I'm glad that Jellico and Riker got all that off of their chests. And hey, they managed to get the job done by working together despite their differences--that's what Star Trek is all about.
@@brandonfrancey5592 I'm inclined to agree with you. Jellico may have been a good captain, in that he accomplished missions and got results. But he wasn't a good leader. I think Riker was right. Jellico was closed-minded. He never listened to his staff. He brushed aside all of their input and concerns, even when they might have been valid or useful. He only ever cared about what HE thought was the right thing to do. A good leader inspires people. That's what Jellico never did. He never gained the trust or the loyalty of the people under his command. When Picard gave an order, his crew followed it because they trusted him. When Jellico gives an order, the crew obeys because they know that there'll be hell to pay if they fail to do as he demands. Jellico gets all of his power through fear, and it is a terrible way to lead. I strongly suspect that if Jellico's crew ever had a way to challenge Jellico's orders to a higher authority and get him overruled, they would have done it in a heartbeat. I also have a hard time imagining any crew serving under Jellico feeling devastated at the idea of losing him, like the Enterprise crew did in "Chain of Command" and "Gambit."
@@akshin1556 I mostly agree, except I wouldn't say Jellico rules through fear. He isn't Darth Vader. The crew isn't afraid of Jellico, they just don't like him. Jellico's power comes from his pips. He's Captain. To him, that's end of story. It's like when your boss tells you to do something and you ask why, his response is, "Because I'm your boss." It's not a real answer but it is true. Same applies with Jellico. He's the captain, he gave an order. Do it. He doesn't want to hear excuses.He wants results. The one redeeming factor is Jellico didn't ask for the impossible. Difficult, sure but not impossible or criminal. He didn't demand 6 hours of work be done in 2 and punish everyone for not meeting his impossible goals. Hell, when it came down to a dangerous mission, he asked Riker, not Order him to do it.
@@brandonfrancey5592 >> Jellico didn't ask for the impossible. Yes, he did. In fact, that was precisely the issue that Geordi was having with him. Jellico was issuing orders to the Engineering department that could not possibly be fulfilled with the time and resources they were being given. A specific example : Jellico ordered Geordi to take the secondary distribution grid offline and realign the warp coil, to increase the warp coil efficiency by 15%, in two days' time, with only two-thirds of the Engineering crew working. That was impossible, and Jellico knew it. He was present when Data explicitly stated that realigning the warp coil in two days would require the entire Engineering crew, and then only if the entire crew worked around the clock for the full two days. Despite knowing this, Jellico still transferred a third of the Engineering crew to Security and still expected the warp coil to be realigned. Riker said that the other departments on the Enterprise were experiencing the same issues with their new captain. I don't know if Jellico ever penalized the crew for being unable to complete the work he was demanding, but he did, in fact, ask for the impossible.
@@davidbryantpiano6003from what I understand, that is pretty much the exact reason why red and gold switched places from TOS to TNG. Data didn’t look good in red and Picard didn’t look good in Gold
Their working relationship was strengthened by them both admitting their personal dislike for each other. This is how mature individuals bring light to their feelings in order to overcome them for the sake of others/the task at hand.
I have had to deal with housemates I don't get along with. I try to be nice but in the end just give up and avoid interacting with them unless necessary.
@@AdamWEST-yu2osthat was actually more because Marina Sirtis herself wanted the change rather than the eye candy costumes she'd worn up to this point. She actually got a few good stories after this too - the episode where she takes the commander test, and when she is kidnapped by the Romulans.
1:15 I have the distinct impression that, although Jellico doesn't necessarily agree with Riker's assessment of his approach to command, he actually does understand where Riker is coming from ... and it doesn't sit well with Jellico that he does.
@@unusualbydefault 1. Jellico doesn't need Riker to agree to this. If he wanted to, he could simply order Riker to pilot the shuttlecraft. 2. Riker would have agreed to pilot the shuttlecraft whether he liked Jellico's attitude about it or not. If Jellico neither asked nor ordered Riker to be the pilot, Riker would have volunteered. Jellico likely knew this, or at least suspected it. 3. LaForge never said that Riker was the only pilot who could accomplish this mission. He said Riker was the best pilot, but also said that he could do it himself. There may have been other pilots who could pull it off as well. 4. If the Enterprise had just one absolutely flawless pilot, it would have to be Data. If it came to it, Jellico could have somebody else take over as acting first officer and instruct Data to pilot the shuttlecraft. Jellico had no pressing need to get on Riker's good side. He had other options. He chose to ask Riker to pilot the shuttlecraft rather than resort to any of those other options, because he felt it was the right thing to do, and it's unlikely that Jellico would have felt that way if he sincerely believed that Riker was totally wrong about everything. With all of that said, there's no real way to know what Jellico actually thought of Riker's assessment of him. What exactly his facial expression and body language at 1:15 actually meant is a matter of perception, which is always going to vary with the individual. I sincerely believe that Jellico didn't agree with Riker's assessment, but he did understand where Riker was coming from. That's just my perception of it.
@@akshin1556 No Riker has been stated to be the best pilot, that includes Data. For whatever reason an instinct Data doesn't have for the ships Riker is the best Pilot on the Enterprise. He'd relieved Riker of his duties at this point which likely would have given Riker the right to refuse.
I like that they didnt make jellico an idiot with his conflict with Ricker. The conflict comes from their styles of leadership, decisions and command. They just dont mesh. Which happens irl.
I agree. Leadership style plays a big part of a team. Jellico's approach to the crew did not create an atmosphere of trust which can ruin teams/crew on a ship. I this case, everyone was more than capable of performing their duties and they were successful.
Plus the Enterprise crew were used to Picard's style of command and their personalities were well suited to mesh with Picard's personality to produce great results. Jellico's style of command however was quite different from Picard's so they weren't at all used to and suited mentally to his style of command. In turn, Jellico wasn't used to the independent minded senior staff of the Enterprise which frustrated him to no end.
sure... but that doesn't mean all styles are equal. Riker and Piccard have different styles which are both effective. Jellico is a garbage leader and the type of guy that would have been mysteriously "sniped" in modern war.
A lot of people saying Captain Jellico acted like a dick to the Enterprise crew......all I know is that he's "Dick" Jones and Riker just *_F*CKED_* with the wrong guy! Picard's a sweet old man and he means well but he's not gonna live forever and Dick Jones is No. 2 around here......pretty simple math, huh, Riker?
I’ve had managers like Jellico. They’re smart as hell, so damn sharp, and absolutely produce results, but they do not inspire others to work for them. One manager was incredibly competent but she was a micromanaging douchebag, wanted updates the moment they happened, constantly applied pressure for work to get done, and only cared about how the team made her look. She was a good manager but was a terrible leader, and made no friends in the process despite how many times she smiled and shared laughed during networking events. No one wants to work for people like this and they push talent away like it’s a damn sport. Despite what you want to say about “hurt feelings” and “bruised egos”, it is not good for your career if you have this reputation.
One of the departments I used to work in had one just like Jellico. He came in one morning yelling at everyone over a 0.75% drop in quality. In less than 3 hours, 1/2 of the staff walked down to H.R. to tether their resignations. Before the end of the day, upper management sent him packing. Some of the staff that walked out had been with the company for 15 years. After he was gone, quality went up by 5%.
@jasonvoorhees5640 I disagree with myself actually. Jellico was right. Riker was being emotional and immature I probably wrote that comment without seeing the full context of the episode. That it was a military situation I do disagree with jellico's insults of Riker though here. Unnecessary and incorrect in any event. Riker is competent and he is hardly insubordinate
@jasonvoorhees5640 lol but I think any chance of that happening was lost when jellico came into his quarters and slandered him in this way. Riker is not insubordinate or a bad officer. He just missed his Picard
@@mistermonologue2442 yep! Leaders like this are good but they leave behind a trail of people who do not want to work for you and people who are likely willing to throw you under the bus if the opportunity arises. It’s the whole phrase of “I won’t wish the man to be fired but I sure as hell won’t lose any sleep if he does” Anyone who thinks this isn’t bad does not have good social acumen, and is still emotionally stunted by not accepting that their mother and daughters are humans who have feelings like everyone else.
@@steverogers7601 It's a lazy way of leading and is frustratingly (and historicaly) supposed to be viewed as endearing but what it really is is a lack of confidence mixed with an ignorant view of what leadership is all topped off with a child's aptitude for patience.
I met Frakes at a convention about 10 years ago and showed him that I am a Riker. He was amused and started talking about Rikers in space. I know he kids about that in conventions and we laughed, but he said, no I'm serious I would like to make a show with me and Marina. Well, look at Picard in 2020 and seems like he's halfway there.
Picard is a manager that knows how to instill trust and confidence in people and has enough trust in his subordinates to delegate tasks so he can focus other things. And this is more or less reciprocated and appreciated by the crew. You even see O'brien do this during Starship Down when he talks to Worf about handling the other crewman. Jellico is like R. Lee Ermy in The Siege of Firebase Gloria. He takes command of his ship knowing that bad stuff is about to go down and that there's no time to get to know the crew, or build up confidence trust and respect. This situation is too immediate for any of that. Jellico knows what he's doing and is confident in his own ability as Captain, but he simply doesn't have the luxury of time to show that to any of the other crew. Picard is clearly a diplomat. Jellico is a warrior. His personality is going to rankle some people but that's just how it is. If he had more time with the crew in less shit circumstances they'd have probably gotten along better.
Jellico treats the crew of a luxury cruise and exploration ship as if it was a tightly run military ship. He may be a really good CO when he's got a crew that's used to that style, but whether he was ignorant, too inflexible, or didn't care - his approach wasn't working at all, and he still insisted upon it. _That_ alone made him a terrible CO in this situation.
It's funny that people like jellico would end up taking over starfleet once the conflict with the dominion and the borg started. Picard would not fit in that Era. Picard is a peacetime captain. An explorer
@@stevencoardvenice I'd rather say people like Sisko would take over. Jellico is too inflexible in his ways to make _any_ use of the exploration focussed crews of the vast majority of Starfleet ships, as he's thoroughly demonstrated in these episodes.
@@stevencoardvenice Yes, this was a military operation. That an exploration ship and crew were forced to do because nobody else was available. So of course the military just goes in and expect everyone to function as if they were career military... 🙄 Seriously, _this_ mindset you're displaying here is exactly what almost got not only the entire mission to fail, but also to lose the Enterprise and Picard. Military "my way or... well, there's only my way" idiocy.
I know how Riker feels. I have a boss at my job that almost everyone dislikes. What people like that don't realize is they don't inspire people to go out of their way for them, its get in get out.
Idazmi7 he has a point - he tried to get the captain to inspire his crew so they would be ready for combat and unified. That’s a ship of exploration not a military ship. They have families and children on board. He was dismissed because Jellico saw Riker’s behaviour as as dissent and didn’t understand how to get the crew behind him. Riker didn’t wager anything- both he and Jellico knew he would pilot the shuttle.
@@makasete30 but he it´s still member of military organization. Also in situation which is at edge of war. There is no space for some argument or anything. He is great officer, but terrible first officer, similar situation was in The Best of Both Worlds, when he acts like a idiot when Shelby has a interesting proposals and he only "throwing sticks" into her path. If there any character in TNG which I really don´t like, that would be him.
Starfleet isn't a military organization. It's more apt to call them a merchant/science marine expetionary force. Starfleet is more civilian than military. And civilian ships do have rank, and certain offenses (especially mutiny) are crimes in civilian shipping. But Starfleet does not wage offensive wars and largely does not have the capacity until the end of the Dominion War, where Starfleet starts going very wrong.
@@ayanithtalreign _"Although the Enterprise is a military vessel, it's organization is only semi-military. The "enlisted men" category does not exist. Star Trek goes on the assumption that every man and woman aboard the U.S.S. Enterprise is the equivalent of a qualified astronaut, and therefore an officer."_ - Gene Roddenberry, The Making of Star Trek, page 209. _"I'm a soldier, not a diplomat."_ - James Kirk Starfleet is a military organization.
I always wondered if Riker disliked Jellico because he reminded him of Eric Pressman from the Pegasus. When he was on Enterprise, Pressman said he preferred the younger Ensign Riker he knee as he blindly followed orders - "once I've made a decision, I don't have time for my officers to question it", while Commander Riker would question orders. In fact Riker disobeying Captain DeSoto was what made Picard choose him for the First Officer for the Enterprise. Unlike Jellico (and Pressman), Picard would actively seek his officers opinions and advice before coming to a decision.
Ronnie Cox is a superb actor. First saw him in Beverly Hills Cop and then Total Recall as well as Robocop. It's guest star appearances on TNG which really enhanced the quality of the episode. Bob Gunton (Warden from Shawshank Redemption) also played a superb Captain (Benjamin Maxwell) in TNG.
I remember him in Beverly Hills Cop as Andrew Bogamil. He was a hardass to Eddie Murphy in the first one. Eventually he warmed up to him, and by the second movie, he was friends with him. Of course, he is probably best known for playing Richard "Dick" Jones in Robocop.
