Let me know your thoughts on all this in the comments below as fighting game or gacha players. EDIT: I changed the Thumbnail. I don't support AI Art and didn't even know it was AI Art. Sorry & Thanks @NeuroseZX for the updated thumbnail!
My take on the whole juggle argument, Iyo woulda made a stronger case if he drew the comparisons to DMC games, in those games the main idea behind juggles was to crowd control fodder mobs in order to make the game "easier" by essentially avoiding incoming attacks (being airborne while enemies are stuck on the ground for example). This of course has no practical use against bigger boss enemies but the idea of "atracking so that i dont get hit" can still be applied but in a different way.
The problem is mainly that gacha games are built around timers for endgame, where this type of stuff is supposedly good for. Unless you can somehow find a way to juggle while still optimizing rotations to deal the same damage as normal play, it's still pointless. And even then, people would just prefer to dodge instead of doing sweaty combos in a gacha game. It's all about his delivery of this stuff. He wanted to bring in terms from another game genre into a community that doesn't need or care about it, and acted condescending and defensive when people pushed back. He could've just said that these are cool things you can do, but instead he framed it as the optimal way to play, which is so obviously not true to anyone with a brain and knowledge of the game mechanics.
@@tetraavalon3664yeah pretty much, if he puts it as a showcase on stylistic combos and stuff i'm pretty sure that he's not gonna get as much hate as he currently is getting, but instead his argument relied on how this tech is somehow the preferable way to play over the actual mechanics of the game and bashes the game for not adhering to his tech, when in a vaccuum this tech is just redundant both in zzz and wuwa as its just not the core mechanics for both, is it cool to do so ? heck yeah it is but to pretend that its more than that is disingenuous.
Yes exactly! As someone who got super into DMC5 and now is 200 hours deep in Tekken 8, my first fighting game. It is more in line with the idea of juggling in DMC. It's memorizing strings so that you render certain enemies useless. For example: Hell Antenora, it's an enemy you can juggle anytime, but once it falls it gains super armor and charges at you so you can't rejuggle it for a while. So if you engage with it you need to have your high damage juggle combo to deal with it in as few cycles as possibles, or have an infinite juggle to make it easier, which would not always work depending on how many enemies there are. That's not really how fighting game juggling works. My biggest mistake coming into Tekken was thinking it's a game about juggling, when it's not.
Another thing with the "Tekken is a game where you don't want the enemy to play the game" is complete nonsense. It is literally impossible to juggle the enemy all game, and it is also impossible to punish every single mistake, even Arslan Ash misses sometimes. What you want to do is to reinforce your game while reading the opponnent's gameplan. 1 Jab Checks, df1 Mid Checks, sometimes this is all what it takes to deny the other player their game. But this may not always work. So if this is you're plan and you just go with it every game, you're gonna get destroyed once you played against a Ling, a Yoshi, a Steve. So in this case, it is literally impossible to not make the other player not play the game as their characters by right makes you unable to play yours, so you have to adjust and to adapt. The most accurate description I can think of for Tekken would be "Its everything but what the internet has told you it is"
hah, good point. I don't play fighting games, but that is exactly how I use Sanhua to make her rotation faster. An actual practical use of it, and yet I still don't give a crap about the terms.
I mentioned that too I think idk my comment got buried, misusing these silly terms and not even mentioning the number 1 character I edge to I mean that uses negative edge
He's the only mf that knoooooows the secret tech, the secret tech, the ouuuuuuuugghhhh, the dragon scroll. Bud is basically master SHIFU rn 😂. Only the dragon warrior...the iyo warriors know the secret technique.
the hate that iyo is gettin is mostly cuz of his ego...while he's pushin this 'tech'. he's goes on about how the gacha community does not have a him or sayin shit like this tech is something fgc will get but gacha players will not understand. basically sayin gacha players are dumb, of course he's goin to get pushback. the worst is he's not even using the terms correctly so he's gettin shit on by both gacha players and fighting game players.
he also went on this tangent that content creators are not passionate if they dont primarily make videos for one game basically shittin on the whole space
Bro is having an ego when he’s a complete random in the fighting game space. Since these games are too hard for him he had to pivot to gacha mobile games and use complex terminology that has no relevance whatsoever to sound smarter and feel above the average casual gacha gamer. What a miserable narcissist.
Basically he is on a ego trip, and refuse to accept when anyone is pointing that he is wrong. Everyone is gettting negative edge and kara cancelling out of the gacha community. He hides his videos now to members only when he could not accept all these dramas and the crtitcisms.
The funniest thing is that mrpokke literally went in and did exactly what iyo said you can’t do, spam dash and attack, blindfolded, on the highest content available that iyo said you can’t do it on, and cleared it with an S rank 😂🤣🤣
@@joebob6387 It's the same idea as "plinking" as explained in this video, in which that the windows to do thing in this game is so large and it's braindead easy to just pull it off. The very apparent sound cue and large windows to parry/dodge make it so that you don't even have to think about it to do it if you've been playing the game for a few hours already.
@@leduq2383 Correct, and this is exactly where the fighting game inspiration is and the crossover stops: easy to do flashy and cool shit. But people only hear what they want, and keep pushing the narrative that these are fighting games... No, they're not. They have the same philosophy, but they achieve it in different ways, with different gameplay. And the people pushing for ZZZ to be Dark Souls hard are completely missing the point, and won't ever enjoy it. Not supposed to be hard, it's supposed to be F U N, and for that it combines a little bit of challenge with satisfying combat feedback.
I play fighting games. and even I find that the jargon that he uses is kinda... its annoying. Also what is he expecting? "Gacha game players don't understand this." thats literally talking down on an entire community of players how is he NOT expecting backlash? The situation is ridiculous and it never should have gotten to this point, but to be real here as much as everyone is clowning on Iyo right now he kinda deserves it. Now don't misconstrue this as me saying that people should be racist to him, but regarding the terminology used and how it was used Incorrectly in some cases and only partially right in others its just not a good look.
It’s funny cuz all the shit he’s talking about doesn’t even really apply to the zzz mans heard that the devs did a talk with street fighter and started thinking the game has fighting game mechanics
Iyo's jargon mechanics are getting roman canceled 1 by 1 I think the part where he said "...the wuwa community doesn't have me in it." was the trigger for this, he didn't have to say it but he did it anyways
He really made a second channel dedicated to zzz just so he can say that he is a "primary" content creator, like who tf cares. Blud really kuro cancelled himself
@@cheekynandos5888yeah, I don't understand this logic either. Even on Volkin's Podcast, volkin himself said to him that said basically "Yeah your zzz channel is primary cover zzz, but YOU are not a Primary zzz Content creator" since Iyo also cover other games
Im definitely not trying to diss Iyo but I've never heard of bro and I've been following the FGC scene since the first videos surfaced on RUclips and playing arcades in 99
@@RageGS ive only been following fgc ever since melty blood type lumina released and never seen him there. also never seen him played a fighting game ever too.
The only way a player like Iyo will get "true depth" out of a gacha game is if said game is ever made disregarding the mobile genre entirely. As long as a touch screen has to be a viable option to complete all content, you just can't have that kind of mechanical depth. Touch screens simply won't allow it.
That's partially true, but the real reason is the parasitic tumor attached to these games from inception, the gacha itself and greed, skill can't be a determining factor for even getting high ranks or clearing the content when they have to pedal new shiny characters and completely needless currencies and upgrade systems to siphon as much money as feasibly possibly from their player base and also make the players who spend feel like they're accomplishing something by doing so
Sanhua is the only character in WuWa that can truly NEGATIVE Edge. Iyo bringing up negative edging on Jiyan or Jinhsi is wrong, they have no on release attacks. All their kit is on click, not on release...😂
Gacha players (mostly Iyo's community) are definitely not making fun of fighting game players, they are actually making fun of Iyo for trying to bring that jargon in something like gacha and telling the community to use fighting game terms while at the same time sh***ing on his own community.
