@@Uc9uE3pKsS6uQ My PERSONAL garage? A 1982 Porsche 928S 5-speed, a 1979 Lancia Beta Coupe 2000, a 1977 Citroën Mehari, a 1977 Land Rover Series III 88 soft top, a 1977 Mercedes-Benz 280SE (w116) and a 1985 Mercedes-Benz 300TD 50-speed wagon. Also some vintage Vespas and mopeds and stuff.
@@paulmisencik I have to disagree with one of the cars in this video. The Lancia Gamma. The car was a lemon due to the way the engine was put together. It literally exploded when you turned the steering wheel. It wasn't the only reason it would explode. Just think the car was designed a bit too dangerous.
I worked in a garage in Bristol UK which imported Gamma coupe's from Saudi Arabia. We converted them to manual gearboxes and rebuilt the engines (which typically had valve gear problems) and made a tidy profit from collectors. Great cars. Nice video BTW, those Peugeot 504's are fantastic.
Yes, the early Gamma coupes had an oil starvation problem to the head, caused by the power steering pump if I'm not mistaken. They sorted it after the first year or so, and I suspect almost all of them have either been updated or repaired by now. Thanks for watching!
Very interesting car. At idle mine sounds like a tractor but rev it and in turns into a turbine. Gears become irrelevant, its so smooth. Amazing high speed acceleration and superb cornering
I have never owned the 504 Coupe, but having owned the 130 I think it's one of the most overlooked motorcars of the period, for sure. It's such a wonderful driver, but also hugely problematic in the way 1970's Italian cars are famous for. The 504 is more robust and happier being used daily, I think.
In my early years I owned early 70's Fiats (124 Coupe and Spider) and also owned a mid 60s 404 .. The Peugeot was by far a better car. I would love to own a 505.
Pitty you made a little mistake about the 504, which was sold in little quantities in Brazil but made big numbers in Argentina, where it was manufactured from 1969 to 1999, from upper middle class to taxi, 1.6/1.8, 2 litre 4 and diesel too, it came as a saloon, an estate (little numbers) and a pick up. I had one myself, plus 4 505, 1 405 and a 307SW...almost a lifetime experience, always a pleasure to drive, reliable, comfortable, and inexpensive to keep up..
When i was 18 years old, i had a Bagheera in France. Now i live in Portugal and 42 years later i still got a Bagheera. ( 2nd generation) Fantastic car. Very good video and choices
We had a Lancia Beta here in Australia and really enjoyed it. My lady was caught 25 kph over the 110 speed limit here and seemed to have little idea she was going so fast. Easy to service and comfortable. Don't think it had power steering with its front wheel drive which may have made parking a bit harder. Thanks for your channel.
Thanks so much for your comment, and for watching! I JUST sold my personal Beta Coupe last month, and I love that car immensely. Castigated for a lot of unfair reasons, it is a wonderful driver. Good looking, balanced, comfortable and entertaining at any speed. Glad you enjoyed yours as much as I did mine.
I have driven many Peugeots, I am dutch, and the 504 coupe was my favourite. Has to be a manual shifter, mind you! Yet the fiat 130 makes me drool, never owned or drove one. Absolutely gorgeous....
Those big Italian coupes are very nice. They were not give the time of day in the UK. I mean I didn't even know about them. I really like that Fiat 130.
As an english reference, the 130 Coupe almost has a "Jaguar-like" quality to it. The ride and handling balance is just... SPOT ON. I always felt that Jaguar was particularly good at making luxurious cars feel nimble and balanced. The 130 feels like that too. It's comfortable over bad pavement, and then you bend it into a turn and it goes around it like a sports car. The grip and balance are just amazingly good. Thanks for watching!
Excellent choices, all of them. I will never forget my first encounter with a Lancia Gamma Coupe, in the city center of Rome, Italy 1985. That folded edge Pininfarina design stopped me in my tracks! Loved them ever since, almost imported one to NY from Greece a couple years ago. I’ll have to look you up when we get to Spain. PS - I’ll suggest one for your list: The wedgy Giugiaro designed boxer-engined Alfasud Sprint Veloce. Cheers!
Great choice! When the 2nd car shown was the Fiat 130 Coupé, I immediately thought of the Lancia Gamma Coupé, and see, you included that too! I always compare these cars but I cannot explain why. Maybe for the relation of the companies and they have a similar design language. But in reality they are not similar at all. For a start I think the 130 Coupé is the most beautiful car Fiat has ever made, but I do not like the 4-door saloon version. In contrast to the Gamma saloon, which I think is extremely beautiful too. But even under the skin, it is not only V6 vs Boxer, the Fiat has RWD whilst the Lancia has FWD. As a big rally fan I must make a slight correction on your Peugeot 504 comments. Indeed the V6 was available with the first facelift in 1974 (on many European markets only from early 1975). And it is maybe worth to note that the 504 saloon never had the V6. The V6 was only available in the 504 Coupé, the 504 Cabriolet and the 604 in versions SL (carb 136HP) and TI (injection 144HP) - Note, maybe as some buyers guide: the 504 Coupé had both engines as well but not the "SL" tag. If it is just called Coupé V6 it is carbs, the injection is the Coupé V6 TI. I believe this is because the upmarket 604 was sold with both engines at the same time, while 504 Coupé/Cabrio only had the 136HP engine at first and had it straight replaced by the 144HP TI from late 1977. However there was NO entry for the 504 Coupé in the 1974 Safari Rally! They were running the 504 saloons for many, many years and they proved to be indestructible cars on African rallies. The 1974 Safari was a nightmare for Peugeot for some reason, but the 504 saloon went on to win all 3 African rallies of the WRC in 1975: Safari with Ove Andersson, Morocco with Hannu Mikkola and Bandama (Ivory Coast) with Bernard Consten. Despite these massive successes Peugeot saw that, while their 504 was utterly reliable, they were severely down on power compared to the ever stronger opposition. Unbelievably already on the Safari 1975 the winning 170BHP 504 saloon beat two Lancia Stratos to the top step of the podium! And as the proven saloon was not available as a V6, two 504 Coupés debuted on the Safari Rally 1976 alongside an army of 504 saloons. Sadly on that occasion both coupés retired after accidents. Never mind, already on its very next WRC start, the Bandama Rally 1976, the 504 Coupé had a commanding victory. Not only that, it was a Peugeot top5 lock out, Timo Mäkinen's 504 Coupé was followed home by four 504 2litre saloons. But even though the 504 saloon filled up the next places, the European manufacturers had an ever larger interest in the African rallies with ever more powerful cars. So the biggest success for the 504 Coupé V6 surely was the Safari Rally 1978. Not only did Jean-Pierre Nicolas win, his navigator Jean-Claude Lefèbvre normally was not a navigator but a driver himself. Plus the pair had a hefty accident, damaging the radiator, having the track out of line, etc... It must have been so ironic to see the battered, strapped together with expanders and totally muddy 504 Coupé on the winners podium, followed by a works Porsche 911 with huge budget and huge, clean Martini marketing. And that Martini Porsche was still over half an hour down on the battered Peugeot. Meanwhile Mercedes entered no less than 6 works 280E, 5 of which retired and the only surviving example was over 7hrs down on the 504 Coupé! It really must have been one of the most ironic results in WRC history. Seeing the bent, strapped, muddy 504 Coupé on the ramp, you must have wondered how this car survived at all. But against big fuzz posh operations like Martini Porsche and Mercedes it was counting winning margins in hours rather than seconds! And it was not a one off, the 504 Coupé won African championships up to 1983, many rallies in South America, etc.
As a bonus if interested: The 504 Coupé technology was so sturdy and good that Peugeot's 1st groupB car was based around it. It is the Peugeot 305 V6 Sport. Everybody thinks "305 groupB, what a laugh!" Yes, the public and media laughed about Peugeot that a conservative 305 was their idea of a groupB car. Plus admittedly, the 305 was not a very interesting car at all. Sadly team director of the 504 days Gerald Allégret had to quit for health reasons and with that the "laughable" 305 groupB car was buried and so nobody ever realised what the idea behind it was. Thing is Peugeot had that massively successful Africa and marathon car in the 504 Coupé V6, plus they had Talbot as the new 1981 World Champions. With Talbot (who had groupB plans too) being extremely strong on sprint rallies, it just made sense that Peugeot's groupB car was for Africa and marathons again. So what media and public totally misunderstood (and likely some in house people as well since the project was cancelled with Allégret's departure): The 305 groupB was never meant to compete Talbot, the Lancia 037 and the likes. And seeing that throughout the groupB era cars as the Opel Ascona 400 and Toyota Celica TA64 dominated the Safari and Bandama rallies, obviously the 305 groupB did not need 4WD. So the starting point is the proven 504 Coupé V6 and we have groupB freedom. We start with a body shell completely made of aluminium, so it is much lighter. And model it around a current model that in size maybe is slightly smaller than the 504 coupé: the 305. The wheel arches are widened to allow for much more suspension travel than even the 504 had. Of course the 305 groupB is RWD with longitudinal engine, again a layout like the 504 and not like the 305 at all. But the gearbox swaps propshaft ends for a transaxle layout and better weight distribution. The engine is the same V6 as in the 504 Coupé, but for the first time with 24 valves heads, increasing power yet again. Still laughing about the 305 groupB? If you think about it the 305 is a groupB development out of the successful and sturdy 504 Coupé V6, only the body shell was changed to look like a 305 as the 504 Coupé was no longer sold from 1983.
Even more bizarre is the story of the Citroën SM sold new in the US to an Australian ex-pat, who subsequently had it converted - in the US! - to right-hand-drive, then took it back with him to Australia. Some time ago, it found its way to Britain where it is the only working RHD SM in the country. It also came up for auction earlier this year, but failed to find any takers at £48,000. Other RHD SMs exist, and they were all converted in Australia; there are 25 or so.
