You're a life saver Dr. Hans. I am less worried now. I brewed a chocolate stout over the weekend and used 70 grams of unsweetened bakers chocolate (60% cacao) at flameout and thought my head was going to suffer greatly. Knowing that you used 200 grams of 70% chocolate gives me hope that my beer will turn out ok. I will still carbonate a bit higher when bottling to counteract the little fat in there. Thanks again!
I recently brewed a big imperial stout and did a split batch: half with coffee added, and half without. There was a huge difference in head retention between the two. The head dissipated almost instantly on the coffee version while the regular version had a head that stuck around for the entire time it took for me to drink the beer. Not sure if it had something to do with how I made the coffee. I used an Aeropress and made an almost espresso-like concentrate and added that before bottling.
I always brew a recipe of coffee chocolate stout for a late May Beer festival, it's always a big hit and has nearly won best home brew a few times. Always surprised how popular a stout can be on a hot day. I've never added the roasted malts late, but after hearing many people do it and why, I'll have to try it. I've had some good lager stouts, really makes the malt flavor and ingredients stand out. I always add very little hops as I know the coffee and chocolate will add bitterness. I have done cold brewed coffee for my coffee wheat with very good results.
I'm happy to see that you are skimming off hot break since recommending it to you some time back. How does adding wheat malt counteract added fat? A spunding valve is used on a secondary fermenter and on conditioning tanks not on a primary fermenter. What is top mashing and what purpose does it serve? Mash pH is adjusted to be optimum for the enzyme being activated. Mash pH isn't stuck at a single pH when making ale and lager.
Top smashing is when you steep part of your grains on top of the mash for a shorter time at the end. Instead of giving it a full mash. It gives a smoother non astringent beer. Try it with dark malts like chocolate malt or roasted barley for example.
Excellent video Doc as usual. I love the way you give constructive criticism and appraise your beers . That looked a lovely stout I just hope my African Queen Stout turns out ok. I bottled it Sunday so the African Queen will have to wait a while yet before she gets to taste it!
DrHans Brewery I have recently been drinking beers from Verdant Brewery who are based in Falmouth Cornwall. My aim now is to try and brew similar styles but I think it will be a year or two of experimenting before I even get close. Lol I doubt I will ever get close to their beers!
Lipids (fats) come in different molecular structure. Processed lipids, such as brewed coffee MAY be structurally different than non-modified lipids. So, maybe try an experiment where you add some hydrogenated vegetable oil (Crisco) to the mash. Maybe boiling the lipids breaks apart the bonding agents and leaves the beer pretty much unaffected by the lipid introduction?
Apologies if this has been raised already, but 5.2 seems a low pH for a stout mash, especially BEFORE adding the dark grains. I tend to target a pH of 5.4-5.5 for my strong dark beers during the mash, as reading has led to be believe that a higher pH at the end of fermentation gives a rounder, smoother flavour to dark beers. Can you comment on that?
Andrew!! No apolgies needed. When the dark grains goes in using this method the mash is already over. Regarding if a lower PH gives smother flavour to dark beers i cant comment about. What I can say though is by using this method you will get a really smooth dark beer IMO. Bets if you try it out for your self. Cheers DrHans
Hi Hans, I'm loving your channel. I would love to moot the possibility that you could also balance out the extra bitterness by increasing either (or both) sweetness or sourness instead of by reducing your additions. I'm looking forward to hearing how your long term yeast cake experiment pans out.
Not sure on the "fat" is bad for head retention as I haven't brewed anything with an amount of fat in it but... I've brewed Kolsch just base malt (an amount of sour malt for water adj) hops water and yeast so no fat at all and.... no head retention, although the traditional Kolsch also doesn't have a head to speak of... food for thought, cheers Dr H, Mike 🍻🍻
Just done a stout and used cocoa nibs and it's weird first few pours amazongvthick creamy head just bottled some loads of carb and the head lasts around 30 seconds then nothing going to give it more time to condition as its still very new
I think adding fats AFTER the boil could be more of concern. Heat and pressure are going to separate the lipids into smaller "amino-acid-like" components. Any fats AFTER boil could inhibit head retention since lipids are "slippery" *a scientific term*
I think your coffee is responsible for the astringency. 150 gm is quite a lot since it is so strong flavored. I wonder if it might have turned out less bitter if you brewed the coffee and added it cold? I am planning a chocolate addition - no bars of chocolate - but nibs. I was surprised that you ground your nibs - they went in during the boil? How long? I also am considering using 190 proof alcohol to make a nib tincture? Opinions? Great video - greatly enjoyed it!
