Dealing With Disability & Moving Beyond The FIRE Movement
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- Опубликовано: 12 сен 2024
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Chelsea sits down with money expert and RUclipsr Erin Moriarity to talk about creating a financial routine and outlook that go beyond the baggage of our previous selves.
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As a 50 something mom that raised a severely disabled child, I felt left out of life in general, let alone the work force. As she became an adult, I became disabled myself. I was only able to work part time and work credits were very low when I took SSDI. I felt it very unfair that with all the resources in our country, I still had little support to be able to work outside my home and build a sustainable retirement income.
Yes it's really unconscionable how little of our resources go to those who need it at home. :/
I hope people watching this understand that this is ONE person with a disability. Many of us are unable to be financially stable because of systemic oppression. There is no option to work enough to be above the poverty level, while still getting support. Even living within your means is barely possible at today’s costs.
Thank you for also pointing this out. I really found this interview was out of touch.
Living within your means is always possible…it literally means to live a standard according to your current financial stance.
I know someone who’s disabled from the waist down…he’s a contractor who installs flooring in home construction. He goes to the gym to build strength to allow himself to install flooring in multiple floor homes. He makes around 85k a year and is the primary provider for his family.
That’s nice, but that is only one individual. I became disabled after getting Covid, lost my 20 year teaching career, and now I’m on disability. Because I lost my career, I also lost my healthcare. So now because of having to pay for healthcare out-of-pocket, and most of my chronic illnesses, Western medicine does not know how to cure nor treat, I have to go holistic route, which means we’re paying about $2000 out of pocket for my healthcare that we were not doing before hand.
therefore, we have had to move in with my parents, because we can no longer afford our apartment. When my parents pass away, because they are in their 70s, and not very healthy, we will have nowhere to go I know where we can survive. My husband continues to try to get higher paying jobs, but with the inflation in price gouging, that’s going on amongst most utility companies, you will find that most disabled people cannot afford to survive.
Your one example, does not hold true for the majority of us.
Systemic suppression is a self imposed state. Just because you are disabled doesn’t mean you have to receive support from the government and if you choose to get it then you should expect to live in the poverty zone. It makes no sense to expect to live above the poverty line with government benefits…it should be looked at as a momentary assistance not a life long income. I was horned disabled and have always worked because I don’t want to struggle financially and be dependent n the government. Either you choose to get help and be poor or choose to be employed and have financial security.
@@SaintsandSushi it certainly means you need to receive assistance if you are UNABLE to be self-supporting. Our current level of poverty doesn’t even allow one to maintain food & housing at a minimal level. We’re not talking about living high on the hog here… it’s about not living in a constant state of anxiety over BASIC HUMAN NEEDS!!
Having a little trouble with the beginning of this (as someone who is disabled and struggling a lot financially) because yes the emergency fund is very good advice, but it’s literally not possible when bills keep coming and emergencies keep happening. When you’re VERY poor, it’s not always that your mindset & planning is bad, it’s that we are living in a practically dystopian economic state. But I’m not gonna preach about that because generally I trust you guys and your advice. I also totally recognize that this is meant to be a teaching tool, so I’m not knocking it.
Gonna keep watching before I comment more, just wanted to note this because it did kind of make me feel inadequate and isolated. It’s a little difficult balancing trying to take the very good advice, while also recognizing that there are so many uncontrollable factors that effect people’s finances, especially when you’re disabled.
Edit: Other people added this too, but you can only save so much before you lose benefits when you’re disabled. Telling disabled people to have an emergency fund is not groundbreaking or even practical advice when so many of us depend on benefits that will be taken away instantly if we save as much as $2,000.
NEW edit: having watched this whole thing, I really have gotta say this video is , imo, very tonedeaf. If the advice is only for disabled people who aren’t on SSI , then it should be specified. There’s very little useful information for anyone on the lower income end of the spectrum.
And you can only save so much before losing benefits
@@nesser1352 yes. Too many people who receive benefits learn this the hard way, unfortunately.
