My colleagues and I describe it as a "hazing ritual". Friends/colleagues doing PhDs seem to get stuck towards the end of their PhD and I will always tell them "Let it go. Just do whats required and submit. Its not a part of you. Its just a thesis." So far helped everyone I've given that advice to.
That's how I treated it, yet my supervisor refused to acknowledge this and even when I considered my work ready for write-up he subjected me to an extension of year and a half to continue painstakingly criticising and correcting and sometimes even shoehorning his own ideas... I agree with a lot here presented, but it kinda puts the onus on ths student and at least in my country, without his signature and approval you get nowhere. It's the system and some outdated approaches like thy of my supervisor, who treated the whole process very rigidly, treating the thesis like a magnum Opus and subjecting me to unreasonable demand when everybody else was getting through it so much more lightly with supervisors who understood academia is more business-like today.
The bit about "becoming your project" hit hard. During my Ph.D., I had months-long cycles where I felt incredibly depressed because nothing was working and the only thing that made me feel better was when I had a good research day. Having a life & hobbies outside of your Ph.D. (and work in general) is so incredibly important.
Current Ph.D. student. (And rock climber) I got married and started having kids during my undergrad. My graduate studies have been so rigorous and they function off the assumption that nobody does anything with their lives except research and homework. I have typically been unable to start homework until after 10 PM because I have other things going on at home. It has severely limited my ability to get things done and ability to study with my classmates, which I’m also expected to do. Academia’s expectations of being the only thing in my life has been indirectly punishing me for having a family, and it has consequently been having a very heavy toll on my mental and emotional well being.
Ain't nobody got time for that. I'm about to do oral comps so my situation is a bit more stressful than usual, but in general hard to find balance. Holidays are also a trap.
Ain't nobody got time for that. I'm about to do oral comps so my situation is a bit more stressful than usual, but in general hard to find balance. Holidays are also a trap.
I was thinking of part time PhD exactly because of that, I have a very stable job that provides me enough free time to do other things, a PhD could be one of them.
I was working at the US Patent Office and considering going back for my PhD, talked to some potential supervisors, met up with them at their lab, talked about their projects (III-V semiconductor processing, back in the mid 80s). Decided to stay at the Patent Office and go to law school at night, worked for me. Examining patent applications is enjoyable and talking to inventors about their inventions is great without my having to do any of the hard research leading to the inventions. Also I get to see many more fields of tech than I ever would have had I gotten my PhD. No regrets almost 40 years later.
Me too...in the orientation, the professor was like, "you know, you could go look for a jobs and build a successful life than coming here to do a PhD that you may not even finish, so think twice.
So true about them wanting it to be your everything! I refused to abandon critically ill family members and my Chair and department head were baffled and angry at why I lagged in my work. I will always put famil first.
I'm still in Academia as a full-time full professor at a state college. I love my job, but one of the saddest things to me is how many professors and deans seem unhappy. They don't smile. They don't take an interest in other people. They complain almost constantly when they do speak. It seems more pronounced in R1 universities.
Yes! I did undergrad and masters at a state school and had a wonderful experience. Then decided to go for a PhD 8 yrs later at a R1 institution and OMG was it the worst 5yrs of my life! So much abuse, neglect, and exploitation was too much to bear for me. At the state school, I felt uplifted, growing, supported.... but at the R1, I felt like I was drowning and further being pushed down by "mentors". It was awful.
Teachers are a form of caregiver. And there is this special type of self loathing that caregivers get when they try to take time for themself, cause you know, if you are not giving 110% to your wards you are obviously a selfish and horrible person.
@@staciweaver7801 I had a similar experience as I progressed through my degrees. I was fortunate to work with a great dissertation advisor, but I saw more misery at that program than at my BA and MA institutions (though there was certainly some of it at my MA school). Many professors in my Ph.D. program seemed to actively discourage their students. They were downright mean for no reason. And most chairs, deans, provosts, etc. I've come across seem fairly unhappy too.
@@scurvofpcp You may be right. The unhappiness I've observed seems more tightly tied to inflated egos, trivial projects, and strained relationships. I've met very few grad professors at the R1 level who fit the caregiving profile. In fact, most professors in R1s teach very few classes each year. Some of them only teach 1 or 2 courses per semester and often talk about teaching as if it's a bother that prevents them from doing their "real" work of researching and publishing.
As a PhD student, I think that the issues you describe are particularly prevalent in students who enter their programs directly after their undergraduate degrees. I strongly advocate taking at least a year or more to work or travel or just chill before applying to grad school. You need to learn how to build an identity separate from your field of study! Perspective is key, self worth must come from within
Interesting, because that is exactly what I did. Started studying directly after school. After undergrad mechanical engineering I did one and a half year voluntary service in a primary school abroad. Started learning playing guitar and partner dancing. Came back, finished grad school and declined PhD opportunity. Switched careers and work now as a school teacher. Part time dance teacher. Couldnt be happier.
nah, it's the toxic culture, it will affect you no matter your age because it's about power dynamics. Even if you're older you're still at the bottom and you're still in that toxic culture.
Einstein for relativity, Perelman for the Pointcare conjecture, Wiles for Fermat’s last theorem, Newton for everything .. all recluses from academia for freedom of thought.
@@HappyduderawrTrue but they weren't really held back hy academia too much, and in Tao's case; He kinda leads the conversation so he has a lot more freedom I imagine. Erdos was just an outgoing guy, he would've been, with academia or without.
@@popdop0074 I'm actually on the more reclusive side of things, but I think most people arn't like me, and biggest reason im more reclusive is because i cant just sit with a bunch of people and come up with things on the spot. That requires a lot of natural talent. I think its down to personality types mostly though and I work best with very long periods of zero distraction.
@@Happyduderawr I disagree with everything you said tbh. Most people are reclusive, there are levels of extraversion but most just do the minimum to get by in most situations. As for it being a talent, that's really not true dude, I can tell you firsthand, charisma is a skill and a skill only. Yes there are certain essential personality traits that each person has, doesn't matter, everyone can become a version of themselves where they can openly communicate, I went from a totally isolated dude to a public speaker, it just took time and practice. It's kind of how politicians work... The thing stopping most people is simply their belief that they can't. And maybe you can't, so what? Fail until you succeed. It's the same process as dating, no one's born a smooth talking bachelor, they learn it and the first step is having the confidence to fail. I'm autistic so trust me I've been there, but it's all about having a topic focus. Better yet, what's your purpose talking to X people? If it's just someone talking for the sake of talking then no wonder, but imagine if there's a focus like a math topic, then it'd be a lot easier. Social anxiety is tough (and super underlooked) but really just try not to stress so much because like I said, most people just do the bare minimum so they honest to god, could not care less how you respond.
@@Happyduderawr The impression I'm getting is that a scientist who just wants to have a decent career and make some average-sized contributions can do well by collaborating a lot. But the people who really make the breakthroughs are recluses who spend a lot of time being alone. Obviously this isn't universally true but still.
I was a late-life PhD (musicology, not the sciences) who had so few expectations of what I would achieve in academe, that anything which I *did* achieve in academe automatically became a pleasant surprise. And none of the obvious horrors which afflict PhD candidates ever befell me: I had a supervisor at once friendly, competent, and punctual (I've heard plenty of alarming tales from other PhD candidates about supervisors who were obnoxious, inept, and slothful). What enabled me to complete the doctorate satisfactorily - within three years, whereas I've encountered several individuals who never completed their own doctorates even within a decade - was my realisation that (a) although getting a scholarship from the federal government was most agreeable, I wouldn't have been heartbroken if I'd failed to get one; (b) I wouldn't have been heartbroken if a PhD more generally had become impossible for me. Therefore there was, I guess, an element of the 'gentleman amateur' about my whole attitude: not that I was at all slack about doing the requisite labour, but neither my economic life nor my spiritual life depended on obtaining the qualification.
I went to a top-level music conservatory for my undergrad (viola performance), and many of the things you say in this video sound exactly like what I experienced then. I distinctly remember an advisor during freshman orientation saying “if you’re serious about your instrument, then you can forget about your other hobbies. Because if you’re not practicing your instrument 6 hours a day, you’re wasting your tuition.”
That's terrible advice even for music majors that are extremely serious about their craft, I'm one of them, composer specifically and I can tell you the only thing that can give your creative or performance focused endeavors is having hobbies and a life outside of music, otherwise your music won't say anything to anyone except that you haven't done anything in your life worth sharing through your craft
The best professors I’ve had encouraged me to do better with kindness and patience. This made learning fun. Some professors were so nit-picky that I wondered why I was even trying. It’s amazing how being too critical of students can actually hold them back
"You are your project" -- I love this. It just inspired me. I am not an academic. I have only recently started contemplating about taking up a master's degree, and the thing that keeps bothering me most is, "what if I fail?". I like the practicality of your videos, and it is nice to know your insights. Keep it up!
After spending three years trying to reproduce data from the previous grad student that eventually turned out to be complete garbage anyway, I was forced to take a masters. I worked and worked all that time, never getting to do my own experiments, constantly being gaslit that it was all my fault. It couldn’t be that the original data was wrong. No way. Honestly, that never even occurred to me until the end when it was staring me in the face. It always had to be my fault. The lasers weren’t aligned properly. I wasn’t getting enough power out of the non-linear crystals. That signal had to be somewhere under that noise. It was never that the reaction was too endoergic or that the room temperature spectrum was simply incorrect. It was always my fault. Eventually, I was just going through the motions, and treating it like a regular job. I was simultaneously devastated and ecstatic when it all ended. I was, however, afraid to tell my family what had happened, so I spent days by myself in my apartment looking for any job so I could avoid starvation. Fortunately, I found one before my depression led me to end it all. I hate academia and I will tell anyone with dreams like I had to be very careful when choosing to go to graduate school, and especially with what advisor they choose. Even the respected ones with stellar reputations for having happy groups will throw you under the bus when you get results that are contrary to what they expect. The scientific method and integrity mean nothing to them when grant money is on the line.
