Church history and the Bible show us that God, by the Spirit, has guided His Church and guided individuals. Unfortunately, church history and the Bible also show us that the Body of Christ and individuals can be involved in heresy and error.
I often point out to my Protestant friends that God, being a good Father, would not let us figure out on our own what is true doctrine. Thank God for the gift of the Church, "the pillar and bulwark of the truth" (1 Timothy 3:15)
See 2 Tim. 3:16. We are to judge all things by scripture. So if a Pope or group of bishops says I must venerate holy images as they did at Nicaea II then I am not bound to obey them and violate God's word. This is not private interpretation. It's acknowledging that 2 Tim. 3:16 has meaning and is true.
@@jcalvin4796 No, it do not work in this way. If 1) Bible is word of God 2) God promised that Church will teach truth of his word, then proving that 3) Church contradicts bible, lead to “God contradicted himself, Christianity if false” It is same situation, as if you would prove doctrinal contradiction in bible itself. If you want to refute teaching of Church, you have to refute arguments for God’s promise that Church will always teach truth, otherwise by bashing Church you are bashing God.
How do you know that? Perhaps, seeking to build us up in virtue and wisdom, He expects us to train our faculties in determining truth though using reason. If we get it wrong, His grace is more than sufficient and will judge us accordingly (John 9:41).
@@danielboone8256 Of course at the end it is personal rational decision to move to any conclusion. And salvation of one who was not fully informed and God forgiving him for that is possible. But it is very impotant to understand that there can not be debate about Bible vs Church. At first there needs to be debate: Did God promised that his Church will always preach full truth? If yes, debate Bible contradicts Church is same as debate Bible contradicts Bible. If no, catholicism is already defeated.
If we take Charles' mantra of, "I want to know what Jesus commands" and apply it to Papal infallibility, then I fail to see how the dilemma isn't also mirrored in Roman Catholicism. Because wanting to know Jesus’ commands would logically require knowing when the Pope has infallibly conveyed them. Otherwise, there is a likelihood that the Pope may be in error and what he says is not actually the command of Jesus. Not only this, but there is disagreement amongst Roman Catholics on when the Pope has spoken infallibly. So Charles has not escaped this dilemma, he only thinks he has which is just a placebo. Here are a few examples of Roman Catholics disagreeing about when the Pope has spoken infallibly. The following is taken from Roman Catholic scholar Dr John Joy's book, "Disputing Questions of Papal Infallibility". Here Joy surveys whether Pope John Paul 2 spoke infallibly in Evangelium Vitae. Look at how Roman Catholics (including Pope Benedict) disagree with each other on this question. These are 4 typical objections for thinking PJP2 did not speak infallibly: "Objection 1. It would seem that the pope does not speak infallibly in Evangelium Vitae (1995). For Cardinal Ratzinger is reported to have said: “Pope John Paul II considered making an infallible declaration against abortion and euthanasia in his latest encyclical Evangelium Vitae, but the idea was dropped because the teachings were considered ‘so evident’ in Christian faith and tradition.”[35] But if the pope did not intend to speak infallibly in Evangelium Vitae, then he did not speak infallibly. Objection 2. Furthermore, according to Bishop Anthony Bosco: “If the pope wanted to say something was infallible, he would have used the word.”[36] Objection 3. Furthermore, in order to speak infallibly, the pope must propose a doctrine of faith or morals as definitively to be held, as shown above. But this phrase is not used in the encyclical. Objection 4. Furthermore, encyclical letters are organs of the ordinary papal magisterium, which is not infallible, as shown above. But Evangelium Vitae is an encyclical letter." Now, ultimately Joy makes the case that EV was spoken infallibly, but the point is still the same: There is disagreement about this and Joy had to go about this by using his own fallible judgement, just like Protestants do. Heres another excerpt showing how Roman Catholics disagree on when the Pope speaks infallibly: "Whether the Essential Conditions for Speaking Ex Cathedra Are Rightly Enumerated as Three? Objection 1: It seems that the essential conditions for speaking ex cathedra are not rightly enumerated as three. For Cardinal John Henry Newman enumerates four conditions, saying: “He speaks ex cathedrâ, or infallibly, when he speaks, first, as the Universal Teacher; secondly, in the name and with the authority of the Apostles; thirdly, on a point of faith or morals; fourthly, with the purpose of binding every member of the Church to accept and believe his decision.”[3] Objection 2: Furthermore, Joseph Fenton enumerates five conditions, saying that the pope is infallible when: “A) He speaks in his capacity as the ruler and teacher of all Christians. B) He uses his supreme apostolic authority. C) The doctrine on which he is speaking has to do with faith or morals. D) He issues a certain and definitive judgment on that teaching. E) He wills that this definitive judgment be accepted as such by the universal Church.”[4] Objection 3: Furthermore, even if there are only three conditions given in the body of the definition of papal infallibility, we must add another condition, which is that the pope must be faithfully interpreting divine revelation and not inventing any new doctrine. For the First Vatican Council teaches that “the Holy Spirit was promised to the successors of Peter not so that they might, by his revelation, make known some new doctrine, but that, by his assistance, they might religiously guard and faithfully expound the revelation or deposit of faith transmitted by the apostles.”[5] And again, the Second Vatican Council also teaches that, “when either the Roman Pontiff or the body of bishops together with him defines a judgment, they pronounce it in accordance with revelation itself, which all are obliged to abide by and be in conformity with.”[6] And again: “The Roman Pontiff and the bishops, in view of their office and the importance of the matter, by fitting means diligently strive to inquire properly into that revelation and to give apt expression to its contents; but a new public revelation they do not accept as pertaining to the divine deposit of faith.”[7]"
I occasionally went to the Methodist church with my paternal grandmother. After she passed, no church. My parents were nones. I met my husband and converted in ‘94. Thanks be to God
I’ve thoroughly enjoyed your channel. It has been extremely helpful! God bless you sir! Me and my family are currently in OCIA and looking forward to becoming Catholic next Easter vigil after growing up southern Baptist for 40 years. I can’t deny the truth about the church and the richness of everything. The Catholic Church is truly the church that belongs to our King!
If we take Charles' mantra of, "I want to know what Jesus commands" and apply it to Papal infallibility, then I fail to see how the dilemma isn't also mirrored in Roman Catholicism. Because wanting to know Jesus’ commands would logically require knowing when the Pope has infallibly conveyed them. Otherwise, there is a likelihood that the Pope may be in error and what he says is not actually the command of Jesus. Not only this, but there is disagreement amongst Roman Catholics on when the Pope has spoken infallibly. So Charles has not escaped this dilemma, he only thinks he has which is just a placebo. Here are a few examples of Roman Catholics disagreeing about when the Pope has spoken infallibly. The following is taken from Roman Catholic scholar Dr John Joy's book, "Disputing Questions of Papal Infallibility". Here Joy surveys whether Pope John Paul 2 spoke infallibly in Evangelium Vitae. Look at how Roman Catholics (including Pope Benedict) disagree with each other on this question. These are 4 typical objections for thinking PJP2 did not speak infallibly: "Objection 1. It would seem that the pope does not speak infallibly in Evangelium Vitae (1995). For Cardinal Ratzinger is reported to have said: “Pope John Paul II considered making an infallible declaration against abortion and euthanasia in his latest encyclical Evangelium Vitae, but the idea was dropped because the teachings were considered ‘so evident’ in Christian faith and tradition.”[35] But if the pope did not intend to speak infallibly in Evangelium Vitae, then he did not speak infallibly. Objection 2. Furthermore, according to Bishop Anthony Bosco: “If the pope wanted to say something was infallible, he would have used the word.”[36] Objection 3. Furthermore, in order to speak infallibly, the pope must propose a doctrine of faith or morals as definitively to be held, as shown above. But this phrase is not used in the encyclical. Objection 4. Furthermore, encyclical letters are organs of the ordinary papal magisterium, which is not infallible, as shown above. But Evangelium Vitae is an encyclical letter." Now, ultimately Joy makes the case that EV was spoken infallibly, but the point is still the same: There is disagreement about this and Joy had to go about this by using his own fallible judgement, just like Protestants do. Heres another excerpt showing how Roman Catholics disagree on when the Pope speaks infallibly: "Whether the Essential Conditions for Speaking Ex Cathedra Are Rightly Enumerated as Three? Objection 1: It seems that the essential conditions for speaking ex cathedra are not rightly enumerated as three. For Cardinal John Henry Newman enumerates four conditions, saying: “He speaks ex cathedrâ, or infallibly, when he speaks, first, as the Universal Teacher; secondly, in the name and with the authority of the Apostles; thirdly, on a point of faith or morals; fourthly, with the purpose of binding every member of the Church to accept and believe his decision.”[3] Objection 2: Furthermore, Joseph Fenton enumerates five conditions, saying that the pope is infallible when: “A) He speaks in his capacity as the ruler and teacher of all Christians. B) He uses his supreme apostolic authority. C) The doctrine on which he is speaking has to do with faith or morals. D) He issues a certain and definitive judgment on that teaching. E) He wills that this definitive judgment be accepted as such by the universal Church.”[4] Objection 3: Furthermore, even if there are only three conditions given in the body of the definition of papal infallibility, we must add another condition, which is that the pope must be faithfully interpreting divine revelation and not inventing any new doctrine. For the First Vatican Council teaches that “the Holy Spirit was promised to the successors of Peter not so that they might, by his revelation, make known some new doctrine, but that, by his assistance, they might religiously guard and faithfully expound the revelation or deposit of faith transmitted by the apostles.”[5] And again, the Second Vatican Council also teaches that, “when either the Roman Pontiff or the body of bishops together with him defines a judgment, they pronounce it in accordance with revelation itself, which all are obliged to abide by and be in conformity with.”[6] And again: “The Roman Pontiff and the bishops, in view of their office and the importance of the matter, by fitting means diligently strive to inquire properly into that revelation and to give apt expression to its contents; but a new public revelation they do not accept as pertaining to the divine deposit of faith.”[7]"
Been following Joshua on FB for some years now. If it’s one thing he doesn’t do, it’s getting weighed down in the ideological tug-of-war match that’s going on within the Church. I can say with reasonable certainty that when this platform takes off, unlike some other Catholic influencers that shall remain nameless, Joshua will continue to not get distracted with the current ecclesiastical politics of the day.