The biggest thing I think you missed is that Iyo made a few tweets saying “THIS TECH IS NECESSARY and you Gacha players NEED TO LISTEN TO ME!” When he comes across as that fucking pretentious it’s pretty hard not to dog pile on someone that’s just incorrect on the terms he used. Telling people they NEED TO LISTEN TO HIM because he’s the messiah that gacha has been waiting for. Iyo did this shit to himself by inflating his big ass head for no goddamn reason.
The worst thing is that you DON'T need anything Iyo teaches you to effectively play the game. Most the tech he discover is pretty useless to the average player. At best swap canceling tech can help you, but there are way better people that can teach and show you that without the jargon. Any "secret input tech" that is practically a little easter egg with super super niche use case, or any juggle tech that is only for combo mad movie, it's not required for actual gameplay at all.
Appreciate the insights! I think you kinda misunderstood all the "negative edging" jokes. People are mostly saying it just to clown on Iyo's massive ego. Hardly anyone is disrepecting the FGC and their terminology.
Fighting game terms for specific moves are born out of necessity and it is cool because it is necessary to gain an edge in the game. All of these things are not necessary in Gacha and therefore will never be used. IF in a fighting game, negative edge, kara cancel and so on are not needed or is simply detrimental to you from gaining advantage over an opponent, NOBODY will do it. Just like in Gacha, nobody will want to do it, because you don't have to.
ZZZ is designed to be playable on touchscreen, mouse and controller. so they had to design it so it is playable in the least effective inpurt model. that's really what it is when you have cross platform games. it not even a gacha or a genre thing. it what PC gamers has always complain about when they see that a title is "cross platform". =]
Playing a bit of ZZZ, I just found it fun. It was fun to press the LMB and do a pause for the final hit to get a bigger hit at the end of the combo. I enjoy watching the animations as well. But it's not a fighting game at all. Good video, and respect for Modernia in the background.
Easiest way to "punish" him is just call him the "edging guy", don't call him by his name. He asked to be recognized as the pioneer of these jargon in the community, now he got it.
It's been interesting to see a few fighting game players weigh in on this. Finding tech in games is fun but you usually don't need it depending on what you're playing, which especially goes for what Iyo wanted to apply to WuWa and ZZZ. I think bro needs to just take a step back and calm down. Sooner he admits he made a rough take the better off things will be.
His misuse of fgc terminology and forcing it into an entire different genre and audience is silly Its like grabbing your little siblings Legos and telling them how they should build a long brick wall, you accomplish nothing besides coming off like a rude douche
Here's the thing, I don't think the gacha community should be blamed for making fun of the FGC terms in this case, and I think the main reason why is because none of them actually asked for that terminology to be brought upon them. You say they don't understand them, and that's true. No gacha gamer is ever gonna understand fighting game terms naturally, because it just isn't necessary, and that's totally fine. But when you have a content creator like Iyo coming in and telling regular players that "They don't understand something and that it's very hard for them to do or comprehend, but fighting game players can do it or catch onto it easily", you have a very condescending and smug opinion being presented (especially from someone using the terms wrong lmfao), so you shouldn't be surprised when people clap back. It's not the community's fault for not understanding this, it's Iyo's fault for trying to present himself as superior to regular players just because he "plays this very high skill intensive genre" which is fighting games. As a player of both genres, I love both types of games, but let's be honest, there's a lot of people who get an ego out of merely playing them. Iyo was trying to use that ego to cement himself as an authority in the space, and it just backfired horribly, partly due to the high and mighty attitude, and partly because he MISUSED THE VERY TERMS HE TOOK AS EXAMPLE IN ORDER TO PRESENT HIMSELF AS SUPERIOR AND MORE KNOWLEDGEABLE. I feel bad that the gacha community is making fun of fighting game terms, but this is what happens when you have a self proclaimed representative of the FGC coming into another community and making a bad case for the FGC. Iyo should be blamed for this, not the community. He was irresponsible in how he portrayed both himself, and the community he supposedly loves so dearly. If the FGC doesn't want this to happen, frauds need to be called out, and dumb statements need to be held accountable. Especially in front of other communities who don't know any better.
I play fighting games and I'm a gacha CC (in the Wuthering Waves CC program). Not that any of that matters. The jokes are mostly because of the ego boosting from Iyo. They aren't really intended to disrespect fighting games. Iyo meant well. It's true most of the combos are not necessary. It's fun though and I myself enjoy the cool tech too. But tbh most of it is really easy to use. And not that in depth. Especially compared to fighting games. Wuthering Waves however just got a character that can actually juggle some bosses. But it still isn't necessary. IT'S FUN THOUGH ~ I like Iyo, I think he just chose very poor wording in some of his statements. And everybody is goofing around about it now. - anyways I like your content been watching for a while. Good takes and good video man ~
@@nickn5419 fully agree that was an insane thing to say. - plenty of top notch creators in the space and it takes 1 youtube search to realize that IDK what bro was cooking with that one
@@PancakeBreakfast i think he don t understand that those juggling and tech in those games are for fun first and also one of the biggest backlash is that he try to made then meta relevant like YOU NEED to know then to clear faster and be good at the game.
Same. I like Iyo, but I do think all these reaction videos are a pile on at this point. Allow the man to have a terrible take and move on, if he has a ego problem then he has to address that himself. I appreciate the tech that he did put out that made me appreciate ZZZ more, so personally I see no reason for all this other than everyone wanting to make content to point out a awful take.
I'm more surprised it didn't come to mind that instead of comparing it to a fighting game they or iyo should've compared it to the devil may cry series combat because it is much closer to that specific genre than fighting games.
I sympathize with the points youre making here for sure. I get it...the reason all this has become a meme is really 100% Iyo's fault. He just sadly went about this whole situation in like the worst way possible. Its not even just the gacha community making fun at this point this has spread beyond them due to the ridiculousness of it all.
Iyo- you can't mash in the hard content. Mr Pokke - mashing whie blindfolded- Why can't he just admit this game isn't as sweaty as he he's trying to make it out to be.
Thanks for your inputs about and your thoughts on all this stupid stuff that happening recently My personal storys - In the few games i play in the past that i got my friends into that were similar to fighting games but in a different style (For example For honor) I always try my best to be a guide for them and be there in real time as we practice fighting each other in a infinite rounds 1v1 style match and improving our worse skills before we enter a team base match For some stuff my friend struggling with like Correctly doing Input Cancels to make you the player your facing Flinched into a panic input and while also teaching them to combating Flinching aswell in a 2v1 or worse a 4v1 scenario in A team based match in For honor 95% of the time you will lose However you can buy Time and Survive even longer for your team to come back and rally with you with the objective on the map And depending How you play (from me personally) When i Play a Character that i main (Peacekeeper) im very reckless and just take the hit instead to Trade the Damage we did to other other during the 2 or 4v1 scenarios and gamble on Time and Make the Opposing Players be weakened for my team to come back full health Side note - The fighting game i Usually play is called GranBlue Fantasy Versus: Rising and been injoying it in recent years - Anyways good Vid and insightful thoughts
My take is bro is trying to make a mountain out of a mole hill and make these gacha games seem more than what they are. Gachas are time and money gaited although you can do the special tech you dont need to or have to, and if tech is the focus then dont interact with those that hate it.