Watching as a faculty member and graduate student supervisor (albeit not in the sciences), I find this content really helpful--negative models to avoid to try to get students to the next step(s) of their lives. Cheers, Guy
I was applying for PhD last year (after 2 years of hesitating on my career). It's not that no one wanted to take me, but my director wanted me to go for another subject and I just felt really uninspired with it. My deep thought was : if I have to work for years on that subject, I rather be clear on what I want and not start to negociate even before starting... so in the end, I didn't find a director, and I don't know if I will apply for a PhD later. There is still some research I would love to do, but right now, I rather be a teacher, write in magazines, talk in podcasts, do lectures in conventions and cinemas (I'm a literature and animation specialist ahah). When I think back of my academia projects, I think that I'm a failure, I didn't have the nerve to continue despite criticism etc... but truth is, I feel very ok with my life right now, very empowered with projects and exploration, and if I have to dedicate my life to whatever research... let's be honest, I don't want it.
Many of these things just make me cringe. It’s been almost 5 years since I left academia, but every once in a while, a professor will comment on my socials or I'll bump into one on the street. They still think I'm part of their world and talk like it... but it just sounds weird now. I can't believe it all seemed so normal to me when I was still in it!
When I finished my PhD contract and failed to get any other funding, I hated it. People assuming I was going to continue working for free lol, attending expensive conferences, writing complicated treaties and ordering dozens of books for it as if daddy paid the bills or money grew on trees. The absolute disconnect from reality this people have. And they think they are helping you by asking you to commit to write something for them after it's obvious you won't have time as now you have to find another source of income!
I think how good or bad your PhD experience is very heavily depends on your supervisor. I've heard some proper horror stories, but also heard from people who had great PhD experiences
I've just got admitted in my desired PhD program, I've been watching your videos for the last 2 years in and out, but I think I have to watch your videos more often.
Just remember: 1.there is a life outside of academia. Always has been, always will be, it is not the end all be all. 2. Even if academia doesnt work out, that doesnt mean you are dumb. You are always able to learn more and acquire new skills. Acquiring skills and knowledge should be fun, or at the very least, rewarding. It will sometimes be difficult and grueling, as all hard work is, no matter the field. But if academica begins to kill your love for your field or your passion or inspiration, perhaps rethink it. 3. PhD is really cool bragging rights, but most ppl outside of academia do not care. They will not treat you better or worse. Unless it is someone looking to date for money and/or status. So be weary of the flashy title. 4. I'd even go so much is to say "is this money I'm spending worth it even if I end up failing or hating my field of study afterwards?" For some, the cost of academia is a drop in the bucket, and it's no skin off their back if they succeed or fail. If your hypoethetical success is dependent on the PhD, I think you need to take a harder look at why you think that is 🤷🏻♀️ it is a big investment and a big risk if you cannot afford to fail. If it's too risky for you to fail, I'd focus on other areas of your life first and make sure you have connections, experience, other achievements, a fulfilling personal life so that your studies carry less risk and don't consume you.
Not everyone’s experience. Depends on the supervisor. It’s hard work but so it should be….you’re getting a phd. My supervisor was very encouraging and supportive.
I agree with both of you. I have great supervisors who have been nothing but supportive and basically none of the things he talks about have been my experience. Even know when I'm coming to the end of the PhD and I'm feeling the pressure (mostly from myself), they're a fantastic support. Having said that, I do believe this is the experience that many people have and there is so much toxicity in academia that is being perpetuated. I think it's getting better with the generation of younger PIs. Though not always. I know our institute basically only hires young PIs. I don't think there's a single one over 50. But there are some among them who perpetuate the same toxicity nevertheless. Thankfully, it's being actively combated by leadership. So hopefully the future generation, who was trained in environments like this will do better.
There is so much truth in this video... I left the academia 15 years ago, and it was considered by everyone as an existencial crisis, telling me i will be back in short... for years... And the main reason i left it's exactly the next point you mention xd. I wanted to do many things, to learn many things... and while i was in, that was not possible. I'm a biologist, but while i was still in, i assisted to quantic physics conferences, to classic literature reunions, to politics lectures from 90 years sages, and so on... taking a toll in my schedule... and that being a 23 youngster! I loved science, but i don't like how scientifics work nowadays (not aplying correctly the scientific method neither in most cases, because you have to publish), so i was clearly out of it. A pity, but we are not in the times of Einstein, Ramon y Cajal, or similar others, and I'm happy nowadays with my current life
@@Veeravaara i ended teaching high schoolers. It was the easy thing to do when leaving, but i enjoy it so i stayed as a teacher for many years now. I'm passionate with science and have a broad view of life so it's a good combo when you combine it with an excentric personality for students. I'm planning to write some books too, some fiction and some about kids development (I'm a parent now, and i'm realizing a lot of things which are wrong from the early stages of a baby, which translates in possible problems in 14-16 or more years). I'm spanish so i cannot speak about others countries, as i have seen the ones in spain and un.
@@alejandrosunshadow6041 this is encouraging to hear! I just started my PhD, but I tried teaching high schoolers before, that is my current plan b for when I've had enough of academia. For an ecologist and evolutionary biologist it's a tough job market atm 😔
I am happy my experience was better. My PhD was industrially funded and the company was great to work with. Most people in my group went into industry and there was no stigma about it. People even joined our group because of all the industry contacts. I went into industry as soon as I finished.
Thank you so much for this video! I relate the most to the criticism aspect. It wrecks me. I just finished the first year of my PhD, I am super motivated about my project , but I am never pleased with my progress, despite everyone saying I am progressing fine. most of the time I feel like things just fly by right before my eyes and I am not making the most of them
I was thrown in at the deep end in my PhD, as were my colleagues. Criticism came from peers at the weekly seminars we gave (one student per week, so a cycle). I was expecting criticism when I read a paper at a conference at which Max Perutz was an attender. I got none, but incredible support from Max. Major criticism came when we submitted papers. My first accepted, which was also my first submitted, was in _Nature_ . That was in the '70s. I saw things change, with pressure to obtain grants, so was pleased to retire.
I am one of the fortunate ones. My supervisor didn't like quick trivial stuff and instead always looked for deep, non-trivial, slow research. I thoroughly enjoyed it. They are also great human-being to around with! Now I am in my first postdoc and my new supervisor seems to share the same ideology. I hope anyone who decides to stay will eventually find a pleasant place.
I've always wanted to pursue a PhD, but I never aspired to be an academic. My passion lies in doing independent research within my field. However, completing my Master's was an exhausting experience-I had no time for anything else, my supervisor wasn't helpful, and I often felt isolated. I still dream of earning a PhD one day, but now I have a solid career and my own home. I don't want to give that up, and in the UK, I haven't found a way to balance my career with independent research. I'm not looking to work in academia, but I'd love the chance to make a meaningful contribution to my field.
I had a young professor just a few years older than me and was working in a new field. We were just trying to figure out how to do the experiments, so I did not have the experience you describe. Also, this was the early 1970s and I had received a letter from the department with my acceptance letter that it was unlikely that I would ever get a job in the field, since times were hard, so I had no expectations. I was going to do something interesting for a few years and then figure out what to do. I would not have put up with any of the browbeating - I would have left. I ended up having a surprisingly great career in physics and never once had to go through the situation you described. I have however seen it, and my only question is why smart students put up with it. And I don't know why the supervisors do it. I always say the most important things you learn in advance education is that most of your ideas are wrong (as are everyone else's) and you learn where the limits of your knowledge and understanding lie, so you know where to tread carefully.
OMG, this is so true!!! I mean, I wonder if it's even more difficult for psychology degree students because we know we are being trained in high empathy tasks and it's not what we receive, it's not what they model as institutions...
Try doing it with undiagnosed adhd. I didn't understand why I was failing. Why I couldn't be as organized and methodical as everyone else. I left with no PhD and severe depression. Afterwards I would sit at home and my husband would come home and ask what I did that day and I couldn't even answer because all I did was sit and stare at the wall completely numb for 6-8 hours straight. Took another 10 years to actually get the right diagnosis and get help.
I agree. The university system and ita metrics is ridiculous:H index, press releases, publish quantity rather than quality, get as much funding as possible, etc, etc)...And at the end of the day it is important to say that much research is useless or BS* in practice, representing a waste of money from the citizens (who pay it with their taxes) and industry (same). Something new and genuine is needed.
The biggest issue I see with academia is the emphasis on length. A topic that could have been covered in five pages is stretched to twenty with repetition and BS.
I would say that it is really hard to get any substantial independence before getting permanent job. Even then, you have many different commitements, thus, very little time to pursue what you are actually interested in.
Passed my viva in February and have been in industry since finishing. My supervisor kept saying over and over to do a post doc and become ‘famous’ in my field. Every time I spoke to him about trying industry so that I could make an informed decision, he would make out that if I didn’t go straight to a post doc, my academic career would be out of the window. The thing is, knowing what I know now (that this obviously is not the case) makes me feel worse about it, because I know he also knew it. He was prepared to not be truthful to me to try to get me to stay in academia. I do love my supervisor, but this rubbed me the wrong way, and I have determined it’s a mix of academic norms with his own cultural expectations. Either way, while I don’t let it make me lose sleep, it’s still a shame that he sees me as less for ‘settling’ with industry when actually, I am the happiest I have been in four years
Thank God I left academia before it was too late... I was one semester into a PhD, in a discipline where so many already knew going in they wanted to go into industry, and I had a panic attack that made me realize I wouldn't be happy in research...
More than half of my friends that have PhD’s are unemployed or working at Starbucks. Nothing wrong with Starbucks. It’s just ironic that they spent so much time there writing their thesis only to work there.
I am a 6th year post doc and yes, unfortunately, it happens to me to see people believing to one or more of these points. I myself, from time to time, fall into beliving these traps.
