Just re-watching this after having watched it a couple times in late 2020 and owning and thoroughly enjoying the Bartok for over a year now. Thank you for the video, it is a great unit indeed.
My thought playing devils advocate, is if you sell a product and also ‘review’ it, that if you describe it in a way the brand don’t like, they reserve the right to take action they want to correct it. Simply because of the commercial arrangement between seller and brand and terms in place and the fact Cameron, I think, has a commercial relationship with this channel / seller so is probably a subcontractor or employee. This is probably what is under the surface in this context and if I’m right, the point that people should realise in reviews, is that an independent review of a product can say what it wants. People who sell a product and then ‘review’ cannot, both because : a) they want to sell it and b) for the commercial reasons above. That said I do empathise with Cameron and the heavy handed way he has been faced with such an officious and demanding letter.
Had Bartok for just over 1.5 yrs. A really outstanding dac. However presentation might not be slightly laid back for some. I use Tidal for steaming, good but not great. If this is going to be your main mode of listening then there might be better alternatives. CD transport via aes/Xlr and USB inputs are much better. Unfortunately USB is very much underdeveloped by DCS. Overall highly recommended but pricey.
I agree with you, I think CD players at a premium can have a hold on lots of streamers from my small experience of a premium cd player - the Mohican from Hegel, and judging what other reviews say too.
I know …I personally prefer the value for money stuff more but the sensible money is in the mid to low tier because diminishing returns are paid for. Alright if you’ve got the money but personally £20k on one hifi component is silly no matter the money. I’ve got some Totem Loon speakers atm and they are incredible for their price
Fantastic review, excellent way you mixed in "Getting away with it"- Owen Morris. I've got a few questions, since the DAC is so good in the Bartok, can you put a percentage on it in comparison with the DAVE and MScaler combo. Secondly what other DAC comes close to the Bartok, at which price point? Thirdly, how does it compare to the Denafrips Terminator / Denafrips Terminator Plus?
Thank you very much, it’s 5 percent on the Dave imo, but you may prefer Dave. Never tried Dave with m scaler. Don’t know what dac comes close not denfrips, never tried. Bw.
@@13thnotehifireviews7 yeah, I guess the casework is part of the hi-fi tho with isolated this and that... I actually ended up ordering a Rossini ... the addition of a second power supply and separation of the analogue and digital side made a noticeable difference... my goal is to add the clock at some point as I actually noticed that makes a difference too, just ran out of money at $25K 😂
@@13thnotehifireviews7 not to mention, even if they put it in a cardboard box, the military grade electronics work they do would still put this at north of $10K US for the Bartok,.
@@Sams911 I get the technical reasons of the case but sometimes you get great products that don't have such expensive casing. I suppose if you have the money then all power to you, but when I test some gear the case doesn't seem to be important. Mostly a lot cheaper so I see how it makes sense to money no object type hifi. Enjoy!
I doubt it gets massively better because as we know the diminishing returns for this type of hifi is big as you pay more and more, which the manufacturers wouldn’t disagree with at these prices, so it comes down to small percentage point differences normally.
@@13thnotehifireviews7 It definitely gets massively better when you have the caliber of system to match. Rossini with clock is entirely another league, let alone the Vivaldi stack. MSB Select II is yet another level better at detail retrieval and imaging, but not as dynamic as DCS.
Keep.it up Justin!! Another clean, concise, no nonsense review. This time on ultra premium gear.. Bravo!!!! I would love a double blind test for sound QUALITY between this and another "stratospheric" dac-stack at 3x the price or higher.. I say above this price point, improvements are subjective, not substance.
Hi. What do you make of the recent controversy where some reviewers are crticising the measurements of the Bartok and goldensound has said that the Bartok is just too soft. I am a Bartok owner and am curious on your virwsp
Goldensound is not someone I listen to and anyone professing an overt technical opinion where there are motives in the way, isn’t credible in HiFi. Presumptions are made by people regularly in HiFi based on ‘professed experience’ which is often or can be wrong. I always prefer to put out credible reviews that people can back up by listening themselves and get the sensible people onboard, not the sensationalists who are trying to get subscribers and build up RUclips income.
Is that a dent in the front panel of the unit? I just listened to one of these and it is pretty damn impressive to say the least. It made me want to sell my Hugo TT2.
@@13thnotehifireviews7 no worries I actually bought a bartok and have not looked back. I actually sold off most of my headphones and listen with speakers 99% of the time now.
The reason we have such poorly recorded music all around is because 99% music creators don’t invest in such high quality setups in the production studios. So having a super capable music re-production system at home becomes a moot point.
