Thanks for the comparison of the two. I was mulling the idea of getting a Wraith but think I’ll save up some more and get a Flir PTS233. Also I’ve been using a Photon RT for little over a year now and Really impressed with it. I shot hogs as close as 25 yards and as far as 250 yards. For the $$ it’s been a Fantastic unite. I am running a 6500 external battery pack as my power source, I can get thee solid nights of hunting with it keeping the Illuminator set at 4 so when I shoulder the rifle it’s got some illumination running. Also if using AA batteries get some rechargeable ones. It eats batteries pretty quickly.
Thank you for the good information on the pHOTON RT 4.5 . I was thinking of getting one but all these replies I feel better now knowing that it is better for night hunting . I will use this only for Night Hunt and for hogs mainly 25 to 200 yards.with most of my shots being 50 &100 yards . so I did subscribe and thank you for a good video very well explain & keep them comeing
I guess it's the way the camera sees the recorded video but my Wraith is way better than the images shown here. The detail, color, and brightness are way better than they appear in this video. Day time video is crazy high resolution and night time is almost as good. I couldn't be happier with the Wraith especially considering the price.
I'm glad you are happy with your purchase and that it works for you, which is all that really matters ~ As for the external recorded video from the scopes it's very challenging to show exactly what the human eye sees for many reasons, but when doing comparative type videos I usually try to keep all settings identical for everything to where I'm not biasing what I'm showing. The biggest problem technically is that many LCD screens have color shifts and banding because of how individual screens refresh, and with traditional night vision it's the limited brightness of the screen that makes it hard to record. Unfortunately by trying to be fair (and doing minimal editing of the video) the results are not always going to look as good as what we perceive. Thanks for posting!
@@PhoenixRising62 I liked your review but I do wonder if you might have gotten a sub-par example. I have mine on a 308 AR-10 and have had zero issues with anything. I have probably shot around 200 rounds with it and it's never even blinked. I recently took it on a hog hunt and used it day and night and it worked perfectly. The Wraith does have some short comings as I see it too. I had to add an external power supply even while using high end rechargeable batteries. I also wish it had audio recording. I had an Armasight Nemesis 6X gen 2 HD and an ATN X-Sight II 5-20 and I didn't like either of those units. All that said my personal experience with the Wraith has been very good. Thanks for the review!
@@bigjimmy6690 Thanks for your Comment! ... I just got off of the phone with Sightmark and after talking with their Support Technician I've submitted an RMA. What the Tech told me was that the early wraith's had recoil issues that had to be corrected, I had pre-ordered mine from Outdoor Legacy and it was shipped the end of April last year. It's odd that if there was a know issue I wasn't contacted as I did register the product and had actually contacted them as the illuminator that came with my scope failed after turning it on and off a couple of times. Anyway Thanks for the Feedback, I'm going to put a note in the description for this Video about the RMA and the Issue and once all of the dust settles I'll update the video or post a new one.
@@nativejuicevapors Unfortunately mine recently faild. It started shooting all over the place one day at the range. It worked and looked fine but Consecutive shots were as much as 8 inches apart. I contacted Sightmark and they gave me an RMA number and said send it in. Lucky for me I only live about 20 minutes away from their headquarters so shipping was quick. In less than a week I had a brand new unit at my door. I mounted it up and went to the range. It worked perfectly like the other one did before it broke. So I have to say their customer service is excellent. My only issue now is will it break again? I go hog hunting a couple times a year. I don't know anyone with a place to hunt so I have to pay to hunt. Here in Texas hunting on someone else's property is quite expensive. I also have to drive as much as 400 miles one way to get to the ranch. So needless to say I can not afford for a piece of equipment to fail on a hunting trip. So I am considering wether or not I want to keep the unit or sell it. I have a hard time trusting something once it has broke especially so soon after I bought it.
That was the best and most useful comparison. I was going for the Wraith, but no more. Yes the Wraith is better for day, an example not shown, but I 'm not buying it for day use. Thank you.
Thanks! ~ I've been needing to re-mount the Wraith and do further testing (I had it on a PTR-91 and it seemed like it had an aim point shift partway through testing and would also have focus shift while shooting a string of shots), but I've had too many other irons in the fire to do it. There is a section in my PTR-91 review on some of the issues encountered with the Wraith, but I want to do some more testing on something with less recoil. In fairness I've not yet tried the Photon on a Rifle so I can't speak for it.
@@PhoenixRising62 Thanks for that update that make my desicion even more confident. The Photon has been out there for a much longer period of time of years, as compared to months for the Wriath. The Photon has proven itself, and by your excellent demonstration and keen analysis, clearly show the Photon is better night scope than the Wraith. The Wraith is more versatile, but it compromised in the NV part of the equation.
The wraith does have a hot standby feature. Press and hold the arrow facing you for a few seconds the display shuts down and you can turn it back on by pushing the power button once. It does save some time versus shutting the scope off completely. I dont know about battery life as i havent tried it yet.
True, The Photon also has a similar feature... I've seen reviews / comments on Amazon etc. where people have complained about the batteries draining with the Photon off which are likely due to folk not understanding the "standby" feature on these scopes vs. shutting them completely off. The truth is that every digital and thermal scope out there that I've seen are all battery hogs between having to continuously run the Sensor, Screen and Processor, and also their using standard types and sizes of batteries compared to specialty battery packs. I have seen some of the Thermal's etc. that do use proprietary battery packs that likely give better run times, but I'm a little leery of them just because if I'm going to spend a lot of $$$ on a scope I don't want something that several years down the road I won't be able to get batteries for, or get gouged just to keep my equipment operable. I do use rechargeable batteries in both the Photon and the Wraith with good results (and rechargeable CR123's in two thermal devices as well), but I would advise people to test their battery life with the particular brand / type of batteries they plan on using and swap them out based on how long they last (giving a say 15-20 minute margin on the safe side) since most rechargeable batteries drop off voltage very quickly when they get close to empty (not linear like non-rechargeable types) so if you were out hunting your batteries could deplete without much warning since the battery meters in these scopes aren't set up / calibrated to be accurate with other than disposable battery types. Also in the case of the AA rechargeables since they are NiMh and not Lithium they do lose their charge in storage much faster (though some are now designed to last longer while stored) so while they are usable, there are additional logistics involved. One other thing just as an aside ~ Battery Life is another big advantage of Traditional NV over Thermal, and the reason for that is the lack of having to run all of the above off of your battery, since Traditional NV tubes are based on High Voltage and photon's being used to generate electrons which are then multiplied and directly excite a phosphor screen all of which is very efficient in comparison.
The Wraith is the clear winner in the value for what you get category. BTW you run the external battery pack and it goes for days. The RTs that I have had (2) were all junk neither worked well and one lasted a whole year before crapping out, the other about 4 months, returned for repair, 2 months, repair and then I sold it - , but I went to Pulsar for thermal., and now that ATN has worked out its early model issues on the X-sight 2, is a far better HD day/night scope than either of these scopes. A couple of observations from using them both. 1) The Wraith is actually waterproof - the RT not so much. Having to use a pinhole is a complete no-go for a tactical application - the Wraith will auto compensate very quickly to sudden bright light, the RT is useless until you fumble around, find the pinhole cover, and wait for YOUR vision to night adapt again. Since everyone in the industry has profiles now - the RT is just obsolete in comparison.. Just some things to keep in mind. I would personally not buy either right now with ATN stepping up so well.
Thanks for adding your Experience. While I've not used my RT on anything with substantial recoil, I did use the Wraith on a PTR-91 .308 and had loss of Zero and focus shift issues and ended up sending it back. My wraith was a first production run version (had to pre-order it) and when I contacted Sightmark they said that there were issues with those. So I sent my Wraith back and what I received was an entirely new scope. I have not since tested in on a high recoil firearm. As an aside while Sightmark customer support was friendly and responsive I also had issues with the illuminator ... The first one died after cycling it on and off a couple of times, sent just that back and got a 2nd one that would not change brightness levels, sent that one back and finally got a 3rd one that worked. Unfortunately when I had the scope replaced I had to send EVERYTHING back and guess what - When I got the new scope the illuminator again would not cycle through brightness levels so I just gave up on it. So I've overall got mixed feelings about Sightmark's QC and Customer Service concerning the Wraith.
I have both , what I have found is they work well in open fields , not so much with heavy wooded areas with branches in the path of scoping . The reflection from these branches is a problem for me .
