Sanwa JLF vs Hori Hayabusa vs Seimitsu LS-32 : Joystick Centering and Wobble
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 4 июл 2024
- I mounted these all to the same panel to do some comparison testing. I also slow down time to show you how they return to neutral and in some cases actuate the opposite direction.
Игры
Great video this is exactly what I was looking for at 1am lol.
I'm making my own arcade stick so all I've been doing is watching comparison videos for different sticks, buttons and switches.
3:30am for me
It's actually 1 am for me holy shit lol
@@3amcucumbertech Same
3:08am haha
Awesome video man! Really gave me some insights.
@Fundando. Great video. If you use youtubes .25 speed setting along with your slow motion video you can really see some difference. The major flaw I see is the dust cover lifts up. That's a deal breaker on that joystick.
The most scientific joystick test on the internet! Make more!
No, it's far from scientific.
Excellent analysis
I have an 8 way gate for my Hayabusa. I did find the stock spring way too loose. Putting in the 2lb made it better.
I switched over to a hitbox style on my main stick. I adjusted to it very quickly.
hayabusa has too large backlash
I love my JLF! I use a 1/2 Ibs. spring and oversized actuator. The sensitivity helps me with reactionary play and I tend to ride the gate less with lighter spring. I tried an optical PCB and the lack of clicks just feels to weird!!
My issue with the stock Sanwa JLF lever is not the control aspect of it in general terms. I don't ride or grind the gate or anything if that's what you are referencing. Doing Fireballs and Dp motions basic/intermediate combos isn't my dilemma. What I am talking about is when it comes to doing high execution combos that have multiple 1-frame links, require nearly instant dashes/running and also need extremely fast neutral/throw/centering its just feels impossible. I have a Seimitsu LS-40 on the way and also a octo plate with a 1mm oversized actuator for the JLF coming as well. I am forced to switch the stock square restrictor gate that comes with the JLF for the octo gate because the oversized actuator does not work properly with the default square gate. My issue basically with stock JLF is the input quickness is far too slow to be able to do the Hardest of Hard combos their are (talking about older games from the harder execution era). Like Evil Ryu 1 frame link combos in SF4 for example. Can do them on D-pad Dual Shock by the way. SFV and modern fighting games are easy in general (does not matter the control device really) and pretty much require juggle timing mostly not lighting fast inputs with extremely small link combo windows if that makes sense.
Magnifica prueba. Se ve claramente que el hayabusa rebota demasiado y dara problemas. El JLF tiene un recorrido mas corto que el LS3 por lo que para juegos como street fighter seria mas adecuado. En cambio el seitmisu iria mejor para los shoot èm up porque en estos juegos no necesitamos que que el recorrido sea muy corto, si no que necesitamos que la palanca tire los menos posible para estar en la misma posicion mas rato. En una prueba en retromadrid 2018 pude probar dos mandos con estas palancas, y con el sanwa jugaba mejor a juegos de lucha tipo street fighter, pero con el LS-32 jugaba mejor a los shoot em up.
Pero la JLF no marca bien las vueltas, ya le cambié el actuador y sigue fallando, que recomiendas?
@@evilk99 Idk if you can translate this in your app too, but maybe try out a few different gates. There's also mod kits you can buy with different grommets for things like return to center. Basically to make jlf's and hayabusa's mimic other stick designs
awesome video it helped me a lot...
would have loved to see u use a strain or forever sensor to take precise measurement
Nice comparison mate, would love to see fanta joysticks
Hoping to have those in my inventory at some point.
You can get less springing on the centering on the hayabusa lever with a 1mm oversized actuator. The actuator has to be grinded down a bit to fit in Hori's square gate but it solves the issue and honestly rides smoother than the stock actuator
bro where and wich actuator can i buy
@@SpeerKING Kowal oversized actuator, but tbh since this comment I've went back to a stock Hayabusa and just control the stick better with my fingers to prevent wobbling.
Would highly recommend getting some stick grease and applying it though. The Hayabusa felt so much smoother after that.
