i was a junior concept artist and left the field in 2 years. Now i draw just for fun and my mental health is 100% better. Honestly working in the creative industry is not really worth it for the vast majority of people. You can have a nice little hobby and have absolute creative freedom
@@valentynporada5617 a lot of art dudes are pure doom and gloom. Specially the pros. I would much rather work from home doing art for a few hundred bucks than breaking my back spitting wood (I have done it). Pros from the 1st world are some of the biggest crybabies I have ever heard of. You are an artist!!!!
I know that some of you do art for a long time, please don't be discouraged. Even if you can't find a career to place for your creativity, keep creating. There should be a part where you do it for yourself.
Another fantastic video! I worked as a concept artist for about 4 years fulltime, a couple years freelance before that (worked for Disney Interactive during the mobile gaming craze until they slowly started shuttering each studio). I've been out of the industry a while and love to check these videos to get a truly inside look at where the industry is at. I still draw and paint and occasionally think about getting back in. These videos serve as a great window to let me know exactly what I'd be trying to get back into. Also, another depressing note that viewers should take into account. I've been part of two mass layoffs and can say from experience that when a company says they laid off 700 employees, the actual number could be closer to 1000 if not more. I'm not sure how companies get around it, but there doesn't seem to be a set-in-stone rule when it comes to announcing this sort of thing. When you see some grim layoff numbers being thrown around, just keep in mind the numbers could be much higher.
@@AndyWalsh After games, I did a little freelance until I could find stable work. I painted backgrounds to be used for projections in stage shows. Very long hours for okay pay, but I was able to work from home. Then I got full time work in the electronics industry. Designing booths for trade shows, package design, even some product design. The first year of that was amazing. I was able to go nuts with my designs and concepts and see them realized in real life. A year into my time with the company, the art director left and the art department was then essentially run by the salespeople. It turned into a mess. The company didn't need me anymore (I had already redesigned the entire line of packages for the company) and I think I was replaced by a more junior designer (probably making a little more than half what I was getting paid). That job had been an hour away and I wanted to be closer to home. I am now in the aerospace industry doing technical illustrations for airplane equipment. Ironically, the work is much less creative than game art, but I have a ton more independence in how I go about my day. It's twenty minutes from house and while the pay isn't exceptional, it's fairly stable and the benefits are pretty good. I live in the US (east coast where living is crazy expensive) and we do alright.
@@keithv2974 Very interesting! How does one enter in this particular industry (aerospace industry) with previous experience in entertainment/electronics industry? Doesn't it require anything like a degree or anything technical-related stuff?
@@christianpetrov6976 I didn't need any specialized degree other than my graphic design degree. In truth, they were very uninterested in my college or my degree. After the job with the electronics company, I was back doing freelance and looking for steady work again (I have two kids and mortgage). I applied for about 1000 jobs before putting in my resume for a tech illustrator. The head of the department saw my application, looked at my portfolio, and was impressed. I have a good amount of 3d work in my portfolio (lots of 3d renders of earbuds, speakers, etc). The head of the department was an avid gamer and dabbled in 3d, so he knew how challenging 3d could be. He was confident that if I could produce work like he saw on my website, I could handle the kind of technical illustrations they needed. If you're interested in technical art, there's always a good amount of companies looking for artists. It's dry work, not terribly creative, but it can pay pretty good. Right before my current job, I was in talks with the naval base near me for a position there as a tech artist. One position opened up, then closed, and then another position opened up but that closed as well. Maintain an impressive body of work and keep applying to places. A lot of it can come down to the person viewing your stuff. If they like what they see, they may go and convince their own bosses to give you a chance.
That last third of the video is soo godamn important. I'm in art school and was wanting to go the concept art route. Realised pretty quickly that the industry both in 3D and concept art wasn't for me, there are so many things that go against who I am as a person main one being there is very little self expression in the work they ask you to make, its kina machine like work. Growing my own brand and doing my own thing is now what I am working towards.
As a concept artist, even if you do land a role, the pay may be very low. Earlier this year, I got offered $35/hr for an art director position, which is much lower than my hourly rate as a concept artist, with much more responsibilities. Getting in is also a lot about who you know besides having a great portfolio. I also completely agree with being an independent artist because right now, it’s more stable in terms of income because you’re always going to have an audience that is wanting to buy your art & products - you just need to build a audience, which will take time, but will help support you in the long run. I like to think of it as a safety net when the jobs are not rolling in or things like layoffs happen.
My rates were roughly half of the top tier during 'normal times' but now, even the top tier guys are having to take my rates and less. So one might say they're 50% down, but if you're already charging 50% you may not notice the difference. Just precisely what happens when there are too many workers.
What I hate the most about all this is that despite all the time invested in improving my drawings and illustrations, I still haven't been able to put it all into practice in any job. I've sent many portfolios to different companies and job offers (offers that, of course, required experience, but if I have to wait for junior positions, maybe I'll apply to one in a year), and all the responses I've received have been negative. Not even a skills test or anything. This is what I hate the most; I haven't even been given a chance to see if I would be good at this or not.
Thing is, if your work isn't good then you just will not be give a chance because the art director already knows everything he needs to know by looking at your work. In this industry zero people get given 'a chance'. You upload until people go 'wow' and then you get your chance but by that time, it isn't a big gamble for them. Which is brutal of course and why it's definitely not a career if you want to feel comfortable any more than 25% of the time.
@@AndyWalsh Basically they base it off of if the artist already has a following of sorts on social media/art websites (DeviantArt, ArtStation, Twitter, RUclips, etc)?
@@JLCL01 No. social media following has nothing to do with it. You just have to be honest with yourself - can you create work as good as the best art in the most recent Art Of books? Can you design, turnaround, and think about player or viewer needs while delivering something polished and ready to use? If you can’t, then you’re not going to be looked at by a recruiter thinking, ‘Maybe we give this one an interview”. Because the standards are extremely high across the board. You just have to be honest with yourself.
@@JLCL01 no, no, no... it may seem like I'm saying that I suppose because to be fair, you could be amazing and never uploaded to ArtStation and more than likely get no recognition due to no one knowing you exist. So that said, it's delicate. So like, if you ARE able to get like 800-1000 likes or more on a piece, then you'll get visibility on that piece, especially if it has good tags and ADs can find it on AS. Get that consistently and you'll get little offers here and there. I guess I have seen the odd new-to-AS artist get that. To simplify, if you're good you'll get noticed. If no one is ever noticing you ever, then you're still not there and need to improve. Likely by a lot.
Hi Andy, at this point i do feel like a complete failure, all of these years spent grinding hoping that my career would take off, to make money for my family and now i`m 32 years old, i can sculpt a hulkbuster movie quality but i`m completely jobless,no family, no children, i`ve achieved nothing. Years ago my sister got a job in the supermarket, now she`s still working there. But at the moment i`m a little bit happy, i`ve been working on my own projects, i haven`t published anything yet and i`m still a failure but i do like being indipendent, i`ve been painting and sculpting traditionally, i have ideas for some statues to be 3d printed. I`m scared to death about the future and i don`t think i`m going to be successful but at this point i have nothing to lose.Anyway congratulations for your contract and thank you, you`re the only one in this terrible industry that answered me when i needed help and yours videos have been the only thing really useful, if i had success i`d like to share what i`ve learnt. Thank you again Gabriele
Thanks Gabriel. I always like to help when I can because I've lived that same life myself. The constant threat of being a failure. But hey, as long as you still have breath in your body, you're not a failure, you just haven't been successful yet. I didn't even start until I was your age. The biggest advice I can give is that you must get better and better and be humble. Those who know the exact quality of their work and where it needs to get to will usually triumph. Those who just want to believe their work is already good but are bitter that someone else wants it to be better before they get paid, will usually fail.
Thanks for the video & the honesty Andy, it’s much appreciated. This video, plus the experience of having taken a few concept art classes this year, plus AI and the state of the industry have made me realise ‘concept art’ is not what I want to do: I don’t enjoy the class homework, I don’t wan’t to work for corps anymore, I don’t want to have to use 3d or AI for an ‘art’ job when what I like to do is draw & paint traditionally. Also, the concept-art job I’d want to do hasn’t existed for about 20-30 years anyway😅 Gonna pivot & work towards the independent route with traditional art, in fine art, and sell to actual individuals if they want to buy the work. It’s what I actually want to do - life’s too short to pursue something that isn’t what I thought it was, and will probably barely exist in a few years anyway with AI.
You know it is bad when Reid Southen, a senior concept artist for films is talking about there not being much work in the industry. Just looked at an interview with him on the ATMO RUclips page and his talk about AI and the industry.
Yeah right now is not a good time for any junior artists. I just got good enough to get interviews and some jobs back in 2022. Then the studio closures started happening with management teams being entirely terminated (Volition) while in the middle of interviewing with them! Took a break to update portfolio and came back this year to no available openings, no interviews and no jobs. Thinking of going to 3D, Animation or even doing my own stories. But at that point i dont even know if thats worth it.