That is shocking!😮 I don't live in the USA, but you get financially penalised for saving and being good with money???? That is just ludicrous 🤦
@@anaalves3658 yep :( I think it’s a little different in every state, but generally the cap is somewhere around like, $2000 . It’s truly awful
Yeah, I don't think TFD is good at talking to people on the low end of the income spectrum. I've noticed that in a lot of their content, on here and on IG, they're really aimed at middle income earners. People who have disposable income. The low to very low income earners don't have disposable income. It's a totally different ball game.
I struggled listening to her a little bit because her experience was so different then mine and so many other people with a disability that I know. I’m really glad she was able to start a business and work on her terms, but that seems so unattainable for most women. As the oldest of the Gen Z, I want to ask, “okay can we have a video on how to start your own business as a disabled person and be as financially stable as her?” But that question also leads to those sketchy women who sell PDF’s on how to spice up your sex life or the create your own online course girlies. She’s a little too bootstrappy to be relatable.
she is a literal unicorn money wise for someone with a disability. Almost everyone I know with severe disability or chronic illness is broke.
Wonderful convo. I just turned 27 and I've reoriented my approach to work and finances pretty significantly. I decided to go back to the 9-5 after freelancing for 2 years because monetizing my 'passion' (I have a lot of passions tbh) was emotionally exhausting. I was beyond burnt out. I'm taking the next few years to have work be just work and repair my relationship with the things I love--and I'll probably do them for money again later! The idea of FIRE always stressed me out because I've already lost a lot of my youth to trauma and grinding to get out of bad situations...I'm personally not sacrificing the years where I'm physically able to do certain things for a future that is not guaranteed. These conversations about ability/health remind us that saving for tomorrow is certainly important, but we must enjoy what we have today and not take it for granted.
I appreciate how even-keeled she is and practical in her approach. She's taken a firm slow and steady approach, but I'm glad she's also found some balance to enjoy what money can allow you along with being fiscally aware/responsible. A lot of what she's done as a married adult certainly relies on the power of the stability of her husband--and she's fair about recognizing that, so this isn't a knock against her. But as all things, what she says definitely works is not universal. eta: also I have no idea how she overcame catastrophe aside that she worked long hours at ? jobs, and I was interested in a possible nuts and bolts strategies along with the emotional work that takes.
She struck me as more (small c) conservative than many other guests. Again, totally fine! I had the sense she wanted to say student debt is the borrower's responsibility, but she reined that in to we should teach kids what fields are lucrative instead. That also isn't a knock against her and she's not wrong we set kids into the world with too much "good luck!" and too little solid knowhow, but Chelsea's continued "hm okay moving on" vibe was similar to mine. This might sound like I'm hurt by what she said or down on her, but not at all. She's just got some bootstrap energy that I find can be very beneficial in some ways and marginalizing to people who still need help and advice in others.
I really wanted to know more deets about her business lol. WFH medical billing isn't an out of nothing decision; what connections did she have, etc etc. Ah well.
I found the "Okay, moving on..." vibe so off putting. Yes, Chelsea chose different and is in a different position. But people with financially stable partners also have strategies on how to remain independent or become independent again after hardship. Just like Chelsea always has trouble with guests who have kids and how that takes away money/time/energy and shifts your energy from saving for retirement to paying for schools etc.
@@thirstwithoutborders995 I see how you mean; my experience was it was more a "gotcha, not my stance but this is an 'argument' that won't serve the conversation, what's next." What we want to know and have discussed definitely shades our perceptions. Maybe it's the hourlong format, but there's often not a lot of depth of the hows and whys in these. I mean, I expected to hear how she 'made it' after struggling, but it was distilled to just keep at it, work with a SO, and btw I have a degree in finance. I don't mind at all that she does! but that seemed a big part of her internal/external process to this point that sailed by.
Student debt is in fact the borrower’s responsibility so would they be something against her message? Any loan is the responsibility of the one taking it out…many people pretend to be innocent victims of the system when in fact they willingly pit themselves n that position. You can definitely obtain a college degree without student loans so loans are not a necessity but a choice. Also, those who take student loans to get degrees with low paying jobs are putting themselves in debt on purpose….who on earth does anyone get a master’s degree that doesn’t even lead to lucrative paycheck is beyond me.
