John Shannon On Trading Rielly Instead Of Marner, Tavares' Decline, & What To Do In The Crease
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- Опубликовано: 8 сен 2024
- The long-time NHL broadcasted joined Nick Alberga & guest co-host Matt Larkin.
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Take what Shannon says with a grain of salt, he once said kadri would never play in the league, too small lol
Yeah and John Gibson as our #1 LMAO .....I almost fell out of my chair...
He may not be the best at evaluating athlete talent but no one in the country is as knowledgeable about how sports institutions (leagues/media) work than he does based on his decades of experience at Sportsnet and the NHL head offices. That's where his value comes in.
And he wins the cup
agree
Shannon is entitled to be wrong every once in a while. Kadri is good but he thinks he's in the elite category which is laughable.
Morgan Rielly doesn’t deserve a $7.5 M AAV salary because he’s not a top pairing defenseman.
Agreed, we need a Zadorov type Dman, big, mean, can be mobile WITHOUT defensive lapses, which Reilly isn't capable of fulfilling any of these things.
@@Ottotherepoman1Dumbest take I've ever heard LMAO. Zadorov had one decent playoffs, and has been a bottom pairing guy his entire career
He absolutely is a top pairing d-man. He just doesn't ever have the right partner.
@Ottotherepoman1 Are you stupid??? Reilly is among the league leaders in points by defenseman. He skates better than most and can carry the puck up ice. He's never been a defensive defenseman, but he's always good, and he is a leader. Overpaid, yes. But he's a player you want. I agree Zadorov would be great, and he could be paired with Rielly. Together, they would be deadly.
@@user-ut4cv7cc2z I'd say both statements are true. He's a 2-3 on a contender.
Did he compare Skinner to the elite goaltenders remaining? That was a tough take
What a joke of an idea, Skinner is gonna save us LOL.
The moment he said Gibson I knew he had no clue what the fuck was going on
Gibby has been on the ducks dude for 5+ years they have been absolute dumpster fire ....gibby on a good team he will be a workhorse man , get them to eat half the salary thats a steal and pray to the goalie gods mr glass man himself aka joe woll can stay healthy as a back up
Hey, Hey, the glass man’s in town!
@@jlove8445 😂
What Toronto should have done was to move the leafs to Utah and bring in the Arizona franchise.
I don't care if Marner wins 10 cups with another team. Changes have to come!!! Like 3 years ago!!
Right On! Does anybody have any confidence that Marner is going to win a cup here???? Its irrelevant what he wins somewhere else.
Wont happen. They will run it back and old Berube is gonna teach them the correct way to play 😂😂😂
he's done here
So who replaces Marner’s career +110?
Unfortunately I am going to have to agree with you.
The trouble with upgrading the Buds are all these NMC’s Dubas handed out.The Gm can ask a player to waive his NMC and that player can veto that or submit a limited no trade list which limits the return the Buds can get.Big changes will not occur for at least another season,
This is the first honest assessment of the "Def" I have heard. Morgan Rielly should be traded. Thanks John Shannon ,I agree with you.
Totally agree with trading Morgan, Riley
Marner Tavares Reilly all of them are going no where,,,,,,, their fear of failure through change is palpable
This guy is bonkers: they couldn’t score. Lol
John Gibson as our #1 LMAO .....I almost fell out of my chair...😝
What the hell is wrong with Gibson? You do know he's been stuck on a garbage Ducks team for years right? I can promise you right now John Gibson is a better goaltender than every other goalie the Leafs have had since Freddy Andersen.
I’d argue Gibson would blow Freddy out of the water especially when it comes to meaningful games. Guy has been a relatively elite goalie on a useless team for years
What are you talking about moving Reilly
Just look at his Career +/-
No D, No goalie, No grit. Leafs have a long way to fo.
And who are we going to replace 58 points of Rielly for less then 7.5M exactly?
Marner and Tavares have to waive and Shanahan has to be fired or TML will not win next year guaranteed!
Spot on
how many of those are secondary assist on the PP? Reilly is not a true number 1dman . the way he handles the puck is embarrassing
@@Gypsyalchemy333 exactly - he's awful. He is a D who wants to play like a forward, pinching all the time and he has absolutely no idea how to clear the net. All he does is poke check with the stick.
It will be a Shame to Lose Marner BUT we have NO other Choice fellas. Hes gonna go and Win a cup on another Team But We Just cant Afford it no more. Time to move one. Bye Bye Little Guy. We can do it without him ! Weve obviously Tried with him. It just don't Work.
