Thank you for spending the money to test your theory. I've never really put much stock in having a toy graded. Spending money on a grading that may be + or - 5, is not worth it to me.
While the results here are largely consistent, I'm convinced this whole grading premise is a racket. Expensive and in the end no intrinsic value has been added to the figures - yet graded figures go for outlandish prices on the market. But you really hit the nail on the head here - figures continue to age and degrade even after grading and sealing in acrylic, so eventually this whole venture is pointless. I'd rather take the odd $50 I'd spend to grade a figure in the US and get $50 worth of figures I don't have in my collection - but that's me.
They are sealede from dust and come in UV protected cases so they are preserved much safer than a figure on a shelf. Plus they look great and you know the figure your getting is authentic and not repainted or a knock off. I myself love the Kenner figures when there loose and graded.
Thanks. I've never liked the idea and couldn't find anyone else testing out the process. The results are interesting. And I am still not convinced in the whole process.
I agree with your assessment. Grading process is just too subjective. One thing that looks like an improvement, are Skeletor's accessories secured in new case without tape? If so, that is a definite change for the better! Thanks for making such relative, helpful videos ( and fun as well)!
You can get it non-taped if you prefer and AFA has a nice case with special head on display for weapons and staffs. UKG is ok and they have only the taped and non taped versions. The non-taped is inside a little side box next to the figure that holds the accessory.
@@ilbftman taped or not of they dont put something between the toy and case like a piece of cloth the acrylic case will one day fuse with the plastic toy..if there are rubber parts they will react with the acrylic.
Someone on here mentioned you sending in something you restored yourself - I wonder how some of your imperial army might fare? I think that's a GREAT idea. Or some MOTU that you replaced the rubber joint on?
In comics grading there have been a very significant power creep with regards to the grading. 10 years ago extremely few comics got a near perfect grade while now a day it appears they are a dime a dussin. The graders basically want to pleas their costumers, and the customers want as high a grade as possible. So there is a huge discrepancy between what comic got what grade simply based on when it got graded. And I assume there is a similar thing going on here. Well it was nice to see that they at leased stooped using tejp on the skeletor figure. So a small win.
I enjoyed the video! Grading certainly isn't for everyone. I will also point out that the grades are given as of the time of the item's submission. Bubble yellow, figures yellow, etc. I have re-submitted loose-graded figures before and received lower scores than before myself. Grading companies do also offer bubble protection for rare figures still on the card, but if the item is dropped there is always a risk that the bubble will crack, whether it is graded or not. But I really enjoyed the experiment and thanks for spending the money and time doing this. I am in the process of doing the same thing myself with some UKG graded items that are being submitted to a different grading company so we can see how the scores change between different grading companies.
I'll be interested to see the results you get. This is actually turning into and interesting experiment as I posted pictures of the skeletor on a motu group and they all say the figure is wrong. And so should never have been graded as it's a mishmash. I'm looking into that at the moment to find out if it's correct or not.
Grading certain items that are deemed rare is quite a good idea in my opinion, say those ultra rare Trilogo Miscards and French Meccano cards I have. The two Oritet Russian Bootleg Bossks you have, certainly deserve to be graded. Another thing with grading, is that you are pretty certain of what you are getting, whereas ungraded you are dependent on good photography, honesty of the seller and so on. I would say the likes of my channel and action figure grader are going to be Pro- grading, whereas Toy.Polloi you are more into every thing and doing restoration and customisation work. Just want to say that I enjoy both areas of the hobby! Action Figure Grader did bring up some issues about UKG graded PBP vintage Star Wars action figures a while back and you should check it out. I myself just purchased a rather pricey PBP vintage Star Wars Black Bespin Guard... I think that's a pretty rare figure. Certainly UKG and AFA have made mistakes- Toytoni carded vintage Star Wars figures, UKG labelled two of my vintage Star Wars figures as prototype figures when they were infact Lili ledy overstock 😭. AFA labelled a carded prototype/ sample figure as a miscard. Overall the two figures you sent in came back with virtually the same grade, I put down the difference to whoever was grading the items, the Gamorrean Guard was originally graded a long time ago- due to the old style grading label. Interesting video, I am hoping to send some stuff into UKG soonish. Goodbye 😎
This is exactly why I don't have a single item in my collection graded. It's just one person's opinion on the day. Who appoints them as masters of grading? No one! Like Comic Books, video games and trading cards, it's a nice little earner with no actual outlay. They'll always be collectors who have nothing but graded figures as they are perceived as premium items. Not so, they probably have paid a premium to get them graded, what a waste. Touching, posing and actually displaying figures is part of the joy of the hobby,. I do not want my toys sealed in plastic boxes. The only reason this practice became popular was so there was at least some consistency when buying online, but as we've seen, it is NOT, an exact science.
The A-Team intro!!! My favorite!!! Great video. I don't own any graded figures and I don't want any either. I always figured it was done by best judgment. The problem is everyone judges something differently. And I also think that you can add the graders to the list of people who have banished you, lol. It's no longer just the Star Wars sites, lol. I love it! You're awesome! This hobby NEEDS you! You are our "scientist". You scare the Hell out of the mighty giants.
I am not a toy collector, I just enjoy the channel. My opinion about this type of scoring is that it is probably the same as any "judgment based" rating system for anything, from antique furniture, to baseball cards. None of those qualitative evaluations are an exact science. Each expert is going to come up with a slightly different rating but still be within a similar range. The ratings are most likely determined by one or more Individuals making a personal judgement based on experience and knowledge of that toy, and likely using some sort of check list to compile a final score. There aren't computers scanning and rating these. A 5% change over a period of time seems minor to me. It's still close enough to fall within a margin of error between ratings by different people. Maybe the figures are judged by different standards based on release date, numbers produced (rarity) or popularity. Some very rare items of any type can be in horrific awful shape and still have a high rating or value simply based on the value others would put on it because of that rarity or popularity. On the other hand, it could be they simply just look at the item and make up a number... but that seems unlikely. There may be some ratings groups that are "shady". :)
Grading is subjective. It comes down to a judgement of opinion. Every grading company uses several different judges, and even if they're all using the same grading system/scale, it's unlikely that they'll all reach exactly the same conclusion grading. There are many factors to consider, and when it come to judging, many are going to judge more conservatively than others will. It's just how things are going to work. How it will work. It happens with judges in court cases, referees in ball games, and even with people judging food contests. I'm an artist and I've won many art contests, but I've come in second and third before too when I thought I should have come in first, but like grading toys, art is also subjective. Judging anything is subjective. That's all there is to it. No grading system is flawless or foolproof. That said, grading is a piece of mind kind of thing. It's to give you an idea of what condition your toys, comics or stamps are in. Many want to use it like a pedigree of authenticity so that they can justify high prices. That's going to happen more often than not. People send toys in to be graded primarily because they are seeking out knowledge of the true value of their toy, books, etc. They want to know what something is worth money wise, at the end of the day. Generally speaking, most professional grading of things like comic books tends to be pretty good. CGC does a nice job. I have thousands of vintage books, and when CGC says they're in Fine or Very Fine, I tend to agree almost 100% of the time. I only buy high grade vintage books because I like original comics, and I like to have comics that don't crumble to dust in your hands. Oddly enough I don't usually keep graded comics slabbed. I usually break them out of those plastic coffins, and put them back in a mylar bag so that I can read them. I don't resale comics, ever. I don't collect comics because I'm out to invest in a future fortune. I collect them because I love them. Many comics in my collection are worth a small fortune, true, but I don't buy them for that. I collect quality stuff with art and stories and characters that I like. Stuff from my childhood, and stuff before that that intrigues me. The true value of collecting anything is the joy of collecting and enjoying your collection. Getting stuff slabbed and graded is fine as a dipstick on how decent something is condition-wise, but too many people only do the grading thing in order to sale toys back and forth. As a way to justify ridiculous prices for things. Again, I'm not a person who wheels and deals. My joy of collecting has nothing to do with buying comic books so that I can turn around and make a profit selling them later. I don't trade comics either. I just collect them for myself to read and enjoy. I always buy what I want, but before I buy anything, I find out what the item's value truly is in the condition presented. Many toy sellers' prices are far too high for me to consider them. Others are more reasonable. The same can be said with regards to comic book sellers. That's why it pays to look for bargains and to seek them out whenever possible. Sometimes you can find a few things for reasonable or below value prices. Other times, you're going to have to shell out some dough to get what you want. It's just the nature of collecting.