I came to the Church on a near-identical road as Mr. Charles, except that my "crisis" so-to-speak was whether or not I stuck with the progressive LGBTQ Protestantism I embraced and lived out, lost my faith almost entirely, or became Catholic. Here I am.
Thank you for your work and witness. Revert here because of the converts like Scott Hahn, Steve Ray and many others and now you! May you be an instrument for the eventual unity. And yes… like William Buckley!
The issue of authority had also been one of my dilemmas as a protestant (Lutheran now Catholic, 2022). It wasn't my main contention by any means, but I did think it seemed strange seeing non-denom churches pop up out of no where with someone who "maybe" has a theology certificate. I know the Holy Spirit is able to do good things with these churches and people - I've seen at least exteriorly the fruits of some - however they are not getting to experience the Full Richness of the Christian faith. That is sad.
Such a good and clear talk - thank you. Marcus Grodi said the same thing, one of the observations that led him to the Catholic Church - As a Protestant minister leading Bible studies, there would be opposing opinions and conclusions. He realized that everyone cannot be right. There has to be an Authority to declare which is the correct conclusion. The Catholic Church was the only organization that offered the unequivocal authority.
You are very thought provoking, I could leave 20 comments. Much appreciated, I think we disagree on probably many things but probably just slightly. I think I'll listen to more, thanks for your heart and dedication to Jesus.
Thank you for your witness and work to develop yourself to the fullest potential for God. “Be who God ment you to be, and you will set the world on fire” -St. Catherine of Siena
A crucial question posed and I believe answered correctly! Thank you. Just wondering which Bible version the passages presented come from? God bless you Joshua.
To be honest, the first time I saw this in my RUclips feed, I thought it was a from protestant channel. Then I found out it was Joshua Charles' channel. I do recommend keeping the background. It is kinda like Brian Holdsworth's background for his videos.
Hey Joshua, I've started seeking out your talks and appearances on various channels and really enjoy your approach to these questions our lost little bros in Protestantism. Also, and it may be my ADHD, but I find the circles filling to the side slightly distracting. I was constantly looking at them and found it took away from the substantive talk you were giving. Again, it might just be me. Great stuff.
Thank you for the kind words! I’m sorry it’s distracting. It’s meant to help people follow along, and so far the vast majority have told me they found it helpful. So my apologies! But I really do appreciate you listening. Please pray for us.
That was my realization also. The question was “What is Truth?” All you have is your best guess my best OPINION. If I want to get to a destination I need an accurate map. So all a Protestant could say is well truth is nice but not really necessary because we just have to believe Jesus died and rose and voila. You’re in.
This is going to be a huge channel. Came here after passively following you on X. Michael Knowles gave you a shout out a few months ago..which is how I found you on X in the first place
Hi Joshua. As a questioning non-Catholic, may I ask is that a rosary you are wearing? Do you wear it all the time? I only ask because a Catholic told me that it is not "right" to wear them, but I wouldn't know. Thanks for the informative video. I think I am slowly approaching the Catholic church with an open mind and an open heart.
Thank you very much. Yes, it’s a Rosary I’ve had since 2018. I got it from the company, Rugged Rosaries. Never heard from a single Catholic they shouldn’t be worn. I see them worn quite a bit. I wear it everywhere I go.
@@joshuatcharles That's really interesting, thank you. I already use an "Anglican rosary" and find them very meditative and it allows me to focus my mind on the Lord. Thank you for your prayers. I follow you on twitter and your website and articles have helped me immensely. Much like you yourself were in your journey, I feel a little afraid of what the truth may mean for me if I accept the position of the Catholic Church!
@@joshuatcharlesA certain generation (much older; say of your age during the 60’s) didn’t like outward signs of devotion and filled our heads with lots of don’ts. Don’t veil. Don’t worry about what you wear. Don’t worry about a scapular. Don’t wear a Rosary. Don’t kneel in Church. Don’t take Communion on the tongue. Don’t wear clericals. Don’t wear a habit. Praised be to the Lord, that we are witnessing a return to seeing outward signs that prompt us to be better.
@@joshuatcharles in St Louis De Montfort's book, Secret of the Rosary, he actually talks about the benefit of wearing the rosary. It is actually a protection against Satan/demons.
Fantastic start, Joshua! So excited to see where you take this whole multi-faceted project. I’m several years behind you (tho much older 😊) and have had a different route but experiencing a similar process.
If a doctrine isn’t in the pages of the New Testament it is man made. You will not find the sinlessness of Mary, the Papacy, or prayers to saints in the NT. - it really is this simple.
I used to believe the same thing. But what the Church Fathers taught me is Scripture is far deeper than I realized, and the teachings on Our Lady, the papacy, etc. are not only there, but all over the place. I just had to learn how to read the Bible like Jesus and the Apostles. Once I actually listened to what the Catholic Church had to say, I realized it had far more biblical and deep answers than any protestant sect.
@@joshuatcharles I used to be Catholic so I understand the comfort of the magisterium. The richness tactile aspects of the Mass and the images. The smells and antiquity of the culture-Justification by faith alone and the word of God surpasses all of it.
@@jcalvin4796I hope you’re well and thanks for chiming in….im curious, did you happen to see the debates between James White and Trent Horn and/or James White and Jimmy Akin? If so, what did you think and as a Catholic to Protestant convert, what part of the P argument resonates for you? If you haven’t seen them, highly commend them to you. Jimmy and Trent were great and I thought it was one of James’ better performances.
This is the same dilemma that I had that brought me to the Catholic Church. I came to the realization that there has to be a central authority to resolve disputes. There are many ways scripture can be interpreted that are all logical and make sense yet are completely contradictory. I read a scripture that says "For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace". This passage is about speaking in tongues but it reveals a truth about God. The teaching of Sola Scripture causes confusion and conflict, therefore it cannot be from God.
Another important point is that if you are discerning to be a Christian, and all you have is the Bible to know what is expected of you and the church into which you are thinking of entering, how are these teachings meant to be clear, when you are still an unbelieving sinner? It really doesn't make much sense and sounds completely impractical. In fact, it sounds like a 20th century approach, where paper Bibles are everywhere, rather than the preceding millennia (or two) when faith was preached, not self-taught... Our Lord left us a Church as He didn't want to leave us orphans, a mother to teach, nurture and lead us.
@@BensWorkshopIt's my understanding that the mainl reason, in the early 1800's, the 7 books were removed from the canon that had been in place so the 300's because the Bible societies (who were distributing free Bibles around the world ) would save a ton of money
@@goldie862 Sort of. Luther kept them in after the reformation and quoted them till 1522 when he lost an argument from them, he then said they were not inspired but still potentially useful. That would technically put them out of the cannon but still in the book.
@@BensWorkshop The situation is the very definition of circular reasoning, in that protestants defer to a Sola scriptura that had been canonized over 1000 years prior and changed (BY MEN OF COURSE). Sola scriptura would require that THE BIBLE ITSELF would have to have said that those books needed to be removed (from itself 🤦♂️) PS - thank you for the additional details that I forgot. GBY 🙏 ✝️ ❤️
So how is one saved? From what is one saved? How would you answer those questions? I listened to this but I’m not finding your connection between the baptism and salvation. So glad I happened upon this from Liz Wheeler’s recommendation!
Also, I know a few Catholics who don’t agree with all the Catholic teachings. Are they not Catholic? How about the bishops who vocally differ on whether they should give certain politicians Eucharist because of their views on abortion, etc? There is definitely disagreement in the Catholic faith as well.
Bellaerme's quote bemoaning Luther's departure from the Catholic Church and creating the atmosphere of division contradicts that Vinny guy in 434 who was already citing all the heretics departing from the faith requiring a need for an (unscriptural) centralization of authority.
Much more important than the biblical example of resolving disputes was their answer (which you omit) ... "We should not make it difficult for those who are turning to God."
@@renjithjoseph7135 What is the "correct process" for salvation? Is it the same way the Ethiopian eunuch was saved, or Zacchaeus, or the thief on the cross, or?
Among the various "Catholic" churches to which Paul wrote his Epistles and which Jesus addressed in the Book of Revelation, it could also be said that one might not recognize the Gospel or a unified teaching in their communities.