I've always seen disability as something that would never touch me if I ate healthily and exercised, and it was under my control. That is until I contracted COVID-19 in 2020 and was severely disabled for a year, and now could be partially disabled for the rest of my life. My husband also ended up quitting his job recently after a brutal COVID infection, and we have grappled with various unemployment bouts and financial burdens I had no idea existed for me as a "healthy" young person in their twenties. There are no support nets for people like us, even though there are millions of Americans still struggling with long-COVID today - even though it is clearly affecting a large population of the workforce and economy. Thanks for touching on this issue, Chelsea, more attention is needed for this issue that we're left to deal with by ourselves.
Unfortunately I think the Disability section of this conversation missed the mark. Th reality is if you have more than $2,000-$4,000 in assets, you won't be able to access the medial and caregiving services only provided through medicaid, insurance won't cover this and it's far too expensive to pay for out of pocket. As for already disabled people, in order to maintain those services we must continuously live below the poverty line making emergency funds and other safety nets a fantasy. All-in-all this video did not peak very well to the Disabled Experience but rather played on the fear of disability to convince non-disabled to save more which could very well bite them in the ass we their disability does arrive. Instead of saying 'Dealing with Disability' this should say 'Dealing with Temporary Lost Income' imo.
Agreed! This was an incredibly oblivious interview.
I asked my husband for a prenup - my family was poor, his was fairly well off, but I was way better at saving than him. Our incomes were about equal, we made sure each of us were contributing similar amounts to our retirement, the house, etc. For me, it wasn't about protecting my assets since I didn't have much - I wanted to know that he was with me because he wanted to be, not because he felt a divorce would financially wreck him or that I would go after everything he had. He said that the fact I talked like that meant he wasn't worried at all. We didn't end up getting a pre-nup, though I think everyone should.
Per "you have to find a way to be ok", my thoughts are as follows. Firstly, I think it's crucial to acknowledge that unfairness does exist. It exists in different degrees, and people respond to it with different levels of effectiveness. I think it's complicated to say that someone is just making excuses, obviously because we don't fully understand other people's situations, but also because there are subtle advantages that some people have over others. For example, some people have more emotional fortitude, whether that is due to upbringing or just their natural personality. I think it might be easier for such a person to look at their coworker who is struggling and think, why can't they just tough it out when I'm clearly managing, why are they so weak, it's their own fault they're not doing well. I know I personally struggle with such thoughts. I digress. My point is that unfairness exists and feelings of unfairness are valid.
I want to take it a step further and say that it is most certainly possible to do everything within your power and still not be able to make it work. What if your seizures are so frequent and last so long that no employer wants to take on the liability to accommodate you? Do you deserve to just starve and die?
Having said that, unless you're able to instantly effect certain social changes in response to feelings of unfairness, those feelings are unhelpful in the current moment. The only helpful response one can have for oneself is to try and do the best one can given the cards one had been dealt. I choose to interpret "you have to find a way to be ok" like that. Personally, I try to remember one of my own rules of thumb, which is that no matter what situation you are in, there is at least one thing you can do to make it better. For example, if you've just done 12 hours of underpaid work and are worried about money needed to service your car next week and you're absolutely starving, you can eat something. It doesn't help with your job or your car, but it makes that one moment just a little better because you're not starving anymore. To be clear, the situation is still very bad, but when I fight for myself and my happiness within the confines of what I can control, it assures me that I matter to myself, even if it doesn't seem like I matter to the entities that control my circumstances. That helps me keep going.
To summarize, I think that the saying of "we're all dealt different hands in life" is often perceived as condescending, and for all I know some people who say it are truly being unempathetic or dismissive. However, it's also true. I think it's valid to be angry that life is harder than it needs to be, and social change is needed, but in this moment, we as individuals are unfortunately the best resource at our own disposal. We're not guaranteed a satisfactory outcome, even if we do everything we can and do it all correctly, but it is our freedom and our right to do everything in our small spheres of power to make it better. That is the hope that gives me strength to take my next step into my future.
This is an underrated response!