I'm waiting for my photon rt to come in the mail now! After watching this video I now know that I made the right decision. I'm replacing my ATN xsight, which resembles the Wraith, and has a horrible eye relief issue on bolt actions. I chose the photon RT because it looks like I could get the right eye relief using regular scope rings.
@@PhoenixRising62 It was the first version of the x sight 5x18. Despite a lot of bad reviews, I didn't have any other problems with it except for eye relief. I chose to switch to the sightmark at the recommendation from Lonestar Boars when I was struggling with moving scope back far enough to close the gap to my eye.
@@bobbyduck4673 Cool, at some point I want to get an X-Sight 2 for testing, It likely won't be for awhile. You will likely be happy with the RT, I wish Sightmark would come out with an updated version with higher resolution and perhaps use a SiOnyx type sensor (though at the moment they don't have anything in 1080p, as although the Photon won't win any contests for looks in mounting it what I found was that the simple controls and large over-textured focus ring at the front were actually outstanding as the scope is long enough that I could use the thumb on my foregrip hand to focus very fast and effectively which is not the case on the Wraith and likely the photon either so between that and having a built in illuminator that can be aimed and actually works (meaning it really is all you need without anything else), I have been much more impressed than I expected to be with it.
@@PhoenixRising62 what I found on the original x sight was that when I mounted an ir light to the mount on side of scope, that I was unable to turn the focus ring because the ir flashlight blocked it. My hunting buddy has the x sight 4K pro. It seems really nice, but I went with the recommendations of someone else.
@@PhoenixRising62 I have a Savage bolt action 22-250 with a picatinny rail, any idea what scope ring height I'm going to need? Was hoping to get a jump on preparations before the scope comes in on Friday.
Green is not a gimmick. It is much less harsh on the eyes when scoped for long periods of time and many people find it easier to acquire targets in the dark.
Actually you are partially correct. Green is less harsh on the eyes than a WP or black and white image.. And the human eye is also more sensitive to green than other colors. But that is not what I am talking about as far as it's being a "Gimmick". It is Sightmark's implimentation of the Green screen that I am talking about that is a Gimmick... Basically Sightmark just washes over the screen with Green so that the contrast between dark and light is greatly diminished. Had Sightmark spent the time to do this correctly (as in going Monochrome and applying green to only the what is white while leaving contrast intact) it would be useable, but as it is applied in the wraith IMO it is a poor substitute with its only real value being to allow someone to pretend the wraith is conventional night vision. And Sightmark isn't alone as far as digital scope manufacturers doing this as I have a SiOnyx Aurora Sport that also has this "Feature" and implements it the same way (although they do a slightly better job).... Some additional thoughts on this are that these manufacturers are doing this for one or both of two reasons... First because it's cheap and easy to just add a green overcast to everything vs. processing the image to keep contrast and make it effective (aka profit over perfection), or perhaps it could be that they haven't figured out (or the hardware / software solutions haven't been developed) how to correctly do this or perhaps more likely the hardware processing power is not there to do this properly without inducing further lag in the image, which is one of the major issues digital NV currently struggles with.
Have been looking for something on the affordable end of night scopes, was at a gun store over the weekend had the pleasure of testing a 7,000 NV scope lmao well that cleared up a lot of questions. Normal zooming field of view 100% could hunt at night like it was day
Absolutely, I've built (assembled) some night vision using both Gen 2 and NOS (New Old Stock) blemished tubes that you can get on Fleabay for a pretty reasonable price sometimes and it's a Night and Day difference (pun intended) with what they are capable of. But on the low end from my experience so far I feel the Photon RT is the most bang for the buck out of what I've seen and generally works better than the low end Gen 1 scopes. If you don't mind Old Mil-Surp you can find Gen 1 Cascade (three G1 tubes back to back) Zeiss Fero Z51 / Orion 80 scopes on Fleabay for around the same price as the Photon / Wraith, They are Large and require a Picatinny mount that has the cut-outs / screws for a STANAG mount, but they offer a lot of bang for the buck (they were what was used on the G-3's up into the 90's from my understanding) I actually want to do a video comparing one to the Photon as it would be cool to see, since the commercial Gen 1's only use one tube (I believe the US PVS-2 was also a cascade tube scope as well). For a little more (like around $1k) you can still fine US PVS-4 scopes as well which are Gen 2. I don't have any experience with them but would love to get the chance to play with one.
Thanks for this review. I've got a photon rt 4.5s and have been very pleased. I have a wraith on order for a 2nd setup but have been torn with the features of the wraith vs what I get with the photon. My intended use is night only as day time digital is not allowed in the 2 states I do the majority of my hunting. That said the fact that the wraith doesn't have sound or wifi with the photo stream app is a real downer to me. Typically we have several people with us hunting and it makes it a lot more fun for everyone to be involved via the app. I also like the battery swap on the photon as well. The only plus of the wraith is the sd card. After watching your video I think I have decided to cancel my wraith order and go with the photon which I can get for $100 less than the wraith right now. When the 2nd gen version of the wraith is released I'll give it another look and maybe upgrade then. Maybe it will have sound and wifi built in.
Glad you found the video helpful ~ And it sounds like the Photon and Phone App works well for you? I tried with two different android phones and couldn't get it to function full or stream on either. What Devices have you been using (may have to revisit the app) if you don't mind my asking?
@@PhoenixRising62 have been using my iPad mini 2 and my Google pixel 2 phone successfully. Went ahead and ordered a 2nd photon. When the wraith adds sound and wifi I'll revisit. For what I'm using this for the photon fits the bill.
I use the photon here in mn and it's nice to know if its snowing I can still use the scope without the IR. I have used the photon for 3yrs now and has never malfunctioned
That's good to hear! I have to say from it's looks the Photon isn't too inspiring, but once you get to use it you can really appreciate how well designed it really is. I'd love to see an update to it using something like the sensor out of a SiOnyx Aurora..
I have the 2 power Wrath on my crossbow its quite deadly at 20 yards,, i also put a large zip tie on the Lenze that's hard to turn with the nub out for one finger focus.
Cool! And that's a Good Idea with the Zip Tie... I actually have might have to see if something like that might help on one of my Thermals that could use a better grip on the front lens.. Thanks!
@@PhoenixRising62 A bit of gorilla tape underneath the zip will give it grip, my wrath was very hard to move with a few fingers torquing it, now with the zip it's a one-finger focus.
Very helpful video! I am looking to get a digital scope for close range pest control and medium range hunting. I am trying to decide between the photon and the atn x-sight II.
Thanks! ... I'm hoping to get to play with an x-sight II to play with and compare at some point, just waiting for the resources and a good price on a used one on Fleabay to be there at the same time. Also I will be doing an update on the Wraith at some point as I had issues with it (loss of focus while shooting and point of impact shift) and a viewer said he had none of those issues so I contacted Sightmark and found out that the early production Wraiths had some issues so I sent my Wraith in and they actually gave me a Whole new Scope - Just got it back Yesterday, and it also has version 03.19.09 firmware with my Original having 02.19.01. I did turn it on and look around the yard with it last night briefly and it doesn't appear that it's low light performance is any better than the original, but maybe it will be interesting to see if anything else has improved. And Thanks for Subscribing too! ... The channel currently has enough view time to be Monetized but not enough Subscriber's and I'm hoping to grow the channel into something that might be self supporting.
@@PhoenixRising62 After watching your video and some others I have decided against getting a sightmark unit. The wraith lacks sound and the photon lacks color for daytime use so I will be getting an ATN x sight II or 4k pro. They sell refurbished scopes from ATN for a fair price. Thanks for subscribing! I am in the same boat with my channel. Best of luck to you!
I can’t get over the fact you called the green screen a gimmick. It’s really not it’s actually for your eye at night. Reduces the time you eye has to adjust to darkness.
Actually I just replied to a comment similar to yours just a week ago concerning Green on the Wraith made by Nate 88, so please refer to that comment for a more detailed reply, apparently I should have explained that remark better at it seems to be getting taken the wrong way. I'm not bashing Green, as I like Green over Black and White if you're using a monochrome display... It's Sightmark's implementation that IMO is a Gimmick. The SiOnyx Aurora also has a "Green" mode that also is more Gimmick than practical for the same reason (though not as pronounced as the Wraith), by the same token. Recently I just have gotten the Opportunity to use a Leupold LTO-Tracker 2 HD Thermal which has a Green mode and my opinion so far (haven't had much time with the Tracker yet) is that their implementation seems pretty Spot-On.