“Well...now that the ranks are dropped, Captain, I don’t like you either! You just watch yourself! We’re wanted men! I have the death sentence on TWELVE systems!”
Riker: You are arrogant and close minded. You need to control everything and everyone Jellico: ...yeah, well, um, you've been treated for every STD known in the quadrant, and you keep on infecting the newer female cadets (and a select group of the males), so there. Riker: Touché
This shows Ronny Cox's skills as an actor. He's not like that in real life. Remember reading an article where he says that he doesn't stay in character after "CUT".
Andy Taylor was an amazing and immensely likable person. Andy Griffith was supposed to be an asshole. How he can play nice guy, but be such a rotten person is amazing.
Jellico, despite being different, was a true hero in his own right : a) He destroyed the Cardassians' perceived position of strength swiftly and with full confidence. A masterclass in flipping the script. b) He ordered Troi to wear a Starfleet uniform.
Good little poke at Troi's 'casuality' in uniform. Jelico had no need for a counselor on the bridge; he needed an advisor, one person who can stay observant and 'read the room' while everyone else stays focused on task execution.
"I always knew where the line was drawn, and you just stepped over it, buddy-boy. You've insulted me and you've insulted this company with that bastard creation of yours. I had a guaranteed military sale with ED 209 - renovation program, spare parts for twenty-five years... Who cares if it worked or not?" -- Great actor!
The Federation definitely could, but did not want a war that would solve nothing for EITHER side. The Federation's primary goal was exploration, as JLP has mentioned frequently between the TV series, at least one of their movies, and especially in the novel series.
They fought a war that lasted from 2347-2366. It mainly skirmished. It wasn't that the Federation couldn't win, it was that they didn't want to be involved in total war, that would cost lives and resources. The other thing is, the Cardassians, despite having less advanced technology than the Federation, are known for their deceptive tactics and highly skilled at ambushes. They proved to be a formidable foe, despite the odds against them.
the newer ships such as the galaxy and nebula class ships were more than a match for even multiple cardassian warships. The thing is that the vast majority of Starfleet's vessels were the older class vessels. Miranda class, excelsior class, and oberth class vessels which were dedicated exploration and research vessels as opposed to prioritizing defense. They were at best on equal footing with the cardassians, and at worst outgunned. The federation didn't start emphasizing development of defensive starships until after wolf 359 and the buildup to the dominion war.
It's great to work for a truly competent 'superior' Officer or NCO. Even more significant when later, after retirement, a Staff Sergeant recognizes you (without a name badge) and states "You're the reason I stayed in the military."
Beauty scene. Showed Jellico was the bigger man. Also nice to see that not all Star fleet Captain's were hesitant to use the power they had to avoid conflicts. Mines on the belly make up for one million diplomatic words that are destined to fail.
@@Wolf-ln1ml In the end they both put their egos and arguments to one side (without either conceding) and they both did their duty. I don't think either was bigger than the other.
So Jellico comes to Riker, insults him, then expects him to go on a dangerous mission? Way to inspire the troops, NOT! Plus look at his face when Riker responds in kind: total whipped puppy. Riker stepped up in spite of Jellico's ego. I don't see how he's the bigger person. That said, I would have liked if Riker acknowledged he was wrong to question Jellico in front of another officer. He should have known better, and offered an apology for what it's worth.
I had a boss like Jellico once. He was a complete and utter asshole. I suffered under him for three years and finally told him I was done. I went on vacation, came back on Monday and he fired me. Gave me a ton of severance and I got a better job the next week. I call him the human cold sore.
This should be a lesson in leadership. You need to let workers WANT to help you. Let them think they're doing you a favor. Positive gets more done than negative.
Indeed. An atmosphere of fearing to step on toes or run the leader the wrong way and so on, that can be created - but what *should* be created is an atmosphere of respect, which must be earned, to the point where the crew want to work *for* their captain, and don’t consistently need reminding about who is in charge.
@@stevencoardveniceOne that the crew of the Enterprise was MORE than ready to take on already. Remember: Jellico is an inferior Captain who until recently was in command of an inferior ship. He was out of his depth on the Enterprise and instead of yanking everyone around by his chain he should have relied on Will to be the one to balance between what he wants at short notice and what the Enterprise crew needs. Everyone claiming hes a hero? He alienated the ONE man needed to complete his mission and said man had to choose to help of his own accord. When it comes to command? Total. Abject. Failure.
@@jmlaw8888 totally disagree. You call him an "inferior captain," but that's just your opinion, because you like Picard. We all do. But jellico was brought in there by starfleet for a specific purpose. He was a militarist, not a diplomat like Picard. And Riker's behavior was kind of immature. He loved his captain, Picard. And he let his feelings for Picard cloud his judgment. The mission was more important than Picard's life And this was a military crisis. No time for team bonding exercises. People just needed to follow orders. Captain Jellico does not have to ADAPT to his inferior officers' idiosyncrasies. It's the opposite! They have to adapt to HIM. It's not a democracy. The enterprise crew's' "needs" are irrelevant. It's starfleet and the federation's needs that are paramount. And the federation's "need" during this time was to intimidate the ruthless cardassians during this standoff/crisis Implicit in your argument, (and in the argument of all the Riker defenders) is the notion that the enterprise is some sort of democracy, or pirate ship, where the captain basically serves at the pleasure or his crew
@@stevencoardvenice Picard is the captain of the Federation flagship. He and his crew are simply put the best the Federation have to offer. Full stop. And no - at a moments notice the officers do not have to adapt to all of what Jellico wants. HE has to adapt as well. Otherwise - as it actually happens - he causes fractures among the crew and exposes himself as a bad captain. Implicit in YOUR argument is the idea that the captain does not have to adapt to the needs and strengths of his or her crew. This leads to at best a mass exodus of personnel or at worst outright mutiny - which we would later learn Riker has first hand experience of. Riker has been a part of that slavish dedication to rank. Sorry, in the real word leaders need to EARN not only respect but their authority. Any who dont should fully expect to have it questioned by anyone with a backbone. Jellico was a presumptuous, arrogant tyrant and the only reason, the ONLY reason he came out of that mission without suffering complete disgrace is because Will Riker - the only man with the skills to pull off his plan - CHOSE to do so of his own accord. I cant think of anything more damning to an officer than having your butt saved by a man you lacked the skills to properly command.
After Jellico leaves the Enterprise, Riker is finally able to relax some. Suddenly over the comms….”Picard to Riker, where the hell are my fish?!?” Lol
Jellico gets a bad rap. He's given a couple days to turn a research and exploration vessel into a war ship and gets nothing but push back from Riker. If he has failed in any way, it's his demand for obedience without explaining why everything is changing.
That's a huge failure though. And Riker was taking the hit for everyone's pushback and stress and confusion, not just his own. If you want people to follow you into a battle earning their faith in you is pretty major.
@@junbh2 jellico stated to everyone that he needs to get the enterprise battle ready and he doesn't have time for everyone to like him. In the end he proved his worth because he forced the cardassians into retreating and letting picard go. Riker just didn't want to accept that the federation with all its lofty ideals keeps starfleet as a military unit rather than for research. It shattered the paradise that picard had created aboard the enterprise.
Nearly every senior member of that ship became a captain, it was because the environment wasn't meant to be a warship. If Riker had followed orders from Jellico, Picard would've been killed.
I used to dislike Jellico when I saw this growing up but now years later I see what he was up against and think he was exactly what was needed. This was a military situation with the possibility of war and the Enterprise had to be ready. In war situations sometimes unpleasant decisions have to be made. Jellico was definitely a war commander who spent enough time with the Cardassians to know how to handle them.
When Jellico decided to (1) disregard ranks and (2) tell Riker what he didn't like about him, he effectively invited Riker to return the favor. Lesson to be learned here, folks ... Don't ask somebody to critique you if you don't want to hear what they're going to say.
Jellico wanted to decrease tension between them so he let Riker critique him as he likely knew what Riker thought of him already plus he's likely heard it before from other officers.
@General Bismarck LOL. That's funny, because I seem to recall the Klingons getting their butts kicked by the Dominion just as badly as the Federation did. After the Cardassians joined the Dominion, the Jem'Hadar fleet drove out all of the Klingon forces occupying Cardassian territory, and Chancellor Gowron declared that he was going to fortify the Klingon Empire and prepare for a fight to the death. Those aren't the words of a man who's on the winning side of a war. I also remember General Martok lamenting that "War is much more fun when you are winning," and that the defeats they had been suffering made his wounds ache. And I'm pretty sure that the only reason the Romulans didn't suffer the same fate is because they chose to sell out the Alpha Quadrant and sign a non-aggression treaty with the Dominion rather than join the fight. If it was really being "nice and polite" and lacking a militaristic mindset that caused the Federation to lose so badly to the Dominion, then how come the Klingons didn't do any better?
@@girlgarde And he knew they were probably had a point and chose to disregard that point anyway either because he wasn't willing to change or behaved that way on purpose.
Jellico made a really bad first impression when he took command. First they are in a tense geopolitical situation and he is wasting his time and resources rearranging the shift rotation disrupting the pace and flow of the efficient operation his command. Luckily he did not have to test those changes he made in combat. Riker also did not make the beat first impression by not implementing those changes, but he was advocating for the crew at this point and Jellico failed to listen to the officer that was second in command of the operation of the ship. In this scene they both admitted that they were a very bad fit together as a command staff. Which given Jellico's style and persoanlity Data was a perfect choice for him.
In my military experience, Riker should have discussion his viewpoint privately with Jellico. If Jellico continued to disagree, then Riker should have walked out of the room and said to the crew, "This is what the captain wants...and it's a damned fine plan."
As Captain of the Enterprise, the ship that inspires the ideals of Starfleet and the Federation, Jellico is indeed *not* a good Captain. But as a military officer needing to try and control a flashpoint situation to avoid an all-out war, Jellico is perfect. The Enterprise crew themselves doesn't need him, but he is a necessary evil since, for all they rather be explorers, they have to warriors when the situation calls for it, because military is part of what is expected of Starfleet.
Riker : You don't provide an atmosphere of trust. This line made me think of so many things ... When the new commanding officer orders the Engineering crew to make changes that are simply impossible to get done with the time and resources available ... It does not inspire confidence among the crew members that their new CO knows what he's doing. When the senior staff tries to raise concerns about the captain's orders, and the captain simply refuses to hear them out ... The officers and crew will invariably wonder, "If he's not listening to us, then who ELSE is he not listening to? Is it possible that there are people out there who are trying to give the captain important information, and he's simply ignoring them?" The captain orders changes to be made to the warp coils, the power systems, etc., that he emphasizes are vitally important, and won't listen when the staff tells him that those changes can't be made as quickly as he's insisting on ... The ship's personnel will worry that the captain is COUNTING ON the ship performing at a level that they cannot make happen, which would place everybody in danger if they really do go into combat. When the captain consistently refuses to listen to his senior officers, then the crew will eventually stop trying to inform the captain about potential problems and issues, particularly with regard to the orders he's giving. This can create real problems when the crew doesn't bother to try to tell the captain about a potentially crucial issue with the latest order he's given. If the crew doesn't trust the captain, they will start disregarding his orders and trying to find ways around them. "He obviously doesn't know what he's doing. Do you really want to place your fate in his hands? I'd rather be court-martialed than dead." If the crew believes that the captain doesn't trust them, they won't come to him when there's an issue, and the ship will be in trouble when the commanding officer is unaware of a developing problem. "Don't you think we should report this?" "The captain didn't listen the first ten times we tried to report a problem. What makes you think he'll listen this time?" Being a good leader means inspiring trust. You need to convince the people under your command to trust you, and you also need to convince them that you're willing to trust them. That's what Jellico never did.
^This In any kind of work environment, as useful as it is to have a leader making the decision, no ship (figurative and literal) can thrive without the input of its officers. The best way to ensure employee/crew resentment is to never give a modicum of respect or taking them seriously.
In the film The Wrath of Khan, when he took over Command of Interprise from Captain Spock, then Admiral Kirk made an announcement to the cadets on the ship, informing him of the need to attend an extremely urgent mission and that he needed the ship to do this in time. He says he knows it's not fair to demand so much of them now but he needs them to grow up faster. And they work hard and do a good job, because they know that Kirk and the others on the bridge are very experienced and that they can trust them, just as they want to trust the cadets they trained. I understand that in the case of Jelico, it is quite different, since everyone at Interprise is a veteran at the moment, and he is concerned with avoiding a war with Kardashia. But he acts with everyone like he's an instructor sergeant talking to recruits. He doesn't say why he needs to make all these changes and shows disinterest in Picard's fate, which everyone on the ship loves and respects, showing little empathy, which could be used to motivate more care in fulfilling the mission. To be honest, I recognize that starting with sending Picard on a mission like this was a real snafu from the Starfleet Command and asking Jelico to clean up the mess without causing a war is very unfair after the spilled milk. Do they mess around and Jelico has to invent a miracle that saves the Federation from war? What will be asked of him next? Turn a bunch of guts into a heart using only string? I would also be very stressed and very little open to people questioning me for everything I say to do. But in the end, everything was resolved. jelico was professional enough to step on his pride and ask Riker for help. Jelico may not even be the most sympathetic person in the fleet, but he is undoubtedly a competent captain who solves problems.