I have imported to Mexico the Peugeot 604, also designed by Pininfarina, perhaps it is the only one in my country. The Lancia coupé and the 504 were designed by Aldo Brovarone. 😉
Brovarone was a genus and a gentleman. He also did the Ferrari F40. Have you seen this brief video on his career? ruclips.net/video/ohE_uyKaApg/видео.html
To answer your question, you gave a great top 5 list of really good examples. I knew about 3 of them but wasn't aware of the Peugeot, which really looks a lot like the Fiat 130, and the Matra Bagheera is a complete surprise, it is a fascinating design both interior and exterior and very clean on the outside, notably absent are the ugly bumpers that plagued cars from the early 70's on that were required here in the US.
Thanks for watching! Yes, I agree about the bumpers. Some companies handled the "impact" bumpers better than others (Porsche, maybe?) and some handled them worse (MG?), but there was definitely a loss of simplicity and stylistic grace when they arrived on the scene. It is a marker point in automotive history for me, and cars will always be sort of split up in the "Pre-1974" and "Post-1974" eras. In my mind, anyway. Stay tuned for a "Version 2" of this video which will be coming out soon.
Safety bumpers were great considering 4,500-5,000lbs lumbering Giants ruled American roads well into early 90s. No expensive surprises if one slightly bumped into your car while at: booze store, grocery mart, mall,etc.
Drove a Fiat 130 sedan with automatic transmission for many miles, the later 3.2 liter variant. Fantastic, sporty and with plenty of torque. The Borg Warner auto transmission didn't like to kick down automatically and had to be coaxed down manually. The only way to obtain an automatic downshifting was to floor the accelerator. The 60 degree V6 engine was very smooth, a gem. I read over the years that its 165 hp and rather high price hurt sales because, at its price, it competed against slightly more powerful Mercedes and BMW cars, better known as luxury touring autos than Fiat. I think it would have been more successful in the marketplace if it had been badged Lancia. In any case, I found it to be a great, fun drive.
I agree. My 130 5-speed was a great, silky touring car, but it never felt FAST, really. But man, it was a lovely car to take my wife a couple of suitcases on a sporting tour of the Mediterranean coast, which I guess is pretty much what it was designed to do. Thanks for watching!
Yes, it wasn't meant to be a 0-60 mph ace but it would cruise smoothly and quietly at 100+ mph all day long. Great autostrada car that also handled very well.
Thank you, sir! Brovarone’s Gamma coupe design is just… crazy good looking. And the 5-speed 130 Coupe I owned for a while got into my blood. Maybe the best ride/handling balance I have ever experienced. It dealt with rough pavement with soft composure, yet cornered like a Porsche 928. And that interior? Oh, MAN…. I’m still in love.
Yes, and an Opel Manta! And a Mk2 Ford Escort (or maybe a V6 Granada?) And a later Alfetta GTV 2.0! I think I need to do a “part 2” version of this video...
All excellent choices. Personally I would have perhaps chosen the later Talbot-Matra Murena over the Bagheera - it's even prettier, and I believe generally a better, more resolved car. But I'm quibbling :) Great video!
I think it's the name! Hahaha! "Bagheera." C'mon! You gotta love that name. But you are of course correct, the Murena is a better car and better put together. Thanks for watching!
Loved that Paul, and owned 19 BMWs over thirty years and three of these were new. Always thought the 3 was a ‘people’s car’ in that it carried 4/5 people, had a bulletproof 4 pot engine and excellent build quality. I frequently bought, drove and sold my Beemers to avoid depreciation, plus I loved the research and buying process. Didn’t know that Peugeot made a 504 coupe? Cheers Geoff
I was fortunate to purchase a Gamma Coupe in New Zealand, brand new in 1983. I believe that it might have sat on a Hong Kong or Singapore lot for a while, but who cares. After my HPE 1600 ripper, the Gamma was smooth, glorious and handsome. Fast, quiet and so Lancia. Finally sold to an Italian mechanic from Wellington, who had a close hard look before giving it the o.k. It was more than o.k. I wish it was still in my garage on the Gold Coast, Australia.....Dang.
Aw, man. That's fantastic! What color did you choose? I always wonder, with each of these old cars I own, which color I would have chosen if I had bought one new. For example, my Beta Coupe 2000 is Rosso Corsa (bright red) and I like it fine, but I doubt I would have chosen it back in the day. I think I would have chosen the dark blue, or maybe even the brown.
Kia Ora, or Hola. 3 very durable classics: MB W123/124, Peugeot 504, Volvo P1800. Drove each back in the 80s/90s but never owned. Had 4 Lancias:62'Flaminia coupe (Pinin),77' Beta Hpe, 82' Gamma coupe , 83' Beta Hpe. I knew a guy had a Fiat 130 coupe (manual) 30 years ago. Still a small following for these cars here in New Zealand but not many good ones left.
Hi Simon! Thanks so much for watching, and I appreciate the suggestions, because I plan to make a "part II" of this video soon. Or maybe just an updated 2023 version...
You missed out the Citroen XM. Car of the year when released in 1989, it has a beautiful body, one of the most comfortable cars you will drive with the hydro-pneumatic suspension, and exceptional handling car with the computer-contolled hydractive 3 suspension. 3.0 lt V6, or 2.0lt. turbo petrol. You can pick them up for around $1500 in good condition (as I did), and they were an $80,000 car in their day.
Shane, you're so right. In fact, there are probably half a dozen super entertaining Citroëns I could have added here. What about the CX GTI? That car is a hoot, too. I am working on a version 2 of this (now three year old) video, and I appreciate you watching and commenting! Happy holidays, hermano!
Wow! Very nice informative video gentleman. The only one of my knowledge was the BMW. Loved the Matra, theLancia and the Peugeot in that order. Tks, keep up the wonderful work !
Thank you for watching, sir! And for the kind words! I am going to get back to making videos, I promise, and "Version 2" of this very video is coming soon! Stay tuned.
Great video, @paulmisencik! It's been through two owners in the US, but I have your 130 Coupe in this video and I intend to drive it regularly. It's only covered 300 km since this was filmed, and while it's now very attractive after the last owner installed new headlights and taillights, rechromed bumpers and refreshed rubber ends, did a respray in the original color and the new "Arogosto" (Lobster) velvet going in to make the inside look as good as the outside looks, I can now begin on sorting the electrics, brake hydraulics, carb, cams and fuel system that I've found it needed. Looking forward to sharing the updates as they occur.
I suspect the 130 may be the most beautiful 3-box car ever designed. Putting aside any practicalities, one of those and a Bagheera would be a reasonable crack at 'dream garage'
Mum and dad had a Peugot 504 estate when I was a kid. That got traded for the Peugot 505 estate (diesel, naturaly). The 504 had something like 300 000 km on the klock when they sold it. The 505 had about 570 000 kilometers under it's belt when they got a newer car.
504 Coupé is certainly gorgeous, but is not the rugged beast the sedan/berline was. But an excellent car nonetheless. The 130 Coupé was also a wonder, but there is a reason they are not more popular. Parts simply do not exist. I agree totally about the E21. Actually, any E21. The fours were wonderful too. The front seats were an excellent place to sit. The Gamma Coupé is a mad car. There was a degree of cooperation with Citroën on this one, with the Cx. Crazy and sublime, but I wouldn't go near one today. The Matra-Simca Bagheera is divine, but is an acquired taste. There was a later development (Murena) that may be in better condition. What an excellent list. All wonderful cars, although most (or all) are only for the brave. One more for the list? A mad one. Or two... Peugeot 405 Mi16x4. Citroën BX 16 valve.
The BX 16v is a sweet and typically rather bizarre car. I might need. to make a 2022 updated version of this is! Or rather a "Part 2." Thanks for watching!
I love this video, thanks for posting. I particularly like the Peugeot 504 - I've always loved these cars. And the Matra Bagheera is one that I had forgotten existed! Love it.
I wish I could've kept the clean garage pampered 504 Peugeot sedan I bought before moving across the country. Problem was it was a Diesel that turned out to have a cracked head. I could live with the slow poke highway speed but a mechanic told me that head problem was common on Peugeot 4 cylinder Diesels so I didn't want that back in it. I suppose I could've rigged a way to put a Chevy 4 cylinder or even an Isuzu Diesel reefer motor in it. But I was in transition with no place to keep it so I let the immaculate body amotor go to a guy for $100. It was actually a decently built and handsome little car except for some little engineering flaw that saw too many cracked heads on their 4 cylinder diesel. I once heard a judge tell a girl in his courtroom that just because she owned a Fiat wasn't proof that it wasn't running. I suppose you could apply that to Peugeot's diesel.
Hah! I saw one on the beach in Javea, Spain about three years ago, and haven't seen one since. They are rare birds! Thanks for watching, and look for Version 2 of this video coming out soon.
Great video!, My favorite in the list is the BMW, simply because is a panzer, you can drive it for a trillion miles... but the Matra is the most exotic, maybe the most interesting, for someone looking for a "black sheep" classic. The 504 very interesting and unseen (but all 504 rust like hell...), almost non-existent outside France I think. Cheers!
That's the beauty of living in dry, arid Spain. Rust is not as much of an issue here. You still need to be careful, but there are plenty of clean examples...
The Matra Baghera was an amazing , civilized bad-ass sport car. Find me one in Spain or in the Moon and I'l l buy it. The same goes for the 504 Coupe ou the Cabriolet. Older cars are easy to fix -- on the other hand, modern cars are a set of micro-chips and computers, controlling everything. They require a Scientist, not a good Mechanic. None of this fascinating electronic toys will survive a 5 years rest in a barn or garage. Unfortunately, I underwent that experience. Thank you and congratulations for a fabulous Video. A.
You're so right. People get SO WORRIED about reliability with older cars. My wife is a good example. She drives only new cars, and if her 2022 Volvo starts throwing "propulsion fault" warnings on the dashboard, as it did recently, what the hell am I going to do about it? Nothing. Book an appointment at the dealer. But I drive exclusively classic cars, and if they are in good shape they are perfectly dependable. And if they go wrong, I can actually sort them, often on the roadside. But that's pretty rare! I drive my old cars like, well... like CARS. I use them every day. I take my kids to school in them, commute to work in them, and if I need to go across country tomorrow? I'd take my old Lancia without thinking too much about it. I trust old cars if they are in good shape, and more often than not they repay that trust. Thanks so much for the kind words, and thanks for watching. I'm going to get back into making these videos in 2023, so keep an eye out.