The examples of Timothy and Titus are likely more decisive than Acts 15 Jerusalem council because they are truly authoritative successors of the apostles, showing the continuation of the apostles authority. Missed opportunity here: "Declare these things; exhort and *reprove/correct with all authority.* Let no one disregard you." Titus 2:15
“In essentials, unity; in non-essentials, liberty; in all things, charity" the holy spirit is not schizophrenic. I love that comment. It reminds me of the phrase that Jesus was either a liar, a lunatic or Lord. There is attainable Truth from God and his Church!
@@jcalvin4796- Show me in the catechism of the Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church where it says “belief in Mary’s aimlessness is essential for salvation.” Take your time….ill wait. No rush, really.
@@ragnardanneskajold1880 To be a communing member of the RCC you have to affirm the teachings of the RCC which includes veneration of images and the sinlessness of Mary. Neither of these ideas are present in the New Testament and are doctrinal developments.
“The Holy Spirit told me” always felt squirmy. I didn’t like it, and I knew why, but I couldn’t make myself stand up and challenge someone in whom I had faith and trust. Bottom line, I kind of believed whomever I was hearing at the time. Yeah, squirmy.
Meh. Never heard of this guy before, but he looks familiar. Stellar job on the podcast. Going in with a structure makes you look like a nerd, but it's setting you up for long-term success. 😎👍🏻
When I hear people say “better than some Catholics” I believe that they came across young (under 25) Catholics still (hopefully) maturing in their faith. How dare their theology not be perfect. Hypocritical no? It would be similar to me saying at my age 30’s. Saying every time I came across a Protestant in my youth and in college they treated their faith like “feelings” and Jesus was a hippie. In my 30’s , every time I across a Catholic they all know their faith incredibly well . Their apologetics are spot on, BUT as Catholics we don’t run around looking for debates. 😅
I trust that the main things in scripture are the plain things…and believing and following these unify us spiritually as one body across the hundreds of different “denominations”(Catholic Orthodox Protestant etc). God knows whom are truly his own within and across the denominations. Also the dilemma is not entirely solved by just submitting that the Catholic authority is The Authority …for example why does the Catholic authority have more authority than say the Eastern Orthodox Church written doctrines. I think we just have to live with some uncertainty on some of the doctrines pointed out in the videos until we meet in heaven and know for sure…and some with get to say “I told you so” in a loving lighthearted manner 😊. Like on infant baptism…for me the believers baptism is so clearly the right doctrine. It’s one thing to dedicate a baby to the Lord and commit to raise them in the faith but it’s the believers baptism Jesus was telling his disciples to go out and do…not infant baptism. But I could be wrong on this and you can tell me I told you so in heaven…or vice versa. Thanks.
Hi Tony, I'm Catholic. Your good hearted attempt at ecumenism does not make sense when you take a dispassionate view of the whole situation, parts of which you've unintentionally left out. If you say "main things = plain things", then the Triune Godhead is not a "main thing" because it is not a "plain thing". How many thousands of people have fought and died over disgareements on the reality of the Godhead over the centuries? Why do you therefore, only limit your example to Catholics, Orthodox, and Protestants? Arius, the figure from the mid 200s to early 300s AD, was someone who was closer in time to the Apostles, and the early Church, and one who could claim Apostolic Succession, having been a Bishop of Alexandria, one of the 5 Sees of Church, BEFORE the major schisms with the Oriental and Eastern Orthodox. Arius could claim the Holy Spirit is guiding him just the same as the Holy Spirit is guiding you. He could exegete his view from Scripture that Jesus was *created by the Father,* although he would say, "before time". This is precisely what modern Arians-with-a-twist, like JWs do. Under your framework then, do you believe Jesus is going to exclude anyone at all? If you insist historical Arians and JWs will be excluded OR included, on what authority are you making that determination?
It's not just commandments of Christ in terms of rules to follow with do's and don'ts, it's the teachings of Christ. Christ taught for instance, that doing the will of the Father means believing in the Son. Our trust that Jesus is the King who will rule the world, the one God anointed who is worthy of our loyalty, love, obedience, honor, and trust ... this is how we obey. It is not that we love God, but that God loved us, and gave the Son for our sins. I John 4: 9 This is how God showed his love among us: He sent his one and only Son into the world that we might live through him. 10 This is love: not that we loved God, but that he loved us and sent his Son as an atoning sacrifice for our sins. 11 Dear friends, since God so loved us, we also ought to love one another.
Can someone approve the catholic practices which lead to the reformation? I have hard time to approve those bad practices, though I’m not saying that catholics are not part of the church. We need to look at history in all aspects, and I think eventually we can approve some things, and we can’t others. Reformation happened because of the bad practices of the catholic faith, and not because of the good doctrines found in it. If we look at all aspects, then we might understand the reformers. That is my dilemma. I would add to this also that we should not ignore the earlier schisms of the church, as those also have their own reasoning, and hunger of power was also in play at that time. Apostle Paul said by the Holy Ghost that among the brothers will arise those who will cause these schisms. Without persecution during the centuries we would not have the Martyrs mentioned in the book of revelation. Everything written it was and will be fulfilled, it is not just a possibility or a possible outcome. It will be fulfilled. Hope that I will not be misunderstood. God bless all the true believers.
I think the most powerful example of salvation in the Bible is the theif on the cross. He was saved because he believed in his heart and confessed that belief with his mouth, in that he asked Jesus to remember him when He came into His kingdom, demonstrating that belief. I think there is actually a dichotomy going unacknowledged: salvation vs christian living a.k.a. obedience to God. Salvation comes and then you wish to show you love God by living by Jesus' example.
In great love for you my brother, I ask you to consider the following. Did Jesus tell the Apostles to Baptise whole nations of thousands/millions of people or to hang them on a cross and beg Jesus for salvation? The use of exceptional one off cases, like the thief on the cross as the normal rule is one of the most illogical approaches to exegeting scripture. The extraordinary case of the thief on the cross is the basis for understanding how observable human behaviour like death bed conversions by deeply hardened sinners who are facing imminent death occurs. This is NOT the normal/ordinary means by which Salvation occurs.
You still have to use your fallible faculties to determine whether your Church is true. You can’t get around the fact that you will never have certainty.
Polite suggestion.... the moving text at the bottom of the screen is distracting and unnecessary. It takes away from listening to Joshua who has a lot of valuable things to say and one wishes to concentrate on that.
Let's not read Jesus backwards. It's that if one loves him, we will hold to his teachings. It's not that if we keep his teachings, we will know that we love him. Love for God in the three persons is not something we conjure up through will power and following rules, as Saul the Apostle found out in his conversion. Love for God comes from the new birth, when God circumcises our hearts. Many people think that obedience in the flesh equates to love for God, while God is saying all along that in the flesh nobody can please God. But intellectually reading Jesus backwards is a mistake of the mind; it does not say anything about the love for God either way.
Different interpretations of various scriptures abound even among Catholic scholars and clerics. You can't just decide to go with "the Catholic interpretation" of a passage, because oftentimes there is no one clear Catholic interpretation of a passage, or of some sense of a passage.
If Jesus commissioned the Apostles to teach to others all that he commanded the Apostles, then that includes the command for others to go and do and teach the same things that the apostles did and taught. Apostles make more apostles, just as disciples of Jesus go and make more disciples. In the Catholic church there seems to be the idea that only the clergy can go and teach what the apostles did and taught, and even that in way inferior to the Apostles, unless one happens to be the Pope. In Jesus' teaching, however, all who follow Christ are under the same commission as the Apostles, to continue teaching others to do all that Jesus taught the Apostles. All disciples are therefore commanded to baptize and receive divine assistance, because that is one of the things that Jesus commanded the Apostles, and that is what the Apostles then teach other followers of Jesus to likewise go and do.
We believe that Church as whole can not err, so there is kind of divine assistance for all believers. Hovewer if you look at Church at most of history, you will see that it as whole did not operated under “just be with Jesus, and Catholic Church do not matter”
You take too many detours in making your points. I relate well to your approach to your faith, as you explain it. Are you conducting a university-style lecture, or are you communicating with the general population. I am very highly educated, but the structure of your presentations are more suited to a university lecture. I think that style will limit the number of Patrons that you attract. My wife would never have the patience to listen to you. I am a very busy person. I need to have people get to the point more quickly than you do. I now have listened to Episode #1 twice. You can be sure that I am intellectually satisfied. Just passing on my thoughts.
Obviously, Protestantism is wrong, Calvinism specifically, for if "works don't save," what do you do with obedience to God's commandments? Why obey His commandments at all? Truth is, works do save. It's just that the works the Bible says that do not save are the ones where WE can work our own salvation. It is as if God has spanned the great gulf between us and Him in His Son, Jesus Christ, but it still requires US to "work" to cross over.
Our lady? Stop worshipping her and stop elevating her beyond what scriptures do... It's dangerous, because it flirts with idolatry.. You're encouraging Mary idolators to continue idolizing her... If the worship of angels leads to Hell (Col 2:18 disqualified from the race), the worship of Mary leads to the same result... STOP IT.