I believe many audiophile recording studios are using decent enough system. But surely not this type of expensive budgets. If one spend lesser money for lesser performing system, they get even more lesser overall performance of what the recording studio intended. One can always strive more than that or get as close as possible to the recording studio performance.
john darko reviewed this prduct again as purely a headphone dac. he fed the auralic aries g 1 bridge into the dac section and found it had the same sound quality as the bartok streamer. now the auralic aries g2 bridge is way ahead in sound quality compared to the auralic g1, . and the latest g2.1 has further improvements. a new heavy coper base like the naim 555 streamer s heavy brass plate. and more galvanic shielding. ithe g1 costs 1800£. In my opinion, a bettter more cost effective streaming solution would have the g2.1 at the front end, followed by the chord upscalar and chord tt 2 dac.
He would be able to get away and say it’s the same as the g1 because the Bartok is a pricey product with no metric on the value of the cost of the streaming part in the bartok. The Bartok streaming board is nothing special sonically. The dac is what you pay for. I doubt it’s way ahead as streamers have huge diminishing returns. Sitting listening to a linn Kilmax against an innuos zenith se, over double price and no change. G2.1 may have improvements but does it have improvements enough to make it value for money against the price hike? That’s the question to ask. I doubt it based on g1. Chord upscaler is poor value. Tt2 is tremendous. Bartok tremendous dac.
13th Note HiFi Reviews Based on my research into streaming audio and Q and A. with high end auditioners on forums such as Naim, they say that for Audiophile streaming to be realised, the “clocking “ of the digital source is vital, garbage in, garbage out. The conclusion is that the new products on the market offered by Innuos, Auralic and indeed DCS are very expensive “masterclocks” to be placed between Streaming bridge and DAC. These are the only Audiophile digital set ups, very expensive clocks feeding very expensive DACs like the BArtok that are reported as being truly astounding in sound quality. Ergo, for those of us not able to shelve out £20,000 or so as a digital front end in this way, the least we can do in planning our set up is to ensure the best possible digital streaming source ( many of John Darko s preoccupations in his videos is exactly to show the importance of a pristine streaming source). The Auralic G2.1 on the new Tesla 2 platform is definitely streets ahead of the G1 and so probably the most affordable quality streaming bridge at the moment that is to attain a “taste” of what is achieved by the masterlocks
Nice review. Have you tried bartok as an all in one streamer, dac, and preamp in a 2 channel audio setup? Does it sound excellent without a separate preamp? Thank you and keep up the good work!
Waitaminutesilly yes with my pmc’s and Cyrus mono amps. It’s an awesome dac, a little better than the Chord DAVE for me as it just strikes a fantastic balance of detail retrieval, natural balance and tone. The DAVE has detail retrieval but it’s not quite as balanced and decent with tone.
Waitaminutesilly yes sorry, on the pre amp issue I never even bothered to try as it is so awesome as a pre amp. dCS never bother with a separate pre amp in their premium systems like the 4 box systems they use on real premium gear. Go to my website and you can check out my written article on the review plus have a look at my factory tour photos and write up. Enjoy.
True Stu, but the reason it’s niche and high price is because of the small audiophile market. Take that out and it’s cheap. I guess it’s really whether you are prepared to pay for it. I would in the headphone system I mentioned, as lots of people spend a lot more than £12.5k plus headphones on HiFi.
An external DAC is only as good as the AMP and speakers connected to it. An individual can have the best DAC made connected to an AMP and/or speaker that will not yield the best results. I am curious what AMP & speakers would be recommended with this dCS DAC to take full advantage of its characteristics? Example: I tend to prefer a capacitor based/multi-bit DAC when pared with a class D AMP (yes even professional level class D). These capacitor based/multi-bit DACs when paired with a class D AMP to my ears soften the sharp clarity typically produced by those class D AMPs making for a great pairing. My question is, what type of setup would best be paired with the dCS DAC to take full advantage of its processing?
That’s like asking how long is a piece of string. It’s not a valid question. There is so much kit the dCS will improve from systems I used it in, to much pricier ones. It depends on how you rate value of the unit against the system which is a question for you to find out.
behemothinferno not at all. These were my own thoughts. The fact I reached similar but not identical views should tell you something about what goes into it and my credibility. My own planning, my own editing, my own listening, my own filming. It goes on and on. These videos take serious effort. Try it. Cheers.
Most of what you are buying this unit for is the dac (as this is the units talents 80-90 percent) so on that score you can buy it for that and add another amp to it. So I definitely wouldn’t be thinking about it in the terms you reckon.