The Peugeot 504 and 505 are incredible cars.. I bought a 505gti wagon in Australia $600,, detailed it spend $750 on it and now its a $20,000 classic.. the same series had the 405 Mi16 and the 205GTi who jeremy clarkson said car whip a super car on a tight track. i love driving it over my camaro.
The 505 GTI and 505 Turbo are cars I keep my eyes open for around here, because I REALLY WANT ONE. Pininfarina styling which has aged astonishingly well, and they are reliable and dynamic cars. The GTI wagon is a fantastic car to own. Good for you, thanks for watching, and stay tuned for a "Version 2" of this video coming out soon.
The 604 is so cool I can't stand it. That is such a handsome, stately, beautifully proportioned Pininfarina design. I am entirely smitten with the 604. I am always actively looking for a 505 GTI, or maybe a really nice 505 Estate, because the 505 is another design I really love. But the 604 has more... gravitas. Thanks so much for watching and commenting.
@@paulmisencik I agree, the 604 is a classy car. The ride, handling and comfort also puts it into a special category. But when you start with a 504 platform you can't really go wrong.
Really very interesting. I like the “blacksheep”. The 504 Coupe would be my pick. I lived and worked in Johannesburg 1977-81. One of our execs ran our car biz. He frequently had gift cars from OEM’s hoping we might assemble them in SA. The first was a first year Citroen CX Prestige which knocked my socks off. Then a Bagheera. Had no idea Matra made cars. Loved the show. Have my own unmolested Euro Mercedes: 1975 W116 350SE and a 1992 C124 300CE-24 Sportline with 5-speed Getrag. Never any issues with parts. Love them.
Fascinating stuff. I always forget that South Africa is a very popular place for OEM's to develop local production. I love your Benzes. I own a 1977 280SE (w116) and absolutely adore it. And I have a 1984 300TD Estate (w113) which I am also fond of, but the w116 has always been my favorite older Mercedes-Benz model. I'm not even sure why. There is something almost impossibly elegant and substantial about the lines. Your 300CE 5-speed is also right up my alley. I owned an e320 Cabriolet in the states and became pretty convinced that the w124 was last of the truly over engineered, overbuilt Mercedes-Benz models. My son is 15, and I want to start building him a car, so we can do it together as a project and have it ready for him when he gets his license at age 18. I REALLY want to do a 300CE 5-speed, and there is a 2-valve car close to me that's the right price. But he seems unimpressed. Says he wants a Nissan 350Z, and whenever he says that it's very difficult for me not to roll my eyes. Kids. What're you gonna do? Thanks so much for the lovely comment, and enjoy your cars.
@@paulmisencik Thank you for your note. Yes, SA built lots of cars from CKD’s. To avoid import duties, they had to be 60% local content by weight. Tires, glass, etc. The Mercedes facility was the only one outside Germany allowed to build engines. I had a locally-built Alfa Romeo 1600 GTJ, a Citroen DS Pallas 5-speed (on the tree!). The Cit was marvelous. I have Catholic car taste. Agree on the 116. I was in college in 1972 and saw the first pictures of them in Road & Track. They looked like space ships compared to the family W108. Bought a ratty used 911T at the same time my dad bought a 1973 450SE. The handling astounded me. Vowed to have one someday. You mention your son. I feel like I need to pare my fleet down at this point. Oddly enough my 31-year old son and his 27-year old sister think I should keep the 350SE and sell the C124 and 6-speed SLK320. They and their friends think the 116 is so classy.
This is cool - I would love to own one of these - they are cars from my childhood and I am familiar with all but one of them (I did not know Matra Bagheera - whoa!) .. You have given me something to think about because, given my limited pocketbook for stuff like classic cars, this makes me feel like it is more attainable (I always go to stuff that costs 6 figures -haha). Thanks.. POST MORE VIDEOS!!!!
That Fiat 130, is and has been overlooked all this time,,remember seeing one in Paris in april 1973,,been 504 is close…85 and my dream car days are over…be still my heart..
The Fiat 130 coupe is truly a desirable car. A British journalist changed the 3 speed auto with a more modern overdrive 4 speed auto and he claimed that it transformed it into an even more comfortable and refined GT. He chose to do the auto rather than a manual as it was more in character with the rest of the car.
Very cool video Paul! Love those cars and most, never heard of. The 504 reminded me of some of the well to families I knew had the peugeot 505 wagon..diesel engine I believe. Anyway, I lived in the UK/London for nearly 4 yrs and loved seeing cars I never even heard of or seen back in the US. Even "Ford's" never sold in the US market. However, I was stationed in Tokyo all through the 1980's and fell in love with Japanese cars! I have in my drive way now here in FLA, a 1993 Nissan Gloria GT and have won 2 car shows with it pre Covid. Bought it at auction 5+ yrs ago with only 18K original miles...now has 55K on her, daily driver. Love it!! Cheers for the video, keep'em coming!
You're so right! The JDM craze has brought attention again to some really cool and quirky old Japanese cars. Everyone wants a 510 or an early Celica, but I'd love a Cressida wagon or something! Thanks for watching, and look for Version 2 of this video coming out soon.
@@paulmisencik The JDM's are truly great cars. When I lived there my first car was a 1975 Mitsubishi GSR GTO. It was in PERFECT condition. I bought for $500.00 US in 1983. That car had a 1900cc duel side draft Solex carbs, 5-Speed, positraction, with the side mirrors up over the from wheel wells(which totally works because you only need to shift your eyes, not move your head) loved it!! The Japanese cars there ALL have(had) names, not "numbers" - used for export cars. The 510 was named the "Bluebird". I'm sure you know the Z cars = "Fairlady", and so on with the Silvia, Laurel, Sunny, Cedric, Gloria, President etc., to name just some Nissan cars. The Cressida was is a great car!! Plus, because Japanese take/took such good care of their cars, the cars 25+ years later are in really good shape! The "road taxes" there, at leat when i was there were such that a 4 years old car 's road tax were higher than a new car, so people got new cars every 4 years. Created a strong economy and a GREAT resale market! Ok, I'll be looking for Version 2! Tell us something about the Lotus', Renault's and the Cosworth's if you can! Cheers!
TOTALLY agree. A good e21 is a good car, and if you're into tweaking and tuning and changing things to your taste (as I am) it's one of the best bases for building something uniquely yours. Thanks so much for watching! Version 2 of this video is coming out soon...
The Lancia Gamma coupè is the most beautiful front-wheel drive I've ever driven, low center of gravity, boxer, incredible road holding, braking and the impression of always having it in your hands. Shame about the quality...
I owned a gamma berlina, which I actually prefer over the coupé in styling, quirkiness and details, for 8 years and 200.000km. While the coupé is good in all the points you mention, the berlina is even better. Fabulous car and today even more rare than a coupé. In all those 8 years I never encountered another one 'in the wild'.
The Fiat 130 coupe is truly a beautiful car, loved getting them in wehn I was in the trade, a proper gt car, preferred the manual though. The 504 coupe was a pretty good car also, more useable than the Gamma, which was a ‘little precious’ with not enough engine cooling…forget the German car, they are so bloody boring and NOT as rust free as they’re made out to be, like 3/4 panels and where they meet the sills, electrics that get wet especially fuse boxes
Agreed on all counts, although I'm more of a fan of the six-cylinder e21 than I think you are. In stock form there isn't enough roll stiffness, but you can set up a 320/6 to a be a proper vintage screamer without too much effort or money. But you're SO RIGHT on the rust issue. I own a 1977 Lancia Beta Coupe, and everyone (particularly the English immigrants here in Spain) always quip: "Hah! Hasn't rusted to dust yet?" My car is dry and rust free, and the later Betas are no more prone to rust than, say... a Toyota Celica or BMW 320i or Ford Capri from the same year, none of which are as infamous for rust as the Beta seems to be.
@@paulmisencik the politics in uk is very much anti anybody but the English The number of folk who thought Ford and Vauxhall were British were/are staggering…I trained as a Fiat/Lancia (then Alfa) auto electrician so know they were as good or better than the competition…as for the BMW, loved the 2002 but three and five series were a nightmare
The Fiat 130 was the car that inspired RR to make the Camargue, the most expensive car in the world at it's time. Tha Lancia Beta Coupe VX is also a good choice.
07:38 you might want to mention this cars have a steeringpump driven by the cambelt (yes, thats right) and when steering fulllock the belt jumps and the engine gets shredded to bits. So if buying a gamma, DO NOT STEER FULL LOCK
Some interesting choices. I like the full background information, including reliability - I had a '74 Lancia Beta Coupe - couldn't keep the thing running, but what a great driving machine.
Thank you for watching and for the kind words! I daily drive a 1979 Beta Coupe right now, and have done for three years. It has been amazingly reliable, and even has factory air conditioning, which is rare and wonderful. Sometimes old cars need sorting, but in my experience once they are sorted, assuming they are taken care of and treated with at least a modicum of respect, they will do you well!
Dude, you have NO IDEA how much we resemble each other! My wife says you are my doppelganger. I even wear a hat like that (because I have nothing underneath). I could not watch this whole video; I could not stare "myself in the eyes". You must be 45-52, that is when I looked the most like you. I am 61 now. I am still stunned. My brother does not look as much like me.😵💫
Matra-Simca Bagheera MkI my Cousin own one in the 80's. And for a 8 year ild at the time. It became my dream car. But... with a all new mechanic!!! Congrat's for the Video. Just the Lancia isn't my scene.
Often Lancia cars are so idiosyncratic that it takes a while before you make up your mind as to whether you think them beautiful or ugly. The Gamma coupe, however, is one of the most beautiful cars I've ever seen in the flesh, so to speak!