They knibs vent in at flameout. First time I grounded them. Just wanted to try it. More contact area. Yes the coffee was the thief I think to. I just wanted to play with adding it at different ways in this mini series. So I and you guys can learn from it. Glad you liked it. Cheers!
Hey Dr, tell me, for the quantity of chocolate you used on this beer what kind of dimension you achieved? You know, was it a subtle note or a strong chocolate taste? I'm planning on brewing a chocolate stout myself next month. Cheers
More subtle than strong. Check out my chocolate mint porter video. That one was very much chocolate. Try google DrHans mint porter. Let me know if you dont find it and I will link it to you. Cheers!
Nice looking beer, nice head and nice looking beard on a handsome man! Great video!! Haven't dared to brew with fat yet, but maybe as some suggest the trick is to boil the fat! Cheers mate! 😛👍🍺
Good experiment Doc. I'm going to turn this fat question around. Do you think adding the chocolate bars to this recipe added anything to risk potential head reduction? Couldn't you get just as much chocolate flavour from using the Chocolate malt and the nibs only?
My experiments have suggested that adding too much (it's a fine, fine line...) chocolate malt will again introduce astringency. You need more than just malt to introduce chocolate. It's art...really.
@@jcinsaniac Try to top mash the chocolate malt instead. Than you can add more without the astringency. It comes from mashing it to long in my experience. For chocolate there better malts to get chocolate from than chocolate malt. Try midnight wheat for example or chocolate wheat malt. It gives way more chocolate than the barley one in my opinion. Cheers!
@@@DrHansBrewery I have wanted to exbeeriment with midnight wheat - I also have gotten 1 lb packs of different kinds of Chocolate malts to see which I liked more. But the most powerful chocolate I have sampled is from nibs - Valrhoma Grue nibs. I want to experiment with steeping some and doing a tincture with 190 proof grain alcohol for maximum extraction. You say to use maybe high heat for a short period of time as a steeping grain - is that the top mash? I'm unfamiliar with that technique but google is your friend, so I will do some searching on that. Prost!
Dr. Hans, I rewatched some of your brew videos. When top mashing, I noticed you often do a fine crush on the dark grains, and mash for the last 15-20 min. Do you also increase the amount of dark grains? If so by how much? I tried it in my last brew, but it didn’t turn out as dark as I hoped. Maybe because I don’t have a pump yet. I did not increase the amount of dark grains or do a fine crush either. I just did a top mash for the last 15 min.
I top mash dark grains to get a smother non astringent beer. I add it at mashout. Steep for 20min in this one. Doing 10min for BIPAS. and when just for a color i add it just before I start to sparge. Have a look at my other dark beer videos and I talk about it more than in this video. Theres also the BIPA mini series playlist on my channel where I bring up this topic a lot. Try it and let me know how it works for you.
From what I remember, it pulls less tannins from the heavier roasted malts, gives a cleaner profile. I've had good results without adding late, but I'm going to try it next brew.
Nope, but the foam dies rather quick that's why I make extract now and for coffee a cold brew, you won't have too much harshness with a cold brew and if the coffee is light to medium roasted is even better. African coffee tends to be a bit harsher than the south american one. Cheers!
@@jacquael Its because it makes the beer smother and with no astringency and harshness. No need to condition the beer for a long time and so on. I usually do 20min if its astout or porter. 10min for BIPA. If I just want the color I add it at sparging. The roasted malt dont need any mashing just steeping is needed. As the conversion is already over in the roasting step of the malting. Cold brew is another method you could try. But this method is so simple and works so great so this is my main method. Please do try it end leave me a note on how it worked out for you. I bet you will love the result. Cheers and sorry for the long answer :D
@@DrHansBrewery thanks a lot for you answer! i plan to do a stout this weekend so i will do as you said. i would like to add chocolate flavor but no cacao butter. I am thinking of adding Van houten powder 5 min boil or flame out what do you think? i will also try to add cold brewed coffe in secondary.