Well, the scores came out remarkably consistent so it's clear they're following some sort of criteria for grading of figures. Slight variances just show that some amount of judgement calls are necessary to grade a figure but they're clearly falling back on some sort of reference.l for the scores. Is it worth the price? Probably not for most people.
This was a great idea for a video, maybe the paint score will increase over time as all the loose versions slowly deteriorate I'd imagine that in 35 years these are going to be almost impossible to find in good condition
Great video!!! I did not think much about grading too deeply, not my thing. Because you brought it up, I see that no matter how much we want to preserve these things and want to preserve the value, we can not take out the human factor in the grading factor and most of all, we can not stop time and it's affect. Grading date is certainly relevant. I do know that if a company tends to grade on the higher side, investors will send them to those graders rather than those that tend to grade on average lower. They then want you to believe that the grading system somehow added real value to it, other then just a nice case. So I would also add greed to the list of factors. The graders that know this and sellers that just see money, greed. In the end, a buyer will be looking for the best price, the seller will always point to the grade regardless of age and in the end, the uniformed will pay the price. I think grading is a scam. Better off doing your best to protect the items, maybe put them in a case and let the item speak for its self. But as long as money is changing hands, greed will always win out.
Thanks for taking the time and spending the money on having them regraded. Interesting outcome. Personally I wouldn't pay any extra for any toy just because it's encased in a plastic cocoon wit H someone else's opinion on what condition it's in. I use my own "grading" and common sense and if it's worth it for me, then I'll buy it. Thanks again for an interesting video! 👍
Grading is a strange thing. I personally don't see the point, people bicker over which grader to send it to and which is better. At the end of the day, I trust eye-sight and tend to buy in person. For online buying, I can see the benefit of having a somewhat uniform system in place. I appreciate you doing this test though! It's interesting to see the results! I will say, the display cases do look very nice the second time around and at the very least make a nice way to display figures.
Interesting results and thank you for doing this Toy Polloi! I think for my purposes of collecting, this is not worthwhile to me. For those that find this type of collecting fun, it could be useful, but I agree that it really depends on the grader and seems subjective.
I appreciate that you did this test. I’m actually surprised that the second grading was as consistent as it was. I have a number of boxed G1 Transformers and would honestly never have any of them graded.
I'm only now starting to look into 'grading' and I'm a little suspicious about the whole thing. There's a brand new video out by a guy named Karl Jobst about grading in the 2nd hand video game market and it's made me put all my grading plans on hold.
@@ultra_marcus Hey Ultra Marcus. Some people are all for it and I respect that but it’s just not for me as a collector. Perhaps my position would be different if this was a business for me and if I was looking to try to make money. Having a said that’s, the grading companies are a businesses and I don’t like some of the inconsistencies that I’ve seen in the past. Furthermore, multiple companies are doing it now which creates potential questions regarding which gradings mean more to collectors from the companies that are doing it. To each their own though. Cheers M
how do you think they grade a toy sealed in a box? they wouldn't even know if it is complete inside. plus the tapes would have caused damage to the box itself after so many decades.
If he were to sell the Skeletor loose and ungraded versus selling the same item with an 80 score from UKG, the price difference will be substantially higher than the grading cost. All of the sales price statistics for graded versus ungraded confirm this. Personally, I grade items to authenticate rare bootlegs and to get an unbiased but supportable opinion of value. When I die, my wife will have a much easier time selling my collection for fair market value than if the items were not graded. Better displayability (personal opinion - not everyone agrees with that), dust protection, UV protection, authentication are also reasons. But I understand and appreciate the opposing viewpoint. The great thing is that we all can collect how we want to!
Thanks for this! To each their own, of course, but I'd rather save my money for other things. It often seems that the price paid for the grading service eats too far in to the premium value added to the figure after grading. My most significant gripe is how some (maybe even most or all) grading companies base the price of their service on the value of the figure. Figures of similar age/size/type/complexity should cost approximately the same to grade and encapsulate, in my opinion.
when comes to grading , don't believe in it, I been collecting since 1975,One mans trash is another man treasure ! I do like the cases and would send them in for that , but not for grading.
I think a good comparison would be between the toy grading companies themselves. Would one company grade differently from another. UKG, AFA, TGA, CGA, etc. You know, it's also surprising that they grade on paint rubs when their display cases have plastic pieces that come on contact with the figure and possibly make more paint rubs? Makes no sense.
UKG I prefer for vintage SW variants especially European ones. AFA is good for the regular vintage SW line. AFA is currently NOT accepting anything for loose grading except vintage SW. All other loose figure refused by AFA. The figures are pretty tigh but some yes will rattle so could be in issue? If you just store them away or in a display cabinet with no jarring then they should be ok.
Thank you for the post. You have inspired me to start creating my own custom custom cases that can be reopened. I already a better idea for mounting weapons than clear tape. For a 50 spot all they used was clear tape to mount the weapons and expose them to that adhesive. That bugs me.
I have never been a fan of grading either, or carded figures for the most part. They look nice on the wall, but I get more joy out of loose figures that I can clean and fix up to be appreciated again.
Grading is terrible! There are guys that make custom figures and send them into to be graded and they come back with great grades and stating they’re original when they’re clearly not also that’s a dragon blaster skeletor not even the right fig but they are supposed to be the experts
I wonder if there is a mark put on the figures in UV ink that the toy graders can read and call up a previous grading? Might be an idea to shine a UV torch over the figure to find out. Obviously a US graded item will not be recorded by a UK grader so they may have access to databases to provide a standardised comparison index. In any case, I would never consider collecting anything that’s graded. The most enjoyment comes from disassembling something that is broken or scuffed and then proceeding to fix it to as close to the original as possible.
Few questions. Are they graded based off what people are sending in or what they know exists graded? Also I would love to see some of your stuff you have repaired to see how close they look.
Never liked graded figures and totally lost faith in the system when they started to grade loose figures. Once they're trapped in the casings, they're not even loose anymore.
one thing people tend to overlook is that plastic can react with plastic and rubber when in prolonged contact with each other, this means acrylic casings can react with the toys they are holding onto. rubber parts are more prone to this issue but painted parts too can react with acrylic.
One thing to keep in mind, is that for some companies like CAS, you can choose to get an item cased but not graded. For a standard loose Kenner SW figure, you only save about $8 of the $35, so most of the cost is probably just casing the toys, which definitely does have value for preservation (unless done badly, of course).
consider they have to customize the cases it is a decent price. 8 weeks probably to make the cases. i wonder if they are water proof? in terms of preservation, the cases might actually cause damage to the figure due to chemical reactions between plastic/plastic or plastic/rubber. you can see the damage done by the tapes on the soft plastic weapons, acrylic can leave a glossy stain on other plastic or rubber when in prolonged contact especially if the weight sits on them.
@@TomatoTomato911 They no longer use tape to affix the weapons, that's usually referred to as "old style" and I haven't seen a freshly cased figure with that in years. Nowadays, they usually use laser-cut acrylic shaped to the design or simple braces made of acrylic for weapons like staffs. It's possible the toy material could react with acrylic, but it's something I've never personally noticed. I've seen figures damaged by badly made cases, but that's also where company matters; CAS and UKG are a lot better at making safe, good looking cases than AFA is. Also, they aren't waterproof. There is an unglued edge of every case to allow air in and out to allow the plastic to "breathe." Otherwise, the case would trap the plasticizer gas from the aging toy and it would form into a liquid. Last year opened a MOSC ewok from 1985 and there was a literal puddle of plasticizer in the previously air-tight bubble. This is also why you'll sometimes open old, carded toys to find them very sticky.
I often wonder why there is such a thing as figure grading, or even for that matter, a vehicle or even a playset grading. For example, if you look at the USS Flagg on eBay, the complete set, can run as high as now $7,499, but I have seen it be as high as $15,000 for a complete set. I have even seen a box of the G I Joe Skystriker at a Toy store in Broken Arrow, Oklahoma, go for $200, when the box looked worn and had a hole in the lower right corner of the box. That is definitely a problem called "Joeflation". I really think that action figure grading is a scam, and it should be shut down.
I've seen battered toys that have charm, and would be happy to buy them as they are. The only reason for grading is purely for the uber investor, not the enthusiast.
