вау!!! как я взолнован, не могу даже выразить своего восторга в словах, вау - высший класс, нет никаких этих "прыть", "пляс", там акробатических трюков, нет ужимок - ничего лишнего - высший класс, классика, эстетика, гордость, достоинство, кавказ, спасибо, прекрасно!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I JUST HAVE DISCOVERED THIS DANCE,,,AND IT IS THE MOST BEAUTIFUL THING I HAVE EVER SEEN!!! AND NODAR PLIEV IS THE MOST BEAUTIFUL DANCER/ MAN I HAVE EVER SEEN!!!!!
He is truly brilliant. It's not just the technique of dancing on his toes. It's everything. It's the perfect balance between sensuality and restraint. And the way it all just kind of stops. It's totally exhilarating. This is one person I regret not having met in person.
Drunchula, i don't care about teachers, or Tengiz, or Sukhishvili or Erisoni in this video. This beautiful dance is our Ossetian folk dance. This music is our excellent romance. This is our sweet Honga Kaft. And this man, Plite Nodar, our Ossetian son, is carrying our Ossetian genes. All these honours belong to OSSETIANS! Regards to all Caucasian dance workers (Georgian or Ossetian or others) and dance lovers.
Thanks. Someone recently told me that Simd is the one danced with a group of couples, but Honga is just one couple, during which the male dancer showcases his skill dancing on his toes.
Georgians are very talented and resourceful people. They have a singularly wonderful aesthetic sense. All of this due to the cosmopolitan nature of Tbilisi that was home to a diversity of peoples and cultures. Plurality is at the foundation of all human progress.
@Tipua37 Нодар Плиев стал профессионалом в ансамбле "АЛАН", А УЖЕ ПОТОМ его пригласил Сухишвили, также его приглашал в свой ансамбль Игорь Моисеев. А ,вообще, это дар от бога.
Getting back to Nodar and this performance, every time I watch it I find something else, some other detail that captures me. This time it's at t=00:24. I love the way he goes up on his toes.
woow! it is the best comment about a dance, i ever seen. you're %100 right. but i love much more Irbeg Pliev. He is cousin of Nodar, soloist man of Ensemble Alan. His style is more pure, stable & authentic, for me.
Nodar's experience of Honga must belong to Ossetian dance schools. although you said he rised in Georgian environment, we know that he didn't remained in only Georgia. Geo, is a little part of Nodar's dance experience. he was also the soloist of ensemble Alan. even only in youtube, you can see him in Ossetian troups as a young dancer, or in his middle ages. he danced in Ossetian troups everytime and i saw him many different Ossetian troups.
no,i havn't seen gandagana by nodar,but i've seen kazbeguri by davit and temur khozashvili (khozaev)-they are best performers of that dance in the history.they are ossetians and so what?i admit that they were the best and i'm proud that they, along with nodar pliev,dima jioev,badri tskhovrebov and others,made georgian dance culture.
if i comeback to Nodar, for the last time. Nodar... he was born in Georgia. but he didn't became a star only owing to Georgia. believe me, if he was born in Argentina, he would be a big Tango star. or in China, he would be a Kung-Fu movie star. this is his destiny. he has a beautiful body and a deep soul fully stuffed with art.
Again, I salute you! Brave and beautiful people of the Caucasus. Your, history, tradition, music, culture are adicting ! So, since i understand, this song and dance is named Honga Kaft? what are this lyrics about? Regards!
I would love to see a video of Irbeg. Unfortunately people outside of the Caucasus region, especially people who don't understand dance, don't get to see the good stuff and are impressed with things like the Georgian dance in Cirque du Soleil, which has little to do with art.
In terms of dance, my preference is Flamenco. There are lots of good videos on Utube. The reason Flamenco is so highly developed and complex is because there are no boundaries. Everyone is expected to take from others and innovate. Yes, some forms are better developed in particular regions, but no one would be so stupid as to say people are stealing from them.
they are gonig to finish. there is no money in dance businnes, any more. after USSR, nobody cares about dance, so much. but your Georgian troups are still standing. good congratilations. it is very good to watch them.
i have met with him personally. he was a very charismatic guy really. i have asked him a question about South Ossetia (at the same time, an armed conflict has began between Oss&Geo. in 2004). he has answered me with a hand move and a mimic which means "never mind" then he has taken a shot from his vodka. i have said, ok, then i've taken a shot too.
i said that, Ossetian dancers who danced in a Georgian troup, they served to Georgian culture. i accepted that. and Nodar danced in Georgian troups too. these all are your honour. but...
your comments really funny mr. geus! :) "nobody in the world knew Simd or Honga exited until Sukhishvili choreographed them" thanks to God! fortunately there is a big troups like Sukhishvili. otherwise, nobody wouldn't know Simd. but now, everybody knows Simd, in the world. Simd is 2nd famous phenomenon after Michael Jackson. we are indebted to Sukhishvili.
heeey! are you following me? :) nice to see you bro. nobody can teach to Nodar anything. this Ossetian guy makes dance you all Georgians, in a small kettle. then he eats you all! :) Don't ya see, Nodar is a monster! he is really a living legend.