@@DrHansBrewery it's an American football team. I'm from Baltimore, the Baltimore Orioles are rivals of the Yankees. The Baltimore Ravens(football) are rivals of the Steelers.
Oh boy. Looks great. I was just thinking of brewing a coffee stout or porter before I watched this. Definitely on my to do list. Thanks!
Cool Larry, cheers!
You're a life saver Dr. Hans. I am less worried now. I brewed a chocolate stout over the weekend and used 70 grams of unsweetened bakers chocolate (60% cacao) at flameout and thought my head was going to suffer greatly. Knowing that you used 200 grams of 70% chocolate gives me hope that my beer will turn out ok. I will still carbonate a bit higher when bottling to counteract the little fat in there. Thanks again!
Hey! Glad you liked the video. Good luck!
My understanding is that oils (from fat or fingers) have less surface tension and make it harder for bubbles to stick around. Great video, Cheers!
I agree, but I also think it would take a LOT of structural lipids to make head dissipate. More than what's on your skin.
The amount of fat weren't enough at least in this brew. A topic that still needs some more investigation.
I recently brewed a big imperial stout and did a split batch: half with coffee added, and half without. There was a huge difference in head retention between the two. The head dissipated almost instantly on the coffee version while the regular version had a head that stuck around for the entire time it took for me to drink the beer.
Not sure if it had something to do with how I made the coffee. I used an Aeropress and made an almost espresso-like concentrate and added that before bottling.
Thanks for sharing!
I always brew a recipe of coffee chocolate stout for a late May Beer festival, it's always a big hit and has nearly won best home brew a few times. Always surprised how popular a stout can be on a hot day. I've never added the roasted malts late, but after hearing many people do it and why, I'll have to try it.
I've had some good lager stouts, really makes the malt flavor and ingredients stand out. I always add very little hops as I know the coffee and chocolate will add bitterness. I have done cold brewed coffee for my coffee wheat with very good results.
Try adding the dark grains at mash out like I do. I'll bet you will like it.
I'm happy to see that you are skimming off hot break since recommending it to you some time back. How does adding wheat malt counteract added fat? A spunding valve is used on a secondary fermenter and on conditioning tanks not on a primary fermenter. What is top mashing and what purpose does it serve? Mash pH is adjusted to be optimum for the enzyme being activated. Mash pH isn't stuck at a single pH when making ale and lager.
Top smashing is when you steep part of your grains on top of the mash for a shorter time at the end. Instead of giving it a full mash. It gives a smoother non astringent beer. Try it with dark malts like chocolate malt or roasted barley for example.
Excellent video Doc as usual. I love the way you give constructive criticism and appraise your beers .
That looked a lovely stout I just hope my African Queen Stout turns out ok. I bottled it Sunday so the African Queen will have to wait a while yet before she gets to taste it!
Thanks buddy. Waiting for your tasting video!
DrHans Brewery I have recently been drinking beers from Verdant Brewery who are based in Falmouth Cornwall. My aim now is to try and brew similar styles but I think it will be a year or two of experimenting before I even get close. Lol I doubt I will ever get close to their beers!
Lipids (fats) come in different molecular structure. Processed lipids, such as brewed coffee MAY be structurally different than non-modified lipids. So, maybe try an experiment where you add some hydrogenated vegetable oil (Crisco) to the mash. Maybe boiling the lipids breaks apart the bonding agents and leaves the beer pretty much unaffected by the lipid introduction?
Thanks but why would I want to add oil to it?
Apologies if this has been raised already, but 5.2 seems a low pH for a stout mash, especially BEFORE adding the dark grains. I tend to target a pH of 5.4-5.5 for my strong dark beers during the mash, as reading has led to be believe that a higher pH at the end of fermentation gives a rounder, smoother flavour to dark beers. Can you comment on that?