UPDATE AND CORRECTION: In this video I stated that the Wraith has 5 separate profiles that you can Rename to whatever you want, and that is Not entirely true... The Wraith does have 5 separate profiles and you can rename them, but the renaming is limited to having Three Digits you can choose for the Caliber and another three for the bullet weight with the format XXX Cal. XXX Gr. (you can only change the "XXX"). Sorry for missing this on the initial review!
Just adding an FYI ... There have been several comments that I've not been able to reply to that show up in my feed, but not where I can reply... So if you've asked a question and I've not replied, I'm not ignoring the channel, but RUclips has some glitches in the way it's commenting works that sometimes makes things "difficult". Thanks!
I have both wraith has better picture, focusing the RT is helped if you pop the pinhole disc out of the lens cap for a bigger aperture, it's all about depth of field !
I enjoyed the opportunity to compare the two scopes however, it was vary difficult to follow which scope you were using at various times as you did not clearly identify which was in operation at each time you changed views. I am still a bit confused as to which is which.
Great video. Thanks for putting it together. I am looking for a night vision scope for a Benjamin Marauder .25 for 25 - 50 yard max shooting. IT is a bolt action. Would you recommend the Photon RT for that purpose?
I would think that the Photon would be good for that... The one that I have can still be had for about $430 on Amazon, if you want the one with the less visible illuminator (the 940nm vs. 850nm) it's aroud $550. Here is a link to the Spec's from Sightmark for this scope sightmark.com/product.php?item=999 The only concern that I would have with mounting a scope on a high powered air rifle is that some of them have a very high recoil impulse (thinking the break barrel type that either have very heavy springs or gas charged pistons), if the Marauder is a pump up, or uses a gas charge (that you have to refill) then there shouldn't be any issues, and even if it is the type with heavy recoil the Photon is rated for .375 Holland and Holland recoil (big game type round), though the Wraith is only rated to .308 Winchester recoil and when I had it mounted on a .308 PTR-91 I had issues with it (I mentioned them in my PTR Video's and plan on doing a follow up on the Wraith when I get the chance with something with less power to try and give it a second chance).
If I had to pick one currently it would be the Photon RT, Since this Video I posted two video's on the PTR-91 and on the 2nd one I used the Sightmark Wraith HD for a reference scope and had a lot of problems with it even though it is rated to 308 recoil those issues included a POI shift as I was shooting, the scope shifting out of focus as I was shooting, several Lock-ups when recording video with it where in order to stop recording or access the menu I literally had to remove the batteries, plus it not responding linearly or like the manual states when sighting it in. Now to be fair I've not tried the Photon under similar circumstances, but the fact is I will likely be doing an RMA on the Wraith (and I've already returned the IR Illuminator TWICE, with the 3rd one not working correctly.. turns on and off, but can't adjust the brightness like it's supposed to). If the Wraith did not have all of the issues that mine does (and maybe I just got a bad one... will have to wait and see there), It would be a Decent Scope since it does do Color / Daytime but is less effective for Night use, but I would likely limit it to a rimfire rifle for stuff like relatively close in varmit type stuff or rabbit hunting etc, while the Photon IMO is as good or better than a single tube Gen 1 scope (but not a Gen 2 or Gen 1 Cascade) for nighttime use. I will be doing another follow up with the Wraith, hopefully sometime in the next couple of months. As for your second question I'm not sure what you're asking... The one that can Zoom in closer is the Wraith HD, it's 4x with an 8x digital zoom (though in reality 3x or maybe 4x are all that's usable IMO) while the Photon in 4.5x with a 2x digital zoom (though they do make them in 6x with 2x digital zoom but they are more expensive).
Ok, There are two wavelengths of illuminators that you will see on the market. The most common ones are 850nm based which for the two scopes used in this video is what is included (separately on the Wraith and built in on this particular model* of the Photon RT). 850nm Illuminators are more visible to the naked eye and both people and animals can see a focused 850 at 300+ yards (I've checked at 300 personally)... It won't be bright, but it will be fairly easy to see. The second type of illuminator you will see are 940nm. These are much more difficult to see with the naked eye and tend not to "Spook" game as much as the 850's. (I've checked them and I couldn't see the 940 as much beyond 100 yards- but Human night vision isn't that good). Now one thing to keep in mind is that 940's also don't put out as much usable light for night vision as 850's will for the wattage (from my experience I would say about 15-20% less usable for Gen 3 and Digital NV), and they work very poorly for some Night vision (esp. Gen 1 & Gen 2, or at least the Gen 2 I have been able to test them with). If you look at Game Camera's the newer ones that tout "Invisible Lights" are using 940nm LED's instead of 850's. *Note: if you look at the Photon RT's there are four models... Two 4.5x and Two 6x and with the models with an "S" at the end having 850nm Illuminators and the one's without the "S" at the end using 940nm illuminators. The Wraith only comes with an external 850nm (which isn't that good... it uses CR123 batteries and SM's quality control on these SUCKS!... When I got my Wraith I had to return the illuminaor Twice to get one that worked correctly, then when I Returned my early version scope (a preordered one) due to loss of focus problems the new one they sent me also had a faulty illuminator that wouldn't adjust brightness). Oh, and the 940nm versions of the Photon are also more expensive (about +$50 or greater when I purchased my RT).
i own a yukon photon rt 6x50, it's my first night visor so i can't compare but according to all the videos i watched,i think the atn xsight and the pard008 are better (especially the pard)
RE the Photon RT, what is difference between the "S" model and its sister model. It appears to be $50.00 or so cheaper. Why? Which one for hogs and coyotes?
If you read the specs between the two the only difference between them is the built in Illuminator, the Cheaper one has an 850nm and the more expensive one has a 940nm. What that means in the field is that the 850 emits more visible to the naked eye light than the 940. If you are familiar with game cameras you've likely seen images where the Deer appear to be Posing for the Picture and looking directly at the camera, those cameras use an array of 850nm LED's. Some of the newer / more expensive game cameras will say they are "Invisible" etc. and supposedly don't spook game as much, they use 940nm LED's. In the field using the add on illuminators with an approx. 1" lens up front I can see an 850 at 300 yards with the naked eye (likely farther but the range that I test at is limited to 300 yards) with the same style 940 illuminators I can see it faintly at 100 yards and by 200 it's pretty much imperceptable. One other thing about the 940's ... They don't put out as much usable light for night vision (and perform very poorly with Gen 1 regular NV), so they don't illuminate quite as well. FWIW I've not had the opportunity to play with a Photon with a built in 940, I've just used aftermarket 940's with it. And no matter which model Photon you pick up you can pick up a Cheaper illuminator of the other frequency for around $50 USD or so (they use 18650 lipo batteries, so you will also need a couple of spare batteries etc as well).
I just bought the Wraith HD. It's my 1st scope. The soft rubber piece you look through to aim, mine has a small hole on the left side of it. It looks like a dart puncture. Is this normal/intentional? It's Sunday and I can't call Sightmark or store I purchased from.
The hole is perfectly normal, it's a vent hole so that the rubber eyepiece doesn't suction to your face or glasses etc. I've seen similar holes on other eyecups too.
Actually Yes you can power the Photon RT using the unit's micro SD port with USB power over-riding the battery pack if available (when plugged in the Photon will show a plug icon in the top right of the screen to show that you are operating on USB power instead of the battery meter). Additionally as an FYI you do not even need to have batteries in the battery pack or for that matter the battery pack / holder can even be removed without affecting the Photon's operation if operating on USB Power.
Also, just thinking about it I did put together a 5,000ma external picatinny mount battery pack for use with a FLIR PTS233 that would also work with the Photon (although I don't know how long it would last) using this battery: www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01CU1EC6Y/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1 and a 30mm offset ring mount. This battery is actually about 31.5mm in diameter so it was a challenge to mount the battery in the offset ring but other than that it worked out well.