Of course the DAC is what one buys this for but note the headamp module is actually £2000 and one can buy much better headamp with that sort of money. For me the stand alone unit without the headamp is the better option
John Smith respect to your view on that and it’s definitely a good way of looking at it. Check my article out on the website if you didn’t as I give the lowdown against some competition eg CHORD DAVE.
![Gucci Mane & Sexyy Red - You Don't Love Me [Official Music Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/j7IBqyFKT4c/mqdefault.jpg)
Just re-watching this after having watched it a couple times in late 2020 and owning and thoroughly enjoying the Bartok for over a year now. Thank you for the video, it is a great unit indeed.
Thank you too Andre.
I wasn’t sure to go for the Chord DAVE or dCS Bartok. After several reviews and your comment, I purchased the dCS Bartok, thanks.
how do you like it Joseph?
Goldensound brought me here
Me to,
@kentbergstrom3020 point being…….
Ahem...
Were you under duress to produce a favourable review?
See, im not too polite to ask😅
No I wasn’t under duress. Best dac by a mile.
My thought playing devils advocate, is if you sell a product and also ‘review’ it, that if you describe it in a way the brand don’t like, they reserve the right to take action they want to correct it. Simply because of the commercial arrangement between seller and brand and terms in place and the fact Cameron, I think, has a commercial relationship with this channel / seller so is probably a subcontractor or employee.
This is probably what is under the surface in this context and if I’m right, the point that people should realise in reviews, is that an independent review of a product can say what it wants. People who sell a product and then ‘review’ cannot, both because : a) they want to sell it and b) for the commercial reasons above.
That said I do empathise with Cameron and the heavy handed way he has been faced with such an officious and demanding letter.
Abyss 1266 + viva egoista 845 is the best combination as far as I know . Even more impressive than 009+blue Hawaii
Any measurenents or this is just good because expensive?
It’s just good because it’s expensive.
Bad Reviews are not allowed with DCS. They will sue everyone who does not write a positive review 😅
Had Bartok for just over 1.5 yrs. A really outstanding dac. However presentation might not be slightly laid back for some. I use Tidal for steaming, good but not great. If this is going to be your main mode of listening then there might be better alternatives. CD transport via aes/Xlr and USB inputs are much better. Unfortunately USB is very much underdeveloped by DCS. Overall highly recommended but pricey.
I agree with you, I think CD players at a premium can have a hold on lots of streamers from my small experience of a premium cd player - the Mohican from Hegel, and judging what other reviews say too.
It’s 4 years since this video and it’s astonishing that the equivalent product is now nearly double the price at £19k….
I know …I personally prefer the value for money stuff more but the sensible money is in the mid to low tier because diminishing returns are paid for. Alright if you’ve got the money but personally £20k on one hifi component is silly no matter the money. I’ve got some Totem Loon speakers atm and they are incredible for their price
Fantastic review, excellent way you mixed in "Getting away with it"- Owen Morris. I've got a few questions, since the DAC is so good in the Bartok, can you put a percentage on it in comparison with the DAVE and MScaler combo. Secondly what other DAC comes close to the Bartok, at which price point? Thirdly, how does it compare to the Denafrips Terminator / Denafrips Terminator Plus?
Thank you very much, it’s 5 percent on the Dave imo, but you may prefer Dave. Never tried Dave with m scaler. Don’t know what dac comes close not denfrips, never tried. Bw.
@@13thnotehifireviews7 A comparison with the MSB Discrete DAC with 2 power supply will be interesting
dCS is simply the benchmark for DAC's.... nothing even comes close. I had a PS Audio DS and it was good, but this is next level.
It is very good indeed. I'd like to see these types of products more mainstream with less expensive cases. I think we might in the future.
@@13thnotehifireviews7 yeah, I guess the casework is part of the hi-fi tho with isolated this and that... I actually ended up ordering a Rossini ... the addition of a second power supply and separation of the analogue and digital side made a noticeable difference... my goal is to add the clock at some point as I actually noticed that makes a difference too, just ran out of money at $25K 😂
@@13thnotehifireviews7 not to mention, even if they put it in a cardboard box, the military grade electronics work they do would still put this at north of $10K US for the Bartok,.
@@Sams911 I get the technical reasons of the case but sometimes you get great products that don't have such expensive casing. I suppose if you have the money then all power to you, but when I test some gear the case doesn't seem to be important. Mostly a lot cheaper so I see how it makes sense to money no object type hifi. Enjoy!
@@13thnotehifireviews7 thanks and keep up with the great reviews!