5:25 is the heart of it. I heard the same thing when I decided to opt out of my PhD program, finish a masters and leave. They know it. They're insecure about it. And they try to cover it up by creating facade of self-importance through busyness and criticism, which consistently lead to burn-out.
Tonight I am taking the last data for my PhD thesis. This video came at the perfect time, just need to write the thing, get it over with, and get the hell out.
I have to strongly disagree with you about my own experience, I got my PhD in theoretical physics 4 years ago. For theoretical physics, take everything he said in this video, and multiply it by 100,000. Then it’s accurate. Happy in industry right now. People have realistic expectations, they don’t leave you out to dry if you are having problems, and they care about their life outside of work (and I’m in a FAANG, even here is so much better than academia).
Indeed. I'm also happier and less stressed right now working in industry than I was in academia. Looking back, academia is almost a bit cult-like / religion-like, in the sense that they look down on the outside world and they more or less expect you to have nothing substantial in your life going on aside from it.
It would be an interesting social experiment to have (say) business owners with 10+ years of experience (heck, even just employment outside of education sector) become teachers. I suspect we would see a greater emphasis on real-world skills, self-reliance and entrepreneurism, and less on the 'need' to go to university. A possible result would be less university enrolments with more focus on valuable qualifications, less focus on 'soft' qualifications, and a rise in private business ownership/participation.
In general, I get the sentiment that teachers with a genuine passion for sharing their knowledge will always do a better job than professors in it for the research, so that wouldn't surprise me.
When I was studying for my doctorate, I learned it was like an ideological reeducation camp. If one didn’t agree with the prevailing theory or model, one was subject to ridicule and condemnation. I had to leave because of health detriments, and I didn’t finish.
I’m a junior at a college prep high school, not even pursuing a phD atm but all of this is so true, I can’t wait to get out of here because they really do reduce you to your work and nothing is ever enough. It really restrains your growth as a human being, so I’d like to become independent from this even though my mother wants me to be a doctor
Regarding waiting for supervisor's approval for everything, its good to keep in mind that in some places (institutions, countries, specific grants) you really are *bound* to your supervisor and leaving them (or upsetting them and getting kicked out) might mean never getting a grant in that country anymore or lose your entire PhD. I work now in a country where that's not an issue at all, and i see some grad students changing groups for the simplest reasons like they didn't enjoy the research as much. While in my country, i ended my PhD under literal threats from my supervisor, and it was a power he had - if i left that project with him and/or didn't defend my thesis (which was also subject to his approval) i would lose my entire PhD, i would never be able to get a grant in my country anymore from basically the one funding agency that is stull standing there and i would have to give back 150k to the funding agency. So in some cases, there's literally no such thing as 'don't wait for their approval' etc, unfortunately.
Even as a Computer Engineer undergraduate, by the fourth year, I started feeling that the skills I learned in vector calculus and quantum physics are worthless, and computer hardware design is only somewhat useful. Because of time constraints, all the class projects are just toy examples to show that you understand the theoretical knowledge. After I graduated and started doing coding on my own, I realize how the knowledge connects with real world applications.
The best programmer coworker I've ever had was just a guy who started coding in his teens and never stopped, and he never had any kind of science degree. Admittedly I work at just a web development company, so it's not like we're doing super complicated stuff here.
Younger academics - more supportive Older academics- not so That's so on point. Prospective PhD students must be aware of this. Saves a lot of distress during the degree. Sadly, most want to join under an accomplished senior prof.
2:23 it's just like in a normal job. When I finish a project there's also no fanfare. It's just a job you get money for. The next project starts right away. No one's clinking glasses.
The difference is that in academia you're under the pretense that you're pushing your field forward in exciting new directions. Which is a lie 99% of the time.
Well yeah, but if we think of a phD as "just a job you get money for", then it's a high-stress, high-skill-required, low-pay job. It's a terrible deal as "just a job." I was significantly more stressed during my university master's degree than I am now at my ICT job, because at my ICT job I just clock eight hours per day, and I'm unlikely to get fired, and even if I get fired I can find a new job quickly. There's almost no "fail state", plus I'm paid well.
I feel that those who do PhD or even Master's degrees have a tremendous amount of grit. I personally only attempted an Honour's degree in Computer Science here in South Africa, which is basically a step between a Bachelor's and Master's degree. I struggled so much that I only completed 2 modules that had no programming/practical components to the research, and I dropped my year long research project and the remaining 4 modules which all had programming/practical components in the research. I didn't have any idea as how I was going to integrate 5 programming projects into 5 different research papers (1 large one and 4 mini ones). I had no inspiration for what I was going to do. I ultimately dropped on in the first month of my second semester. I became very depressed after I left. And it didn't help that my friend seemed to cope and he graduated with the Honour's degree. It made me feel even worse about myself. But at least I managed to find work shortly after leaving the Honour's degree. Crazy thing is, I'm actually doing a Bachelor's degree in Accounting now. The Honour's degree actually was a stepping stone in determining that I'm not a fan of working in the tech field in general. Programming and making projects is not something that I'm all that passionate about. It feels more like a burden than anything else. I truly figured this out when I started working in the field. Accounting at least feels like it's more interesting. I love the fact that a lot of what I learn can be applied to real life.
Hmmm. Yeah, I would say that pretty much sums up my PhD. The intense culture of criticism and the internalization. It beat me down. That, plus the isolation, created the conditions that led to depression. I was a train wreck. The journal Nature is doing a series on this. Andy did a video as well. Be careful during the process. Yes, get a healthy non-academic outlet (sport club, knitting club, something). After the brief academic career, sadly, I learned that my PhD is a professional liability in the non-academic world. Be careful. If possible, find a place that is explicitly looking for someone with a PhD.
not gonna lie when I’ve heard the first couple of seconds at the video I thought this was going down a completely different road. Glad to hear actual critiques that aren’t from someone who’s never been to college pulling shit out of their ass.
I find profs mean to PhDs everywhere. On the other hand they're very welcoming to UG and PG students - encouraging, talkative, I'm a cool guy kind of image.. When it comes to a PhD student they are the exact opposite - discouraging, condescending, abusive, manipulative, and what not. If you see someone with a PhD, that person has had immense courage to overcome all of this, which not even 0.001 percent of the world population would even attempt.
I'm planning to do a PhD program in a few years, but to be honest most of my experiences with higher education we're similar to what you have talked about in this video
I also encountered the opposite extreme: the need for constant praise. Funny how people don't have time to write a peer review but they have endless time to write hollow press releases talking about how great they are to pass along to the stenographers that make up the bloated marketing team.
I worked as a tech in a Bio Sciences lab for a flagship research university, and all of this was so true of my experience. If “you are your project,” I was little more than a servant whose only purpose was to make other people’s project succeed. My PI (a young, intelligent woman just starting her own lab) was fully bought into the “gatekeeper, god-like” persona, and her constant criticism caused at least 3 techs to flame out in the first 2 years of the lab. On not having skills for the real world, my boss implied that if I weren’t in Academia, I’d only be good for working in a pizza shop. My mental health got absolutely wrecked, and even 6 months after I left, I still have a hard time relating to work and criticism due to the toxic environment. If you’re thinking about starting a career in the biological sciences, I sincerely hope your experience is different from mine
That's your personal experience. It is sad but definitely partial. My supervisor always says my work is great, invites me to a restaurant at least once in a year etc. But I understand what you're saying
Yes its’s healthy to be more than your project but also I remember my advisor frowning when I said I was seeing a therapist at 10am on Thursday mornings because they don’t want you to be anything except your project.
OMG my man you just expressed all my thinking in language and I can't even just how close home this feels ! constant criticism and not enough praise and as a result you feel like you haven't done shit and you're alone in your journey and the stigma of "postdoc or make money" and the elitist take on everything.
As a computer systems engineering student, we have to learn follow IEEE standards to ensure that all types of messages are universally consistent, no matter which country you publish your work from. It's customary to ensure that there's no confusion between engineers, no matter where they've graduated from. That's just an example of what may not be considered brainwashing, but instead a useful system to memorize for whoever plans to work in any STEM field, given it's universally accepted.
My paper just got accepted into a really good journal in my field. This happened during the weekend and everyone wrote "Congratulations" in an email. Monday morning I was met with: do you think this deadline for PhD submission is realistic!? And We need to finish this next paper! 😩
I have done a phd in chemistry and now.working as an r&d leader but actually also trying to build up my startup and become independent. I love research and still like chemistry but modern academia felt instanely suffocating and toxic.. The fake niceness, fake sucking up to each professor, whete at the same time there is at least as much cut-throat competition if not even more than in industry... In academia, as a phd student, it's full responsibility with practically zero authority.. yes, that's what called slavery which also reflects in salaries and working conditions.. modern academia is pretty much a giant pyramid scheme at this point but a t least a super cynical and hyprocritical one that always preaches about values etc.. also, modern publishing is a scam and research is so standardised that the real geniuses from 100 years ago would barely have a chance as their groundbreaking ideas would be considered unproved or not well supported by peers.. and about the shaming, a community which critisizes you for everything and pays you shit but shames you if you leave, sounds pretty much like a cult to me... Don't get me wrong, I have met many both personally and professionally amazing scientists, but the modern academic structure now is a bloated cancer in my opinion, something that is more about name recognition and politics and quotas, than actual groundbreaking ideas...
Yep. It's trash. Recently rescued a data engineer from a bio marine post PhD program, and her situation was of utter stagnation. Most people in there tho doublethink themselves into ascribing a special sense of self importance to the rehearsal of peer review crunching. Which is permutations of the same thing over and over again and publishing until you reach 'the next' level of academic privileges. In Mexican case, the fucking SNI. Dropped out very soon of an advanced program within my own bachelors (luckily) the moment I was told I had to live off a glorified pension.
