What Does Shaft Torque Actually Do?
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- Опубликовано: 4 окт 2024
- Testing two near identical shafts with two different torque ratings to determine what effect on ball flight can occur by isolating that variable.
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Filmed at: Tour Experience Golf
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TXG always comes in clutch with ideas and videos you’ve always wondered about, but no one else ever covers
This video is a perfect example of why TXG is the only place I look for equipment information. The transparency and lack of bias in your testing is absolutely invaluable. Thank you!
With so many of the other YT Golf channels turning out basically the same output, we need TXG to keep pushing the boundary of our knowledge.
WOW getting really close to the 100k Guys, I have a nice bottle chilling for the celebrations 👍🥂
Chin chin!
😊 so do I Bandit, so do I. What is your tipple of choice for the auspicious occasion?
@@rufussthoo4083 I reckon a double meths a tonic....
@@rufussthoo4083 I have a nice white Rioja chilling in the fridge, but my tipple of choice is Laphroaig. Although my doctor seems to be under the impression that I have stopped drinking completely, it would be remiss of me not to celebrate the Buoys great achievement
@@banditbaker1675 don't trust the medics Bandit. A lot of smoke and mirrors in medicine. Living well is the best revenge and the occasional Laphroaig should be an integral part...
A year ago I would have scoffed at the idea of spending 15 minutes learning a little about shaft torque. I am so much more informed about the game as a result of watching your vids. The imminent TXG subscriber breakthrough is very well deserved. Next year I'm replacing my irons, I've a feeling the fitter may get irritated by my questions/ challenges....
No one else can come up with ideas like this, talks about the "nuances" of shaft and still attract audience like TXG....Well done!
I love that you call em as you see em! No matter of your relationship with the company, you guys just tell the truth. Well done boys.
Appreciate you guys not editing out any shots. Always love to see on comparison videos like this if there are trends in misses
And that's why you guys are the best! I'll go out on a limb and say you've proven again and again that fittings are individualized and won't necessary work the same for everyone, that's why each of us needs our own fitting. Thanks again boys for the great stuff!
Would this test be more valid if Matt couldn't see the ball flight of each shot and subconsciously make adjustments?
love these videos, who knew a 15 minute video on shafts could be so interesting. thanks guys.
Fascinating- Love when you guys go down the rabbit hole! Great camera work and production once again as well!!
"Apologies if we lose some of you because we're getting into the nuances"... Pauses, refills coffee, and gets comfortable :D
Craig Nelson Agreed. This type of stuff got me here in the first place
Nuance is why my notification bell is on
Zach Baker the nuance-ification bell some might say 🛎
"More nuances!", I say. "More!", I tell you. 😂
I’m here for the nuances
I enjoy the way you present information as it's both informative and entertaining. Thanks!
This video is just ANOTHER reason why I subscribe, AND why Ian is the ONLY person I want to fit me for my next set!
The greater part of me that loves you guys is intrigued. The 10 Year old boy that heard the word shaft and stiffness, on the back of a tough working week and a very large gin...... well there is something on TXG for the both of us!
From 500 subs to nearly 100k. Man I feeling like a proud dad. Lol Go TXG go!!
Just 1000 odd more subs to go!!!
So keen to see how the 100k giveaway goes. Such a huge milestone, so stoked for you guys
truth > marketing..... and that's why we love TXG!!!!!
Love these types of videos where you really say it's more than one thing. I love the live videos but it drives me crazy when people ask what shaft will fix x problem.
Makes two of us!!
Fantastic to see this awesome channel gaining momentum guys, 100k not far away, great stuff!!! 🙌🏻👌🏻
Matt with the Tony Finau swing length today. Great video guys.
Excellent vid once again Gents. Keep up the great work!
Almost only 1k to go. Let's go!!
Inching closer to 100K!!! 👍
Its nuggets like this video that makes this channel what it is!!