Considering Bartok is only the entry level in the DCS line, I'm guessing it indeed does get much better. There's also MSB and Esoteric.
I doubt it gets massively better because as we know the diminishing returns for this type of hifi is big as you pay more and more, which the manufacturers wouldn’t disagree with at these prices, so it comes down to small percentage point differences normally.
@@13thnotehifireviews7 It definitely gets massively better when you have the caliber of system to match. Rossini with clock is entirely another league, let alone the Vivaldi stack. MSB Select II is yet another level better at detail retrieval and imaging, but not as dynamic as DCS.
Keep.it up Justin!! Another clean, concise, no nonsense review. This time on ultra premium gear.. Bravo!!!! I would love a double blind test for sound QUALITY between this and another "stratospheric" dac-stack at 3x the price or higher.. I say above this price point, improvements are subjective, not substance.
Do you think it is better than the M-Scaler and Chord DAVE combination?
I am sure this is the best of the best, impressive. However it is just too eye-gorgingly costly.
It outperforms the naim reference streamer priced at £23000, which doesn’t come with a headphone amp
and thats their bottom of the line DAC... the Rossini is $24,000+ and the Vivaldi is $115,000 or so..
I wonder how it compares to the Latest offering from Linn - i.e. their Next Generation KDSM released earlier this year ??
Maybe a Rockna WD review with Hegel in the future?
Good call someone said about those !
That Electronic track is so good. Excellent review - I just subscribed.
David1200 cheers, thanks v much.
Hi. What do you make of the recent controversy where some reviewers are crticising the measurements of the Bartok and goldensound has said that the Bartok is just too soft. I am a Bartok owner and am curious on your virwsp
Goldensound is not someone I listen to and anyone professing an overt technical opinion where there are motives in the way, isn’t credible in HiFi. Presumptions are made by people regularly in HiFi based on ‘professed experience’ which is often or can be wrong. I always prefer to put out credible reviews that people can back up by listening themselves and get the sensible people onboard, not the sensationalists who are trying to get subscribers and build up RUclips income.
Is that a dent in the front panel of the unit?
I just listened to one of these and it is pretty damn impressive to say the least. It made me want to sell my Hugo TT2.
Yes demo units get bashed around . Not there when I received it.
It is an awesome unit. Step up from tt2
I don’t really answer this anymore. If people want to know I ask they make donations for personal chats etc.
@@13thnotehifireviews7 no worries I actually bought a bartok and have not looked back. I actually sold off most of my headphones and listen with speakers 99% of the time now.
Enjoy, it is a terrific product. 😀👍
@@13thnotehifireviews7 hi, may I know what percentage better when compare Bartok with Hugo TT2? Thanks
Amazing review and you’ve really tested the best of the lot.
@@13thnotehifireviews7 dcs?
Have you heard the dCS network bridge?
No haven’t tbh
The reason we have such poorly recorded music all around is because 99% music creators don’t invest in such high quality setups in the production studios. So having a super capable music re-production system at home becomes a moot point.
I believe many audiophile recording studios are using decent enough system. But surely not this type of expensive budgets. If one spend lesser money for lesser performing system, they get even more lesser overall performance of what the recording studio intended. One can always strive more than that or get as close as possible to the recording studio performance.
I'm puzzled that this sound so good on a youtube upload.
Cheers empire of the sun
john darko reviewed this prduct again as purely a headphone dac. he fed the auralic aries g 1 bridge into the dac section and found it had the same sound quality as the bartok streamer.
now the auralic aries g2 bridge is way ahead in sound quality compared to the auralic g1, . and the latest g2.1 has further improvements. a new heavy coper base like the naim 555 streamer s heavy brass plate. and more galvanic shielding. ithe g1 costs 1800£.
In my opinion, a bettter more cost effective streaming solution would have the g2.1 at the front end, followed by the chord upscalar and chord tt 2 dac.
He would be able to get away and say it’s the same as the g1 because the Bartok is a pricey product with no metric on the value of the cost of the streaming part in the bartok. The Bartok streaming board is nothing special sonically. The dac is what you pay for. I doubt it’s way ahead as streamers have huge diminishing returns. Sitting listening to a linn Kilmax against an innuos zenith se, over double price and no change. G2.1 may have improvements but does it have improvements enough to make it value for money against the price hike? That’s the question to ask. I doubt it based on g1. Chord upscaler is poor value. Tt2 is tremendous. Bartok tremendous dac.