Yeah i dont like to dogpile on the guy, and i'm sure he's seeing some comments that are out of bounds, 99% of the comments are fair game due to his attitude. He comes across way too pretentious and condescending in his comments, like you should be grateful a fighting games expert is teaching you these secret techs. The problem is, no one should waste time juggling their opponent in wuthering waves. Use your intro skill, build up your ult and then use your outro skill. All this "secret" tech is a dps loss in these kind of games.
Nice vid! Been playin gachas for a decade+ now. In my opinion he’s gettin clowned on so much because of his ego. He won’t admit he’s wrong and basically talking down to gacha players while making himself seem superior for playing FGs. To me gachas are games u play while slump on the couch with half a hand and the TV on, definitely not that serious. Everything is time gated anyways, with actual time or character power, and can be bypassed by overleveling content. Anyways good video, well put!
This was a intresting discussion. I wonder if we ever will get to the point where cpu ai will ever be comparable to real human interaction? Makes me want a future where we see a Jrpg with an advance enough AI/ combat system where you play "mind games".
I feel like iyo is doing what he said that wuwa community does to him, which is bringing things that no one asked. He is expecting a gacha game where the main point of playstyle/kits tight to a character to be a fighting game. I dont blame him because the dev itself said its gonna be a heavy combat game and we'll see if its true or not in the upcoming patches. I might not be a hardcore fg player. I like deep mechanics in the game, i wouldnt expect that from a gacha game, id rather boot dota/league instead. If the game isnt like the way it advertised/what i hoped for then ill just stop playing.
Hey alright, lemme hit my DP with Anby. I'm a fg player and when i started playing zzz i tried to pull silly shit too like cancelling recovery frames of attacks to attack faster, juggle loops, etc. For solo challenges i guess those things can help a tiny bit, still the game is designed to play with 3 agents and with their stats up. The combat "tech" it's not that important in this game like you said. Maybe if the guy just went "you know what, there's this thing you can do with x, it's not optimal and the game is not intended to play this way but it's hella fun" the hate could've been avoided.
As a gacha gamer 2nd .. and a monster hunter player it's is best to have the move efficiency rather than juggle the enemies pointlessly for cool points .. since in mh speedrun you need to do certain things that is confusing like launching yourself with a bomb (mhw doesn't have that only the old gen mh) and other stuff .. but those stuff if you know what they are it will make sense .. and i think it is the same applies to wuwa and zzz also where the most efficient strat is to just do the most efficient move and kill the enemies faster ..
Its very weird for them to adopt these phrases and attempt these things in a hack & slash gacha of all things . Just like Sol pointed it out it can exist in even games like DMC series . Honestly there is a one gacha with some combo potential to use some terms but its really bare bones and only a couple phrases can be used in it . That game is My hero ultra rumble , now ik its not a fighter and its a battle royal game but because Byking was the studio who made it plus they also created the fighter my ones justice 2 ( a anime arena fighter ). There was tech in one's justice that can be used in ultra rumble but it varies . Small tangent aside weird things in gacha community and sol gets free content so win win really .
I mean, it's really difficult to appreciate something to its fullest when it's presented incorrectly, is one of the issues. What I do appreciate though is FGC people actually showing the proper usage of the term.
The bigger problem with Iyo is that he’s a gacha creator first and foremost, his audience is the gacha community and he presents all of this fighting game terminologies to his audience in a way that’s just awful, and he also tried to force them too. Especially when everything that he is presenting is just mostly useless information that you will never use in a gacha game. “It’s easy for the fighting game players to understand this, but it’s very hard for the gacha players to understand and accept this”. “We in the fighting community can do this, but you guys won’t be able to do this”. Like he’s actively calling his audience dumb for no reason lol, over some very simple tech that everyone can replicate too because it’s a gacha game and the timing is very generous. It becomes worse when u realize that he’s using the terminology wrong. Bud is not only making a fool of himself, he’s also making the fighting game community look bad too.
Bro i love your videos man, i want this videos more about this you are really good at explaining I love how you differentiate between fighting games and gacha games. Its really true that fighting games are actually having pvp, like the truth about this fighting games are having this advantage like frames,combos etc while gacha games are just needed you to have a better artifact rather than doing other combos etc but i think iyo is just making himself as play for fun as a gacha player.
The best part about it Imo is most of the time you can’t even do it cause it’s not practical and you output to much dps aswell to even juggle. The only time you can juggle is against a boss and even then it’s hard to even make that happen cause most of the time they won’t flinch.
So when playing a fighting games story mode, you’re not playing a fighting game. Or fighting these god like CPUs that body pros. You’re not playing a fighting game.
I'm pretty sure people aren't making fun of fighting games, they are using this meme to make fun of IYO specifically, because he's the only one seriously using these terms in a gacha game that couldn't be FURTHER from a fighting game, even if they implemented a fighting game tech or two.
There is a boss you can juggle to death and its hologram Crownless. I literally posted a video of juggling him and I have juggled him to death but I ended the video early for the sake of the video.
That man saw that Eddy bot do 3333333 and thought oh it's the same. Lol. The closest thing to ZZZ being a fighting game is those long boring TV sections putting me to sleep like the MK1 grand finals.
Idk why it's so hard for Iyo to understand that these things don't matter in a single player game. People look up guides and stuff mostly for PvP games. So that they can be better than the other player. In single player games, by default you as a human are already better than the AI. Even in the hardest single player games, you figure out the pattern and beat the boss or whatever. People are clowning on Iyo because of he was acting like a know-it-all who's better than everyone. His egotistical and demeaning tone towards the community rubbed them the wrong way. Now blud acting like he's the victim, which in turn resulted in even more clowning.
It's not that gacha community shits on terms. It's about using them just to sound smart. I can guarantee, at least half of people understand that these terms are in fighting games for a reason, but they also understand that while there may be similarities with gacha games, these terms, techniques and advanced stuff simply don't matter.
its not just that him using confusing terms, but also feeling very superior about it, as if we really needed him and that we are inferior for not knowing, fkin ridiculous
A lot of the terms he wants to use go all the way back to the granddaddy SF2ST even before SF4, things like plinking, kara canceling, etc. You could kara cancel even back then because ST did not allow for 3 light attacks to hit in a row. I played Guile on ST and this was especially important if you wanted to land like c. lk, c. lk, s. lk, Super/Flash Kick, the standing light kick needs to mashed out, but it would get canceled into the super or special. Hell, you would most likely even plink the flash kick or super input to make sure it would come out after the double light punch or kick into super or special. And no, both WuWa and ZZZ, do not need either of these techniques. Not even higher execution characters with animation cancels like Zhu Yuan count. I really hope Iyo does not make the analogy of her dash attack optimization in both her standard and burst combo chains and refer to it as dash cancel or god-forbid a form of backdash cancel.