You guys are on a tear with the uploads!
Matt’s swing has come a long ways!!! Wow. Much better now.
I have been thinking about getting new irons with graphite shafts, and I realize how many "identical" options are out there with different torques, I tried researching the ones that would match my steel shafts and realize that is nearly impossible without spending a few hours being properly fitted.
Thank you guys for providing a glimpse on the world of shaft torque.
I've been watching you guys for at least a year, and a subscription has been long overdue. I've been curious for a long time what shaft torque actually amounts to and why.
I'd love to see some more data and discussion about this sort of "nuance" aspects of shaft fitting.
You guys are in my top 3 YT golf content channels along with mike malaska and golf sidekick. Thanks for all the effort you put in and keep it coming!
100 000 subscribers exaclty in this moment, big congrats guys!
Great video on torque - I understand the concept but the results through testing are so true. Thanks again
100k subs at this very moment. Hooray and congrats to 100k subscribers guys! Keep up the never ending coolness whatever you guys do.
1st , TXG you already know it’s going to be good , another adventure down the shaft rabbit hole , defiantly makes a difference , I have many ,always trying something different and they all feel different. , and I’ve found shaft and head combinations can make a big difference , one shaft feels horrible in one head ,in another feels great . Possibly head weight . 100% you have got to try different shafts and head combos on a launch monitor and see what gives you the best numbers
Great experiment once again. For me, higher torque shafts seem to enhance the gear effect on my off-center hits. For someone like Matt who rarely misses the sweet spot, as shown here, it becomes more of the preference of feel and dispersion pattern.
You Guys have come so far since your very early collaboration with Mr Clements, well done and thank you for all the education you have imparted along the way!
Good stuff isn't it Bandit? I like Shaun as well. Do you look at Paul Wilsons stuff?
@@oldgold5848 No, I haven't come across Paul Wilson before I will check him out
@@banditbaker1675 he is very much a start the downswing with the legs sort of instructor. Now, I am not getting any younger and have always been a very armsy player which as the years go by tends to lead to distance drop off. I have a long way to go, but I try and just have a backswing thought of maintaining arm contact with my chest with a weak grip, and starting the downswing by transferring weight into my left foot. I have carried some standard loft 6 irons 180 yards recently which I have not done in years...if ever...
Sorry for the essay!
@@oldgold5848 a 180yard 6 iron deserves an essay, well done👍
@@banditbaker1675 yeah couldn't quite believe it. Most were about 165 carry but some really pure ones just flew!
New TXG video. *Grabs beer and sits down*
The master fitter teaching a master class 👏
Get home from work. Get settled wait for notification. Watch. Cheers boys⛳🏌️♂️🇦🇺🙌
Love the channel. Watch every video. Y’all keep up the good work. Would love to see a video on putter grips- specially different sizes, and whether those actually influence speed or face control.
So true....get a professional fitting!! Well done guys!
Once you guys hit that 100k mark I know you'll get to 250k in no time!
It's been fascinating to watch Matt go from openly saying he's not somebody who can identify shaft dynamics in the swing to now being able to confidently say "Yeah, I feel that movement low in the shaft." It's somehow reassuring to know that it can be learned like that.
I've always used torque figure as a guide for shortlisting prospective shafts based on feel, personal preference being a dislike for low torque.
Very serious job as usual! By watching your vids I might leave my current occupation to switch as a club fitter!😂 I learn so much from you… You made a very good test of Epon af 506 a few time ago. Would like so much to watch a test of the Protoconcept CO1 d driver!! Go on this way! Thanks .
Loving the Channel. Biggest problem I have have is that there is no fitters that I know in my country who have such a wide range of shafts to test. Most pro shops or retail outlets have 3 or 4 OEM shafts for each driver. Would be great to get a fitting the way u guys do it.
Myself and a couple guys were doing a little testing on the course and we came to the conclusion for us the higher torque shafts (softer feeling) shafts were harder to draw verse the lower torque (firmer feeling) shafts. Which was different than we had been told or thought.