One year out of university I had a chance to buy a 323 coupe for $3k. I lived near an army base and a guy who had come back from Germany traded it in at a used car lot for a pickup. The guy who owned the lot had no idea what he had. I had the money to buy it but not to fix it, and no place to store it. One of the big regrets of my life.
I hear you. I think all of us car guys look back on similar missed opportunities. The good news for you is that 323's are still REASONABLY affordable. But I'm telling you man, pick up a 320/6 for half the money and you can tune it and tweak it to make more power than a stock 323 with relatively little effort, and with a punchier hit of midrange torque to boot. The e21 is known for a sneaky lift-throttle oversteer condition, but other than that it's a fantastic chassis to modify to your liking. (Besides, snap oversteer keeps us all on our toes.)
I’m loving the Peugeot 504, and thought I knew my Fiats well enough, but you said 130, I heard 131.. and thought, nice enough car but why is this one the list? Then you showed it to me. I want one.
What is going on with this video? I made it two and a half years ago, and three weeks ago it had 4000 views. Now I am getting comments every five hours and the views have more than doubled. Was it posted somewhere or something? PS. I LOVE pretty much all old Saabs, and should have included at least one of them. Early 900's are getting expensive, but the 9000 is a very good choice. And so is the Taunus. Or maybe the 6-cylinder Granada?
All good choices, except... maybe the 166?! Hahaha! I have never been too hot on the 166 for some reason. But the Busso drivetrain cures a lot of ills.
Good to see the 130 coupe getting some love - there’s currently a beautiful one for sale on eBay, if anyone’s in the market for one………although personally, I’d go for the Lancia Gamma coupe myself - in my view quite possibly the most beautiful 70s coupe (although the Jaguar XJC and XJS are also favourites…….)
I hear that. I loved my 130 coupe, but Fiat does such a lousy job of supporting their classic cars, certain things can be witheringly expensive to put right when they go bad. My rear glass was delaminating. Not a huge deal, but it bothered me. Not available. Nowhere. No one has the rear glass for a 130 coupe anymore. I ended up having to have it custom made by Pilkington in England for something like 1500€ plus tax and delivery. And it took eight months. (But they did a magnificent job, even replicating the original light green tint, and incorporating the exact original style defrosting wires...) I think if it were my money and I had to buy one tomorrow, it would be the Gamma. Thanks so much for watching, and stay tuned for Version 2 of this vehicle, coming soon.
@@agskytter8977 True, but if you live in the rust belt you hear everything rust. Everything from the 1970's, that is, with the possible exception of a late 1970's Porsche 911 or 928. But everything else from the 1970's rusts. Toyota Celicas rust. Ford Capris rust. MGB's rust. Mk.1 VW Sciroccos rust. Ford pickup trucks rust. BMW Bavarias rust. Jaguars rust. Opel Mantas rust. Jeep Wagoneers rust. 1970's cars are rust worries, and in the rust belt everything else is also. In my personal experience? After decades of owning and driving and restoring Alta Romeo GTV's and Fiat 130's and Lancia Betas and Fulvias and Spiders from both Alfa and Fiat, I have not found them to be substantially better or worse in this regard than anything else made in the period. And yet the Italian cars are always saddled with the boat anchor that they are "unreliable and rusty." In my personal experiences both of those scarlet letters they have been forced to wear are a little unfair. If they are good, and you take care of them, they stay good. By and large.
Me too, and it's a better car. My ONLY problem with the Murena, and the reason I passed it over for the Bagheera, is the styling. I find the Murena kinda... mild and derivative looking. There is something about the way the Bagheera looks that does it for me. But you're right, the Murena is a great choice too, and a demonstrably better car.
So funny you mention this, because I was sorta halfway thinking about making an updated version of this video, or a "Version 2," four years on or whatever, and the first car that came to my mind was the Lancia 2000 Coupé! Such an underrated gem. Thanks for watching!
So, 130 Coupe and Gamma Coupe. Throw in an Alfasud Sprint and you have the holy trinity of small to medium coupes. If you had a GTV6 and a FIAT Dino you've pretty much got the lot.
I was LABORING over whether or not to include the Sprint. I keep looking at them here, because I loved my old Mk 1 Scirocco, and the Sprint Veloce is proof that even Guigiaro could get lazy and sell the same design to two companies. Hahaha! Love me some Sprints! Thanks for watching!
You're absolutely right. The real suspensions were a bit tricky in lift-throttle situations all the way through the e30 days. You're absolutely right. Thanks for watching!
I was tempted by a Gamma Coupe and a Bagheera but bought an Alfetta GTV in 1984. The 504 is a nice car but I prefer the 505 with the V6 (a friend had one). I recognized the 130 as soon as I saw it, a classic design. The 3 series beemer was so common in the UK they were known as the BMW Mondeo. I had a nice E92 335i coupe.
Hahaha! BMW Mondeo. I love that. I owned an Alfetta GTV also. Mine was a 1982, I think. Maybe I am a Giugiaro fanboy, but to me the Alfetta GTV is one of the best looking cars of that era. Dead sexy. And totally agreed on the 505! Gorgeous Pininfarina design and unusual to see these days. I keep my eyes open for a good 505 Turbo with a manual, but Is even love a good 505 GTI. They are fantastic cars. Thanks for watching!
@David Peters The e21 3 series was long gone before Mondeo appeared on the scene. First Mondeo was 1992. Or Is your comment just about 3 series in general being as common as a Mondeo ? Which was true… Helped purely by fleet sales and personal leases. It was cheap to get into a BMW in the 90s and 2000s on a lease. Still is I guess.
I had a 323 for a racing course. It would not go through corners if you would manhandle it through. When the engine seized I used my road car in the day a Alfa Romeo 75 2L TS on the track. A beautifully balanced car way, way, and yes, way better car. If you look for somethings special that is the car to have... The V6 is not as well balanced but for BHP lovers a good alternative.
I couldn't have put it better. I had an Alfa 75 TS for three years from new and covered 90,000 miles in it. I had the pleasure of driving it round Silverstone circuit in 1991, and I drove the V6 the same day. I've always found the 3 series BMW rather wooden to drive by comparison with the Alfa.
Website? I might like to look into importing?
Yep. It's in the video. It's in the description. But now it's also here: www.autologymotors.com
@@paulmisencik what you have in garage ?
@@Uc9uE3pKsS6uQ My PERSONAL garage? A 1982 Porsche 928S 5-speed, a 1979 Lancia Beta Coupe 2000, a 1977 Citroën Mehari, a 1977 Land Rover Series III 88 soft top, a 1977 Mercedes-Benz 280SE (w116) and a 1985 Mercedes-Benz 300TD 50-speed wagon. Also some vintage Vespas and mopeds and stuff.
@@paulmisencik where you park these babes ?
I have few cars also, and I have park problems.
Thanks
@@paulmisencik
I have to disagree with one of the cars in this video.
The Lancia Gamma.
The car was a lemon due to the way the engine was put together.
It literally exploded when you turned the steering wheel.
It wasn't the only reason it would explode.
Just think the car was designed a bit too dangerous.
130, 504 & Gamma coupe all shot from the same barrel. All gorgeous, all great.
I worked in a garage in Bristol UK which imported Gamma coupe's from Saudi Arabia. We converted them to manual gearboxes and rebuilt the engines (which typically had valve gear problems) and made a tidy profit from collectors. Great cars. Nice video BTW, those Peugeot 504's are fantastic.
Yes, the early Gamma coupes had an oil starvation problem to the head, caused by the power steering pump if I'm not mistaken. They sorted it after the first year or so, and I suspect almost all of them have either been updated or repaired by now. Thanks for watching!
I have bought a Lancia Gamma Coupé 1982, just one month ago, my big love 😍
You're my hero. Enjoy it!
@@paulmisencik thank you so much 😊
Very interesting car. At idle mine sounds like a tractor but rev it and in turns into a turbine. Gears become irrelevant, its so smooth. Amazing high speed acceleration and superb cornering
Back in 1979, I recall my sister dating a guy who had a Fiat 130 Coupe - a lovely thundercloud metallic one. And I have never seen any since.
That guy was a keeper!
I can't make up my mind between the 504 Coupé or the 130 Coupé.
Pininfarina sure designs works of art.
I have never owned the 504 Coupe, but having owned the 130 I think it's one of the most overlooked motorcars of the period, for sure. It's such a wonderful driver, but also hugely problematic in the way 1970's Italian cars are famous for. The 504 is more robust and happier being used daily, I think.
I'm with you there - both are magnificent
In my early years I owned early 70's Fiats (124 Coupe and Spider) and also owned a mid 60s 404 .. The Peugeot was by far a better car. I would love to own a 505.
@@paulmisencik Agreed. I've had 2 Fiats and tho' I liked the cars,
they were not the most reliable to get you where you want to go.
504 Coupe for me.
@@paulmisencik yes, certainly the 4cil version. The PRV V6 is a bit meh.
Pitty you made a little mistake about the 504, which was sold in little quantities in Brazil but made big numbers in Argentina, where it was manufactured from 1969 to 1999, from upper middle class to taxi, 1.6/1.8, 2 litre 4 and diesel too, it came as a saloon, an estate (little numbers) and a pick up. I had one myself, plus 4 505, 1 405 and a 307SW...almost a lifetime experience, always a pleasure to drive, reliable, comfortable, and inexpensive to keep up..
When i was 18 years old, i had a Bagheera in France.
Now i live in Portugal and 42 years later i still got a Bagheera. ( 2nd generation)
Fantastic car.
Very good video and choices
You are my hero. Thank you for watching!
We had a Lancia Beta here in Australia and really enjoyed it. My lady was caught 25 kph over the 110 speed limit here and seemed to have little idea she was going so fast. Easy to service and comfortable. Don't think it had power steering with its front wheel drive which may have made parking a bit harder. Thanks for your channel.
Thanks so much for your comment, and for watching! I JUST sold my personal Beta Coupe last month, and I love that car immensely. Castigated for a lot of unfair reasons, it is a wonderful driver. Good looking, balanced, comfortable and entertaining at any speed. Glad you enjoyed yours as much as I did mine.