The Australian Universities warned me last year. New Zealand Warned me. Habbo Hotel in the early 2000s was more accurate to how people would actually behave than anything I was told in therapy lol
This is Interesting bc All my friends who have gotten their masters degrees have discouraged the process and reasoning behind it…unless it was required in their field.
The only way i can see myself doing a PhD is if I somehow manage to not really care about it too much. But I'm not sure if it's achievable to start a PhD without being ridiculously motivated and having a "I'll try my best but I don't care for perfection"-attitude instead.
Fucking this! After teaching high-school students in science for two summers, I realized how much I had lost myself doing my PhD. High-schoolers seemed much more entusiastic about science and learning, than any academic - which is paradoxal, as academics "should" be at the very forefront of current knowledge boundaries. There is very little room for passion in academia. I beleive some of this stems from the fact that being passionate or driven often is deemed naive or hopeful. And academia is not about hoping, but about doing. This is what kills enthusiasm and curiousness. The inner child that is curious slowly withers and dies and all there is left is cold hard logic and statistics and pressure of publishing papers.
Calling someone who goes into industry and makes at least two times what a Professor makes and calling them a failure is just beyond self delusional. Academia is nice and all, but generally people in Academia do not make a Lot of money. It is of course great if people are fine with just doing the science and not caring so much about money, but calling people out for going to industry because they want to leverage their gained expertise to make money is not nice. Also, I don't know which knowledge you gain during your PhD is useless in industry. That is certainly not the case for most STEM subjects. If what you are learning during your PhD is useless later in industry (how to operate certain equipment, how certain methods work theoretically, what are the limits of each method, gaining a lot of knowledge about a certain field within a subject by conducting experiments and reading papers) then you are either studying a very specific subject or doing sth seriously wrong during your PhD.
Doesn't this feel more like a society or social media thing. The way everyone frames everything in negative light, especially Instagram now. Then reflects into all areas and career paths
Most advisors expect to be treated, viewed, ego-stroked like they are god. I was having incredible anxiety for one of my yearly seminars and left off my acknowledgments slide, not intentionally at all and omg the sky fell down.
But is this an "academy problem" only? Because the way i see it (and live it) is that this lovely system we all live on has this same problems outside academy. Not recongizing effort or time invested is exactly what large corporations do with their employees. They milk your life for profits and then give the bare minimum in return. Shaming quitters is a common tactic that the same corps apply. Even Amazon shame it's workers for retiring, instead of accepting that they left because awful working conditions. This entire system love to convert people onto shells of themselves. Levels of stress, depression and anxiety are peaking through the western world even while not even half the population is doing/have a PhD. The problem is that academia should be a space free from those problems, where people go to furrher their knowledge so science can keep advancing in every field. Now it's just another step on the capitalist ladder to get a somewhat decent job. Add to that the classic problem of ego on academy and we have an exact copy of the machine that breaks workers but made for minds that only want to improve/make a change. Tldr, it's a problem of academy? Yes. But it's a problem that permeated from the system we currently live on.
I would've appreciated if you made a video or a part of the video about the good things about being in academia too, am a 3rd year medical student right now and this like scared me uk
Just a job for bright people, like any other (although bright not necessarily needed). And you know what they say - occupational habit. As an engineer by trade, I do find myself over-analysing and looking for solutions. There you go - I'm brainwashed too.
@@biner01 . Delivering masters programs is their role so they are doing their function. It’s the same in every area, less people at each level; worker bee, manager, head of dept. Creating jobs is not their function. Less people complete study at each level anyway; undergrad, masters, phd. Not everyone wants a job in academia, some want the education as a thing in itself or to support work elsewhere. Teaching programs bring in revenue and fund the department. Lots of other reasons no doubt.
@@biner01 because a phd has to have value otherwise it’s not a PhD, a PhD would not be a PhD without having tough challenges, that’s how you earn it, otherwise you are just doing stuff and not passing tests. Also, It’s not training for work it’s academic. It’s just an academic cult. And They need loads of people for this numbers game so they can find the clever ones and then the Nobel prize winners, and also to pay fees to keep the department going. I’m so bored of this now. How old are you? If you are under 25 i forgive you because your frontal lobe is not complete yet. But do learn about the world away from the comments section.
Yes, well put, unfortunately. Obviously it depends on the field, but getting a phD in a direction where there's no work is a pretty poor move, even though it's superficially a tempting way to delay having to face the real world. And for the vast majority of real-life work, you don't need a phD; it might even be a drawback, they might fear you'll get bored and not hire you.
I feel like my humour is broken because I find Thesis memes so funny. (I think it could just be my self-deprecating humour style from growing up in a big family though). 😂
Andy, can you direct me to some of your videos on academic mumbo jumbo, and why it is 'needed'? Why is there no importance attached to writing in accessible language? As an example, I have had to take my own health seriously recently, and, as well as a little bit of exercise, I have had to eat sensibly. I personally did not want to go from 'pre-diabetic' to 'diabetic'. I learned that diabetes (type two) is simple, I just had to go on a whole food, plant based diet to cook my own food. After a while I got to a sensible BMI and I found exercise came to me naturally. I hopped on my bicycle and just started going further. With no fat lurking in my arteries, everything came together. According to my doctor, my blood pressure and BMI is 'perfect' so no meds needed. Clearly I am an n=1 autodidact, however, I could summarise what I did in words that a layman could understand, maybe to inspire others to get rid of their own paunches, with no science mumbo jumbo needed. If I wanted to go all sciency, I could run a slow cookery club and get one group cooking whatever they want with another group cooking just plants. I am reasonably sure that just cooking would get both groups somewhere, however, I would expect the latter group to be able to self report the more impressive health gains. I have a friend studying diabetes and doing a PhD. This friend eats the garbage food, meatballs, burgers, ice cream and much else that, according to my own experience, is not good for the arteries, fat in the cells and insulin response. This friend also believes that too much fruit is bad and that physical activity means lifting weights in front of a mirror in the gym. I worked in science myself for a year and I appreciate that some jargon is needed at times. But, this friend writes utter gobbledygook regarding diabetes research, it is such a pity, as, due to my own health journey, I am actually very interested. This makes me think it is all one big lie, and that it is one big 'displacement activity'. Type two diabetes is simple, just eat sensibly with no animal products or processed food. It should be a solved problem but people like their burgers, don't want to take personal responsibility and trust in the science. But the science is nonsense, bamboozlement with big words is all that is going on. It irks me slightly as funding for writing piffle comes easily whereas nobody would ever fund me for running a slow cookery course with a control group to show how simple this important health problem can be solved. Is the majority of university science makework for middle class kids where daddy pays? What am I missing? Should science papers that make no sense whatsoever be seen for what they are? Carl Sagan is one of my great heroes and he could write popular science as well as understand tricky things like Gauss' Theorem, where no mere mortals understand it. Please help me understand why the need for making science impossible for the layman to understand, even if they are genuinely interested because their health provides a vested interest.
Ultimately we're monkeys -- phD people are just highly educated monkeys. And monkeys care about status. Writing gobblygook is a good way to signal high status / high education, and that's why monkeys do it. I'm being completely serious. Don't think that just because someone is highly educated that they're immune to these kinds of drivers. There's also the issue that you don't need a phD person to say "eat a whole foods, plant based diet". Which means that phDs need to earn their existence by overcomplicating things -- because no one is going to pay a phD to say "eat whole foods" that, it's already common knowledge. Companies also can't make an ungodly amount of money by selling rice and bananas. Yes it's a stupid system, but at the end of the day, all directly involved parties either benefit or think they benefit from the current system.
Yes, that's something I really dislike about academia and think is ultimately counterproductive. Unfortunately, amount of publications is an easy measurement to track and so it has become more important than actually doing good work.
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My colleagues and I describe it as a "hazing ritual".
Friends/colleagues doing PhDs seem to get stuck towards the end of their PhD and I will always tell them "Let it go. Just do whats required and submit. Its not a part of you. Its just a thesis." So far helped everyone I've given that advice to.
I had a professor tell me that his PhD advisor told him “there are two types of theses: a good thesis and a finished thesis.”
Makes sense. I wonder if some of it is the breaking down without building them back up after the fact.
Yup, that’s what got me over the line for my dissertation: My GA going, “Get it done and get your degree. You ARE checking boxes.”
That's how I treated it, yet my supervisor refused to acknowledge this and even when I considered my work ready for write-up he subjected me to an extension of year and a half to continue painstakingly criticising and correcting and sometimes even shoehorning his own ideas... I agree with a lot here presented, but it kinda puts the onus on ths student and at least in my country, without his signature and approval you get nowhere. It's the system and some outdated approaches like thy of my supervisor, who treated the whole process very rigidly, treating the thesis like a magnum Opus and subjecting me to unreasonable demand when everybody else was getting through it so much more lightly with supervisors who understood academia is more business-like today.
@@OpsReitia Unfortunately it depends a lot on which supervisor you get.
The bit about "becoming your project" hit hard. During my Ph.D., I had months-long cycles where I felt incredibly depressed because nothing was working and the only thing that made me feel better was when I had a good research day. Having a life & hobbies outside of your Ph.D. (and work in general) is so incredibly important.
Every PhD student should go rock climbing
Current Ph.D. student. (And rock climber) I got married and started having kids during my undergrad. My graduate studies have been so rigorous and they function off the assumption that nobody does anything with their lives except research and homework. I have typically been unable to start homework until after 10 PM because I have other things going on at home. It has severely limited my ability to get things done and ability to study with my classmates, which I’m also expected to do. Academia’s expectations of being the only thing in my life has been indirectly punishing me for having a family, and it has consequently been having a very heavy toll on my mental and emotional well being.
Ain't nobody got time for that. I'm about to do oral comps so my situation is a bit more stressful than usual, but in general hard to find balance. Holidays are also a trap.
Ain't nobody got time for that. I'm about to do oral comps so my situation is a bit more stressful than usual, but in general hard to find balance. Holidays are also a trap.