It’s hard to listen to someone who gets on his little Pedestal Calling us non-Catholics ignorant uneducated and are twisting the scriptures. That’s exactly what I take from you from your quotation of Peter. And I would challenge you to only use scripture and not one single word from someone in the past. You won’t do that because you don’t know the scriptures
If we take Charles' mantra of, "I want to know what Jesus commands" and apply it to Papal infallibility, then I fail to see how the dilemma isn't also mirrored in Roman Catholicism. Because wanting to know Jesus’ commands would logically require *knowing* when the Pope has infallibly *conveyed* them. Otherwise, there is a likelihood that the Pope may be in error and what he says is not actually the command of Jesus. Not only this, but there is *disagreement* amongst Roman Catholics on when the Pope has spoken infallibly. So Charles has not escaped this dilemma, he only thinks he has which is just a placebo. Here are a few examples of Roman Catholics *disagreeing* about when the Pope has spoken infallibly. The following is taken from Roman Catholic scholar Dr John Joy's book, "Disputing Questions of Papal Infallibility". Here Joy surveys whether Pope John Paul 2 spoke infallibly in Evangelium Vitae. Look at how Roman Catholics (including Pope Benedict) disagree with each other on this question. These are 4 typical objections for thinking PJP2 did not speak infallibly: "Objection 1. It would seem that the pope does not speak infallibly in Evangelium Vitae (1995). For Cardinal Ratzinger is reported to have said: “Pope John Paul II considered making an infallible declaration against abortion and euthanasia in his latest encyclical Evangelium Vitae, but the idea was dropped because the teachings were considered ‘so evident’ in Christian faith and tradition.”[35] But if the pope did not intend to speak infallibly in Evangelium Vitae, then he did not speak infallibly. Objection 2. Furthermore, according to Bishop Anthony Bosco: “If the pope wanted to say something was infallible, he would have used the word.”[36] Objection 3. Furthermore, in order to speak infallibly, the pope must propose a doctrine of faith or morals as definitively to be held, as shown above. But this phrase is not used in the encyclical. Objection 4. Furthermore, encyclical letters are organs of the ordinary papal magisterium, which is not infallible, as shown above. But Evangelium Vitae is an encyclical letter." Now, ultimately Joy makes the case that EV was spoken infallibly, but the point is still the same: There is *disagreement* about this and Joy had to go about this by using his own *fallible* judgement, just like Protestants do. Heres another excerpt showing how Roman Catholics *disagree* on when the Pope speaks infallibly: "Whether the Essential Conditions for Speaking Ex Cathedra Are Rightly Enumerated as Three? Objection 1: It seems that the essential conditions for speaking ex cathedra are not rightly enumerated as three. For Cardinal John Henry Newman enumerates four conditions, saying: “He speaks ex cathedrâ, or infallibly, when he speaks, first, as the Universal Teacher; secondly, in the name and with the authority of the Apostles; thirdly, on a point of faith or morals; fourthly, with the purpose of binding every member of the Church to accept and believe his decision.”[3] Objection 2: Furthermore, Joseph Fenton enumerates five conditions, saying that the pope is infallible when: “A) He speaks in his capacity as the ruler and teacher of all Christians. B) He uses his supreme apostolic authority. C) The doctrine on which he is speaking has to do with faith or morals. D) He issues a certain and definitive judgment on that teaching. E) He wills that this definitive judgment be accepted as such by the universal Church.”[4] Objection 3: Furthermore, even if there are only three conditions given in the body of the definition of papal infallibility, we must add another condition, which is that the pope must be faithfully interpreting divine revelation and not inventing any new doctrine. For the First Vatican Council teaches that “the Holy Spirit was promised to the successors of Peter not so that they might, by his revelation, make known some new doctrine, but that, by his assistance, they might religiously guard and faithfully expound the revelation or deposit of faith transmitted by the apostles.”[5] And again, the Second Vatican Council also teaches that, “when either the Roman Pontiff or the body of bishops together with him defines a judgment, they pronounce it in accordance with revelation itself, which all are obliged to abide by and be in conformity with.”[6] And again: “The Roman Pontiff and the bishops, in view of their office and the importance of the matter, by fitting means diligently strive to inquire properly into that revelation and to give apt expression to its contents; but a new public revelation they do not accept as pertaining to the divine deposit of faith.”[7]"
You are deeply confused in thinking that "wanting to know jesus' commands would logically require knowing when the pope has infallibly conveyed them". That assertion is obviously false. You might reasonably replace that with the statement 'wanting to know jesus' commands would logically require WANTING TO KNOW when the pope has infallibly conveyed them". But from this, there is no real difficulty or contradiction. Of course all Catholics will want this - but failing to perfectly achieve it is only expected, since we remain imperfect creatures. You are clearly intelligent. You should really try to understand the way St. Thomas Aquinas approaches these matters instead of merely aping his style.
Your dilemma is one of authority. If scripture is the final authority then we must appeal to scripture. The RC magisterium doesn’t give definitive interpretations on every line of scripture. It’s a system of progressive dogma over centuries. As much as you would like a rock solid interpretation of every verse of scripture the RCC doesn’t provide this.
I nowhere said or implied I needed or was looking for “a rock solid interpretation of every verse of Scripture.” If you misrepresent what is said, it’s pretty easy to tear it down. You have simply assumed your own worldview is true, and concluded according to your own premises. But your premises are the very thing in dispute. Millions of people claiming the same “authority” as you come up with entirely different things. That’s a problem. We see that nowhere in Scripture, and it contradicts the very notion for truth as an absolute thing. Christ either commanded something, or He didn’t.
@@joshuatcharles Yes I respectfully understand and am not trying to strawman you which is hard in the YT comments, but the reformation wasn’t attempting to start a new church. It’s congruous with the church Christ established. It was to correct errors which accumulated through centuries. For example, the infallibility of the pope or sinlessness of Mary is nowhere to be found in the new testament so to require it as essential would be an error. This wasn’t official RC doctrine until the time of the American Civil war at Vatican I. Not all things are equally clear in Scripture, but the essentials are which all Protestants agree upon. (Not all non-Catholics are Protestants -Mormons for example aren’t Protestants) There is also variance in beliefs of RC believers in many areas, but they agree on essential biblical doctrine and have unity. -the church of Christ is united in Christ and by faith in Him.
Thank you for the expression of respect, which I take at face value. I accept your intention is sincere. However, I’m not here to debate with you the entire “reformation.” And sincerity does not undo the fact that your statement has many errors, and unpacking all your presuppositions (which you assume, but don’t argue for) won’t be done via RUclips comments. Truly, it does not seem like you even listened to what was in the video, which means engaging in a drawn out debate would be even more foolhardy on my part. For example, the idea that all protestants agree in “essentials” is not just absurd, but laughably so. I address that somewhat, and you haven’t responded to anything that was said. This episode was not about apologetics for the Catholic position. It was explaining how the protestant position is unsustainable, and how I experienced that in the lead up to my own conversion. You have provided no answer to any of it, and I think good faith people who read your comments will see that.
@@joshuatcharles yes the historical facts of the development of the papacy is there for anyone who wants to research it. I just wanted to at least assert that there is no unsolvable dilemma of Protestantism. Unless you are coming to scripture with the presuppositions that lead you there. I grew up in the RCC and my reading of scripture and church history couldn’t allow me to continue in it. I would love to talk to you or any RC at length, but the information of history and scripture is accessible for anyone who wants to see it without my YT comments. -also, I appreciate your standing for what you believe, we need more of this sort of conversation and not less.
Laura, I did not grow up Catholic. I had no Catholic presuppositions that led me to this. So again, your statement is false. You continue to state your conclusion, but provide no arguments for any of it. I am reading the documents of the ancient Church Fathers everyday. The evidence of the papacy is everywhere. Your comments have already shown that you don’t understand the very thing you reference. For example, papal infallibility was asserted and affirmed by ecumenical councils of the Church long before Vatican I. I hope you come back Home to the Church one day. Again, thank you for your final comments.
Nice work, brother. You have great things in store with this.
“It’s very strange to claim the Holy Spirit can’t guide the Catholic Church but it CAN guide individuals.”
Amen.
Real.
Church history and the Bible show us that God, by the Spirit, has guided His Church and guided individuals. Unfortunately, church history and the Bible also show us that the Body of Christ and individuals can be involved in heresy and error.
why? our elationship to God is as individuals, not churches.
@@daveperk yes and reformed Protestants agree with you
I often point out to my Protestant friends that God, being a good Father, would not let us figure out on our own what is true doctrine. Thank God for the gift of the Church, "the pillar and bulwark of the truth" (1 Timothy 3:15)
See 2 Tim. 3:16. We are to judge all things by scripture. So if a Pope or group of bishops says I must venerate holy images as they did at Nicaea II then I am not bound to obey them and violate God's word. This is not private interpretation. It's acknowledging that 2 Tim. 3:16 has meaning and is true.
@@jcalvin4796 No, it do not work in this way. If 1) Bible is word of God 2) God promised that Church will teach truth of his word, then proving that 3) Church contradicts bible, lead to “God contradicted himself, Christianity if false” It is same situation, as if you would prove doctrinal contradiction in bible itself.
If you want to refute teaching of Church, you have to refute arguments for God’s promise that Church will always teach truth, otherwise by bashing Church you are bashing God.