When actual fighting games players starts to call out on Iyo on hes bs , not one not two this is like 5th actual fighting game player that shows players how ridiculous of a takes Iyo has. Worst part is tho instead of apologising publicly for all the nonsense and misusing names of a tech he claims usefull , he rather privatise hes L take 3 hours nonsense video and blames gacha players for not praising hes content/ideas like it was revolutionary or what xD bro is actually trying to live in hes delusion of being Kara potent positive edge xD
I can see where the guy is coming from. When the npc is 10 or more levels above you, juggling and stunning the enemy doesn't seem like such an awful idea. Considering gacha games are resource heavy you're only gonna be building main dps units while support units are often brought up to a level that won't immediately get them wiped(or a level to proc their buff/passive) This info can be used for people who aren't whales. I understand that's not the main audience but the entire point is to play how you want
I understand why you feel like the terms should be respected. but then again, pretty much every community specific terms will be made fun of when it "makes no sense." At least that's my understanding
this is such a interesting issue, i sad Iyo XS private the video this year i''ve gotten into the FGC (SF and under night inbirth) so was looking forward to rewatching those vids on how he combos etc etc I guess I'm new to gatcha and fighting games tbh IMO it's not a fighting game its closer to a anime arena fighter if anything, it may have fighting game tech which is really cool but yeah its a gacha game I think this is cool asf personally, "plinking"
he can choose to make apologies video to prevent yet...he took to left his old channel...n make new channel lol...clearly he start the fire on twitter n get judged by people...now he sayin he was attacked by wuwa community...i mean he start the fire...now he playin as victim n then he left his channel
Cool video seeing fgc terms broken down more easily like this and what makes them well... The term. The biggest reason imo as why Iyo is getting so much flack is because of his ego and his doubling down on how he's talking about everything. From the games, to the terms, to the communities like... I hear him and feel like he's thinking he's above everyone and we're all idiot cavemen. Like at least for Wuwa and PGR you just need to play mindfully, and you'll be doing good enough in like 90% of the content. Unless your goal is to do stylish showcases, then you got a different question for utilizing these things, but day to day play for average people I'd say can get by by just understanding core mechanics and being mindful. Until we get more widely implemented mechanics that encourage stylish play and reward you via buffs or currency or whatever like DMC and Bayo, the tech stuff will be resigned to being a semi-niche thing of hardcore player skill expression. And that's totally fine, and we should encourage the shed dwellers.
I dont think that the gacha community is clowning on the FGC. Its clowning on Iyo. He used negative edge as a verb, thus people laugh about that. For kara cancel, it made no sense to use the term and it was even wrong. So people are clowning on it as saying it in random situations. anyway, great video!
This man's career is getting 100 to zero by having a bad take. Started out with the bad take, to getting shit on by FGC players. Once you've expose urself to the internet, people are just gonna keep digging.
You can't expect not to be mocked; it's normal for us to make fun of terms we don't know. The reason is simple: a gacha is not a fighting game. Gacha players don't play fighting games; it's a different niche. Obviously, hearing such absurd terms from someone when gachas aren't complex games leads to ridicule. The fault doesn't lie with the gacha players but with the person who dares to use terminologies that don't belong in this type of game. Use those in fighting games. But I've played Tekken, and honestly, trying to implement these terms in a gacha is ... extremely unnecessary and ridiculous, especially in WuWa, which can have better combat, but it's not a game where canceling is necessary. It's a game of combos and quick attacks; the faster you attack and dodge, the easier the boss will be. If you let yourself get hit, even small creatures can deal a lot of damage. It doesn't feel that way because of the speed in killing, but you can't blame the community for making fun of it. The guy just came off as a lunatic.
That negative edge-ing joke is funny af lol. Dunno why Iyo is trying to impress gacha players by constantly slinging around FGC lingo that doesn't really apply to gacha games at all. It comes off as cringe, and pretentious. Gacha games aren't that deep, and aren't designed to be honestly, which is a part of the charm of them (for me at least). Log in, do dailies, and just chill with your favorite characters and see them in action through gameplay. Cool you touched on this topic. Anyways... Imma be negative edging now lmaoooo
Feels kinda bad that the gacha community making fun of all the Fighting game terms. But I bet you 90% of the community didn't even know of these terms until iyo the honoured one, The only MF that should be getting praised for knowing the secret tech xD, brought it up and made a clown fest
As a gacha gamer and dont play fighting games gotta remember gacha gamers are immature or kids so we'll shit on any term, dont take it to heart and ignore us when terms are shit/memed on
I dabble in both types of games pretty heavily and I think there's one point that you did mention but I think could be framed more clearly. In fighting games, these techniques are *competitive*. Using them directly gives you a higher chance of victory because they are maximizing the gameplay mechanics and abusing them. The techniques that Iyo found actively makes you worse at the game because it's doing the opposite - you're not playing to the strengths of the gameplay mechanics given to you as a player. Especially in Wuwa like Fob said, juggling just makes you a worse player because you're sacrificing using the outro skill bar, energy bar, maintaining a cohesive buff rotation - and throwing anything optimal for damage out the window in order to look flashy. All this in addition to his clown tweets and comments looking down on gacha players while introducing nothing actually useful to the community is causing this huge backlash. Gacha games are largely punching bag simulators and if he found techs to push the limits within the confines of the mechanics given to us and gives us like a 10%+ damage output, even if he misused some fighting game terms, he would still be respected. An example of this would be if he made something like Sweetily's skip chain attacks video and added some fgc jargon to it, people might've poked fun at him but still been very respectful.
![Blox Fruits Dragon Rework Update [Full Stream]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/EqDAp8udhm0/mqdefault.jpg)
Let me know your thoughts on all this in the comments below as fighting game or gacha players.
EDIT: I changed the Thumbnail. I don't support AI Art and didn't even know it was AI Art. Sorry & Thanks @NeuroseZX for the updated thumbnail!
my thoughts are don't use the shitty AI art ellen joe in the thumbnail
@@nilzero5686lol
Tectone needs to react to this video too lmaooo
😂 my bad I just saw girl cock didn't know it was ai. Wanna make a thumbnail for me instead?
Fun fact negative edging and Kara cancel is not in the game it has been disproven by two content creators
The time has come.. WE NEGATIVE EDGERS
No way, SonicSol himself chiming in on this as well. Love it. Ima negative edge to this video.
My take on the whole juggle argument, Iyo woulda made a stronger case if he drew the comparisons to DMC games, in those games the main idea behind juggles was to crowd control fodder mobs in order to make the game "easier" by essentially avoiding incoming attacks (being airborne while enemies are stuck on the ground for example). This of course has no practical use against bigger boss enemies but the idea of "atracking so that i dont get hit" can still be applied but in a different way.
The problem is mainly that gacha games are built around timers for endgame, where this type of stuff is supposedly good for. Unless you can somehow find a way to juggle while still optimizing rotations to deal the same damage as normal play, it's still pointless. And even then, people would just prefer to dodge instead of doing sweaty combos in a gacha game. It's all about his delivery of this stuff. He wanted to bring in terms from another game genre into a community that doesn't need or care about it, and acted condescending and defensive when people pushed back. He could've just said that these are cool things you can do, but instead he framed it as the optimal way to play, which is so obviously not true to anyone with a brain and knowledge of the game mechanics.
@@tetraavalon3664yeah pretty much, if he puts it as a showcase on stylistic combos and stuff i'm pretty sure that he's not gonna get as much hate as he currently is getting, but instead his argument relied on how this tech is somehow the preferable way to play over the actual mechanics of the game and bashes the game for not adhering to his tech, when in a vaccuum this tech is just redundant both in zzz and wuwa as its just not the core mechanics for both, is it cool to do so ? heck yeah it is but to pretend that its more than that is disingenuous.
Yes exactly! As someone who got super into DMC5 and now is 200 hours deep in Tekken 8, my first fighting game. It is more in line with the idea of juggling in DMC. It's memorizing strings so that you render certain enemies useless. For example: Hell Antenora, it's an enemy you can juggle anytime, but once it falls it gains super armor and charges at you so you can't rejuggle it for a while. So if you engage with it you need to have your high damage juggle combo to deal with it in as few cycles as possibles, or have an infinite juggle to make it easier, which would not always work depending on how many enemies there are. That's not really how fighting game juggling works. My biggest mistake coming into Tekken was thinking it's a game about juggling, when it's not.