Yea bro i am thinling about a 2lb spring and still try a oversize actuator just for trying, because i wana try to play with less deathzone
@@SpeerKING Yeah, go for it. Hayabusa is a super solid base for those mods
This might not exactly directly related to the topic here. Is it okay to mount your stick with 2 bolts like that for playing?
Dude. I fucking love you. Thank you so much!
The ls-32 is such a fucking workhorse.
Doc Awful for real, I've been on the fence for a while to make the jump from sanwa to seimitsu, but this video just sealed the deal, I'll be swapping all of the sanwa components of my working Omni stick for seimitsu parts.
Nice upload.
thanks!
Like I said in my video, the hayabusa stick sucks. It's so wobbly when going back to neutral. Even though you'd more than likely be holding the stick at all times, but if you tried to grab it from a certain direction while it's wobbling, it could throw off your motion.
Not a fan of it myself
Helgen X hey dude, what's is your opinion for the JLF-YP-8Y Sanwa? Thanks
It's a classic stick for Japanese cabs and is usually included with most joysticks released these days. It has a very long throw but not as much as a standard US Happ type stick. Most likely the entry level up to pro level stick most use. A good purchase. You can adjust spring to the level of "weight" you want the throw to feel like, but I'd say don't start doing that till you actually know what you're doing.
My Hori is fine, must just be you.
With a higher tension spring will eliminate the loose fill.
Genius
Hello, it is about the Joystick Seimitsu LS-32. It works
great but I have noticed that in the middle/center position there is
slack/looseness. I mean that the sitck moves without any effort just
touching it.
It does not affect the performance but I want to know if it is normal in
these model of joystick or it is something that can be fixed.
Thanks in advanced
Sorry for my english (I'm spanish)
eso es normal pablo
Thing is for me is that, I know people are comparing different sticks from stock, but you can change the springs, actuators, shaft length, microswitches, so I kind of want to know what differences go beyond those variables. For example I've got Jlf with, kowal actuator, 3lb spring from paradise aecade.
If I put a short shaft on that, would it really feel that different from an LS32 for example?
it prob would be kinda uncomfy since it’s shorter and that would mean depending on ur hand size ur fingers would be kinda crushed together
@@omegawaffles7348 yeah 3lb spring was stupid! For me at least, I've gone back to stock jlf stock. Stock Ls - 40, stock ls-32 as I have an actual astro city cab now think it's best but each to their own.
This is strange. I have never experienced opposite direction input by releasing my hayabusa stick in my Hori Rap 4. I just tested it and was unable to make it go opposite direction even with effort. I used input display in tekken 7 so there is no doubt my stick doesnt have this problem.
i get it all the time and just switched it to sanwa jlf. hori rap 4 too
@@user-yj5zw4gb8s I have the Hori Alpha now and still no problem with opposite direction on releasing the lever. Maybe its something to do with technique..
I have a Hori ex-se wich comes with a seimitsu ls-32, but mine has larger stick above surface. I don't know why. Am I wrong?
Subarashii!
is there a fix for rap V hayabusa silent joystick recentering? or do I have to replace them with sanwa?
heavier spring works somewhat. I prefer sanwa or seimitsu sticks
how thick the panel should be to use any of this? can i use wood what it a good thickness?
May i know where to get those led?
Hi does the ls-32 have the same bolt up dimension
I've always used a jlf, ever since 3rd strike. However, to this day I still don't feel 100% comfortable on it. I've tried heavier springs, bigger actuators, but I just can't quite find the short throw I'm looking for. That seimetsu looks like it's shorter than the rest, however I heard you mention that seimetsu doesn't have an octagonal gate? Ugh that sucks. I just don't have enough knowledge of these different sticks to make a choice on my next lever purchase. I'm looking for a very short throw, not necessarily more spring pressure, just less distance. The shorter seimetsu stick also looks like something I'd be interested in. Any advice?
LS-62 by seimitsu is my personal favorite. nice and short and octagonal gate options.