I have driven many Peugeots, I am dutch, and the 504 coupe was my favourite. Has to be a manual shifter, mind you! Yet the fiat 130 makes me drool, never owned or drove one. Absolutely gorgeous....
Those big Italian coupes are very nice. They were not give the time of day in the UK. I mean I didn't even know about them. I really like that Fiat 130.
As an english reference, the 130 Coupe almost has a "Jaguar-like" quality to it. The ride and handling balance is just... SPOT ON. I always felt that Jaguar was particularly good at making luxurious cars feel nimble and balanced. The 130 feels like that too. It's comfortable over bad pavement, and then you bend it into a turn and it goes around it like a sports car. The grip and balance are just amazingly good. Thanks for watching!
Because they started rusting on the way here
The FIAT 130 looks absolutely stunning♥️
Agreed. Itr's such a stately, handsome car, and astoundingly good to drive. Thanks for watching!
Excellent choices, all of them. I will never forget my first encounter with a Lancia Gamma Coupe, in the city center of Rome, Italy 1985. That folded edge Pininfarina design stopped me in my tracks! Loved them ever since, almost imported one to NY from Greece a couple years ago. I’ll have to look you up when we get to Spain. PS - I’ll suggest one for your list: The wedgy Giugiaro designed boxer-engined Alfasud Sprint Veloce. Cheers!
Ooof. I love the Alfa Sprint! Great call! It’ll be in episode 2. Lol
I would love the lancia.
Me too. It’s a Really underrated and incredibly stylish bit of kit...
Enzo Ferrari personally owned Peugeot 504 coupe.
The 130 Coupe is gorgeous, it’s my all time favourite classic car
I was always torn between that and the Fiat Dino. The Dino coupe is a stunner.
@@hughwalker5628 yes it definitely is
The limited 130 sedan in the same style is even better looking. There was also a shooting brake which is quite lovely
@@rovervitesse1985 a limited version?
@@GForceVRX yes the Fiat 130 opera. It's the rare four door version
Great choice!
When the 2nd car shown was the Fiat 130 Coupé, I immediately thought of the Lancia Gamma Coupé, and see, you included that too! I always compare these cars but I cannot explain why. Maybe for the relation of the companies and they have a similar design language. But in reality they are not similar at all. For a start I think the 130 Coupé is the most beautiful car Fiat has ever made, but I do not like the 4-door saloon version. In contrast to the Gamma saloon, which I think is extremely beautiful too. But even under the skin, it is not only V6 vs Boxer, the Fiat has RWD whilst the Lancia has FWD.
As a big rally fan I must make a slight correction on your Peugeot 504 comments.
Indeed the V6 was available with the first facelift in 1974 (on many European markets only from early 1975). And it is maybe worth to note that the 504 saloon never had the V6. The V6 was only available in the 504 Coupé, the 504 Cabriolet and the 604 in versions SL (carb 136HP) and TI (injection 144HP)
- Note, maybe as some buyers guide: the 504 Coupé had both engines as well but not the "SL" tag. If it is just called Coupé V6 it is carbs, the injection is the Coupé V6 TI. I believe this is because the upmarket 604 was sold with both engines at the same time, while 504 Coupé/Cabrio only had the 136HP engine at first and had it straight replaced by the 144HP TI from late 1977.
However there was NO entry for the 504 Coupé in the 1974 Safari Rally!
They were running the 504 saloons for many, many years and they proved to be indestructible cars on African rallies. The 1974 Safari was a nightmare for Peugeot for some reason, but the 504 saloon went on to win all 3 African rallies of the WRC in 1975: Safari with Ove Andersson, Morocco with Hannu Mikkola and Bandama (Ivory Coast) with Bernard Consten.
Despite these massive successes Peugeot saw that, while their 504 was utterly reliable, they were severely down on power compared to the ever stronger opposition. Unbelievably already on the Safari 1975 the winning 170BHP 504 saloon beat two Lancia Stratos to the top step of the podium!
And as the proven saloon was not available as a V6, two 504 Coupés debuted on the Safari Rally 1976 alongside an army of 504 saloons. Sadly on that occasion both coupés retired after accidents. Never mind, already on its very next WRC start, the Bandama Rally 1976, the 504 Coupé had a commanding victory. Not only that, it was a Peugeot top5 lock out, Timo Mäkinen's 504 Coupé was followed home by four 504 2litre saloons. But even though the 504 saloon filled up the next places, the European manufacturers had an ever larger interest in the African rallies with ever more powerful cars.
So the biggest success for the 504 Coupé V6 surely was the Safari Rally 1978. Not only did Jean-Pierre Nicolas win, his navigator Jean-Claude Lefèbvre normally was not a navigator but a driver himself. Plus the pair had a hefty accident, damaging the radiator, having the track out of line, etc... It must have been so ironic to see the battered, strapped together with expanders and totally muddy 504 Coupé on the winners podium, followed by a works Porsche 911 with huge budget and huge, clean Martini marketing. And that Martini Porsche was still over half an hour down on the battered Peugeot. Meanwhile Mercedes entered no less than 6 works 280E, 5 of which retired and the only surviving example was over 7hrs down on the 504 Coupé!
It really must have been one of the most ironic results in WRC history. Seeing the bent, strapped, muddy 504 Coupé on the ramp, you must have wondered how this car survived at all. But against big fuzz posh operations like Martini Porsche and Mercedes it was counting winning margins in hours rather than seconds! And it was not a one off, the 504 Coupé won African championships up to 1983, many rallies in South America, etc.
As a bonus if interested: The 504 Coupé technology was so sturdy and good that Peugeot's 1st groupB car was based around it.
It is the Peugeot 305 V6 Sport.
Everybody thinks "305 groupB, what a laugh!" Yes, the public and media laughed about Peugeot that a conservative 305 was their idea of a groupB car. Plus admittedly, the 305 was not a very interesting car at all.
Sadly team director of the 504 days Gerald Allégret had to quit for health reasons and with that the "laughable" 305 groupB car was buried and so nobody ever realised what the idea behind it was.
Thing is Peugeot had that massively successful Africa and marathon car in the 504 Coupé V6, plus they had Talbot as the new 1981 World Champions. With Talbot (who had groupB plans too) being extremely strong on sprint rallies, it just made sense that Peugeot's groupB car was for Africa and marathons again.
So what media and public totally misunderstood (and likely some in house people as well since the project was cancelled with Allégret's departure): The 305 groupB was never meant to compete Talbot, the Lancia 037 and the likes. And seeing that throughout the groupB era cars as the Opel Ascona 400 and Toyota Celica TA64 dominated the Safari and Bandama rallies, obviously the 305 groupB did not need 4WD.
So the starting point is the proven 504 Coupé V6 and we have groupB freedom. We start with a body shell completely made of aluminium, so it is much lighter. And model it around a current model that in size maybe is slightly smaller than the 504 coupé: the 305. The wheel arches are widened to allow for much more suspension travel than even the 504 had. Of course the 305 groupB is RWD with longitudinal engine, again a layout like the 504 and not like the 305 at all. But the gearbox swaps propshaft ends for a transaxle layout and better weight distribution. The engine is the same V6 as in the 504 Coupé, but for the first time with 24 valves heads, increasing power yet again.
Still laughing about the 305 groupB?
If you think about it the 305 is a groupB development out of the successful and sturdy 504 Coupé V6, only the body shell was changed to look like a 305 as the 504 Coupé was no longer sold from 1983.
You got me with first strike! Damn that green 504 Coupe' What a piece of Art.
Love the Fiat. I chose to buy a Citroen SM when I had the choice. Both were £4,000 at the time.
The SM is a true car junkie’s car! No one sane buys an SM, and you are exactly my kinda crazy. Thanks for watching!
@@paulmisencik Your'e welcome. Only found your channel today, Gonna subscribe.
Even more bizarre is the story of the Citroën SM sold new in the US to an Australian ex-pat, who subsequently had it converted - in the US! - to right-hand-drive, then took it back with him to Australia. Some time ago, it found its way to Britain where it is the only working RHD SM in the country. It also came up for auction earlier this year, but failed to find any takers at £48,000. Other RHD SMs exist, and they were all converted in Australia; there are 25 or so.
@@smhorse Strange! There was a right hand conversion available from a company just north of London. Don't know how many they made.
@@stevehowell231 : the trio converted to RHD in Britain were done by Midleton Motors in Potters Bar. Only one still exists, in Australia.
I have imported to Mexico the Peugeot 604, also designed by Pininfarina, perhaps it is the only one in my country. The Lancia coupé and the 504 were designed by Aldo Brovarone. 😉
Brovarone was a genus and a gentleman. He also did the Ferrari F40. Have you seen this brief video on his career? ruclips.net/video/ohE_uyKaApg/видео.html
To answer your question, you gave a great top 5 list of really good examples. I knew about 3 of them but wasn't aware of the Peugeot, which really looks a lot like the Fiat 130, and the Matra Bagheera is a complete surprise, it is a fascinating design both interior and exterior and very clean on the outside, notably absent are the ugly bumpers that plagued cars from the early 70's on that were required here in the US.
Thanks for watching! Yes, I agree about the bumpers. Some companies handled the "impact" bumpers better than others (Porsche, maybe?) and some handled them worse (MG?), but there was definitely a loss of simplicity and stylistic grace when they arrived on the scene. It is a marker point in automotive history for me, and cars will always be sort of split up in the "Pre-1974" and "Post-1974" eras. In my mind, anyway. Stay tuned for a "Version 2" of this video which will be coming out soon.
Safety bumpers were great considering 4,500-5,000lbs lumbering Giants ruled American roads well into early 90s. No expensive surprises if one slightly bumped into your car while at: booze store, grocery mart, mall,etc.