I was thinking of part time PhD exactly because of that, I have a very stable job that provides me enough free time to do other things, a PhD could be one of them.
There's a reason Einstein did his best work as a Patent Clerk far away from Academia.
Not possible when you need a lab
I was working at the US Patent Office and considering going back for my PhD, talked to some potential supervisors, met up with them at their lab, talked about their projects (III-V semiconductor processing, back in the mid 80s). Decided to stay at the Patent Office and go to law school at night, worked for me. Examining patent applications is enjoyable and talking to inventors about their inventions is great without my having to do any of the hard research leading to the inventions. Also I get to see many more fields of tech than I ever would have had I gotten my PhD. No regrets almost 40 years later.
It'd the exception to the rule tbh.
@@erbiumfiberMust have been a very fulfilling life!
Science is a great album
Heard a very similar talk in my first PhD course - “you should seriously reconsider what you are doing with your life” - no argument there
Me too...in the orientation, the professor was like, "you know, you could go look for a jobs and build a successful life than coming here to do a PhD that you may not even finish, so think twice.
lmao
Yeah. A professor gave us the same warning. Should have listened
Hm I think it also depends on were you do it and maybe on the department. In Psychology aeveryone is nice and supportive :)
@@veroboro4035 Psychology is a medical practice, so a PhD is useful in the industry. But that's generally not true outside of medical practices.
So true about them wanting it to be your everything! I refused to abandon critically ill family members and my Chair and department head were baffled and angry at why I lagged in my work. I will always put famil first.
You did the right thing
At work you will always be replacable, in your family you will never be replacible. So I am happy you have these priorities right :)
I'm still in Academia as a full-time full professor at a state college. I love my job, but one of the saddest things to me is how many professors and deans seem unhappy. They don't smile. They don't take an interest in other people. They complain almost constantly when they do speak. It seems more pronounced in R1 universities.
Yes! I did undergrad and masters at a state school and had a wonderful experience. Then decided to go for a PhD 8 yrs later at a R1 institution and OMG was it the worst 5yrs of my life! So much abuse, neglect, and exploitation was too much to bear for me.
At the state school, I felt uplifted, growing, supported.... but at the R1, I felt like I was drowning and further being pushed down by "mentors". It was awful.
@@alexanderlyon is that in the US?
Teachers are a form of caregiver.
And there is this special type of self loathing that caregivers get when they try to take time for themself, cause you know, if you are not giving 110% to your wards you are obviously a selfish and horrible person.
@@staciweaver7801 I had a similar experience as I progressed through my degrees. I was fortunate to work with a great dissertation advisor, but I saw more misery at that program than at my BA and MA institutions (though there was certainly some of it at my MA school). Many professors in my Ph.D. program seemed to actively discourage their students. They were downright mean for no reason. And most chairs, deans, provosts, etc. I've come across seem fairly unhappy too.
@@scurvofpcp You may be right. The unhappiness I've observed seems more tightly tied to inflated egos, trivial projects, and strained relationships. I've met very few grad professors at the R1 level who fit the caregiving profile. In fact, most professors in R1s teach very few classes each year. Some of them only teach 1 or 2 courses per semester and often talk about teaching as if it's a bother that prevents them from doing their "real" work of researching and publishing.
As a PhD student, I think that the issues you describe are particularly prevalent in students who enter their programs directly after their undergraduate degrees. I strongly advocate taking at least a year or more to work or travel or just chill before applying to grad school. You need to learn how to build an identity separate from your field of study! Perspective is key, self worth must come from within
Interesting, because that is exactly what I did. Started studying directly after school. After undergrad mechanical engineering I did one and a half year voluntary service in a primary school abroad. Started learning playing guitar and partner dancing. Came back, finished grad school and declined PhD opportunity. Switched careers and work now as a school teacher. Part time dance teacher. Couldnt be happier.
Louder for the people in the back!!!!
Are you saying the student is the issue here?
nah, it's the toxic culture, it will affect you no matter your age because it's about power dynamics. Even if you're older you're still at the bottom and you're still in that toxic culture.
Einstein for relativity, Perelman for the Pointcare conjecture, Wiles for Fermat’s last theorem, Newton for everything .. all recluses from academia for freedom of thought.
Paul erdos and terrance tao are highly social. Different types of ppl on there do whatever works for them. Math is mostly collaborative.
@@HappyduderawrTrue but they weren't really held back hy academia too much, and in Tao's case; He kinda leads the conversation so he has a lot more freedom I imagine. Erdos was just an outgoing guy, he would've been, with academia or without.
@@popdop0074 I'm actually on the more reclusive side of things, but I think most people arn't like me, and biggest reason im more reclusive is because i cant just sit with a bunch of people and come up with things on the spot. That requires a lot of natural talent. I think its down to personality types mostly though and I work best with very long periods of zero distraction.
@@Happyduderawr I disagree with everything you said tbh. Most people are reclusive, there are levels of extraversion but most just do the minimum to get by in most situations. As for it being a talent, that's really not true dude, I can tell you firsthand, charisma is a skill and a skill only. Yes there are certain essential personality traits that each person has, doesn't matter, everyone can become a version of themselves where they can openly communicate, I went from a totally isolated dude to a public speaker, it just took time and practice. It's kind of how politicians work...
The thing stopping most people is simply their belief that they can't. And maybe you can't, so what? Fail until you succeed. It's the same process as dating, no one's born a smooth talking bachelor, they learn it and the first step is having the confidence to fail.
I'm autistic so trust me I've been there, but it's all about having a topic focus. Better yet, what's your purpose talking to X people? If it's just someone talking for the sake of talking then no wonder, but imagine if there's a focus like a math topic, then it'd be a lot easier. Social anxiety is tough (and super underlooked) but really just try not to stress so much because like I said, most people just do the bare minimum so they honest to god, could not care less how you respond.
@@Happyduderawr The impression I'm getting is that a scientist who just wants to have a decent career and make some average-sized contributions can do well by collaborating a lot. But the people who really make the breakthroughs are recluses who spend a lot of time being alone.
Obviously this isn't universally true but still.
I was a late-life PhD (musicology, not the sciences) who had so few expectations of what I would achieve in academe, that anything which I *did* achieve in academe automatically became a pleasant surprise.
And none of the obvious horrors which afflict PhD candidates ever befell me: I had a supervisor at once friendly, competent, and punctual (I've heard plenty of alarming tales from other PhD candidates about supervisors who were obnoxious, inept, and slothful).
What enabled me to complete the doctorate satisfactorily - within three years, whereas I've encountered several individuals who never completed their own doctorates even within a decade - was my realisation that (a) although getting a scholarship from the federal government was most agreeable, I wouldn't have been heartbroken if I'd failed to get one; (b) I wouldn't have been heartbroken if a PhD more generally had become impossible for me.
Therefore there was, I guess, an element of the 'gentleman amateur' about my whole attitude: not that I was at all slack about doing the requisite labour, but neither my economic life nor my spiritual life depended on obtaining the qualification.
Love that attitude! Knowing who you are
Awesome perspective
Nice
Fascinating to see those principles of non-attachment at play!
Yeah, this is me, but in my 30s. It feels good to write, study and research because I just want to.
I went to a top-level music conservatory for my undergrad (viola performance), and many of the things you say in this video sound exactly like what I experienced then. I distinctly remember an advisor during freshman orientation saying “if you’re serious about your instrument, then you can forget about your other hobbies. Because if you’re not practicing your instrument 6 hours a day, you’re wasting your tuition.”
That's terrible advice even for music majors that are extremely serious about their craft, I'm one of them, composer specifically and I can tell you the only thing that can give your creative or performance focused endeavors is having hobbies and a life outside of music, otherwise your music won't say anything to anyone except that you haven't done anything in your life worth sharing through your craft
After watching this video, I realize that I have to prepare my mental and commitment before taking a PhD. Thank you for your advice.
Ask yourself, do you really want to ?.
The best professors I’ve had encouraged me to do better with kindness and patience. This made learning fun. Some professors were so nit-picky that I wondered why I was even trying. It’s amazing how being too critical of students can actually hold them back
All of this is true for most jobs/careers in the STEM industries as well. It's all driven by the voracious markets that control everyone's life.
yes haha , I fear to become a slave to this as well
"You are your project" -- I love this. It just inspired me. I am not an academic. I have only recently started contemplating about taking up a master's degree, and the thing that keeps bothering me most is, "what if I fail?". I like the practicality of your videos, and it is nice to know your insights. Keep it up!
After spending three years trying to reproduce data from the previous grad student that eventually turned out to be complete garbage anyway, I was forced to take a masters. I worked and worked all that time, never getting to do my own experiments, constantly being gaslit that it was all my fault. It couldn’t be that the original data was wrong. No way. Honestly, that never even occurred to me until the end when it was staring me in the face. It always had to be my fault. The lasers weren’t aligned properly. I wasn’t getting enough power out of the non-linear crystals. That signal had to be somewhere under that noise. It was never that the reaction was too endoergic or that the room temperature spectrum was simply incorrect. It was always my fault.
Eventually, I was just going through the motions, and treating it like a regular job. I was simultaneously devastated and ecstatic when it all ended. I was, however, afraid to tell my family what had happened, so I spent days by myself in my apartment looking for any job so I could avoid starvation. Fortunately, I found one before my depression led me to end it all. I hate academia and I will tell anyone with dreams like I had to be very careful when choosing to go to graduate school, and especially with what advisor they choose. Even the respected ones with stellar reputations for having happy groups will throw you under the bus when you get results that are contrary to what they expect. The scientific method and integrity mean nothing to them when grant money is on the line.
Watching as a faculty member and graduate student supervisor (albeit not in the sciences), I find this content really helpful--negative models to avoid to try to get students to the next step(s) of their lives. Cheers, Guy
Thank you so much for seeing it like this ! :) it's not the case of all supervisors...