I agree with his take 0 percent lol
1/20+ pp attempts seems like a pretty big issue lol
Mo isn't a true #1 but he also isn't the issue. Scoring has been. I agree on JT, though.
It appears Matthews, Marner, Tavares, Reilly and to a degree Nylander are not built for playoff hockey.
Amen ..
Reilly was great in the 2023 playoffs and Nylander, to my eye, has been pretty reliable. Tavares just isn't that guy anymore. I can't explain Matthews. I don't believe Marner is built for playoff hockey.
Blame Dubas and Shanahan. Geezus Dubas dumped Marchmant for Malgin ffs.
What a terrible take. Nylander is the only one out of that group that has shown up for nearly every damn series they have played and elevated his game in those situations. Playoffs Nylander goes into the corners a lot more, uses his body a lot more etc.
@@hairycotter …evidently you’ve missed the part where Marner’s got more points in the playoffs, even with Nylander being a Pro a year longer.
John Tavarres only worth 4 to 5 million on his next contract at best for 3 more years and Marner only 8 million if wants to stay as a leaf to allow Toronto on to last 4 round but the leafs defence was bad in the first round because of the problems on 5 on 5 to score against Boston and the health of Nylander, Mathews and Both goalies Samsonov and Woll in particular if he can stay healthy and last 4 rounds of gruelling hockey to hopefully win it so untill the Big 4 understand to round out 4 good lines were not going anywere from a leaf team perpective and I agree Morgan Reilly is not a top 4 defenceman because his worse asset is playing tough defence in the playoffs
Yes! Yes!
Trade Reilly 7.5!
Their defence isn't good enough, so they should trade their best defenceman. Brilliant plan.
Exactly. Scoring in the playoffs has been the issue, not the defence or (to a certain extent) goaltending.
@@MmmM-bl7ih it's all been a issue, but if defence is an issue you'd want to push Rielly down the depth chart
The Rielly contract is awful when he isn't putting up points offensively. Pushing Rielly down to middle pair is all well and good until you remember his cap hit is 7.5M. I wouldn't mind trading him to free up cap space.
for the right return, I would be fine seeing both of them go to be totally honest. Marner HAS to go though..
Marner goes so does Mathews 50 goal seasons
Trading Reilly makes no sense at all you gotta support him Anderson pesce montour
Saying Woll is not in the same league as Skinner is a bad take. Find someone who can share the net with Woll and allocate your resources towards a top pairing D and a second line center.
Nick, do your homework. The Leafs had a .500 or better record against the remaining 4 teams. 2-2 vs FLA, 2-1 vs NYR, 2-0 vs DAL and 1-1 vs Oilers. Shannon still showing his love for the Oilers, saying Skinner is an elite goalie shows you how much he knows about hockey.
John Shannon makes no sense. He thinks trading our best defence man to upgrade our defence is the best thing for the team?! I mean…really???
no he make sense. 1 it's cultural issue. 2. goaltending is a priority 1 prior to defense. your doing both but the goalie has to be prioritized because your not going anywhere without goaltending. This BS with Woll being number 1 is stupid.
Reilly is the worst #1 defenceman in the league
Who cares what Marner does with a new team? He did nothing for years in the playoffs here. Freeing up the cap space would be enough so they can get 2 good defensemen for the same money, maybe even 3 above average defensemen. Trading Rielly would be really stupid. Get him some help for the first time in years and see what happens with a decent defense and a Marnerless offence.
Anyone see what Jon Cooper said on this same show? Its fucking tough to get out of the atlantic
I think one of the major issues is not scoring more than two goals every playoff game..
Leafs need to improve their defence but "don't need four Simon Benoit" so the logic is to trade our best defenseman to improve the defense?
Lol ye i thought that was funny too if we had 4 benoits i bet we don't get scored on as much , reilly doesnt even put that much offense up for a guy making 7.5 pffff terrible contract
This is like listening to a guy at work who doesn't watch the games
Couldn’t agree more. Morgan Reilly gotta go.
Stop changing every year , let the team gel and get better together
2:22 How on earth does getting rid of your best defenceman make your defense better lol?? Sure... you can replace Rielly with a better defenseman, but the improvement to your defense would be minor. The Leafs need to out Marner's 11 mill into a decent goalie to tendem with Woll, and another top 4 defenceman TO PLAY WITH Rielly. Also... it's not like Rielly is taking up massive cap space anyway. What's he thinking?
I have been saying this for a couple years. Rielly has to go.
