Came out around 1979. Waterproofs was either the OG poncho, or the crinkly plastic water proof introduced around 1982. Keenies would buy a good waterproof and wear it under the smock, as usually in those days tactical zips and studs was not common at all.
Your Para smock is late '85 pattern, the early ones were white inside that changed to green on the later ones. The cuffs are a poly wool mix elastic. It's in very good condition. I would say around '89?
Thanks for that. When I was looking up some details, someone mentioned the white inner. I also saw one for sale with the wrong idea for the sizing and i think some people are getting mixed up with the old 68 pattern standard army jacket. That had a crotch flap, and the buttons for the epalets were used for the hood. It was quite enjoyable looking it all up. It took me back a bit. Anyways, thanks for the information 💯👍
The flap is a hangover from old Windak outdoor wear from the 30s. Its designed to seal the bottom of the smock off and trap in heat. This is a very old design that was carried over to the 68 pattern smock. It is largely redundant since the advent of draw cords but was incorporated into the DPM Parka as well. The theory about stopping it from billowing up is incorrect. Windak designed the first prototype Denison smock but didn't win the contract to manufacture them. Gen. Browning as a consolation for Windak ordered a special run of full length zip Windak smocks for issue to senior officers. These exceedingly rare smocks are referred to as 'Windak Smocks'. Monty famously wore one.
That's very interesting, thanks for that. Yes, I've just seen that picture of monty, and yet it's commonly known as the denison Smock, so I've just learned a couple of things. Thanks.
The rumours about the 'beaver tail' (as we called it) persist to this day. I don't know anyone who's actually employed it in the field. Airborne guys that I've known over the years generally sew them to the jacket so they won't come undone at inopportune moments.
@lib556 it did cross my mind for a second if it was actually used, and I came to the conclusion that it was, due to the nature of what you were doing before landing. Interesting. Thanks for that. 👍
The information about the tail only very recently came to light after the Windak Company unearthed some correspondence between Boy Browning and the head of the company and some reminiscences provided by one of their descendants. The South African Slangvel Smocks actually have a heavy canvas tail flap designed to protect the crutch during tree landings. I imagine this was their way of justifying having the tail. It's actually on the user instructions inside the collar!
@@johnsteele2986 Good info. I'm a mil jumper although I never served in an op AB unit. My Dad was a paratrooper (Cdn AB Regt). My brother has his 70s pattern Cdn DPM smock and I have his old 50s pattern OD nylon one. The beaver tail is sewn to the jacket in both. I have another 50s pattern OD sock that is also sewn shut. I have a Slangvel (repro - who can afford a real one?). One of the first mods I made was to swing the tail round to the inside and stitch it in place. As it's just a repro (albeit very nice) it doesn't have the instructions for tree landings. Nor is the tail made of canvass - same nutria nylon material as the rest of the jacket.
Neat little bit of woodland that you were in, Andy. Never tire of these vids. Keep them coming! Think I'll order in a British MTP smock for the spring this year.
Thanks for the compliment johnanon. These older smocks took a bit of time to dry, and you'll need a waterproof to go with it, but other than that, they are great. I have no idea what the new ones are like. 💯🤘
Yes, the 68 pattern was my first. That was 1985, TA issue. Joined the regs, 1987 and had to use the TA stuff first. Though some of it got replaced. So everyone had the 85 pattern, and I had the 68 pattern in training. And of course, I kept my 1985 regimental number.
Can't be the 68 pattern smock as it has knitted cuffs. It's defo not soldier '95 because of the buttons. So a bit of an oddball. The hood is from the Arctic smock I think and the that was my smock of choice ;)
I would say the hood is a 66 or 68 pattern. My first combat jacket was a 68 pattern and was the same material and colours as the hood. But this para smock was common in the 80s, but what pattern it comes under, I don't know? Late 70s or 80s, I think.
The sas smock has no map pockets on the chest and has sown on ink blue buttons. It's not rip stop material. It's gabardine, but the inner is dpm. I can remember these smocks. The first zipped chest pockets on the standard combat jacket were the 94 pattern, which was quite good. That was my last issue. I never had the 95 pattern.
@@Andy-walkaboutnutty I went to cadets at Raglan Barracks through the late 80's early 90's where 22 had their main stay. They obv didn't adevertise that but we got to see them up close quite regular. Thats why i think that one you have is fudge. I mentioned soldier 95 as being mostly ripstop as by the time i joined in '98 that is what i wore for quite a time ;)
The TA was 3RRW in pontypool. The regulars was 1RRW for a few years, including training, then transferred to 16 tk tptr sqn rct, in fallingbostel. Left the army for 1 year but went back in on a type engagement, which was in the 1rwf in 1995.
Thanks just wondered ex RRF myself late 80’s. Owned a para smock for a short while sold it and bought my survival aids SAS smock. It was the best for the worst weather especially any wind
@mikel6517 I can well believe that. The para smock is good, but it takes longer to dry. In 1rrw, we weren't aloud any bought/goochie kit. It was just way too strict for my liking. And most people's liking, I think. I came from a farming background and not mining, so that made me stick out a bit. So, I got my hgv1 in sivvy Street, booked it all up on the Sly, and went through the transfer system, and that's what I've been doing ever since.
![British Army [surplus] Smock adapted.](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/fLAdOn8_TYU/mqdefault.jpg)
![British Army [surplus] Smock adapted.](/img/tr.png)
Came out around 1979. Waterproofs was either the OG poncho, or the crinkly plastic water proof introduced around 1982. Keenies would buy a good waterproof and wear it under the smock, as usually in those days tactical zips and studs was not common at all.