Personally like to create * World to work in full of passion and personal short projects to post * forget the industry, forget the masses, think about selling an idea you like and give it life by showing everything around it * have multiple ways to sell that world you enjoy being in Seems so simple but probably very difficult, draw what YOU love to draw and put it out there. * don’t get a degree in concept art or many art degrees in general, just get online guided courses for fundamentals and principles of design, and then in whatever field you’re interested in. Research before buying the courses what is required and what works, look at artists you are envious of their work and be in-tuned about what YOU love to draw and invest in. * artists you like - consistency of art, type of art, how they express themselves and their art, uniqueness and outside of box rather than just focusing on the job market
I still want to do concept art, but realistically like what you said its almost impossible for junior artists to even have a chance in this industry. My siblings are both graphic designers, and while the whole economy is bad they were able to find jobs recently which is amazing. Can i ask your insight of graphic design/ UX design and how much better it is compared to the gaming industry? I know for sure it’s both competitive but I feel that I chose the worst path for art..
Do something you enjoy is all I can say. You might think that Graphic Design is a good plan B for Concept art but they're different. I get we need jobs but if you just choose to do the "safe thing" which is graphic design, you might be miserable.
@@dp2791 I definitely want to do this more than anything in my life. So I will keep trying until death. Thank you so much for the optimism. It’s what we need more than anything these days.
I used to be a graphic designer and I hated it. It's low pay and zero creativity. It's someone else, who isn't creative, telling you to change every conceivable detail on their wholemeal loaf packaging. UI design though, could be an option. Like, high end, animated, games UI stuff.
@@mozzile8368 It's just one the most competitive fields in the world and always will be. it's not like graphic design, or finance, or plumbing etc. but more akin to acting or professional sports. Concept artists help bring videogames, movies and entertainment to life which is cool and exciting therefore it will always be highly sought after
At the beginning of the 2000-s if anyone here's old enough to remember there was a similar psychosis regarding 3d. Everyone was so hyped and the artists were so stressed that because of 3d there will be no more jobs for the artists and that 3d will soon replace all mattepainters, decoration and prop artists and even the actors themselves. We outlived this hysteria and layoffs. We will outlive this most recent ones with AI and whatnot. Just stay faithful to your true self - everything will calm down soon.
The problem is, AI isn't even 10% of the problem right now. It's just the industry contracting in the most brutal way imaginable, in an industry that was already massively saturated with talent.
i remember final fantasy spirits within and how it was so realistic that computer generated actors were gonna replace hollywood actors in the near future.
3d killed a lot of jobs though . If absolutely annihilated 2 d animation in the states. Photoshop destroyed page rates in illustration along with companies pushing minimalism for book covers.
You know after university (general design course, covered all sorts of concept art modules) I took a detour to set myself up comfortably so that I could have as much time as possible to hone my craft so I could to land a design job, and I've arrived at the point where I have said free time to do so I'm a decent enough sketcher, painter, know my way around Blender, have some ideas, but I am very self aware that I need some real rigorous discipline and 'grind' time to put it all together and level up to a better standard But I think unfortunately I timed it wrong and these huge changes in the industry have me feeling that I should use said time to find a new path for myself, i've had my head in the sand a little and chugged along with the vague idea that 'i'm gonna be one of the ones who makes it!' but after doing some digging i'm waking up to the harsh realities of the industry I have been to a few industry events in the UK where I get some general 'yeah man you can do it, go for it, it'll be tough but anythings possible' and cynically I am starting to feel that they sort of have to hype you up because said events are an industry in themselves y'know? They can't host these events if they're telling people to simmer their expectations, I bump into the same people regularly who are working much harder than me and not getting anywhere Emotionally and stubbornly I have the urge to try and overcome the absurd odds, realistically I think I should, as already said, use my free time to find a more comfortable/stable job, and become content with maybe at best for now I can keep honing my skills, having fun creating my own projects, and perhaps some freelancing here and there will come my way down the line, but I am a very 'all or nothing' type of person so this option is difficult for me to wrap my head around, sincerely I'd like your view on which path seems more realistic, I mean I already know the answer seeing as I watched the video haha but it's nice to vent Either way glad you landed a decent contract project and I wish you all the best for the future
i love making art since young but the thought of working in an industry is a turn off for me so i just pick whatever random job that can feed me and roof me and keep my art for myself since it's up for me what i do , not someone else deciding
I’m freelancing some right now, but for small illustration projects. Still working on my personal brand. Its tough. I feel lucky I have a whole different skill-set in print production and graphic design for my day-job, and I actually don’t mind of the lack of creativity or pickiness. It does require extreme perfectionism and technical knowledge. Concept art is a whole different beast that people always seem to assume is just the same as splash art.
Thanks so much for the video Andy I wish you the best on your job hunts and social media , I would like to add as for the industry goes forward with less attachment to artist : Hopefully better leadership on companies will raise , and make a better market that will speak as you mentioned with better products since creative people make better branding , and our new portfolio is the brand we adopt as our own narrative we like to see like content in social media, and stop that awful trend of doing all concepts with the same formulas behind and just with better or worst cosmetic and budgets ! That it is clearly not connecting with audience for their budget expectations , and for it wont sell any more ...
Good advice in this video. There's a book every artist should read called The Millionaire Fastlane by MJ DeMarco. Don't let the cringy, cheesy title put you off. A bit more of a relevant idea, it might be worth teaming up with Indie game makers and working out a revenue split deal. Indie games are really popular now and they are quicker to make than triple A. Better odds than a lottery ticket of the game blowing up and taking the world by storm but even if the resulting game doesn't sell, it's an extra body of work to put on artstation.
I've actually read that book! I gave me the basic idea of what wealth is vs getting a job. But it didn't really equip me with the sensibility and cunning to create a business. Alex Hormozi is almost good for that, but all he talks about is B2B vs selling a 'thing' like an artistic product. So I'm still waiting for my business guru for that specific requirement.
Hi Andy, very insightful feedback from the industry. I am a student that is currently studying and wanted to get ready for this industry, while I am not 100% focused on concept art as I am expected to be in animation realistically, concept art has always fascinated me. However the more I heard from the news from just an outsider, and insider perspective, the more I feel depressed and I am not a very mentally capable person to withstand the amount of expectation from this industry. I really do wished to have a job and place, I know everyone keeps telling me to just develop the portfolio and keep swimming but I still cannot shake the feelings entirely. How do you prepare yourself back then? I would really love to know and maybe some peace of mind kind of advice coming from you.
I've been making my own projects colaborating with people online in an attempt to get experience in a project involving a team. Me and 6 other junior artists are making a 5 minutes long animation together. I don't know what else to do besides that and constantly working on my portfolio.
This one video shook me to my core and has definitely sent me into a hole of existential crisis. I’ve been trying to break into the industry since graduating college in 2007. I’ve spent countless days and nights practicing my skills, networking, and just trying to come across any opportunity I can squeeze myself into - all while passing up on hanging with friend and passing up on what could of been life altering moments. Now what do I do?
I'm genuinely sorry for your circumstance. I know that feeling. I've missed out on (and still miss out on) time with friends and family. I have a full time job now but I'm also working in my spare time to move towards a more reliable state of independence, build more skills etc. If you want more in-depth advice (if I can help) then hit me up on facebook or ArtStation. I hate seeing people suffer like this.
A brief pitch idea: create a product of your own that you can sell online. The upsides to this are multiple: 1) You could potentially have something that brings in revenue. 2) You'll broaden your portfolio 3) You'll sharpen your entrepreneur skills. It might feel like an entrepreneurial push ends in a dead end, but I have discovered that's rarely the case - creating something has almost ALWAYS opened new doors for me. Potential ideas you could develop: A) A board game B) A card game C) A tarot card deck D)Broader variety of fan art prints to sell on Etsy (this is probably the first and best option). So many things out there to sell online. If you find yourself between projects, you can take control and make things happen in your life.
Another idea: E) An art book for a hypothetical game that feels nostalgic and pays homage to a big hit game from the past - for this you dont have to make a game - just create cool art that reminds people of X or Y game they love.
@@AndyWalsh You're missing the point. 'Finding jobs' is just begging for work. It's asking for permission to work, pay bills, and even exist from day to day. Even steady employment can be terminated at the employer's whim. Working artists are at the mercy of somebody else's agenda. I'm saying that we have an opportunity to build our own products, our own brands, and escape the cycle.
I just saw your LinkedIn page today :) I don't know if you will see my comment, but I want to share something that is dear to me. I am a junior 2D artist and feel a true calling in character concept art. I am incredibly fond of games, stylization and fantasy. I'm currently working as a 2D artist in a studio, but no matter how hard I try to work as a concept artist, I keep failing. I love design, I love looking for shapes, body language, silhouettes, solving visual challenges and drawing the story of a creature or a main character, but I can't do it in the entertainment industry because I'm younger and I don't have enough experience, vision or anything else . I aspire to become a concept artist for fairly well-known projects like Warcraft or Warhammer etc. The Games industry is going through its biggest crisis right now, and I don't know if I'll ever have the chance to become who I see and feel. I study many trends in conceptual art, all kinds of solutions to certain visual problems, creation of various ideas, I study the works of projects that I want to get into because I'm just burning with it! I would like to get some advice from you, namely about my path, what I need to achieve to be what I dream of and achieve a certain goal. I will be very grateful!
