creates cool and original ideas. I hadn’t really considered just how much of the scare or enormity if the antagonist comes from just seeing it’s effect on things.
I’m definitely going to favorite this one. Thanks again!
Glad to hear you liked it 🙂
Great comment. I love the 3 Body Problem series. Not going to spoil anything other than to say that we don't physically see cosmic horror, and yet it is the most terrifying book I've ever read. I got chills a hundred times.
Very Insightful. Well Done!
Thank you, glad to hear you liked the video 🙂
I consider Dickens festive spectres to be classed as examples of cosmic horror
"What does a creature that's never loved enough to know loss know of despair?"
How do you capture this in a visual medium such as manga? Considering given example around 10min of "stilness in the air", I just dunno how to capture it. Sure peopel being angsty or birds fleeing is possible but that alone doesnt inflict the dread of cosmic horror.
Hmm….I've never been a fan of Lovecraft but I can understand the appeal. Still, this gives me a lot of ideas for what is in my setting is called the Remnants of the Void in which the essence of the Void that preceded the Creation of Universe tries to undo all of Creation. So this is actually a treasure trove of good ideas for this villain.
Glad to hear there was something in the video that could inspire you - especially if you don't tend to like Lovecraft that much 🙂
I always appreciate a lovecraftian villain.
My favorite would be the Absolute Solver from Murder Drones.
I have a few of my own planned. One which is literally just a primordial shadow.
I have an abyssal serpent that wants to eat the world.
And I have a matter manipulating mass of silver water the size of a planet adrift in space.
The only issue is, how would a mortal defeat such an entity?
Well, with the Primordial Shadow, the protagonist used the power of its twin entity, the Primordial Luminescent.
For the mass of living, matter manipulating, silver water, (it’s not actually hostile, but for the sake of being hypothetical) the entity would die if its mortal host died with it trapped inside, so there would need to be a very strong-willed sacrifice who is able to keep his wits about him for a few seconds under the strain of an immensely powerful, (and immensely pissed) entity trying to destroy him.
For the abyssal serpent (Apophis), it can only escape from the abyss from a few specific points on Earth, and the gateway that allows the serpent to escape is extremely unstable, so it can easily be collapsed. But if it escapes, basically, the world is doomed. There is one shot to kill it, but it’s at the core of the abyssal pocket dimension that acted as its prison. There is a strange mass of tissue with tendrils that extent outwards. Destroy the mass, and you will have a shot as the serpent’s null essence. Destroy that, and the snake will be sucked back into the void and the pocket dimension will implode (with whoever destroyed the core along with it)
Bait the mass of waterstuff in the direction away from home instead of towards it, being the sacrifice a drama of who is gonna lead it out.
@@stanleyholmes1266 whoops, forgot to finish my comment, lol.
Even still, that’s a nice one, I’ll remember that. However, if the entity was intelligent, chances are it knows the value of earth outweighs the value of a decoy.
"I have an abyssal serpent that wants to eat the world."
Is there only one world to eat? If so, how would it exist itself when done eating? :)
I don't see an issue. Why should a cosmic horror have to lose? Every major Lovecraftian story ends in disaster and tragedy for good reason. Hope extinguished is a literary spice. Just wait till the end to sprinkle it on. 😈
@@MichaelSplatkins true, but it’s a fun and interesting writing exercise to find ways for an immortal, immense being of incredible power to be defeated.
Iä iä Lovecraftian villains ftaghn!
1:39 is the wildest pronunciation of Cthulhu I’ve ever heard……
Awesome video, just thought it was a funny dikhead comment to make
I actually have it to where three cosmic beings while two support life as a whole and one is against it. One of the ones that support it was born of the other two and a key part in the creation of life and balance. These beings will be mentioned and revered as gods throughout the story with only their influence being seen except for a few special occasions where their attention is drawn to the planet between the constant struggle between their influences. With the three of them I was able to form how everything came to be, the world religions and certain cultures as well as eventually creating a political structure around how certain circumstances are treated like magic, race, and how villians come to be in the world I've made.
For me, a cosmic horror that makes you feel insignificant from the beginning is not as effective as a cosmic horror that makes your best effort to stop it feel insignificant. Imagine you believe, even hope, you have a chance at stopping a descending, uncaring and indifferent being from destroying everything you know. In the final moment, when it's time to end it, you realize you never really stood a chance. Your long and arduos struggle to save everything was for nothing. Your effort means nothing in the end. That's far more effective than making me feel small compared to the incomprehensible size of the universe.
Where are the examples you used from? or did you make them up for the sake of the video? I want to read them now lol
You mean the examples such as Callum investigating his home town? These type of examples are usually something I make up for the videos.
In terms of worldbuilding, sometimes I include things from my own world but most of the times - at least currently - it is exclusively for each video 🙂
Why not go beyond? Make the unknowable entity incompressible in nature but mentally human.
Perhaps the embodiment of death is scared of getting to know mortals because it's scared of caring about them. The fire that burns away at magic itself is only doing this because it blames the god of magic for the loss of a loved one. The entity doesn't even understand itself and is going through an identity crisis, causing ruin to the mortal realm.
What if everyone knew about the Lovecraftian being?
There could be a culture around worshiping it, protecting one's self from it, or studding it. Then you can reveal that everything they thought they knew about was false and everything they were doing to appease it was merely superstition.