@@Fundando thanks dude, turns out that's exactly what I ordered yesterday! Ha
I wonder if a thicker actuator would greatly influence this. I'm going to mod the JLF I have with a 2lb spring, but I'm also getting a thicker actuator - just not sure if I'm going to be installing that quite yet, just wanted to have the option.
My issue with the stock Sanwa JLF lever is not the control aspect of it in general terms. I don't ride or grind the gate or anything if that's what you are referencing. Doing Fireballs and Dp motions basic/intermediate combos isn't my dilemma. What I am talking about is when it comes to doing high execution combos that have multiple 1-frame links, require nearly instant dashes/running and also need extremely fast neutral/throw/centering its just feels impossible. I have a Seimitsu LS-40 on the way and also a octo plate with a 1mm oversized actuator for the JLF coming as well. I am forced to switch the stock square restrictor gate that comes with the JLF for the octo gate because the oversized actuator does not work properly with the default square gate. My issue basically with stock JLF is the input quickness is far too slow to be able to do the Hardest of Hard combos their are (talking about older games from the harder execution era). Like Evil Ryu 1 frame link combos in SF4 for example. Can do them on D-pad Dual Shock by the way. SFV and modern fighting games are easy in general (does not matter the control device really) and pretty much require juggle timing mostly not lighting fast inputs with extremely small link combo windows if that makes sense.
You will need to switch the Square gate for a Octo gate if you are going to add the Kowal 1mm oversized actuator. Apparently the oversized actuator does not work properly with the default square gate in the JLF. It gets stuck in the corners from what I have read on forums and what not.
Tnx dude
👍🏻👍🏻
I just have a question about my Hori Arcade stick. Its the Ps4 Hori RAP4 Kai. Price wise it works. But the Hayabusa stick is not my cup o tea. So I ordered a Sanwa JLF and I'm wondering if it will plug into the RAP4 from me?
yes a sanwa will fit
Welp, that's it. Looks like the Hayabusa lever is beyond redemption. I did want to keep my HRAP V Hayabusa completely stock, but with this video out, I have no problem switching back to the Sanwa JLF.
Come to think of it, I should've ditched the Hayabusa much sooner when I started doing small pounces in Tekken instead of "while standing" attacks. (Those are moves that have you fully crouching, and then returning to neutral for you non-Tekken players.)
I actually had my Hayabusa lever customized for about two minutes with those aluminum FA Nippon ball tops, shafts, and dustwashers that Focus Attack sells. But I was noticing a bit more deflection with them, so I made the Hayabusa stock again and figured I could work around the opposite direction hitting. But just now I tested those same aluminum products on the JLF and it added deflection there too (I test in the PS4 notifications menu), so those aluminum products are out too. I'm back to using no shaft and the original red-orange-ish balltop that came with my HRAP3. Plus the colors match so I'm happy about that.
best stick if you play virtua fighter 5
Thinking about it, "while rising" does seem like the better term (Tekken 7 uses it in its in-game move lists), but what're ya gonna do. :/
Maybe we should've all just adopted that NumPad notation like the Soul Calibur community...
Justin Sison I used to hate the hayabusa stick until I put a 2lb spring in it. Just that alone changed everything for me.
"While Standing" makes zero sense and conflicts with notation within the game. The command list has said "While Rising" since Tekken 2. TZ uses "While Standing" because they chose to use "WR" for "While Running" which is retarded because they could have just called it "Running" or just "R". Zero sense and zero foresight. It's obnoxious as hell but since TZ is so big, everyone uses their stupid terminology.
I know its an old video, but how did you setup the light for the levers?
I just wired each joystick so that engaging it would complete the circuit for the lights.
i had so switch my hayabusa stick for a sanwa stick since yeah the recoil was too much for me and i’m always mashing my stick against the gate. it’s perfect for me tho
Can you please post which led's you used, model number etc, and where you bought them?
I just picked up an led wire with battery pack already pre-assembled and bypassed the on off switch.
the hori rebounds much quicker. only thing is the actual joystick is too short.
Which one do you recommend? I have never tried a sanwa joystick but I do have the hori hayabusa joystick.