Andrew!! No apolgies needed. When the dark grains goes in using this method the mash is already over. Regarding if a lower PH gives smother flavour to dark beers i cant comment about. What I can say though is by using this method you will get a really smooth dark beer IMO. Bets if you try it out for your self. Cheers DrHans
Thanks for sharing that experience buddy! Cheers 🍻
Thanks for watching buddy!
Hi Hans, I'm loving your channel. I would love to moot the possibility that you could also balance out the extra bitterness by increasing either (or both) sweetness or sourness instead of by reducing your additions. I'm looking forward to hearing how your long term yeast cake experiment pans out.
Yes it's all about balance. It will come soon!
Thanks for your kind words
Not sure on the "fat" is bad for head retention as I haven't brewed anything with an amount of fat in it but... I've brewed Kolsch just base malt (an amount of sour malt for water adj) hops water and yeast so no fat at all and.... no head retention, although the traditional Kolsch also doesn't have a head to speak of... food for thought, cheers Dr H, Mike 🍻🍻
Kolsh doesn't have many proteins left for much head retention. Kolsh is supposed to have little head retention, if any.
@@kerryhales8736 correct 10 points 🍻🍻
Yes. You could add some wheat in a kolsch for the head.
Just done a stout and used cocoa nibs and it's weird first few pours amazongvthick creamy head just bottled some loads of carb and the head lasts around 30 seconds then nothing going to give it more time to condition as its still very new
Watched with interest, thinking of using Peanut butter but I've never used fats so Thanks for the info looks a solid drink Cheers
Powdered peanut butter is the way to go.
I think adding fats AFTER the boil could be more of concern. Heat and pressure are going to separate the lipids into smaller "amino-acid-like" components. Any fats AFTER boil could inhibit head retention since lipids are "slippery" *a scientific term*
I clearly need to investigate this topic further!
I think your coffee is responsible for the astringency. 150 gm is quite a lot since it is so strong flavored. I wonder if it might have turned out less bitter if you brewed the coffee and added it cold? I am planning a chocolate addition - no bars of chocolate - but nibs. I was surprised that you ground your nibs - they went in during the boil? How long? I also am considering using 190 proof alcohol to make a nib tincture? Opinions? Great video - greatly enjoyed it!
They knibs vent in at flameout. First time I grounded them. Just wanted to try it. More contact area.
Yes the coffee was the thief I think to. I just wanted to play with adding it at different ways in this mini series. So I and you guys can learn from it. Glad you liked it. Cheers!
Hey Dr, tell me, for the quantity of chocolate you used on this beer what kind of dimension you achieved? You know, was it a subtle note or a strong chocolate taste? I'm planning on brewing a chocolate stout myself next month. Cheers
More subtle than strong. Check out my chocolate mint porter video. That one was very much chocolate. Try google DrHans mint porter. Let me know if you dont find it and I will link it to you. Cheers!
Nice looking beer, nice head and nice looking beard on a handsome man! Great video!! Haven't dared to brew with fat yet, but maybe as some suggest the trick is to boil the fat! Cheers mate! 😛👍🍺
It might be. Still needs much experimenting this topic. Cheers l!
Still watching you describe the flavours is giving me a tumour.
Hahaha thanks for your honesty. Cheers!
That's what I brewed 2 days ago. I'm still thinking if I should put both the cold brewed coffee and the cocoa nibs extract before bottling.
I would add it when there is still some activity left.
Good experiment Doc. I'm going to turn this fat question around. Do you think adding the chocolate bars to this recipe added anything to risk potential head reduction? Couldn't you get just as much chocolate flavour from using the Chocolate malt and the nibs only?
Good question. Yes I could have added knibs to the fermenter. Could have used some darker wheat malts etc
My experiments have suggested that adding too much (it's a fine, fine line...) chocolate malt will again introduce astringency. You need more than just malt to introduce chocolate. It's art...really.
@@jcinsaniac Try to top mash the chocolate malt instead. Than you can add more without the astringency. It comes from mashing it to long in my experience. For chocolate there better malts to get chocolate from than chocolate malt. Try midnight wheat for example or chocolate wheat malt. It gives way more chocolate than the barley one in my opinion. Cheers!