Could you elaborate? In which segment?... Part of this video was shot with cameras behind the scopes (with the banding on the wraith), part was internal recorded video which looks better. A couple of points to remember with the Wraith also is that while the Sensor resolution and recorded video is 1920x1080 (1080p), the actual display screen that you look at is only 1280x720 (720p), so the recorded quality is better than what you see looking through the scope. The banding that you see in the video on the wraith when recorded from behind is due to the refresh rate of the Wraith's display speed, which appears to be much slower than the view screen on the Photon. One additional note, The Wraith in the video was a purchased early production unit, and on the one that I purchased it had a point of impact shift when mounted on a .308 caliber rifle (which it is rated for) and it also developed focus issues where it would not stay in focus after a few rounds. I ended up having to do an RMA and they ended up giving me a whole new scope which also has updated firmware. I have not fully tested the replacement, however as far as it's NV capabilities and "rubber banding" when panning rapidly those issues still persist. One other thing I will say about the Wraith - They have very poor quality control with the included IR Illuminators... When I first received the Wraith the illuminator quit working after being cycled on and off just a few times. I went to Sightmark and received a Replacement which was again faulty and only turned ON and OFF without cycling through the three levels of illumination. I sent that one back and finally received a good illuminator. Then when I had to send my Wraith back I had to include the illuminator and when I received my new unit the illuminator the new illuminator again would only cycle ON and OFF without the different brightness levels... I've yet to contact Sightmark on on the last one, but I'm very unimpressed with the quality control on the Wraith line... Meanwhile the Photon has been rock solid. Personally I feel that Sightmark made the Wraith to compete with ATN and has sacrificed quality and function for having a "Wonderscope". A trend which I hope they do not continue to pursue.
@@Michiganwatch Sorry to disappoint, I had high hopes for the Wraith as there was a lot of hype (and several NV / Hog Hunting channels that also were raving about it). But the real reason I bought into it was after buying a Photon RT and seeing how well it functioned in (though limited in resolution) I hoped the Wraith would follow suit. From the quick change battery pack to simple and functional controls the Ugly Ducking Photon was actually very friendly to use. Even the focus ring had large enough lugs and was far enough forward to use your thumb vs having to take your hand off of the rifle to focus. The real truth is I'm still waiting for digital to close the gap with traditional Gen 2 or 3 NV. So far the closest I've seen is the SiOnyx Units which are not scopes, but I got a heck of a deal last black friday weekend on Aurora Sport (it was $299 that weekend vs. $500+) which is a viewer only and it's fairly close in capability to a an MX-9644 based Gen 2 (the tube that is in the PVS-4, TVS-5 Military Scopes and VVS-2 Armored vehicle NV System). I have a full review of it in my channel and I'm hoping that SiOnyx up's the resolution and develops a Day / Night vision scope as their system shows a lot of promise. Thanks for watching and Commenting. Oh, and I'm hoping to get another video out on the replacement Wraith to see if any of the issues have been fixed, esp. the aim point shift and loss of focus due to recoil.
Needed to learn how to adjust the Wrait!!!!!His pictures suck ,his ir is not centered,its put of focus!!!! I can shoot a field rat st 100 yrs with mine!!!
If you are in the US the Wraith is about $500 (and hard to find in stock), and the Photon RT in this video (which is the cheapest one that is 4.5x vs 6.5x and has the more visible IR illuminator) is available for around $430 on Amazon at this time.
@@PhoenixRising62 I didn't look into sightmark, but I noticed, that a lot of US brands, like ATN, Moonlight, Lunaoptics and a few other, I can't remember, tend to sell re branded devices from former soviet states and china. Yukon is a Belarusian and Japanese joint venture. And they list this device, as something they manufacture. I was just hoping you might have noticed some markings, that say made in USA(indicating it's a licensed build) or some other indication of the origin. Something drives me to figure out which of the many seemingly identical devices out there are copies, knockoffs or re brands.
@@heyarno actually I just looked at the unit and this particular unit is made in Belarus, so you are likely right with it being rebranded Yukon etc. The one thing that I wonder about (but won't spend the money buy just to see) is on some of the units like say the Firefield NVRS and the similar Yukon scopes which always seemed to be priced high for what they were are in fact the same or if the Yukon brand has better tubes, etc.
@@PhoenixRising62 Thanks, it's good to know, these units have good quality and are not just knockoffs. And I agree on the not spending money just to find out part. There are so many cases that would need investigation, that it's ridiculous to try. It's better when the community of night vision users shares the information they have.
Someone has to pay you to crap on the wraith lmao this the only review ive seen on RUclips with this horrible a quality and this many complaints... I have neither but Jesus I'm not trusting this at all especially since I've seen the wraith in person
Believe what you want. But I have to ask - Do you even know what you are saying? - First if you don't agree with the video that's fine, Post a comment with some content. - And accusing someone of being paid to bash a product? Back it up Please! - .... Especially when I'm "Bashing" and comparing two products from the same Company! And who might pay for that service? - The fact is that I have took out and tested a number of NV and Thermal products (and have purchased them- not been given or loaned them by someone selling them) and out of them the Wraith's performance is below par and about the only product I would put it above for use as a NV Scope Firefield NVRS, which is a Shame because If Sightmark had good sense they would have worked on improving the Photon's resolution and capabilities because functionality wise it's a top notch product. Is it "Ok" for a budget Day/Night scope ~ Yes, but to be honest it falls more into the "Techno Toy" category than anything, which is why it's currently sitting on a shelf instead of ready to go on a rifle in my home, and will likely at some point be mounted on a rimfire. And as food for thought perhaps some of the more glowing reviews are helping to sell products and either getting kickbacks or getting to borrow cool toys to do video's with from some of the folks selling said items (and that's not an accusation, but I actually ordered my Wraith from a company who happens to support just one such RUclips channel and funny their review happened to be one of the more "Glowing" reviews.) So you're welcome to you opinion... But accusing someone of being paid to bash something because you disagree is pretty lame.
It is lame, I'm sure he bought one and is trying to justify it and bashing you is his way of doing it. I was going to pull the trigger on a Wraith because I saw a lot RUclips videos hyping it, i didn't consider the photon because its ugly as shit, but after watching your videos and further reading reviews it seems like a rock solid NV scope and i will probably get one in the near future.Thanks for the videos, i have learned a lot about Night vision, and I purchased a Leupold Tracker 2HD thanks to you. Late.
Sorry for not replying sooner, somehow I missed your comment.... I wouldn't say Trash, It might be good for some people, but with a very limited scope (no pun intended). Definitely wouldn't recommend it for higher recoil rifles even though it's rated for 308, but for someone who wants to put something on a low recoil primarily day rifle who wants to record video and maybe do a little close in nighttime shooting (like rats in a barn or at a dump etc.) it might be a lot of fun. Other than that though I would say definitely better places to spend your hard earned $$$. I'd like to get a hold of an ATN X-Sight II (ATN's current digital "WonderScope") to compare since really that is the Wraith's closest competitor that I'm aware of. Thanks for Watching and Commenting~
Thanks for the comparison of the two. I was mulling the idea of getting a Wraith but think I’ll save up some more and get a Flir PTS233. Also I’ve been using a Photon RT for little over a year now and Really impressed with it. I shot hogs as close as 25 yards and as far as 250 yards. For the $$ it’s been a Fantastic unite. I am running a 6500 external battery pack as my power source, I can get thee solid nights of hunting with it keeping the Illuminator set at 4 so when I shoulder the rifle it’s got some illumination running. Also if using AA batteries get some rechargeable ones. It eats batteries pretty quickly.
If you don't mind My asking what caliber are you using the Photon RT with? If I remember correctly it says it's rated up to. 375 H&H. I do really like the Flir though so far I've only used it for observation (which is why I like it so much since it's small enough to also be good for observation / spotting).
@@davemiller3027 Cool, I've not mounted the Photon on a rifle, but from everything I've read it handles recoil well, wish I could say the same with the Wraith, but I wasn't happy with it on a 308 (PTR-91).
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Thanks for the comparison of the two. I was mulling the idea of getting a Wraith but think I’ll save up some more and get a Flir PTS233. Also I’ve been using a Photon RT for little over a year now and Really impressed with it. I shot hogs as close as 25 yards and as far as 250 yards. For the $$ it’s been a Fantastic unite. I am running a 6500 external battery pack as my power source, I can get thee solid nights of hunting with it keeping the Illuminator set at 4 so when I shoulder the rifle it’s got some illumination running. Also if using AA batteries get some rechargeable ones. It eats batteries pretty quickly.
Thank you for the good information on the pHOTON RT 4.5 . I was thinking of getting one but all these replies I feel better now knowing that it is better for night hunting . I will use this only for Night Hunt and for hogs mainly 25 to 200 yards.with most of my shots being 50 &100 yards . so I did subscribe and thank you for a good video very well explain & keep them comeing
Thanks!