I feel like often times you guys try and shape your results to match the manufacturers claim. This video goes a long way for me because you called a spade a spade. And interestingly, Matty's comments about feel are 100% dead on. I once interviewed Jamie Pipes when he was with UST about Torque values. He said that 90% of the function of torque is FEEL and contrary to popular belief that Flex code is attributable to feel, it is actually Torque that the golfer feels (especially at impact). This was the impetus for their Tour SPX VTS lineup that had a million skews because they offered every weight and flex in 3 different Torques.
In summary - Outstanding video, gents.
Would love to have a conversation with you guys on this over a pint. I think gear effect is going to be a big factor, also level of acceleration or deceleration into impact. I think you are spot on that every swing will interact differently but I also think there’s not enough attention on the importance of torque. I went to a low torque shaft and my toe hits are almost completely without penalty. Lower torque shafts (3.0 and less) are mysterious and I think a lot of people might benefit from these shafts but never get fit into them
👏 welcome back to the channel
👏🏻
With these types of videos, I personally would really appreciate an explanation of what torque is and why it's a spec manufacturer's use at the beginning of the video. Maybe some sort of visual to help us understand exactly what torque is in relation to a shaft. Then, I'm watching Matty hit drives for 10 minutes and not truly understanding what is going on between the two shafts, so it doesn't really connect me to the video in any way because I still don't have any clue what torque is. Some of the comments are people saying they know what torque is from this vid, but they just think that low means left and high means right = torque.
I always thought of torque in wood shafts having more to do with feel, which is completely subjective. I am very happy you have tested it out bcs I suggested wondered if their was more to it if they are puting it in the damn specs right next to flex and grams
Ian, good video thanks. Now can you do one with semi identical(butt/mid sections) shafts but with different tip firmness, soft tip section/firm tip section? And lets see how the dispersion is.
I have an F8 with the Aldila 2KNV blue in the 60 Stiff, I found that the face would twist during the downswing and result in a hook or a big push fade. Today I bought a Taylormade SIM with a HZRDUS Smoke Green 70g Stiff which is a lower torque shaft by 1.4 degrees. Whether that has made a difference, it's hard to tell. But I hit in way better and more consistently, my bad strikes were more forgiving with the SIM and I could visibly see the ball flight was much flatter and had less backspin. Excited to get out on the course and try it, but with how good i hit it today I'm hoping for the same.
My torque window for driver is 3.1 to 3.6. Any flex in this window works pretty well.
Perfect window
Hey TXG, I’m a new subscriber and love the videos as I’ve gained a lot of knowledge that has helped me take strokes off my game in just the 6 months since tuning into the channel! Wanted to know if you could give some advise on what “puring” of a wood shaft or iron shaft can be helpful for? Recently went through a fitting and was told about this concept, but wondering why it’s beneficial if the irons used in the fitting aren’t “pured”. Thank you and always looking forward to the new videos!
Hi guys.
What were the Torque figures for the 2 shafts, ie. was it a 2.9 vs 4.5?
Thanks for the great content. Stay safe.
Yeah it would have been nice if they mentioned this. I was disappointed.
TXG uploads video
Me: just gonna like this now and watch it later when i have time
@Sumner Foreskinsuckingstone if its Ian doing the talking, id have to hear him out. That Scottish accent can make anything appealing
1,100 subscribers. Let’s go boys.
Are you guys able to test SST pured shafts vs the same shaft that hasn't been pured? I think this would be a great thing for those getting fit to decide if it's worth the extra cost. Would be great to see how effective it is with driver, long irons, and short irons.
I believe this correlates with point of the swing ''impact'' which I don't think most people think about but may be one of the most important part of the swing. If you can engineer it efficiently ( savvy with biomechanics of the customer) It can make impact easier without changing ball flight too much.