I had an absolutely perfect vintage POTF Yak Face graded. I mean perfect. No paint chips/ smudges. Minty fresh figure. It came back an 85. After that, I never sent in another figure. Its subjective for sure.
Comic book grading is the same problem. You can only grade it at the time of sale - sealing comics or toys after grading does not prevent entropy and what is the fun in sealing up a toy?
To me a component missing to the grading aspect is the sample size and the year of grading. If you submit your original Bobba Fett in 1999 for grading, and the grading company at that time had only graded 100 copies of BF, and yours was #075, and was given a score of 8.0, and then submit another original BF in 2019 and the company has graded 1000 Fetts, yours being #0854 and also graded 8.0, do you think both deserve to be worth the same? No, because it's been 20 years difference, the sample size has grown but also in 20 years how has that version graded in 1999 held up to the one just graded in 2019? As time passes the figures can only continue to deteriorate in condition, so your 2019 graded figure to me is much more valuable then the one graded in 1999.
£15.00 and eight weeks to me means you have to be a pretty serious collector to go through this process. But I'm a displayer, and a number of my figures are a little worse for wear, but to me personally, I collect toys and it's part of their charm.
Is it possible they grade on a bit of a curve? Say I've graded 5 Skeletors in my life and I give the 6th one an 80. You send it back to me a year later. In that timeframe I have graded 10 more. All of which were in a lower condition than yours. My opinion is now that your submission is a 90. Is my grading inconsistent or have I gained a better eye for appreciating the rarity of the condition of yours? On a side note, I wouldn't get anything graded unless I was trying to preserve it for sentimental reasons. I'd rather spend money on the figs.
When I was home (in Canada) in the summer, I watched an episode of Antique Roadshow, where they showed updates on assessments they had done years ago -- some as many as ten years back. In some cases, an item that was valued at tens of thousands of dollars was now devalued to half the original assessment...or worse! Imagine being the owner who invested in that antique. I think comics and action figures could potentially suffer the same kind of devaluing, given enough time. What's considered valuable now might not hold up down the road. Interesting video!
Its all based on demand at the time. Popularity of items will ebb and flow which can be influenced, as in SW figures, by revivals of a movie franchise. Before Lucasfilm did the original trilogy "special editions" or prequels episodes 1-3, there wasn't a huge demand for vintage SW figures. When you couple that to the nostalgic value we place on these items we played with as kids, the price will definitely sky rocket. Problem is we, as in the 40 -50 somethings, are really the only ones interested in collecting these figures. We are the ones driving the price increases because we are willing to pay these outrageous prices to recapture a part of our youth. I can only imagine that the values will only go down over time as we all get older and are not a sound investment. Even with this belief I am an avid collector and have spent a lot of money collecting, but do not expect to cash in on a huge payday for retirement if I decide to sell these in my later years. Just my two cents.
I get the feeling that the majority of your subscribers won't have much use for toy grading. We're the kind of people who like toys for what they mean to us, not what they mean to others.
I can’t believe they use tape to keep the items in place. Wouldn’t the tape residue be bad for the long term condition. I think grading is stupid. It’s like people are trying to trick themselves into thinking their figure is still moc.
Jason Fuller lame, and a venal attempt to say I dont have coin for it. I've graded comics, and its not worth it+ the constant stories of shenanigans and theft of books and fakes being graded. Thanks for showing your intelligence 👍😘
I've had the same comic book graded differently by 2 different stores (not the sealed in plastic kind). And one of the shops sent stuff off to get graded & got royally goofed over with some comics being damaged in the process. Or how about when at an auction I bought a framed mint comic, which turned out to be the cover & a few internal pages. Let's be honest it is a scam, but an arbitrary one which could potentially increase the value of said piece but will forever rob somebody of playing with it again.
Andrew Grant absolutely so better not to play their game. I also heard about one of the newer grader outfits swipped a 1st print tmnt and put in a 2nd print and graded that one the owner got wise to it but his 1st print is still gone. Too arbitrary and shady for me
I wholeheartedly agree with you. I do not agree with the reason why people would pay so much money to grade a figure. I understand that a graded figure costs more, but that’s just merely an arbitrary and inflated number someone assigned to something to make it “more valuable”. And to paraphrase Steve Sansweet: “how much is something worth? It’s what the collector is willing to pay for”. So ultimately, we give an item the final value by paying whatever we believe it deserves.
I'm not sure if it's a scam but I don't do graded figures either. I want to be able to put on the white gloves and handle them from time to time. I even recently bought a carded figure and removed it to add it to my collection. I keep mine in glass-topped cigar boxes on a cotton bed, covered in a hanky and in the dark, and I think they'll preserve better
Has anyone looked them over with a UV light, they may stamp the 'Archive No.' with security ink under the feet for instance, knowing they have graded them before or for tests just like this?
It is totally for the speculator or collector who can brag his Yoda is a 5.5 instead of a 5. But the reality is that it isn't an officially sanctioned system and there are no overseers. It's someone who takes your money and gives you a number to feel good about your item. That's all.
I personally think they look really nice in their acrylic boxes, I much prefer them graded, I’m going to have all my Star Wars figures graded in the future
I found this video quite interesting. You gained another subscriber Are grades given based on comparison to a mint example? If so, how can they maintain a mint version for comparison if time causes degradation, even when stored under the best condition possible? Is it possible that your Skeletor grades higher because the mint example used for comparison has degraded with time, so the difference between you figure and their mint version has become less drastic than it was the first time you had it graded? If the scenario I described actually occurs, how could using a mint example for comparison be at all accurate? No two environments are the same, so no two items would deteriorate at the same rate. There is a lot more I'd like to learn about the grading/certification process, but I won't overload you with questions. Any insight to the questions I did ask would be most appreciated though..
I’d like to see how graders actually examine these figures for signs of fixes and such. Do they do some kind of forensic testing to differentiate original coats of paint or, say, joint stiffness vs. touch-ups or mods that would lower the supposed resale value?
As TP said, they use blacklights to look for touch-ups to the figure or packaging, and they even use X-ray to check if an item is actually still inside the package if the item is not visible when there is a question as to whether the item is a re-seal or considered unopened. For loose figures, there are all sorts of resources online such as Imperial Gunnery to check for accessories to see if they are repro, especially with how good the scammers are getting with copying vintage accessories now.
It's exactly like the Hot Wheels redlines book that it shows you every price of every Hot Wheels redlines and it tells you which one is the most rare one it shows every Hot Wheels made in the 60s in every color that they were made and some of them have bogus prices
Ever try to buy stuff on ebay/at shows and thier dealer *reallly* tries to sell you on what grade it *would* get? Yeah thats happened to me to :p Graders opinions are inflating the market even before they touch it
Restored figures would be rejected, at least if the grading company is a legit one like AFA, UKG, and CAS. Certainly all three have made mistakes before, but they all use blacklights to test for paint touch-ups to loose figures as well as mint-on-card examples.
I was just making a joke about sending in restored figures for grading. David really does a nice job restoring toys and I enjoy watching him do so and I've also tried his techniques. It's fun. This whole grading thing is too serious and takes the fun out of things. These are toys after all and their purpose and existence is found FUN!
R. David Hill I agree. Graded or not, something is only worth what someone is willing to pay up for. If you don’t ever plan on selling your figure/figures/collection then you’ve just got a bunch of toys like the rest of us collectors.
Pro grading is a product of the Internet age. It boomed because too many people selling stuff on the internet had WIDELY varying definitions of good, bad, mint, etc. They helped to establish some standards for the world wide market... and as long as you have faith in their consistency (not all do) then you can make purchases with a bigger degree of confidence. They have good and bad points but overall they benefit the kind of collectors that are picky about condition.
Exactly so. Grading isn't for everyone, but the sales prices of graded versus ungraded support the fact that high-graded figures will always command a huge premium. Even going from a "near-mint" score of 80 to a "near-mint plus" score of 85 or higher means a massive difference to some collectors, myself included.
The grading part is in my opinion a waste of time but the boxes are a good way of protecting mint or rare figures but you can buy a good PVC box with the same result, I wonder if the display boxes will yellow with age like a lot of plastics.
I think your experiment supports the idea that the grading sites are very consistent...at least for the two items you sent in. One was exact and the other was off by one grade. That being said, I've never liked the idea of enclosed cases for collectibles meant to be played with or read. I guess it makes more sense for sports cards.