I guess it's the way the camera sees the recorded video but my Wraith is way better than the images shown here. The detail, color, and brightness are way better than they appear in this video. Day time video is crazy high resolution and night time is almost as good. I couldn't be happier with the Wraith especially considering the price.
I'm glad you are happy with your purchase and that it works for you, which is all that really matters ~ As for the external recorded video from the scopes it's very challenging to show exactly what the human eye sees for many reasons, but when doing comparative type videos I usually try to keep all settings identical for everything to where I'm not biasing what I'm showing. The biggest problem technically is that many LCD screens have color shifts and banding because of how individual screens refresh, and with traditional night vision it's the limited brightness of the screen that makes it hard to record. Unfortunately by trying to be fair (and doing minimal editing of the video) the results are not always going to look as good as what we perceive. Thanks for posting!
@@PhoenixRising62 I liked your review but I do wonder if you might have gotten a sub-par example. I have mine on a 308 AR-10 and have had zero issues with anything. I have probably shot around 200 rounds with it and it's never even blinked. I recently took it on a hog hunt and used it day and night and it worked perfectly. The Wraith does have some short comings as I see it too. I had to add an external power supply even while using high end rechargeable batteries. I also wish it had audio recording. I had an Armasight Nemesis 6X gen 2 HD and an ATN X-Sight II 5-20 and I didn't like either of those units. All that said my personal experience with the Wraith has been very good. Thanks for the review!
@@bigjimmy6690 Thanks for your Comment! ... I just got off of the phone with Sightmark and after talking with their Support Technician I've submitted an RMA. What the Tech told me was that the early wraith's had recoil issues that had to be corrected, I had pre-ordered mine from Outdoor Legacy and it was shipped the end of April last year. It's odd that if there was a know issue I wasn't contacted as I did register the product and had actually contacted them as the illuminator that came with my scope failed after turning it on and off a couple of times. Anyway Thanks for the Feedback, I'm going to put a note in the description for this Video about the RMA and the Issue and once all of the dust settles I'll update the video or post a new one.
BigJimmy mine is on a ptr91 no issues year later
@@nativejuicevapors Unfortunately mine recently faild. It started shooting all over the place one day at the range. It worked and looked fine but Consecutive shots were as much as 8 inches apart. I contacted Sightmark and they gave me an RMA number and said send it in. Lucky for me I only live about 20 minutes away from their headquarters so shipping was quick. In less than a week I had a brand new unit at my door. I mounted it up and went to the range. It worked perfectly like the other one did before it broke. So I have to say their customer service is excellent. My only issue now is will it break again? I go hog hunting a couple times a year. I don't know anyone with a place to hunt so I have to pay to hunt. Here in Texas hunting on someone else's property is quite expensive. I also have to drive as much as 400 miles one way to get to the ranch. So needless to say I can not afford for a piece of equipment to fail on a hunting trip. So I am considering wether or not I want to keep the unit or sell it. I have a hard time trusting something once it has broke especially so soon after I bought it.
That was the best and most useful comparison. I was going for the Wraith, but no more. Yes the Wraith is better for day, an example not shown, but I 'm not buying it for day use. Thank you.
Thanks! ~ I've been needing to re-mount the Wraith and do further testing (I had it on a PTR-91 and it seemed like it had an aim point shift partway through testing and would also have focus shift while shooting a string of shots), but I've had too many other irons in the fire to do it. There is a section in my PTR-91 review on some of the issues encountered with the Wraith, but I want to do some more testing on something with less recoil. In fairness I've not yet tried the Photon on a Rifle so I can't speak for it.
@@PhoenixRising62 Thanks for that update that make my desicion even more confident. The Photon has been out there for a much longer period of time of years, as compared to months for the Wriath. The Photon has proven itself, and by your excellent demonstration and keen analysis, clearly show the Photon is better night scope than the Wraith. The Wraith is more versatile, but it compromised in the NV part of the equation.
The wraith does have a hot standby feature. Press and hold the arrow facing you for a few seconds the display shuts down and you can turn it back on by pushing the power button once. It does save some time versus shutting the scope off completely. I dont know about battery life as i havent tried it yet.
True, The Photon also has a similar feature... I've seen reviews / comments on Amazon etc. where people have complained about the batteries draining with the Photon off which are likely due to folk not understanding the "standby" feature on these scopes vs. shutting them completely off. The truth is that every digital and thermal scope out there that I've seen are all battery hogs between having to continuously run the Sensor, Screen and Processor, and also their using standard types and sizes of batteries compared to specialty battery packs. I have seen some of the Thermal's etc. that do use proprietary battery packs that likely give better run times, but I'm a little leery of them just because if I'm going to spend a lot of $$$ on a scope I don't want something that several years down the road I won't be able to get batteries for, or get gouged just to keep my equipment operable.
I do use rechargeable batteries in both the Photon and the Wraith with good results (and rechargeable CR123's in two thermal devices as well), but I would advise people to test their battery life with the particular brand / type of batteries they plan on using and swap them out based on how long they last (giving a say 15-20 minute margin on the safe side) since most rechargeable batteries drop off voltage very quickly when they get close to empty (not linear like non-rechargeable types) so if you were out hunting your batteries could deplete without much warning since the battery meters in these scopes aren't set up / calibrated to be accurate with other than disposable battery types. Also in the case of the AA rechargeables since they are NiMh and not Lithium they do lose their charge in storage much faster (though some are now designed to last longer while stored) so while they are usable, there are additional logistics involved.
One other thing just as an aside ~ Battery Life is another big advantage of Traditional NV over Thermal, and the reason for that is the lack of having to run all of the above off of your battery, since Traditional NV tubes are based on High Voltage and photon's being used to generate electrons which are then multiplied and directly excite a phosphor screen all of which is very efficient in comparison.
The Wraith is the clear winner in the value for what you get category. BTW you run the external battery pack and it goes for days. The RTs that I have had (2) were all junk neither worked well and one lasted a whole year before crapping out, the other about 4 months, returned for repair, 2 months, repair and then I sold it - , but I went to Pulsar for thermal., and now that ATN has worked out its early model issues on the X-sight 2, is a far better HD day/night scope than either of these scopes. A couple of observations from using them both. 1) The Wraith is actually waterproof - the RT not so much. Having to use a pinhole is a complete no-go for a tactical application - the Wraith will auto compensate very quickly to sudden bright light, the RT is useless until you fumble around, find the pinhole cover, and wait for YOUR vision to night adapt again. Since everyone in the industry has profiles now - the RT is just obsolete in comparison.. Just some things to keep in mind. I would personally not buy either right now with ATN stepping up so well.
Thanks for adding your Experience. While I've not used my RT on anything with substantial recoil, I did use the Wraith on a PTR-91 .308 and had loss of Zero and focus shift issues and ended up sending it back. My wraith was a first production run version (had to pre-order it) and when I contacted Sightmark they said that there were issues with those. So I sent my Wraith back and what I received was an entirely new scope. I have not since tested in on a high recoil firearm.
As an aside while Sightmark customer support was friendly and responsive I also had issues with the illuminator ... The first one died after cycling it on and off a couple of times, sent just that back and got a 2nd one that would not change brightness levels, sent that one back and finally got a 3rd one that worked. Unfortunately when I had the scope replaced I had to send EVERYTHING back and guess what - When I got the new scope the illuminator again would not cycle through brightness levels so I just gave up on it. So I've overall got mixed feelings about Sightmark's QC and Customer Service concerning the Wraith.
I have both , what I have found is they work well in open fields , not so much with heavy wooded areas with branches in the path of scoping . The reflection from these branches is a problem for me .
I'm waiting for my photon rt to come in the mail now! After watching this video I now know that I made the right decision. I'm replacing my ATN xsight, which resembles the Wraith, and has a horrible eye relief issue on bolt actions. I chose the photon RT because it looks like I could get the right eye relief using regular scope rings.
Cool and Thanks! Which version and magnification of the x-sight did you have?
@@PhoenixRising62 It was the first version of the x sight 5x18. Despite a lot of bad reviews, I didn't have any other problems with it except for eye relief. I chose to switch to the sightmark at the recommendation from Lonestar Boars when I was struggling with moving scope back far enough to close the gap to my eye.