How do you know that? Perhaps, seeking to build us up in virtue and wisdom, He expects us to train our faculties in determining truth though using reason. If we get it wrong, His grace is more than sufficient and will judge us accordingly (John 9:41).
@@danielboone8256 Of course at the end it is personal rational decision to move to any conclusion. And salvation of one who was not fully informed and God forgiving him for that is possible.
But it is very impotant to understand that there can not be debate about Bible vs Church. At first there needs to be debate: Did God promised that his Church will always preach full truth? If yes, debate Bible contradicts Church is same as debate Bible contradicts Bible. If no, catholicism is already defeated.
very nice. as a methodist looking to convert, this is helping the process.
Welcome. I grew up Methodist and have been a Catholic since 2008. You'll never regret it!
If we take Charles' mantra of, "I want to know what Jesus commands" and apply it to Papal infallibility, then I fail to see how the dilemma isn't also mirrored in Roman Catholicism. Because wanting to know Jesus’ commands would logically require knowing when the Pope has infallibly conveyed them. Otherwise, there is a likelihood that the Pope may be in error and what he says is not actually the command of Jesus. Not only this, but there is disagreement amongst Roman Catholics on when the Pope has spoken infallibly. So Charles has not escaped this dilemma, he only thinks he has which is just a placebo.
Here are a few examples of Roman Catholics disagreeing about when the Pope has spoken infallibly. The following is taken from Roman Catholic scholar Dr John Joy's book, "Disputing Questions of Papal Infallibility". Here Joy surveys whether Pope John Paul 2 spoke infallibly in Evangelium Vitae. Look at how Roman Catholics (including Pope Benedict) disagree with each other on this question. These are 4 typical objections for thinking PJP2 did not speak infallibly:
"Objection 1. It would seem that the pope does not speak infallibly in Evangelium Vitae (1995). For Cardinal Ratzinger is reported to have said: “Pope John Paul II considered making an infallible declaration against abortion and euthanasia in his latest encyclical Evangelium Vitae, but the idea was dropped because the teachings were considered ‘so evident’ in Christian faith and tradition.”[35] But if the pope did not intend to speak infallibly in Evangelium Vitae, then he did not speak infallibly.
Objection 2. Furthermore, according to Bishop Anthony Bosco: “If the pope wanted to say something was infallible, he would have used the word.”[36]
Objection 3. Furthermore, in order to speak infallibly, the pope must propose a doctrine of faith or morals as definitively to be held, as shown above. But this phrase is not used in the encyclical.
Objection 4. Furthermore, encyclical letters are organs of the ordinary papal magisterium, which is not infallible, as shown above. But Evangelium Vitae is an encyclical letter."
Now, ultimately Joy makes the case that EV was spoken infallibly, but the point is still the same: There is disagreement about this and Joy had to go about this by using his own fallible judgement, just like Protestants do.
Heres another excerpt showing how Roman Catholics disagree on when the Pope speaks infallibly:
"Whether the Essential Conditions for Speaking Ex Cathedra Are Rightly Enumerated as Three?
Objection 1: It seems that the essential conditions for speaking ex cathedra are not rightly enumerated as three. For Cardinal John Henry Newman enumerates four conditions, saying: “He speaks ex cathedrâ, or infallibly, when he speaks, first, as the Universal Teacher; secondly, in the name and with the authority of the Apostles; thirdly, on a point of faith or morals; fourthly, with the purpose of binding every member of the Church to accept and believe his decision.”[3]
Objection 2: Furthermore, Joseph Fenton enumerates five conditions, saying that the pope is infallible when: “A) He speaks in his capacity as the ruler and teacher of all Christians. B) He uses his supreme apostolic authority. C) The doctrine on which he is speaking has to do with faith or morals. D) He issues a certain and definitive judgment on that teaching. E) He wills that this definitive judgment be accepted as such by the universal Church.”[4]
Objection 3: Furthermore, even if there are only three conditions given in the body of the definition of papal infallibility, we must add another condition, which is that the pope must be faithfully interpreting divine revelation and not inventing any new doctrine. For the First Vatican Council teaches that “the Holy Spirit was promised to the successors of Peter not so that they might, by his revelation, make known some new doctrine, but that, by his assistance, they might religiously guard and faithfully expound the revelation or deposit of faith transmitted by the apostles.”[5] And again, the Second Vatican Council also teaches that, “when either the Roman Pontiff or the body of bishops together with him defines a judgment, they pronounce it in accordance with revelation itself, which all are obliged to abide by and be in conformity with.”[6] And again: “The Roman Pontiff and the bishops, in view of their office and the importance of the matter, by fitting means diligently strive to inquire properly into that revelation and to give apt expression to its contents; but a new public revelation they do not accept as pertaining to the divine deposit of faith.”[7]"
I occasionally went to the Methodist church with my paternal grandmother. After she passed, no church. My parents were nones. I met my husband and converted in ‘94. Thanks be to God
@@theosophicalwanderings7696 If it isn't clear that the Pope is speaking infallibly, then he is not speaking infallibly.
@@BensWorkshop Roman Catholics disagree as to when this is clear. So...
I’ve thoroughly enjoyed your channel. It has been extremely helpful! God bless you sir!
Me and my family are currently in OCIA and looking forward to becoming Catholic next Easter vigil after growing up southern Baptist for 40 years. I can’t deny the truth about the church and the richness of everything. The Catholic Church is truly the church that belongs to our King!
Great video! As a Protestant who has grown very interested in Catholicism these past few months, I'm excited for the next videos.
If we take Charles' mantra of, "I want to know what Jesus commands" and apply it to Papal infallibility, then I fail to see how the dilemma isn't also mirrored in Roman Catholicism. Because wanting to know Jesus’ commands would logically require knowing when the Pope has infallibly conveyed them. Otherwise, there is a likelihood that the Pope may be in error and what he says is not actually the command of Jesus. Not only this, but there is disagreement amongst Roman Catholics on when the Pope has spoken infallibly. So Charles has not escaped this dilemma, he only thinks he has which is just a placebo.
Here are a few examples of Roman Catholics disagreeing about when the Pope has spoken infallibly. The following is taken from Roman Catholic scholar Dr John Joy's book, "Disputing Questions of Papal Infallibility". Here Joy surveys whether Pope John Paul 2 spoke infallibly in Evangelium Vitae. Look at how Roman Catholics (including Pope Benedict) disagree with each other on this question. These are 4 typical objections for thinking PJP2 did not speak infallibly:
"Objection 1. It would seem that the pope does not speak infallibly in Evangelium Vitae (1995). For Cardinal Ratzinger is reported to have said: “Pope John Paul II considered making an infallible declaration against abortion and euthanasia in his latest encyclical Evangelium Vitae, but the idea was dropped because the teachings were considered ‘so evident’ in Christian faith and tradition.”[35] But if the pope did not intend to speak infallibly in Evangelium Vitae, then he did not speak infallibly.
Objection 2. Furthermore, according to Bishop Anthony Bosco: “If the pope wanted to say something was infallible, he would have used the word.”[36]
Objection 3. Furthermore, in order to speak infallibly, the pope must propose a doctrine of faith or morals as definitively to be held, as shown above. But this phrase is not used in the encyclical.
Objection 4. Furthermore, encyclical letters are organs of the ordinary papal magisterium, which is not infallible, as shown above. But Evangelium Vitae is an encyclical letter."
Now, ultimately Joy makes the case that EV was spoken infallibly, but the point is still the same: There is disagreement about this and Joy had to go about this by using his own fallible judgement, just like Protestants do.
Heres another excerpt showing how Roman Catholics disagree on when the Pope speaks infallibly:
"Whether the Essential Conditions for Speaking Ex Cathedra Are Rightly Enumerated as Three?
Objection 1: It seems that the essential conditions for speaking ex cathedra are not rightly enumerated as three. For Cardinal John Henry Newman enumerates four conditions, saying: “He speaks ex cathedrâ, or infallibly, when he speaks, first, as the Universal Teacher; secondly, in the name and with the authority of the Apostles; thirdly, on a point of faith or morals; fourthly, with the purpose of binding every member of the Church to accept and believe his decision.”[3]
Objection 2: Furthermore, Joseph Fenton enumerates five conditions, saying that the pope is infallible when: “A) He speaks in his capacity as the ruler and teacher of all Christians. B) He uses his supreme apostolic authority. C) The doctrine on which he is speaking has to do with faith or morals. D) He issues a certain and definitive judgment on that teaching. E) He wills that this definitive judgment be accepted as such by the universal Church.”[4]
Objection 3: Furthermore, even if there are only three conditions given in the body of the definition of papal infallibility, we must add another condition, which is that the pope must be faithfully interpreting divine revelation and not inventing any new doctrine. For the First Vatican Council teaches that “the Holy Spirit was promised to the successors of Peter not so that they might, by his revelation, make known some new doctrine, but that, by his assistance, they might religiously guard and faithfully expound the revelation or deposit of faith transmitted by the apostles.”[5] And again, the Second Vatican Council also teaches that, “when either the Roman Pontiff or the body of bishops together with him defines a judgment, they pronounce it in accordance with revelation itself, which all are obliged to abide by and be in conformity with.”[6] And again: “The Roman Pontiff and the bishops, in view of their office and the importance of the matter, by fitting means diligently strive to inquire properly into that revelation and to give apt expression to its contents; but a new public revelation they do not accept as pertaining to the divine deposit of faith.”[7]"
How has it gone in the last 3 months for you?