I worked for a large manufacturing company implementing and running an employee suggestion program designed to get input into our manufacturing processes. The program was highly successful at all of our plants, foundries, and distribution centers except one (by successful I mean $100 million in cost savings over 4 years). In interacting with the manager of that plant, he made it know to me and to all of his employees, at the top of his voice while on the production floor, that his employees could never have an idea of any merit that he hadn't already thought of first. The workforce was not happy and no one who worked there wanted to go beyond their strict job description. His management style pretty much guaranteed that his unit was constantly under performing and he wound up getting fired.
@Darth Pancake Studios >> But to be fair, he didn't ask the engineering crew to make impossible changes. Actually, that's exactly what he did. >> Data mentioned that all of what he did was technically possible within the amount of time he asked it for. That was before Captain Jellico transferred a full third of the Engineering staff to Security. Here's what happened : Data said that it would be possible to improve the warp coil efficiency by 15%, like Jellico wanted, by taking the secondary distribution grid offline and realigning the warp coil. But it would require the entire Engineering crew to work around the clock for the full two days. Jellico told them to do that. But then, in a later scene, Geordi reveals that Jellico has transferred a third of his crew to Security. And Jellico still expected the Engineering department to realign the warp coil within two days, even though, by Data's estimates, Jellico had now made that impossible. Geordi's entire frustration with their new captain was that Jellico was ordering them to do a great deal of work without giving them the time and resources they needed to get that work done.
@Darth Pancake Studios About two months ago, when we were talking about this video and this episode, somebody else stated that the Engineering crew did, in fact, complete the work on time. I haven't seen this episode in years, so I will take his word for it, and yours, that the work was finished. The question (which I asked then and am asking now again) is, HOW? Did the episode explain how the Engineering crew was able to complete the work within the time required? It should not have been possible, unless you're willing to believe that Data was just flat out wrong when he calculated that it would require the entire Engineering crew to realign the warp coil, on top of all of the other work Jellico wanted them to do. If it was possible to perform the task with only two-thirds of the staff working ... That is a pretty big margin to be off by. It's not like Data to make a mistake like that. Did they simply say that the work was finished, and never explained how? If so, then that's just bad writing. The script made a big deal of the fact that the work was impossible to get done in the time permitted, and then they just brush it aside by saying, "Oh, they just got it done somehow, let's move on to the next plot development"? Sloppy. If they were able to get the work done because Jellico sent them additional help from other departments or something like that, then I would argue that if Jellico was planning to do that, then he should have told the Engineering crew what he had in mind, so they could plan accordingly. I still maintain that Jellico was asking for the impossible by giving the crew orders that, by Data's projections, could not be done with the resources given. Jellico couldn't have known that the Engineering crew would pull a miracle right out of their asses - or, more accurately, that the show's writers would.
I like how both of them view the other as arrogant, but Jellico starts with "Insubordinate", as if questioning his logic or decisions unequivocally makes someone arrogant. Riker says "You ARE arrogant...", which sounds to me like that's the general consensus amongst everyone, Riker is just stating it in a way that implies "I've heard this, and you live up to it". Jellico thinks Riker is arrogant simply for not agreeing with him, Riker finds him arrogant because he'd think something as absurd as disagreeing makes someone arrogant...which is why Riker follows it up with "... and closed-minded" too.
The insubordination is when Riker did not follow his order for the four shift rotation the first time he told him in addition to Riker screaming in his face about admitting Picard was on a starfleet mission. Riker was indeed insubordinate. Once the CO confirms the order that's the end of the convo. Data chastises Worf and Hobson for doing alot less than Riker does in this episode.
@@paulrasmussen8953 Which is why Riker should have completed the task and THEN gone back to Jellico with his concerns. By waiting Riker wasted an entire morning which just made things worse on everyone because of the needless starting and stopping. Riker had his orders and did not complete them because he assumed that Jellico would give him the same latitude that Picard gave him but as we see in his first meeting with Picard , Picard expects Riker to confirm to his style of leadership. Riker blindsides Jellico with not following orders and then coming to him hours later to let him know that it has not been done. Jellico unlike every other Captain we see does not get to pick his entire senior staff or Ex but just inherits one before being sent on a mission that changes the entire mission sop of the ship. He's constantly being judged compared to perfect world thinking.
@@paulrasmussen8953 Except there was no danger as Riker not only got it done..but did so even after wasting an entire morning. The last second scramble was all on him.
Trojansfan Though originally cmdr Sulu in twok was to take command of Excelsior in 3 weeks but it was edited out when they decided to make more movies.
Jellico: Oh, and one more thing. I understand you're holding a Starfleet officer named Jean-Luc Picard. He said that as if he just found out. I guess he forgot at the moment Gul Lemec told him they were holding Picard at the beginning of the episode.
Not at all, Lemec tried to pressure him earlier into publicly acknowledging Picard's mission was sanctioned by starfleet and as such would be an act of war. That would have given the Cardassians legal leverage to launch an attack on a federation target which is why they were in the nebula ready to strike. Jelico refused to acknowledge Picard was on a mission which is why Riker spazzed out and got relieved of duty. This is him publicly acknowledging that Cardassians are holding a starfleet officer. He could only do this after he caught their invasion fleet and had them by the balls.
They both knew that they all knew all along. as the prior comment said .... Jellico could not acknowledge it until he had ALL the leverage. That's all that was.
j.oz you shouldnt cardassians are conquerors but the aren’t particularly good as genocide. So theres still a lot of enemies capable of space travel and that wouldnt let a fleet of cardassian warships get away armed or unarmed. They would likely be destroyed before too long.
Create a positive environment and you'll have a team who'll independently work to try and help you. Create a negative one and they'll lie, avoid and do the bare minimum for you. Jellico does the latter then uses his own ego to rationalise it. Amazing how many people look up to his 'leadership' style.
@Fred Miller Jr No, Jellico is a half step short of being a martinet. He is one of those captains that expects his orders to be followed without question, and those captains either get bumped up to admiral or they get killed because in Riker's painfully correct assessment, part of being a good Starfleet captain is to value the opinions of the officers under his command. Kirk did it, Picard did it, Sisko did it, Janeway did it (even though she had to learn it in the beginning), Archer did it (though he had to learn it during and shortly after the attack on Earth). Jellico obviously does not do that, and his command style clashed hard with Riker and the rest of the crew. His dressing down of Troi (as well as the changing of the duty shifts), while by the book was justified and well within his rights, they were Jellico's attempt to remake the Enterprise crew in his own image of what the flagship should be, never mind the massive successes the Enterprise had up to that point. If Jellico had been in command at the time of The Best of Both Worlds, The Enterprise would have been destroyed and Earth would have been assimilated.
@@Rendclaw the Enterprise up until that point hadn’t really faced the sort of military situation that they were encountering. They’d never engaged in proper pitched battles nor had they intended to. The majority of time they were flying round in uncharted systems facing completely and utterly inferior species or races.
@@Rendclaw My assessment was Jelico didn't need a staff. He knew everything. A man who makes others feel small so he can feel special. Not the best choice to lead others into battle.
@@jamiengo2343 And while that's true, Jellico doesn't inspire trust in any of his subordinates. And because he refuses to even listen to their opinions, they doubt his competency. Which then leads to the problems in the episode. He either needed to get the crew to understand that they would have to trust his decisions because of how time-sensitive the situation was, or he needed to demonstrate his knowledge/compentency so that the crew had a reason to trust his decisions aside from his position. Because he does neither, the crew spends the whole episode second-guessing and doubting his decisions even if they were objectively correct. Basically, Jellico expected the entire crew to place their lives in his hands without a single justification as to why. And while that could work in a military that emphasizes quick reactions and obediance, the independance necessary for operating in Star Fleet exploration runs directly contrary to Jellico's style of leadership.
Gained a small amount of respect for Jellico here. Still don't like him, but frankly he was the one that was more in the right here. Gotta love how Riker calls him arrogant, and then is arrogant himself 15 seconds later.
I had a manager ask me for feedback about her once. I based my response on what Riker told Jellico beginning at 0:51 Needless to say, I didn't like her one bit!
If you micro-manage your officers, it smothers their growth, destroys their morale, and expresses distrust and contempt. It is very not-good to have a resentful crew.
He was not micro managing at all. He told the leaders of the ship what he expected to get done. How they got that done was not Jellico's concern and delegated to the department leads. They just had to get it done, in time, and on par to expectations. That's not at all micro managing.
Micromanagement is awful. I've had to deal with it in my current job and it just makes you terrible because you can't do or see enough to be good at anything. A downward spiral.
I always wanted Jellico to say to Riker, 'If I stayed on as Captain, would take the first command Starfleet offered you?' Riker would say, 'Yes.' Then Jellico says, 'Good. I can tell the Admiral my other mission is now successful.' Riker would respond, 'What?' Jellico, 'Wil, the Admiral knew our personalities and styles would not...mix. While at the same time she wants you to move into the big chair. So she saw this as excellent opportunity to demonstrate to you that it will soon be time to move up and onward.' Meaning the antagonism between was partly genuine and partly Jellico being the kick in the ass Riker needed.
The reality of this is that they’re officers like this - and XO’s who hold their ground and tell them what they think. He is a bad captain. He may have experience in negotiating but like Riker said “You have everyone wound up so tight-there’s no joy in anything.” There’s way to approach officers to get something done, then there’s the wrong way to tell them to get something done.
Always saw Riker as the one who was the bad command officer. He couldn't get past his own opinions and let it guide his response to Jellico. In the end Jellico defeated the Cardassians and saw the return of Capt. Picard.
Jellico is a technocrat. He was brought in for his expertise with Cardassians. Despite the episode painting him as the secondary antagonist, he only did 1 thing wrong in the entire 2 parts. That was reassigning half of Engineering to Security before they finished the modifications which Data stated would take the entire department working round the clock for 2 days. Everything else he did was well within his rights and very reasonable for a military situation. They were basically preparing for a flashpoint confrontation that could have kicked off an interstellar war. He conducted himself like a competent military officer and the crew threw a tempertantrum. But THE best thing he did for the show was to get Troi out of that catsuit.
You thank someone for a favor, not for fulfilling a military necessity. If Riker knew he was most likely to satisfy the mission and save lives, that was his duty. You don't get thanked for doing your duty.
I'd like to point out that this mission was supposedly a diplomatic one but the entire time leading up to meeting with the Cardassians Jellico spent that time preparing for battle.
It seems to me that Jellico never believed that diplomacy had any real chance of success with the Cardassians. That's why he was so focused on a military solution. He may have been right, but it still has to be pointed out ... The problem with going into a negotiation ASSUMING that it will fail is that you will usually find a way to make that happen.
As much as a prick that Jellico comes across, Riker was the bigger prick in that scene...with the smug on his face. Jellico could have ordered Riker, but chose not to. Too many lives were at stake for an argument raised over a closed subject. Riker was the man for the job. At least they took a moment to "speak their peace".
Okay, I will attempt to change your mind in a respectful manner. I ask you to look at more than the results, for a moment. Jellico used the talent and crew of the Enterprise that flourished under Picard to achieve those results. Many of those officers would transfer away from Jellico to work for someone that inspired trust and did more than just bark orders, as correct as the decisions behind those orders may be, I wouldn't work for someone like Jellico, and I can prove it by all the jobs I have left when I realized I worked for someone like him. You're ranking him based on what he could accomplish based on leading a team cultivated and developed and inspired by Picard, and in the short time you saw him, he turned his own first officer against him, a VERY competent officer who historically has even exceeded Picard in raw ability whenever he was in command, most of the crew as well, and the senior officers. He also overworked them and overlooked the problems caused by his decisions, like how there wasn't enough staff for a four shift rotation, and didn't want to hear what problems his decisions caused. An effective commander can continue to insist the order gets followed if it is the right call, but that feedback is invaluable and he ignored it. That's the sign of a bad commander in the long term. If Jellico were tasked with building a staff and a crew from scratch, he would cause massive brain drain. He'd push away talented people who do not want to be ignored, mistreated, not trusted or listened to. In the long term, he would only have a crew of people willing to work in that environment, and every time I worked with a crew that was led by such a manager, they either had poor morale, a desire for revenge, no respect for their manager or his rules, or were sociopaths themselves. They were terrible to work with, and that also inspires good people to leave. Similar to how people with any sense leave a dictatorial nation like Russia or North Korea, when human rights and personal freedoms are suspended and advice is not heeded and people are treated as cannon fodder and without respect, the smart people who can leave always do. Loyalty is earned, so is trust, commanders like this absolutely destroy both things. You CANNOT have an effective team without these things, not for long. Jellico wasn't there for long and took advantage of assets Picard had, that he pushed away the entire time he was there. Consider also that Jellico made no decisions Picard couldn't have made. Picard could have ordered every single order that Jellico did, and the years of experience and trust and respect between the captain and crew would have made all those orders get carried out easier and more enthusiastically.