13th Note HiFi Reviews Based on my research into streaming audio and Q and A. with high end auditioners on forums such as Naim, they say that for Audiophile streaming to be realised, the “clocking “ of the digital source is vital, garbage in, garbage out. The conclusion is that the new products on the market offered by Innuos, Auralic and indeed DCS are very expensive “masterclocks” to be placed between Streaming bridge and DAC. These are the only Audiophile digital set ups, very expensive clocks feeding very expensive DACs like the BArtok that are reported as being truly astounding in sound quality.
Ergo, for those of us not able to shelve out £20,000 or so as a digital front end in this way, the least we can do in planning our set up is to ensure the best possible digital streaming source ( many of John Darko s preoccupations in his videos is exactly to show the importance of a pristine streaming source). The Auralic G2.1 on the new Tesla 2 platform is definitely streets ahead of the G1 and so probably the most affordable quality streaming bridge at the moment that is to attain a “taste” of what is achieved by the masterlocks
How does this compare to the Holo May KTE?
Never tried
Hi did you try the volume control? When I reviewed it I noticed a major degradation of sound when the volume control was used.
No definetely didn’t find that.
Beautiful. That gouged faceplate hurts
wasn't me. They get knocked about a bit going from place to place I'm sure. Someone with butter fingers.
Nice review. Have you tried bartok as an all in one streamer, dac, and preamp in a 2 channel audio setup? Does it sound excellent without a separate preamp? Thank you and keep up the good work!
Waitaminutesilly yes with my pmc’s and Cyrus mono amps. It’s an awesome dac, a little better than the Chord DAVE for me as it just strikes a fantastic balance of detail retrieval, natural balance and tone. The DAVE has detail retrieval but it’s not quite as balanced and decent with tone.
Waitaminutesilly yes sorry, on the pre amp issue I never even bothered to try as it is so awesome as a pre amp. dCS never bother with a separate pre amp in their premium systems like the 4 box systems they use on real premium gear. Go to my website and you can check out my written article on the review plus have a look at my factory tour photos and write up. Enjoy.
Nils frahm.... Nice
I’m sure it can but at what price point.
True Stu, but the reason it’s niche and high price is because of the small audiophile market. Take that out and it’s cheap. I guess it’s really whether you are prepared to pay for it. I would in the headphone system I mentioned, as lots of people spend a lot more than £12.5k plus headphones on HiFi.
An external DAC is only as good as the AMP and speakers connected to it. An individual can have the best DAC made connected to an AMP and/or speaker that will not yield the best results. I am curious what AMP & speakers would be recommended with this dCS DAC to take full advantage of its characteristics? Example: I tend to prefer a capacitor based/multi-bit DAC when pared with a class D AMP (yes even professional level class D). These capacitor based/multi-bit DACs when paired with a class D AMP to my ears soften the sharp clarity typically produced by those class D AMPs making for a great pairing. My question is, what type of setup would best be paired with the dCS DAC to take full advantage of its processing?
That’s like asking how long is a piece of string. It’s not a valid question. There is so much kit the dCS will improve from systems I used it in, to much pricier ones. It depends on how you rate value of the unit against the system which is a question for you to find out.
I hear it's too smooth.
Wow that music track was stunning
Steve Birmingham definitely is. Such a heart warming melody, from empire of the sun as I think I highlighted
Try Audio Music DAC/1.
How about vs. rockna wavedream signature.
Not sure what that is
@@13thnotehifireviews7 Its a dac that is similar price range and praised by many. Have you compared the bartok to any other dacs?
Smood47 best check out website 👌👍
Sounds like you were paraphrasing Darko's review!
behemothinferno not at all. These were my own thoughts. The fact I reached similar but not identical views should tell you something about what goes into it and my credibility. My own planning, my own editing, my own listening, my own filming. It goes on and on. These videos take serious effort. Try it. Cheers.
wow , looks like the holy grail , one can only dream.
Headamp in the DAC is not powerful enough for top headphones
Most of what you are buying this unit for is the dac (as this is the units talents 80-90 percent) so on that score you can buy it for that and add another amp to it. So I definitely wouldn’t be thinking about it in the terms you reckon.
John Smith see my reply I did.
Of course the DAC is what one buys this for but note the headamp module is actually £2000 and one can buy much better headamp with that sort of money. For me the stand alone unit without the headamp is the better option
John Smith respect to your view on that and it’s definitely a good way of looking at it. Check my article out on the website if you didn’t as I give the lowdown against some competition eg CHORD DAVE.
@@JohnSmith-il6kk So buy the model without the headphone amp since it is an option! Easy solution!
Very good vid. Just joined.
GoldenEars Thankyou v much