I was applying for PhD last year (after 2 years of hesitating on my career). It's not that no one wanted to take me, but my director wanted me to go for another subject and I just felt really uninspired with it. My deep thought was : if I have to work for years on that subject, I rather be clear on what I want and not start to negociate even before starting... so in the end, I didn't find a director, and I don't know if I will apply for a PhD later. There is still some research I would love to do, but right now, I rather be a teacher, write in magazines, talk in podcasts, do lectures in conventions and cinemas (I'm a literature and animation specialist ahah). When I think back of my academia projects, I think that I'm a failure, I didn't have the nerve to continue despite criticism etc... but truth is, I feel very ok with my life right now, very empowered with projects and exploration, and if I have to dedicate my life to whatever research... let's be honest, I don't want it.
Many of these things just make me cringe. It’s been almost 5 years since I left academia, but every once in a while, a professor will comment on my socials or I'll bump into one on the street. They still think I'm part of their world and talk like it... but it just sounds weird now.
I can't believe it all seemed so normal to me when I was still in it!
?they're just saying hey what you mean? Don't understand
@@PowerK1phd academia jargon in the passing small talk
When I finished my PhD contract and failed to get any other funding, I hated it. People assuming I was going to continue working for free lol, attending expensive conferences, writing complicated treaties and ordering dozens of books for it as if daddy paid the bills or money grew on trees. The absolute disconnect from reality this people have. And they think they are helping you by asking you to commit to write something for them after it's obvious you won't have time as now you have to find another source of income!
Not to mention you are left bereft of resources (access to databases, libraries, research centres, etc.)
I think how good or bad your PhD experience is very heavily depends on your supervisor. I've heard some proper horror stories, but also heard from people who had great PhD experiences
This is probably one of the best videos I've seen on this channel.
I've just got admitted in my desired PhD program, I've been watching your videos for the last 2 years in and out, but I think I have to watch your videos more often.
Just remember: 1.there is a life outside of academia. Always has been, always will be, it is not the end all be all.
2. Even if academia doesnt work out, that doesnt mean you are dumb. You are always able to learn more and acquire new skills. Acquiring skills and knowledge should be fun, or at the very least, rewarding. It will sometimes be difficult and grueling, as all hard work is, no matter the field. But if academica begins to kill your love for your field or your passion or inspiration, perhaps rethink it.
3. PhD is really cool bragging rights, but most ppl outside of academia do not care. They will not treat you better or worse. Unless it is someone looking to date for money and/or status. So be weary of the flashy title.
4. I'd even go so much is to say "is this money I'm spending worth it even if I end up failing or hating my field of study afterwards?" For some, the cost of academia is a drop in the bucket, and it's no skin off their back if they succeed or fail. If your hypoethetical success is dependent on the PhD, I think you need to take a harder look at why you think that is 🤷🏻♀️ it is a big investment and a big risk if you cannot afford to fail. If it's too risky for you to fail, I'd focus on other areas of your life first and make sure you have connections, experience, other achievements, a fulfilling personal life so that your studies carry less risk and don't consume you.
Not everyone’s experience. Depends on the supervisor. It’s hard work but so it should be….you’re getting a phd. My supervisor was very encouraging and supportive.
Which doesn't matter much. Is a systemic and quite general issue, hence, it is a problem to be highlighted.
I agree with both of you. I have great supervisors who have been nothing but supportive and basically none of the things he talks about have been my experience. Even know when I'm coming to the end of the PhD and I'm feeling the pressure (mostly from myself), they're a fantastic support.
Having said that, I do believe this is the experience that many people have and there is so much toxicity in academia that is being perpetuated. I think it's getting better with the generation of younger PIs. Though not always. I know our institute basically only hires young PIs. I don't think there's a single one over 50. But there are some among them who perpetuate the same toxicity nevertheless. Thankfully, it's being actively combated by leadership. So hopefully the future generation, who was trained in environments like this will do better.
There is so much truth in this video...
I left the academia 15 years ago, and it was considered by everyone as an existencial crisis, telling me i will be back in short... for years...
And the main reason i left it's exactly the next point you mention xd. I wanted to do many things, to learn many things... and while i was in, that was not possible. I'm a biologist, but while i was still in, i assisted to quantic physics conferences, to classic literature reunions, to politics lectures from 90 years sages, and so on... taking a toll in my schedule... and that being a 23 youngster! I loved science, but i don't like how scientifics work nowadays (not aplying correctly the scientific method neither in most cases, because you have to publish), so i was clearly out of it. A pity, but we are not in the times of Einstein, Ramon y Cajal, or similar others, and I'm happy nowadays with my current life
May I ask what you did after you left academia?
@@Veeravaara i ended teaching high schoolers. It was the easy thing to do when leaving, but i enjoy it so i stayed as a teacher for many years now. I'm passionate with science and have a broad view of life so it's a good combo when you combine it with an excentric personality for students. I'm planning to write some books too, some fiction and some about kids development (I'm a parent now, and i'm realizing a lot of things which are wrong from the early stages of a baby, which translates in possible problems in 14-16 or more years). I'm spanish so i cannot speak about others countries, as i have seen the ones in spain and un.
@@alejandrosunshadow6041 this is encouraging to hear! I just started my PhD, but I tried teaching high schoolers before, that is my current plan b for when I've had enough of academia. For an ecologist and evolutionary biologist it's a tough job market atm 😔
Transitioning into industry really does seem to carry a significant stigma, that is perpetrated by a lot of professors
I am happy my experience was better. My PhD was industrially funded and the company was great to work with. Most people in my group went into industry and there was no stigma about it. People even joined our group because of all the industry contacts. I went into industry as soon as I finished.
Thank you so much for this video! I relate the most to the criticism aspect. It wrecks me. I just finished the first year of my PhD, I am super motivated about my project , but I am never pleased with my progress, despite everyone saying I am progressing fine. most of the time I feel like things just fly by right before my eyes and I am not making the most of them
I was thrown in at the deep end in my PhD, as were my colleagues. Criticism came from peers at the weekly seminars we gave (one student per week, so a cycle).
I was expecting criticism when I read a paper at a conference at which Max Perutz was an attender. I got none, but incredible support from Max.
Major criticism came when we submitted papers. My first accepted, which was also my first submitted, was in _Nature_ .
That was in the '70s. I saw things change, with pressure to obtain grants, so was pleased to retire.
I am one of the fortunate ones. My supervisor didn't like quick trivial stuff and instead always looked for deep, non-trivial, slow research. I thoroughly enjoyed it. They are also great human-being to around with!
Now I am in my first postdoc and my new supervisor seems to share the same ideology. I hope anyone who decides to stay will eventually find a pleasant place.
What a video to stumble upon 3 weeks into my PhD haha… but definitely valuable things to keep in mind on this journey
haha it’s good to get things right from the start
My Prof was really supportive towards me, and he was one of few profs who was that way to students, so generally a can agree with this video
I've always wanted to pursue a PhD, but I never aspired to be an academic. My passion lies in doing independent research within my field. However, completing my Master's was an exhausting experience-I had no time for anything else, my supervisor wasn't helpful, and I often felt isolated.
I still dream of earning a PhD one day, but now I have a solid career and my own home. I don't want to give that up, and in the UK, I haven't found a way to balance my career with independent research. I'm not looking to work in academia, but I'd love the chance to make a meaningful contribution to my field.
I had a young professor just a few years older than me and was working in a new field. We were just trying to figure out how to do the experiments, so I did not have the experience you describe. Also, this was the early 1970s and I had received a letter from the department with my acceptance letter that it was unlikely that I would ever get a job in the field, since times were hard, so I had no expectations. I was going to do something interesting for a few years and then figure out what to do. I would not have put up with any of the browbeating - I would have left. I ended up having a surprisingly great career in physics and never once had to go through the situation you described. I have however seen it, and my only question is why smart students put up with it. And I don't know why the supervisors do it. I always say the most important things you learn in advance education is that most of your ideas are wrong (as are everyone else's) and you learn where the limits of your knowledge and understanding lie, so you know where to tread carefully.
Also this was my experience of MSC but I’m doing an MA in history now and there is more room for positive feedback and positive experiences
OMG, this is so true!!! I mean, I wonder if it's even more difficult for psychology degree students because we know we are being trained in high empathy tasks and it's not what we receive, it's not what they model as institutions...
Try doing it with undiagnosed adhd. I didn't understand why I was failing. Why I couldn't be as organized and methodical as everyone else. I left with no PhD and severe depression. Afterwards I would sit at home and my husband would come home and ask what I did that day and I couldn't even answer because all I did was sit and stare at the wall completely numb for 6-8 hours straight. Took another 10 years to actually get the right diagnosis and get help.
“stigmatization of leaving”
That’s some cult existence right there.
I agree. The university system and ita metrics is ridiculous:H index, press releases, publish quantity rather than quality, get as much funding as possible, etc, etc)...And at the end of the day it is important to say that much research is useless or BS* in practice, representing a waste of money from the citizens (who pay it with their taxes) and industry (same). Something new and genuine is needed.
The biggest issue I see with academia is the emphasis on length. A topic that could have been covered in five pages is stretched to twenty with repetition and BS.
I would say that it is really hard to get any substantial independence before getting permanent job. Even then, you have many different commitements, thus, very little time to pursue what you are actually interested in.
Well glad I'm too dumb to be a Phd lol, already felt insane in undergrad. Man I really hope I can just escape societial norms period.
Passed my viva in February and have been in industry since finishing. My supervisor kept saying over and over to do a post doc and become ‘famous’ in my field. Every time I spoke to him about trying industry so that I could make an informed decision, he would make out that if I didn’t go straight to a post doc, my academic career would be out of the window. The thing is, knowing what I know now (that this obviously is not the case) makes me feel worse about it, because I know he also knew it. He was prepared to not be truthful to me to try to get me to stay in academia. I do love my supervisor, but this rubbed me the wrong way, and I have determined it’s a mix of academic norms with his own cultural expectations. Either way, while I don’t let it make me lose sleep, it’s still a shame that he sees me as less for ‘settling’ with industry when actually, I am the happiest I have been in four years
Thank God I left academia before it was too late... I was one semester into a PhD, in a discipline where so many already knew going in they wanted to go into industry, and I had a panic attack that made me realize I wouldn't be happy in research...
imho, there's 2 much competition in the whole socio-economic system for wellbeing, let alone "growth"?