Yeah, the results of this video actually support grading consistency. He made a big deal about the 5% on skeletor, but the overall grade was still the same. He sent in two figures, and got basically the same scores back, sounds like they're doing a good job to me. Not that graded figs are my thing, but you really can't argue that they are all over the place with scores, at least based on this video. I think Toy Polloi was hoping for a bigger difference!
I do have to say, at least with sports card grading, it’s generally accepted by collectors you’re going to have a +/- degree of variance, probably a half to a whole point on a 1-10 scale, just based on human error and/or bias. That same human variable is going to apply to the grading of ANYTHING in any hobby or something even like fine art. I’ve heard of people getting a card graded as an 8.5, and they opened it and sent back to the same grading company multiple times to try and get a 9. Sometimes it really backfires and the rating goes DOWN a half point.
I’ve always thought that grading is a scam. Putting these toys in a case only does one thing and one thing only… raise the price by an insane amount. It’s just a bragging right, or in some cases, a way for someone to make a quick buck. I also collect comics, and it is so infuriating when someone buys a collection of comics, like 100+ comics, all worth around 2 to 10 dollars a piece, just to ship them all off to be graded. Most of the comics are not even rare or really worth anything, but that case will give a 2 dollar comic a 52 dollar price tag. I understand putting something in a case like that if it is extremely rare and deteriorating, but outside of that, it seems pointless, unless you are a reseller.
I think the score is higher for the paint considering the fact that some figures paint fade and discolour and this one maintained well compared to others the same age and also time passed since the 1st grading.
While I don't believe in toy grading services I will say that I do believe that a large part of the grading service expense is that custom (to a degree) acrylic case made for each figure. The ridiculous end comes from people selling for an extreme premium.
This is something that all of the grading companies offer for an extra charge. A detailed report of the faults complete with a chart showing where the damages/flaws were noted. This type of thing is rarely done unless it is an extremely rare figure.
Well if you take ito account the wide range of variants I think many are worthy of recognition. Take into count the blue helmet Boba Fett which is different from the regular Boba Fett. The helmet was sprayed blue due to some issue with the plastic at the time of manufacture and its therefore worth more than the regular Boba Fett. There were far fewer made and many have paint chips and /or defects. I actually have the first one graded by AFA and it is a legitimate variant. The tri-logo Fett has a lighter blue body and is a European release quite different from its USA version. Some Fett figures have a lighter chest or a darker chest color. Obviously carded grading is more expensive and I stick to loose grading myself. Other examples are the Lili Ledy line from Mexico with the renowned Removable Hood Jawa. This is a very rare figure and many of them are missing the hood so genuine complete high grade examples are hard to come by. Even harder to acquire is the Fixed Hood Jawa like the Kenner But its completely made by Lili Ledy and has a different cloth cloak with fixed hood. All Lili Ledy Jawas come with different blasters from the Kenner. Its important to get rare figures graded and authenticated due to the level of fake accessories and weapons. Some are touched up and more often than not this altering is caught. The only legit Boba Fett with removable rocket is made by Lili Ledy aside from Kenner prototypes ! I had mine graded and authenticated as this figure complete is extremely rare. I have seen sellers pulling the rocket out from the tri-logo Fett and try to pass it off as a legit variant when it is Not. There is no tri-logo Fett with removable rocket. There are also regular Lili Ledy Fetts with fixed rockets and are more common but still the plastic and colors are different from the Kenner or Palitoys. PBP/POCH (Spain) also have there own versions as did Meccano out of France. So I could write paragraphs on and on but it is worthwhile if you have rare figures. I also have the red cape Bib Fortuna from Lili Ledy and if you are into more than just the regular SW line and go into variants its worthwhile getting them recognized as legitimate.Bear in mind that through time aging discolors the plastic and that is not a variant but due to aging. Having figures graded in cases makes them easier to store and stack in boxes. They are protected from falls and are slightly UV resistant with the case. They display easily on shelves or cabinets in the acrylic case so don't worry about them falling over. UKG I prefer for variants and AFA is great for the regular line but they do recognize many variants now. If in doubt email them before to be sure and provide pictures. You'll get an answer about it soon. I have over 700 graded Star Wars figures both vintage and modern including bootlegs ( yes these are faked also- ironic isn't it?)
Grading is your choice. I chose to grade all of my loose figures because of all the fake weapons and staffs plus switching sabers to make a complete figure. Example- A Lili Ledy (Mexico) Darth Vader with a Kenner saber. They won't grade it but refuse it and ship it back inside a sealed case. You cannot mix and match figures and weapons. Lili Ledy Vader sabers are thicker than Kenner and are harder to come by. Kenner Vader sabers are thinner and you can see the difference. Same goes for staffs which are thicker for Lili Ledy figures in some cases. Remember that the infamous "float" test is Not foolproof and savvy counterfeiters make weapons that float so it takes careful examination to be sure its real. They do this to sell a 'complete' figure and get more money out of it leaving you with a partially fake figure. It depends what you want out of this hobby.
Thank you for spending the money to test your theory. I've never really put much stock in having a toy graded. Spending money on a grading that may be + or - 5, is not worth it to me.
While the results here are largely consistent, I'm convinced this whole grading premise is a racket. Expensive and in the end no intrinsic value has been added to the figures - yet graded figures go for outlandish prices on the market. But you really hit the nail on the head here - figures continue to age and degrade even after grading and sealing in acrylic, so eventually this whole venture is pointless. I'd rather take the odd $50 I'd spend to grade a figure in the US and get $50 worth of figures I don't have in my collection - but that's me.
Brian Fitzgerald my dad saying it was meant to be Played with and in the case with comic books read
A company that made plastic boxes found a way to get people to buy plastic boxes from them. "Who cares if the grading is accurate!"
They are sealede from dust and come in UV protected cases so they are preserved much safer than a figure on a shelf. Plus they look great and you know the figure your getting is authentic and not repainted or a knock off. I myself love the Kenner figures when there loose and graded.
@@stevenseagal4664 Knock offs have been found to be graded and boxed as originals
Steven Seagal But big houses and nice cars also get repainted
What a fantastic idea!... I have always wondered about this -it’s such an ambiguous number.
Thanks. I've never liked the idea and couldn't find anyone else testing out the process. The results are interesting. And I am still not convinced in the whole process.
I agree with your assessment. Grading process is just too subjective. One thing that looks like an improvement, are Skeletor's accessories secured in new case without tape? If so, that is a definite change for the better! Thanks for making such relative, helpful videos ( and fun as well)!
I love the presentation they received the 2nd time around but that's about it. I think a figure is worth how much I like or not.
I'm perhaps MOST offended at the idea they're using TAPE to affix the weapons in there. I HATE tape.
You can get it non-taped if you prefer and AFA has a nice case with special head on display for weapons and staffs. UKG is ok and they have only the taped and non taped versions. The non-taped is inside a little side box next to the figure that holds the accessory.
Doesn’t seem very sympathetic to the plastic.
@@ilbftman taped or not of they dont put something between the toy and case like a piece of cloth the acrylic case will one day fuse with the plastic toy..if there are rubber parts they will react with the acrylic.
Someone on here mentioned you sending in something you restored yourself - I wonder how some of your imperial army might fare? I think that's a GREAT idea. Or some MOTU that you replaced the rubber joint on?
That would be the real test..
I would like to know as well. It would be very interesting indeed.
My wife and I wholeheartedly agree with this idea!
Toy Polloi, please send in a figure with replacement LEG BANDS. I, too, am curious about the way they are considered. Thanks!
@@gabrielaviles9610 Grading companies won't grade figures that have had alterations or paint touch-ups.
Yep. Paid toy grading is just another thing on a long list of “I wish I had thought of that racket.”
In comics grading there have been a very significant power creep with regards to the grading. 10 years ago extremely few comics got a near perfect grade while now a day it appears they are a dime a dussin. The graders basically want to pleas their costumers, and the customers want as high a grade as possible. So there is a huge discrepancy between what comic got what grade simply based on when it got graded. And I assume there is a similar thing going on here. Well it was nice to see that they at leased stooped using tejp on the skeletor figure. So a small win.
You got much nicer presentation on the Skeletor figure the second time round. Maybe they added 5% for that! ;P
I agree the display was better. But £30 better, not sure.