I watch Erin's channel and she does repeatedly point out at she was raised with a financial education in her family, before her seizure. She constantly saved odd job money, etc. That probably is a factor in how she approached money post-seizure.
So, she's a person who probably couldn't qualify for SSDI and never needed to be on it. I think her points would have been more understandable in this interview if she started with that instead of her seizure.
I completely agree. So much of this advice does absolutely nothing for poor disabled ppl who rely on benefits.
She also mentioned working 80 hours a week in her 20's up until recently. To me that's extremely problematic and unrealistic for a lot of healthy people, let alone disabled ones. Saying things like that makes me believe she's really not that disabled and that's why she didn't qualify. Not her upbringing and financial literacy. An I bet I'm not the only one who would think that hearing her story. The vast majority of people on disability can't work a regular 40 hour a week job let alone the equivalent of 2 jobs per week and that's why they need benefits.
@@ayemiksenoj5254 just because she works 80hrs doesn’t mean she is working in two “conventional jobs”. I’m disabled by birth and have always found ways to make money both thru a regular job and also passively. Both involved putting hours so I count them all as work hrs.
@@SaintsandSushi, interesting.
Thank you for your response.
This interview feels far too pull yourself up by the bootstraps to be relatable. If you're on disability benefits, you can't save more than a certain amount without losing them and the amount you get is so low that saving is near impossible anyway. Many disabled people couldn't marry without losing benefits that they need to get by. There are additional costs associated with being disabled and it can make you almost entirely or entirely dependent on someone else. So good luck relying on your partner, and good luck affording to get married if you're disabled and on benefits. Working from home is a massive privilege; you have to be able to afford somewhere with the space for a desk set up, and you have to be able to get a job that will allow you to work from home. There are so many lower income people where that's not something they can do. This interview isn't applicable for so many people.
This may have been my favorite interview of these types of TFD videos. It did seem Chelsea did not agree or relate to what Erin was saying. Normally, Chelsea chimes in a lot more instead of going straight from question to question without much input. But, personally, I am inspired by Erin and I do agree with a lot of what she was saying. It's a harsh reality, but sometimes we do have to fully accept that we are who we are (disabilities, lacking certain capabilities, upbringing, etc.) and the world is what it is (unfair, unkind, etc.). At the end of the day, as much as we can, the best we can do for ourselves is try to make the best life out of what we have. It does nothing but suck the life and motivation and hope out of us to languish in self-pity. We are imperfect and do this anyway sometimes, but as a mindset, this is not the way. We may not reach lofty goals even if we try our best and "do everything right", sure. It's not guaranteed. However, the way to surely fail at it every time is to never try. Oftentimes, this is defeatist attitude kills our chances before even getting started at something that could make our lives better. "It can't happen because [insert society, health, circumstances, upbringing, a whole host of other negative factors here]!"
I really glad you brought Erin on. I've been watching her videos for a while now. Her advice and path is not for every one and it's very nice that FD branch out to different people with different circumstances and perspectives. One good thing I got from this video was actually from the comments from people on financial circumstances associated with disabilities. I learned something I didn't know and it allows me to empathize more with disable people.
One of my close friends has a chronic illness. I got to know through him how a big part of the community which has disability or chronic illness is unable to work.
Yep. Most of us have zero ability to work. A large % of us would be dead without family. A large % cannot even bathe and feed themselves. This interview does not portray even a mild level of chronic illness realistically. Happy for her but I know 100s if not 1000s of sick people and I know exactly one person with this level of financial freedom and that is coz the are mostly recovered now and just have to do things on their terms. So off the mark for a channel that is usually fairly realistic.
This totally happened to me. I became suddenly disabled and it really kickstarted me really thinking about what would happen if I stopped being able to work. I was almost 27 when I became disabled and I take home the higher pay in my marriage. Kids aren’t going to be a factor for me, but I didn’t want my husband to struggle if I was no longer able to work. I 100% agree with Erin, you have to find a way to be okay. Operating from fear isn’t helpful, but being coolheaded and coming from a place of neutrality. It is more easier said than done sometimes, but it is important. Great interview! This is perspective that is rarely given platform in the the PF space.