Hey bud. I feel your passion for sure. I get questions like this with portfolios like yours a fair bit. Always when I see work like this and I think back to when I used to do work like this, and what makes the difference between then and now and the answer is a kind of unconscious laziness. We don't realise, at the junior level, that we're trying to do as little as possible to just get to the end. The difference would be just going to the gym 4 times per week and each session just doing a bit of this, a bit of that and not eating right and saying: well I go to the gym all the time, vs going as hard as you can, lifting more each week and counting calories. You're showing a tiny amount of designs and then doing multiple very slight variations on one of those designs, putting them all on one page, and then adding them each in separately. Very little effort. You need to be looking at great artists and doing exactly what they're doing in terms of effort. The research, the sketches, the variations, the rendering level, the studies, the not taking second best and starting over because it could be better even though you spend hours on that one thing. Being brutal, being tough on yourself. Accept that the work is crap and will be for ages but that you don't care, your goal is not to get a job but to be better, and if you keep getting better a job will come, but not until it's DEFINITELY good and not just the bare minimum. Pick what is amazing, art wise, and steer towards it. Think bigger. Good luck!
I havent watched the video yet but, ive studied and just started working 5 years ago. i had only have a handfull of freelance job for "concept art" and from last year i noticed how bad it is. The thing is i don't know what to do!!!! Im so lost!!!
I gave up on doing art as a work long time ago, today I'm a tech lead in a tech company and I do art in my free time, I dont even care to post on social media anymore, I was having anxiety because of this... I do for the love of making art, painting (oil), not for money, for like count on social media nor anything like that, and I'm very happy with this decision
7 yrs post school, of me trying to break into the animation industry through my concept art (cg & 2d art) & storyboarding portfolio. My 20s are over, so I “gave up” on the dream this year. Tired.
Be interesting to find out if there's a significant salary difference. Do you know which part of the US the company was physically based? If it's somewhere like LA or SF, then I'm imagining Australia could save them about 50% on staff.
As an Aussie I can tell you, yes it is and it has been for quite a while, particularly in film. We have great govt tax incentives for US companies to buy VFX and Studio time from us. And the exchange rate is amazing for US companies. We're cheaper for a start and on top of that they get 1.5 value in the exchange rate, plus tax rebates. Have a look at the end of all of the big movies for logos from Screen Vic, Screen NSW and our Govt logos. We're like a 2nd Mexico. Sorry to break it to ya. It's long relationship and it ain't ending any time soon.
@@robertdouble559 it certainly opened my eyes, speaking english natively probably helps too. i knew there were a couple of 3D animators and VFX artists contracting out of Australia to US film companies but i didn't know it was that big
I think being realistic is positive in setting you on track or away from a track towards doom. Tho I shouldn’t take this as a problem to be a doomer about, rather a step in the right direction. First for myself, do I even like designing? Researching what designers do in each field, is that something I like to do? (Models in rotation, clothing designs, expressions, etc. from what I’m seein’). Is there another side of character art I am interested and what setting would that work for me occupationally? Or am I just looking to make a pretty picture? Additionally, working independently seems to be a more lucrative and creatively fulfilling route, with the only “downsides” that I can muster being the longer term effort and self managing, as well as being at the whims of algorithms and staying up to date as a “content creator” on 2-3 platforms or more. Sounds arduous tho so do all the other art fields in different ways. Plus, a lot if these people also do freelance for whomever they applied for and will take off of creation online for those projects when they arise. So they’re always working either for a company or for themselves. So finding your voice, and hence your brand and enunciating your voice is the long term strategy. That will help with your portfolio and further figuring out how work will work. Still in school for graphic design in my last year, been doing self study for 2D character design for like half a decade or more now, more amateurly growing up. Been super afraid of the future and what’s coming up after college and with loans and such. I accept that I’ll be doing part time or graphic design job if I get one out the gate to get a decent enough amount of money while continuing to get better at character design and my portfolio. I think I like the story telling aspect of art rather than extreme rendering? Like how character interact with others or objects, and the feeling a pose gives to convey the mood. I’m unsure where that lends job wise, but it gives me some personal insight. Thank you for the vid gave me some realistic self interrogating to do before college ends.
FYI I can confirm that US studios are indeed outsourcing to UK & EU. Average 1 bedroom rent in NYC (where a lot of us work in concept design for studios) is $4200 per month. LA isn’t far behind. Part of the problem for US artists is the huge strength of the US dollar against foreign currencies right now. Every studio has always outsourced to LatAm, but now it’s saturated there. The difference in our salary versus theirs is staggering. It’s not an exaggeration to say that 1 day for a NY artist will feed & house a Brazilian for a whole month. In the internet age it’s difficult for most positions to justify that much of a premium by being 30x more valuable. You mentioned the prevalence of those scifi projects. Most of this stuff has a fairly high degree of realism & is somewhat generic. It’s like… how good do the scifi props need to be!? Is there even such a thing as 30x better? Idk 😂
I'm sorry Andy but as a veteran who has been in the industry for two decades, at this point in time advising anyone to consider this has a career path is just irresponsible...
@@inkfly7532 What’s your opinion on this whole situation? For junior artists specifically do you think it’s worth investing years to work on a portfolio for an unstable industry? Thanks a lot.
@@mozzile8368 I do not. Making it in this industry was hard enough 10 years ago and has never been harder than now. Moreover, the idea that your skills will somehow determine your success in this job is just false, most of the time the people who advance in the corporate ladders or are involved in productions are the lip workers making this "career" at best stagnant and at worse totally unstable. I would not recommend basing your life on this career more than I would recommend to base it on winning the lottery, you may make it, but the odds are so awfully stack against you that you may just spend your entire life scratching tickets without ever winning.
yeah, that's where I'm at. Man it's tough. Someone comes to me asking advice on how to get in etc. and the thing is, how do I know that they're not one of the few who'll make it and create something amazing? eesh.
@@mozzile8368I would err against. As a professional myself. You grind to get to a competitive level, but the grind of other students and better professionals continues. Tools change, workflows update and what you learned to deliver might not compete anymore, and you have to keep training and practicing. Every job you get will always be a competition with 200 other seniors and 1500 competent juniors. Gigs are inherently short-term, as teams break up after the project is done in many cases. So think - the grinding you do to get the first job, just gets you that first job. Your ‘career’ is not guaranteed. Every single job after that will be just as up in the air, so keep grinding, for the rest of your life haha. You do it because you enjoy it and can’t imagine anything else. But the trap is you spend all these years looking to do something, and you now have an extremely specialized skill with no use in nearly any other industry other than entertainment art. So, keep that in mind.
@@AndyWalsh the thing is they might be, but the odds at this point are so stacked against artists that you may well wish them to base their life on winning the lottery... it may happen and they may win big, but chances are they may just spend their entire life on scratch tickets...
Honestly, I only recommend going into the art field if you’re independent wealthy. Nobody should be taking out loans to go into any commercial art field right now. This is my second career so I’ve had a lot of flexibility but a lot of us saw the writing on the wall even a few years back. I started a mural business & have more work than I can even do- but I realize that’s also dependent on living in an urban area or a region with fairly wealthy people who love murals.
Well done on finding decent work though. It's a big gamble, but some people are just naturally meant to pursue the art field. I think many will fail due to lack of business skills.
It's funny, you'd think that 3d production art is close, but it's as different as... I dunno, UI design is. As a 3d production artist, you need to have perfect and efficient edge flow. Something I, as an artist who's used 3d for 26 years now, absolutely suck at. You also need to know how to efficiently pack UVs, again, after 26 years in 3D I can barely unwrap something. Both of those sciences are a mystery to me.
My point is, there are people who say that "if the gaming industry is too hard to into, get into other industries". Why would I get into industries that has nothing to do with gaming? If working on games is what I want to do I should pursue that. How getting into animation, tv, movie industy would be fulfilling, if game making is what I want?. Usually you're happy when you know what you want and get it. Anything else would be unfulfilling and a waste of life.
I do understand you, i'm completely jobless i don't have other interests. From your profile i can't understand what you do but at this point the only way is to make our own game,to sell our own products. Traditional artists,musicians and indie developers have been doing this,i've been trying and it's really hard, sorry but it seems there's no other way at the moment.
There comes a point where making money actually matters. I'm not sure how old you are but once you live out and have to sustain yourself there's only so much you can take being unemployed/freelancing to make ends meet. I used to have a similar mindset.
@@pasust1688😂 💯 exactly. I see a lot of these comments & assume they’re independently wealthy, which is great I guess. In that situation perhaps they just keep applying over & over to the same game companies
Character concept art and splash illustration. Come hell or high water, I will make it happen. My own brand, business and the whole sort. I plan on going to study art in South Korea for that at some point. Art standards there are far more lucrative in my opinion. Even with all this doom and gloom hanging over the industry's head, I really don't care enough for it to actually stop me from pursuing it.
Ah, bugger. I try to keep it as low as possible. It's just really dead if I just have silence. Thanks for watching! I thought they were depressing videos though, so glad to hear they're inspiring!
what about pursuing matte painting? Anyone know if the market is slightly different for this role? I hear some vfx roles like compositing are still in demand. (just considering to branch out to a slightly different avenue but similar field)
Matte painting could be an option. It's a weird discipline though because you literally can't define what it is because it can be as simple as a sky replacement and as complex and a set extension. I was very close to moving into this field (well, trying to pivot) but with the film industry also on its knees right now, it may only be a slightly better option. But maybe as a supplemental skill addition. Certainly being a good matte painter would improve the quality of your 2d art.