The way I look at it, you pay for an fancy UV rated box.
This is not even a uv rated box. That costs more.
@@toypolloi wow I didn't know that. I know the one's here in the States use UV rated acrylic boxes.
@@toypolloi do they clean the figures for you before putting them in? is the box airtight?
I enjoyed the video! Grading certainly isn't for everyone. I will also point out that the grades are given as of the time of the item's submission. Bubble yellow, figures yellow, etc. I have re-submitted loose-graded figures before and received lower scores than before myself. Grading companies do also offer bubble protection for rare figures still on the card, but if the item is dropped there is always a risk that the bubble will crack, whether it is graded or not. But I really enjoyed the experiment and thanks for spending the money and time doing this. I am in the process of doing the same thing myself with some UKG graded items that are being submitted to a different grading company so we can see how the scores change between different grading companies.
I'll be interested to see the results you get. This is actually turning into and interesting experiment as I posted pictures of the skeletor on a motu group and they all say the figure is wrong. And so should never have been graded as it's a mishmash. I'm looking into that at the moment to find out if it's correct or not.
Grading certain items that are deemed rare is quite a good idea in my opinion, say those ultra rare Trilogo Miscards and French Meccano cards I have. The two Oritet Russian Bootleg Bossks you have, certainly deserve to be graded. Another thing with grading, is that you are pretty certain of what you are getting, whereas ungraded you are dependent on good photography, honesty of the seller and so on. I would say the likes of my channel and action figure grader are going to be Pro- grading, whereas Toy.Polloi you are more into every thing and doing restoration and customisation work. Just want to say that I enjoy both areas of the hobby! Action Figure Grader did bring up some issues about UKG graded PBP vintage Star Wars action figures a while back and you should check it out. I myself just purchased a rather pricey PBP vintage Star Wars Black Bespin Guard... I think that's a pretty rare figure. Certainly UKG and AFA have made mistakes- Toytoni carded vintage Star Wars figures, UKG labelled two of my vintage Star Wars figures as prototype figures when they were infact Lili ledy overstock 😭. AFA labelled a carded prototype/ sample figure as a miscard. Overall the two figures you sent in came back with virtually the same grade, I put down the difference to whoever was grading the items, the Gamorrean Guard was originally graded a long time ago- due to the old style grading label. Interesting video, I am hoping to send some stuff into UKG soonish. Goodbye 😎
This is exactly why I don't have a single item in my collection graded. It's just one person's opinion on the day. Who appoints them as masters of grading? No one! Like Comic Books, video games and trading cards, it's a nice little earner with no actual outlay.
They'll always be collectors who have nothing but graded figures as they are perceived as premium items. Not so, they probably have paid a premium to get them graded, what a waste.
Touching, posing and actually displaying figures is part of the joy of the hobby,. I do not want my toys sealed in plastic boxes.
The only reason this practice became popular was so there was at least some consistency when buying online, but as we've seen, it is NOT, an exact science.
it has become a norm so buyers would be willing to pay mich more for something graded so one day you might be forced to grade your toys to sell them.
The A-Team intro!!! My favorite!!! Great video. I don't own any graded figures and I don't want any either. I always figured it was done by best judgment. The problem is everyone judges something differently. And I also think that you can add the graders to the list of people who have banished you, lol. It's no longer just the Star Wars sites, lol. I love it! You're awesome! This hobby NEEDS you! You are our "scientist". You scare the Hell out of the mighty giants.
I am not a toy collector, I just enjoy the channel.
My opinion about this type of scoring is that it is probably the same as any "judgment based" rating system for anything, from antique furniture, to baseball cards. None of those qualitative evaluations are an exact science. Each expert is going to come up with a slightly different rating but still be within a similar range.
The ratings are most likely determined by one or more Individuals making a personal judgement based on experience and knowledge of that toy, and likely using some sort of check list to compile a final score. There aren't computers scanning and rating these. A 5% change over a period of time seems minor to me. It's still close enough to fall within a margin of error between ratings by different people. Maybe the figures are judged by different standards based on release date, numbers produced (rarity) or popularity. Some very rare items of any type can be in horrific awful shape and still have a high rating or value simply based on the value others would put on it because of that rarity or popularity. On the other hand, it could be they simply just look at the item and make up a number... but that seems unlikely. There may be some ratings groups that are "shady". :)
Grading is subjective. It comes down to a judgement of opinion. Every grading company uses several different judges, and even if they're all using the same grading system/scale, it's unlikely that they'll all reach exactly the same conclusion grading. There are many factors to consider, and when it come to judging, many are going to judge more conservatively than others will. It's just how things are going to work. How it will work. It happens with judges in court cases, referees in ball games, and even with people judging food contests. I'm an artist and I've won many art contests, but I've come in second and third before too when I thought I should have come in first, but like grading toys, art is also subjective. Judging anything is subjective. That's all there is to it. No grading system is flawless or foolproof. That said, grading is a piece of mind kind of thing. It's to give you an idea of what condition your toys, comics or stamps are in. Many want to use it like a pedigree of authenticity so that they can justify high prices. That's going to happen more often than not. People send toys in to be graded primarily because they are seeking out knowledge of the true value of their toy, books, etc. They want to know what something is worth money wise, at the end of the day.
Generally speaking, most professional grading of things like comic books tends to be pretty good. CGC does a nice job. I have thousands of vintage books, and when CGC says they're in Fine or Very Fine, I tend to agree almost 100% of the time. I only buy high grade vintage books because I like original comics, and I like to have comics that don't crumble to dust in your hands. Oddly enough I don't usually keep graded comics slabbed. I usually break them out of those plastic coffins, and put them back in a mylar bag so that I can read them. I don't resale comics, ever. I don't collect comics because I'm out to invest in a future fortune. I collect them because I love them. Many comics in my collection are worth a small fortune, true, but I don't buy them for that. I collect quality stuff with art and stories and characters that I like. Stuff from my childhood, and stuff before that that intrigues me. The true value of collecting anything is the joy of collecting and enjoying your collection. Getting stuff slabbed and graded is fine as a dipstick on how decent something is condition-wise, but too many people only do the grading thing in order to sale toys back and forth. As a way to justify ridiculous prices for things. Again, I'm not a person who wheels and deals. My joy of collecting has nothing to do with buying comic books so that I can turn around and make a profit selling them later. I don't trade comics either. I just collect them for myself to read and enjoy. I always buy what I want, but before I buy anything, I find out what the item's value truly is in the condition presented. Many toy sellers' prices are far too high for me to consider them. Others are more reasonable. The same can be said with regards to comic book sellers. That's why it pays to look for bargains and to seek them out whenever possible. Sometimes you can find a few things for reasonable or below value prices. Other times, you're going to have to shell out some dough to get what you want. It's just the nature of collecting.
Good for you Dave, challenging the logic of this process. I’m not one for graded figures but it was a worthwhile exercise
Well, the scores came out remarkably consistent so it's clear they're following some sort of criteria for grading of figures. Slight variances just show that some amount of judgement calls are necessary to grade a figure but they're clearly falling back on some sort of reference.l for the scores.
Is it worth the price? Probably not for most people.
This was a great idea for a video, maybe the paint score will increase over time as all the loose versions slowly deteriorate
I'd imagine that in 35 years these are going to be almost impossible to find in good condition
Any paintwork can be restored with enough skill I'm sure some restored figures already got into high grading.
Great video!!! I did not think much about grading too deeply, not my thing. Because you brought it up, I see that no matter how much we want to preserve these things and want to preserve the value, we can not take out the human factor in the grading factor and most of all, we can not stop time and it's affect. Grading date is certainly relevant. I do know that if a company tends to grade on the higher side, investors will send them to those graders rather than those that tend to grade on average lower. They then want you to believe that the grading system somehow added real value to it, other then just a nice case. So I would also add greed to the list of factors. The graders that know this and sellers that just see money, greed. In the end, a buyer will be looking for the best price, the seller will always point to the grade regardless of age and in the end, the uniformed will pay the price. I think grading is a scam. Better off doing your best to protect the items, maybe put them in a case and let the item speak for its self. But as long as money is changing hands, greed will always win out.
Not as bad as comic book grading- SO MANY SCAMMERS in that!
same with sports cards
Would never get anything graded, would never buy anything graded, personally.