i never said that we are number one, but if my aggresion is saying that georgians made those dances, then yes, i'm aggressor. if you check the history of caucasian dance, u have to see only dates and that's it. btw, u can check 1988 sukhishvili dancers list online and u can check how many ossetians danced there. now, do u think they served georgian culture or ossetian?
yes,everything i say is about stage performance and if u remember,in erisioni clip we argued and agreed that stage is different than original folk,but it's roots are still going to people. about me georgian,yes, i'm proud to be born and raised there and till my last breath i'll be georgia and defend my country, but i'm not and expert in everything-have no idea about chinese grammar for example:)but i do know little bit more about dance and history of caucasus, than average person.
i'm not sure but, something about a girl, who is like a flower. and singer doesn't know, where must he look for her. this song is an old folk song's variant. it's called Honga/Khongae and it's very popular in Caucasians, Ossetians.
btw, tengiz passed away couple of months ago and his son, iliko is head choreographer. u said u wouldn;t pay to see them. todays sukhishvili performance is 2 parts, old one and new one - all the dances in the new part are newly staged. it's your choice see or not see them. there are also other troups in georgia and guess what, they did survived in post soviet era and even more, had and have sell out performances all over the europe.
No, Nino Ramishvili died couple of years ago. In the last years, Iliko Jr was working with the ansamble, so he knows the stuff, but i can agree, after nina got old and couldn't get involved actively, troup became regular village performer. it's changing right now, but still, to compare to old days, it's a village ansamble. the only thing they do the best are solos. male performers are still the best.
bolat, i can agree that on youtube, he's the best honga performer, but i'll try to get old sukhishvili version of simd and there you can see how tengiz sukhishvili is performing. really hope you'll have balls to accept his class.
first of all,i didn't translated honga or simd. i just said that the dance is called invitation.not honga not simd. btw,if u know, simd and honga are usually danced together but people know it under simd name. and about dances-believe me, every single person in georgia knows that simd and honga are ossetian dances - simdi-ossetian dance - same thing.
you are right again. there isn't attraction but; there is totally character and art on this video. Nodar is an expressionist artist also :) i know only one video about Irbeg. please check the title, "lord of the dance caucasian" there, he is a little fat and he is not so young, but i love it. however, in this video, Nodar is not younger than 50. both of them are really cool.
Wow. You guys have really been going at it! Bolat you mentioned something about Pliev's anatomy. I was noticing his thin legs and wondering if that has something to do with why he's able to do what he does. As for all this arguing, we can thank old Stalin for that.
People outside of caucasus region do know our dances and cirque du soleil is just a show. everybody knows it. there wasn't even idea of cirque than georgian dances were known all over the world. of course, back then everybody from USSR was called russian, but still, it's now that hard to understand who's good performer.
if u have access to nodar,ask him was he better than tengiz in honga?there's no point of argue-nodar is proud son of ossetia and u guys love him.we, georgians are proud that he's a part of georgian culture and he's made by georgian teachers.but back then, nobody cared about your origin.and for me, he;s an artist, son of caucasus and i really like him.
Nart epos has a lot of thing with Alans. british scholars published a book about similarities of Nart and Arthur legends. They mentioned that, Sarmato-Alan mercenaries and their culture are the basic sources of Arthurian legend. Nart epos had made by North Caucasian tribes: Ossetians, Adiga-Kabards, Karachays and Chechens. Nart is belonging to them only.
and also, as i know, he was the people's artist of Georgia, Ossetia, Chechnia and one more republic (i don't remember maybe Daghestan). all these schools formed Nodar. now, how can anybody say, Georgia made Nodar?
have you seen Gandagan performance of Nodar? it was really cool. but i can't say that it is better then every Georgian dancers. actually, we are arguing about an absurd subject. it is art and it is a subjective point. everybody has their own liking. i am just opposing to be prejudiced because of ethnic obsessions. maybe i'm like that too, a little bit but, i think it is good to see the dancing Nodar or Tengiz.
if i meet him again, i will ask. but maybe he will say "Tengiz is better", if he is a modest preson. i can't say anything for Tengiz, i haven't seen him yet. it is possible that he is better than Nodar. but Nodar is a different organisma. look at his body. you can see what a thin feet he has. it brings a different tune for Nodar. dance becomes an amazing experience because of his anathomy and his soul.
bolat,i can't promise you that i'll upload it today or tomorrow,have to find old recordings, but i'll definately will and you'll be the first i'll inform. and do u really think i don't know the difference between honga and simd? :) BTW, in the georgian version, the one u don't like, simd is called "mipatizheba", meaning invitation. different huh?
your knowledge about Ossetian dance is owing to proffesional dance groups. but this is folk dance. this is not consisting only from stage and show. this is related to folk, its traditions, life style of people and cultural characteristic. maybe you don't have a concept about those, never mind, you are a Georgian, therefore you are natural born expert for dance or all subjects. Huh?
but this is current situation when there is a Georgian troup only. did you listened carefully the announcer on the begining of this video? what did she said? i don't know Russian (and (: Chineese too) but she said "Asetia", Ossetia. The dancers representing Ossetia in a festival in Daghestan. There is nothing about Georgia. Because there is no Georgian group. They are serving to Ossetia here.