It's probably easier since I've cast a wide net in terms of job applications and landed one for matte painting. (maybe it's luck based idk) you could apply this skillset from polishing in-game assets to creating full key visuals but you do need some knowledge of 3D softwares. What I'm *assuming* is that you don't really need a lot of people to create concepts/ideas but assets and promotional materials/screens require way more manpower and time.
I think I follow that chap. Great work. What would you say stands out as why he's good at marketing? Is there anything compelling about his brand that makes us want to follow him?
@@AndyWalsh Well he used to be the frontman of a popoular band in France..so I think he is a natural 'showman' and good in front of the camera, and his work is excellent too, and he has a lot of free giveaways of prints of his work...
A couple of my trachers said I should get a following or a discernable art style and the companies will come to me instead. Seems like sound advice but I can only guess
interesting...a lot of art directors tell junior artists to create portfolios based on a singular original project. so you can definitely kill 2 birds with one stone regarding the process of creating a portfolio for work, while also creating something cool to get the attention of potential fans and clients.
RUclips and tik tok is killing movies. games are still made but how many artists are really needed out there? Its like pro sports. Theres millions of young athletes who want to go pro, but there's only a tiny handful of real art jobs. And it dosent even pay millions like pro sports. You will be lucky to make a single dollar let alone a living from art.
it's a piece of piss to make a tiny bit of money, if you're not lazy. Not 'lucky to make a single dollar' territory. But the thing is it can take years to get good, and you expect the pay to be worth it. So it's possible to make minimum wage, but who wants to grind for years and years to make minimum wage - that's the issue. However, if you get really good, and the job market is sensible, you can earn as much as a doctor. Although I think they're trying to put an end to that.
Having art as a job is not worth it. Unless you are self employed like the instagram artists or youtubers where you can set your own time and subject matter. You don't want to be working on other people's boring, money grabbing, soulless games. You don't want to be working overtime in some studio with awful working conditions. Your job doesn't have the potential to scale, so the pay will forever be small. Just do it as a hobby. Post it online and if you are lucky, you will be one of those that can turn it profitable.
To some degree. In the games industry, if you get the right company, you can earn a decent living and many games companies have cool working conditions. And if before the great gaming collapse, if you freelanced for a solid year you could earn as much as a doctor. But those times may be over for 98% of us. But it is much better to find success creating your own IP than working on someone else's.
I mean i would love to have multiple ways to be creative like animation and be a RUclipsr but knowing the amount of skill thinking recording and at the same time maybe commissions that would take it's kinda overwhelming
@@weronikasanecka1945 Yeah it is actually overwhelming. I work in the animation industry and have a stable 9-5, so I've essentially achieved my dreams when I was a student. However, even though I am grateful, I feel I haven't achieved much outside of this job. I have no following and no personal brand. Everything Andy said about independence is true. Dare I say, having an independent brand as an artist is the ultimate goal, even working in a studio can be ultimately unfulfilling. All that said. YES it is still worth it, it won't be straight forward but if it's your calling, it's your calling, don't deny your spirit what it wants. If you can find a way to resonate with people through your personal work, you can forgo the studio job altogether and speedrun to the real end goal - you make what you want, directly to the people who want it.
One concept artist I've had the displeasure to work with was the most insufferable and self-centered person I ever met. I'm a bad person for being happy he's been laid off for AI but he deserved it.
Not a bad idea. Particularly if MAGA get in. If you already work for someone like LUMA pictures, have them transfer you to their Melbourne office. I'll shout you your first beer.
@@robertdouble559 If MAGA doesn't get in, we can forget jobs period as the planet will be a ball of nuclear smoke. Still, there'd be a lot less job competition!
Not necessarily out of the US, but there are parts of the US that are super cheap to live. Look up Dave Rapoza. He moved to Colorado because it was a pretty location and dirt cheap. Stay out of the west coast and NY etc.
Absolutely. If I lived in a 3rd world country, as long as I can still charge my day rate (which is coming into question these days, so maybe I couldn't, but if I could...) then I could live like a king on my typical 3-4 weeks of work per year.
@@AndyWalsh That's great to hear, although my concern is with the laws and regulations regarding paycheck withdrawals and taxes, (I'm from India btw) Do you know any resources that talk about this?
Wow! So jaded... I usually like your content man but this is just too much focusing on the negative. The industry is changing, big studios will fall, new studios powered by humans with new visions will emerge. I liked the part on working a personal brand and growing that part also but hey it's a damn big industry and a huge world. Like any other industry its ups and downs... why do you round so much in being pesimistic about the whole thing? "oh we've seen better times..." come on man
Please tell me how much industry experience you actually have. This is not a slight dip in the industry. This is the wholesale slaughter of jobs simply to get rid of people. The amount of money Microsoft just invested in AI could have paid 96,000 artists a decent salary. And the industry for concept art was terrible before all this. As one guy commented: As an industry veteran, I just can't advise that people get into this career any more. It's just not responsible. However, I am saying there's hope for indie games and indie art projects in this age of global outreach in a global market. But forget about concept art as a career path unless you don't mind being unemployed for at least half of the rest of your life.
@@AndyWalsh I'm a noob of course... but I have a different world view. I don't think it's ok to generalize and think that newcomers will have the same experience you did. Again, it's about the focus, you seem very fixated on the macroeconomic aspect of this and how doomed everything is. Sorry I don't share that perspective. Even if I'm naive I'll aim for the best and keep an open mind, a positive attitude and focus on the hopeful thoughts. I wish some light comes into your professional life soon.
9:43 I cannot understand this bcoz I have many film art books where the "art" IS BASIC! Terrible even. I mean awful photo-bashing that you can see is rushed... ...etc...etc.
The main reason behind shit that's happening is spiking rise in interest rates in all major western economies to combat inflation. The reasons for inflation are COVID stimulus payments (money printer) and war in Ukraine and Israel that caused issues in logistic chains. Stuff getting more expensive, people (but not all!) had too much cash, cash devaluates, inflation. Raising interest rates is the primary method that governments can use to combat inflation. I'm not going to cover all aspects how it's working, but basically it makes cash more expensive to borrow, but more profitable to keep in banks. So people with spare cash (investors) would rather keep their money in a bank earning safe 5% per year return rather than invest in risky projects (which are extremely common in entertainment industry). No cash from investors - no jobs, no one wants to work for free. When inflation will get under control and interest rates begin to fall, we will see more jobs coming as investors would need to invest their money somewhere if they don't want them to be eaten by inflation. Anyway, my point is, the current situation is pure economics and little to do with AI and absolutely nothing with conspiracy theories like "evil corporations just want everyone to starve to get cheap labour". Yes, times are tough right now, but economy goes in cycles and after every recession there's an economic boom following. It WILL get better. It always was. But of course people prefer to be doomers and spreading calls about "end of world, it's over".
You’re right but with respect to US artists specifically, the problem we’re facing (which is linked to inflation) is the huge value of the US dollar against foreign currency. What I get paid in 1 day as a NYC artist can feed & house a Brazilian artist for a month. That’s not an exaggeration - our average rent here is $4200 per month. So while many jobs it’s worthwhile having a local artist (especially for those of us who are senior/ mgmt/ client-facing level) the vast majority of art jobs can’t justify a 30x premium- especially in the internet age.
![Noob To Max With DRAGON REWORK In Blox Fruits [FULL MOVIE]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/LnBMOinoOvA/mqdefault.jpg)
Working in concept art sounds like living hell to be honest. I love art, I don't wanna hate it.
When you get work, it's fine. But really, I would say that in 12 years I've probably only worked about 3 years if you added it all up.
i was a junior concept artist and left the field in 2 years. Now i draw just for fun and my mental health is 100% better. Honestly working in the creative industry is not really worth it for the vast majority of people. You can have a nice little hobby and have absolute creative freedom
I work in concept art and enjoy it (well, 85-90% of it). This video is too much doom and gloom.
Do your own thing.
@@valentynporada5617 a lot of art dudes are pure doom and gloom. Specially the pros. I would much rather work from home doing art for a few hundred bucks than breaking my back spitting wood (I have done it). Pros from the 1st world are some of the biggest crybabies I have ever heard of. You are an artist!!!!
I know that some of you do art for a long time, please don't be discouraged. Even if you can't find a career to place for your creativity, keep creating. There should be a part where you do it for yourself.
Another fantastic video! I worked as a concept artist for about 4 years fulltime, a couple years freelance before that (worked for Disney Interactive during the mobile gaming craze until they slowly started shuttering each studio). I've been out of the industry a while and love to check these videos to get a truly inside look at where the industry is at. I still draw and paint and occasionally think about getting back in. These videos serve as a great window to let me know exactly what I'd be trying to get back into.
Also, another depressing note that viewers should take into account. I've been part of two mass layoffs and can say from experience that when a company says they laid off 700 employees, the actual number could be closer to 1000 if not more. I'm not sure how companies get around it, but there doesn't seem to be a set-in-stone rule when it comes to announcing this sort of thing. When you see some grim layoff numbers being thrown around, just keep in mind the numbers could be much higher.
eesh, wow. Another motivation to try and be independent. So what did you transition into?
@@AndyWalsh After games, I did a little freelance until I could find stable work. I painted backgrounds to be used for projections in stage shows. Very long hours for okay pay, but I was able to work from home.