I like in this exchange, effectively, both characters were correct. Riker was inflexible to Jellico in some respects, for a mission that needed it - and he needed calling on that. However, Jellico is too much of an obsessed micro manager, and indeed - doesn't inspire that trust atmosphere that a crew needs. To their credit, Riker comes under Jellico's command effectively the rest of the episode, and Jellico takes Riker's feedback on board to become better in his remaining crew exchanges. A great pair of lessons, from a great episode, that took me a long while to learn could apply to my life as well.
the difference between Jelico and Picard is this: Picard is at his core a diplomat and explorer, Jelico is a MILITARY man at heart he expects orders to be followed simply because they are orders and to him discipline is everything because without discipline people die.
Except good military men don't try to make everyone feel small. You need them to believe in their ability, not inability. Richard Winters comes to mind. He didn't puff himself up like Jelly does. Riker is a far better choice. He expects competency, so doesn't ignore people like Jelly did. Ego can not replace knowing what you're doing. I liked the militarily mindset, but execution was horrible.
I think Riker is 51% in the wrong. The reason? Jellico is a Captain. Show who the better man/officer is by maintaining military bearing and discipline - for both.... That's why The captain is 49% in the wrong because he failed to lead by example.
Everyone seems to forget Picard’s attitude when he assumed command of the Enterprise in “encounter at farpoint”. When you are pressed for time you don’t stand on pleasantries, you give orders and expect them to be carried out. Jellico was a fine captain, he just didn’t have time to get to know the crew, so he asked of them what they are trained for.
Lots of bosses and managers out there that rule by fear and mistrust and they indeed kill any joy that the job ever had. I'd venture to say that most workers and labor don't operate on money/pay alone. You have to like what you are doing. Even a little bit. I hated the character of Captain Jellico for what he stood for.
@@attiepollard7847 His second on command was a android a living computer. People aren't computers or things. They need proper incentive to function at there peak efficiency even if they are obligated to serve you. You don't get there best if rule through fear just get the bare minimum. Sometimes that's enough but most of time it isn't especially not in the long term.
That's a good point. Remember that brief encounter with an Enterprise from a Borg-infested universe in the episode "Parallels"? I wonder how Captain Jellico and the Cairo were doing in that universe where Starfleet failed to stop the Borg from assimilating the Federation. I'd be willing to bet that that universe's Captain Jellico would have a very different perspective on a Starfleet officer who succeeded in stopping the Borg.
This is why jellico is a bad captain. He isolated everyone from the beginning and pushed his authority over the mission and ended up having to crawl back to Riker with his tail between his legs. If this was Kirk or picard or sisko they would have been able to instill respect from the crew and still make the final call even if their crew didn't fully agree, at least they would trust him. Like he said he didn't have time for people to like him. Well if they don't like AND they don't respect you then they aren't going to put their lives at risk for you. As far as they knew picard was dead so they had no reason to follow jellico except they were starfleet.....but when you can resign at any time this isn't strong enough motivation to follow your captain to was or death
Isn't it just lovely when your boss, who treats you and other like crap, comes to you for help and you hold all the cards. And you finally get to dictate the terms of whether or not you supply that help. I just loved Riker in this moment.
@@Idazmi7 when? He simply stated his disagreement with the captain's decision, which is the duty of a first officer when he believes the captain is acting recklessly. In response, Jellico relieved him of command
Can we talk about how Jellico was mature enough to first admit his thoughts and was humble enough to go to Riker for the mission. Riker turned petty at the end for the you’re welcome comment
It's not petty. It's a clever jibe that proves that Jelico only cares about results, not the team that produces them. He walks in, having screwed himself up to trying to negotiate with Riker after effectively booting him off the bridge, gets what he wants (because he actually _does understand_ people, he just doesn't care much about others), and quickly walks out the door "without so much as a 'thank you' ." Riker's jibe is a way of saying "the grass REALLY IS greener over here!" without being overtly arrogant or condescending.
I had this problem at work. Sometimes being too good at a job alienates others, and like a poster said, just because something worked doesn't necessarily mean the means to get it done were both moral and logical It does seem to be unsustainable, Jellicos style like it was for me at work. You'd have to basically be God to be able to manage perfectly all the time with all the wisdom to match
@Clippy on point. thing is, picard is a diplomat, jelligo is military. the enterprise crew (and federation) was too complacent anyhow imho....as showcased by Q. even troy understood where jellico was coming from...and she was hotter in uniform anyhow lol
@@unusualbydefault Yeah! They were a little too complacent, that's a great point! There's certainly a balance between diplomacy and inflexibility though
I think Riker's behavior was the height of unprofessionalism. He should have had an official reprimand placed in his record. Imagine if he had tried to pull that attitude under the command of Sisko or Kirk
0:54 My absolute favourite part of the two parter and one of my favourite Riker moments. All the rank ass kissers are wrong, Riker is right. Jellico should have had enough experience to give and take with the crew at such short notice. Adaptation is the sign of a good commander correct? He was an arrogant tyrant who was lucky not to come out of that mission in complete disgrace.
Both sides can be right, and both sides can be wrong, and both sides can be both right and wrong. In the end, not only was this critical mission accomplished, but every main character became a better officer. The Enterprise crew had become to soft, too casual, too comfortable. And while Jellico was the right fit for this particular mission, he got to see exactly why his command style wouldn't cut it with the best of the best for very long. Reminds me of when Kurn was f ing with the whole crew just to evaluate his brother. If I had to pick sides, I would have to say Jellico was right. His sense of urgency was absolutely correct for this particular situation, and it is surprising how many of the senior staff failed to see this.
In someways he was right the problem was... he was coming onto a ship where the plan was it to be a short term command and changing everything around him to fit his style. IT would have been fine if he was taking over the Enterprise long term and they had time to fit into his style, but he wasn't, the plan was always for Picard to come back and he knew that. Worse through was the shift changes he introduced, it was a terrible idea, while his preferred shift style might have been better long term, it introduced into the crew right before a dangerous and vital mission a great way to give a lot of them Jet Lag.
@@andyme3541 I've never served in the military myself, but I have read some opinions on this from people who are veterans or currently serving. They said that when you're preparing for an impending crisis, you should be changing from a three-shift rotation to a two-shift rotation, so that everyone works 12 hours a day instead of 8. These people argued that changing to a four-shift rotation, which actually reduces people's working hours, during an emergency makes no sense. Basically, changing to a four-shift rotation means that every crew member now has to get 8 hours' worth of work done in 6 hours, just to maintain the same productivity they had before. To look at it another way ... Suppose that a particular department has 120 crew members. With a three-shift rotation, there are 40 crew members working at any given time. With a four-shift rotation, the working personnel is reduced to 30. Which essentially means that, at any given time, 30 people need to somehow do the work of 40 people, just to get the same amount of work done as before. Changing to a four-shift rotation would only work if every department got additional personnel, but there was no indication that was happening here. Even if Jellico was reassigning personnel from the science labs that were being shut down, that still creates a shortfall because the newly reassigned personnel are being forced into an unfamiliar working environment, meaning that they won't be able to work as quickly or as well as the personnel normally working in that section.
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I'm glad that Jellico and Riker got all that off of their chests. And hey, they managed to get the job done by working together despite their differences--that's what Star Trek is all about.
@The Cornfield I wouldn't say good leader. Good Captain, maybe. Good strategist? Leader? Not so much.
@@brandonfrancey5592 I'm inclined to agree with you.
Jellico may have been a good captain, in that he accomplished missions and got results.
But he wasn't a good leader.
I think Riker was right. Jellico was closed-minded. He never listened to his staff. He brushed aside all of their input and concerns, even when they might have been valid or useful. He only ever cared about what HE thought was the right thing to do.
A good leader inspires people. That's what Jellico never did. He never gained the trust or the loyalty of the people under his command.
When Picard gave an order, his crew followed it because they trusted him.
When Jellico gives an order, the crew obeys because they know that there'll be hell to pay if they fail to do as he demands. Jellico gets all of his power through fear, and it is a terrible way to lead.
I strongly suspect that if Jellico's crew ever had a way to challenge Jellico's orders to a higher authority and get him overruled, they would have done it in a heartbeat. I also have a hard time imagining any crew serving under Jellico feeling devastated at the idea of losing him, like the Enterprise crew did in "Chain of Command" and "Gambit."
@@akshin1556 I mostly agree, except I wouldn't say Jellico rules through fear. He isn't Darth Vader. The crew isn't afraid of Jellico, they just don't like him.
Jellico's power comes from his pips. He's Captain. To him, that's end of story. It's like when your boss tells you to do something and you ask why, his response is, "Because I'm your boss." It's not a real answer but it is true. Same applies with Jellico. He's the captain, he gave an order. Do it. He doesn't want to hear excuses.He wants results.
The one redeeming factor is Jellico didn't ask for the impossible. Difficult, sure but not impossible or criminal. He didn't demand 6 hours of work be done in 2 and punish everyone for not meeting his impossible goals. Hell, when it came down to a dangerous mission, he asked Riker, not Order him to do it.
@@brandonfrancey5592
>> Jellico didn't ask for the impossible.
Yes, he did.
In fact, that was precisely the issue that Geordi was having with him. Jellico was issuing orders to the Engineering department that could not possibly be fulfilled with the time and resources they were being given.
A specific example : Jellico ordered Geordi to take the secondary distribution grid offline and realign the warp coil, to increase the warp coil efficiency by 15%, in two days' time, with only two-thirds of the Engineering crew working.
That was impossible, and Jellico knew it. He was present when Data explicitly stated that realigning the warp coil in two days would require the entire Engineering crew, and then only if the entire crew worked around the clock for the full two days. Despite knowing this, Jellico still transferred a third of the Engineering crew to Security and still expected the warp coil to be realigned.
Riker said that the other departments on the Enterprise were experiencing the same issues with their new captain. I don't know if Jellico ever penalized the crew for being unable to complete the work he was demanding, but he did, in fact, ask for the impossible.
@@akshin1556 He didn't "in fact ask for the impossible" because the work got done.
2:22 Love that Data specifically mimics Riker's pose in the first officer's chair
Lol
Good observation!!!
Is it just me, or does Data look a little weird in the red?
@@davidbryantpiano6003from what I understand, that is pretty much the exact reason why red and gold switched places from TOS to TNG. Data didn’t look good in red and Picard didn’t look good in Gold
Their working relationship was strengthened by them both admitting their personal dislike for each other. This is how mature individuals bring light to their feelings in order to overcome them for the sake of others/the task at hand.
Something too many people have trouble with some act like they'd rather kill each other than work with each other
Back when people gave a shit about good script writing. New Trek is garbage by comparison.
I like Jellico. He told Troi to put the poom poom away. AND she listened. Try doing that today and see what happens.
I have had to deal with housemates I don't get along with. I try to be nice but in the end just give up and avoid interacting with them unless necessary.
@@AdamWEST-yu2osthat was actually more because Marina Sirtis herself wanted the change rather than the eye candy costumes she'd worn up to this point.
She actually got a few good stories after this too - the episode where she takes the commander test, and when she is kidnapped by the Romulans.
1:15 I have the distinct impression that, although Jellico doesn't necessarily agree with Riker's assessment of his approach to command, he actually does understand where Riker is coming from ... and it doesn't sit well with Jellico that he does.
No he doesn't, he's just smart enough to not push it since he needs riker
@@unusualbydefault
1. Jellico doesn't need Riker to agree to this. If he wanted to, he could simply order Riker to pilot the shuttlecraft.
2. Riker would have agreed to pilot the shuttlecraft whether he liked Jellico's attitude about it or not. If Jellico neither asked nor ordered Riker to be the pilot, Riker would have volunteered. Jellico likely knew this, or at least suspected it.
3. LaForge never said that Riker was the only pilot who could accomplish this mission. He said Riker was the best pilot, but also said that he could do it himself. There may have been other pilots who could pull it off as well.
4. If the Enterprise had just one absolutely flawless pilot, it would have to be Data. If it came to it, Jellico could have somebody else take over as acting first officer and instruct Data to pilot the shuttlecraft.
Jellico had no pressing need to get on Riker's good side. He had other options. He chose to ask Riker to pilot the shuttlecraft rather than resort to any of those other options, because he felt it was the right thing to do, and it's unlikely that Jellico would have felt that way if he sincerely believed that Riker was totally wrong about everything.
With all of that said, there's no real way to know what Jellico actually thought of Riker's assessment of him. What exactly his facial expression and body language at 1:15 actually meant is a matter of perception, which is always going to vary with the individual.
I sincerely believe that Jellico didn't agree with Riker's assessment, but he did understand where Riker was coming from. That's just my perception of it.
I would disagree with choosing Data over Ryker. A flawless pilot isn't necessarily the best pilot. Data doesn't have Ryker's instinct and intuition.
@@danieldickson8591
Perhaps.