Thanks for this channel, Joshua. Your content has been very helpful in my process of coming into the Church. I’ll be confirmed this Sunday.
Praise God! Welcome Home!
Congratulations
Praise the Lord!!❤🙏🏻Welcome Home!
Excited for this. I’ve grown so weary with the vitriolic infighting with Catholicism. I’m happy to be on a channel that is not going down that route.
Well said. This is fresh breath of air.
Been following Joshua on FB for some years now. If it’s one thing he doesn’t do, it’s getting weighed down in the ideological tug-of-war match that’s going on within the Church.
I can say with reasonable certainty that when this platform takes off, unlike some other Catholic influencers that shall remain nameless, Joshua will continue to not get distracted with the current ecclesiastical politics of the day.
I came to the Church on a near-identical road as Mr. Charles, except that my "crisis" so-to-speak was whether or not I stuck with the progressive LGBTQ Protestantism I embraced and lived out, lost my faith almost entirely, or became Catholic. Here I am.
Praise God. Stay close to God through His church and it's Sacraments.
I love how organized your video is. Don't stop making videos! God bless you!!
Dr. David Anders is a fountain of knowledge and truly a blessing. He has helped me on my journey more than I can count.
And he knows 10,000 $100 words :).
Thank you for your work and witness. Revert here because of the converts like Scott Hahn, Steve Ray and many others and now you! May you be an instrument for the eventual unity. And yes… like William Buckley!
The issue of authority had also been one of my dilemmas as a protestant (Lutheran now Catholic, 2022). It wasn't my main contention by any means, but I did think it seemed strange seeing non-denom churches pop up out of no where with someone who "maybe" has a theology certificate. I know the Holy Spirit is able to do good things with these churches and people - I've seen at least exteriorly the fruits of some - however they are not getting to experience the Full Richness of the Christian faith. That is sad.
Such a good and clear talk - thank you.
Marcus Grodi said the same thing, one of the observations that led him to the Catholic Church - As a Protestant minister leading Bible studies, there would be opposing opinions and conclusions. He realized that everyone cannot be right. There has to be an Authority to declare which is the correct conclusion. The Catholic Church was the only organization that offered the unequivocal authority.
You are very thought provoking, I could leave 20 comments. Much appreciated, I think we disagree on probably many things but probably just slightly. I think I'll listen to more, thanks for your heart and dedication to Jesus.
Thank you for your witness and work to develop yourself to the fullest potential for God.
“Be who God ment you to be, and you will set the world on fire” -St. Catherine of Siena
Can’t wait for ep 2! Hope it’s coming soon
Fantastic content so far, I can't wait to see more to come!
A crucial question posed and I believe answered correctly! Thank you.
Just wondering which Bible version the passages presented come from?
God bless you Joshua.
RSVCE.
Excellent premier episode. I look forward to see what else you produce. God Bless!
This was so good, Joshua! ❤️❤️❤️
This was fantastic. Thank you for your honesty.
Really enjoyed the show looking forward to seeing the next one
To be honest, the first time I saw this in my RUclips feed, I thought it was a from protestant channel. Then I found out it was Joshua Charles' channel. I do recommend keeping the background. It is kinda like Brian Holdsworth's background for his videos.
Hey Joshua,
I've started seeking out your talks and appearances on various channels and really enjoy your approach to these questions our lost little bros in Protestantism.
Also, and it may be my ADHD, but I find the circles filling to the side slightly distracting. I was constantly looking at them and found it took away from the substantive talk you were giving. Again, it might just be me.
Great stuff.
Thank you for the kind words! I’m sorry it’s distracting. It’s meant to help people follow along, and so far the vast majority have told me they found it helpful. So my apologies!
But I really do appreciate you listening. Please pray for us.
That was my realization also. The question was “What is Truth?” All you have is your best guess my best OPINION. If I want to get to a destination I need an accurate map. So all a Protestant could say is well truth is nice but not really necessary because we just have to believe Jesus died and rose and voila. You’re in.
So much here. Loved it! ❤️💙
Outstanding
Looking forward to listening to this.
Wonderful work so far, guys. I hope you make an episode about the Pope because that's the only thing stopping me from becoming a Catholic.
Strangely, having a singular earthly authority is the only way to make the buck stop. The very thing Protestants lack. 🙏🙏🙏
Great work, definitely subbing
Keep up the good work.
Subscribed on RUclips and following on X
Prayers for you 🙏🏻
This is going to be a huge channel. Came here after passively following you on X. Michael Knowles gave you a shout out a few months ago..which is how I found you on X in the first place
Really excellent. Keep up this great work.
This is good!
Congrats , Great to see you on your own RUclips now, Thank you .
Hi Joshua. As a questioning non-Catholic, may I ask is that a rosary you are wearing? Do you wear it all the time? I only ask because a Catholic told me that it is not "right" to wear them, but I wouldn't know. Thanks for the informative video. I think I am slowly approaching the Catholic church with an open mind and an open heart.
Thank you very much. Yes, it’s a Rosary I’ve had since 2018. I got it from the company, Rugged Rosaries.
Never heard from a single Catholic they shouldn’t be worn. I see them worn quite a bit. I wear it everywhere I go.
Also, I’ll be praying for you. I know being open minded about this can be very difficult. I commend you for it.
@@joshuatcharles That's really interesting, thank you. I already use an "Anglican rosary" and find them very meditative and it allows me to focus my mind on the Lord. Thank you for your prayers. I follow you on twitter and your website and articles have helped me immensely. Much like you yourself were in your journey, I feel a little afraid of what the truth may mean for me if I accept the position of the Catholic Church!
@@joshuatcharlesA certain generation (much older; say of your age during the 60’s) didn’t like outward signs of devotion and filled our heads with lots of don’ts.
Don’t veil.
Don’t worry about what you wear.
Don’t worry about a scapular.
Don’t wear a Rosary.
Don’t kneel in Church.
Don’t take Communion on the tongue.
Don’t wear clericals.
Don’t wear a habit.
Praised be to the Lord, that we are witnessing a return to seeing outward signs that prompt us to be better.
@@joshuatcharles in St Louis De Montfort's book, Secret of the Rosary, he actually talks about the benefit of wearing the rosary. It is actually a protection against Satan/demons.
Been really enjoying this series. Thank you.
Fantastic start, Joshua! So excited to see where you take this whole multi-faceted project.
I’m several years behind you (tho much older 😊) and have had a different route but experiencing a similar process.
Thank you and your team for all your great work.
This was great. I look forward to future videos
Superb closing verse and musical score and video
This is such excellent content. Thank you.
This is greatness. Great job friend.
Thank you Joshua. Very informative. Also you do pose some good ways of looking at things. In order to love Jesus we must know what he commanded.
As a former Catholic now Protestant but looking deeper into my beliefs and trying to discern what is true, this dilemma is very real.
If a doctrine isn’t in the pages of the New Testament it is man made. You will not find the sinlessness of Mary, the Papacy, or prayers to saints in the NT. - it really is this simple.
I used to believe the same thing. But what the Church Fathers taught me is Scripture is far deeper than I realized, and the teachings on Our Lady, the papacy, etc. are not only there, but all over the place. I just had to learn how to read the Bible like Jesus and the Apostles.
Once I actually listened to what the Catholic Church had to say, I realized it had far more biblical and deep answers than any protestant sect.
@@joshuatcharles I used to be Catholic so I understand the comfort of the magisterium. The richness tactile aspects of the Mass and the images. The smells and antiquity of the culture-Justification by faith alone and the word of God surpasses all of it.
@@jcalvin4796I hope you’re well and thanks for chiming in….im curious, did you happen to see the debates between James White and Trent Horn and/or James White and Jimmy Akin? If so, what did you think and as a Catholic to Protestant convert, what part of the P argument resonates for you?
If you haven’t seen them, highly commend them to you. Jimmy and Trent were great and I thought it was one of James’ better performances.
@@jcalvin4796 - not very convincing calvin….
Great video!
Excellent
This is the same dilemma that I had that brought me to the Catholic Church. I came to the realization that there has to be a central authority to resolve disputes. There are many ways scripture can be interpreted that are all logical and make sense yet are completely contradictory.
I read a scripture that says "For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace". This passage is about speaking in tongues but it reveals a truth about God. The teaching of Sola Scripture causes confusion and conflict, therefore it cannot be from God.
Another important point is that if you are discerning to be a Christian, and all you have is the Bible to know what is expected of you and the church into which you are thinking of entering, how are these teachings meant to be clear, when you are still an unbelieving sinner? It really doesn't make much sense and sounds completely impractical. In fact, it sounds like a 20th century approach, where paper Bibles are everywhere, rather than the preceding millennia (or two) when faith was preached, not self-taught... Our Lord left us a Church as He didn't want to leave us orphans, a mother to teach, nurture and lead us.
Yes. People being able to read in numbers is a new thing. Also being able to buy a book. Pre printing press and paper a Bible was very very expensive.