JLF with octagon gate is great and you can't go wrong. Depending on personal preference I would add a heavier spring as well.
I have a JLF (Mad Catz TE) and in the street fighter v menu if I hold the joystick up let go the selection goes down right at the last moment which makes me think it actuates the opposite side, but in your video it looks like this doesn't happen...
it is still possible you might be getting the opposite input. you might want to replace or try a slightly stiffer spring.
can the hayabusa's hitting opposite direction be fixed with a stiffer spring?
If you watch the video you see me testing with a stiffer spring. Any stiffer than that it gets too uncomfortable to play.
With the stock spring i don't get any opposite inputs, idk if it was mounted wrong or what the issue was
I was wondering which might have the shortest activation distance? these look pretty similar but I find my sanwa to be too much
get an oversized actuator
Good comparison. But wasn't it easier to use training mode in some game to show the inputs?
not really as I would've had to wire a joystick to a pcb for each.
Fundando, this is true. Didn't think about this.
would a 4lb spring help the hayabusa from this problem?
it definitely could, but I havent tried it myself
I have the Seimitsu LS-56. It's a bit too stiff, how do I make it a little bit looser to the level of a Seimitsu LS-32?
It's probably just the string. Buy a weaker one.
@Stefano Pavone I don't think I will be using Seimitsu joysticks. I just used the Hayabusa joystick and a tighter spring.
My Hori is a lot tighter than that with a lot less distance between the shaft and the switches.
tutorial for putting sanwa octogonal gate on hory hayabusa?
Basically you just take the stock gate off and use a drill to make holes where the screw holes are. It is not the most ideal solution.
Use this instead and use the octoganal gate insert.
paradisearcadeshop.com/gates/1798-hayabusa-universal-gate-plate-paradise-hugs.html
Would anybody know if the original wiring harness on a Hori RAP Kai Hayabusa joystick is compatible with a Sanwa JLF, like would it be a simple drop-in replacement on a Hori RAP Kai?
Yes. They use the same 5 pin connector.
Thanks for the video and i have some questions for you: Do you recommended men buy the hayabusa joystick over sanwa and seimitsu? If I buy Hayabusa joystick recommend me buying octupus octagonal restrictor hayabusa, kowal 1 mm actuator and 2 lb tension spring? im interested in a buy Hayabusa joystick but i want to haver better performance whit that joystick.
+UKONOU DARTHLORD It all depends on personal preference, but currently I do not think the Hayabusa is worth the extra $10 price premium over its competition. If you are looking for something with short throw, stiffer spring and Octagonal gate I recommend the Seimitsu LS-56-01 and buying the official octagonal gate for it or a JLF with heavier spring and 1mm oversized delrin actuator.
Also, I personally own the kowal oversized actuator and octogonal gate. The Kowal actuator is prone to failure and will create plastic "dust" in your joystick from normal use. The gate feels flimsy and I will wait for a better solution.
@@Fundando How does the oversized actuator leave dust behind when it is made of Nylon? I have tried to dig up as much info about the Kowal oversized actuator and you are the ONLY person I have found on the entire internet that has made such a comment. I am not doubting you, I am just wondering why literally no one else have mentioned this "plastic dust" I just ordered a Kowal, a Octo plate, for the JLF and am eager to install them. I am never playing or touching a stock JLF lever ever ever again. It is much to slow with its throw range to perform extremely fast High execution combos from my testing so far. In my opinion and experience I would much rather use a normal D-pad controller than a stock JLF lever. I cleared SF4 trials with all characters with a regular Sony Pad Controller and would not have a snowballs chance in hell in achieving this accomplishment with a Stock JLF. No way not in this lifetime LMAO
Spring strength is specific to distance of throw between stick contact and switch activation.
I prefer a more light spring with sensitive switch activation.
The Egde is a perfect stick for my input style.
I'm wondering why the seimitsu is shortter than the others? I thought they were all the same size.
there are a variety of shaft sizes among different sticks
probably a dumb question, but what mounting plate are you using for the seimitsu?