@@akshin1556 No Riker has been stated to be the best pilot, that includes Data. For whatever reason an instinct Data doesn't have for the ships Riker is the best Pilot on the Enterprise. He'd relieved Riker of his duties at this point which likely would have given Riker the right to refuse.
I like that they didnt make jellico an idiot with his conflict with Ricker. The conflict comes from their styles of leadership, decisions and command. They just dont mesh. Which happens irl.
I agree. Leadership style plays a big part of a team. Jellico's approach to the crew did not create an atmosphere of trust which can ruin teams/crew on a ship. I this case, everyone was more than capable of performing their duties and they were successful.
Plus the Enterprise crew were used to Picard's style of command and their personalities were well suited to mesh with Picard's personality to produce great results. Jellico's style of command however was quite different from Picard's so they weren't at all used to and suited mentally to his style of command.
In turn, Jellico wasn't used to the independent minded senior staff of the Enterprise which frustrated him to no end.
Jelico's style was to treat everyone as incompetent, while giving ridiculous orders. Ego masquerading as leadership.
@@icecold9511 I'm trying to think of an example of him doing that.
sure... but that doesn't mean all styles are equal. Riker and Piccard have different styles which are both effective. Jellico is a garbage leader and the type of guy that would have been mysteriously "sniped" in modern war.
I got second hand smug from Riker
Riker with that BDE
But he directed first contact
Seriously...
A lot of people saying Captain Jellico acted like a dick to the Enterprise crew......all I know is that he's "Dick" Jones and Riker just *_F*CKED_* with the wrong guy! Picard's a sweet old man and he means well but he's not gonna live forever and Dick Jones is No. 2 around here......pretty simple math, huh, Riker?
@@hmartinspliff Christ, what I'd give to have an outtake like that.
I’ve had managers like Jellico.
They’re smart as hell, so damn sharp, and absolutely produce results, but they do not inspire others to work for them.
One manager was incredibly competent but she was a micromanaging douchebag, wanted updates the moment they happened, constantly applied pressure for work to get done, and only cared about how the team made her look.
She was a good manager but was a terrible leader, and made no friends in the process despite how many times she smiled and shared laughed during networking events.
No one wants to work for people like this and they push talent away like it’s a damn sport.
Despite what you want to say about “hurt feelings” and “bruised egos”, it is not good for your career if you have this reputation.
He's too insecure. And doesn't trust his own soldiers. Like how the Vorta don't trust the jem hedar. When a boss doesn't show u trust, it's very toxic
One of the departments I used to work in had one just like Jellico. He came in one morning yelling at everyone over a 0.75% drop in quality. In less than 3 hours, 1/2 of the staff walked down to H.R. to tether their resignations. Before the end of the day, upper management sent him packing. Some of the staff that walked out had been with the company for 15 years. After he was gone, quality went up by 5%.
@@davidharris8444 collective bargaining, or a united front, is so underutilized among employees in our workforce.
@jasonvoorhees5640
I disagree with myself actually. Jellico was right. Riker was being emotional and immature
I probably wrote that comment without seeing the full context of the episode. That it was a military situation
I do disagree with jellico's insults of Riker though here. Unnecessary and incorrect in any event. Riker is competent and he is hardly insubordinate
@jasonvoorhees5640 lol but I think any chance of that happening was lost when jellico came into his quarters and slandered him in this way. Riker is not insubordinate or a bad officer. He just missed his Picard
David Warner and Sir Patrick Stewart... two legendary British actors with outstanding performance!
Star Trek V, Star Trek VI, and then TNG. David Warner was so good they had to keep bringing him back.
Ah! The photographer from the "The Omen". I didn't recognize him at first.
David Warner was the greatest Dr Who we never got (on screen - he played the Doctor in talking books, and was excellent).
Let's not forget Ronny Cox, who could play the righteous leader, good or bad, better than just about anyone.
Raz al Ghul
Picard: "You enjoyed that." Riker: "You're damn right I did."
Nice turn of the phrase!
You know Riker rehearsed that in anticipation of Jellico dropping the ranks.
Really admire Jellico using the foot-in-the-door technique with Picard’s release.
The ceremony? It's starfleet protocol and he made it perfectly clear he doesn't give a crap how the crew feels about it.
@@mistermonologue2442 yep!
Leaders like this are good but they leave behind a trail of people who do not want to work for you and people who are likely willing to throw you under the bus if the opportunity arises.
It’s the whole phrase of “I won’t wish the man to be fired but I sure as hell won’t lose any sleep if he does”
Anyone who thinks this isn’t bad does not have good social acumen, and is still emotionally stunted by not accepting that their mother and daughters are humans who have feelings like everyone else.
@@steverogers7601 It's a lazy way of leading and is frustratingly (and historicaly) supposed to be viewed as endearing but what it really is is a lack of confidence mixed with an ignorant view of what leadership is all topped off with a child's aptitude for patience.
Personally I call it the Columbo approach “Just one more thing…” *
It's a shame that Jonathon Frakes got more interested in directing. I could definitely have seen a "Captain Riker" series.
I met Frakes at a convention about 10 years ago and showed him that I am a Riker. He was amused and started talking about Rikers in space. I know he kids about that in conventions and we laughed, but he said, no I'm serious I would like to make a show with me and Marina. Well, look at Picard in 2020 and seems like he's halfway there.
Scott Laux life has been good to him.
A bit of a love/hate with Riker, sometimes he was great, and other times he annoyed me, but despite that, a perfect fit for next gen main characters.
For sure I was hoping to see him captain the Titan. Then they just moved on. Shame.
He directed the Picard episode that killed icheb, terrible episode.
A show like this will never come again.
I dunno, I recaptured a lot of the feelings I've lost in modern Star Trek with the Stargate shows.
I dropped this masterpiece on my supervisor once. Tears were drawn. It needed to be said.
Picard is a manager that knows how to instill trust and confidence in people and has enough trust in his subordinates to delegate tasks so he can focus other things. And this is more or less reciprocated and appreciated by the crew. You even see O'brien do this during Starship Down when he talks to Worf about handling the other crewman.
Jellico is like R. Lee Ermy in The Siege of Firebase Gloria. He takes command of his ship knowing that bad stuff is about to go down and that there's no time to get to know the crew, or build up confidence trust and respect. This situation is too immediate for any of that. Jellico knows what he's doing and is confident in his own ability as Captain, but he simply doesn't have the luxury of time to show that to any of the other crew.
Picard is clearly a diplomat. Jellico is a warrior. His personality is going to rankle some people but that's just how it is. If he had more time with the crew in less shit circumstances they'd have probably gotten along better.
Jellico treats the crew of a luxury cruise and exploration ship as if it was a tightly run military ship. He may be a really good CO when he's got a crew that's used to that style, but whether he was ignorant, too inflexible, or didn't care - his approach wasn't working at all, and he still insisted upon it. _That_ alone made him a terrible CO in this situation.
It's funny that people like jellico would end up taking over starfleet once the conflict with the dominion and the borg started. Picard would not fit in that Era. Picard is a peacetime captain. An explorer
@@stevencoardvenice I'd rather say people like Sisko would take over. Jellico is too inflexible in his ways to make _any_ use of the exploration focussed crews of the vast majority of Starfleet ships, as he's thoroughly demonstrated in these episodes.
@@Wolf-ln1ml jellico got the job done. He wasn't there to make friends. This was a military operation
@@stevencoardvenice Yes, this was a military operation. That an exploration ship and crew were forced to do because nobody else was available. So of course the military just goes in and expect everyone to function as if they were career military... 🙄
Seriously, _this_ mindset you're displaying here is exactly what almost got not only the entire mission to fail, but also to lose the Enterprise and Picard. Military "my way or... well, there's only my way" idiocy.
I know how Riker feels. I have a boss at my job that almost everyone dislikes. What people like that don't realize is they don't inspire people to go out of their way for them, its get in get out.
Isn't it lovely with an arrogant first officer wagers the future of the Federation on a personal vendetta against his boss?
Idazmi7 he has a point - he tried to get the captain to inspire his crew so they would be ready for combat and unified. That’s a ship of exploration not a military ship. They have families and children on board. He was dismissed because Jellico saw Riker’s behaviour as as dissent and didn’t understand how to get the crew behind him.
Riker didn’t wager anything- both he and Jellico knew he would pilot the shuttle.
@@makasete30 but he it´s still member of military organization. Also in situation which is at edge of war. There is no space for some argument or anything. He is great officer, but terrible first officer, similar situation was in The Best of Both Worlds, when he acts like a idiot when Shelby has a interesting proposals and he only "throwing sticks" into her path. If there any character in TNG which I really don´t like, that would be him.
Starfleet isn't a military organization. It's more apt to call them a merchant/science marine expetionary force. Starfleet is more civilian than military. And civilian ships do have rank, and certain offenses (especially mutiny) are crimes in civilian shipping.
But Starfleet does not wage offensive wars and largely does not have the capacity until the end of the Dominion War, where Starfleet starts going very wrong.
@@ayanithtalreign
_"Although the Enterprise is a military vessel, it's organization is only semi-military. The "enlisted men" category does not exist. Star Trek goes on the assumption that every man and woman aboard the U.S.S. Enterprise is the equivalent of a qualified astronaut, and therefore an officer."_ - Gene Roddenberry, The Making of Star Trek, page 209.
_"I'm a soldier, not a diplomat."_ - James Kirk
Starfleet is a military organization.
Great episode and a fantastic guest cast. Ronny Cox and David Warner were excellent here.
I would have liked to have seen Jellico make a cameo in Picard Season 3
Yeah, Jelico ends up saving Riker and as hes leaving turns to Riker and says "You're Welcome" 😂
He shows up in Prodigy. I remember my jaw dropped when it was him lmao
You got your return of Jellico in Produgy season 2!
Jellico should have started counting down to make the Cardassian yell "Stop counting..stop counting!!".
Nah only Dukat could have the balls to do convince that smuggler to sign a confession.
That takes not just any Cardassian...
Jellico would have atomized those Cardassians and been home in time for cornflakes.
I always wondered if Riker disliked Jellico because he reminded him of Eric Pressman from the Pegasus. When he was on Enterprise, Pressman said he preferred the younger Ensign Riker he knee as he blindly followed orders - "once I've made a decision, I don't have time for my officers to question it", while Commander Riker would question orders. In fact Riker disobeying Captain DeSoto was what made Picard choose him for the First Officer for the Enterprise.
Unlike Jellico (and Pressman), Picard would actively seek his officers opinions and advice before coming to a decision.
lol, when i started watching this clip i thought it was from that episode.
Ronnie Cox is a superb actor. First saw him in Beverly Hills Cop and then Total Recall as well as Robocop. It's guest star appearances on TNG which really enhanced the quality of the episode.
Bob Gunton (Warden from Shawshank Redemption) also played a superb Captain (Benjamin Maxwell) in TNG.
I remember him in Beverly Hills Cop as Andrew Bogamil. He was a hardass to Eddie Murphy in the first one. Eventually he warmed up to him, and by the second movie, he was friends with him. Of course, he is probably best known for playing Richard "Dick" Jones in Robocop.
@@BrotherDerrick3X I'd buy that for a dollar
ruclips.net/video/EYdpy9ShoVU/видео.html
This role made me dislike Ronny Cox, still do. Guess it worked then,,great acting
Abdul M. Ismail Gunden’s character in both cases was “the Bad Guy”.
@@BrotherDerrick3X As well as the main bad guy from Total Recall /the 1990 version/.
2:10
Do I want to know how close that was?
NO.
and THIS is why Riker was the best for this job.
@@RubbittTheBruise I'm pretty sure that Riker detected that vessel closer than 500 meters ..... based off his clear sense of relief.
Cool under pressure?
“Well...now that the ranks are dropped, Captain, I don’t like you either! You just watch yourself! We’re wanted men! I have the death sentence on TWELVE systems!”
He'll be careful
@@Rutherford_Inchworm_III “He’ll be DEAD!”
Welcome to TrekWars.
@@Rutherford_Inchworm_III ‘He’ll be dead!”
"Wait, wrong franchise."
Riker: You are arrogant and close minded. You need to control everything and everyone
Jellico: ...yeah, well, um, you've been treated for every STD known in the quadrant, and you keep on infecting the newer female cadets (and a select group of the males), so there.
Riker: Touché
This shows Ronny Cox's skills as an actor. He's not like that in real life. Remember reading an article where he says that he doesn't stay in character after "CUT".
you have to look at him like lt bogomil from beverly hills cop and not dick jones from robocop.
Andy Taylor was an amazing and immensely likable person. Andy Griffith was supposed to be an asshole. How he can play nice guy, but be such a rotten person is amazing.
Kinsey!
Jellico, despite being different, was a true hero in his own right :
a) He destroyed the Cardassians' perceived position of strength swiftly and with full confidence. A masterclass in flipping the script.
b) He ordered Troi to wear a Starfleet uniform.
Good little poke at Troi's 'casuality' in uniform.
Jelico had no need for a counselor on the bridge; he needed an advisor, one person who can stay observant and 'read the room' while everyone else stays focused on task execution.