@@@DrHansBrewery I have wanted to exbeeriment with midnight wheat - I also have gotten 1 lb packs of different kinds of Chocolate malts to see which I liked more. But the most powerful chocolate I have sampled is from nibs - Valrhoma Grue nibs. I want to experiment with steeping some and doing a tincture with 190 proof grain alcohol for maximum extraction. You say to use maybe high heat for a short period of time as a steeping grain - is that the top mash? I'm unfamiliar with that technique but google is your friend, so I will do some searching on that. Prost!
I have a system that is almost identical to yours. How do you mash without a bag and not get a bunch of grain hanging around for the boil?
I do get some grains in the boil. Just did a brew and answered your question there as well. Will come in a video in the future.
Dr. Hans, I rewatched some of your brew videos. When top mashing, I noticed you often do a fine crush on the dark grains, and mash for the last 15-20 min. Do you also increase the amount of dark grains? If so by how much? I tried it in my last brew, but it didn’t turn out as dark as I hoped. Maybe because I don’t have a pump yet. I did not increase the amount of dark grains or do a fine crush either. I just did a top mash for the last 15 min.
Try increasing it by like a third. Fine crush works for me. Try it!
23 liters is almost exactly 6 US gallons
Why did you add the dark grains in later? And what time in the mash?
I top mash dark grains to get a smother non astringent beer. I add it at mashout. Steep for 20min in this one. Doing 10min for BIPAS. and when just for a color i add it just before I start to sparge. Have a look at my other dark beer videos and I talk about it more than in this video. Theres also the BIPA mini series playlist on my channel where I bring up this topic a lot. Try it and let me know how it works for you.
Nice video! Just wondering, why did you add the dark malt in separately to the base malt mash? Does this make any difference?
From what I remember, it pulls less tannins from the heavier roasted malts, gives a cleaner profile. I've had good results without adding late, but I'm going to try it next brew.
Dark malts have little to no effect on fermentation. So, adding them later makes no difference except to flavor and color.
As already answered here. It makes the beer smoth without the astringency and needs no time to condition.
Thanks for that everyone. I may try this in a stout at some point. Cheers!
Have you any experience when fat has been a head killer?
Nope, but the foam dies rather quick that's why I make extract now and for coffee a cold brew, you won't have too much harshness with a cold brew and if the coffee is light to medium roasted is even better. African coffee tends to be a bit harsher than the south american one. Cheers!
Yes adding cold brew in this one would have been better.
I used peanut butter in my imperialstout.
That retention was so poor . .
Maybe pb has so many fat. .:(
At what time in the mash did you add the dark malts?
Cheers
Added them at mashout for stouts I do 20min step before sparging.
@@DrHansBrewery hy Doctor, why do you add Dark malt at mashout, 20 min step before sparging and not at the beguining of the mash?
@@jacquael Its because it makes the beer smother and with no astringency and harshness. No need to condition the beer for a long time and so on. I usually do 20min if its astout or porter. 10min for BIPA. If I just want the color I add it at sparging. The roasted malt dont need any mashing just steeping is needed. As the conversion is already over in the roasting step of the malting. Cold brew is another method you could try. But this method is so simple and works so great so this is my main method. Please do try it end leave me a note on how it worked out for you. I bet you will love the result. Cheers and sorry for the long answer :D
@@DrHansBrewery thanks a lot for you answer! i plan to do a stout this weekend so i will do as you said. i would like to add chocolate flavor but no cacao butter. I am thinking of adding Van houten powder 5 min boil or flame out what do you think? i will also try to add cold brewed coffe in secondary.
@@jacquael I would ad it at flame out. Hope the beer turns out great!
Love your videos...but the Oriole in me hates that f'n hat. Cheers!
Hahaha thanks buddy for still watching. Cheers!
@@DrHansBrewery As long as you don't start wearing a Steelers hat, we're good. GO ORIOLES!
@@mrdespizeme You're safe, never heard of them!
@@DrHansBrewery it's an American football team. I'm from Baltimore, the Baltimore Orioles are rivals of the Yankees. The Baltimore Ravens(football) are rivals of the Steelers.