We haven’t scored more then three goals in how long in the playoffs? And apparently Reilly is a better option and saying are offence “could” be good enough… my guy sounds like the Toronto media himself😂
Instead of trading all your prospects and draft picks away develope them and sign some free agents. Leafs have left cupboard bare and keep getting into trouble drafting.
You people need to be realistic. Marner and Traverse are not going anywhere. They are selfish and will not waive their no movement clause. Worst case scenario is you let them walk on July1st 2025. You free up over 20 million in cap space. Go out and get a number 1 goalie and defenseman and better supporting cast. Knies and Minton will have another year of experience and Cowan will make the team. Repeat after me - Leafs have no cap space to make the team better for the 2024/25 season. Even if they make the playoffs and get into the second round big deal. They are not making it to the final round. Facts do not lie. Let the talking heads talk as they have to play it up and make a living.
finally a voice of reason: Rielly is the Achilles heel of the Leafs. Be gone, Morgan.
Defence is key obviously but when youth team can’t score in the playoffs there’s a deeper issue at play. When your top players clench their buttcheeks in playoff hockey it’s a bad sign.
When the Leafs were losing only one player was slamming stuff in disgust like McDavid and Crosby and the other Leaf stars just sat there and could care less.
D was good this year defensively. They couldn't score is the problem.
Why not develop a good core - then build around it?
It is this Core 4 that disappoints when it comes playoff times. 😀
It should've stayed the Core 3 and they did a bad job building around them.
@@wizzerwiser2056 I think all the Leafs Core 4 players are playoff disappointments. Matthews would likely be an elite playoff winger. In the playoffs Matthews disappoints & Domi is a much better playoff centre than Matthews. The Leafs Core 4 all remind me of PLD now in LA - with skills that at time promise but never deliver in the playoffs. 😀
Marner is NOT the problem!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This whole “ How many times are we going to run this back” comment is ridiculous. The whole plan was to keep adding to the core as the salary cap increased. We had a flat cap. They couldn’t add to the core. You need to look at the peripheral issues and understand that looking at the core four and not looking around them at other factors is a folly exercise. JT comes off the books after next season. That is $11mil freed up. The cap will rise about $10mil between this year and next. Add in JT’s $11mil and that is $21mil right there. Matthews, Marner, and Nylander raises combined with a team friendly JT contract ($4mil) eats up about $11mil of that. That gives them $10mil to spend. Then add the expiring Brodie, Domi, Bertuzzi, Samsonov, and Klingberg contracts, and you recapture another $21mil. So, between this year and next, keeping Marner and JT, they would have ~$31mil to spend. That is a far cry from the $12mil they had to spend last offseason.
They can only improve what Shannon said needs improving by dumping one of the core four
Vegas would be an ideal trading partner for Marner, they’re super aggressive and go for superstar talent every off season and have what the Leafs need in droves
I like Mo but i wouldn’t be opposed to moving him for a diff dman at all. He’s just not a #1 he can be a great #2-3 on a team but in no way is he a top dman. When it comes to playing DEFENCE he’s not even top 3 on the leafs D😭 His upside is being offensive but there’s just not enough there. i trust Jarnkrok, Marner and Kampf playing in their own ends than i do mo.
I love Reilly. He’s the only guy who shows heart.
No heart shown in last Round 1 against the Bruins.
@@WW3_Soon cope
Absolutely, lets get rid of Reilly its about time to let him go !
Marner lilejgren jarnkrok to Calgary for markstrom and Anderson
John Shannon is not even close to credible source. There hasn’t been anything I have ever heard him say that actually came true. He just likes to talk. 😊
Skinner has a 3.12 GAA/.885SV% in the playoffs
Let marner go do his figure skating on another team
He gets 100 points a season and this plays has 2 goals and like 3-4 assists lol
The blue & white in Toronto have always thought they were hot shit, right from Atom to the NHL.
John Shannon is tough on prospect players. Uff.
If people are shocked when Marner leaves and lights the world on fire they must be new to this team. How much pain can we endure? Try us...trade him
I don't care what you do with Rielly but Marner has to go regardless.
Leafs need a Marner trade with a team who has young D, forwards with upside and size. Bring up the young guys, Minten and Cowan. Take a step back and see what we have. Look at Dallas with their young guys doing well. Tavares takes less the following year and we can fill the holes defence goalie for a run. Samsonov resign for 2years for less money as he would be a good 1B. We also have Hildeby 6'7 who should get some NHL time before we run out and overpay for an older goalie. Wait till following year.