Another thing with the "Tekken is a game where you don't want the enemy to play the game" is complete nonsense. It is literally impossible to juggle the enemy all game, and it is also impossible to punish every single mistake, even Arslan Ash misses sometimes. What you want to do is to reinforce your game while reading the opponnent's gameplan. 1 Jab Checks, df1 Mid Checks, sometimes this is all what it takes to deny the other player their game. But this may not always work. So if this is you're plan and you just go with it every game, you're gonna get destroyed once you played against a Ling, a Yoshi, a Steve. So in this case, it is literally impossible to not make the other player not play the game as their characters by right makes you unable to play yours, so you have to adjust and to adapt. The most accurate description I can think of for Tekken would be "Its everything but what the internet has told you it is"
Except for like how pointed out
Juggling low tier mobs in WuWa is worthless in applicability
Its funny how Sanhua, the character who you can use negative edge input(if you want), is never even mentioned.
hah, good point. I don't play fighting games, but that is exactly how I use Sanhua to make her rotation faster. An actual practical use of it, and yet I still don't give a crap about the terms.
I mentioned that too I think idk my comment got buried, misusing these silly terms and not even mentioning the number 1 character I edge to
I mean that uses negative edge
@@LUCAS420BLZ technicaly Changli too even if its more normal animation cancel than this term.
@@LUCAS420BLZ Lmao you reported yourself there with this "I edge to" buddy😂
I dont blame you btw, Sanhua is hot asf.
He's the only mf that knoooooows the secret tech, the secret tech, the ouuuuuuuugghhhh, the dragon scroll. Bud is basically master SHIFU rn 😂. Only the dragon warrior...the iyo warriors know the secret technique.
This part in mrPokke's video had me dying bro, the way he delivered it is so hilarious
I read this in his voice 😂
the hate that iyo is gettin is mostly cuz of his ego...while he's pushin this 'tech'. he's goes on about how the gacha community does not have a him or sayin shit like this tech is something fgc will get but gacha players will not understand. basically sayin gacha players are dumb, of course he's goin to get pushback. the worst is he's not even using the terms correctly so he's gettin shit on by both gacha players and fighting game players.
he also went on this tangent that content creators are not passionate if they dont primarily make videos for one game basically shittin on the whole space
@@chinkyflahz While he also don't and claim himself passionate XD
Bro is having an ego when he’s a complete random in the fighting game space. Since these games are too hard for him he had to pivot to gacha mobile games and use complex terminology that has no relevance whatsoever to sound smarter and feel above the average casual gacha gamer. What a miserable narcissist.
Basically he is on a ego trip, and refuse to accept when anyone is pointing that he is wrong.
Everyone is gettting negative edge and kara cancelling out of the gacha community.
He hides his videos now to members only when he could not accept all these dramas and the crtitcisms.
@@reimondo3329 even blame pokke for react to his video and keep the drama going 😂
The funniest thing is that mrpokke literally went in and did exactly what iyo said you can’t do, spam dash and attack, blindfolded, on the highest content available that iyo said you can’t do it on, and cleared it with an S rank 😂🤣🤣
Tbf ZZZ has really solid sound design. Pokke wasn’t exactly mashing.
@@joebob6387 It's the same idea as "plinking" as explained in this video, in which that the windows to do thing in this game is so large and it's braindead easy to just pull it off. The very apparent sound cue and large windows to parry/dodge make it so that you don't even have to think about it to do it if you've been playing the game for a few hours already.
@@leduq2383 Correct, and this is exactly where the fighting game inspiration is and the crossover stops: easy to do flashy and cool shit. But people only hear what they want, and keep pushing the narrative that these are fighting games... No, they're not. They have the same philosophy, but they achieve it in different ways, with different gameplay.
And the people pushing for ZZZ to be Dark Souls hard are completely missing the point, and won't ever enjoy it. Not supposed to be hard, it's supposed to be F U N, and for that it combines a little bit of challenge with satisfying combat feedback.
I play fighting games. and even I find that the jargon that he uses is kinda... its annoying. Also what is he expecting? "Gacha game players don't understand this." thats literally talking down on an entire community of players how is he NOT expecting backlash? The situation is ridiculous and it never should have gotten to this point, but to be real here as much as everyone is clowning on Iyo right now he kinda deserves it. Now don't misconstrue this as me saying that people should be racist to him, but regarding the terminology used and how it was used Incorrectly in some cases and only partially right in others its just not a good look.
he's gettin clowned on more cuz he wont admit he was wrong lol
@@chinkyflahz as i said he deserves it lol
It’s funny cuz all the shit he’s talking about doesn’t even really apply to the zzz mans heard that the devs did a talk with street fighter and started thinking the game has fighting game mechanics
Iyo's jargon mechanics are getting roman canceled 1 by 1
I think the part where he said
"...the wuwa community doesn't have me in it." was the trigger for this, he didn't have to say it but he did it anyways
"the wuwa community doesn't have me in it"
The Wuwa community doesn't want you in it Iyo.
He really made a second channel dedicated to zzz just so he can say that he is a "primary" content creator, like who tf cares. Blud really kuro cancelled himself
@@cheekynandos5888yeah, I don't understand this logic either. Even on Volkin's Podcast, volkin himself said to him that said basically "Yeah your zzz channel is primary cover zzz, but YOU are not a Primary zzz Content creator" since Iyo also cover other games
good call out. there were way too many fake people claiming to be part of the FGC and using cool terms ever since the capcom collab announcement
Im definitely not trying to diss Iyo but I've never heard of bro and I've been following the FGC scene since the first videos surfaced on RUclips and playing arcades in 99
@@RageGS ive only been following fgc ever since melty blood type lumina released and never seen him there. also never seen him played a fighting game ever too.
bro just knows every fighting game player on the planet apparently
This is the wildest crossover war I have ever seen in my life.
The only way a player like Iyo will get "true depth" out of a gacha game is if said game is ever made disregarding the mobile genre entirely.
As long as a touch screen has to be a viable option to complete all content, you just can't have that kind of mechanical depth. Touch screens simply won't allow it.
That's partially true, but the real reason is the parasitic tumor attached to these games from inception, the gacha itself and greed, skill can't be a determining factor for even getting high ranks or clearing the content when they have to pedal new shiny characters and completely needless currencies and upgrade systems to siphon as much money as feasibly possibly from their player base and also make the players who spend feel like they're accomplishing something by doing so
Sanhua is the only character in WuWa that can truly NEGATIVE Edge.
Iyo bringing up negative edging on Jiyan or Jinhsi is wrong, they have no on release attacks. All their kit is on click, not on release...😂
Gacha players (mostly Iyo's community) are definitely not making fun of fighting game players, they are actually making fun of Iyo for trying to bring that jargon in something like gacha and telling the community to use fighting game terms while at the same time sh***ing on his own community.
I agree to think WW, ZZZ and now FG community are hating and making fun of Iyo because of it
@@marielgalicha8548He needs to hurry up and make a statement. the longer this goes on, the more he's getting cooked.
@@marielgalicha8548 Bro really went full Lelouch and united different peoples
yeah, do that "i'm holier than thou" in any community and you would expect the same treatment everywhere
The biggest thing I think you missed is that Iyo made a few tweets saying “THIS TECH IS NECESSARY and you Gacha players NEED TO LISTEN TO ME!”
When he comes across as that fucking pretentious it’s pretty hard not to dog pile on someone that’s just incorrect on the terms he used. Telling people they NEED TO LISTEN TO HIM because he’s the messiah that gacha has been waiting for. Iyo did this shit to himself by inflating his big ass head for no goddamn reason.