More than half of my friends that have PhD’s are unemployed or working at Starbucks.
Nothing wrong with Starbucks. It’s just ironic that they spent so much time there writing their thesis only to work there.
I am a 6th year post doc and yes, unfortunately, it happens to me to see people believing to one or more of these points. I myself, from time to time, fall into beliving these traps.
Your channel is really important to us, Andy. Thank you once more.
5:25 is the heart of it. I heard the same thing when I decided to opt out of my PhD program, finish a masters and leave.
They know it. They're insecure about it. And they try to cover it up by creating facade of self-importance through busyness and criticism, which consistently lead to burn-out.
I've been saying these for years, thanks for putting it all together
Tonight I am taking the last data for my PhD thesis. This video came at the perfect time, just need to write the thing, get it over with, and get the hell out.
Good luck finishing it!
I have to strongly disagree with you about my own experience, I got my PhD in theoretical physics 4 years ago.
For theoretical physics, take everything he said in this video, and multiply it by 100,000. Then it’s accurate.
Happy in industry right now. People have realistic expectations, they don’t leave you out to dry if you are having problems, and they care about their life outside of work (and I’m in a FAANG, even here is so much better than academia).
Indeed. I'm also happier and less stressed right now working in industry than I was in academia.
Looking back, academia is almost a bit cult-like / religion-like, in the sense that they look down on the outside world and they more or less expect you to have nothing substantial in your life going on aside from it.
It would be an interesting social experiment to have (say) business owners with 10+ years of experience (heck, even just employment outside of education sector) become teachers. I suspect we would see a greater emphasis on real-world skills, self-reliance and entrepreneurism, and less on the 'need' to go to university. A possible result would be less university enrolments with more focus on valuable qualifications, less focus on 'soft' qualifications, and a rise in private business ownership/participation.
In general, I get the sentiment that teachers with a genuine passion for sharing their knowledge will always do a better job than professors in it for the research, so that wouldn't surprise me.
When I was studying for my doctorate, I learned it was like an ideological reeducation camp. If one didn’t agree with the prevailing theory or model, one was subject to ridicule and condemnation. I had to leave because of health detriments, and I didn’t finish.
I’m a junior at a college prep high school, not even pursuing a phD atm but all of this is so true, I can’t wait to get out of here because they really do reduce you to your work and nothing is ever enough. It really restrains your growth as a human being, so I’d like to become independent from this even though my mother wants me to be a doctor
Regarding waiting for supervisor's approval for everything, its good to keep in mind that in some places (institutions, countries, specific grants) you really are *bound* to your supervisor and leaving them (or upsetting them and getting kicked out) might mean never getting a grant in that country anymore or lose your entire PhD.
I work now in a country where that's not an issue at all, and i see some grad students changing groups for the simplest reasons like they didn't enjoy the research as much. While in my country, i ended my PhD under literal threats from my supervisor, and it was a power he had - if i left that project with him and/or didn't defend my thesis (which was also subject to his approval) i would lose my entire PhD, i would never be able to get a grant in my country anymore from basically the one funding agency that is stull standing there and i would have to give back 150k to the funding agency.
So in some cases, there's literally no such thing as 'don't wait for their approval' etc, unfortunately.
Even as a Computer Engineer undergraduate, by the fourth year, I started feeling that the skills I learned in vector calculus and quantum physics are worthless, and computer hardware design is only somewhat useful. Because of time constraints, all the class projects are just toy examples to show that you understand the theoretical knowledge. After I graduated and started doing coding on my own, I realize how the knowledge connects with real world applications.
I'm in my third year ..same degree..but I am not enjoying it, so much pointless knowledge for the amount of useful knowledge left on the table
The best programmer coworker I've ever had was just a guy who started coding in his teens and never stopped, and he never had any kind of science degree.
Admittedly I work at just a web development company, so it's not like we're doing super complicated stuff here.
Younger academics - more supportive
Older academics- not so
That's so on point. Prospective PhD students must be aware of this. Saves a lot of distress during the degree. Sadly, most want to join under an accomplished senior prof.
2:23 it's just like in a normal job. When I finish a project there's also no fanfare. It's just a job you get money for. The next project starts right away. No one's clinking glasses.
The difference is that in academia you're under the pretense that you're pushing your field forward in exciting new directions. Which is a lie 99% of the time.
Well yeah, but if we think of a phD as "just a job you get money for", then it's a high-stress, high-skill-required, low-pay job. It's a terrible deal as "just a job."
I was significantly more stressed during my university master's degree than I am now at my ICT job, because at my ICT job I just clock eight hours per day, and I'm unlikely to get fired, and even if I get fired I can find a new job quickly. There's almost no "fail state", plus I'm paid well.
I feel that those who do PhD or even Master's degrees have a tremendous amount of grit. I personally only attempted an Honour's degree in Computer Science here in South Africa, which is basically a step between a Bachelor's and Master's degree. I struggled so much that I only completed 2 modules that had no programming/practical components to the research, and I dropped my year long research project and the remaining 4 modules which all had programming/practical components in the research. I didn't have any idea as how I was going to integrate 5 programming projects into 5 different research papers (1 large one and 4 mini ones). I had no inspiration for what I was going to do. I ultimately dropped on in the first month of my second semester. I became very depressed after I left. And it didn't help that my friend seemed to cope and he graduated with the Honour's degree. It made me feel even worse about myself. But at least I managed to find work shortly after leaving the Honour's degree. Crazy thing is, I'm actually doing a Bachelor's degree in Accounting now. The Honour's degree actually was a stepping stone in determining that I'm not a fan of working in the tech field in general. Programming and making projects is not something that I'm all that passionate about. It feels more like a burden than anything else. I truly figured this out when I started working in the field. Accounting at least feels like it's more interesting. I love the fact that a lot of what I learn can be applied to real life.
Dude thank you for these videos, without these videos explaining what's going on in my head I feel like a literal insane person.
Hmmm. Yeah, I would say that pretty much sums up my PhD. The intense culture of criticism and the internalization. It beat me down. That, plus the isolation, created the conditions that led to depression. I was a train wreck. The journal Nature is doing a series on this. Andy did a video as well. Be careful during the process. Yes, get a healthy non-academic outlet (sport club, knitting club, something). After the brief academic career, sadly, I learned that my PhD is a professional liability in the non-academic world. Be careful. If possible, find a place that is explicitly looking for someone with a PhD.
I want to hug you right now. Thank you so much for articulating this disease.
Perfect! Hollow of network! Gatekeeper to overuse students under their control!
not gonna lie when I’ve heard the first couple of seconds at the video I thought this was going down a completely different road. Glad to hear actual critiques that aren’t from someone who’s never been to college pulling shit out of their ass.
I find profs mean to PhDs everywhere. On the other hand they're very welcoming to UG and PG students - encouraging, talkative, I'm a cool guy kind of image..
When it comes to a PhD student they are the exact opposite - discouraging, condescending, abusive, manipulative, and what not.
If you see someone with a PhD, that person has had immense courage to overcome all of this, which not even 0.001 percent of the world population would even attempt.
What is this life if full of care if we have no time to stand and stare?
You could not be more accurate than this! I hope this criticism changes.
A lot of this just applies to working in the real world. Substitute things like "PhD supervisor" for "boss" and there you go.
Many of these things are not PHD specific. Many times in Bachlors the CGPA becomes your worth as well.
It´s good that ur adressing this, this is part 1 of solving a problem!
I'm planning to do a PhD program in a few years, but to be honest most of my experiences with higher education we're similar to what you have talked about in this video
I also encountered the opposite extreme: the need for constant praise. Funny how people don't have time to write a peer review but they have endless time to write hollow press releases talking about how great they are to pass along to the stenographers that make up the bloated marketing team.
I worked as a tech in a Bio Sciences lab for a flagship research university, and all of this was so true of my experience. If “you are your project,” I was little more than a servant whose only purpose was to make other people’s project succeed. My PI (a young, intelligent woman just starting her own lab) was fully bought into the “gatekeeper, god-like” persona, and her constant criticism caused at least 3 techs to flame out in the first 2 years of the lab. On not having skills for the real world, my boss implied that if I weren’t in Academia, I’d only be good for working in a pizza shop. My mental health got absolutely wrecked, and even 6 months after I left, I still have a hard time relating to work and criticism due to the toxic environment. If you’re thinking about starting a career in the biological sciences, I sincerely hope your experience is different from mine
That's your personal experience. It is sad but definitely partial. My supervisor always says my work is great, invites me to a restaurant at least once in a year etc. But I understand what you're saying
Yes its’s healthy to be more than your project but also I remember my advisor frowning when I said I was seeing a therapist at 10am on Thursday mornings because they don’t want you to be anything except your project.
My PhD work and its aftermath seem to have permanently broken my mental circuitry for delayed gratification.
OMG my man you just expressed all my thinking in language and I can't even just how close home this feels ! constant criticism and not enough praise and as a result you feel like you haven't done shit and you're alone in your journey and the stigma of "postdoc or make money" and the elitist take on everything.
As a computer systems engineering student, we have to learn follow IEEE standards to ensure that all types of messages are universally consistent, no matter which country you publish your work from. It's customary to ensure that there's no confusion between engineers, no matter where they've graduated from. That's just an example of what may not be considered brainwashing, but instead a useful system to memorize for whoever plans to work in any STEM field, given it's universally accepted.