@@bobbyduck4673 Cool, at some point I want to get an X-Sight 2 for testing, It likely won't be for awhile. You will likely be happy with the RT, I wish Sightmark would come out with an updated version with higher resolution and perhaps use a SiOnyx type sensor (though at the moment they don't have anything in 1080p, as although the Photon won't win any contests for looks in mounting it what I found was that the simple controls and large over-textured focus ring at the front were actually outstanding as the scope is long enough that I could use the thumb on my foregrip hand to focus very fast and effectively which is not the case on the Wraith and likely the photon either so between that and having a built in illuminator that can be aimed and actually works (meaning it really is all you need without anything else), I have been much more impressed than I expected to be with it.
@@PhoenixRising62 what I found on the original x sight was that when I mounted an ir light to the mount on side of scope, that I was unable to turn the focus ring because the ir flashlight blocked it. My hunting buddy has the x sight 4K pro. It seems really nice, but I went with the recommendations of someone else.
@@PhoenixRising62 I have a Savage bolt action 22-250 with a picatinny rail, any idea what scope ring height I'm going to need? Was hoping to get a jump on preparations before the scope comes in on Friday.
Green is not a gimmick. It is much less harsh on the eyes when scoped for long periods of time and many people find it easier to acquire targets in the dark.
Actually you are partially correct. Green is less harsh on the eyes than a WP or black and white image.. And the human eye is also more sensitive to green than other colors. But that is not what I am talking about as far as it's being a "Gimmick". It is Sightmark's implimentation of the Green screen that I am talking about that is a Gimmick... Basically Sightmark just washes over the screen with Green so that the contrast between dark and light is greatly diminished. Had Sightmark spent the time to do this correctly (as in going Monochrome and applying green to only the what is white while leaving contrast intact) it would be useable, but as it is applied in the wraith IMO it is a poor substitute with its only real value being to allow someone to pretend the wraith is conventional night vision. And Sightmark isn't alone as far as digital scope manufacturers doing this as I have a SiOnyx Aurora Sport that also has this "Feature" and implements it the same way (although they do a slightly better job)....
Some additional thoughts on this are that these manufacturers are doing this for one or both of two reasons... First because it's cheap and easy to just add a green overcast to everything vs. processing the image to keep contrast and make it effective (aka profit over perfection), or perhaps it could be that they haven't figured out (or the hardware / software solutions haven't been developed) how to correctly do this or perhaps more likely the hardware processing power is not there to do this properly without inducing further lag in the image, which is one of the major issues digital NV currently struggles with.
Have been looking for something on the affordable end of night scopes, was at a gun store over the weekend had the pleasure of testing a 7,000 NV scope lmao well that cleared up a lot of questions. Normal zooming field of view 100% could hunt at night like it was day
Absolutely, I've built (assembled) some night vision using both Gen 2 and NOS (New Old Stock) blemished tubes that you can get on Fleabay for a pretty reasonable price sometimes and it's a Night and Day difference (pun intended) with what they are capable of. But on the low end from my experience so far I feel the Photon RT is the most bang for the buck out of what I've seen and generally works better than the low end Gen 1 scopes.
If you don't mind Old Mil-Surp you can find Gen 1 Cascade (three G1 tubes back to back) Zeiss Fero Z51 / Orion 80 scopes on Fleabay for around the same price as the Photon / Wraith, They are Large and require a Picatinny mount that has the cut-outs / screws for a STANAG mount, but they offer a lot of bang for the buck (they were what was used on the G-3's up into the 90's from my understanding) I actually want to do a video comparing one to the Photon as it would be cool to see, since the commercial Gen 1's only use one tube (I believe the US PVS-2 was also a cascade tube scope as well). For a little more (like around $1k) you can still fine US PVS-4 scopes as well which are Gen 2. I don't have any experience with them but would love to get the chance to play with one.
Great job fella! Really. Thanks for taking the time do shoot this video. Its the best comparison video going on those 2 scopes. By far.
Thanks!
Thanks for this review. I've got a photon rt 4.5s and have been very pleased. I have a wraith on order for a 2nd setup but have been torn with the features of the wraith vs what I get with the photon. My intended use is night only as day time digital is not allowed in the 2 states I do the majority of my hunting. That said the fact that the wraith doesn't have sound or wifi with the photo stream app is a real downer to me. Typically we have several people with us hunting and it makes it a lot more fun for everyone to be involved via the app. I also like the battery swap on the photon as well. The only plus of the wraith is the sd card. After watching your video I think I have decided to cancel my wraith order and go with the photon which I can get for $100 less than the wraith right now. When the 2nd gen version of the wraith is released I'll give it another look and maybe upgrade then. Maybe it will have sound and wifi built in.
Glad you found the video helpful ~ And it sounds like the Photon and Phone App works well for you? I tried with two different android phones and couldn't get it to function full or stream on either. What Devices have you been using (may have to revisit the app) if you don't mind my asking?
@@PhoenixRising62 have been using my iPad mini 2 and my Google pixel 2 phone successfully.
Went ahead and ordered a 2nd photon. When the wraith adds sound and wifi I'll revisit. For what I'm using this for the photon fits the bill.
I use the photon here in mn and it's nice to know if its snowing I can still use the scope without the IR. I have used the photon for 3yrs now and has never malfunctioned
That's good to hear! I have to say from it's looks the Photon isn't too inspiring, but once you get to use it you can really appreciate how well designed it really is. I'd love to see an update to it using something like the sensor out of a SiOnyx Aurora..
Have You been burning batteries up recently in MN Jesse 😏
@@texanbalaban6777 hahaha I wish
@@JESSEHIGGINS507 😁
I have the 2 power Wrath on my crossbow its quite deadly at 20 yards,, i also put a large zip tie on the Lenze that's hard to turn with the nub out for one finger focus.
Cool! And that's a Good Idea with the Zip Tie... I actually have might have to see if something like that might help on one of my Thermals that could use a better grip on the front lens.. Thanks!
@@PhoenixRising62 A bit of gorilla tape underneath the zip will give it grip, my wrath was very hard to move with a few fingers torquing it, now with the zip it's a one-finger focus.
Very helpful video! I am looking to get a digital scope for close range pest control and medium range hunting. I am trying to decide between the photon and the atn x-sight II.
Thanks! ... I'm hoping to get to play with an x-sight II to play with and compare at some point, just waiting for the resources and a good price on a used one on Fleabay to be there at the same time. Also I will be doing an update on the Wraith at some point as I had issues with it (loss of focus while shooting and point of impact shift) and a viewer said he had none of those issues so I contacted Sightmark and found out that the early production Wraiths had some issues so I sent my Wraith in and they actually gave me a Whole new Scope - Just got it back Yesterday, and it also has version 03.19.09 firmware with my Original having 02.19.01. I did turn it on and look around the yard with it last night briefly and it doesn't appear that it's low light performance is any better than the original, but maybe it will be interesting to see if anything else has improved. And Thanks for Subscribing too! ... The channel currently has enough view time to be Monetized but not enough Subscriber's and I'm hoping to grow the channel into something that might be self supporting.
@@PhoenixRising62 After watching your video and some others I have decided against getting a sightmark unit. The wraith lacks sound and the photon lacks color for daytime use so I will be getting an ATN x sight II or 4k pro. They sell refurbished scopes from ATN for a fair price. Thanks for subscribing! I am in the same boat with my channel. Best of luck to you!
I can’t get over the fact you called the green screen a gimmick. It’s really not it’s actually for your eye at night. Reduces the time you eye has to adjust to darkness.
Actually I just replied to a comment similar to yours just a week ago concerning Green on the Wraith made by Nate 88, so please refer to that comment for a more detailed reply, apparently I should have explained that remark better at it seems to be getting taken the wrong way.
I'm not bashing Green, as I like Green over Black and White if you're using a monochrome display... It's Sightmark's implementation that IMO is a Gimmick. The SiOnyx Aurora also has a "Green" mode that also is more Gimmick than practical for the same reason (though not as pronounced as the Wraith), by the same token. Recently I just have gotten the Opportunity to use a Leupold LTO-Tracker 2 HD Thermal which has a Green mode and my opinion so far (haven't had much time with the Tracker yet) is that their implementation seems pretty Spot-On.
impretty sure its listed as a 4-32 x 50 just like my bushnell is 3-9x40 the first two numbers are zoom range
UPDATE AND CORRECTION: In this video I stated that the Wraith has 5 separate profiles that you can Rename to whatever you want, and that is Not entirely true... The Wraith does have 5 separate profiles and you can rename them, but the renaming is limited to having Three Digits you can choose for the Caliber and another three for the bullet weight with the format XXX Cal. XXX Gr. (you can only change the "XXX"). Sorry for missing this on the initial review!