It's an SE plate (straight plate) and the plexi is too thick to have the LS-32 at the right height. Most arcade cabinets in Japan came stock with Sanwa mounts but almost all manufacturers had an option for a panel with a Seimitsu mount.
All cabinets that had the Seimitsu option used the LS-32 with an SS plate. The Seimitsu mount had wider mounting points so that the curved SS plate could touch the panel where the joystick was and could be screwed in at the bended ends.
Mostly only cabinets that couldn't fit the LS-32 used the compact LS-33 (now evolved to LS-55,56,58,62 but all still use the LS-33 PCB)
And 99% of arcade sticks now come with a Sanwa/Hori mount and Seimitsu sticks are then too low on the stick. It depends though if you prefer a really low stick.
But to install Seimitsu sticks properly:
The compact stick SS plate fits at least Hori mounting plates at two points at the center but since it doesn't have theads you just have to buy a screws+nuts
To install LS-32 is trickier since you have to either make a wider mount to fit the SS plate or delete the current mounts and screw the SE plate directly on the panel.
@@epicon6 appreciate the knowledge drop there 🕹 👍🏻
Man, my RAP4 Kai Hayabusa with stock spring does not get any opposite direction input. That's weird.
i know i'm almost a year late but he did mention he fitted them with the same spring, aka not stock spring
My RAP V Doesn't hit opposites either... Who would even let go of the stick in a fighting game anyways? Lol
its very important in tekken
Also for 3rd strike, red parrying.
I use RAPV. It does.
Technically, the term for hitting opposite directions is "deflection". That said, great video.
+D3Vlicious Thank you. I will keep that in mind for follow ups.
I would say the short one is fastest
As a Hayabusa user, this stick is painful to use 🙃
is korean better than sanwa? for kof?
My hori stick is super loose so I am probably going to buy a semitsu or sanwa. Now just to pick which.
my new favorite is Seimitsu LS-56. Really tight and responsive.
Fundando thanks, I'll look into that one!
trickyhero I am loving my seimitsu ls-56-01 with a octogate. It felt weird with a squaregate because I kept jumping by accident.
If you stretch the spring you will make it firmer
My Hori is nice and tight, you must have something wrong.
Hmm my 2lb spring in my Hayabusa does not have near as much wiggle. I am not seeing any extra input detection on my stick either. Even with an oversized actuator installed. Maybe because I have a lighter weight Bat Top installed on it? Balltop may be causing more of an imbalance? Just a thought.
why no crown or fanta stick.
Pete HrapStick Seems most mass produced sticks aren't deep enough for Korean style levels without modifying.
Because everyone already knows Fanta sticks are Fantastick 👌
do you recommend stock sanwa over stock hayabusa?
Sanwa JLF is the king
This video has some ASMR qualities to it
don't go and get me demonitized lol
Leave your knob alone...
I bought a cheap 3 dollar joystick and it works great.
Did you buyed cheap buttons to?I'm looking forward to make one
Noobstars21 yes buy the cheap stuff no need to buy some expensive buttons or joysticks.
Whatever suits you. The only advantage of buying premium parts (as with any other premium item) is that it will last longer while keeping the quality. But if you dont play that many fighting games then any stick will do fine.
The stick hitting the right said when released doesnt effect your gameplay because at least in tekken you never release the joy stick.
side
This is true in most cases. When playing I did find the Hori stick to feel a little mushier though.
what amean musher?
Im getting the real arcade pro kai to but i dont care what it feels like because this is my first decent arcade stick you just have to get use to it
It is a solid piece of equipment. It is also easy enough to change out parts if you ever need a different feel.
Anyone have tried 3lb spring on Sanwa?
I hate my Hayabusa... Replaced the spring, the top, the shaft, and it still feels sloppy. Hopefully the ls-32 feels more precise when it arrives.
my favorite seimitsu is ls-62 for and even tighter feel
How about the knew Seimitsu LS 62 :) it
Combines the pros of the LS 32 & LS 56 basically a Hybrid one :)
Elias Martínez I personally love the ls62 and it might be my favorite. Little to no deflection.