@michaelstephanides1854 Yes, I remember. We used to call them waterproofs the crisp packet.
Your Para smock is late '85 pattern, the early ones were white inside that changed to green on the later ones. The cuffs are a poly wool mix elastic. It's in very good condition. I would say around '89?
Thanks for that. When I was looking up some details, someone mentioned the white inner. I also saw one for sale with the wrong idea for the sizing and i think some people are getting mixed up with the old 68 pattern standard army jacket. That had a crotch flap, and the buttons for the epalets were used for the hood. It was quite enjoyable looking it all up. It took me back a bit. Anyways, thanks for the information 💯👍
The flap is a hangover from old Windak outdoor wear from the 30s. Its designed to seal the bottom of the smock off and trap in heat. This is a very old design that was carried over to the 68 pattern smock.
It is largely redundant since the advent of draw cords but was incorporated into the DPM Parka as well.
The theory about stopping it from billowing up is incorrect.
Windak designed the first prototype Denison smock but didn't win the contract to manufacture them.
Gen. Browning as a consolation for Windak ordered a special run of full length zip Windak smocks for issue to senior officers.
These exceedingly rare smocks are referred to as 'Windak Smocks'. Monty famously wore one.
That's very interesting, thanks for that. Yes, I've just seen that picture of monty, and yet it's commonly known as the denison Smock, so I've just learned a couple of things. Thanks.
The rumours about the 'beaver tail' (as we called it) persist to this day. I don't know anyone who's actually employed it in the field. Airborne guys that I've known over the years generally sew them to the jacket so they won't come undone at inopportune moments.
@lib556 it did cross my mind for a second if it was actually used, and I came to the conclusion that it was, due to the nature of what you were doing before landing. Interesting. Thanks for that. 👍
The information about the tail only very recently came to light after the Windak Company unearthed some correspondence between Boy Browning and the head of the company and some reminiscences provided by one of their descendants.
The South African Slangvel Smocks actually have a heavy canvas tail flap designed to protect the crutch during tree landings. I imagine this was their way of justifying having the tail. It's actually on the user instructions inside the collar!
@@johnsteele2986 Good info. I'm a mil jumper although I never served in an op AB unit. My Dad was a paratrooper (Cdn AB Regt). My brother has his 70s pattern Cdn DPM smock and I have his old 50s pattern OD nylon one. The beaver tail is sewn to the jacket in both. I have another 50s pattern OD sock that is also sewn shut.
I have a Slangvel (repro - who can afford a real one?). One of the first mods I made was to swing the tail round to the inside and stitch it in place. As it's just a repro (albeit very nice) it doesn't have the instructions for tree landings. Nor is the tail made of canvass - same nutria nylon material as the rest of the jacket.
Neat little bit of woodland that you were in, Andy. Never tire of these vids. Keep them coming! Think I'll order in a British MTP smock for the spring this year.
Thanks for the compliment johnanon. These older smocks took a bit of time to dry, and you'll need a waterproof to go with it, but other than that, they are great. I have no idea what the new ones are like. 💯🤘
You wanted to say “9 ft 5” didn’t you ?😂, very informative as always Andy 😊
I'm sometimes 1 second ahead of myself, which is quite good for me. I'm glad you enjoyed 🙂
The first "good quality, lined" smock you had when serving would have been a 68 pattern, the poor quality one,would have been an 85.
Yes, the 68 pattern was my first. That was 1985, TA issue. Joined the regs, 1987 and had to use the TA stuff first. Though some of it got replaced. So everyone had the 85 pattern, and I had the 68 pattern in training. And of course, I kept my 1985 regimental number.
Can't be the 68 pattern smock as it has knitted cuffs. It's defo not soldier '95 because of the buttons. So a bit of an oddball. The hood is from the Arctic smock I think and the that was my smock of choice ;)
I would say the hood is a 66 or 68 pattern. My first combat jacket was a 68 pattern and was the same material and colours as the hood. But this para smock was common in the 80s, but what pattern it comes under, I don't know? Late 70s or 80s, I think.
I'd say that SAS smock is Mickey Mouse. Soldier '95 is mostly ripstop ;)
The sas smock has no map pockets on the chest and has sown on ink blue buttons. It's not rip stop material. It's gabardine, but the inner is dpm. I can remember these smocks. The first zipped chest pockets on the standard combat jacket were the 94 pattern, which was quite good. That was my last issue. I never had the 95 pattern.
@@Andy-walkaboutnutty I went to cadets at Raglan Barracks through the late 80's early 90's where 22 had their main stay. They obv didn't adevertise that but we got to see them up close quite regular. Thats why i think that one you have is fudge.
I mentioned soldier 95 as being mostly ripstop as by the time i joined in '98 that is what i wore for quite a time ;)
What was the infantry regiment you were in
The TA was 3RRW in pontypool. The regulars was 1RRW for a few years, including training, then transferred to 16 tk tptr sqn rct, in fallingbostel. Left the army for 1 year but went back in on a type engagement, which was in the 1rwf in 1995.
Thanks just wondered ex RRF myself late 80’s. Owned a para smock for a short while sold it and bought my survival aids SAS smock. It was the best for the worst weather especially any wind
@mikel6517 I can well believe that. The para smock is good, but it takes longer to dry. In 1rrw, we weren't aloud any bought/goochie kit. It was just way too strict for my liking. And most people's liking, I think. I came from a farming background and not mining, so that made me stick out a bit. So, I got my hgv1 in sivvy Street, booked it all up on the Sly, and went through the transfer system, and that's what I've been doing ever since.