Sounds advice getting fit is so important.
The higher TQ shaft also dropped the toe versus the lower TQ shaft - so that's another big factor. In my experience, and I'm very sensitive to TQ with my delivery, there's just more left & right variability - if you go at it too quickly without staying down, the face can be open and Right, stay in it and you get that sweet perfect draw, stay in it hard and really go at it and it can turn over more. So I would agree in principle with what they've said, but once you leave it open with a higher TQ shaft, you then immediately stay in it longer and you change your delivery the next shot.
so close to 100k!
Hey guys curious to know if you could do a comparison of shafts setup normally, and then pured - as in SST pure. Would be really curious to see the results and I feel like you would be able to go into the nuances of it all, and whether it’d be worth it for a plus 1 golfer. :)
I feel i need to make a trip to TXG
I’m curious if the greatest potential for correcting dispersion, trajectory and curvature is found in driver fittings. My feeling is that irons with their shorter shafts, club/ turf contact and other variables, present you guys with different problems to solve. Years ago at a golf school a teacher told me that when you don’t drive the ball well you’ve lost the best opportunity to control the outcome of your shot. When you have the right club in your hands, it’s a nice thought.
An important concept to consider would be keeping a similar torque through-out the selection of metals in the bag..
I noticed this when I had a "Mitsubishi Tensai orange" on the driver, and a "hazardous smoke black" on my 3 wood... opposite spectrums in terms of torque, both stiff shafts. Completely different load times which can throw off tempo dramatically..
Since that realization I've settled with the fujikura ventus blue in the 3 wood and 5 wood. The torque on that is extremely similar to my driver shaft which is also fujikura in the pro 2.0 - 6S .
I can't say that either low or high torque is better than one or the other but from a personal preference I tend enjoy a faster load time which is how I would explain the low torque. Someone with a very deliberate swing style might enjoy those loads too build further in the take away.
Point being keep the torque similar, if not the same, with club selections.
I would also say the same thing for weight and flex from top to bottom with the irons.
Thanks for reading. Hope it sheds light on what I've discovered torque to feel like.
@7:18 sneaky sneaky!
Don’t get Mark Crossfield going he’s got enough people slating him for his attack on Taylormade driver’s 😂
MrTkeddo lol I love Mark but he's so obsessed with taylormade hate its crazy.
I don't even play golf....but I still find stuff like this interesting. Nothing like some data to cut through the marketing.
Yeah, yeah go and get fit…the problem is there aren’t many people who understand all the variables like Ian. My wife said I can come visit you guys when I turn 40!
Great content guys! You break clubs down like no other! How drastic does a swing change effect a fitting. If you get fit one day and then make a swing change is the fit essentially a waste for the newer swing?
What isn't mentioned here is that torque has a positive and negative effect depending on delivery vs flex. Someone who delivers the shaft early may get the shaft to begin to positively (closing face) torque and vice versa with someone who has a later release may till have negative (face holding slightly more open) or neutral torque at impact.....which is why you need a fitter like Ian who understands the relationship between bend profile, flex and torque to match the players swing characteristics, to accentuate the good points of the players swing and limit the bad side of their swing!! Love fitting, sometimes its more fun than the game itself!!
99k.... so close gentleman. I can’t wait for the 1 million countdown. Onward we go!
Another great video concept. I am loving the new camera too.
Does the fitting shop at TXG have the abilty to measure shaft toque? If so check to see if it is the twisting left the same as it is twisting right.
I have never seen a toque measurement tested for a left hand golfer. I did some research into this about 10 years ago and found almost nothing.
From my experience, all of the older shafts will twist more in one direction than the other, usually to the left for low torque shafts.
Im the same way, have a HZRDUS blk 6.5 75g with low torque. Higher torque feel soft to me and pull hook to much. I prefer the baby fade with stiffer feeling shaft.