"I always knew where the line was drawn, and you just stepped over it, buddy-boy. You've insulted me and you've insulted this company with that bastard creation of yours. I had a guaranteed military sale with ED 209 - renovation program, spare parts for twenty-five years... Who cares if it worked or not?" -- Great actor!
I KNEW I recognized him!
Dang, I never made that connection. Great catch.
The Federation in my opinion could whip the Cardassian’s asses.
They keep foolishly tying their hands behind their back.
The Federation definitely could, but did not want a war that would solve nothing for EITHER side. The Federation's primary goal was exploration, as JLP has mentioned frequently between the TV series, at least one of their movies, and especially in the novel series.
They fought a war that lasted from 2347-2366. It mainly skirmished. It wasn't that the Federation couldn't win, it was that they didn't want to be involved in total war, that would cost lives and resources. The other thing is, the Cardassians, despite having less advanced technology than the Federation, are known for their deceptive tactics and highly skilled at ambushes. They proved to be a formidable foe, despite the odds against them.
The Federation prided themselves on not starting wars. Peace and cooperation were their ideals.
the newer ships such as the galaxy and nebula class ships were more than a match for even multiple cardassian warships. The thing is that the vast majority of Starfleet's vessels were the older class vessels. Miranda class, excelsior class, and oberth class vessels which were dedicated exploration and research vessels as opposed to prioritizing defense. They were at best on equal footing with the cardassians, and at worst outgunned. The federation didn't start emphasizing development of defensive starships until after wolf 359 and the buildup to the dominion war.
the federation needs more dilithium and the cardassians dont.
It's great to work for a truly competent 'superior' Officer or NCO. Even more significant when later, after retirement, a Staff Sergeant recognizes you (without a name badge) and states "You're the reason I stayed in the military."
This episode truly stands out. Fantastic writing. Great side characters. This was so close to movie material. It's one of my favorites!
Beauty scene. Showed Jellico was the bigger man. Also nice to see that not all Star fleet Captain's were hesitant to use the power they had to avoid conflicts. Mines on the belly make up for one million diplomatic words that are destined to fail.
How was he the bigger man?
@@Wolf-ln1ml These comment sections are full of Jellico ass-kissers.
@@Wolf-ln1ml In the end they both put their egos and arguments to one side (without either conceding) and they both did their duty. I don't think either was bigger than the other.
@@paulwhite6745 Yep, I can agree with that.
So Jellico comes to Riker, insults him, then expects him to go on a dangerous mission? Way to inspire the troops, NOT! Plus look at his face when Riker responds in kind: total whipped puppy. Riker stepped up in spite of Jellico's ego. I don't see how he's the bigger person. That said, I would have liked if Riker acknowledged he was wrong to question Jellico in front of another officer. He should have known better, and offered an apology for what it's worth.
I had a boss like Jellico once. He was a complete and utter asshole. I suffered under him for three years and finally told him I was done. I went on vacation, came back on Monday and he fired me. Gave me a ton of severance and I got a better job the next week. I call him the human cold sore.
Did you at least thank him because in the future you will just act like him in a leadership position?
Id have taken a page out the Klingon relationship of captain and first officer: Challenge him for command and kill him
@@attiepollard7847 In fact, I have spent every moment trying to be exact opposite of him.
“I had to relieve Will Riker because he made a mistake! Now it’s time to rectify that mistake!” 😂😂😂
That shit eating grin on Riker gets me every time.
This should be a lesson in leadership. You need to let workers WANT to help you. Let them think they're doing you a favor. Positive gets more done than negative.
Indeed. An atmosphere of fearing to step on toes or run the leader the wrong way and so on, that can be created - but what *should* be created is an atmosphere of respect, which must be earned, to the point where the crew want to work *for* their captain, and don’t consistently need reminding about who is in charge.
@esphaeraspraestans4212yes. It's a military crisis
@@stevencoardveniceOne that the crew of the Enterprise was MORE than ready to take on already. Remember: Jellico is an inferior Captain who until recently was in command of an inferior ship. He was out of his depth on the Enterprise and instead of yanking everyone around by his chain he should have relied on Will to be the one to balance between what he wants at short notice and what the Enterprise crew needs.
Everyone claiming hes a hero? He alienated the ONE man needed to complete his mission and said man had to choose to help of his own accord. When it comes to command? Total. Abject. Failure.
@@jmlaw8888 totally disagree. You call him an "inferior captain," but that's just your opinion, because you like Picard. We all do.
But jellico was brought in there by starfleet for a specific purpose. He was a militarist, not a diplomat like Picard.
And Riker's behavior was kind of immature. He loved his captain, Picard. And he let his feelings for Picard cloud his judgment. The mission was more important than Picard's life
And this was a military crisis. No time for team bonding exercises. People just needed to follow orders.
Captain Jellico does not have to ADAPT to his inferior officers' idiosyncrasies. It's the opposite! They have to adapt to HIM. It's not a democracy. The enterprise crew's' "needs" are irrelevant. It's starfleet and the federation's needs that are paramount.
And the federation's "need" during this time was to intimidate the ruthless cardassians during this standoff/crisis
Implicit in your argument, (and in the argument of all the Riker defenders) is the notion that the enterprise is some sort of democracy, or pirate ship, where the captain basically serves at the pleasure or his crew
@@stevencoardvenice Picard is the captain of the Federation flagship. He and his crew are simply put the best the Federation have to offer. Full stop.
And no - at a moments notice the officers do not have to adapt to all of what Jellico wants. HE has to adapt as well. Otherwise - as it actually happens - he causes fractures among the crew and exposes himself as a bad captain.
Implicit in YOUR argument is the idea that the captain does not have to adapt to the needs and strengths of his or her crew. This leads to at best a mass exodus of personnel or at worst outright mutiny - which we would later learn Riker has first hand experience of. Riker has been a part of that slavish dedication to rank. Sorry, in the real word leaders need to EARN not only respect but their authority. Any who dont should fully expect to have it questioned by anyone with a backbone.
Jellico was a presumptuous, arrogant tyrant and the only reason, the ONLY reason he came out of that mission without suffering complete disgrace is because Will Riker - the only man with the skills to pull off his plan - CHOSE to do so of his own accord.
I cant think of anything more damning to an officer than having your butt saved by a man you lacked the skills to properly command.
After Jellico leaves the Enterprise, Riker is finally able to relax some. Suddenly over the comms….”Picard to Riker, where the hell are my fish?!?” Lol
1:30
Fans: "You enjoyed that."
Riker: "You're damned right!"
Jellico gets a bad rap. He's given a couple days to turn a research and exploration vessel into a war ship and gets nothing but push back from Riker. If he has failed in any way, it's his demand for obedience without explaining why everything is changing.
That's a huge failure though. And Riker was taking the hit for everyone's pushback and stress and confusion, not just his own. If you want people to follow you into a battle earning their faith in you is pretty major.
@@junbh2 jellico stated to everyone that he needs to get the enterprise battle ready and he doesn't have time for everyone to like him. In the end he proved his worth because he forced the cardassians into retreating and letting picard go. Riker just didn't want to accept that the federation with all its lofty ideals keeps starfleet as a military unit rather than for research. It shattered the paradise that picard had created aboard the enterprise.
Nearly every senior member of that ship became a captain, it was because the environment wasn't meant to be a warship. If Riker had followed orders from Jellico, Picard would've been killed.
because he was a bad officeer
@@shahidulkhan9566 but all his change was making th enterpris a weaker ship
THERE ARE FOUR LIGHTS!!!
I used to dislike Jellico when I saw this growing up but now years later I see what he was up against and think he was exactly what was needed. This was a military situation with the possibility of war and the Enterprise had to be ready. In war situations sometimes unpleasant decisions have to be made. Jellico was definitely a war commander who spent enough time with the Cardassians to know how to handle them.
He still deserves the dislike. He is a toxic leader. Some of his ideas are good its the method is the issue
He also didn't want to be liked... it wasn't his crew
@@paulrasmussen8953 Nonsense. He performed his duty perfectly and the results are very clear.
When Jellico decided to (1) disregard ranks and (2) tell Riker what he didn't like about him, he effectively invited Riker to return the favor.
Lesson to be learned here, folks ... Don't ask somebody to critique you if you don't want to hear what they're going to say.
Jellico wanted to decrease tension between them so he let Riker critique him as he likely knew what Riker thought of him already plus he's likely heard it before from other officers.
@General Bismarck And were it not for the Enterprise-D ALONE, with WILLIAM RIKER as captain, Earth would’ve fallen to the Borg
@General Bismarck
LOL. That's funny, because I seem to recall the Klingons getting their butts kicked by the Dominion just as badly as the Federation did.
After the Cardassians joined the Dominion, the Jem'Hadar fleet drove out all of the Klingon forces occupying Cardassian territory, and Chancellor Gowron declared that he was going to fortify the Klingon Empire and prepare for a fight to the death. Those aren't the words of a man who's on the winning side of a war.
I also remember General Martok lamenting that "War is much more fun when you are winning," and that the defeats they had been suffering made his wounds ache.
And I'm pretty sure that the only reason the Romulans didn't suffer the same fate is because they chose to sell out the Alpha Quadrant and sign a non-aggression treaty with the Dominion rather than join the fight.
If it was really being "nice and polite" and lacking a militaristic mindset that caused the Federation to lose so badly to the Dominion, then how come the Klingons didn't do any better?
@@girlgarde And he knew they were probably had a point and chose to disregard that point anyway either because he wasn't willing to change or behaved that way on purpose.
@@girlgardeYes. This exactly.
Jellico made a really bad first impression when he took command. First they are in a tense geopolitical situation and he is wasting his time and resources rearranging the shift rotation disrupting the pace and flow of the efficient operation his command. Luckily he did not have to test those changes he made in combat. Riker also did not make the beat first impression by not implementing those changes, but he was advocating for the crew at this point and Jellico failed to listen to the officer that was second in command of the operation of the ship. In this scene they both admitted that they were a very bad fit together as a command staff. Which given Jellico's style and persoanlity Data was a perfect choice for him.
In my military experience, Riker should have discussion his viewpoint privately with Jellico. If Jellico continued to disagree, then Riker should have walked out of the room and said to the crew, "This is what the captain wants...and it's a damned fine plan."
As Captain of the Enterprise, the ship that inspires the ideals of Starfleet and the Federation, Jellico is indeed *not* a good Captain. But as a military officer needing to try and control a flashpoint situation to avoid an all-out war, Jellico is perfect. The Enterprise crew themselves doesn't need him, but he is a necessary evil since, for all they rather be explorers, they have to warriors when the situation calls for it, because military is part of what is expected of Starfleet.
My gosh every actor on this show did an Oscar worthy performance I swear
Since it's TV, you mean Emmy.
Ronnie Cox is such a great actor.
Riker : You don't provide an atmosphere of trust.
This line made me think of so many things ...
When the new commanding officer orders the Engineering crew to make changes that are simply impossible to get done with the time and resources available ... It does not inspire confidence among the crew members that their new CO knows what he's doing.
When the senior staff tries to raise concerns about the captain's orders, and the captain simply refuses to hear them out ... The officers and crew will invariably wonder, "If he's not listening to us, then who ELSE is he not listening to? Is it possible that there are people out there who are trying to give the captain important information, and he's simply ignoring them?"
The captain orders changes to be made to the warp coils, the power systems, etc., that he emphasizes are vitally important, and won't listen when the staff tells him that those changes can't be made as quickly as he's insisting on ... The ship's personnel will worry that the captain is COUNTING ON the ship performing at a level that they cannot make happen, which would place everybody in danger if they really do go into combat.
When the captain consistently refuses to listen to his senior officers, then the crew will eventually stop trying to inform the captain about potential problems and issues, particularly with regard to the orders he's giving. This can create real problems when the crew doesn't bother to try to tell the captain about a potentially crucial issue with the latest order he's given.
If the crew doesn't trust the captain, they will start disregarding his orders and trying to find ways around them.
"He obviously doesn't know what he's doing. Do you really want to place your fate in his hands? I'd rather be court-martialed than dead."
If the crew believes that the captain doesn't trust them, they won't come to him when there's an issue, and the ship will be in trouble when the commanding officer is unaware of a developing problem.
"Don't you think we should report this?"
"The captain didn't listen the first ten times we tried to report a problem. What makes you think he'll listen this time?"
Being a good leader means inspiring trust. You need to convince the people under your command to trust you, and you also need to convince them that you're willing to trust them. That's what Jellico never did.
^This
In any kind of work environment, as useful as it is to have a leader making the decision, no ship (figurative and literal) can thrive without the input of its officers. The best way to ensure employee/crew resentment is to never give a modicum of respect or taking them seriously.
In the film The Wrath of Khan, when he took over Command of Interprise from Captain Spock, then Admiral Kirk made an announcement to the cadets on the ship, informing him of the need to attend an extremely urgent mission and that he needed the ship to do this in time.
He says he knows it's not fair to demand so much of them now but he needs them to grow up faster.