Just adding an FYI ... There have been several comments that I've not been able to reply to that show up in my feed, but not where I can reply... So if you've asked a question and I've not replied, I'm not ignoring the channel, but RUclips has some glitches in the way it's commenting works that sometimes makes things "difficult". Thanks!
I have both wraith has better picture, focusing the RT is helped if you pop the pinhole disc out of the lens cap for a bigger aperture, it's all about depth of field !
I enjoyed the opportunity to compare the two scopes however, it was vary difficult to follow which scope you were using at various times as you did not clearly identify which was in operation at each time you changed views. I am still a bit confused as to which is which.
Great video. Thanks for putting it together. I am looking for a night vision scope for a Benjamin Marauder .25 for 25 - 50 yard max shooting. IT is a bolt action. Would you recommend the Photon RT for that purpose?
I would think that the Photon would be good for that... The one that I have can still be had for about $430 on Amazon, if you want the one with the less visible illuminator (the 940nm vs. 850nm) it's aroud $550. Here is a link to the Spec's from Sightmark for this scope sightmark.com/product.php?item=999 The only concern that I would have with mounting a scope on a high powered air rifle is that some of them have a very high recoil impulse (thinking the break barrel type that either have very heavy springs or gas charged pistons), if the Marauder is a pump up, or uses a gas charge (that you have to refill) then there shouldn't be any issues, and even if it is the type with heavy recoil the Photon is rated for .375 Holland and Holland recoil (big game type round), though the Wraith is only rated to .308 Winchester recoil and when I had it mounted on a .308 PTR-91 I had issues with it (I mentioned them in my PTR Video's and plan on doing a follow up on the Wraith when I get the chance with something with less power to try and give it a second chance).
2 Questions ... if you had to pick one, which would you choose? 2) Which one is actually zooming out to the target on the far right?
If I had to pick one currently it would be the Photon RT, Since this Video I posted two video's on the PTR-91 and on the 2nd one I used the Sightmark Wraith HD for a reference scope and had a lot of problems with it even though it is rated to 308 recoil those issues included a POI shift as I was shooting, the scope shifting out of focus as I was shooting, several Lock-ups when recording video with it where in order to stop recording or access the menu I literally had to remove the batteries, plus it not responding linearly or like the manual states when sighting it in. Now to be fair I've not tried the Photon under similar circumstances, but the fact is I will likely be doing an RMA on the Wraith (and I've already returned the IR Illuminator TWICE, with the 3rd one not working correctly.. turns on and off, but can't adjust the brightness like it's supposed to).
If the Wraith did not have all of the issues that mine does (and maybe I just got a bad one... will have to wait and see there), It would be a Decent Scope since it does do Color / Daytime but is less effective for Night use, but I would likely limit it to a rimfire rifle for stuff like relatively close in varmit type stuff or rabbit hunting etc, while the Photon IMO is as good or better than a single tube Gen 1 scope (but not a Gen 2 or Gen 1 Cascade) for nighttime use.
I will be doing another follow up with the Wraith, hopefully sometime in the next couple of months.
As for your second question I'm not sure what you're asking... The one that can Zoom in closer is the Wraith HD, it's 4x with an 8x digital zoom (though in reality 3x or maybe 4x are all that's usable IMO) while the Photon in 4.5x with a 2x digital zoom (though they do make them in 6x with 2x digital zoom but they are more expensive).
Great video. Thank you. Gonna buy me a Photon RT now that I've watched this.
I have an rt and I'd much rather run the wraith.
Can anyone educate me on the wavelength animals get spooked with and how these two scopes pick up different wavelength illuminators?
Ok, There are two wavelengths of illuminators that you will see on the market. The most common ones are 850nm based which for the two scopes used in this video is what is included (separately on the Wraith and built in on this particular model* of the Photon RT). 850nm Illuminators are more visible to the naked eye and both people and animals can see a focused 850 at 300+ yards (I've checked at 300 personally)... It won't be bright, but it will be fairly easy to see.
The second type of illuminator you will see are 940nm. These are much more difficult to see with the naked eye and tend not to "Spook" game as much as the 850's. (I've checked them and I couldn't see the 940 as much beyond 100 yards- but Human night vision isn't that good). Now one thing to keep in mind is that 940's also don't put out as much usable light for night vision as 850's will for the wattage (from my experience I would say about 15-20% less usable for Gen 3 and Digital NV), and they work very poorly for some Night vision (esp. Gen 1 & Gen 2, or at least the Gen 2 I have been able to test them with). If you look at Game Camera's the newer ones that tout "Invisible Lights" are using 940nm LED's instead of 850's.
*Note: if you look at the Photon RT's there are four models... Two 4.5x and Two 6x and with the models with an "S" at the end having 850nm Illuminators and the one's without the "S" at the end using 940nm illuminators. The Wraith only comes with an external 850nm (which isn't that good... it uses CR123 batteries and SM's quality control on these SUCKS!... When I got my Wraith I had to return the illuminaor Twice to get one that worked correctly, then when I Returned my early version scope (a preordered one) due to loss of focus problems the new one they sent me also had a faulty illuminator that wouldn't adjust brightness). Oh, and the 940nm versions of the Photon are also more expensive (about +$50 or greater when I purchased my RT).
Just got the Wraith HD. 20 minutes run time on 4 brand new batteries is more than a bit reduculas.
can the wraith be used on an xbow?
i own a yukon photon rt 6x50, it's my first night visor so i can't compare but according to all the videos i watched,i think the atn xsight and the pard008 are better (especially the pard)
RE the Photon RT, what is difference between the "S" model and its sister model. It appears to be $50.00 or so cheaper. Why? Which one for hogs and coyotes?
If you read the specs between the two the only difference between them is the built in Illuminator, the Cheaper one has an 850nm and the more expensive one has a 940nm. What that means in the field is that the 850 emits more visible to the naked eye light than the 940. If you are familiar with game cameras you've likely seen images where the Deer appear to be Posing for the Picture and looking directly at the camera, those cameras use an array of 850nm LED's. Some of the newer / more expensive game cameras will say they are "Invisible" etc. and supposedly don't spook game as much, they use 940nm LED's. In the field using the add on illuminators with an approx. 1" lens up front I can see an 850 at 300 yards with the naked eye (likely farther but the range that I test at is limited to 300 yards) with the same style 940 illuminators I can see it faintly at 100 yards and by 200 it's pretty much imperceptable.
One other thing about the 940's ... They don't put out as much usable light for night vision (and perform very poorly with Gen 1 regular NV), so they don't illuminate quite as well. FWIW I've not had the opportunity to play with a Photon with a built in 940, I've just used aftermarket 940's with it. And no matter which model Photon you pick up you can pick up a Cheaper illuminator of the other frequency for around $50 USD or so (they use 18650 lipo batteries, so you will also need a couple of spare batteries etc as well).
I just bought the Wraith HD. It's my 1st scope. The soft rubber piece you look through to aim, mine has a small hole on the left side of it. It looks like a dart puncture. Is this normal/intentional? It's Sunday and I can't call Sightmark or store I purchased from.
The hole is perfectly normal, it's a vent hole so that the rubber eyepiece doesn't suction to your face or glasses etc. I've seen similar holes on other eyecups too.
Appreciate the quick answer, thanks very much. Now I can relax!
Thanks for the info
Looks like the photon RT is discontinued so that leaves my original choice of the wraith
Can you run an external battery pack on the photon?
Actually Yes you can power the Photon RT using the unit's micro SD port with USB power over-riding the battery pack if available (when plugged in the Photon will show a plug icon in the top right of the screen to show that you are operating on USB power instead of the battery meter). Additionally as an FYI you do not even need to have batteries in the battery pack or for that matter the battery pack / holder can even be removed without affecting the Photon's operation if operating on USB Power.
Also, just thinking about it I did put together a 5,000ma external picatinny mount battery pack for use with a FLIR PTS233 that would also work with the Photon (although I don't know how long it would last) using this battery: www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01CU1EC6Y/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1 and a 30mm offset ring mount. This battery is actually about 31.5mm in diameter so it was a challenge to mount the battery in the offset ring but other than that it worked out well.
excellent reviews
Thanks!