Thanks for taking the time and spending the money on having them regraded. Interesting outcome. Personally I wouldn't pay any extra for any toy just because it's encased in a plastic cocoon wit H someone else's opinion on what condition it's in. I use my own "grading" and common sense and if it's worth it for me, then I'll buy it. Thanks again for an interesting video! 👍
Am so glad you did this because I never have trusted these grading companies
how do you feel after seeing this?
Grading is a strange thing. I personally don't see the point, people bicker over which grader to send it to and which is better. At the end of the day, I trust eye-sight and tend to buy in person. For online buying, I can see the benefit of having a somewhat uniform system in place.
I appreciate you doing this test though! It's interesting to see the results! I will say, the display cases do look very nice the second time around and at the very least make a nice way to display figures.
Awesome video. The intro alone got me to subscribe ..."you know there ain't no dog on that leash Murdoch."
Interesting results and thank you for doing this Toy Polloi! I think for my purposes of collecting, this is not worthwhile to me. For those that find this type of collecting fun, it could be useful, but I agree that it really depends on the grader and seems subjective.
You should try sending in a couple of your restored figures
I don't want to waste my money. Better spent in other toys 👍
I appreciate that you did this test. I’m actually surprised that the second grading was as consistent as it was. I have a number of boxed G1 Transformers and would honestly never have any of them graded.
I'm only now starting to look into 'grading' and I'm a little suspicious about the whole thing. There's a brand new video out by a guy named Karl Jobst about grading in the 2nd hand video game market and it's made me put all my grading plans on hold.
@@ultra_marcus Hey Ultra Marcus. Some people are all for it and I respect that but it’s just not for me as a collector. Perhaps my position would be different if this was a business for me and if I was looking to try to make money. Having a said that’s, the grading companies are a businesses and I don’t like some of the inconsistencies that I’ve seen in the past. Furthermore, multiple companies are doing it now which creates potential questions regarding which gradings mean more to collectors from the companies that are doing it. To each their own though. Cheers M
how do you think they grade a toy sealed in a box? they wouldn't even know if it is complete inside. plus the tapes would have caused damage to the box itself after so many decades.
YES - some guy looks at a figure, places it in a plastic case and apparently now the £10 toy from 1988 is worth £300+? yeah sure ...
If he were to sell the Skeletor loose and ungraded versus selling the same item with an 80 score from UKG, the price difference will be substantially higher than the grading cost. All of the sales price statistics for graded versus ungraded confirm this.
Personally, I grade items to authenticate rare bootlegs and to get an unbiased but supportable opinion of value. When I die, my wife will have a much easier time selling my collection for fair market value than if the items were not graded. Better displayability (personal opinion - not everyone agrees with that), dust protection, UV protection, authentication are also reasons. But I understand and appreciate the opposing viewpoint. The great thing is that we all can collect how we want to!
I like grading.
The a-team intro was awesome.
Got one item graded...don't think I'll be doing that again.
Thanks for this! To each their own, of course, but I'd rather save my money for other things. It often seems that the price paid for the grading service eats too far in to the premium value added to the figure after grading. My most significant gripe is how some (maybe even most or all) grading companies base the price of their service on the value of the figure. Figures of similar age/size/type/complexity should cost approximately the same to grade and encapsulate, in my opinion.
when comes to grading , don't believe in it, I been collecting since 1975,One mans trash is another man treasure ! I do like the cases and would send them in for that , but not for grading.
I would never buy graded figures myself. Even keeping things in the box is strange.
I think a good comparison would be between the toy grading companies themselves. Would one company grade differently from another. UKG, AFA, TGA, CGA, etc. You know, it's also surprising that they grade on paint rubs when their display cases have plastic pieces that come on contact with the figure and possibly make more paint rubs? Makes no sense.
I would have like to have got a few companies to grade figures for me, but it is very expensive to do. Out of my budget for this channel.
UKG I prefer for vintage SW variants especially European ones. AFA is good for the regular vintage SW line. AFA is currently NOT accepting anything for loose grading except vintage SW. All other loose figure refused by AFA. The figures are pretty tigh but some yes will rattle so could be in issue? If you just store them away or in a display cabinet with no jarring then they should be ok.
Thank you for the post. You have inspired me to start creating my own custom custom cases that can be reopened. I already a better idea for mounting weapons than clear tape. For a 50 spot all they used was clear tape to mount the weapons and expose them to that adhesive. That bugs me.
I have never been a fan of grading either, or carded figures for the most part. They look nice on the wall, but I get more joy out of loose figures that I can clean and fix up to be appreciated again.
I've started fixing figures too. I find that holding a loose figure more enjoyable than one in a plastic box.
@@glynnbrown6642 Yes, you can only stare at something for so long. lol Then it get boring. With loose figures there are some many options of display.
Grading is terrible! There are guys that make custom figures and send them into to be graded and they come back with great grades and stating they’re original when they’re clearly not also that’s a dragon blaster skeletor not even the right fig but they are supposed to be the experts
DB for sure.. Look at those feet
I wonder if there is a mark put on the figures in UV ink that the toy graders can read and call up a previous grading? Might be an idea to shine a UV torch over the figure to find out. Obviously a US graded item will not be recorded by a UK grader so they may have access to databases to provide a standardised comparison index.
In any case, I would never consider collecting anything that’s graded. The most enjoyment comes from disassembling something that is broken or scuffed and then proceeding to fix it to as close to the original as possible.
ive thought it was a scam since the first time i heard of it and i still do.
Few questions. Are they graded based off what people are sending in or what they know exists graded? Also I would love to see some of your stuff you have repaired to see how close they look.
Never liked graded figures and totally lost faith in the system when they started to grade loose figures.
Once they're trapped in the casings, they're not even loose anymore.
one thing people tend to overlook is that plastic can react with plastic and rubber when in prolonged contact with each other, this means acrylic casings can react with the toys they are holding onto. rubber parts are more prone to this issue but painted parts too can react with acrylic.
Scores are lower in the morning and higher after lunch.
Nice one!
One thing to keep in mind, is that for some companies like CAS, you can choose to get an item cased but not graded. For a standard loose Kenner SW figure, you only save about $8 of the $35, so most of the cost is probably just casing the toys, which definitely does have value for preservation (unless done badly, of course).
consider they have to customize the cases it is a decent price. 8 weeks probably to make the cases.
i wonder if they are water proof?
in terms of preservation, the cases might actually cause damage to the figure due to chemical reactions between plastic/plastic or plastic/rubber. you can see the damage done by the tapes on the soft plastic weapons, acrylic can leave a glossy stain on other plastic or rubber when in prolonged contact especially if the weight sits on them.
@@TomatoTomato911 They no longer use tape to affix the weapons, that's usually referred to as "old style" and I haven't seen a freshly cased figure with that in years. Nowadays, they usually use laser-cut acrylic shaped to the design or simple braces made of acrylic for weapons like staffs. It's possible the toy material could react with acrylic, but it's something I've never personally noticed. I've seen figures damaged by badly made cases, but that's also where company matters; CAS and UKG are a lot better at making safe, good looking cases than AFA is.
Also, they aren't waterproof. There is an unglued edge of every case to allow air in and out to allow the plastic to "breathe." Otherwise, the case would trap the plasticizer gas from the aging toy and it would form into a liquid. Last year opened a MOSC ewok from 1985 and there was a literal puddle of plasticizer in the previously air-tight bubble. This is also why you'll sometimes open old, carded toys to find them very sticky.
I often wonder why there is such a thing as figure grading, or even for that matter, a vehicle or even a playset grading. For example, if you look at the USS Flagg on eBay, the complete set, can run as high as now $7,499, but I have seen it be as high as $15,000 for a complete set. I have even seen a box of the G I Joe Skystriker at a Toy store in Broken Arrow, Oklahoma, go for $200, when the box looked worn and had a hole in the lower right corner of the box. That is definitely a problem called "Joeflation". I really think that action figure grading is a scam, and it should be shut down.
Intersting experiment! Thank you for the heads up on the video! Great stuff as always!
Glad you enjoyed it!
I have the same problem with the inconsistent grading in comics. The only way I'll buy graded Comics now is if they're Signature Series.
I can answer this question without even watching the video: Yes it's a scam. So is video game grading.
I've seen battered toys that have charm, and would be happy to buy them as they are.
The only reason for grading is purely for the uber investor, not the enthusiast.