Cosmic horror is all about feeling small, that you don't everything about the world you live it, but more accurately... that you are an ant in someone's backyard, living for 7 years doing hard labor to serve your colony while never thinking about stuff like cars, rent, or climate change. No, that is what the humans know about and are effect by. They are immortal compared to you, the size of mountains compared to you, could destroy your entire colony because you were in the way of their new garden. To you, how are they not unknowable, all powerful, cosmic being?
"Perhaps the embodiment of death is scared of getting to know mortals because it's scared of caring about them."
That certainly would be an interesting take, yeah 🙂
The story of lovecraftian horror starts off good but the intrigue peters out as the story progresses to mid to late mid section. Also trying to justify the incomprehension aspect of lovecraftian horror in story telling is like explaining 4D concepts which bores out the reader. The incomprehension part of lovecraftian horror is illogical and it driving out people insane when you view it is also a cop out. It is equivalent to performing mental gymnastics trying to explain the biblical gad which was seen by hagar, the slve of abrahm then turned into angel. As you see in horror movies where the character makes idotic decisions because plot, this is where you notice plot dictates the decision thereby showing you how illogical they are.
just read lovecraft. there is no better teacher than the man himself.
That is a huge over generalization imo. 3 Body Problem and Shards of Earth (the latter of which is absolutely lovecraftian) are both great sci-fi examples of cosmic horror with excellent endings.
As with all stories it can be done well, or it can be done terribly, or it can be somewhere in the middle.
I disagree that an incomprehensible antagonist is illogical or a copout. To an ant, we are incomprehensible with our poison traps, or our ant-colony sized can of poison spray. I was hiking recently and sat on their mound. Thousands came out, confused, running around trying to see what happened. They could not possibly comprehend that a giant ape carrying complex plastic hiking gear sat down to eat and unknowingly collapsed all of the tunnels leading into their nurseries, causing incaclulable losses to the colony just because I tired and hungry and wanted to eat a sandwich.
It's easy for me to feel sympathy for them, tossed about by the force of a being who came from 1,000 miles away- without warning- and devastated their whole world.
The characters are where the logic can be found. Trying to tease apart the mystery where they can, drawing flawed conclusions with limited information, picking up disparate puzzle pieces that seem contradictory until more is revealed. Trying to understand the motivations of such an entity, trying to cope and maintain hope in the face of it.
I'd love to ask if you have an example of a puttering "copout" lovecraftian cosmic horror? I think a lot of Lovecraft reads that way today because the genre has continued to improve and evolve.
@@samus598 Thank you for replying. BTW did you spoil Shards of Earth? I actually happened to make a much more precise argument during my first comment but apparently it did not get posted so I made a haphazard oversimplified post here.
Motivation of such an entity is not always important, because it can just be a being of pure malice.
'drawing flawed conclusions with limited information, picking up disparate puzzle pieces that seem contradictory until more is revealed.. ' - This is part of the Detective intrigue this is what keeps the audience engaged. But I am talking about the main threat.
BTW you see when you mentioned Ants, the ants are still able to know you because they have pheromones sensors small hairs and antennae and eyes, you are still within the Edge of their Comprehension. Because we know some ants/insects were able to develop defense mechanism they are able to affect you by biting or injecting poison/ac1d. Why were you affected? Because you and the ants are bound by Logic of Universe. The ants are still able to form large colonies with huge Ant Hills. For them a human destroying their colonies is equivalent to a storm or earthquake destroying their colony. They die out or able to create a colony somewhere if they can save the queen. And storms/earthquake also destroy even human settlements.
IMO you cannot equate ants with humans, Because self-awareness, reasoning, intellect,logic grants humans certain comprehension faculties that are not available to ants.
Even the Sun and even bigger stars(even galaxies) are within the realm of comprehension even though you feel insignificant in front of it but there is a point where for you where you brain notices it realizes it and just accepts it and you move one. Man will eventually through iteration, recording, development of knowledge system will be able to explain the chaos. So unless you are telling me lovecraftian horror is beyond chaos? Then that is like trying to create an image of stuff that existed before BigBang. You can speculate but it won't drive everyone who thinks about it to become insane. Hope you understand why driven insane is a cop out because it underestimates and trivializes human mind and comprehension as horror movies undermine their audience's intelligence.
I think this insanity idea stems from the ancient j0daic notion that when anyone sees the biblical gad Yahweh, that person d1es so to explain the inconsistency the later authors changed gad to angel of gad when Hagar meets gad in forest.
@@adultdeleted I would add Nature alongside Man as being 2 Great Teachers.
I must know what kind of accent this is. O-O
I was born in Germany but grew up speaking both German and Danish, and now I've had English as part of my daily life for about 20 years as well. So it's a mix of all that somehow I guess 🙂
@@TheTaleTinkerer Ah, that explains why it was difficult to put my finger on. I appreciate your taking the time to respond! :)
...lok'tar ogar...
Forces of Nature as antagonists are mostly boring. They have no goal, the hero cannot argue with them and they cannot be stopped. So what's the use trying?
If you can master them, it really can add crazy depth to your characters. Though, unpolished ones can ruin a story.
Stories like that focus on the efforts of people to overcome hardship. You can have protagonists gather resources, argue over approaches to a solution, win allies, defeat opposition with different ideas or who might seek to gain from others' misfortune, suffer losses, struggle, and overcome. Personification of opposition isn't particularly necessary.
A villain is not the same as an antagonist
Are you sure you're in the right place? You're not embracing scope of what he's saying.