The worst thing is that you DON'T need anything Iyo teaches you to effectively play the game. Most the tech he discover is pretty useless to the average player. At best swap canceling tech can help you, but there are way better people that can teach and show you that without the jargon. Any "secret input tech" that is practically a little easter egg with super super niche use case, or any juggle tech that is only for combo mad movie, it's not required for actual gameplay at all.
Appreciate the insights! I think you kinda misunderstood all the "negative edging" jokes. People are mostly saying it just to clown on Iyo's massive ego. Hardly anyone is disrepecting the FGC and their terminology.
I just wanna play the damn game man. Im trying to hack and slash, not play fucking zato-1.
Fighting game terms for specific moves are born out of necessity and it is cool because it is necessary to gain an edge in the game.
All of these things are not necessary in Gacha and therefore will never be used.
IF in a fighting game, negative edge, kara cancel and so on are not needed or is simply detrimental to you from gaining advantage over an opponent, NOBODY will do it. Just like in Gacha, nobody will want to do it, because you don't have to.
ZZZ is designed to be playable on touchscreen, mouse and controller. so they had to design it so it is playable in the least effective inpurt model. that's really what it is when you have cross platform games. it not even a gacha or a genre thing. it what PC gamers has always complain about when they see that a title is "cross platform". =]
Everybody wants their game to be considered a fighting game but wont just play fighting games. It’s so weird to me.
In iyo's case he does play but he is very much trying to force certain gacha games to be fighting games so he can say he discovered tech pretty much
@@justcallmesiv I know I just meant in general
Lmao. My brain is so rotted that I keep giggling each time you said negative edge in the negative edge section
Playing a bit of ZZZ, I just found it fun. It was fun to press the LMB and do a pause for the final hit to get a bigger hit at the end of the combo. I enjoy watching the animations as well. But it's not a fighting game at all. Good video, and respect for Modernia in the background.
I love Modernia. she is best gatcha girl :)
I find it hilarious that not only is iyo off base with his attitude and presentation, but even the fgc is like "nah bro you talking out yo assssss"
Tbh it really sounds like he only recently got into fgc
Easiest way to "punish" him is just call him the "edging guy", don't call him by his name.
He asked to be recognized as the pioneer of these jargon in the community, now he got it.
Iyo got overcooked becasue his ego lmao
It's been interesting to see a few fighting game players weigh in on this. Finding tech in games is fun but you usually don't need it depending on what you're playing, which especially goes for what Iyo wanted to apply to WuWa and ZZZ. I think bro needs to just take a step back and calm down. Sooner he admits he made a rough take the better off things will be.
His misuse of fgc terminology and forcing it into an entire different genre and audience is silly
Its like grabbing your little siblings Legos and telling them how they should build a long brick wall, you accomplish nothing besides coming off like a rude douche
The wallet card swipe on the Nikke character sent me! That's too good! LMAO!!!
Fuck all that can I Kara-Cancel onto Zhu Yuan THOOO LIKKE DAAAMN
Here's the thing, I don't think the gacha community should be blamed for making fun of the FGC terms in this case, and I think the main reason why is because none of them actually asked for that terminology to be brought upon them. You say they don't understand them, and that's true.
No gacha gamer is ever gonna understand fighting game terms naturally, because it just isn't necessary, and that's totally fine. But when you have a content creator like Iyo coming in and telling regular players that "They don't understand something and that it's very hard for them to do or comprehend, but fighting game players can do it or catch onto it easily", you have a very condescending and smug opinion being presented (especially from someone using the terms wrong lmfao), so you shouldn't be surprised when people clap back.
It's not the community's fault for not understanding this, it's Iyo's fault for trying to present himself as superior to regular players just because he "plays this very high skill intensive genre" which is fighting games. As a player of both genres, I love both types of games, but let's be honest, there's a lot of people who get an ego out of merely playing them. Iyo was trying to use that ego to cement himself as an authority in the space, and it just backfired horribly, partly due to the high and mighty attitude, and partly because he MISUSED THE VERY TERMS HE TOOK AS EXAMPLE IN ORDER TO PRESENT HIMSELF AS SUPERIOR AND MORE KNOWLEDGEABLE.
I feel bad that the gacha community is making fun of fighting game terms, but this is what happens when you have a self proclaimed representative of the FGC coming into another community and making a bad case for the FGC. Iyo should be blamed for this, not the community. He was irresponsible in how he portrayed both himself, and the community he supposedly loves so dearly.
If the FGC doesn't want this to happen, frauds need to be called out, and dumb statements need to be held accountable. Especially in front of other communities who don't know any better.
I play fighting games and I'm a gacha CC (in the Wuthering Waves CC program). Not that any of that matters.
The jokes are mostly because of the ego boosting from Iyo. They aren't really intended to disrespect fighting games.
Iyo meant well. It's true most of the combos are not necessary. It's fun though and I myself enjoy the cool tech too.
But tbh most of it is really easy to use. And not that in depth. Especially compared to fighting games.
Wuthering Waves however just got a character that can actually juggle some bosses. But it still isn't necessary. IT'S FUN THOUGH ~
I like Iyo, I think he just chose very poor wording in some of his statements. And everybody is goofing around about it now.
- anyways I like your content been watching for a while. Good takes and good video man ~
we dont have a him though. crazy statement.
@@nickn5419 fully agree that was an insane thing to say.
- plenty of top notch creators in the space and it takes 1 youtube search to realize that
IDK what bro was cooking with that one
@@PancakeBreakfast i think he don t understand that those juggling and tech in those games are for fun first and also one of the biggest backlash is that he try to made then meta relevant like YOU NEED to know then to clear faster and be good at the game.
Same. I like Iyo, but I do think all these reaction videos are a pile on at this point. Allow the man to have a terrible take and move on, if he has a ego problem then he has to address that himself. I appreciate the tech that he did put out that made me appreciate ZZZ more, so personally I see no reason for all this other than everyone wanting to make content to point out a awful take.
The way my neck snapped when I heard " negative edging "
Who's watching while negative edging?
even the chat was cookin iyo lmao
I'm more surprised it didn't come to mind that instead of comparing it to a fighting game they or iyo should've compared it to the devil may cry series combat because it is much closer to that specific genre than fighting games.
The Marian dakimakura in the background is just perfect 👌
I sympathize with the points youre making here for sure. I get it...the reason all this has become a meme is really 100% Iyo's fault. He just sadly went about this whole situation in like the worst way possible. Its not even just the gacha community making fun at this point this has spread beyond them due to the ridiculousness of it all.
Iyo- you can't mash in the hard content.
Mr Pokke - mashing whie blindfolded-
Why can't he just admit this game isn't as sweaty as he he's trying to make it out to be.
Thanks for your inputs about and your thoughts on all this stupid stuff that happening recently
My personal storys -
In the few games i play in the past that i got my friends into that were similar to fighting games but in a different style
(For example For honor)
I always try my best to be a guide for them and be there in real time as we practice fighting each other in a infinite rounds 1v1 style match and improving our worse skills before we enter a team base match
For some stuff my friend struggling with like Correctly doing Input Cancels to make you the player your facing Flinched into a panic input and while also teaching them to combating Flinching aswell in a 2v1 or worse a 4v1 scenario in A team based match in For honor
95% of the time you will lose However you can buy Time and Survive even longer for your team to come back and rally with you with the objective on the map
And depending How you play
(from me personally)
When i Play a Character that i main (Peacekeeper) im very reckless and just take the hit instead to Trade the Damage we did to other other during the 2 or 4v1 scenarios and gamble on Time and Make the Opposing Players be weakened for my team to come back full health
Side note -
The fighting game i Usually play is called GranBlue Fantasy Versus: Rising and been injoying it in recent years
- Anyways good Vid and insightful thoughts
Watching sonic play dmc 3 was not what i was expecting to see today.