Never heard of this before but I'm with you Dave - it's a bit subjective and a lot of money for what is , to be fair, a nice display case.
you can say the exact same thing about a Home Appraisal, 2 different appraisers will give the property 2 different values
I had an absolutely perfect vintage POTF Yak Face graded. I mean perfect. No paint chips/ smudges. Minty fresh figure. It came back an 85. After that, I never sent in another figure. Its subjective for sure.
I have loose figures I know are as good as any cased 'graded' figure yet supposedly not worth half what they are. A complete scam.
Comic book grading is the same problem. You can only grade it at the time of sale - sealing comics or toys after grading does not prevent entropy and what is the fun in sealing up a toy?
I agree with you. I don't think it is worth the money for granted figures.
you leave me waiting for the A-team theme to start playing
What a great video with a awesome entrance 👍👍
Repro's and restorers are what caused grading companies to thrive!
lol thats what im missing here...arent graders in existence because of bootlegs? Whether its action figures, comics, antiques, art, vinyl records etc.
I don't care about grades. Some figures are stupid expensive. I'd rather have one in poor condition then not having it.
To me a component missing to the grading aspect is the sample size and the year of grading.
If you submit your original Bobba Fett in 1999 for grading, and the grading company at that time had only graded 100 copies of BF, and yours was #075, and was given a score of 8.0, and then submit another original BF in 2019 and the company has graded 1000 Fetts, yours being #0854 and also graded 8.0, do you think both deserve to be worth the same?
No, because it's been 20 years difference, the sample size has grown but also in 20 years how has that version graded in 1999 held up to the one just graded in 2019? As time passes the figures can only continue to deteriorate in condition, so your 2019 graded figure to me is much more valuable then the one graded in 1999.
Is this a DragonBlaster Skelletor with Armo from a normal Skelletor? 🤔
It does look like it. I am finding out more at the moment and will contact the graders to see what they have to say.
£15.00 and eight weeks to me means you have to be a pretty serious collector to go through this process.
But I'm a displayer, and a number of my figures are a little worse for wear, but to me personally, I collect toys and it's part of their charm.
i be honest 15pound wont get you a customized acrylic case so kinda fair price for shipping, grading and putting them in a customized case.
They probably painted skeletor while they were grading it. Lol.
nice, what would happen if someone sent in a knock off or fake figure? will it get graded as well?
I gritted my teeth as the plastic case was cracking. It's almost like scratching a blackboard.
Is it possible they grade on a bit of a curve? Say I've graded 5 Skeletors in my life and I give the 6th one an 80. You send it back to me a year later. In that timeframe I have graded 10 more. All of which were in a lower condition than yours. My opinion is now that your submission is a 90. Is my grading inconsistent or have I gained a better eye for appreciating the rarity of the condition of yours?
On a side note, I wouldn't get anything graded unless I was trying to preserve it for sentimental reasons. I'd rather spend money on the figs.
When I was home (in Canada) in the summer, I watched an episode of Antique Roadshow, where they showed updates on assessments they had done years ago -- some as many as ten years back. In some cases, an item that was valued at tens of thousands of dollars was now devalued to half the original assessment...or worse! Imagine being the owner who invested in that antique. I think comics and action figures could potentially suffer the same kind of devaluing, given enough time. What's considered valuable now might not hold up down the road. Interesting video!
Its all based on demand at the time. Popularity of items will ebb and flow which can be influenced, as in SW figures, by revivals of a movie franchise. Before Lucasfilm did the original trilogy "special editions" or prequels episodes 1-3, there wasn't a huge demand for vintage SW figures. When you couple that to the nostalgic value we place on these items we played with as kids, the price will definitely sky rocket. Problem is we, as in the 40 -50 somethings, are really the only ones interested in collecting these figures. We are the ones driving the price increases because we are willing to pay these outrageous prices to recapture a part of our youth. I can only imagine that the values will only go down over time as we all get older and are not a sound investment. Even with this belief I am an avid collector and have spent a lot of money collecting, but do not expect to cash in on a huge payday for retirement if I decide to sell these in my later years. Just my two cents.
I get the feeling that the majority of your subscribers won't have much use for toy grading. We're the kind of people who like toys for what they mean to us, not what they mean to others.
I’m sure that’s the case as well. But I hope you still found the video interesting.
I can’t believe they use tape to keep the items in place. Wouldn’t the tape residue be bad for the long term condition. I think grading is stupid. It’s like people are trying to trick themselves into thinking their figure is still moc.
Yeah, seems a bit rubbish that. They have used it for years on the star wars figures.
It is a scam, just like comic book and card grading
A popular comment from those who can't grade.
Jason Fuller lame, and a venal attempt to say I dont have coin for it. I've graded comics, and its not worth it+ the constant stories of shenanigans and theft of books and fakes being graded. Thanks for showing your intelligence 👍😘
I've had the same comic book graded differently by 2 different stores (not the sealed in plastic kind). And one of the shops sent stuff off to get graded & got royally goofed over with some comics being damaged in the process. Or how about when at an auction I bought a framed mint comic, which turned out to be the cover & a few internal pages. Let's be honest it is a scam, but an arbitrary one which could potentially increase the value of said piece but will forever rob somebody of playing with it again.
Andrew Grant absolutely so better not to play their game. I also heard about one of the newer grader outfits swipped a 1st print tmnt and put in a 2nd print and graded that one the owner got wise to it but his 1st print is still gone. Too arbitrary and shady for me
I wholeheartedly agree with you. I do not agree with the reason why people would pay so much money to grade a figure. I understand that a graded figure costs more, but that’s just merely an arbitrary and inflated number someone assigned to something to make it “more valuable”. And to paraphrase Steve Sansweet: “how much is something worth? It’s what the collector is willing to pay for”. So ultimately, we give an item the final value by paying whatever we believe it deserves.
I'm not sure if it's a scam but I don't do graded figures either. I want to be able to put on the white gloves and handle them from time to time. I even recently bought a carded figure and removed it to add it to my collection. I keep mine in glass-topped cigar boxes on a cotton bed, covered in a hanky and in the dark, and I think they'll preserve better
They might go "this is weird we just graded and chewed this postal address figures and he's sent them back again?,muppet"
Has anyone looked them over with a UV light, they may stamp the 'Archive No.' with security ink under the feet for instance, knowing they have graded them before or for tests just like this?
never been a fan of grading. i feel grading is for the investor /speculator hoping to cash in and not the collector.
cuda70gt exactly. All about profit for the investor.
It is totally for the speculator or collector who can brag his Yoda is a 5.5 instead of a 5. But the reality is that it isn't an officially sanctioned system and there are no overseers. It's someone who takes your money and gives you a number to feel good about your item. That's all.
Am I mistaken... the returned graded Skeletor is tagged 1981? The original graded comment says 1984 as seen in the video
I used your hydrogen peroxide trick on my vintage Hoth stormtrooper and it worked pretty well for only being 3%
3% takes longer time to whiten things up..for me it took a week beside the window. i used cream for haircare though.
I personally think they look really nice in their acrylic boxes, I much prefer them graded, I’m going to have all my Star Wars figures graded in the future
I found this video quite interesting. You gained another subscriber
Are grades given based on comparison to a mint example? If so, how can they maintain a mint version for comparison if time causes degradation, even when stored under the best condition possible? Is it possible that your Skeletor grades higher because the mint example used for comparison has degraded with time, so the difference between you figure and their mint version has become less drastic than it was the first time you had it graded? If the scenario I described actually occurs, how could using a mint example for comparison be at all accurate? No two environments are the same, so no two items would deteriorate at the same rate.
There is a lot more I'd like to learn about the grading/certification process, but I won't overload you with questions. Any insight to the questions I did ask would be most appreciated though..
I’ve know idea on how they come up with a number. They don’t give out that info. I have also emailed hem about this and haven’t got a reply.
I’d like to see how graders actually examine these figures for signs of fixes and such. Do they do some kind of forensic testing to differentiate original coats of paint or, say, joint stiffness vs. touch-ups or mods that would lower the supposed resale value?
I'm sure they use a UV light as that would show up paint touch ups. Not sure about the rest.
As TP said, they use blacklights to look for touch-ups to the figure or packaging, and they even use X-ray to check if an item is actually still inside the package if the item is not visible when there is a question as to whether the item is a re-seal or considered unopened. For loose figures, there are all sorts of resources online such as Imperial Gunnery to check for accessories to see if they are repro, especially with how good the scammers are getting with copying vintage accessories now.