Why over think it, trade them both. What's the worst that can happen, these guys aren't getting it done as it is.
Enough with the D and goalie are the issue.... they lost because they couldn't score. Same reason they lost last year. PP was embarrassing. Marner was a no show. look at the teams remaining. they aren't winning 1-0 games every 2nd game. you need to score when it counts and they Leafs haven't the last 3 yrs.
It's funny seeing people in these comments try and take shots at Shannon claiming he has no idea what he's talking about. Yes, a multi-decade sports analyst, has no idea what he's talking about, but you do.
JFC....... when will the stupidity end?
I have been saying all along to trade Rielly and not Marner. The Leafs need a defenseman like Rosi or Makar. Then let Tavares contract expire next season and use the money for D and G.
Tavares bottom 6 forward!!! Hahahahahahahahaha. Wonder how these guys stay in the covering hockey game??
It makes at least 3 years I cry that Rieilly should go, too much expansive for what he brings. And don't forget who was on the ice for the play of the year for the leafs
Moronto media wants to chase Marner and his career +110 out of town but can’t get enough of Reilly and his “Career” -9?
Shannon saying that everywhere is where the Leafs need to improve shows the stupidity. I agree that they are not there yet but our goaltending was equal to or better than Oilers and the Leafs would beat Oilers in a playoff round. Dallas and Florida would be tough but we matched up good against the Rangers. Why not put us in the West and see what happens. They need some new faces and work from the net to the D and get a few grinders. Sad thing is if they kept Hyman and Marchment we would be more "there" than we are now.
Marner must go
..25 million for Mathews and Marner..recipe for disaster..Berube in and Shanahan out helps..
No one in the country is as knowledgeable about how sports institutions (leagues/media) work than John Shannon does based on his decades of experience at Sportsnet and the NHL head offices. That's where his value comes in.
Ok John.
Rielly and Marner must go. People are just afraid of change. This group is good but to win, you need to be great. Change needs to occur.
Who takes Marner’s spot feeding Mathews for his trophy wins? Mathews has 360+ career goals and Marner’s assisted on 330 of them.
It starts with the fans. Stop supporting mediocrity. That will change the culture over night.
Except for Mathews, everybody should be on the block. There is so much mediocrity on this team.Dubais assembled a bunch of skaters, not hockey players,
Yoreally believe this organization will go out get the players they need,not with the overpaid players they have,how can you,the leafs will always be a team that is good in regular season and playoffs will crumble,they don’t have those kind of players,in your face grinding it out shift after shift,play any type of game you want to play,play for the crest on front not name on back,when I see this then I will start believing,until that we are informed the same old same old my opinion
I strongly think Reilly isn’t the issue on the defence. I feel he’s been put in over his head, he’s not a number one BUT he’s definitely a number two.
Honestly if Marner would waive his no trade clause I’d call Vegas and see if I can pry Theodore from them in a package. A defence led by Theodore, Reilly, McCabe, Benoit and Webber is a really solid unit.
As for goaltending, I agree with John Shannon when he says call Anaheim about John Gibson. If we’ve learnt anything you can’t judge a player who plays there by their numbers. Anaheim is a MESS defensively! Put an average defence infront him and watch him shine. Those would be my two BIG off season moves, Theodore and Gibson.
I just don't get that logic at all ... we have gaping holes on defence and we're going to get rid of our best d-man? The one guy of the "core 5" who is actually on a sensible contract??? SO ... we'll have the same old same old up front, but a weaker d-corp? I like John Shannon, but that makes absolutely no sense to me.
Right now Reilly is our fourth best dman. Check the plus minus, he doesn't produce on offence anymore, and he is now too slow and mistake prone to be an offensive dman. Benoit is on the way up, and should be groomed as new number 1.
@@Ottotherepoman1 You need to check the +/- . Last year Lyubushkin led with a +4 and Reilly was second at +2. Benoit? He came in a -3. McCabe? 0.
Don't get me wrong ... I like Benoit in the bottom pairing. As for him being a #1, have you ever seen Quinn Hughes, or VIctor Hedman, Cal Makar, or Miro Heikanen? If you have, you'll know why Benoit will never be a #1.
By the way, using +/- to assess D-men is a problem. Erik Karlsson won a Norris in 2022-23 with a -26.
how sad is it that our #1 D-man is someone who can't shoot and can't defend? reilly should be nowhere our PP, as nobody is afraid of his lacking point shot. and don't get me started on his "defence."
he has been here since the boston collapse and hasn't gotten any better. so i would try to trade him (and our robotic captain) first before marner.