Drove a Fiat 130 sedan with automatic transmission for many miles, the later 3.2 liter variant. Fantastic, sporty and with plenty of torque. The Borg Warner auto transmission didn't like to kick down automatically and had to be coaxed down manually. The only way to obtain an automatic downshifting was to floor the accelerator. The 60 degree V6 engine was very smooth, a gem. I read over the years that its 165 hp and rather high price hurt sales because, at its price, it competed against slightly more powerful Mercedes and BMW cars, better known as luxury touring autos than Fiat. I think it would have been more successful in the marketplace if it had been badged Lancia. In any case, I found it to be a great, fun drive.
I agree. My 130 5-speed was a great, silky touring car, but it never felt FAST, really. But man, it was a lovely car to take my wife a couple of suitcases on a sporting tour of the Mediterranean coast, which I guess is pretty much what it was designed to do. Thanks for watching!
Yes, it wasn't meant to be a 0-60 mph ace but it would cruise smoothly and quietly at 100+ mph all day long. Great autostrada car that also handled very well.
Great list. Fiat 130 and Peugeot coupe are beatiful. I owned a bagheera the courreges edition and i loved that car.
First time I’ve seen someone that actually likes the fiat and the lancia the guys got taste
Thank you, sir! Brovarone’s Gamma coupe design is just… crazy good looking. And the 5-speed 130 Coupe I owned for a while got into my blood. Maybe the best ride/handling balance I have ever experienced. It dealt with rough pavement with soft composure, yet cornered like a Porsche 928. And that interior? Oh, MAN…. I’m still in love.
I used to walk past a 130 Coupé on the way to school. Super cool.
just came across this - glad I did. Like the way you're thinking !
Fabulous list. So glad you included the gorgeous 130!
Beautiful! I love your taste in car design!
Thank you, Sir! And thanks for watching!
You could add a 130 saloon too.
Yes, and an Opel Manta! And a Mk2 Ford Escort (or maybe a V6 Granada?) And a later Alfetta GTV 2.0! I think I need to do a “part 2” version of this video...
All excellent choices. Personally I would have perhaps chosen the later Talbot-Matra Murena over the Bagheera - it's even prettier, and I believe generally a better, more resolved car. But I'm quibbling :) Great video!
I think it's the name! Hahaha! "Bagheera." C'mon! You gotta love that name. But you are of course correct, the Murena is a better car and better put together. Thanks for watching!
@@paulmisencik , the early Bagheera was slightly more special, the later had an improved powertrain
Loved that Paul, and owned 19 BMWs over thirty years and three of these were new. Always thought the 3 was a ‘people’s car’ in that it carried 4/5 people, had a bulletproof 4 pot engine and excellent build quality. I frequently bought, drove and sold my Beemers to avoid depreciation, plus I loved the research and buying process. Didn’t know that Peugeot made a 504 coupe? Cheers Geoff
Thanks Geoff! Yeah, classic BMW's are easy to love.
I was fortunate to purchase a Gamma Coupe in New Zealand, brand new in 1983. I believe that it might have sat on a Hong Kong or Singapore lot for a while, but who cares. After my HPE 1600 ripper, the Gamma was smooth, glorious and handsome. Fast, quiet and so Lancia. Finally sold to an Italian mechanic from Wellington, who had a close hard look before giving it the o.k.
It was more than o.k. I wish it was still in my garage on the Gold Coast, Australia.....Dang.
Aw, man. That's fantastic! What color did you choose? I always wonder, with each of these old cars I own, which color I would have chosen if I had bought one new. For example, my Beta Coupe 2000 is Rosso Corsa (bright red) and I like it fine, but I doubt I would have chosen it back in the day. I think I would have chosen the dark blue, or maybe even the brown.
Beautiful, all of them are beautiful! What a great video
Agreed ☺️ Excellent video but the Fiat 130 coupe by Pininfarina my fave
Kia Ora, or Hola.
3 very durable classics:
MB W123/124, Peugeot 504, Volvo P1800.
Drove each back in the 80s/90s but never owned.
Had 4 Lancias:62'Flaminia coupe (Pinin),77' Beta Hpe,
82' Gamma coupe
, 83' Beta Hpe.
I knew a guy had a Fiat 130 coupe (manual) 30 years ago.
Still a small following for these cars here in New Zealand but not many good ones left.
Hi Simon! Thanks so much for watching, and I appreciate the suggestions, because I plan to make a "part II" of this video soon. Or maybe just an updated 2023 version...
You missed out the Citroen XM. Car of the year when released in 1989, it has a beautiful body, one of the most comfortable cars you will drive with the hydro-pneumatic suspension, and exceptional handling car with the computer-contolled hydractive 3 suspension. 3.0 lt V6, or 2.0lt. turbo petrol. You can pick them up for around $1500 in good condition (as I did), and they were an $80,000 car in their day.
Shane, you're so right. In fact, there are probably half a dozen super entertaining Citroëns I could have added here. What about the CX GTI? That car is a hoot, too. I am working on a version 2 of this (now three year old) video, and I appreciate you watching and commenting! Happy holidays, hermano!
@@paulmisencik Paul, thanks for the reply. Besides an XM CT 2.0i, I also have 2 CX TRD's which are really great cars, I agree.
I'm glad you appreciate and show these cars. There are so many models that nobody pays attention to.
Wow! Very nice informative video gentleman. The only one of my knowledge was the BMW. Loved the Matra, theLancia and the Peugeot in that order. Tks, keep up the wonderful work !
Thank you for watching, sir! And for the kind words! I am going to get back to making videos, I promise, and "Version 2" of this very video is coming soon! Stay tuned.
Great video, @paulmisencik! It's been through two owners in the US, but I have your 130 Coupe in this video and I intend to drive it regularly. It's only covered 300 km since this was filmed, and while it's now very attractive after the last owner installed new headlights and taillights, rechromed bumpers and refreshed rubber ends, did a respray in the original color and the new "Arogosto" (Lobster) velvet going in to make the inside look as good as the outside looks, I can now begin on sorting the electrics, brake hydraulics, carb, cams and fuel system that I've found it needed. Looking forward to sharing the updates as they occur.
I suspect the 130 may be the most beautiful 3-box car ever designed. Putting aside any practicalities, one of those and a Bagheera would be a reasonable crack at 'dream garage'
Totally agree.
drove Fiat 124 coupe's, Fiat Dino 2400, Fiat 130 coupe and several Lancia's (Beta and Gamma Coupe) in those years as a young person! Great memories.
Mum and dad had a Peugot 504 estate when I was a kid. That got traded for the Peugot 505 estate (diesel, naturaly). The 504 had something like 300 000 km on the klock when they sold it. The 505 had about 570 000 kilometers under it's belt when they got a newer car.
That’s old Peugeots for you. Bulletproof.
Excellent choices. All achingly beautiful. One of my dream cars is the Bagherra.
Mine too.
504 Coupé is certainly gorgeous, but is not the rugged beast the sedan/berline was. But an excellent car nonetheless.
The 130 Coupé was also a wonder, but there is a reason they are not more popular. Parts simply do not exist.
I agree totally about the E21. Actually, any E21. The fours were wonderful too. The front seats were an excellent place to sit.
The Gamma Coupé is a mad car. There was a degree of cooperation with Citroën on this one, with the Cx. Crazy and sublime, but I wouldn't go near one today.
The Matra-Simca Bagheera is divine, but is an acquired taste. There was a later development (Murena) that may be in better condition.
What an excellent list. All wonderful cars, although most (or all) are only for the brave.
One more for the list?
A mad one. Or two...
Peugeot 405 Mi16x4.
Citroën BX 16 valve.
The BX 16v is a sweet and typically rather bizarre car. I might need. to make a 2022 updated version of this is! Or rather a "Part 2." Thanks for watching!
I love this video, thanks for posting. I particularly like the Peugeot 504 - I've always loved these cars. And the Matra Bagheera is one that I had forgotten existed! Love it.
Thanks so much for the comment, and for watching!
I wish I could've kept the clean garage pampered 504 Peugeot sedan I bought before moving across the country. Problem was it was a Diesel that turned out to have a cracked head. I could live with the slow poke highway speed but a mechanic told me that head problem was common on Peugeot 4 cylinder Diesels so I didn't want that back in it.
I suppose I could've rigged a way to put a Chevy 4 cylinder or even an Isuzu Diesel reefer motor in it. But I was in transition with no place to keep it so I let the immaculate body amotor go to a guy for $100. It was actually a decently built and handsome little car except for some little engineering flaw that saw too many cracked heads on their 4 cylinder diesel.
I once heard a judge tell a girl in his courtroom that just because she owned a Fiat wasn't proof that it wasn't running. I suppose you could apply that to Peugeot's diesel.
I saw a Matra in Austria once, in 1985. And never saw one again until today lol. Very cool thank you.
Hah! I saw one on the beach in Javea, Spain about three years ago, and haven't seen one since. They are rare birds! Thanks for watching, and look for Version 2 of this video coming out soon.
Great video!, My favorite in the list is the BMW, simply because is a panzer, you can drive it for a trillion miles... but the Matra is the most exotic, maybe the most interesting, for someone looking for a "black sheep" classic. The 504 very interesting and unseen (but all 504 rust like hell...), almost non-existent outside France I think. Cheers!
That's the beauty of living in dry, arid Spain. Rust is not as much of an issue here. You still need to be careful, but there are plenty of clean examples...
I have a 504 Cabriolet from 1972. Magnifique!
The 130 coupe is in the museum of modern art - such is the potential
Lots of deals to be had in Europe currently, managed to import 2 Matra Bagheera S1's with good floors & parts to complete
Okay. You're my hero.
The Matra Baghera was an amazing , civilized bad-ass sport car.
Find me one in Spain or in the Moon and I'l l buy it.
The same goes for the 504 Coupe ou the Cabriolet.
Older cars are easy to fix -- on the other hand, modern cars are a set of micro-chips and computers, controlling everything.
They require a Scientist, not a good Mechanic.
None of this fascinating electronic toys will survive a 5 years rest in a barn or garage.
Unfortunately, I underwent that experience.
Thank you and congratulations for a fabulous Video.