In the past the dancers cared because being a dancer meant you could travel the world and have access to many things ordinary soviet citizens could never have. The world has changed. People's motivation has changed. There are better, more profitable ways to go abroad.
you don't say, but you think that... but although you claimed something strongly about Honga, you couldn't answer me what is the different between Hong and Simd. It was a simply question. after a clue, you could say only this; they are ussually danced together. but this is wrong. they are two different dances.
ok! i wanna say something for last time. you are defending your country and your peoples prestige, right? it's ok, it's normal. but how do you do that? there was a video about an Ossetian dancer. you said something: His teachers were Georgians. :/ ?
Oh, BTW! why don't i like an Ossetian-Georgian tarnslation? :) You translated for me a word: "Simd" as invitation. But you have a little mistake. In Ossetian, Honga means invitation, not Simd! Ahh Drunchula...
and everybody forgets that if we, caucasians have those dances now, it's because of iliko sukhishvili and nino ramishvili, founders of georgian national ballet. every move, every costume, every music - found, interpreted and staged by them.and after this we stole from them? what would u say?
i think you can't know who were your ancestors directly. you can just estimate about it. and i think that, Georgians have a mixed blood with Iranian nomads, or Turkic nomads. can you remember that how glorious Alans and Kipchaks helped you for rising of Georgian Kingdom?
I didn't know Tengiz had died. Did his mother outlive him? She must be very sad if she did. May he RIP. He was a nice man who gave opportunities to many guys who would otherwise have no future. Iliko was a very minor character years ago. His sister, I thought, was more capable. I never quite understood why the Sukhishvilis became such a dynasty.
it was not me. just somebody supposed that, i need to remember who were Nodar's teachers. they were Georgian teachers. ok. but what was that? i just mentioned that, his comments seems like ethnocentrism. why someone needs an attention about his nations (nominal) succes, when there was nothing about that subject?
i don't get annoyed, believe me. i know nodar's performance and i've seen him dancing in Tbilisi when i was kid. the whole audience applauded him. i just get mad when people and especially in the caucasus start talking crap about georgia, how we stole there dances and so on.
I would LOVE to see Tengiz dancing Simd. When I knew him all he did on stage was to come out an take a bow with his mom at the end. I look forward to your video. BTW, you seem to get annoyed whenever there's a suggestion that someone other than a Georgian can excel at something. Why is that?
It's a shame that we can't simply talk about dance, art, or whatever without it becoming an argument about who was there first and (I'm sorry) who's poop does or doesn't smell.
I am sure some will take offense at what I have written, but I am trying to be objective. I am sure Tengiz knows better than anyone that his company's in trouble. It has got to transform itself somehow to become viable in a post-Soviet world. This is true of every single folk dance ensemble from the former communist countries. Armenians get away with it a little bit because they have a diaspora to support them. But diasporan Armenians are starting to be critical of Armenia's exports.
You have a point. You know, that part of the world didn't have distinct national boundaries until the 19th century or so, so there was a lot of cultural cross-fertilization. That said, some art forms are better developed in some parts that others. Armenians are wonderful duduk players. Georgians are amazing singers. But when it comes to Simd, it's deeply Ossetian.
staging a dance, playing a music part... these are not "to steal something". your great Georgian Ballet, Sukhishvili, is a good ensemble. they are dancing very nice, every Caucasian dance which they want. and we are talking about folk dance; an anonymous product. no one can claim some right about it. so nobody said you stole dances.
I wasn't suggesting that people outside Cauc. region don't recognize your dances. My point was that when an audience doesn't look at a performance with a critical eye, you can do almost anything fancy and get applause. Kinda like Chinese food in America. Very different from the real thing, but the average joe would never know.
we can understand that what a prejudiced person you are, only because of your classification of dance troups. you said that, Nodar's Nartdance has higher level than any Ossetian groups. are these Ossetian groups containing main Ossetian group Alan? if it is so; how can you compare ensemble Alan and Nartdance?
The thing about Sukhishvili is that once the dances were choreographed and staged, they became very static. Little real artistic development has happened since the Georgian State Dance Ens. was formed. Ultimately it became a Soviet product that had little to do with the origins of the dances. Ultimatly it wasn't the best thing that could happen to Caucasian dance.
when a i was counting the peoples, who were owners of Narts, i forgot Abkhazians. Abkhazians are also owners of Narts. but these Abkahzians are not your Apkhazians, i mean real Abkhazians.
you always say, Sukhishvili staged Simd first. but is it true? i just searched somethings. i found an interesting info. there is an interview with Nino Sukhishvili. she says "ensemble Sukh. has been found in 1945" nonetheless, ensemble Alan has been found in the year 1938. if this infomation is true, how Sukhishvili staged Simd first? maybe Alan, couldn't think to stage Simd?
they are not dialects, they are cognate; but different languages. this is the fact. of course, if you wanna accept that. i wrote what i know in a Sukishvili war video for Drunchula. i don't repeat, you can see there, what i say.
i don't think that Tengiz has these abilities so much. Someone like Nodar, comes to earth only one time per century :) but i must see Tengiz first, before i say something for him. then we must ask to people on RUclips, who is better.