And they work hard and do a good job, because they know that Kirk and the others on the bridge are very experienced and that they can trust them, just as they want to trust the cadets they trained.
I understand that in the case of Jelico, it is quite different, since everyone at Interprise is a veteran at the moment, and he is concerned with avoiding a war with Kardashia.
But he acts with everyone like he's an instructor sergeant talking to recruits.
He doesn't say why he needs to make all these changes and shows disinterest in Picard's fate, which everyone on the ship loves and respects, showing little empathy, which could be used to motivate more care in fulfilling the mission.
To be honest, I recognize that starting with sending Picard on a mission like this was a real snafu from the Starfleet Command and asking Jelico to clean up the mess without causing a war is very unfair after the spilled milk.
Do they mess around and Jelico has to invent a miracle that saves the Federation from war?
What will be asked of him next?
Turn a bunch of guts into a heart using only string?
I would also be very stressed and very little open to people questioning me for everything I say to do.
But in the end, everything was resolved.
jelico was professional enough to step on his pride and ask Riker for help.
Jelico may not even be the most sympathetic person in the fleet, but he is undoubtedly a competent captain who solves problems.
I worked for a large manufacturing company implementing and running an employee suggestion program designed to get input into our manufacturing processes. The program was highly successful at all of our plants, foundries, and distribution centers except one (by successful I mean $100 million in cost savings over 4 years). In interacting with the manager of that plant, he made it know to me and to all of his employees, at the top of his voice while on the production floor, that his employees could never have an idea of any merit that he hadn't already thought of first. The workforce was not happy and no one who worked there wanted to go beyond their strict job description. His management style pretty much guaranteed that his unit was constantly under performing and he wound up getting fired.
@Darth Pancake Studios
>> But to be fair, he didn't ask the engineering crew to make impossible changes.
Actually, that's exactly what he did.
>> Data mentioned that all of what he did was technically possible within the amount of time he asked it for.
That was before Captain Jellico transferred a full third of the Engineering staff to Security.
Here's what happened :
Data said that it would be possible to improve the warp coil efficiency by 15%, like Jellico wanted, by taking the secondary distribution grid offline and realigning the warp coil. But it would require the entire Engineering crew to work around the clock for the full two days.
Jellico told them to do that.
But then, in a later scene, Geordi reveals that Jellico has transferred a third of his crew to Security.
And Jellico still expected the Engineering department to realign the warp coil within two days, even though, by Data's estimates, Jellico had now made that impossible.
Geordi's entire frustration with their new captain was that Jellico was ordering them to do a great deal of work without giving them the time and resources they needed to get that work done.
@Darth Pancake Studios About two months ago, when we were talking about this video and this episode, somebody else stated that the Engineering crew did, in fact, complete the work on time.
I haven't seen this episode in years, so I will take his word for it, and yours, that the work was finished.
The question (which I asked then and am asking now again) is, HOW?
Did the episode explain how the Engineering crew was able to complete the work within the time required?
It should not have been possible, unless you're willing to believe that Data was just flat out wrong when he calculated that it would require the entire Engineering crew to realign the warp coil, on top of all of the other work Jellico wanted them to do.
If it was possible to perform the task with only two-thirds of the staff working ... That is a pretty big margin to be off by. It's not like Data to make a mistake like that.
Did they simply say that the work was finished, and never explained how? If so, then that's just bad writing. The script made a big deal of the fact that the work was impossible to get done in the time permitted, and then they just brush it aside by saying, "Oh, they just got it done somehow, let's move on to the next plot development"? Sloppy.
If they were able to get the work done because Jellico sent them additional help from other departments or something like that, then I would argue that if Jellico was planning to do that, then he should have told the Engineering crew what he had in mind, so they could plan accordingly.
I still maintain that Jellico was asking for the impossible by giving the crew orders that, by Data's projections, could not be done with the resources given. Jellico couldn't have known that the Engineering crew would pull a miracle right out of their asses - or, more accurately, that the show's writers would.
This was an amazing episode.
I like how both of them view the other as arrogant, but Jellico starts with "Insubordinate", as if questioning his logic or decisions unequivocally makes someone arrogant. Riker says "You ARE arrogant...", which sounds to me like that's the general consensus amongst everyone, Riker is just stating it in a way that implies "I've heard this, and you live up to it".
Jellico thinks Riker is arrogant simply for not agreeing with him, Riker finds him arrogant because he'd think something as absurd as disagreeing makes someone arrogant...which is why Riker follows it up with "... and closed-minded" too.
The insubordination is when Riker did not follow his order for the four shift rotation the first time he told him in addition to Riker screaming in his face about admitting Picard was on a starfleet mission.
Riker was indeed insubordinate. Once the CO confirms the order that's the end of the convo.
Data chastises Worf and Hobson for doing alot less than Riker does in this episode.
@@bradwatkins7564 no he started it bit the department heads tild him the troubles with it amd he took it to the captain who demanded it get done
@@paulrasmussen8953 Which is why Riker should have completed the task and THEN gone back to Jellico with his concerns.
By waiting Riker wasted an entire morning which just made things worse on everyone because of the needless starting and stopping.
Riker had his orders and did not complete them because he assumed that Jellico would give him the same latitude that Picard gave him but as we see in his first meeting with Picard , Picard expects Riker to confirm to his style of leadership.
Riker blindsides Jellico with not following orders and then coming to him hours later to let him know that it has not been done.
Jellico unlike every other Captain we see does not get to pick his entire senior staff or Ex but just inherits one before being sent on a mission that changes the entire mission sop of the ship.
He's constantly being judged compared to perfect world thinking.
@bradwatkins7564 no if it is a potential danger then pause.
@@paulrasmussen8953 Except there was no danger as Riker not only got it done..but did so even after wasting an entire morning. The last second scramble was all on him.
Ronny Cox's characters were always the best in any movie or series!
Data just doesn't look right in red
He was supposed to be in red as a 2nd officer, but it clashed badly with his makeup so he wears Ops gold.
Who was the chief science officer on the Enterprise?
Trojansfan
Though originally cmdr Sulu in twok was to take command of Excelsior in 3 weeks but it was edited out when they decided to make more movies.
What a great actor David Warner was! RIP.
Jellico: Oh, and one more thing. I understand you're holding a Starfleet officer named Jean-Luc Picard.
He said that as if he just found out. I guess he forgot at the moment Gul Lemec told him they were holding Picard at the beginning of the episode.
Not at all, Lemec tried to pressure him earlier into publicly acknowledging Picard's mission was sanctioned by starfleet and as such would be an act of war. That would have given the Cardassians legal leverage to launch an attack on a federation target which is why they were in the nebula ready to strike. Jelico refused to acknowledge Picard was on a mission which is why Riker spazzed out and got relieved of duty.
This is him publicly acknowledging that Cardassians are holding a starfleet officer. He could only do this after he caught their invasion fleet and had them by the balls.
They both knew that they all knew all along.
as the prior comment said .... Jellico could not acknowledge it until he had ALL the leverage. That's all that was.
Pity Jellico didn't bring out his signature line.
"But that will leave us defenseless!"
"Not my problem. *Get it done!* "
@@DrownedInExile Gul Lemec: Or what?
Jellico: Mr. Worf, prepare to detonate…
Gul Lemec: I will agree to your terms.
I always read that as a nod to Columbo; the "now, I've got ya," comment. Walking out, all is done . . . Oh. Just one more thing.
We need the Enterprise to drive our Kardashians from the galaxy!
The way Riker rubs in that "you're welcome"...I can just feel Jellico's pride taking a hit! 😁
"THERE. ARE. FOUR. APOLOGIES."
"You're mistaken. There's five apologies!"
"But that would leave us defenseless!"
As opposed to your current situation?
"That's your problem. Get it done!"
Cardassian space must be a fecking disaster zone if a fleet of Cardassian warships is worried about getting back to base.
@@Farzlepot I always assumed they meant they would be defenseless against the Enterprise.
j.oz you shouldnt cardassians are conquerors but the aren’t particularly good as genocide. So theres still a lot of enemies capable of space travel and that wouldnt let a fleet of cardassian warships get away armed or unarmed. They would likely be destroyed before too long.
Create a positive environment and you'll have a team who'll independently work to try and help you. Create a negative one and they'll lie, avoid and do the bare minimum for you. Jellico does the latter then uses his own ego to rationalise it. Amazing how many people look up to his 'leadership' style.
Love the way Data copys Rikers body language when in the first officer role
I feel like their openness to one another they'd make a good duo
Jellicho should have held one short speech along the lines of "Ok we're headed for some serious shit. That's why I need everyone to do their best."
@Fred Miller Jr No, Jellico is a half step short of being a martinet. He is one of those captains that expects his orders to be followed without question, and those captains either get bumped up to admiral or they get killed because in Riker's painfully correct assessment, part of being a good Starfleet captain is to value the opinions of the officers under his command. Kirk did it, Picard did it, Sisko did it, Janeway did it (even though she had to learn it in the beginning), Archer did it (though he had to learn it during and shortly after the attack on Earth). Jellico obviously does not do that, and his command style clashed hard with Riker and the rest of the crew. His dressing down of Troi (as well as the changing of the duty shifts), while by the book was justified and well within his rights, they were Jellico's attempt to remake the Enterprise crew in his own image of what the flagship should be, never mind the massive successes the Enterprise had up to that point. If Jellico had been in command at the time of The Best of Both Worlds, The Enterprise would have been destroyed and Earth would have been assimilated.
@@Rendclaw the Enterprise up until that point hadn’t really faced the sort of military situation that they were encountering. They’d never engaged in proper pitched battles nor had they intended to. The majority of time they were flying round in uncharted systems facing completely and utterly inferior species or races.
@@Rendclaw
My assessment was Jelico didn't need a staff. He knew everything. A man who makes others feel small so he can feel special. Not the best choice to lead others into battle.
@@jamiengo2343 And while that's true, Jellico doesn't inspire trust in any of his subordinates. And because he refuses to even listen to their opinions, they doubt his competency. Which then leads to the problems in the episode. He either needed to get the crew to understand that they would have to trust his decisions because of how time-sensitive the situation was, or he needed to demonstrate his knowledge/compentency so that the crew had a reason to trust his decisions aside from his position.
Because he does neither, the crew spends the whole episode second-guessing and doubting his decisions even if they were objectively correct.
Basically, Jellico expected the entire crew to place their lives in his hands without a single justification as to why. And while that could work in a military that emphasizes quick reactions and obediance, the independance necessary for operating in Star Fleet exploration runs directly contrary to Jellico's style of leadership.
Gained a small amount of respect for Jellico here. Still don't like him, but frankly he was the one that was more in the right here.
Gotta love how Riker calls him arrogant, and then is arrogant himself 15 seconds later.
It's like Riker was going out of his way to prove the captain's opinion of him was correct.
Riker: "You're Welcome. "
Jellico's interpretation of Riker's remark: "Now F- Off."
I had a manager ask me for feedback about her once. I based my response on what Riker told Jellico beginning at 0:51
Needless to say, I didn't like her one bit!
If you micro-manage your officers, it smothers their growth, destroys their morale, and expresses distrust and contempt. It is very not-good to have a resentful crew.
He was not micro managing at all. He told the leaders of the ship what he expected to get done. How they got that done was not Jellico's concern and delegated to the department leads. They just had to get it done, in time, and on par to expectations. That's not at all micro managing.
Micromanagement is awful. I've had to deal with it in my current job and it just makes you terrible because you can't do or see enough to be good at anything. A downward spiral.
3:40 That cardassian knew the game was over.
Thanks to Jellico Deanna Troy wears an Uniform from now on.
And it's and a damn shame too 😡
I always wanted Jellico to say to Riker, 'If I stayed on as Captain, would take the first command Starfleet offered you?' Riker would say, 'Yes.' Then Jellico says, 'Good. I can tell the Admiral my other mission is now successful.' Riker would respond, 'What?' Jellico, 'Wil, the Admiral knew our personalities and styles would not...mix. While at the same time she wants you to move into the big chair. So she saw this as excellent opportunity to demonstrate to you that it will soon be time to move up and onward.' Meaning the antagonism between was partly genuine and partly Jellico being the kick in the ass Riker needed.
The reality of this is that they’re officers like this - and XO’s who hold their ground and tell them what they think. He is a bad captain. He may have experience in negotiating but like Riker said “You have everyone wound up so tight-there’s no joy in anything.” There’s way to approach officers to get something done, then there’s the wrong way to tell them to get something done.
Always saw Riker as the one who was the bad command officer. He couldn't get past his own opinions and let it guide his response to Jellico. In the end Jellico defeated the Cardassians and saw the return of Capt. Picard.
Jellico is a technocrat. He was brought in for his expertise with Cardassians. Despite the episode painting him as the secondary antagonist, he only did 1 thing wrong in the entire 2 parts. That was reassigning half of Engineering to Security before they finished the modifications which Data stated would take the entire department working round the clock for 2 days. Everything else he did was well within his rights and very reasonable for a military situation. They were basically preparing for a flashpoint confrontation that could have kicked off an interstellar war. He conducted himself like a competent military officer and the crew threw a tempertantrum.