It's exactly like the Hot Wheels redlines book that it shows you every price of every Hot Wheels redlines and it tells you which one is the most rare one it shows every Hot Wheels made in the 60s in every color that they were made and some of them have bogus prices
I have a sensor scope r2d2 where the blue on his dome and sensor scope doesn’t stay up, any way to fix it?
Ptfe tape. I've done videosmon stiffening loose limbs with that. Should work just fine.
People take comfort in simple numbers, it's easier than talking about nuanced differences.
Ever try to buy stuff on ebay/at shows and thier dealer *reallly* tries to sell you on what grade it *would* get?
Yeah thats happened to me to :p
Graders opinions are inflating the market even before they touch it
Great video. I feel grading toys is foolish! You should try sending in some figures that you restored and see how they score!
Now THAT is a great idea!
Restored figures would be rejected, at least if the grading company is a legit one like AFA, UKG, and CAS. Certainly all three have made mistakes before, but they all use blacklights to test for paint touch-ups to loose figures as well as mint-on-card examples.
I was just making a joke about sending in restored figures for grading. David really does a nice job restoring toys and I enjoy watching him do so and I've also tried his techniques. It's fun. This whole grading thing is too serious and takes the fun out of things. These are toys after all and their purpose and existence is found FUN!
@@korydoe7201 haha yeah I know...the sad thing is that some people have done this though and actually made it through grading successfully. 🤣
That is unfortunate, someone is always trying to swindle someone else
someone el
Thanks for doing this experiment. I've always been of the opinion that a figure is only worth what I'm willing to spend on it. Lol
R. David Hill I agree. Graded or not, something is only worth what someone is willing to pay up for. If you don’t ever plan on selling your figure/figures/collection then you’ve just got a bunch of toys like the rest of us collectors.
I never understood why anyone would want their toy in an unopenable case
Pro grading is a product of the Internet age. It boomed because too many people selling stuff on the internet had WIDELY varying definitions of good, bad, mint, etc. They helped to establish some standards for the world wide market... and as long as you have faith in their consistency (not all do) then you can make purchases with a bigger degree of confidence.
They have good and bad points but overall they benefit the kind of collectors that are picky about condition.
Exactly so. Grading isn't for everyone, but the sales prices of graded versus ungraded support the fact that high-graded figures will always command a huge premium. Even going from a "near-mint" score of 80 to a "near-mint plus" score of 85 or higher means a massive difference to some collectors, myself included.
The grading part is in my opinion a waste of time but the boxes are a good way of protecting mint or rare figures but you can buy a good PVC box with the same result, I wonder if the display boxes will yellow with age like a lot of plastics.
They do, but it takes a lot longer than the plastic and or bubbles. Unless it's around any kind smoker or smoke etc
It is such a scam. It effectively renders the toy useless. They do the same thing with retro video games, and I hate it!
I think your experiment supports the idea that the grading sites are very consistent...at least for the two items you sent in. One was exact and the other was off by one grade. That being said, I've never liked the idea of enclosed cases for collectibles meant to be played with or read. I guess it makes more sense for sports cards.
Yeah, the results of this video actually support grading consistency. He made a big deal about the 5% on skeletor, but the overall grade was still the same. He sent in two figures, and got basically the same scores back, sounds like they're doing a good job to me. Not that graded figs are my thing, but you really can't argue that they are all over the place with scores, at least based on this video. I think Toy Polloi was hoping for a bigger difference!
I do have to say, at least with sports card grading, it’s generally accepted by collectors you’re going to have a +/- degree of variance, probably a half to a whole point on a 1-10 scale, just based on human error and/or bias. That same human variable is going to apply to the grading of ANYTHING in any hobby or something even like fine art.
I’ve heard of people getting a card graded as an 8.5, and they opened it and sent back to the same grading company multiple times to try and get a 9. Sometimes it really backfires and the rating goes DOWN a half point.
Great video very informative!!
Of course grading is worth it - for the people that manage to scam others into paying for it. Easy money.
I’ve always thought that grading is a scam. Putting these toys in a case only does one thing and one thing only… raise the price by an insane amount. It’s just a bragging right, or in some cases, a way for someone to make a quick buck.
I also collect comics, and it is so infuriating when someone buys a collection of comics, like 100+ comics, all worth around 2 to 10 dollars a piece, just to ship them all off to be graded. Most of the comics are not even rare or really worth anything, but that case will give a 2 dollar comic a 52 dollar price tag.
I understand putting something in a case like that if it is extremely rare and deteriorating, but outside of that, it seems pointless, unless you are a reseller.
I think the score is higher for the paint considering the fact that some figures paint fade and discolour and this one maintained well compared to others the same age and also time passed since the 1st grading.
While I don't believe in toy grading services I will say that I do believe that a large part of the grading service expense is that custom (to a degree) acrylic case made for each figure. The ridiculous end comes from people selling for an extreme premium.
On your paperwork did you get any feedback on how they came to those numbers?
They give no indication of how the grade was worked out.
This is something that all of the grading companies offer for an extra charge. A detailed report of the faults complete with a chart showing where the damages/flaws were noted. This type of thing is rarely done unless it is an extremely rare figure.
Well if you take ito account the wide range of variants I think many are worthy of recognition. Take into count the blue helmet Boba Fett which is different from the regular Boba Fett. The helmet was sprayed blue due to some issue with the plastic at the time of manufacture and its therefore worth more than the regular Boba Fett. There were far fewer made and many have paint chips and /or defects. I actually have the first one graded by AFA and it is a legitimate variant. The tri-logo Fett has a lighter blue body and is a European release quite different from its USA version. Some Fett figures have a lighter chest or a darker chest color. Obviously carded grading is more expensive and I stick to loose grading myself. Other examples are the Lili Ledy line from Mexico with the renowned Removable Hood Jawa. This is a very rare figure and many of them are missing the hood so genuine complete high grade examples are hard to come by. Even harder to acquire is the Fixed Hood Jawa like the Kenner But its completely made by Lili Ledy and has a different cloth cloak with fixed hood. All Lili Ledy Jawas come with different blasters from the Kenner. Its important to get rare figures graded and authenticated due to the level of fake accessories and weapons. Some are touched up and more often than not this altering is caught. The only legit Boba Fett with removable rocket is made by Lili Ledy aside from Kenner prototypes ! I had mine graded and authenticated as this figure complete is extremely rare. I have seen sellers pulling the rocket out from the tri-logo Fett and try to pass it off as a legit variant when it is Not. There is no tri-logo Fett with removable rocket. There are also regular Lili Ledy Fetts with fixed rockets and are more common but still the plastic and colors are different from the Kenner or Palitoys. PBP/POCH (Spain) also have there own versions as did Meccano out of France. So I could write paragraphs on and on but it is worthwhile if you have rare figures. I also have the red cape Bib Fortuna from Lili Ledy and if you are into more than just the regular SW line and go into variants its worthwhile getting them recognized as legitimate.Bear in mind that through time aging discolors the plastic and that is not a variant but due to aging. Having figures graded in cases makes them easier to store and stack in boxes. They are protected from falls and are slightly UV resistant with the case. They display easily on shelves or cabinets in the acrylic case so don't worry about them falling over. UKG I prefer for variants and AFA is great for the regular line but they do recognize many variants now. If in doubt email them before to be sure and provide pictures. You'll get an answer about it soon. I have over 700 graded Star Wars figures both vintage and modern including bootlegs ( yes these are faked also- ironic isn't it?)
Grading is your choice. I chose to grade all of my loose figures because of all the fake weapons and staffs plus switching sabers to make a complete figure. Example- A Lili Ledy (Mexico) Darth Vader with a Kenner saber. They won't grade it but refuse it and ship it back inside a sealed case. You cannot mix and match figures and weapons. Lili Ledy Vader sabers are thicker than Kenner and are harder to come by. Kenner Vader sabers are thinner and you can see the difference. Same goes for staffs which are thicker for Lili Ledy figures in some cases. Remember that the infamous "float" test is Not foolproof and savvy counterfeiters make weapons that float so it takes careful examination to be sure its real. They do this to sell a 'complete' figure and get more money out of it leaving you with a partially fake figure. It depends what you want out of this hobby.