Then I got full time work in the electronics industry. Designing booths for trade shows, package design, even some product design. The first year of that was amazing. I was able to go nuts with my designs and concepts and see them realized in real life. A year into my time with the company, the art director left and the art department was then essentially run by the salespeople. It turned into a mess. The company didn't need me anymore (I had already redesigned the entire line of packages for the company) and I think I was replaced by a more junior designer (probably making a little more than half what I was getting paid). That job had been an hour away and I wanted to be closer to home.
I am now in the aerospace industry doing technical illustrations for airplane equipment. Ironically, the work is much less creative than game art, but I have a ton more independence in how I go about my day. It's twenty minutes from house and while the pay isn't exceptional, it's fairly stable and the benefits are pretty good. I live in the US (east coast where living is crazy expensive) and we do alright.
@@keithv2974 Very interesting! How does one enter in this particular industry (aerospace industry) with previous experience in entertainment/electronics industry? Doesn't it require anything like a degree or anything technical-related stuff?
@@christianpetrov6976 I didn't need any specialized degree other than my graphic design degree. In truth, they were very uninterested in my college or my degree. After the job with the electronics company, I was back doing freelance and looking for steady work again (I have two kids and mortgage). I applied for about 1000 jobs before putting in my resume for a tech illustrator. The head of the department saw my application, looked at my portfolio, and was impressed. I have a good amount of 3d work in my portfolio (lots of 3d renders of earbuds, speakers, etc). The head of the department was an avid gamer and dabbled in 3d, so he knew how challenging 3d could be. He was confident that if I could produce work like he saw on my website, I could handle the kind of technical illustrations they needed.
If you're interested in technical art, there's always a good amount of companies looking for artists. It's dry work, not terribly creative, but it can pay pretty good. Right before my current job, I was in talks with the naval base near me for a position there as a tech artist. One position opened up, then closed, and then another position opened up but that closed as well. Maintain an impressive body of work and keep applying to places. A lot of it can come down to the person viewing your stuff. If they like what they see, they may go and convince their own bosses to give you a chance.
That last third of the video is soo godamn important. I'm in art school and was wanting to go the concept art route. Realised pretty quickly that the industry both in 3D and concept art wasn't for me, there are so many things that go against who I am as a person main one being there is very little self expression in the work they ask you to make, its kina machine like work. Growing my own brand and doing my own thing is now what I am working towards.
As a concept artist, even if you do land a role, the pay may be very low. Earlier this year, I got offered $35/hr for an art director position, which is much lower than my hourly rate as a concept artist, with much more responsibilities. Getting in is also a lot about who you know besides having a great portfolio. I also completely agree with being an independent artist because right now, it’s more stable in terms of income because you’re always going to have an audience that is wanting to buy your art & products - you just need to build a audience, which will take time, but will help support you in the long run. I like to think of it as a safety net when the jobs are not rolling in or things like layoffs happen.
My rates were roughly half of the top tier during 'normal times' but now, even the top tier guys are having to take my rates and less. So one might say they're 50% down, but if you're already charging 50% you may not notice the difference. Just precisely what happens when there are too many workers.
What I hate the most about all this is that despite all the time invested in improving my drawings and illustrations, I still haven't been able to put it all into practice in any job. I've sent many portfolios to different companies and job offers (offers that, of course, required experience, but if I have to wait for junior positions, maybe I'll apply to one in a year), and all the responses I've received have been negative. Not even a skills test or anything. This is what I hate the most; I haven't even been given a chance to see if I would be good at this or not.
Thing is, if your work isn't good then you just will not be give a chance because the art director already knows everything he needs to know by looking at your work. In this industry zero people get given 'a chance'. You upload until people go 'wow' and then you get your chance but by that time, it isn't a big gamble for them. Which is brutal of course and why it's definitely not a career if you want to feel comfortable any more than 25% of the time.
@@AndyWalsh Basically they base it off of if the artist already has a following of sorts on social media/art websites (DeviantArt, ArtStation, Twitter, RUclips, etc)?
@@JLCL01 No. social media following has nothing to do with it. You just have to be honest with yourself - can you create work as good as the best art in the most recent Art Of books? Can you design, turnaround, and think about player or viewer needs while delivering something polished and ready to use? If you can’t, then you’re not going to be looked at by a recruiter thinking, ‘Maybe we give this one an interview”.
Because the standards are extremely high across the board. You just have to be honest with yourself.
@@JLCL01 no, no, no... it may seem like I'm saying that I suppose because to be fair, you could be amazing and never uploaded to ArtStation and more than likely get no recognition due to no one knowing you exist.
So that said, it's delicate. So like, if you ARE able to get like 800-1000 likes or more on a piece, then you'll get visibility on that piece, especially if it has good tags and ADs can find it on AS. Get that consistently and you'll get little offers here and there. I guess I have seen the odd new-to-AS artist get that.
To simplify, if you're good you'll get noticed. If no one is ever noticing you ever, then you're still not there and need to improve. Likely by a lot.
Hi Andy, at this point i do feel like a complete failure, all of these years spent grinding hoping that my career would take off, to make money for my family and now i`m 32 years old, i can sculpt a hulkbuster movie quality but i`m completely jobless,no family, no children, i`ve achieved nothing. Years ago my sister got a job in the supermarket, now she`s still working there. But at the moment i`m a little bit happy, i`ve been working on my own projects, i haven`t published anything yet and i`m still a failure but i do like being indipendent, i`ve been painting and sculpting traditionally, i have ideas for some statues to be 3d printed. I`m scared to death about the future and i don`t think i`m going to be successful but at this point i have nothing to lose.Anyway congratulations for your contract and thank you, you`re the only one in this terrible industry that answered me when i needed help and yours videos have been the only thing really useful, if i had success i`d like to share what i`ve learnt. Thank you again
Gabriele
Thanks Gabriel. I always like to help when I can because I've lived that same life myself. The constant threat of being a failure. But hey, as long as you still have breath in your body, you're not a failure, you just haven't been successful yet. I didn't even start until I was your age.
The biggest advice I can give is that you must get better and better and be humble. Those who know the exact quality of their work and where it needs to get to will usually triumph.
Those who just want to believe their work is already good but are bitter that someone else wants it to be better before they get paid, will usually fail.
Thanks for the video & the honesty Andy, it’s much appreciated. This video, plus the experience of having taken a few concept art classes this year, plus AI and the state of the industry have made me realise ‘concept art’ is not what I want to do: I don’t enjoy the class homework, I don’t wan’t to work for corps anymore, I don’t want to have to use 3d or AI for an ‘art’ job when what I like to do is draw & paint traditionally. Also, the concept-art job I’d want to do hasn’t existed for about 20-30 years anyway😅
Gonna pivot & work towards the independent route with traditional art, in fine art, and sell to actual individuals if they want to buy the work. It’s what I actually want to do - life’s too short to pursue something that isn’t what I thought it was, and will probably barely exist in a few years anyway with AI.
"Forget that there is an industry" love it man❤
Thank you for the honesty, we all need it!
welcome!
this gave me so much insight with the future path!! yes, the supermarket job is boring as hell thanks for the video
glad I could help! best of luck, get out of that job!
You know it is bad when Reid Southen, a senior concept artist for films is talking about there not being much work in the industry. Just looked at an interview with him on the ATMO RUclips page and his talk about AI and the industry.
I'll have to check that out. I do wonder if it'll ever come back.
Yeah right now is not a good time for any junior artists.
I just got good enough to get interviews and some jobs back in 2022. Then the studio closures started happening with management teams being entirely terminated (Volition) while in the middle of interviewing with them!
Took a break to update portfolio and came back this year to no available openings, no interviews and no jobs. Thinking of going to 3D, Animation or even doing my own stories. But at that point i dont even know if thats worth it.
Personally like to create
* World to work in full of passion and personal short projects to post
* forget the industry, forget the masses, think about selling an idea you like and give it life by showing everything around it
* have multiple ways to sell that world you enjoy being in
Seems so simple but probably very difficult, draw what YOU love to draw and put it out there.
* don’t get a degree in concept art or many art degrees in general, just get online guided courses for fundamentals and principles of design, and then in whatever field you’re interested in. Research before buying the courses what is required and what works, look at artists you are envious of their work and be in-tuned about what YOU love to draw and invest in.
* artists you like - consistency of art, type of art, how they express themselves and their art, uniqueness and outside of box rather than just focusing on the job market
Just want to say congrats on the contract
Thanks man!
I still want to do concept art, but realistically like what you said its almost impossible for junior artists to even have a chance in this industry. My siblings are both graphic designers, and while the whole economy is bad they were able to find jobs recently which is amazing. Can i ask your insight of graphic design/ UX design and how much better it is compared to the gaming industry? I know for sure it’s both competitive but I feel that I chose the worst path for art..
Do something you enjoy is all I can say. You might think that Graphic Design is a good plan B for Concept art but they're different. I get we need jobs but if you just choose to do the "safe thing" which is graphic design, you might be miserable.
@@dp2791 I definitely want to do this more than anything in my life. So I will keep trying until death. Thank you so much for the optimism. It’s what we need more than anything these days.
I used to be a graphic designer and I hated it. It's low pay and zero creativity. It's someone else, who isn't creative, telling you to change every conceivable detail on their wholemeal loaf packaging. UI design though, could be an option. Like, high end, animated, games UI stuff.