I’m so sorry this happened to you! But it sounds like you have a great attitude, I hope things get better for you! Perhaps you might like Erin’s channel if you have a similar attitude - I really like her videos. 😊
Thank you Chelsea for this wonderful episode! I have the same illness as Erin, and sometimes it makes me feel so insecure and powerless. Especially because I am doing a PhD and the pay is pretty low. Her story makes me feel so hopeful and happy for how she lives on with her disability. I hope I can be as positive as she is in the future!
I just love how creatively nosey Chelsea is!
Being able to put aside 30% of your take home income is such a privilege. Even aggressively cooking and minimizing expenses the cost of living rise is making saving really hard.
Chelsea, I really identify with your world views in general. That said, I think focusing on the societal issues in every episode becomes repetitive and takes away of the uniqueness the guest can bring to the table with their own individual experience. I think you should dive deeper into the specific insights each guest can help us have. This would promote a much more diverse learning experience for us and yourself.
Yeah, this was not a good interview. You could tell Chelsea was rolling her eyes internally and had trouble getting out of her own bubble in this.
Congrats to Chelsea and the whole TFD Team on 1M subs 🎉❤
Omg, you guys brought Erin on! I’ve been listening to her for at least a year; I find her so good. Like others have said, I think she does focus on what we can do as individuals and less on the systemic factors than TFD, but her approach in her content usually has been very efficient to me. She covers what’s in the title in good time in a good way without losing the plot. Systemic injustice is to be dealt with, but we as individuals are inevitably faced with what we should do in the meantime.
I appreciate that TFD brings in a variety of guests, but half of them just leave me feeling really awful. I don’t really see this guest speaking from a place of disability. I don’t want to gatekeep disability, but most disabled people aren’t sick for one year in their teens and then able to work 80 hours a week to save for the next brief episode of illness. They are sick EVERY DAY of their lives. They are not able or are barely able to work part time. They can’t “just be ok” when their bodies and society want them dead. Sorry, obviously triggered here. 😅
It's important to address the challenges that people with disabilities face when it comes to financial independence and early retirement. It's inspiring to see how you're overcoming those challenges and still pursuing your goals.
I totally agree that every married couple should get a prenup. However, divorce rates are actually around 25%. They were 50% in the 1970s, but ever since then have continued to go down till plateauing at 25%.
I really appreciate hearing a story from a disabled person who is doing well for themselves financially!
However, she sounds just like every other person that has enough to live comfortably without doing much.
This is very unrelatable and unrealistic for the majority of us who live with a disability.
Also, she mentioned working 80 hours a week in her 20's up until recently....
I hate to say it..but that doesn't sound very disabled to me...
It sounds like maybe you have a condition, but its not severe and DEFINITELY not debilitating.
I couldn't work for over a decade and that was in my 20's and 30's when the body is supposed to be in its prime.
I can work up to about 30-32 hours now in my 40's..but I struggle with constant pain just doing so.
I also receive SSI like so many have talked about in the comments and can't have a savings passed $2,000 or make over about $1,250 a month without losing my benefits and disability rating entirely!!
Yet, I have good credit.
I graduated with honors. I'm capable and have many ideas, but none of it really matters because not enough support exists to help disabled people who are ACTUALLY doing ALL they can to better their lives. I want to have financial freedom too! I believe I and people like me DESERVE IT!!!!
So.... CAN WE PLEASE HAVE FINANCIAL CONVERSATIONS THAT ACTUALLY HELP THE AVERAGE DISABLED PERSON!
PLEASE!
Yes, I'm upset... No, I'm not going to apologize. There is already a seat at the proverbial table for people like her.
I want a seat for people like me.
An.. I don't want to hear the bs about creating one.. That could easily take a lifetime.
We deserve a seat NOW.
Lets talk about it.