A.
You're so right. People get SO WORRIED about reliability with older cars. My wife is a good example. She drives only new cars, and if her 2022 Volvo starts throwing "propulsion fault" warnings on the dashboard, as it did recently, what the hell am I going to do about it? Nothing. Book an appointment at the dealer. But I drive exclusively classic cars, and if they are in good shape they are perfectly dependable. And if they go wrong, I can actually sort them, often on the roadside. But that's pretty rare! I drive my old cars like, well... like CARS. I use them every day. I take my kids to school in them, commute to work in them, and if I need to go across country tomorrow? I'd take my old Lancia without thinking too much about it. I trust old cars if they are in good shape, and more often than not they repay that trust.
Thanks so much for the kind words, and thanks for watching. I'm going to get back into making these videos in 2023, so keep an eye out.
The Peugeot 504 and 505 are incredible cars.. I bought a 505gti wagon in Australia $600,, detailed it spend $750 on it and now its a $20,000 classic.. the same series had the 405 Mi16 and the 205GTi who jeremy clarkson said car whip a super car on a tight track. i love driving it over my camaro.
The 505 GTI and 505 Turbo are cars I keep my eyes open for around here, because I REALLY WANT ONE. Pininfarina styling which has aged astonishingly well, and they are reliable and dynamic cars. The GTI wagon is a fantastic car to own. Good for you, thanks for watching, and stay tuned for a "Version 2" of this video coming out soon.
Agree with all those. Good taste!
Thank you Sir! And I appreciate you watching!
my favourite the peugeot.
Awesome list, I approve of all on the list. I have had peugeot 504's. I now own a 604 and alfa 90.
The 604 is so cool I can't stand it. That is such a handsome, stately, beautifully proportioned Pininfarina design. I am entirely smitten with the 604. I am always actively looking for a 505 GTI, or maybe a really nice 505 Estate, because the 505 is another design I really love. But the 604 has more... gravitas. Thanks so much for watching and commenting.
@@paulmisencik I agree, the 604 is a classy car. The ride, handling and comfort also puts it into a special category. But when you start with a 504 platform you can't really go wrong.
Pretty cars. Paul's right - I never heard of them! Thanks for the tour.
Thanks for watching, and stay tuned for "Version 2" coming out soon!
Really very interesting. I like the “blacksheep”. The 504 Coupe would be my pick. I lived and worked in Johannesburg 1977-81. One of our execs ran our car biz. He frequently had gift cars from OEM’s hoping we might assemble them in SA. The first was a first year Citroen CX Prestige which knocked my socks off. Then a Bagheera. Had no idea Matra made cars. Loved the show. Have my own unmolested Euro Mercedes: 1975 W116 350SE and a 1992 C124 300CE-24 Sportline with 5-speed Getrag. Never any issues with parts. Love them.
Fascinating stuff. I always forget that South Africa is a very popular place for OEM's to develop local production. I love your Benzes. I own a 1977 280SE (w116) and absolutely adore it. And I have a 1984 300TD Estate (w113) which I am also fond of, but the w116 has always been my favorite older Mercedes-Benz model. I'm not even sure why. There is something almost impossibly elegant and substantial about the lines.
Your 300CE 5-speed is also right up my alley. I owned an e320 Cabriolet in the states and became pretty convinced that the w124 was last of the truly over engineered, overbuilt Mercedes-Benz models. My son is 15, and I want to start building him a car, so we can do it together as a project and have it ready for him when he gets his license at age 18. I REALLY want to do a 300CE 5-speed, and there is a 2-valve car close to me that's the right price. But he seems unimpressed. Says he wants a Nissan 350Z, and whenever he says that it's very difficult for me not to roll my eyes. Kids. What're you gonna do?
Thanks so much for the lovely comment, and enjoy your cars.
@@paulmisencik Thank you for your note. Yes, SA built lots of cars from CKD’s. To avoid import duties, they had to be 60% local content by weight. Tires, glass, etc. The Mercedes facility was the only one outside Germany allowed to build engines. I had a locally-built Alfa Romeo 1600 GTJ, a Citroen DS Pallas 5-speed (on the tree!). The Cit was marvelous. I have Catholic car taste. Agree on the 116. I was in college in 1972 and saw the first pictures of them in Road & Track. They looked like space ships compared to the family W108. Bought a ratty used 911T at the same time my dad bought a 1973 450SE. The handling astounded me. Vowed to have one someday. You mention your son. I feel like I need to pare my fleet down at this point. Oddly enough my 31-year old son and his 27-year old sister think I should keep the 350SE and sell the C124 and 6-speed SLK320. They and their friends think the 116 is so classy.
This is cool - I would love to own one of these - they are cars from my childhood and I am familiar with all but one of them (I did not know Matra Bagheera - whoa!) .. You have given me something to think about because, given my limited pocketbook for stuff like classic cars, this makes me feel like it is more attainable (I always go to stuff that costs 6 figures -haha). Thanks.. POST MORE VIDEOS!!!!
Thank you for the kind words, Dylan! And I am planning to start making videos again, I promise. Version 2 of this video will be coming soon!
That Fiat 130, is and has been overlooked all this time,,remember seeing one in Paris in april 1973,,been 504 is close…85 and my dream car days are over…be still my heart..
The Fiat 130 coupe is truly a desirable car. A British journalist changed the 3 speed auto with a more modern overdrive 4 speed auto and he claimed that it transformed it into an even more comfortable and refined GT. He chose to do the auto rather than a manual as it was more in character with the rest of the car.
Very cool video Paul! Love those cars and most, never heard of. The 504 reminded me of some of the well to families I knew had the peugeot 505 wagon..diesel engine I believe. Anyway, I lived in the UK/London for nearly 4 yrs and loved seeing cars I never even heard of or seen back in the US. Even "Ford's" never sold in the US market. However, I was stationed in Tokyo all through the 1980's and fell in love with Japanese cars! I have in my drive way now here in FLA, a 1993 Nissan Gloria GT and have won 2 car shows with it pre Covid. Bought it at auction 5+ yrs ago with only 18K original miles...now has 55K on her, daily driver. Love it!! Cheers for the video, keep'em coming!
You're so right! The JDM craze has brought attention again to some really cool and quirky old Japanese cars. Everyone wants a 510 or an early Celica, but I'd love a Cressida wagon or something! Thanks for watching, and look for Version 2 of this video coming out soon.
@@paulmisencik The JDM's are truly great cars. When I lived there my first car was a 1975 Mitsubishi GSR GTO. It was in PERFECT condition. I bought for $500.00 US in 1983. That car had a 1900cc duel side draft Solex carbs, 5-Speed, positraction, with the side mirrors up over the from wheel wells(which totally works because you only need to shift your eyes, not move your head) loved it!! The Japanese cars there ALL have(had) names, not "numbers" - used for export cars. The 510 was named the "Bluebird". I'm sure you know the Z cars = "Fairlady", and so on with the Silvia, Laurel, Sunny, Cedric, Gloria, President etc., to name just some Nissan cars. The Cressida was is a great car!! Plus, because Japanese take/took such good care of their cars, the cars 25+ years later are in really good shape! The "road taxes" there, at leat when i was there were such that a 4 years old car 's road tax were higher than a new car, so people got new cars every 4 years. Created a strong economy and a GREAT resale market! Ok, I'll be looking for Version 2! Tell us something about the Lotus', Renault's and the Cosworth's if you can! Cheers!
E21 is now coming into its own.
Late to this party , yes, but this video suddenly appeared in my feed.
So now would be a good time to grab an e21.
TOTALLY agree. A good e21 is a good car, and if you're into tweaking and tuning and changing things to your taste (as I am) it's one of the best bases for building something uniquely yours. Thanks so much for watching! Version 2 of this video is coming out soon...
The Lancia Gamma coupè is the most beautiful front-wheel drive I've ever driven, low center of gravity, boxer, incredible road holding, braking and the impression of always having it in your hands. Shame about the quality...
I have one and I agree, drives superbly and everything still works, even the remote side mirror, but the quality of the plastics is not very good
I owned a gamma berlina, which I actually prefer over the coupé in styling, quirkiness and details, for 8 years and 200.000km. While the coupé is good in all the points you mention, the berlina is even better. Fabulous car and today even more rare than a coupé. In all those 8 years I never encountered another one 'in the wild'.
The Fiat 130 coupe is truly a beautiful car, loved getting them in wehn I was in the trade, a proper gt car, preferred the manual though. The 504 coupe was a pretty good car also, more useable than the Gamma, which was a ‘little precious’ with not enough engine cooling…forget the German car, they are so bloody boring and NOT as rust free as they’re made out to be, like 3/4 panels and where they meet the sills, electrics that get wet especially fuse boxes
Agreed on all counts, although I'm more of a fan of the six-cylinder e21 than I think you are. In stock form there isn't enough roll stiffness, but you can set up a 320/6 to a be a proper vintage screamer without too much effort or money. But you're SO RIGHT on the rust issue. I own a 1977 Lancia Beta Coupe, and everyone (particularly the English immigrants here in Spain) always quip: "Hah! Hasn't rusted to dust yet?" My car is dry and rust free, and the later Betas are no more prone to rust than, say... a Toyota Celica or BMW 320i or Ford Capri from the same year, none of which are as infamous for rust as the Beta seems to be.
@@paulmisencik the politics in uk is very much anti anybody but the English
The number of folk who thought Ford and Vauxhall were British were/are staggering…I trained as a Fiat/Lancia (then Alfa) auto electrician so know they were as good or better than the competition…as for the BMW, loved the 2002 but three and five series were a nightmare
Excellent suggestions. All cars are those of high utility/styling.
Excellent choices. Good vid. Thanks.
The 604 was a 4 door image of 130,stylistic beauty of Paolo Martin at Pininfarina.
The 604 is an incredibly handsome large sporting sedan, you're right! Good call!
The Fiat 130 was the car that inspired RR to make the Camargue, the most expensive car in the world at it's time. Tha Lancia Beta Coupe VX is also a good choice.