@@mozzile8368 It's just one the most competitive fields in the world and always will be. it's not like graphic design, or finance, or plumbing etc. but more akin to acting or professional sports. Concept artists help bring videogames, movies and entertainment to life which is cool and exciting therefore it will always be highly sought after
At the beginning of the 2000-s if anyone here's old enough to remember there was a similar psychosis regarding 3d. Everyone was so hyped and the artists were so stressed that because of 3d there will be no more jobs for the artists and that 3d will soon replace all mattepainters, decoration and prop artists and even the actors themselves. We outlived this hysteria and layoffs. We will outlive this most recent ones with AI and whatnot. Just stay faithful to your true self - everything will calm down soon.
The problem is, AI isn't even 10% of the problem right now. It's just the industry contracting in the most brutal way imaginable, in an industry that was already massively saturated with talent.
i remember final fantasy spirits within and how it was so realistic that computer generated actors were gonna replace hollywood actors in the near future.
*looks at how no major American animation studio does 2D anymore because it's all 3D*
*Nervous laughter*
3d killed a lot of jobs though . If absolutely annihilated 2 d animation in the states. Photoshop destroyed page rates in illustration along with companies pushing minimalism for book covers.
You know after university (general design course, covered all sorts of concept art modules) I took a detour to set myself up comfortably so that I could have as much time as possible to hone my craft so I could to land a design job, and I've arrived at the point where I have said free time to do so
I'm a decent enough sketcher, painter, know my way around Blender, have some ideas, but I am very self aware that I need some real rigorous discipline and 'grind' time to put it all together and level up to a better standard
But I think unfortunately I timed it wrong and these huge changes in the industry have me feeling that I should use said time to find a new path for myself, i've had my head in the sand a little and chugged along with the vague idea that 'i'm gonna be one of the ones who makes it!' but after doing some digging i'm waking up to the harsh realities of the industry
I have been to a few industry events in the UK where I get some general 'yeah man you can do it, go for it, it'll be tough but anythings possible' and cynically I am starting to feel that they sort of have to hype you up because said events are an industry in themselves y'know? They can't host these events if they're telling people to simmer their expectations, I bump into the same people regularly who are working much harder than me and not getting anywhere
Emotionally and stubbornly I have the urge to try and overcome the absurd odds, realistically I think I should, as already said, use my free time to find a more comfortable/stable job, and become content with maybe at best for now I can keep honing my skills, having fun creating my own projects, and perhaps some freelancing here and there will come my way down the line, but I am a very 'all or nothing' type of person so this option is difficult for me to wrap my head around, sincerely I'd like your view on which path seems more realistic, I mean I already know the answer seeing as I watched the video haha but it's nice to vent
Either way glad you landed a decent contract project and I wish you all the best for the future
i love making art since young but the thought of working in an industry is a turn off for me so i just pick whatever random job that can feed me and roof me and keep my art for myself since it's up for me what i do , not someone else deciding
I’m freelancing some right now, but for small illustration projects. Still working on my personal brand. Its tough. I feel lucky I have a whole different skill-set in print production and graphic design for my day-job, and I actually don’t mind of the lack of creativity or pickiness. It does require extreme perfectionism and technical knowledge. Concept art is a whole different beast that people always seem to assume is just the same as splash art.
Thanks so much for the video Andy I wish you the best on your job hunts and social media , I would like to add as for the industry goes forward with less attachment to artist : Hopefully better leadership on companies will raise , and make a better market that will speak as you mentioned with better products since creative people make better branding , and our new portfolio is the brand we adopt as our own narrative we like to see like content in social media, and stop that awful trend of doing all concepts with the same formulas behind and just with better or worst cosmetic and budgets ! That it is clearly not connecting with audience for their budget expectations , and for it wont sell any more ...
I used to want a job in the gaming industry or as an artist. Now Im not even sure if I can find any kind of job.
It's the same for me, no jobs at all
Good advice in this video. There's a book every artist should read called The Millionaire Fastlane by MJ DeMarco. Don't let the cringy, cheesy title put you off.
A bit more of a relevant idea, it might be worth teaming up with Indie game makers and working out a revenue split deal. Indie games are really popular now and they are quicker to make than triple A. Better odds than a lottery ticket of the game blowing up and taking the world by storm but even if the resulting game doesn't sell, it's an extra body of work to put on artstation.
I've actually read that book! I gave me the basic idea of what wealth is vs getting a job. But it didn't really equip me with the sensibility and cunning to create a business. Alex Hormozi is almost good for that, but all he talks about is B2B vs selling a 'thing' like an artistic product. So I'm still waiting for my business guru for that specific requirement.
Hi Andy, very insightful feedback from the industry. I am a student that is currently studying and wanted to get ready for this industry, while I am not 100% focused on concept art as I am expected to be in animation realistically, concept art has always fascinated me. However the more I heard from the news from just an outsider, and insider perspective, the more I feel depressed and I am not a very mentally capable person to withstand the amount of expectation from this industry. I really do wished to have a job and place, I know everyone keeps telling me to just develop the portfolio and keep swimming but I still cannot shake the feelings entirely. How do you prepare yourself back then? I would really love to know and maybe some peace of mind kind of advice coming from you.
I've been making my own projects colaborating with people online in an attempt to get experience in a project involving a team. Me and 6 other junior artists are making a 5 minutes long animation together. I don't know what else to do besides that and constantly working on my portfolio.
This one video shook me to my core and has definitely sent me into a hole of existential crisis. I’ve been trying to break into the industry since graduating college in 2007. I’ve spent countless days and nights practicing my skills, networking, and just trying to come across any opportunity I can squeeze myself into - all while passing up on hanging with friend and passing up on what could of been life altering moments. Now what do I do?
I'm genuinely sorry for your circumstance. I know that feeling. I've missed out on (and still miss out on) time with friends and family. I have a full time job now but I'm also working in my spare time to move towards a more reliable state of independence, build more skills etc.
If you want more in-depth advice (if I can help) then hit me up on facebook or ArtStation. I hate seeing people suffer like this.
@@AndyWalsh I’ll hit you up on ArtStation. Thanks again.
loved this video, thank you. I don't think this video is half as depressing as most people think.
A brief pitch idea: create a product of your own that you can sell online. The upsides to this are multiple: 1) You could potentially have something that brings in revenue. 2) You'll broaden your portfolio 3) You'll sharpen your entrepreneur skills. It might feel like an entrepreneurial push ends in a dead end, but I have discovered that's rarely the case - creating something has almost ALWAYS opened new doors for me.
Potential ideas you could develop: A) A board game B) A card game C) A tarot card deck D)Broader variety of fan art prints to sell on Etsy (this is probably the first and best option). So many things out there to sell online.
If you find yourself between projects, you can take control and make things happen in your life.
Another idea: E) An art book for a hypothetical game that feels nostalgic and pays homage to a big hit game from the past - for this you dont have to make a game - just create cool art that reminds people of X or Y game they love.
yeah, all good ideas and something many artists should be already trying if they're not finding jobs!
@@AndyWalsh You're missing the point. 'Finding jobs' is just begging for work. It's asking for permission to work, pay bills, and even exist from day to day. Even steady employment can be terminated at the employer's whim. Working artists are at the mercy of somebody else's agenda.
I'm saying that we have an opportunity to build our own products, our own brands, and escape the cycle.
I just saw your LinkedIn page today :) I don't know if you will see my comment, but I want to share something that is dear to me.
I am a junior 2D artist and feel a true calling in character concept art. I am incredibly fond of games, stylization and fantasy. I'm currently working as a 2D artist in a studio, but no matter how hard I try to work as a concept artist, I keep failing.
I love design, I love looking for shapes, body language, silhouettes, solving visual challenges and drawing the story of a creature or a main character, but I can't do it in the entertainment industry because I'm younger and I don't have enough experience, vision or anything else . I aspire to become a concept artist for fairly well-known projects like Warcraft or Warhammer etc.
The Games industry is going through its biggest crisis right now, and I don't know if I'll ever have the chance to become who I see and feel. I study many trends in conceptual art, all kinds of solutions to certain visual problems, creation of various ideas, I study the works of projects that I want to get into because I'm just burning with it! I would like to get some advice from you, namely about my path, what I need to achieve to be what I dream of and achieve a certain goal.
I will be very grateful!
Hey bud. I feel your passion for sure. I get questions like this with portfolios like yours a fair bit.
Always when I see work like this and I think back to when I used to do work like this, and what makes the difference between then and now and the answer is a kind of unconscious laziness.
We don't realise, at the junior level, that we're trying to do as little as possible to just get to the end. The difference would be just going to the gym 4 times per week and each session just doing a bit of this, a bit of that and not eating right and saying: well I go to the gym all the time, vs going as hard as you can, lifting more each week and counting calories.
You're showing a tiny amount of designs and then doing multiple very slight variations on one of those designs, putting them all on one page, and then adding them each in separately. Very little effort.
You need to be looking at great artists and doing exactly what they're doing in terms of effort. The research, the sketches, the variations, the rendering level, the studies, the not taking second best and starting over because it could be better even though you spend hours on that one thing. Being brutal, being tough on yourself.