My take is bro is trying to make a mountain out of a mole hill and make these gacha games seem more than what they are. Gachas are time and money gaited although you can do the special tech you dont need to or have to, and if tech is the focus then dont interact with those that hate it.
22:38 omg I laughed so fucking hard, I am one of the people saying that too because of Iyo lmao.
Clipped n shipped😂
Yeah i dont like to dogpile on the guy, and i'm sure he's seeing some comments that are out of bounds, 99% of the comments are fair game due to his attitude.
He comes across way too pretentious and condescending in his comments, like you should be grateful a fighting games expert is teaching you these secret techs.
The problem is, no one should waste time juggling their opponent in wuthering waves. Use your intro skill, build up your ult and then use your outro skill. All this "secret" tech is a dps loss in these kind of games.
Iyo Kara canceled what he was trying to explain into him getting cooked by 3 communities
my man negative edged iyo's whole carrier
Nice vid! Been playin gachas for a decade+ now. In my opinion he’s gettin clowned on so much because of his ego. He won’t admit he’s wrong and basically talking down to gacha players while making himself seem superior for playing FGs. To me gachas are games u play while slump on the couch with half a hand and the TV on, definitely not that serious. Everything is time gated anyways, with actual time or character power, and can be bypassed by overleveling content. Anyways good video, well put!
you are way more knowledgeable about this fighting game stuff then iyo. GG’s
This shit with Iyo is pure comedy gold
This was a intresting discussion. I wonder if we ever will get to the point where cpu ai will ever be comparable to real human interaction? Makes me want a future where we see a Jrpg with an advance enough AI/ combat system where you play "mind games".
I feel like iyo is doing what he said that wuwa community does to him, which is bringing things that no one asked. He is expecting a gacha game where the main point of playstyle/kits tight to a character to be a fighting game.
I dont blame him because the dev itself said its gonna be a heavy combat game and we'll see if its true or not in the upcoming patches.
I might not be a hardcore fg player.
I like deep mechanics in the game, i wouldnt expect that from a gacha game, id rather boot dota/league instead. If the game isnt like the way it advertised/what i hoped for then ill just stop playing.
As a FG player and a Gacha player.. this is good content SonicSol!! 😊
Hey alright, lemme hit my DP with Anby.
I'm a fg player and when i started playing zzz i tried to pull silly shit too like cancelling recovery frames of attacks to attack faster, juggle loops, etc.
For solo challenges i guess those things can help a tiny bit, still the game is designed to play with 3 agents and with their stats up.
The combat "tech" it's not that important in this game like you said. Maybe if the guy just went "you know what, there's this thing you can do with x, it's not optimal and the game is not intended to play this way but it's hella fun" the hate could've been avoided.
Like all the juggling content creators like steparu who show it just for fun and that it...
Thank you SonicSol to clarify this 🙏
As a gacha gamer 2nd .. and a monster hunter player it's is best to have the move efficiency rather than juggle the enemies pointlessly for cool points .. since in mh speedrun you need to do certain things that is confusing like launching yourself with a bomb (mhw doesn't have that only the old gen mh) and other stuff .. but those stuff if you know what they are it will make sense .. and i think it is the same applies to wuwa and zzz also where the most efficient strat is to just do the most efficient move and kill the enemies faster ..
Ayo my boi sonicsol also plays zzz? i love it
Its very weird for them to adopt these phrases and attempt these things in a hack & slash gacha of all things . Just like Sol pointed it out it can exist in even games like DMC series . Honestly there is a one gacha with some combo potential to use some terms but its really bare bones and only a couple phrases can be used in it . That game is My hero ultra rumble , now ik its not a fighter and its a battle royal game but because Byking was the studio who made it plus they also created the fighter my ones justice 2 ( a anime arena fighter ). There was tech in one's justice that can be used in ultra rumble but it varies . Small tangent aside weird things in gacha community and sol gets free content so win win really .
I mean, it's really difficult to appreciate something to its fullest when it's presented incorrectly, is one of the issues. What I do appreciate though is FGC people actually showing the proper usage of the term.
Having a Modernia body pillow makes me want to believe everything what this guys says.
The bigger problem with Iyo is that he’s a gacha creator first and foremost, his audience is the gacha community and he presents all of this fighting game terminologies to his audience in a way that’s just awful, and he also tried to force them too. Especially when everything that he is presenting is just mostly useless information that you will never use in a gacha game.
“It’s easy for the fighting game players to understand this, but it’s very hard for the gacha players to understand and accept this”. “We in the fighting community can do this, but you guys won’t be able to do this”. Like he’s actively calling his audience dumb for no reason lol, over some very simple tech that everyone can replicate too because it’s a gacha game and the timing is very generous.
It becomes worse when u realize that he’s using the terminology wrong. Bud is not only making a fool of himself, he’s also making the fighting game community look bad too.
Bro i love your videos man, i want this videos more about this you are really good at explaining I love how you differentiate between fighting games and gacha games. Its really true that fighting games are actually having pvp, like the truth about this fighting games are having this advantage like frames,combos etc while gacha games are just needed you to have a better artifact rather than doing other combos etc but i think iyo is just making himself as play for fun as a gacha player.
More to come!
The best part about it Imo is most of the time you can’t even do it cause it’s not practical and you output to much dps aswell to even juggle. The only time you can juggle is against a boss and even then it’s hard to even make that happen cause most of the time they won’t flinch.
So when playing a fighting games story mode, you’re not playing a fighting game. Or fighting these god like CPUs that body pros. You’re not playing a fighting game.
Holy shit, sonicsol entering the ring was not on my bingo card.
I'm pretty sure people aren't making fun of fighting games, they are using this meme to make fun of IYO specifically, because he's the only one seriously using these terms in a gacha game that couldn't be FURTHER from a fighting game, even if they implemented a fighting game tech or two.
There is a boss you can juggle to death and its hologram Crownless. I literally posted a video of juggling him and I have juggled him to death but I ended the video early for the sake of the video.
That man saw that Eddy bot do 3333333 and thought oh it's the same. Lol. The closest thing to ZZZ being a fighting game is those long boring TV sections putting me to sleep like the MK1 grand finals.
I saw Marian, I subscribe.
BRO. ZZZ the most advanced gameplay? Am I missing something from the game? I SWEAR HI3rd has more advanced combat than ZZZ. 😅😅
Idk why it's so hard for Iyo to understand that these things don't matter in a single player game.
People look up guides and stuff mostly for PvP games. So that they can be better than the other player.
In single player games, by default you as a human are already better than the AI.
Even in the hardest single player games, you figure out the pattern and beat the boss or whatever.
People are clowning on Iyo because of he was acting like a know-it-all who's better than everyone.
His egotistical and demeaning tone towards the community rubbed them the wrong way.
Now blud acting like he's the victim, which in turn resulted in even more clowning.
It's not that gacha community shits on terms. It's about using them just to sound smart. I can guarantee, at least half of people understand that these terms are in fighting games for a reason, but they also understand that while there may be similarities with gacha games, these terms, techniques and advanced stuff simply don't matter.
its not just that him using confusing terms, but also feeling very superior about it, as if we really needed him and that we are inferior for not knowing, fkin ridiculous
I wish to see a 1v1 in any game with you vs Iyo it may be interesting...