07:38 you might want to mention this cars have a steeringpump driven by the cambelt (yes, thats right) and when steering fulllock the belt jumps and the engine gets shredded to bits. So if buying a gamma, DO NOT STEER FULL LOCK
504 Coupe is amazingly good looking car. Wasn't aware of this model before at all.
I love them too. Thanks for watching! I have a version 2 of this video coming out soon!
Some interesting choices. I like the full background information, including reliability - I had a '74 Lancia Beta Coupe - couldn't keep the thing running, but what a great driving machine.
Thank you for watching and for the kind words! I daily drive a 1979 Beta Coupe right now, and have done for three years. It has been amazingly reliable, and even has factory air conditioning, which is rare and wonderful. Sometimes old cars need sorting, but in my experience once they are sorted, assuming they are taken care of and treated with at least a modicum of respect, they will do you well!
Love this stuff. Please keep it up. Subscribed.
Thank you! I haven't made videos for a couple years, but you are motivating me to get back into it!!
Wow, I didnt know the prices had dropped so much. Where would one look to find cars like these?
3:40 The FIAT 130 Coupe was the styling inspiration for the Rolls-Royce Camargue. Yes, it’s true.
I did not know that! But now that you mention it, it makes perfect sense! Thanks for watching!
Was it not the Lancia Gammas that if you used full lock when cold, the drive shafts fell out?
Got a like for pronouncing 'Coupé' correctly.
Seems North Americans generally think that a coupé is a place where chickens sleep.
Thank you sir! And thanks for watching!
Dude, you have NO IDEA how much we resemble each other! My wife says you are my doppelganger. I even wear a hat like that (because I have nothing underneath). I could not watch this whole video; I could not stare "myself in the eyes". You must be 45-52, that is when I looked the most like you. I am 61 now. I am still stunned. My brother does not look as much like me.😵💫
Hahahaha! No way! That’s awesome!
Matra-Simca Bagheera MkI my Cousin own one in the 80's. And for a 8 year ild at the time. It became my dream car. But... with a all new mechanic!!! Congrat's for the Video.
Just the Lancia isn't my scene.
Often Lancia cars are so idiosyncratic that it takes a while before you make up your mind as to whether you think them beautiful or ugly. The Gamma coupe, however, is one of the most beautiful cars I've ever seen in the flesh, so to speak!
One of Aldo Brovarone's best designs, I think.
Very good picks, i enjoyed that. A Matra would be very tempting
Thank you for watching! I need to make a version 2 of this video, because it's a few years old now.
Cool selection.
Thanks so much for watching!
One year out of university I had a chance to buy a 323 coupe for $3k. I lived near an army base and a guy who had come back from Germany traded it in at a used car lot for a pickup. The guy who owned the lot had no idea what he had. I had the money to buy it but not to fix it, and no place to store it. One of the big regrets of my life.
I hear you. I think all of us car guys look back on similar missed opportunities. The good news for you is that 323's are still REASONABLY affordable. But I'm telling you man, pick up a 320/6 for half the money and you can tune it and tweak it to make more power than a stock 323 with relatively little effort, and with a punchier hit of midrange torque to boot. The e21 is known for a sneaky lift-throttle oversteer condition, but other than that it's a fantastic chassis to modify to your liking. (Besides, snap oversteer keeps us all on our toes.)
The 504 coupe is a dream
Great video you got a new subscriber and long term potential customer 😉
Thank you for watching, and thanks for the kind words! Stay tuned for a "Version 2" of this video coming out soon.
I’m loving the Peugeot 504, and thought I knew my Fiats well enough, but you said 130, I heard 131.. and thought, nice enough car but why is this one the list? Then you showed it to me. I want one.
Loved all the selections
Thank you, and thanks for watching!
Ford Taunus 26m coupe
Saab 9000
And don't forget the 'ordinairy' Fiat 130 sedan.
What is going on with this video? I made it two and a half years ago, and three weeks ago it had 4000 views. Now I am getting comments every five hours and the views have more than doubled. Was it posted somewhere or something?
PS. I LOVE pretty much all old Saabs, and should have included at least one of them. Early 900's are getting expensive, but the 9000 is a very good choice. And so is the Taunus. Or maybe the 6-cylinder Granada?
Alfa 164 and 166, Lancia Thesis and Thema. Still cheap but becoming rare rapidly.
All good choices, except... maybe the 166?! Hahaha! I have never been too hot on the 166 for some reason. But the Busso drivetrain cures a lot of ills.
Good to see the 130 coupe getting some love - there’s currently a beautiful one for sale on eBay, if anyone’s in the market for one………although personally, I’d go for the Lancia Gamma coupe myself - in my view quite possibly the most beautiful 70s coupe (although the Jaguar XJC and XJS are also favourites…….)
I hear that. I loved my 130 coupe, but Fiat does such a lousy job of supporting their classic cars, certain things can be witheringly expensive to put right when they go bad. My rear glass was delaminating. Not a huge deal, but it bothered me. Not available. Nowhere. No one has the rear glass for a 130 coupe anymore. I ended up having to have it custom made by Pilkington in England for something like 1500€ plus tax and delivery. And it took eight months. (But they did a magnificent job, even replicating the original light green tint, and incorporating the exact original style defrosting wires...) I think if it were my money and I had to buy one tomorrow, it would be the Gamma.
Thanks so much for watching, and stay tuned for Version 2 of this vehicle, coming soon.
@@paulmisencik If you live in the rust belt you can actually hear the 130 rust on a quiet day..
@@agskytter8977 True, but if you live in the rust belt you hear everything rust. Everything from the 1970's, that is, with the possible exception of a late 1970's Porsche 911 or 928. But everything else from the 1970's rusts. Toyota Celicas rust. Ford Capris rust. MGB's rust. Mk.1 VW Sciroccos rust. Ford pickup trucks rust. BMW Bavarias rust. Jaguars rust. Opel Mantas rust. Jeep Wagoneers rust. 1970's cars are rust worries, and in the rust belt everything else is also.
In my personal experience? After decades of owning and driving and restoring Alta Romeo GTV's and Fiat 130's and Lancia Betas and Fulvias and Spiders from both Alfa and Fiat, I have not found them to be substantially better or worse in this regard than anything else made in the period. And yet the Italian cars are always saddled with the boat anchor that they are "unreliable and rusty." In my personal experiences both of those scarlet letters they have been forced to wear are a little unfair. If they are good, and you take care of them, they stay good. By and large.
First time I saw your channel. I liked your list.
Thank you! Stay tuned for "Version 2" of this video coming out soon!
Hi, cool video, I always loved the Talbot Matra Murena
Me too, and it's a better car. My ONLY problem with the Murena, and the reason I passed it over for the Bagheera, is the styling. I find the Murena kinda... mild and derivative looking. There is something about the way the Bagheera looks that does it for me. But you're right, the Murena is a great choice too, and a demonstrably better car.
Would hardly call the 504 overlooked. It is an expensive classic. Gorgeous car.
Never heard of Matra, but now I definitely want to "get to know" them better!
Fun company. And they built what I consider to be the best sounding racing car of all time.
Jackie Stewart won his first F1 World Championship in a Matra-Ford in 1969.
Good list! I'd take the later Murena in 2.2 guise vs. the Bagheera. And add the Lancia 2000 HF Coupé to the list.
So funny you mention this, because I was sorta halfway thinking about making an updated version of this video, or a "Version 2," four years on or whatever, and the first car that came to my mind was the Lancia 2000 Coupé! Such an underrated gem. Thanks for watching!
So, 130 Coupe and Gamma Coupe. Throw in an Alfasud Sprint and you have the holy trinity of small to medium coupes. If you had a GTV6 and a FIAT Dino you've pretty much got the lot.
I was LABORING over whether or not to include the Sprint. I keep looking at them here, because I loved my old Mk 1 Scirocco, and the Sprint Veloce is proof that even Guigiaro could get lazy and sell the same design to two companies. Hahaha! Love me some Sprints! Thanks for watching!
A friend of mine had a straight 6 E21. Once I got into a slide at quite low speed. So, please beware of lift-off oversteer!
You're absolutely right. The real suspensions were a bit tricky in lift-throttle situations all the way through the e30 days. You're absolutely right. Thanks for watching!
I was tempted by a Gamma Coupe and a Bagheera but bought an Alfetta GTV in 1984. The 504 is a nice car but I prefer the 505 with the V6 (a friend had one). I recognized the 130 as soon as I saw it, a classic design. The 3 series beemer was so common in the UK they were known as the BMW Mondeo. I had a nice E92 335i coupe.
Hahaha! BMW Mondeo. I love that. I owned an Alfetta GTV also. Mine was a 1982, I think. Maybe I am a Giugiaro fanboy, but to me the Alfetta GTV is one of the best looking cars of that era. Dead sexy.
And totally agreed on the 505! Gorgeous Pininfarina design and unusual to see these days. I keep my eyes open for a good 505 Turbo with a manual, but Is even love a good 505 GTI. They are fantastic cars. Thanks for watching!
@David Peters The e21 3 series was long gone before Mondeo appeared on the scene. First Mondeo was 1992.
Or Is your comment just about 3 series in general being as common as a Mondeo ?
Which was true…
Helped purely by fleet sales and personal leases.
It was cheap to get into a BMW in the 90s and 2000s on a lease.
Still is I guess.
The Peugeot 504 would be an awesome restomod with just a bit of muscle car flavor.
I had a 323 for a racing course. It would not go through corners if you would manhandle it through. When the engine seized I used my road car in the day a Alfa Romeo 75 2L TS on the track. A beautifully balanced car way, way, and yes, way better car. If you look for somethings special that is the car to have... The V6 is not as well balanced but for BHP lovers a good alternative.
I couldn't have put it better. I had an Alfa 75 TS for three years from new and covered 90,000 miles in it. I had the pleasure of driving it round Silverstone circuit in 1991, and I drove the V6 the same day. I've always found the 3 series BMW rather wooden to drive by comparison with the Alfa.