Accept that the work is crap and will be for ages but that you don't care, your goal is not to get a job but to be better, and if you keep getting better a job will come, but not until it's DEFINITELY good and not just the bare minimum.
Pick what is amazing, art wise, and steer towards it. Think bigger.
Good luck!
I havent watched the video yet but, ive studied and just started working 5 years ago. i had only have a handfull of freelance job for "concept art" and from last year i noticed how bad it is. The thing is i don't know what to do!!!! Im so lost!!!
Did it for 15 years. All I can say is never stop doing your own art. Better to build your own brand than someone else’s.
I came here as 3D motion designer, but all I saw was that Ibanez Jem Lefthanded in the background and I new that I'm on the right place...😊
ha, It's not left handed though, I just flipped the camera coz I can't look at my own face if it's not flipped :P
I gave up on doing art as a work long time ago, today I'm a tech lead in a tech company and I do art in my free time, I dont even care to post on social media anymore, I was having anxiety because of this... I do for the love of making art, painting (oil), not for money, for like count on social media nor anything like that, and I'm very happy with this decision
7 yrs post school, of me trying to break into the animation industry through my concept art (cg & 2d art) & storyboarding portfolio. My 20s are over, so I “gave up” on the dream this year. Tired.
one of my friends had their department outsourced to Australia, i was surprised since that is not a typical country the US outsources to
Be interesting to find out if there's a significant salary difference. Do you know which part of the US the company was physically based? If it's somewhere like LA or SF, then I'm imagining Australia could save them about 50% on staff.
@@AndyWalsh Orlando FL, not privy to any salary amounts of the workers here or the new location, but it only makes sense that it is cheaper
As an Aussie I can tell you, yes it is and it has been for quite a while, particularly in film. We have great govt tax incentives for US companies to buy VFX and Studio time from us. And the exchange rate is amazing for US companies. We're cheaper for a start and on top of that they get 1.5 value in the exchange rate, plus tax rebates. Have a look at the end of all of the big movies for logos from Screen Vic, Screen NSW and our Govt logos. We're like a 2nd Mexico. Sorry to break it to ya. It's long relationship and it ain't ending any time soon.
@@robertdouble559 it certainly opened my eyes, speaking english natively probably helps too. i knew there were a couple of 3D animators and VFX artists contracting out of Australia to US film companies but i didn't know it was that big
I work in Australia as a matte painter. We get paid around 60% of what you expect in the US. I have a job, but I can't afford much.
I think being realistic is positive in setting you on track or away from a track towards doom. Tho I shouldn’t take this as a problem to be a doomer about, rather a step in the right direction.
First for myself, do I even like designing? Researching what designers do in each field, is that something I like to do? (Models in rotation, clothing designs, expressions, etc. from what I’m seein’). Is there another side of character art I am interested and what setting would that work for me occupationally? Or am I just looking to make a pretty picture?
Additionally, working independently seems to be a more lucrative and creatively fulfilling route, with the only “downsides” that I can muster being the longer term effort and self managing, as well as being at the whims of algorithms and staying up to date as a “content creator” on 2-3 platforms or more. Sounds arduous tho so do all the other art fields in different ways. Plus, a lot if these people also do freelance for whomever they applied for and will take off of creation online for those projects when they arise. So they’re always working either for a company or for themselves.
So finding your voice, and hence your brand and enunciating your voice is the long term strategy. That will help with your portfolio and further figuring out how work will work.
Still in school for graphic design in my last year, been doing self study for 2D character design for like half a decade or more now, more amateurly growing up. Been super afraid of the future and what’s coming up after college and with loans and such. I accept that I’ll be doing part time or graphic design job if I get one out the gate to get a decent enough amount of money while continuing to get better at character design and my portfolio.
I think I like the story telling aspect of art rather than extreme rendering? Like how character interact with others or objects, and the feeling a pose gives to convey the mood. I’m unsure where that lends job wise, but it gives me some personal insight.
Thank you for the vid gave me some realistic self interrogating to do before college ends.
Thanks for video !
welcome!
FYI I can confirm that US studios are indeed outsourcing to UK & EU. Average 1 bedroom rent in NYC (where a lot of us work in concept design for studios) is $4200 per month. LA isn’t far behind.
Part of the problem for US artists is the huge strength of the US dollar against foreign currencies right now. Every studio has always outsourced to LatAm, but now it’s saturated there. The difference in our salary versus theirs is staggering. It’s not an exaggeration to say that 1 day for a NY artist will feed & house a Brazilian for a whole month. In the internet age it’s difficult for most positions to justify that much of a premium by being 30x more valuable. You mentioned the prevalence of those scifi projects. Most of this stuff has a fairly high degree of realism & is somewhat generic. It’s like… how good do the scifi props need to be!? Is there even such a thing as 30x better? Idk 😂
That's crazy rent in NY! I did not think it was that much. Does make the case for outsourcing. Also makes the case for moving to a cheaper location!
I'm sorry Andy but as a veteran who has been in the industry for two decades, at this point in time advising anyone to consider this has a career path is just irresponsible...
@@inkfly7532 What’s your opinion on this whole situation? For junior artists specifically do you think it’s worth investing years to work on a portfolio for an unstable industry? Thanks a lot.
@@mozzile8368 I do not. Making it in this industry was hard enough 10 years ago and has never been harder than now.
Moreover, the idea that your skills will somehow determine your success in this job is just false, most of the time the people who advance in the corporate ladders or are involved in productions are the lip workers making this "career" at best stagnant and at worse totally unstable.
I would not recommend basing your life on this career more than I would recommend to base it on winning the lottery, you may make it, but the odds are so awfully stack against you that you may just spend your entire life scratching tickets without ever winning.
yeah, that's where I'm at. Man it's tough. Someone comes to me asking advice on how to get in etc. and the thing is, how do I know that they're not one of the few who'll make it and create something amazing? eesh.
@@mozzile8368I would err against. As a professional myself. You grind to get to a competitive level, but the grind of other students and better professionals continues. Tools change, workflows update and what you learned to deliver might not compete anymore, and you have to keep training and practicing. Every job you get will always be a competition with 200 other seniors and 1500 competent juniors. Gigs are inherently short-term, as teams break up after the project is done in many cases.
So think - the grinding you do to get the first job, just gets you that first job. Your ‘career’ is not guaranteed. Every single job after that will be just as up in the air, so keep grinding, for the rest of your life haha.
You do it because you enjoy it and can’t imagine anything else.
But the trap is you spend all these years looking to do something, and you now have an extremely specialized skill with no use in nearly any other industry other than entertainment art.
So, keep that in mind.
@@AndyWalsh the thing is they might be, but the odds at this point are so stacked against artists that you may well wish them to base their life on winning the lottery... it may happen and they may win big, but chances are they may just spend their entire life on scratch tickets...
Honestly, I only recommend going into the art field if you’re independent wealthy. Nobody should be taking out loans to go into any commercial art field right now. This is my second career so I’ve had a lot of flexibility but a lot of us saw the writing on the wall even a few years back. I started a mural business & have more work than I can even do- but I realize that’s also dependent on living in an urban area or a region with fairly wealthy people who love murals.
Well done on finding decent work though. It's a big gamble, but some people are just naturally meant to pursue the art field. I think many will fail due to lack of business skills.
3d artist? or environment artist? maybe its better to find job? in concept art 3d is like 90% now so maybe push this skill and pivot?
It's funny, you'd think that 3d production art is close, but it's as different as... I dunno, UI design is. As a 3d production artist, you need to have perfect and efficient edge flow. Something I, as an artist who's used 3d for 26 years now, absolutely suck at. You also need to know how to efficiently pack UVs, again, after 26 years in 3D I can barely unwrap something. Both of those sciences are a mystery to me.
@@AndyWalsh have you seen the Starfield sandwhich model 💀I'd say it's hilarious for a AAA to produce stuff like that
@@S3nCh4ntopology for static objetos doesnt matter, only if they are going to be animated. But yes, that sándwich was a shitshow.
My point is, there are people who say that "if the gaming industry is too hard to into, get into other industries". Why would I get into industries that has nothing to do with gaming? If working on games is what I want to do I should pursue that. How getting into animation, tv, movie industy would be fulfilling, if game making is what I want?. Usually you're happy when you know what you want and get it. Anything else would be unfulfilling and a waste of life.
I do understand you, i'm completely jobless i don't have other interests. From your profile i can't understand what you do but at this point the only way is to make our own game,to sell our own products. Traditional artists,musicians and indie developers have been doing this,i've been trying and it's really hard, sorry but it seems there's no other way at the moment.
There comes a point where making money actually matters. I'm not sure how old you are but once you live out and have to sustain yourself there's only so much you can take being unemployed/freelancing to make ends meet. I used to have a similar mindset.
@@pasust1688😂 💯 exactly. I see a lot of these comments & assume they’re independently wealthy, which is great I guess. In that situation perhaps they just keep applying over & over to the same game companies
Character concept art and splash illustration. Come hell or high water, I will make it happen. My own brand, business and the whole sort. I plan on going to study art in South Korea for that at some point. Art standards there are far more lucrative in my opinion. Even with all this doom and gloom hanging over the industry's head, I really don't care enough for it to actually stop me from pursuing it.
That's good. Aim towards independence (so do your social media and think outside the box!) and if jobs come along then fine. But think 'product'!