Your the only one I have seen with the wraith with a crappy picture
Could you elaborate? In which segment?... Part of this video was shot with cameras behind the scopes (with the banding on the wraith), part was internal recorded video which looks better. A couple of points to remember with the Wraith also is that while the Sensor resolution and recorded video is 1920x1080 (1080p), the actual display screen that you look at is only 1280x720 (720p), so the recorded quality is better than what you see looking through the scope. The banding that you see in the video on the wraith when recorded from behind is due to the refresh rate of the Wraith's display speed, which appears to be much slower than the view screen on the Photon. One additional note, The Wraith in the video was a purchased early production unit, and on the one that I purchased it had a point of impact shift when mounted on a .308 caliber rifle (which it is rated for) and it also developed focus issues where it would not stay in focus after a few rounds. I ended up having to do an RMA and they ended up giving me a whole new scope which also has updated firmware. I have not fully tested the replacement, however as far as it's NV capabilities and "rubber banding" when panning rapidly those issues still persist.
One other thing I will say about the Wraith - They have very poor quality control with the included IR Illuminators... When I first received the Wraith the illuminator quit working after being cycled on and off just a few times. I went to Sightmark and received a Replacement which was again faulty and only turned ON and OFF without cycling through the three levels of illumination. I sent that one back and finally received a good illuminator. Then when I had to send my Wraith back I had to include the illuminator and when I received my new unit the illuminator the new illuminator again would only cycle ON and OFF without the different brightness levels... I've yet to contact Sightmark on on the last one, but I'm very unimpressed with the quality control on the Wraith line... Meanwhile the Photon has been rock solid. Personally I feel that Sightmark made the Wraith to compete with ATN and has sacrificed quality and function for having a "Wonderscope". A trend which I hope they do not continue to pursue.
Well that just sucks I had my mind made up to get that
@@Michiganwatch Sorry to disappoint, I had high hopes for the Wraith as there was a lot of hype (and several NV / Hog Hunting channels that also were raving about it). But the real reason I bought into it was after buying a Photon RT and seeing how well it functioned in (though limited in resolution) I hoped the Wraith would follow suit. From the quick change battery pack to simple and functional controls the Ugly Ducking Photon was actually very friendly to use. Even the focus ring had large enough lugs and was far enough forward to use your thumb vs having to take your hand off of the rifle to focus. The real truth is I'm still waiting for digital to close the gap with traditional Gen 2 or 3 NV. So far the closest I've seen is the SiOnyx Units which are not scopes, but I got a heck of a deal last black friday weekend on Aurora Sport (it was $299 that weekend vs. $500+) which is a viewer only and it's fairly close in capability to a an MX-9644 based Gen 2 (the tube that is in the PVS-4, TVS-5 Military Scopes and VVS-2 Armored vehicle NV System). I have a full review of it in my channel and I'm hoping that SiOnyx up's the resolution and develops a Day / Night vision scope as their system shows a lot of promise. Thanks for watching and Commenting. Oh, and I'm hoping to get another video out on the replacement Wraith to see if any of the issues have been fixed, esp. the aim point shift and loss of focus due to recoil.
Needed to learn how to adjust the Wrait!!!!!His pictures suck ,his ir is not centered,its put of focus!!!! I can shoot a field rat st 100 yrs with mine!!!
How much is it
If you are in the US the Wraith is about $500 (and hard to find in stock), and the Photon RT in this video (which is the cheapest one that is 4.5x vs 6.5x and has the more visible IR illuminator) is available for around $430 on Amazon at this time.
And I thought the Photon RT is made by Yukon.
No, but interestingly the android app for the photon is labeled / branded Yukon so they may be related.
@@PhoenixRising62 I didn't look into sightmark, but I noticed, that a lot of US brands, like ATN, Moonlight, Lunaoptics and a few other, I can't remember, tend to sell re branded devices from former soviet states and china. Yukon is a Belarusian and Japanese joint venture. And they list this device, as something they manufacture. I was just hoping you might have noticed some markings, that say made in USA(indicating it's a licensed build) or some other indication of the origin. Something drives me to figure out which of the many seemingly identical devices out there are copies, knockoffs or re brands.
@@heyarno actually I just looked at the unit and this particular unit is made in Belarus, so you are likely right with it being rebranded Yukon etc. The one thing that I wonder about (but won't spend the money buy just to see) is on some of the units like say the Firefield NVRS and the similar Yukon scopes which always seemed to be priced high for what they were are in fact the same or if the Yukon brand has better tubes, etc.
@@PhoenixRising62 Thanks, it's good to know, these units have good quality and are not just knockoffs.
And I agree on the not spending money just to find out part. There are so many cases that would need investigation, that it's ridiculous to try. It's better when the community of night vision users shares the information they have.
Someone has to pay you to crap on the wraith lmao this the only review ive seen on RUclips with this horrible a quality and this many complaints... I have neither but Jesus I'm not trusting this at all especially since I've seen the wraith in person
Believe what you want. But I have to ask - Do you even know what you are saying?
- First if you don't agree with the video that's fine, Post a comment with some content.
- And accusing someone of being paid to bash a product? Back it up Please!
- .... Especially when I'm "Bashing" and comparing two products from the same Company! And who might pay for that service?
- The fact is that I have took out and tested a number of NV and Thermal products (and have purchased them- not been given or loaned them by someone selling them) and out of them the Wraith's performance is below par and about the only product I would put it above for use as a NV Scope Firefield NVRS, which is a Shame because If Sightmark had good sense they would have worked on improving the Photon's resolution and capabilities because functionality wise it's a top notch product.
Is it "Ok" for a budget Day/Night scope ~ Yes, but to be honest it falls more into the "Techno Toy" category than anything, which is why it's currently sitting on a shelf instead of ready to go on a rifle in my home, and will likely at some point be mounted on a rimfire. And as food for thought perhaps some of the more glowing reviews are helping to sell products and either getting kickbacks or getting to borrow cool toys to do video's with from some of the folks selling said items (and that's not an accusation, but I actually ordered my Wraith from a company who happens to support just one such RUclips channel and funny their review happened to be one of the more "Glowing" reviews.)
So you're welcome to you opinion... But accusing someone of being paid to bash something because you disagree is pretty lame.
It is lame, I'm sure he bought one and is trying to justify it and bashing you is his way of doing it. I was going to pull the trigger on a Wraith because I saw a lot RUclips videos hyping it, i didn't consider the photon because its ugly as shit, but after watching your videos and further reading reviews it seems like a rock solid NV scope and i will probably get one in the near future.Thanks for the videos, i have learned a lot about Night vision, and I purchased a Leupold Tracker 2HD thanks to you. Late.
So the wraith is trash...
Sorry for not replying sooner, somehow I missed your comment.... I wouldn't say Trash, It might be good for some people, but with a very limited scope (no pun intended). Definitely wouldn't recommend it for higher recoil rifles even though it's rated for 308, but for someone who wants to put something on a low recoil primarily day rifle who wants to record video and maybe do a little close in nighttime shooting (like rats in a barn or at a dump etc.) it might be a lot of fun. Other than that though I would say definitely better places to spend your hard earned $$$. I'd like to get a hold of an ATN X-Sight II (ATN's current digital "WonderScope") to compare since really that is the Wraith's closest competitor that I'm aware of. Thanks for Watching and Commenting~
Thanks for the comparison of the two. I was mulling the idea of getting a Wraith but think I’ll save up some more and get a Flir PTS233. Also I’ve been using a Photon RT for little over a year now and Really impressed with it. I shot hogs as close as 25 yards and as far as 250 yards. For the $$ it’s been a Fantastic unite. I am running a 6500 external battery pack as my power source, I can get thee solid nights of hunting with it keeping the Illuminator set at 4 so when I shoulder the rifle it’s got some illumination running. Also if using AA batteries get some rechargeable ones. It eats batteries pretty quickly.
If you don't mind My asking what caliber are you using the Photon RT with? If I remember correctly it says it's rated up to. 375 H&H. I do really like the Flir though so far I've only used it for observation (which is why I like it so much since it's small enough to also be good for observation / spotting).
@@PhoenixRising62 I'm shooting a 7.62x39 AR build. I currently using Honardy 123sst.
@@davemiller3027 Cool, I've not mounted the Photon on a rifle, but from everything I've read it handles recoil well, wish I could say the same with the Wraith, but I wasn't happy with it on a 308 (PTR-91).