"Georgians made them classic" i am very wondering that, could you say it again, if you are not a Georgian. i was just talking about it, when i was marking to ethnocentrism. sometimes, ethnic feelings avert the objective criticism of art. when somebody shouts so strongly, without any wayout, maybe we must think about an ethnocentrism.
ok. :) i would like to finish this discussion. it was starting to be too long and boring. but i think i can't right now. because of your funny comments. my english is not enough to compete with you. but i wanna say something.
ooooooh yeeaaah! we can see more clearly the racist origins. we were just talking about dance. what is it now? i think these are very important signals about ethnocentrism, or where theorems about dance, art and culture are coming from. keep going!
i know Nartdance, they are very good troups for Turkey, but they are just amateurs. the dancers are just students and the persons who have different careers. i can't claim that Alan was better than Sukhishvili. but they were one of the best dance groups of Caucasia, specially in 80's. so, you must be a person, who have strong obsessions from his head till feet, or you must be blind.
yes, maybe he started to dance in Georgian schools. but i am sure that, he didn't learned Honga so much good, in these schools. i didn't saw any excellent Honga performance from Georgian dancers, honestly (i didn't saw Tengiz yet).
Yes, you didn't said you are number one, but your behaviour shows what you think actually. There is a video about an Ossetian dance from Ossetian dancers in Daghestan. You said that dancer is the best on RUclips but we must see another Georgian dancer's performance. You think he is better then Nodar.
you are amplifying a little bit. there was a troup of Vladikavkaz University, which formed by students. forget professional troups, we can just compare these amateur troups. i can tell you honestly, this universty troup was better then Nart Dance. by repertoire, costumes, musics, synchronization and many other things. maybe Nart Dances's some dancers have more technic. but it is not enough for to be a good troup, you know. so, please leave this bias.
there is another lie: Megrels are not Georgians. Apkhazs are Abkhazians. i can't believe that, how can terminology be used for politic benefits so much like that. Megrels are citizens of Georgia, but they are not Georgians by ethnos. their language is close to Georgian language. but it is a different thing.
Male performers get a lot of attention because of their acrobatics, but what they do has a real "manic" quality to it. The average audience doesn't know how to judge a performance, but all the solos eventually start to look the same and eventually it gets boring. This is not high culture.
a christian Ossetian marries with a muslim Ossetian. the religion is not important for Ossetians, christian, muslim or pagan... and Ossetians don't hate each others, who speaks their same language; and much more like than Georgians. it's the fact. yes, there is some problems between North & South Ossetians, but every Oss. knows that, they are all Ossetians.
ok i will wait for video. not for a racing, just i would like to see it. i'm sure that, Tengiz's performance is also good. i just asked, but yes, i am thinking now; you don't know Honga or Simd truly. You said somethings but, you couldn't answer me. Because you don't know actually, what is Simd and what is Honga. So, how can you arguing for something that you don't know completely? Maybe because of your nationalist personality? Every beautiful things must belong to Georgians for you. Ahh you :)
but, i know this now. being a depolitized man, not to interest about politics, and living like a tree, is better than to be a racist, an athnocntrist, a prejudiced nationalist. i will try to choose the second one. he is an artist. he just cares about dance. it's enough for him. but look, what we do here? :) if he can see us, he laughs to us, with his ass. let's forget everything and watch the video, if you still can.
:) good joke. but there, in Turkey a lot of Adiges, about more than 1 million. i have some Adige (Adiga,Adigha)friends. No one of them, call their native language like Turkiar, or Istanbulabze, or Ankarabla. so you're faking us :) a people, a country, a language, couldn't born like so easy.
Lucky that you can go to a village and see the locals try to perform what, at this point, is inevitably influenced by what the professionals do. There is no more any such thing as authentic or original. BTW, after the 3rd time, 64 or 1004 fouettes become boring. I have seen dancers move but their head slightly and get a standing ovation. If I want gymnastics I go to the Olympics.
Безумно волнительный прекрасный танец! Да ещё в таком восхитительном исполнении Эташтота! Спасибо! Спасибо! Спасибо!!!
вау!!! как я взолнован, не могу даже выразить своего восторга в словах, вау - высший класс, нет никаких этих "прыть", "пляс", там акробатических трюков, нет ужимок - ничего лишнего - высший класс, классика, эстетика, гордость, достоинство, кавказ, спасибо, прекрасно!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I JUST HAVE DISCOVERED THIS DANCE,,,AND IT IS THE MOST BEAUTIFUL THING I HAVE EVER SEEN!!! AND NODAR PLIEV IS THE MOST BEAUTIFUL DANCER/ MAN I HAVE EVER SEEN!!!!!
He is truly brilliant. It's not just the technique of dancing on his toes. It's everything. It's the perfect balance between sensuality and restraint. And the way it all just kind of stops. It's totally exhilarating. This is one person I regret not having met in person.