My paper just got accepted into a really good journal in my field. This happened during the weekend and everyone wrote "Congratulations" in an email. Monday morning I was met with: do you think this deadline for PhD submission is realistic!? And We need to finish this next paper!
😩
I have done a phd in chemistry and now.working as an r&d leader but actually also trying to build up my startup and become independent. I love research and still like chemistry but modern academia felt instanely suffocating and toxic.. The fake niceness, fake sucking up to each professor, whete at the same time there is at least as much cut-throat competition if not even more than in industry... In academia, as a phd student, it's full responsibility with practically zero authority.. yes, that's what called slavery which also reflects in salaries and working conditions.. modern academia is pretty much a giant pyramid scheme at this point but a t least a super cynical and hyprocritical one that always preaches about values etc.. also, modern publishing is a scam and research is so standardised that the real geniuses from 100 years ago would barely have a chance as their groundbreaking ideas would be considered unproved or not well supported by peers.. and about the shaming, a community which critisizes you for everything and pays you shit but shames you if you leave, sounds pretty much like a cult to me...
Don't get me wrong, I have met many both personally and professionally amazing scientists, but the modern academic structure now is a bloated cancer in my opinion, something that is more about name recognition and politics and quotas, than actual groundbreaking ideas...
Yep. It's trash. Recently rescued a data engineer from a bio marine post PhD program, and her situation was of utter stagnation. Most people in there tho doublethink themselves into ascribing a special sense of self importance to the rehearsal of peer review crunching. Which is permutations of the same thing over and over again and publishing until you reach 'the next' level of academic privileges. In Mexican case, the fucking SNI.
Dropped out very soon of an advanced program within my own bachelors (luckily) the moment I was told I had to live off a glorified pension.
The Australian Universities warned me last year. New Zealand Warned me.
Habbo Hotel in the early 2000s was more accurate to how people would actually behave than anything I was told in therapy lol
This is Interesting bc All my friends who have gotten their masters degrees have discouraged the process and reasoning behind it…unless it was required in their field.
The only way i can see myself doing a PhD is if I somehow manage to not really care about it too much. But I'm not sure if it's achievable to start a PhD without being ridiculously motivated and having a "I'll try my best but I don't care for perfection"-attitude instead.
Fucking this! After teaching high-school students in science for two summers, I realized how much I had lost myself doing my PhD. High-schoolers seemed much more entusiastic about science and learning, than any academic - which is paradoxal, as academics "should" be at the very forefront of current knowledge boundaries. There is very little room for passion in academia. I beleive some of this stems from the fact that being passionate or driven often is deemed naive or hopeful. And academia is not about hoping, but about doing. This is what kills enthusiasm and curiousness. The inner child that is curious slowly withers and dies and all there is left is cold hard logic and statistics and pressure of publishing papers.
Calling someone who goes into industry and makes at least two times what a Professor makes and calling them a failure is just beyond self delusional.
Academia is nice and all, but generally people in Academia do not make a Lot of money. It is of course great if people are fine with just doing the science and not caring so much about money, but calling people out for going to industry because they want to leverage their gained expertise to make money is not nice.
Also, I don't know which knowledge you gain during your PhD is useless in industry. That is certainly not the case for most STEM subjects. If what you are learning during your PhD is useless later in industry (how to operate certain equipment, how certain methods work theoretically, what are the limits of each method, gaining a lot of knowledge about a certain field within a subject by conducting experiments and reading papers) then you are either studying a very specific subject or doing sth seriously wrong during your PhD.
Doesn't this feel more like a society or social media thing. The way everyone frames everything in negative light, especially Instagram now. Then reflects into all areas and career paths
Most advisors expect to be treated, viewed, ego-stroked like they are god. I was having incredible anxiety for one of my yearly seminars and left off my acknowledgments slide, not intentionally at all and omg the sky fell down.
holy shit, I never realized it but this is exactly what school is, and why I feel so bad since I went back.
But is this an "academy problem" only? Because the way i see it (and live it) is that this lovely system we all live on has this same problems outside academy.
Not recongizing effort or time invested is exactly what large corporations do with their employees. They milk your life for profits and then give the bare minimum in return.
Shaming quitters is a common tactic that the same corps apply. Even Amazon shame it's workers for retiring, instead of accepting that they left because awful working conditions.
This entire system love to convert people onto shells of themselves. Levels of stress, depression and anxiety are peaking through the western world even while not even half the population is doing/have a PhD.
The problem is that academia should be a space free from those problems, where people go to furrher their knowledge so science can keep advancing in every field. Now it's just another step on the capitalist ladder to get a somewhat decent job. Add to that the classic problem of ego on academy and we have an exact copy of the machine that breaks workers but made for minds that only want to improve/make a change.
Tldr, it's a problem of academy? Yes. But it's a problem that permeated from the system we currently live on.
3:34 the same applies to us artists. We derive our self worth from the quality of our work
I would've appreciated if you made a video or a part of the video about the good things about being in academia too, am a 3rd year medical student right now and this like scared me uk
Just a job for bright people, like any other (although bright not necessarily needed). And you know what they say - occupational habit. As an engineer by trade, I do find myself over-analysing and looking for solutions. There you go - I'm brainwashed too.
Loving the typo in "Constant Criticism," very meta.
OMG I really needed this video
People have to leave.there is not a job for everyone, it’s a funnel.
@@biner01 . Delivering masters programs is their role so they are doing their function. It’s the same in every area, less people at each level; worker bee, manager, head of dept. Creating jobs is not their function. Less people complete study at each level anyway; undergrad, masters, phd. Not everyone wants a job in academia, some want the education as a thing in itself or to support work elsewhere. Teaching programs bring in revenue and fund the department. Lots of other reasons no doubt.
@@biner01 because a phd has to have value otherwise it’s not a PhD, a PhD would not be a PhD without having tough challenges, that’s how you earn it, otherwise you are just doing stuff and not passing tests. Also, It’s not training for work it’s academic. It’s just an academic cult. And They need loads of people for this numbers game so they can find the clever ones and then the Nobel prize winners, and also to pay fees to keep the department going. I’m so bored of this now. How old are you? If you are under 25 i forgive you because your frontal lobe is not complete yet. But do learn about the world away from the comments section.
Yes, well put, unfortunately. Obviously it depends on the field, but getting a phD in a direction where there's no work is a pretty poor move, even though it's superficially a tempting way to delay having to face the real world.
And for the vast majority of real-life work, you don't need a phD; it might even be a drawback, they might fear you'll get bored and not hire you.
I feel like my humour is broken because I find Thesis memes so funny. (I think it could just be my self-deprecating humour style from growing up in a big family though). 😂
Andy, can you direct me to some of your videos on academic mumbo jumbo, and why it is 'needed'? Why is there no importance attached to writing in accessible language?
As an example, I have had to take my own health seriously recently, and, as well as a little bit of exercise, I have had to eat sensibly. I personally did not want to go from 'pre-diabetic' to 'diabetic'. I learned that diabetes (type two) is simple, I just had to go on a whole food, plant based diet to cook my own food. After a while I got to a sensible BMI and I found exercise came to me naturally. I hopped on my bicycle and just started going further. With no fat lurking in my arteries, everything came together. According to my doctor, my blood pressure and BMI is 'perfect' so no meds needed. Clearly I am an n=1 autodidact, however, I could summarise what I did in words that a layman could understand, maybe to inspire others to get rid of their own paunches, with no science mumbo jumbo needed.
If I wanted to go all sciency, I could run a slow cookery club and get one group cooking whatever they want with another group cooking just plants. I am reasonably sure that just cooking would get both groups somewhere, however, I would expect the latter group to be able to self report the more impressive health gains.
I have a friend studying diabetes and doing a PhD. This friend eats the garbage food, meatballs, burgers, ice cream and much else that, according to my own experience, is not good for the arteries, fat in the cells and insulin response. This friend also believes that too much fruit is bad and that physical activity means lifting weights in front of a mirror in the gym.
I worked in science myself for a year and I appreciate that some jargon is needed at times. But, this friend writes utter gobbledygook regarding diabetes research, it is such a pity, as, due to my own health journey, I am actually very interested. This makes me think it is all one big lie, and that it is one big 'displacement activity'. Type two diabetes is simple, just eat sensibly with no animal products or processed food. It should be a solved problem but people like their burgers, don't want to take personal responsibility and trust in the science. But the science is nonsense, bamboozlement with big words is all that is going on. It irks me slightly as funding for writing piffle comes easily whereas nobody would ever fund me for running a slow cookery course with a control group to show how simple this important health problem can be solved.
Is the majority of university science makework for middle class kids where daddy pays? What am I missing? Should science papers that make no sense whatsoever be seen for what they are?
Carl Sagan is one of my great heroes and he could write popular science as well as understand tricky things like Gauss' Theorem, where no mere mortals understand it. Please help me understand why the need for making science impossible for the layman to understand, even if they are genuinely interested because their health provides a vested interest.
Ultimately we're monkeys -- phD people are just highly educated monkeys. And monkeys care about status. Writing gobblygook is a good way to signal high status / high education, and that's why monkeys do it.
I'm being completely serious. Don't think that just because someone is highly educated that they're immune to these kinds of drivers.
There's also the issue that you don't need a phD person to say "eat a whole foods, plant based diet". Which means that phDs need to earn their existence by overcomplicating things -- because no one is going to pay a phD to say "eat whole foods" that, it's already common knowledge.
Companies also can't make an ungodly amount of money by selling rice and bananas.
Yes it's a stupid system, but at the end of the day, all directly involved parties either benefit or think they benefit from the current system.
im not a phd but as a workaholic a lot of this resonates
Andy, you are amazing!!
I wanted to do research, i found myself competing to publish as much as i can even though it's trash
Yes, that's something I really dislike about academia and think is ultimately counterproductive.
Unfortunately, amount of publications is an easy measurement to track and so it has become more important than actually doing good work.
Am academic. Hit the nail on the head.