@@Fundando I haven't tried yet but I read everything about it, I will have the LS-62 within a few days.
I recommend a Seimitsu LS-40. It has the same high level quality of the LS-32 but returns exactly to the middle, has a short throw (not too short) has a taller shaft than LS-32, fixes the LS-32 pivot popping issues because it has a better pivot and the microswitches are lower on the body, has the same sping as on the LS-32 but is fitted tighter so it feels a bit stiffer. And had the best (least) dead zone on the pivot.
The LS-32 is mounted wrong. It should be mounted with an S plate with no space between the LS-32 and the top panel.
+D3Vlicious Please help me understand. The LS-32 is mounted on a flat plate with no space between the top panel. If I mounted it on an s plate I do not see how that would change the performance.
He didn't say it it would change performance, it's still mounted incorrectly though. Needs an S plate obviously, they should be the same height as JLF.
LS-32 and LS-40 are mounted flush with the panel. The JLF and the LS-56 should have about 5mm between the panel and the mount.
Sanwa JLF with a 4lb spring, 8 way gate. Theres no return :-)
I can't argue there
So now i can compare Hayabusa and LS 40 myself. They literalky are not diffirent when you play each. The only diffirence: LS40 has more resistance to pivoting and dampens the oscillations. I ve been missing my inputs with LS 40 because it requires more force to move. Seimitsu feels slower.
My conclusion is that all japanese sticks are just the very same thing for the most part.
Thx, tldr would be nice for us with limited attention and time. ;)
hayabusa stick is great for virtual fighter 5 although the original sega cabinets used seimitsus for VF ...sanwa is great for street fighter and u've mounted the seimitsu incorrectly. to fix the issue of opposite inputs.... don't let go of joystick. that's like your character.... even if you just want him idle and standing there doing nothing you should be prepared at all times to make movements so don't let go of joystick and in street fighter especially if you're not moving around you're usually blocking hence your not lettin go of joystick. As for getting into neutral ... a faster stick is better so hayabusa wins. haven't tested it out for tekken 7 yet. stock square gates are good if you can learn not to ride the gate.
witch one should I use for my rap4 kai only play The king of fighters 96 99 2000 xlll xlv n mortal Kombat 9 n X ?
It is all personal preference. My favorite is the Seimitsu LS-56 with an octogonal gate.
Enable subtitles.
"Today we're gonna be doing a coparison between the Hori Hayabusa, San Juan jlf ..." HAHHAAH
Hi Bro, please help me to choose the best joystick for best performance in games like Street Fighter, KOF, etc., ¿which currently recommend me and the gate? please, thanks.-
LS-40-01 from Seimitsu, short throw, lower dead zone!
Thank you for helping Bro, LS-40-01 is better than ls-56?
_ Ryu - PoP _ That depends! LS-56 is stiffer, both had short travel, lower engage, less dead zone etc... both sticks are great. You had the LS-58, it´s a LS-56 with a softer spring and more options for shaft´s colors.The LS-40 is the lever from Neo Geo cabinets, then you have the LS-32 which remeber the Sanwa JLF. Seimitsu has so much options.
Well that's bollox, my Hori doesn't have that issue.
I did change the shaft to a Phreak Mods quick release handle but I doubt that changed anything.
Korean bats or gfy
hahahaha
Round bat tops are american, not korean
my jlf hits opposite directions all the time maybe I'm just a gorilla
But why would you just let the stick return by itself? Just move the damn thing, it's way faster.
Sanwa or nothing. The rest is complete shit.
Fight me.
God.. Hori Hayabusa is so fucking wobbly. Unusable for Tekken. Wouldn't really use it for any fighting game to be completely honest.
Skeptic Gamer the hayabusa are in the tekken 7 Arcade cabinets ;)
your moving sooo slow i litterally can't help but skipping the vid.
This is pointless...
This is VERY important. I know from experience.
Next time I can’t sleep I’m gonna watch that boring slow motion useless video