Drunchula, i don't care about teachers, or Tengiz, or Sukhishvili or Erisoni in this video. This beautiful dance is our Ossetian folk dance. This music is our excellent romance. This is our sweet Honga Kaft. And this man, Plite Nodar, our Ossetian son, is carrying our Ossetian genes. All these honours belong to OSSETIANS! Regards to all Caucasian dance workers (Georgian or Ossetian or others) and dance lovers.
i watched again. now, i can say that clearly: this is the most beautiful performance of this kind of the dance. the most beautiful! without any doubt!
Спасибо за видео.
Thanks. Someone recently told me that Simd is the one danced with a group of couples, but Honga is just one couple, during which the male dancer showcases his skill dancing on his toes.
Isn't it ? the dances and music of the Caucasus are among my favourites too !
Nodar is the greatest folk dancer of our world. :) Go Ossetians! :D
Georgians are very talented and resourceful people. They have a singularly wonderful aesthetic sense. All of this due to the cosmopolitan nature of Tbilisi that was home to a diversity of peoples and cultures. Plurality is at the foundation of all human progress.
@Tipua37 Нодар Плиев стал профессионалом в ансамбле "АЛАН", А УЖЕ ПОТОМ его пригласил Сухишвили, также его приглашал в свой ансамбль Игорь Моисеев. А ,вообще, это дар от бога.
Getting back to Nodar and this performance, every time I watch it I find something else, some other detail that captures me. This time it's at t=00:24. I love the way he goes up on his toes.
onunla tanistigimiz icin cook sansliyiz. ayrica cok tesekkürler videolar icin. ellerine saglik...
They served Georgian culture i think. I found successful the Georgian groups everytime. This is your honour.
woow! it is the best comment about a dance, i ever seen. you're %100 right. but i love much more Irbeg Pliev. He is cousin of Nodar, soloist man of Ensemble Alan. His style is more pure, stable & authentic, for me.
Nodar's experience of Honga must belong to Ossetian dance schools. although you said he rised in Georgian environment, we know that he didn't remained in only Georgia. Geo, is a little part of Nodar's dance experience. he was also the soloist of ensemble Alan. even only in youtube, you can see him in Ossetian troups as a young dancer, or in his middle ages. he danced in Ossetian troups everytime and i saw him many different Ossetian troups.
no,i havn't seen gandagana by nodar,but i've seen kazbeguri by davit and temur khozashvili (khozaev)-they are best performers of that dance in the history.they are ossetians and so what?i admit that they were the best and i'm proud that they, along with nodar pliev,dima jioev,badri tskhovrebov and others,made georgian dance culture.
if i comeback to Nodar, for the last time. Nodar... he was born in Georgia. but he didn't became a star only owing to Georgia. believe me, if he was born in Argentina, he would be a big Tango star. or in China, he would be a Kung-Fu movie star. this is his destiny. he has a beautiful body and a deep soul fully stuffed with art.
Again, I salute you! Brave and beautiful people of the Caucasus.
Your, history, tradition, music, culture are adicting ! So, since i understand, this song and dance is named Honga Kaft? what are this lyrics about?
Regards!
Adon dissajy raesugъd kafynts! waeddaer iron kaft iron kuyd akafa aftae nichi!:)
I would love to see a video of Irbeg. Unfortunately people outside of the Caucasus region, especially people who don't understand dance, don't get to see the good stuff and are impressed with things like the Georgian dance in Cirque du Soleil, which has little to do with art.
In terms of dance, my preference is Flamenco. There are lots of good videos on Utube. The reason Flamenco is so highly developed and complex is because there are no boundaries. Everyone is expected to take from others and innovate. Yes, some forms are better developed in particular regions, but no one would be so stupid as to say people are stealing from them.
Токое не каждый день увидешь молодцы короли ьанца
they are gonig to finish. there is no money in dance businnes, any more. after USSR, nobody cares about dance, so much. but your Georgian troups are still standing. good congratilations. it is very good to watch them.
NODAR is GREAT !!! BRAVO
i have met with him personally. he was a very charismatic guy really. i have asked him a question about South Ossetia (at the same time, an armed conflict has began between Oss&Geo. in 2004). he has answered me with a hand move and a mimic which means "never mind" then he has taken a shot from his vodka. i have said, ok, then i've taken a shot too.
i said that, Ossetian dancers who danced in a Georgian troup, they served to Georgian culture. i accepted that. and Nodar danced in Georgian troups too. these all are your honour. but...
As I understand it, Simd is the name of the dance, Honga is the name of the song. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
👏👏👏💐💐💐👍👍👍👍👍👍🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹❣️
your comments really funny mr. geus! :) "nobody in the world knew Simd or Honga exited until Sukhishvili choreographed them" thanks to God! fortunately there is a big troups like Sukhishvili. otherwise, nobody wouldn't know Simd. but now, everybody knows Simd, in the world. Simd is 2nd famous phenomenon after Michael Jackson. we are indebted to Sukhishvili.
wow, what a song ! what is the lyrics about ?
Respect and consideration from Romania, Europe !
Ooooo!!! Super...
heeey! are you following me? :) nice to see you bro.
nobody can teach to Nodar anything. this Ossetian guy makes dance you all Georgians, in a small kettle. then he eats you all! :) Don't ya see, Nodar is a monster! he is really a living legend.