Great points, both of you! 🙏😊✝️
@@BensWorkshopIt's my understanding that the mainl reason, in the early 1800's, the 7 books were removed from the canon that had been in place so the 300's because the Bible societies (who were distributing free Bibles around the world ) would save a ton of money
@@goldie862 Sort of. Luther kept them in after the reformation and quoted them till 1522 when he lost an argument from them, he then said they were not inspired but still potentially useful. That would technically put them out of the cannon but still in the book.
@@BensWorkshop The situation is the very definition of circular reasoning, in that protestants defer to a Sola scriptura that had been canonized over 1000 years prior and changed (BY MEN OF COURSE). Sola scriptura would require that THE BIBLE ITSELF would have to have said that those books needed to be removed (from itself 🤦♂️)
PS - thank you for the additional details that I forgot. GBY 🙏 ✝️ ❤️
So how is one saved? From what is one saved? How would you answer those questions? I listened to this but I’m not finding your connection between the baptism and salvation.
So glad I happened upon this from Liz Wheeler’s recommendation!
Who gained the authority after the original, biblical Church’s authority all died?
This was so interesting!! Thank you for sharing!
Also, I know a few Catholics who don’t agree with all the Catholic teachings. Are they not Catholic? How about the bishops who vocally differ on whether they should give certain politicians Eucharist because of their views on abortion, etc? There is definitely disagreement in the Catholic faith as well.
Thanks for your work ❤
Good stuff!
The main issue: Love! Amen, brother!
As a man going into the RUclips comments saying “As an”, I put forward this comment for your review.
Bellaerme's quote bemoaning Luther's departure from the Catholic Church and creating the atmosphere of division contradicts that Vinny guy in 434 who was already citing all the heretics departing from the faith requiring a need for an (unscriptural) centralization of authority.
❤ wonderful
Much more important than the biblical example of resolving disputes was their answer (which you omit) ... "We should not make it difficult for those who are turning to God."
So "believers" can ignore the correct process so that they can be lazy in what is correct belief?
@@renjithjoseph7135 What is the "correct process" for salvation? Is it the same way the Ethiopian eunuch was saved, or Zacchaeus, or the thief on the cross, or?
Thank you
Among the various "Catholic" churches to which Paul wrote his Epistles and which Jesus addressed in the Book of Revelation, it could also be said that one might not recognize the Gospel or a unified teaching in their communities.
Mr. Charles you are highly intellectual yet so plain spoken that even I can understand you. ❤️
45,000 Protestant denominations. Says it all
And they all claim they are led by the Holy Spirit.
@ I know. I agree. The holy spirit cannot contradict itself . One day they will all be Catholic
The examples of Timothy and Titus are likely more decisive than Acts 15 Jerusalem council because they are truly authoritative successors of the apostles, showing the continuation of the apostles authority. Missed opportunity here: "Declare these things; exhort and *reprove/correct with all authority.* Let no one disregard you." Titus 2:15
This will have its own entire episode, so I left it in reserve. ;)
“In essentials, unity; in non-essentials, liberty; in all things, charity" the holy spirit is not schizophrenic. I love that comment. It reminds me of the phrase that Jesus was either a liar, a lunatic or Lord.
There is attainable Truth from God and his Church!
Is the sinlessness of Mary an “essential”? The RCC says it is and it’s absent from the New Testament
@@jcalvin4796- Show me in the catechism of the Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church where it says “belief in Mary’s aimlessness is essential for salvation.” Take your time….ill wait. No rush, really.
@@ragnardanneskajold1880 To be a communing member of the RCC you have to affirm the teachings of the RCC which includes veneration of images and the sinlessness of Mary. Neither of these ideas are present in the New Testament and are doctrinal developments.
@@jcalvin4796 - that was not the question. Show me in the catechism where it says veneration of Mary is a requirement for salvation…..take your time
@@jcalvin4796 you mean develop like this:
ruclips.net/video/maj01k3l6Ss/видео.htmlsi=CY47kmJrryIKBkYy
Why no more videos ?
There will be more videos soon. We have been working behind the scenes on upcoming projects, so please be on the lookout for new updates!
“The Holy Spirit told me” always felt squirmy. I didn’t like it, and I knew why, but I couldn’t make myself stand up and challenge someone in whom I had faith and trust. Bottom line, I kind of believed whomever I was hearing at the time. Yeah, squirmy.
Is it better to say that we agree with non-biblical dogma of the Papacy? The Holy Spirit has given us the written word to test doctrine.
Meh. Never heard of this guy before, but he looks familiar. Stellar job on the podcast. Going in with a structure makes you look like a nerd, but it's setting you up for long-term success. 😎👍🏻
When I hear people say “better than some Catholics” I believe that they came across young (under 25) Catholics still (hopefully) maturing in their faith. How dare their theology not be perfect. Hypocritical no?
It would be similar to me saying at my age 30’s. Saying every time I came across a Protestant in my youth and in college they treated their faith like “feelings” and Jesus was a hippie.
In my 30’s , every time I across a Catholic they all know their faith incredibly well . Their apologetics are spot on, BUT as Catholics we don’t run around looking for debates. 😅
I would like to see the topics of reparation and redemptive suffering covered. These seem to be more like personal revelation than a doctrine.
Important question for you: do you embrace and uphold the anathemas declared by the governing bodies of the Roman Catholic Church?
YES…. What are His commandments? Concretize those and this is a much easier thing.
I trust that the main things in scripture are the plain things…and believing and following these unify us spiritually as one body across the hundreds of different “denominations”(Catholic Orthodox Protestant etc). God knows whom are truly his own within and across the denominations. Also the dilemma is not entirely solved by just submitting that the Catholic authority is The Authority …for example why does the Catholic authority have more authority than say the Eastern Orthodox Church written doctrines. I think we just have to live with some uncertainty on some of the doctrines pointed out in the videos until we meet in heaven and know for sure…and some with get to say “I told you so” in a loving lighthearted manner 😊. Like on infant baptism…for me the believers baptism is so clearly the right doctrine. It’s one thing to dedicate a baby to the Lord and commit to raise them in the faith but it’s the believers baptism Jesus was telling his disciples to go out and do…not infant baptism. But I could be wrong on this and you can tell me I told you so in heaven…or vice versa. Thanks.
Hi Tony, I'm Catholic. Your good hearted attempt at ecumenism does not make sense when you take a dispassionate view of the whole situation, parts of which you've unintentionally left out.
If you say "main things = plain things", then the Triune Godhead is not a "main thing" because it is not a "plain thing". How many thousands of people have fought and died over disgareements on the reality of the Godhead over the centuries?
Why do you therefore, only limit your example to Catholics, Orthodox, and Protestants?
Arius, the figure from the mid 200s to early 300s AD, was someone who was closer in time to the Apostles, and the early Church, and one who could claim Apostolic Succession, having been a Bishop of Alexandria, one of the 5 Sees of Church, BEFORE the major schisms with the Oriental and Eastern Orthodox.
Arius could claim the Holy Spirit is guiding him just the same as the Holy Spirit is guiding you. He could exegete his view from Scripture that Jesus was *created by the Father,* although he would say, "before time". This is precisely what modern Arians-with-a-twist, like JWs do.
Under your framework then, do you believe Jesus is going to exclude anyone at all? If you insist historical Arians and JWs will be excluded OR included, on what authority are you making that determination?
❤
“Psychology of Catholic Converts” is right again. Why is it so hard to acknowledge you will never have full certainty?
It's not just commandments of Christ in terms of rules to follow with do's and don'ts, it's the teachings of Christ. Christ taught for instance, that doing the will of the Father means believing in the Son. Our trust that Jesus is the King who will rule the world, the one God anointed who is worthy of our loyalty, love, obedience, honor, and trust ... this is how we obey. It is not that we love God, but that God loved us, and gave the Son for our sins. I John 4: 9 This is how God showed his love among us: He sent his one and only Son into the world that we might live through him. 10 This is love: not that we loved God, but that he loved us and sent his Son as an atoning sacrifice for our sins. 11 Dear friends, since God so loved us, we also ought to love one another.
Can someone approve the catholic practices which lead to the reformation? I have hard time to approve those bad practices, though I’m not saying that catholics are not part of the church. We need to look at history in all aspects, and I think eventually we can approve some things, and we can’t others. Reformation happened because of the bad practices of the catholic faith, and not because of the good doctrines found in it. If we look at all aspects, then we might understand the reformers. That is my dilemma. I would add to this also that we should not ignore the earlier schisms of the church, as those also have their own reasoning, and hunger of power was also in play at that time. Apostle Paul said by the Holy Ghost that among the brothers will arise those who will cause these schisms. Without persecution during the centuries we would not have the Martyrs mentioned in the book of revelation. Everything written it was and will be fulfilled, it is not just a possibility or a possible outcome. It will be fulfilled. Hope that I will not be misunderstood. God bless all the true believers.
I think the most powerful example of salvation in the Bible is the theif on the cross. He was saved because he believed in his heart and confessed that belief with his mouth, in that he asked Jesus to remember him when He came into His kingdom, demonstrating that belief. I think there is actually a dichotomy going unacknowledged: salvation vs christian living a.k.a. obedience to God. Salvation comes and then you wish to show you love God by living by Jesus' example.