But THE best thing he did for the show was to get Troi out of that catsuit.
1:30 That walking straight out showed how immature Jellico is.
You thank someone for a favor, not for fulfilling a military necessity. If Riker knew he was most likely to satisfy the mission and save lives, that was his duty. You don't get thanked for doing your duty.
@ No, it *was* a favor because he asked him, not order him.
He could’ve said no.
Love that last "You're welcome" stab at politeness
And that Riker didn't stand up. It was a calculated act of disrespect and Jellico stepped in close to loom over him to try to regain control.
Considering Jellico was trying to get out like a bat out of hell, didn't even thank Riker or wish him luck. I'd say that jab was well-earned.
Smarmy and insubordinate, but Riker had just enough leeway because Jellico had set rank aside during the conversation and hadn't restored it yet.
Jellico calls Will Riker "very willful.".... The suspension of disbelief has now been suspended.
I'd like to point out that this mission was supposedly a diplomatic one but the entire time leading up to meeting with the Cardassians Jellico spent that time preparing for battle.
It seems to me that Jellico never believed that diplomacy had any real chance of success with the Cardassians. That's why he was so focused on a military solution.
He may have been right, but it still has to be pointed out ... The problem with going into a negotiation ASSUMING that it will fail is that you will usually find a way to make that happen.
You don't negotiate with the Space Fascists
@Wicker_ That's the Roddenberry way!
@@Bobsmith-xq2prApparantly you do
@@MDE_never_dies I'm missing context
"Good. Otherwise, I'll erase your ass." 😂😂🤣🤣
As much as a prick that Jellico comes across, Riker was the bigger prick in that scene...with the smug on his face.
Jellico could have ordered Riker, but chose not to. Too many lives were at stake for an argument raised over a closed subject. Riker was the man for the job. At least they took a moment to "speak their peace".
I feel the need for self-reflection and introspection after being "recommended" this specifically titled video by RUclips....
Same here seeing is that argument basically describes my relationship with my boss currently.
Change my mind. But I think that Jellico is an excellent captain. This scene shows why the Admiral wanted him to take command of the enterprise
Jellico was the perfect captain for enterprise.
Yes. He was right all along. Riker was actually out of line in this episode. I didn't realize it until I got older
Okay, I will attempt to change your mind in a respectful manner. I ask you to look at more than the results, for a moment. Jellico used the talent and crew of the Enterprise that flourished under Picard to achieve those results. Many of those officers would transfer away from Jellico to work for someone that inspired trust and did more than just bark orders, as correct as the decisions behind those orders may be, I wouldn't work for someone like Jellico, and I can prove it by all the jobs I have left when I realized I worked for someone like him.
You're ranking him based on what he could accomplish based on leading a team cultivated and developed and inspired by Picard, and in the short time you saw him, he turned his own first officer against him, a VERY competent officer who historically has even exceeded Picard in raw ability whenever he was in command, most of the crew as well, and the senior officers.
He also overworked them and overlooked the problems caused by his decisions, like how there wasn't enough staff for a four shift rotation, and didn't want to hear what problems his decisions caused. An effective commander can continue to insist the order gets followed if it is the right call, but that feedback is invaluable and he ignored it. That's the sign of a bad commander in the long term.
If Jellico were tasked with building a staff and a crew from scratch, he would cause massive brain drain. He'd push away talented people who do not want to be ignored, mistreated, not trusted or listened to. In the long term, he would only have a crew of people willing to work in that environment, and every time I worked with a crew that was led by such a manager, they either had poor morale, a desire for revenge, no respect for their manager or his rules, or were sociopaths themselves. They were terrible to work with, and that also inspires good people to leave.
Similar to how people with any sense leave a dictatorial nation like Russia or North Korea, when human rights and personal freedoms are suspended and advice is not heeded and people are treated as cannon fodder and without respect, the smart people who can leave always do.
Loyalty is earned, so is trust, commanders like this absolutely destroy both things. You CANNOT have an effective team without these things, not for long. Jellico wasn't there for long and took advantage of assets Picard had, that he pushed away the entire time he was there. Consider also that Jellico made no decisions Picard couldn't have made. Picard could have ordered every single order that Jellico did, and the years of experience and trust and respect between the captain and crew would have made all those orders get carried out easier and more enthusiastically.
He is a toxic leader. He can get things done but only done not beyond the pale amd you will see allt of transfers coming from his ship
I like in this exchange, effectively, both characters were correct. Riker was inflexible to Jellico in some respects, for a mission that needed it - and he needed calling on that.
However, Jellico is too much of an obsessed micro manager, and indeed - doesn't inspire that trust atmosphere that a crew needs.
To their credit, Riker comes under Jellico's command effectively the rest of the episode, and Jellico takes Riker's feedback on board to become better in his remaining crew exchanges.
A great pair of lessons, from a great episode, that took me a long while to learn could apply to my life as well.
the difference between Jelico and Picard is this: Picard is at his core a diplomat and explorer, Jelico is a MILITARY man at heart he expects orders to be followed simply because they are orders and to him discipline is everything because without discipline people die.
You don't watch much Star Trek, do you?
Except good military men don't try to make everyone feel small. You need them to believe in their ability, not inability. Richard Winters comes to mind. He didn't puff himself up like Jelly does.
Riker is a far better choice. He expects competency, so doesn't ignore people like Jelly did. Ego can not replace knowing what you're doing. I liked the militarily mindset, but execution was horrible.
Damnit I love this show
Nice Burn
I think Riker is 51% in the wrong. The reason? Jellico is a Captain. Show who the better man/officer is by maintaining military bearing and discipline - for both.... That's why The captain is 49% in the wrong because he failed to lead by example.
Agreed.
Everyone seems to forget Picard’s attitude when he assumed command of the Enterprise in “encounter at farpoint”. When you are pressed for time you don’t stand on pleasantries, you give orders and expect them to be carried out. Jellico was a fine captain, he just didn’t have time to get to know the crew, so he asked of them what they are trained for.
ロニー・コックスみたいな役者さんだなと思ったら本人だったのか。
Lots of bosses and managers out there that rule by fear and mistrust and they indeed kill any joy that the job ever had. I'd venture to say that most workers and labor don't operate on money/pay alone. You have to like what you are doing. Even a little bit. I hated the character of Captain Jellico for what he stood for.
You hate him because he takes no bull crap excuses for anyone working for him
Jellico is like the space version of Charles Miner on The Office. He reminds viewers of every crappy boss they've ever had.
Jellico is the asshole manager in every job. I see it all the time.
@@attiepollard7847 His second on command was a android a living computer. People aren't computers or things. They need proper incentive to function at there peak efficiency even if they are obligated to serve you. You don't get there best if rule through fear just get the bare minimum. Sometimes that's enough but most of time it isn't especially not in the long term.
@@Not-Ap it's either you adapt to his authority or you may have to leave Starfleet. You're going to have lots of captains like that.
"Don't make this too easy."
Writers: "Ohhhhh don't worry, we won't."
Will Riker should have gotten much more respect from senior officers, most of 'em would be Borg if it wasn't for him
That's a good point.
Remember that brief encounter with an Enterprise from a Borg-infested universe in the episode "Parallels"?
I wonder how Captain Jellico and the Cairo were doing in that universe where Starfleet failed to stop the Borg from assimilating the Federation.
I'd be willing to bet that that universe's Captain Jellico would have a very different perspective on a Starfleet officer who succeeded in stopping the Borg.
Ronnie Cox...great actor.
2:30 is Data adopting the Riker pose?
Dammit, I have to go watch the whole episode now
This is why jellico is a bad captain. He isolated everyone from the beginning and pushed his authority over the mission and ended up having to crawl back to Riker with his tail between his legs. If this was Kirk or picard or sisko they would have been able to instill respect from the crew and still make the final call even if their crew didn't fully agree, at least they would trust him.
Like he said he didn't have time for people to like him. Well if they don't like AND they don't respect you then they aren't going to put their lives at risk for you. As far as they knew picard was dead so they had no reason to follow jellico except they were starfleet.....but when you can resign at any time this isn't strong enough motivation to follow your captain to was or death
Jellico also was so wrapped tight on completing his mission that he probably damaged his own health. He was all in.
Isn't it just lovely when your boss, who treats you and other like crap, comes to you for help and you hold all the cards. And you finally get to dictate the terms of whether or not you supply that help. I just loved Riker in this moment.
Isn't it lovely with an arrogant first officers wagers the future of the Federation on a personal vendetta against his boss?
@@Idazmi7 how was he wagering the future of the Federation? He did his job when asked
@@stonem0013
He threatened not to do his job for petty reasons.
@@Idazmi7 when? He simply stated his disagreement with the captain's decision, which is the duty of a first officer when he believes the captain is acting recklessly. In response, Jellico relieved him of command
@@stonem0013
At what point did Riker do anything motivated by more than pettiness here?
Can we talk about how Jellico was mature enough to first admit his thoughts and was humble enough to go to Riker for the mission. Riker turned petty at the end for the you’re welcome comment
It's not petty. It's a clever jibe that proves that Jelico only cares about results, not the team that produces them. He walks in, having screwed himself up to trying to negotiate with Riker after effectively booting him off the bridge, gets what he wants (because he actually _does understand_ people, he just doesn't care much about others), and quickly walks out the door "without so much as a 'thank you' ." Riker's jibe is a way of saying "the grass REALLY IS greener over here!" without being overtly arrogant or condescending.
I had this problem at work. Sometimes being too good at a job alienates others, and like a poster said, just because something worked doesn't necessarily mean the means to get it done were both moral and logical
It does seem to be unsustainable, Jellicos style like it was for me at work. You'd have to basically be God to be able to manage perfectly all the time with all the wisdom to match
You sound like a hall of fame sociopath
@Clippy yeah but if Picard died...
And I agree about this scene, he didn't have to be smug
@Clippy on point. thing is, picard is a diplomat, jelligo is military. the enterprise crew (and federation) was too complacent anyhow imho....as showcased by Q. even troy understood where jellico was coming from...and she was hotter in uniform anyhow lol
@@unusualbydefault Yeah! They were a little too complacent, that's a great point! There's certainly a balance between diplomacy and inflexibility though
I think Riker's behavior was the height of unprofessionalism. He should have had an official reprimand placed in his record.
Imagine if he had tried to pull that attitude under the command of Sisko or Kirk
Any good leader could have handled Riker without all that infighting.
0:54 My absolute favourite part of the two parter and one of my favourite Riker moments.
All the rank ass kissers are wrong, Riker is right. Jellico should have had enough experience to give and take with the crew at such short notice. Adaptation is the sign of a good commander correct? He was an arrogant tyrant who was lucky not to come out of that mission in complete disgrace.
Picard was the diplomat and explorer, Jellico was the solider who clearly spent plenty of time at the Cardassian border.
Both sides can be right, and both sides can be wrong, and both sides can be both right and wrong.
In the end, not only was this critical mission accomplished, but every main character became a better officer.
The Enterprise crew had become to soft, too casual, too comfortable. And while Jellico was the right fit for this particular mission, he got to see exactly why his command style wouldn't cut it with the best of the best for very long.
Reminds me of when Kurn was f ing with the whole crew just to evaluate his brother.
If I had to pick sides, I would have to say Jellico was right. His sense of urgency was absolutely correct for this particular situation, and it is surprising how many of the senior staff failed to see this.
In someways he was right the problem was... he was coming onto a ship where the plan was it to be a short term command and changing everything around him to fit his style. IT would have been fine if he was taking over the Enterprise long term and they had time to fit into his style, but he wasn't, the plan was always for Picard to come back and he knew that. Worse through was the shift changes he introduced, it was a terrible idea, while his preferred shift style might have been better long term, it introduced into the crew right before a dangerous and vital mission a great way to give a lot of them Jet Lag.
@@andyme3541
I've never served in the military myself, but I have read some opinions on this from people who are veterans or currently serving. They said that when you're preparing for an impending crisis, you should be changing from a three-shift rotation to a two-shift rotation, so that everyone works 12 hours a day instead of 8. These people argued that changing to a four-shift rotation, which actually reduces people's working hours, during an emergency makes no sense.
Basically, changing to a four-shift rotation means that every crew member now has to get 8 hours' worth of work done in 6 hours, just to maintain the same productivity they had before.
To look at it another way ... Suppose that a particular department has 120 crew members. With a three-shift rotation, there are 40 crew members working at any given time. With a four-shift rotation, the working personnel is reduced to 30.
Which essentially means that, at any given time, 30 people need to somehow do the work of 40 people, just to get the same amount of work done as before.
Changing to a four-shift rotation would only work if every department got additional personnel, but there was no indication that was happening here. Even if Jellico was reassigning personnel from the science labs that were being shut down, that still creates a shortfall because the newly reassigned personnel are being forced into an unfamiliar working environment, meaning that they won't be able to work as quickly or as well as the personnel normally working in that section.
Jellico grabs Riker by the hair and says: "You just, F#CK WITH ME!"😁