Nodaru respect!
i never said that we are number one, but if my aggresion is saying that georgians made those dances, then yes, i'm aggressor. if you check the history of caucasian dance, u have to see only dates and that's it. btw, u can check 1988 sukhishvili dancers list online and u can check how many ossetians danced there. now, do u think they served georgian culture or ossetian?
yes,everything i say is about stage performance and if u remember,in erisioni clip we argued and agreed that stage is different than original folk,but it's roots are still going to people. about me georgian,yes, i'm proud to be born and raised there and till my last breath i'll be georgia and defend my country, but i'm not and expert in everything-have no idea about chinese grammar for example:)but i do know little bit more about dance and history of caucasus, than average person.
i'm not sure but, something about a girl, who is like a flower. and singer doesn't know, where must he look for her. this song is an old folk song's variant. it's called Honga/Khongae and it's very popular in Caucasians, Ossetians.
btw, tengiz passed away couple of months ago and his son, iliko is head choreographer. u said u wouldn;t pay to see them. todays sukhishvili performance is 2 parts, old one and new one - all the dances in the new part are newly staged. it's your choice see or not see them. there are also other troups in georgia and guess what, they did survived in post soviet era and even more, had and have sell out performances all over the europe.
No, Nino Ramishvili died couple of years ago. In the last years, Iliko Jr was working with the ansamble, so he knows the stuff, but i can agree, after nina got old and couldn't get involved actively, troup became regular village performer. it's changing right now, but still, to compare to old days, it's a village ansamble. the only thing they do the best are solos. male performers are still the best.
Nodar prosta master Lezginki...abazayui etat nomeir y musiku
bolat, i can agree that on youtube, he's the best honga performer, but i'll try to get old sukhishvili version of simd and there you can see how tengiz sukhishvili is performing. really hope you'll have balls to accept his class.
first of all,i didn't translated honga or simd. i just said that the dance is called invitation.not honga not simd. btw,if u know, simd and honga are usually danced together but people know it under simd name. and about dances-believe me, every single person in georgia knows that simd and honga are ossetian dances - simdi-ossetian dance - same thing.
you are right again. there isn't attraction but; there is totally character and art on this video. Nodar is an expressionist artist also :) i know only one video about Irbeg. please check the title, "lord of the dance caucasian" there, he is a little fat and he is not so young, but i love it. however, in this video, Nodar is not younger than 50. both of them are really cool.
Wow. You guys have really been going at it! Bolat you mentioned something about Pliev's anatomy. I was noticing his thin legs and wondering if that has something to do with why he's able to do what he does. As for all this arguing, we can thank old Stalin for that.
People outside of caucasus region do know our dances and cirque du soleil is just a show. everybody knows it. there wasn't even idea of cirque than georgian dances were known all over the world. of course, back then everybody from USSR was called russian, but still, it's now that hard to understand who's good performer.
if u have access to nodar,ask him was he better than tengiz in honga?there's no point of argue-nodar is proud son of ossetia and u guys love him.we, georgians are proud that he's a part of georgian culture and he's made by georgian teachers.but back then, nobody cared about your origin.and for me, he;s an artist, son of caucasus and i really like him.
Nart epos has a lot of thing with Alans. british scholars published a book about similarities of Nart and Arthur legends. They mentioned that, Sarmato-Alan mercenaries and their culture are the basic sources of Arthurian legend. Nart epos had made by North Caucasian tribes: Ossetians, Adiga-Kabards, Karachays and Chechens. Nart is belonging to them only.
and also, as i know, he was the people's artist of Georgia, Ossetia, Chechnia and one more republic (i don't remember maybe Daghestan). all these schools formed Nodar. now, how can anybody say, Georgia made Nodar?
have you seen Gandagan performance of Nodar? it was really cool. but i can't say that it is better then every Georgian dancers. actually, we are arguing about an absurd subject. it is art and it is a subjective point. everybody has their own liking. i am just opposing to be prejudiced because of ethnic obsessions. maybe i'm like that too, a little bit but, i think it is good to see the dancing Nodar or Tengiz.
Very nice......
if i meet him again, i will ask. but maybe he will say "Tengiz is better", if he is a modest preson. i can't say anything for Tengiz, i haven't seen him yet. it is possible that he is better than Nodar. but Nodar is a different organisma. look at his body. you can see what a thin feet he has. it brings a different tune for Nodar. dance becomes an amazing experience because of his anathomy and his soul.
hey bolat, i'm here too:) guess who were nodar's teachers :)
bolat,i can't promise you that i'll upload it today or tomorrow,have to find old recordings, but i'll definately will and you'll be the first i'll inform. and do u really think i don't know the difference between honga and simd? :) BTW, in the georgian version, the one u don't like, simd is called "mipatizheba", meaning invitation. different huh?
your knowledge about Ossetian dance is owing to proffesional dance groups. but this is folk dance. this is not consisting only from stage and show. this is related to folk, its traditions, life style of people and cultural characteristic. maybe you don't have a concept about those, never mind, you are a Georgian, therefore you are natural born expert for dance or all subjects. Huh?
by the way. dance is great.