OMG I got so excited when I heard you partnered with the company where I work. 🎉
Very informative video, as usual. Thanks Chelsea!😊
I doubt I'll ever have the income to save enough for an emergency. I never have enough left over. The only smart contingency I made for myself was life insurance starting young to lock in the rate for 80 years. It's an IUL, so if I live long enough, it's retirement; if I bite it before then, well, my brother and his kids won't be experiencing the "generational wealth gap"...😅
I came to terms with the fact that if I get really sick, I'm just going to die. I'm disabled, retired, and not going into debt for medical bills. I know hospitals will go after a patient's family members to get paid & I'm not doing that to my kids. I'm comfortable with my mortality & while I'm not in a hurry to become stardust, I'm not afraid of it.
OMG I love both of you - this collaboration is so exciting!!
38:50 exactly how I feel. Gifts can be so wasteful no matter the intention
"Let's have a convo with someone who has enough money to frequently be able to invest 100% of her pay cheque to the stock market while in her 20s, sounds relatable!" Jesus TFD, sometimes you are so completely out of touch you're a joke.
Not related to the video, but thought the TFD community might be able to help with a problem I'm having! Like a lot of TFD viewers, I opened a Wealthsimple account a few years ago, which was absorbed by Betterment in 2021. Betterment just emailed letting us know they're no longer supporting the Wealthsimple portfolios and are automatically transferring/selling those holdings into a Betterment portfolio. It sounds like they're forcing users to sell (for me and I assume for most people, at a significant loss) and pay taxes on what's sold. Wondering if anyone's in the same boat and knows if I'm interpreting that correctly, bc it sounds super scammy but I probably agreed to it in some terms I didn't read. Any advice??
Omg I love Erin!
If you have a disability, get organized and talk to other people with a disability.
Brainstorm 'What if' questions. Like, you created an investment fund together? Does that count toward savings?
The pair-up I've been waiting for!
I love Erin! Woot woot
👏🏼excellent video !!!
A really rational guest on this channel finally. She has the right attitude, I find a lot of the followers of this space tend to find reason after reason why they don't have it together financially and blame everyone and everything but themselves. Sometimes you have to step back, recognise there are some disadvantages but also some advantages you have and until you make the decision to act you will always be held back waiting for your disadvantages to go away magically.
Wrong name in the video description! It says Emily
Superb video. But, let me share this here knowing it can uplift someone that comes across it. Effective financial management made me rich and it is all you need if you want to build a strong financial future tomorrow. I started with 1000USD, 3 years ago I invested in a diversified stock market and fast forward to now I am worth 500000USD and am currently finishing my 8 unit apartments. I'm only 35 years old. Diversified stock investments have always proven to be very profitable
I'm really impressed. At 35, i was worth a little over $200,000 from * in the stock market. But what you've done with your *finances* and numbers you worth, is pure genius.
*Investing* in diversified stocks is a real hustle that has made me . I have two active stock portfolios and hope to create a third, which will increase my total return on earnings to over 120000USD
You have done well. It's people like you who set the benchmark for people like us to know that achieving financial stability and transition of status from being comfortable to wealthy is possible with the right *investment* plan.
I'm curious, is *investing* in a diversified stock *market* a pretty lucrative venture? Can you share how you achieved these figures?
@@zychenkonicholas9923 Experience plays a key role when *investing* in diversified *stock markets*, which is why I have Rachel Hilda, whose experience has greatly helped me persevere in the diversified *stock market*. For three years she helped me grow my portfolio using her diversified knowledge of the financial *market*.
Solid advice for healthy people however: A lot of disabled people can't work 80 hours a year let alone a week. Please don't add to further misconceptions and unrealistic expectations about chronic illness. We already get compared to 'if paraolympics can do that why can't you?' Even by our own DOCTORS.
This is unrealistic for 99.9% of sick people with 4 hour seizures. I have a family member 6+ hours of seizures on a bad day, possibly more and I cannot understand how anyone works with that going on. He needs rest and recovery time.
I know more people with chronic illness that are unable to even study from home let alone work. Disability and chronic illness is so so hard. It is more expensive to be sick even without medical bills.
Please do a video with someone who is mostly bedridden or housebound and cannot work etc. Help them with their finances around the pitiful benefits systems. Please help those on the harshest side of things find ways to save money.
❤🔥What a lovely guest today! Positive, head straight and not a victim. A rarity in America today! You go girl!