His video was made to try to flex and talk down over useless tech, not educate or explain, that’s pretty much it.
A lot of the terms he wants to use go all the way back to the granddaddy SF2ST even before SF4, things like plinking, kara canceling, etc. You could kara cancel even back then because ST did not allow for 3 light attacks to hit in a row. I played Guile on ST and this was especially important if you wanted to land like c. lk, c. lk, s. lk, Super/Flash Kick, the standing light kick needs to mashed out, but it would get canceled into the super or special. Hell, you would most likely even plink the flash kick or super input to make sure it would come out after the double light punch or kick into super or special.
And no, both WuWa and ZZZ, do not need either of these techniques. Not even higher execution characters with animation cancels like Zhu Yuan count. I really hope Iyo does not make the analogy of her dash attack optimization in both her standard and burst combo chains and refer to it as dash cancel or god-forbid a form of backdash cancel.
ruclips.net/video/UZRIGZtzsco/видео.html
When actual fighting games players starts to call out on Iyo on hes bs , not one not two this is like 5th actual fighting game player that shows players how ridiculous of a takes Iyo has.
Worst part is tho instead of apologising publicly for all the nonsense and misusing names of a tech he claims usefull , he rather privatise hes L take 3 hours nonsense video and blames gacha players for not praising hes content/ideas like it was revolutionary or what xD bro is actually trying to live in hes delusion of being Kara potent positive edge xD
I can see where the guy is coming from. When the npc is 10 or more levels above you, juggling and stunning the enemy doesn't seem like such an awful idea. Considering gacha games are resource heavy you're only gonna be building main dps units while support units are often brought up to a level that won't immediately get them wiped(or a level to proc their buff/passive) This info can be used for people who aren't whales. I understand that's not the main audience but the entire point is to play how you want
I understand why you feel like the terms should be respected. but then again, pretty much every community specific terms will be made fun of when it "makes no sense." At least that's my understanding
Based Marian
this is such a interesting issue, i sad Iyo XS private the video this year i''ve gotten into the FGC (SF and under night inbirth) so was looking forward to rewatching those vids on how he combos etc etc I guess I'm new to gatcha and fighting games tbh
IMO it's not a fighting game its closer to a anime arena fighter if anything, it may have fighting game tech which is really cool but yeah its a gacha game
I think this is cool asf personally, "plinking"
Gacha players will watch someone beat Elden Ring with dodge rolls and say "this mf ain't geared enough to R1 through the game 💀"
he can choose to make apologies video to prevent yet...he took to left his old channel...n make new channel lol...clearly he start the fire on twitter n get judged by people...now he sayin he was attacked by wuwa community...i mean he start the fire...now he playin as victim n then he left his channel
Ellen Joe makes me positively edge
if you name something negative edging…you should fully expect the clowning
Cool video seeing fgc terms broken down more easily like this and what makes them well... The term. The biggest reason imo as why Iyo is getting so much flack is because of his ego and his doubling down on how he's talking about everything. From the games, to the terms, to the communities like... I hear him and feel like he's thinking he's above everyone and we're all idiot cavemen. Like at least for Wuwa and PGR you just need to play mindfully, and you'll be doing good enough in like 90% of the content. Unless your goal is to do stylish showcases, then you got a different question for utilizing these things, but day to day play for average people I'd say can get by by just understanding core mechanics and being mindful. Until we get more widely implemented mechanics that encourage stylish play and reward you via buffs or currency or whatever like DMC and Bayo, the tech stuff will be resigned to being a semi-niche thing of hardcore player skill expression. And that's totally fine, and we should encourage the shed dwellers.
I dont think that the gacha community is clowning on the FGC. Its clowning on Iyo.
He used negative edge as a verb, thus people laugh about that.
For kara cancel, it made no sense to use the term and it was even wrong. So people are clowning on it as saying it in random situations.
anyway, great video!
so he made that "guide" for himself (styling) but said it for the community........
hmmmm its seems familiar to me
And low key.. elden ring is more of a fighting game than gacha games are
This man's career is getting 100 to zero by having a bad take. Started out with the bad take, to getting shit on by FGC players. Once you've expose urself to the internet, people are just gonna keep digging.
I'm chill since I sometimes play BBCF too haha, I just go back to BBCF if I want to play FG outside of gacha daily business
You can't expect not to be mocked; it's normal for us to make fun of terms we don't know. The reason is simple: a gacha is not a fighting game. Gacha players don't play fighting games; it's a different niche. Obviously, hearing such absurd terms from someone when gachas aren't complex games leads to ridicule. The fault doesn't lie with the gacha players but with the person who dares to use terminologies that don't belong in this type of game. Use those in fighting games. But I've played Tekken, and honestly, trying to implement these terms in a gacha is ... extremely unnecessary and ridiculous, especially in WuWa, which can have better combat, but it's not a game where canceling is necessary. It's a game of combos and quick attacks; the faster you attack and dodge, the easier the boss will be. If you let yourself get hit, even small creatures can deal a lot of damage. It doesn't feel that way because of the speed in killing, but you can't blame the community for making fun of it. The guy just came off as a lunatic.
07:19 "a game where i don't want my opponent to play the game", so u mean current state of Yu-Gi-Oh?
lmao Yubel Fiendsmith Snake Eye go brrrrrrrr
That negative edge-ing joke is funny af lol. Dunno why Iyo is trying to impress gacha players by constantly slinging around FGC lingo that doesn't really apply to gacha games at all. It comes off as cringe, and pretentious. Gacha games aren't that deep, and aren't designed to be honestly, which is a part of the charm of them (for me at least). Log in, do dailies, and just chill with your favorite characters and see them in action through gameplay.
Cool you touched on this topic. Anyways... Imma be negative edging now lmaoooo
Would zenless be a fighting if or maybe once it gets multiplayer?
Feels kinda bad that the gacha community making fun of all the Fighting game terms. But I bet you 90% of the community didn't even know of these terms until iyo the honoured one, The only MF that should be getting praised for knowing the secret tech xD, brought it up and made a clown fest
As a gacha player i apologize for Iyo making a foolery of the fighting game players terms. May we all negative edge on him as one
As a gacha gamer and dont play fighting games gotta remember gacha gamers are immature or kids so we'll shit on any term, dont take it to heart and ignore us when terms are shit/memed on
I dabble in both types of games pretty heavily and I think there's one point that you did mention but I think could be framed more clearly.
In fighting games, these techniques are *competitive*. Using them directly gives you a higher chance of victory because they are maximizing the gameplay mechanics and abusing them. The techniques that Iyo found actively makes you worse at the game because it's doing the opposite - you're not playing to the strengths of the gameplay mechanics given to you as a player. Especially in Wuwa like Fob said, juggling just makes you a worse player because you're sacrificing using the outro skill bar, energy bar, maintaining a cohesive buff rotation - and throwing anything optimal for damage out the window in order to look flashy.
All this in addition to his clown tweets and comments looking down on gacha players while introducing nothing actually useful to the community is causing this huge backlash. Gacha games are largely punching bag simulators and if he found techs to push the limits within the confines of the mechanics given to us and gives us like a 10%+ damage output, even if he misused some fighting game terms, he would still be respected. An example of this would be if he made something like Sweetily's skip chain attacks video and added some fgc jargon to it, people might've poked fun at him but still been very respectful.
Can't believe Iyo would kara cancel into ruining his gooner lax negative edged. Iyo doesnt have a "me"
Dude is named Bad Take Iyo for a reason
32:46 😂😂 This Gatcha Community does every day 🤣