Respublika Yujnay Asetia, Gazzaeva Janna, Nadar Pliyev. i can hear those clearly. can you?
but this is current situation when there is a Georgian troup only. did you listened carefully the announcer on the begining of this video? what did she said? i don't know Russian (and (: Chineese too) but she said "Asetia", Ossetia. The dancers representing Ossetia in a festival in Daghestan. There is nothing about Georgia. Because there is no Georgian group. They are serving to Ossetia here.
In the past the dancers cared because being a dancer meant you could travel the world and have access to many things ordinary soviet citizens could never have. The world has changed. People's motivation has changed. There are better, more profitable ways to go abroad.
:) ok, i know that i am slaying English. i hope you understand me. :P
Sulalee, sen Türkçe biliyorsun? You decieved me! :)
Badri Tskhovrebov (rolls eyes).. He may be good at other things, but when he dances Kasbeguri, he looks like he has roller skates on.
you don't say, but you think that... but although you claimed something strongly about Honga, you couldn't answer me what is the different between Hong and Simd. It was a simply question. after a clue, you could say only this; they are ussually danced together. but this is wrong. they are two different dances.
ok! i wanna say something for last time. you are defending your country and your peoples prestige, right? it's ok, it's normal. but how do you do that? there was a video about an Ossetian dancer. you said something: His teachers were Georgians. :/ ?
Oh, BTW! why don't i like an Ossetian-Georgian tarnslation? :) You translated for me a word: "Simd" as invitation. But you have a little mistake. In Ossetian, Honga means invitation, not Simd! Ahh Drunchula...
and everybody forgets that if we, caucasians have those dances now, it's because of iliko sukhishvili and nino ramishvili, founders of georgian national ballet. every move, every costume, every music - found, interpreted and staged by them.and after this we stole from them? what would u say?
i think you can't know who were your ancestors directly. you can just estimate about it. and i think that, Georgians have a mixed blood with Iranian nomads, or Turkic nomads. can you remember that how glorious Alans and Kipchaks helped you for rising of Georgian Kingdom?
I didn't know Tengiz had died. Did his mother outlive him? She must be very sad if she did. May he RIP. He was a nice man who gave opportunities to many guys who would otherwise have no future. Iliko was a very minor character years ago. His sister, I thought, was more capable. I never quite understood why the Sukhishvilis became such a dynasty.
it was not me. just somebody supposed that, i need to remember who were Nodar's teachers. they were Georgian teachers. ok. but what was that? i just mentioned that, his comments seems like ethnocentrism. why someone needs an attention about his nations (nominal) succes, when there was nothing about that subject?
i don't get annoyed, believe me. i know nodar's performance and i've seen him dancing in Tbilisi when i was kid. the whole audience applauded him. i just get mad when people and especially in the caucasus start talking crap about georgia, how we stole there dances and so on.
I would LOVE to see Tengiz dancing Simd. When I knew him all he did on stage was to come out an take a bow with his mom at the end. I look forward to your video. BTW, you seem to get annoyed whenever there's a suggestion that someone other than a Georgian can excel at something. Why is that?
i agree. no need to talk after your words.
:)) yes yes...
It's a shame that we can't simply talk about dance, art, or whatever without it becoming an argument about who was there first and (I'm sorry) who's poop does or doesn't smell.
I am sure some will take offense at what I have written, but I am trying to be objective. I am sure Tengiz knows better than anyone that his company's in trouble. It has got to transform itself somehow to become viable in a post-Soviet world. This is true of every single folk dance ensemble from the former communist countries. Armenians get away with it a little bit because they have a diaspora to support them. But diasporan Armenians are starting to be critical of Armenia's exports.
You have a point. You know, that part of the world didn't have distinct national boundaries until the 19th century or so, so there was a lot of cultural cross-fertilization. That said, some art forms are better developed in some parts that others. Armenians are wonderful duduk players. Georgians are amazing singers. But when it comes to Simd, it's deeply Ossetian.
staging a dance, playing a music part... these are not "to steal something". your great Georgian Ballet, Sukhishvili, is a good ensemble. they are dancing very nice, every Caucasian dance which they want. and we are talking about folk dance; an anonymous product. no one can claim some right about it. so nobody said you stole dances.
I wasn't suggesting that people outside Cauc. region don't recognize your dances. My point was that when an audience doesn't look at a performance with a critical eye, you can do almost anything fancy and get applause. Kinda like Chinese food in America. Very different from the real thing, but the average joe would never know.
we can understand that what a prejudiced person you are, only because of your classification of dance troups. you said that, Nodar's Nartdance has higher level than any Ossetian groups. are these Ossetian groups containing main Ossetian group Alan? if it is so; how can you compare ensemble Alan and Nartdance?