My understanding is that high torque would give you more head deflection on off center hits than low torque. Meaning high torque on the same strike pattern would give you a wider dispersion than low torque.
Always found for myself and fitting others that softer tends to leave out right and stiffer has more integrity through impact and more left (also due to tending to be lower spinning therefore if too stiff a bit ducky in flight).
The common wisdom was always opposite to that which never made sense to me.
Bump this comment up to the top. 100% agree. In regards to myself I prefer a stiffer shaft bc all my drives would traditionally tail off to the right so I would have to aim far left. I finally got fitted last fall for the F9 Cobra. All my drives are going where I want them too. When they do tail off to the right its more of an exaggerated push fade. Hands were just lazy through impact. Easy correction. I'm willing to lose swing speed if it allows me to have accuracy off the tee and hit fairways more consistently.
Yes... stiffer shafts will be lower torque and higher torque will be less stiff. This is also the results that were found.
@@Dead_Goat not necessarily but the general theme is as such.
"Feeling a little bit chunkie" 😂😂
Great content guys
Is torque measurement to me signified how stout the shaft might feel relative to the rated stiffness. Something bloke Accra tzxtreme feels pretty smooth despite being fairly stiff. I never really thought it influenced flight on its own unless that feel made me change delivery.
Great stuff
Great info
Getting fit is the key here. I don’t know how much I wasted before just buying off the shelf store. 20 years ago got fit for Ping that I barely replaced last Xmas with Mizuno.i see it every weekend guys with new drivers or iron that a buddy recommended, not fitted, and are all over the place frustrated.
Just noticed this. If you think about it you can actually tell which shaft (1 or 2) he was still hitting by looking at the color of the ball flight tracer on the sim. But good video though. Love this channel. Lets get to 100k subs!
"hey what club are you hitting?"
"oh you know, dirtydog."
"...what..."
99k subscribers!
huge kudos to ian here for pointing out that marketing isn't universal, and that there is no universal solution to what you're trying to fix.
The high torque shaft should twist open as you load the shaft. After the low point of your swing, does the head "snap shut" as you hit up on the ball? That could explain the draw.
Guys, QUESTION......is Puring of shafts “a thing”? (As in SST puring) thanks in advance. 🤘🏻
Was just about to ask what Ian and Matt think of SST Puring until I saw your comment. Would love to hear your opinion @TXG Tour Experience Golf.
Great idea 💡 hope they catch this
TXG. thanks for this video. Can you help me out with shallow my swing and would Yoga help my Back turn More? Thanks Greg of Ohio.
I wonder how much CG location of the driver plays into it as well.
Always plays a part.
Well done on 100k
Very interesting findings by TFT. I need to test this. I play an M4 with stock shaft. I measured the same shaft raw and found 6.5d of torque. I love the driver but it definitely fades. I also love the fit of the shaft, Atmos 5R made for TM. So to test this I will have to try a 55 gram counter balanced shaft, stiff butt R flex, but lower torque. Suggestion for anything somewhat affordable and available to all?
We never had this problem with steel shafts years ago
Back in the day, I used torque figures to identify what might be reasonable. But after some mucking about I learnt that it’s not the be all or end all. I would love to see if you change head weight you can change the behaviour.. basically what is the point of putting the same old shaft into every new head you buy because you just like this shaft?
Finally a golf channel for golf Geeks.
Ian you mentioned getting fit as always. What would be your deteriming factors for selecting a fitter? Seen some local results of my friends clubs and to me it seemed like a $ decision by the fitter. Your thoughts.
Most cheap fittings at local places will entirely be just them tossing the normal junk at you to make a dime without caring about you. Proper fittings are expensive.
Good info!
I know there are a lot of variables but I have noticed that the driver shafts I hit best and have liked are all 2.9-2.7 torque. Anything over 3.2 and I can pretty much guarantee I’ll struggle with them.
next video is what does matts torque actually do? answer make the ball go forever.