I really like your latest talks, very inspiring (the background music is too distracting though)
Keep it up man
Ah, bugger. I try to keep it as low as possible. It's just really dead if I just have silence. Thanks for watching! I thought they were depressing videos though, so glad to hear they're inspiring!
what about pursuing matte painting? Anyone know if the market is slightly different for this role? I hear some vfx roles like compositing are still in demand. (just considering to branch out to a slightly different avenue but similar field)
Matte painting could be an option. It's a weird discipline though because you literally can't define what it is because it can be as simple as a sky replacement and as complex and a set extension. I was very close to moving into this field (well, trying to pivot) but with the film industry also on its knees right now, it may only be a slightly better option. But maybe as a supplemental skill addition. Certainly being a good matte painter would improve the quality of your 2d art.
It's probably easier since I've cast a wide net in terms of job applications and landed one for matte painting. (maybe it's luck based idk) you could apply this skillset from polishing in-game assets to creating full key visuals but you do need some knowledge of 3D softwares. What I'm *assuming* is that you don't really need a lot of people to create concepts/ideas but assets and promotional materials/screens require way more manpower and time.
Mark Maggiori (western oil painter) is excellent at marketing his art
I think I follow that chap. Great work. What would you say stands out as why he's good at marketing? Is there anything compelling about his brand that makes us want to follow him?
@@AndyWalsh Well he used to be the frontman of a popoular band in France..so I think he is a natural 'showman' and good in front of the camera, and his work is excellent too, and he has a lot of free giveaways of prints of his work...
The more important question here. Is that a left handed Jem or is the image flipped?
aaah, nicely spotted! it's flipped :D
Yeah you have to be a some sort of polymath for the industry, to really be looked as their asset.
A couple of my trachers said I should get a following or a discernable art style and the companies will come to me instead. Seems like sound advice but I can only guess
interesting...a lot of art directors tell junior artists to create portfolios based on a singular original project. so you can definitely kill 2 birds with one stone regarding the process of creating a portfolio for work, while also creating something cool to get the attention of potential fans and clients.
RUclips and tik tok is killing movies. games are still made but how many artists are really needed out there? Its like pro sports. Theres millions of young athletes who want to go pro, but there's only a tiny handful of real art jobs. And it dosent even pay millions like pro sports. You will be lucky to make a single dollar let alone a living from art.
it's a piece of piss to make a tiny bit of money, if you're not lazy. Not 'lucky to make a single dollar' territory. But the thing is it can take years to get good, and you expect the pay to be worth it. So it's possible to make minimum wage, but who wants to grind for years and years to make minimum wage - that's the issue.
However, if you get really good, and the job market is sensible, you can earn as much as a doctor. Although I think they're trying to put an end to that.
the studios are killing movies
they keep making crap films!
Do not worry brothers.
There are enough furry OC feet pic commissions for all of us.
Having art as a job is not worth it. Unless you are self employed like the instagram artists or youtubers where you can set your own time and subject matter.
You don't want to be working on other people's boring, money grabbing, soulless games. You don't want to be working overtime in some studio with awful working conditions. Your job doesn't have the potential to scale, so the pay will forever be small. Just do it as a hobby. Post it online and if you are lucky, you will be one of those that can turn it profitable.
To some degree. In the games industry, if you get the right company, you can earn a decent living and many games companies have cool working conditions. And if before the great gaming collapse, if you freelanced for a solid year you could earn as much as a doctor. But those times may be over for 98% of us.
But it is much better to find success creating your own IP than working on someone else's.
I don't know what type of artist i definitely want to be, im still a beginner and i wonder if it even is worth it
Not sure if you watched the whole video but pay attention to the later part about being an independent artist.
I mean i would love to have multiple ways to be creative like animation and be a RUclipsr but knowing the amount of skill thinking recording and at the same time maybe commissions that would take it's kinda overwhelming
@@weronikasanecka1945 Yeah it is actually overwhelming. I work in the animation industry and have a stable 9-5, so I've essentially achieved my dreams when I was a student. However, even though I am grateful, I feel I haven't achieved much outside of this job. I have no following and no personal brand. Everything Andy said about independence is true. Dare I say, having an independent brand as an artist is the ultimate goal, even working in a studio can be ultimately unfulfilling.
All that said. YES it is still worth it, it won't be straight forward but if it's your calling, it's your calling, don't deny your spirit what it wants. If you can find a way to resonate with people through your personal work, you can forgo the studio job altogether and speedrun to the real end goal - you make what you want, directly to the people who want it.
2023 was my worth year, i was supose to have contra but still not.
One concept artist I've had the displeasure to work with was the most insufferable and self-centered person I ever met. I'm a bad person for being happy he's been laid off for AI but he deserved it.
Since all our jobs are being outsourced, maybe it's time to leave America for good too.
Not a bad idea. Particularly if MAGA get in. If you already work for someone like LUMA pictures, have them transfer you to their Melbourne office. I'll shout you your first beer.
@@robertdouble559 what MAGA has to do with entertainment concept art?
@@robertdouble559 TDR
@@robertdouble559 If MAGA doesn't get in, we can forget jobs period as the planet will be a ball of nuclear smoke. Still, there'd be a lot less job competition!
Not necessarily out of the US, but there are parts of the US that are super cheap to live. Look up Dave Rapoza. He moved to Colorado because it was a pretty location and dirt cheap. Stay out of the west coast and NY etc.
So the fact that I’m from a 3rd world country and make concept art, might get me hired because of varied spending/purchasing power parity?
Absolutely. If I lived in a 3rd world country, as long as I can still charge my day rate (which is coming into question these days, so maybe I couldn't, but if I could...) then I could live like a king on my typical 3-4 weeks of work per year.
@@AndyWalsh That's great to hear, although my concern is with the laws and regulations regarding paycheck withdrawals and taxes, (I'm from India btw)
Do you know any resources that talk about this?
These greedy founders, executives, moguls and tycoons of the large industries are not worth it.
inflation furry commisions it is then lol
so negative
Wow! So jaded... I usually like your content man but this is just too much focusing on the negative. The industry is changing, big studios will fall, new studios powered by humans with new visions will emerge. I liked the part on working a personal brand and growing that part also but hey it's a damn big industry and a huge world. Like any other industry its ups and downs... why do you round so much in being pesimistic about the whole thing? "oh we've seen better times..." come on man
Please tell me how much industry experience you actually have. This is not a slight dip in the industry. This is the wholesale slaughter of jobs simply to get rid of people. The amount of money Microsoft just invested in AI could have paid 96,000 artists a decent salary. And the industry for concept art was terrible before all this. As one guy commented: As an industry veteran, I just can't advise that people get into this career any more. It's just not responsible.
However, I am saying there's hope for indie games and indie art projects in this age of global outreach in a global market. But forget about concept art as a career path unless you don't mind being unemployed for at least half of the rest of your life.
@@AndyWalsh I'm a noob of course... but I have a different world view. I don't think it's ok to generalize and think that newcomers will have the same experience you did.
Again, it's about the focus, you seem very fixated on the macroeconomic aspect of this and how doomed everything is. Sorry I don't share that perspective.
Even if I'm naive I'll aim for the best and keep an open mind, a positive attitude and focus on the hopeful thoughts.
I wish some light comes into your professional life soon.
AI really ruined art fields, huh?
Not quite yet, no. But it likely will eventually. Some very large game companies have banned it though.
Corporate dirty tricks.
'Ain't capitalism great?
9:43
I cannot understand this
bcoz I have many film art books where the "art" IS BASIC!
Terrible even. I mean awful photo-bashing that you can see is rushed...
...etc...etc.
I think seniors do those in a rush sometimes. It’s not the rule.
Hello Coach I would love to discuss some aspect of your course with you, let us connect.
The main reason behind shit that's happening is spiking rise in interest rates in all major western economies to combat inflation. The reasons for inflation are COVID stimulus payments (money printer) and war in Ukraine and Israel that caused issues in logistic chains. Stuff getting more expensive, people (but not all!) had too much cash, cash devaluates, inflation.
Raising interest rates is the primary method that governments can use to combat inflation. I'm not going to cover all aspects how it's working, but basically it makes cash more expensive to borrow, but more profitable to keep in banks. So people with spare cash (investors) would rather keep their money in a bank earning safe 5% per year return rather than invest in risky projects (which are extremely common in entertainment industry). No cash from investors - no jobs, no one wants to work for free. When inflation will get under control and interest rates begin to fall, we will see more jobs coming as investors would need to invest their money somewhere if they don't want them to be eaten by inflation.
Anyway, my point is, the current situation is pure economics and little to do with AI and absolutely nothing with conspiracy theories like "evil corporations just want everyone to starve to get cheap labour". Yes, times are tough right now, but economy goes in cycles and after every recession there's an economic boom following. It WILL get better. It always was.
But of course people prefer to be doomers and spreading calls about "end of world, it's over".
You’re right but with respect to US artists specifically, the problem we’re facing (which is linked to inflation) is the huge value of the US dollar against foreign currency. What I get paid in 1 day as a NYC artist can feed & house a Brazilian artist for a month. That’s not an exaggeration - our average rent here is $4200 per month. So while many jobs it’s worthwhile having a local artist (especially for those of us who are senior/ mgmt/ client-facing level) the vast majority of art jobs can’t justify a 30x premium- especially in the internet age.