The thing about Sukhishvili is that once the dances were choreographed and staged, they became very static. Little real artistic development has happened since the Georgian State Dance Ens. was formed. Ultimately it became a Soviet product that had little to do with the origins of the dances. Ultimatly it wasn't the best thing that could happen to Caucasian dance.
when a i was counting the peoples, who were owners of Narts, i forgot Abkhazians. Abkhazians are also owners of Narts. but these Abkahzians are not your Apkhazians, i mean real Abkhazians.
you always say, Sukhishvili staged Simd first. but is it true? i just searched somethings. i found an interesting info. there is an interview with Nino Sukhishvili. she says "ensemble Sukh. has been found in 1945" nonetheless, ensemble Alan has been found in the year 1938. if this infomation is true, how Sukhishvili staged Simd first? maybe Alan, couldn't think to stage Simd?
they are not dialects, they are cognate; but different languages. this is the fact. of course, if you wanna accept that. i wrote what i know in a Sukishvili war video for Drunchula. i don't repeat, you can see there, what i say.
Yes. I agree. Boku cikarttilar artik. I think Nodar would be very sad to see where these comments have gone.
an important correct: she says RESPUBLIKA ASETIA!
i don't think that Tengiz has these abilities so much. Someone like Nodar, comes to earth only one time per century :) but i must see Tengiz first, before i say something for him. then we must ask to people on RUclips, who is better.
"Georgians made them classic" i am very wondering that, could you say it again, if you are not a Georgian. i was just talking about it, when i was marking to ethnocentrism. sometimes, ethnic feelings avert the objective criticism of art. when somebody shouts so strongly, without any wayout, maybe we must think about an ethnocentrism.
ok. :) i would like to finish this discussion. it was starting to be too long and boring. but i think i can't right now. because of your funny comments. my english is not enough to compete with you. but i wanna say something.
ooooooh yeeaaah! we can see more clearly the racist origins. we were just talking about dance. what is it now? i think these are very important signals about ethnocentrism, or where theorems about dance, art and culture are coming from. keep going!
i know Nartdance, they are very good troups for Turkey, but they are just amateurs. the dancers are just students and the persons who have different careers. i can't claim that Alan was better than Sukhishvili. but they were one of the best dance groups of Caucasia, specially in 80's. so, you must be a person, who have strong obsessions from his head till feet, or you must be blind.
yes, maybe he started to dance in Georgian schools. but i am sure that, he didn't learned Honga so much good, in these schools. i didn't saw any excellent Honga performance from Georgian dancers, honestly (i didn't saw Tengiz yet).
actually, i don't need that everybody knows Simd. i'm happy for i know Simd, even nobody cares.
Yes, you didn't said you are number one, but your behaviour shows what you think actually. There is a video about an Ossetian dance from Ossetian dancers in Daghestan. You said that dancer is the best on RUclips but we must see another Georgian dancer's performance. You think he is better then Nodar.
you are amplifying a little bit. there was a troup of Vladikavkaz University, which formed by students. forget professional troups, we can just compare these amateur troups. i can tell you honestly, this universty troup was better then Nart Dance. by repertoire, costumes, musics, synchronization and many other things. maybe Nart Dances's some dancers have more technic. but it is not enough for to be a good troup, you know. so, please leave this bias.
there is another lie: Megrels are not Georgians. Apkhazs are Abkhazians. i can't believe that, how can terminology be used for politic benefits so much like that. Megrels are citizens of Georgia, but they are not Georgians by ethnos. their language is close to Georgian language. but it is a different thing.
Male performers get a lot of attention because of their acrobatics, but what they do has a real "manic" quality to it. The average audience doesn't know how to judge a performance, but all the solos eventually start to look the same and eventually it gets boring. This is not high culture.
a christian Ossetian marries with a muslim Ossetian. the religion is not important for Ossetians, christian, muslim or pagan... and Ossetians don't hate each others, who speaks their same language; and much more like than Georgians. it's the fact. yes, there is some problems between North & South Ossetians, but every Oss. knows that, they are all Ossetians.
ok i will wait for video. not for a racing, just i would like to see it. i'm sure that, Tengiz's performance is also good. i just asked, but yes, i am thinking now; you don't know Honga or Simd truly. You said somethings but, you couldn't answer me. Because you don't know actually, what is Simd and what is Honga. So, how can you arguing for something that you don't know completely? Maybe because of your nationalist personality? Every beautiful things must belong to Georgians for you. Ahh you :)
but, i know this now. being a depolitized man, not to interest about politics, and living like a tree, is better than to be a racist, an athnocntrist, a prejudiced nationalist. i will try to choose the second one. he is an artist. he just cares about dance. it's enough for him. but look, what we do here? :) if he can see us, he laughs to us, with his ass. let's forget everything and watch the video, if you still can.
:) good joke. but there, in Turkey a lot of Adiges, about more than 1 million. i have some Adige (Adiga,Adigha)friends. No one of them, call their native language like Turkiar, or Istanbulabze, or Ankarabla. so you're faking us :) a people, a country, a language, couldn't born like so easy.
Lucky that you can go to a village and see the locals try to perform what, at this point, is inevitably influenced by what the professionals do. There is no more any such thing as authentic or original. BTW, after the 3rd time, 64 or 1004 fouettes become boring. I have seen dancers move but their head slightly and get a standing ovation. If I want gymnastics I go to the Olympics.