This guys a clown... we need forwards who arent soft as butter and actually forecheck..
Marner will never succeed in Toronto. He will do what Kessel did . The pressure from the Toronto media has destroyed how many ?
John Shannon has no idea what he's talking about. You need to trade Marner, it's pretty simple.
The Leafs have no master plan strategy at all regarding spending the cap and optimizing the talent. They overpay to make good headlines and have the fans feel good. 4 guys making over 10 million leaves not enough to make a leagues best bottom 6. For forwards, a master plan would dictate a budget for the top 3, the second line, the third line and the fourth line. I'm a dummy to buy 4 Porches. I'll end out with shitty pick up trucks and SUV's. I won't have the money.
given the fact that Shannon knows so much he should be manager/ coach of the Leafs Why not head of operations
I've been saying for weeks Reilly is the guy I would trade. Also, I don't think Leafs should resign Domi. He just isn't a first liner and not big enough to be a third line center. Or Bertuzzi. Make better use of that 8.5 mil those guys make. If they trade MM, then after next year only big offense guys will be AM and WN. That's not enough. They need MM and his 90 to 100 points. This year if he hadn't got hurt he might have led the Leafs in points. Certainly would have had more points than WN.
Those guy is an idiot.We are lacking on defence so he wants to trade our best defender with a reasonable cap hit. After i heard this guy give his opinion, i had to turn this off…horrible proposal. Rielly needs help not to get traded
I'm supposed to trust a guy who thinks Skinner is a great goalie? Seriously?????
I've been saying this for some time now, Trading Rielly for 1 or 2 proper d-men will only make this team stronger. Rielly is not the guy you're gonna win with as your #1
Not anywhere close. lol. Pure emotions based. It's almost fashionable to say 'we're not a good team. nowhere close. way off' etc. It's like wanting to play the far end of the cynical spectrum because it makes you look more 'critical' and more 'objective' than your average fan. It's so played. Yeah not, close. Split the season series with the Panthers. Let's not forget the Panthers barely eked into the playoffs last year and went all of the way. Anyone can win these days. Relax. And yeah, losing in 7 games with game 7 going to OT against a team higher in the standings than you ... what a letdown. What a shocker. Technically there was nothing wrong with losing this playoffs. The real brutal losses were vs Montreal a few years ago and Boston in 2013. Everything else is fairly normal. Aside from that, yeah look in Marner's eyes, Matthews eyes ... these guys have no passion nor fight. Never in scrums. Never angry. Never passionate but 60 goal scorers are incredibly rare so Matthews stays obviously but Marner is overrated. Shop him.
If you put Rielly on waivers not a single team would pick him up with that contract.
Marner has too go and Morgan Reilly. Free up the cap space and get stuff that will work in playoffs. Take c off Tavaras and put him on 3rd line
Morgan Reilly is not a good defence man. He has the hands and speed to be a forward….move him to forward and add some stay at home good first pass D men….make some personnel changes in net and up front as in moving players out….just my opinion. To be honest with or without Marner….this team and NO team will win without consistent goaltending.
TRADE REILLY & TRADE MARNER THESE ARE THE TWO WHO NEED TO BE TRADED !
Bunch of nobodies giving their useless opinions. We will wait for the leafs to make official news
Rielly was soooooo far out of position on that final shoot in goal that he made it look like it was Marner's man!!!
Montour is better than Rielly and cheaper. Rielly is slow, does not win puck battles in the corners and is the weak spot on the power play.
Agreed. I'd rather see 44 go than Marner. Yall are drunk lol.
Toss them both and Brodie too..
Him talking about JT the thing is was we were right there and in a lot of ways we're the better team in that series we didn't have our top players in every single game Not to mention shaky goal tending And they should have won that series then we would have had all our players healthy for the next round the thing that pisses me off is there are way too many analysts in Toronto and they'll have their opinion and think they are bang on with that opinion but that Opinion would swing wildly in any direction had they won that series And these guys would be praising the leafs And the worst analyst group is editor in leaf I can't stand hearing the bullshit they have to say they write shit just so people will get pissed off and They make it so you have to be a member in order to comment And the problem is it's basically click bait they write shit that will piss people off just so they have to follow this page in order to give them their 2 cents on the matter And some of the leaf's biggest problems are way too many sports analysts with their opinion And it does carry to the team. These guys opinion will literally do a U-turn if the leafs win a game or lose a game they never keep the same energy When they speak of the leafs who can live under that kind of microscope it's bullshit.