In great love for you my brother, I ask you to consider the following.
Did Jesus tell the Apostles to Baptise whole nations of thousands/millions of people or to hang them on a cross and beg Jesus for salvation?
The use of exceptional one off cases, like the thief on the cross as the normal rule is one of the most illogical approaches to exegeting scripture.
The extraordinary case of the thief on the cross is the basis for understanding how observable human behaviour like death bed conversions by deeply hardened sinners who are facing imminent death occurs. This is NOT the normal/ordinary means by which Salvation occurs.
You still have to use your fallible faculties to determine whether your Church is true. You can’t get around the fact that you will never have certainty.
Polite suggestion.... the moving text at the bottom of the screen is distracting and unnecessary. It takes away from listening to Joshua who has a lot of valuable things to say and one wishes to concentrate on that.
Let's not read Jesus backwards. It's that if one loves him, we will hold to his teachings. It's not that if we keep his teachings, we will know that we love him. Love for God in the three persons is not something we conjure up through will power and following rules, as Saul the Apostle found out in his conversion. Love for God comes from the new birth, when God circumcises our hearts. Many people think that obedience in the flesh equates to love for God, while God is saying all along that in the flesh nobody can please God. But intellectually reading Jesus backwards is a mistake of the mind; it does not say anything about the love for God either way.
Different interpretations of various scriptures abound even among Catholic scholars and clerics. You can't just decide to go with "the Catholic interpretation" of a passage, because oftentimes there is no one clear Catholic interpretation of a passage, or of some sense of a passage.
If Jesus commissioned the Apostles to teach to others all that he commanded the Apostles, then that includes the command for others to go and do and teach the same things that the apostles did and taught. Apostles make more apostles, just as disciples of Jesus go and make more disciples. In the Catholic church there seems to be the idea that only the clergy can go and teach what the apostles did and taught, and even that in way inferior to the Apostles, unless one happens to be the Pope. In Jesus' teaching, however, all who follow Christ are under the same commission as the Apostles, to continue teaching others to do all that Jesus taught the Apostles. All disciples are therefore commanded to baptize and receive divine assistance, because that is one of the things that Jesus commanded the Apostles, and that is what the Apostles then teach other followers of Jesus to likewise go and do.
We believe that Church as whole can not err, so there is kind of divine assistance for all believers. Hovewer if you look at Church at most of history, you will see that it as whole did not operated under “just be with Jesus, and Catholic Church do not matter”
You take too many detours in making your points. I relate well to your approach to your faith, as you explain it. Are you conducting a university-style lecture, or are you communicating with the general population. I am very highly educated, but the structure of your presentations are more suited to a university lecture. I think that style will limit the number of Patrons that you attract. My wife would never have the patience to listen to you. I am a very busy person. I need to have people get to the point more quickly than you do. I now have listened to Episode #1 twice. You can be sure that I am intellectually satisfied. Just passing on my thoughts.
Obviously, Protestantism is wrong, Calvinism specifically, for if "works don't save," what do you do with obedience to God's commandments? Why obey His commandments at all? Truth is, works do save. It's just that the works the Bible says that do not save are the ones where WE can work our own salvation. It is as if God has spanned the great gulf between us and Him in His Son, Jesus Christ, but it still requires US to "work" to cross over.
7th and 10th commandments I think… 6th is the prohibition of murder.
More like the "Holy Confused Spirit" is guiding them
Our lady? Stop worshipping her and stop elevating her beyond what scriptures do... It's dangerous, because it flirts with idolatry.. You're encouraging Mary idolators to continue idolizing her... If the worship of angels leads to Hell (Col 2:18 disqualified from the race), the worship of Mary leads to the same result... STOP IT.
Does the Catholic church still ban the eating of blood and and strangled animals today?
It’s hard to listen to someone who gets on his little Pedestal Calling us non-Catholics ignorant uneducated and are twisting the scriptures. That’s exactly what I take from you from your quotation of Peter. And I would challenge you to only use scripture and not one single word from someone in the past. You won’t do that because you don’t know the scriptures
All will be catholic at some point soon
If we take Charles' mantra of, "I want to know what Jesus commands" and apply it to Papal infallibility, then I fail to see how the dilemma isn't also mirrored in Roman Catholicism. Because wanting to know Jesus’ commands would logically require *knowing* when the Pope has infallibly *conveyed* them. Otherwise, there is a likelihood that the Pope may be in error and what he says is not actually the command of Jesus. Not only this, but there is *disagreement* amongst Roman Catholics on when the Pope has spoken infallibly. So Charles has not escaped this dilemma, he only thinks he has which is just a placebo.
Here are a few examples of Roman Catholics *disagreeing* about when the Pope has spoken infallibly. The following is taken from Roman Catholic scholar Dr John Joy's book, "Disputing Questions of Papal Infallibility". Here Joy surveys whether Pope John Paul 2 spoke infallibly in Evangelium Vitae. Look at how Roman Catholics (including Pope Benedict) disagree with each other on this question. These are 4 typical objections for thinking PJP2 did not speak infallibly:
"Objection 1. It would seem that the pope does not speak infallibly in Evangelium Vitae (1995). For Cardinal Ratzinger is reported to have said: “Pope John Paul II considered making an infallible declaration against abortion and euthanasia in his latest encyclical Evangelium Vitae, but the idea was dropped because the teachings were considered ‘so evident’ in Christian faith and tradition.”[35] But if the pope did not intend to speak infallibly in Evangelium Vitae, then he did not speak infallibly.
Objection 2. Furthermore, according to Bishop Anthony Bosco: “If the pope wanted to say something was infallible, he would have used the word.”[36]
Objection 3. Furthermore, in order to speak infallibly, the pope must propose a doctrine of faith or morals as definitively to be held, as shown above. But this phrase is not used in the encyclical.
Objection 4. Furthermore, encyclical letters are organs of the ordinary papal magisterium, which is not infallible, as shown above. But Evangelium Vitae is an encyclical letter."
Now, ultimately Joy makes the case that EV was spoken infallibly, but the point is still the same: There is *disagreement* about this and Joy had to go about this by using his own *fallible* judgement, just like Protestants do.
Heres another excerpt showing how Roman Catholics *disagree* on when the Pope speaks infallibly:
"Whether the Essential Conditions for Speaking Ex Cathedra Are Rightly Enumerated as Three?
Objection 1: It seems that the essential conditions for speaking ex cathedra are not rightly enumerated as three. For Cardinal John Henry Newman enumerates four conditions, saying: “He speaks ex cathedrâ, or infallibly, when he speaks, first, as the Universal Teacher; secondly, in the name and with the authority of the Apostles; thirdly, on a point of faith or morals; fourthly, with the purpose of binding every member of the Church to accept and believe his decision.”[3]
Objection 2: Furthermore, Joseph Fenton enumerates five conditions, saying that the pope is infallible when: “A) He speaks in his capacity as the ruler and teacher of all Christians. B) He uses his supreme apostolic authority. C) The doctrine on which he is speaking has to do with faith or morals. D) He issues a certain and definitive judgment on that teaching. E) He wills that this definitive judgment be accepted as such by the universal Church.”[4]
Objection 3: Furthermore, even if there are only three conditions given in the body of the definition of papal infallibility, we must add another condition, which is that the pope must be faithfully interpreting divine revelation and not inventing any new doctrine. For the First Vatican Council teaches that “the Holy Spirit was promised to the successors of Peter not so that they might, by his revelation, make known some new doctrine, but that, by his assistance, they might religiously guard and faithfully expound the revelation or deposit of faith transmitted by the apostles.”[5] And again, the Second Vatican Council also teaches that, “when either the Roman Pontiff or the body of bishops together with him defines a judgment, they pronounce it in accordance with revelation itself, which all are obliged to abide by and be in conformity with.”[6] And again: “The Roman Pontiff and the bishops, in view of their office and the importance of the matter, by fitting means diligently strive to inquire properly into that revelation and to give apt expression to its contents; but a new public revelation they do not accept as pertaining to the divine deposit of faith.”[7]"
You are deeply confused in thinking that "wanting to know jesus' commands would logically require knowing when the pope has infallibly conveyed them".
That assertion is obviously false. You might reasonably replace that with the statement 'wanting to know jesus' commands would logically require WANTING TO KNOW when the pope has infallibly conveyed them". But from this, there is no real difficulty or contradiction. Of course all Catholics will want this - but failing to perfectly achieve it is only expected, since we remain imperfect creatures.
You are clearly intelligent. You should really try to understand the way St. Thomas Aquinas approaches these matters instead of merely aping his style.
Your dilemma is one of authority. If scripture is the final authority then we must appeal to scripture. The RC magisterium doesn’t give definitive interpretations on every line of scripture. It’s a system of progressive dogma over centuries. As much as you would like a rock solid interpretation of every verse of scripture the RCC doesn’t provide this.
I nowhere said or implied I needed or was looking for “a rock solid interpretation of every verse of Scripture.”
If you misrepresent what is said, it’s pretty easy to tear it down.
You have simply assumed your own worldview is true, and concluded according to your own premises. But your premises are the very thing in dispute. Millions of people claiming the same “authority” as you come up with entirely different things. That’s a problem. We see that nowhere in Scripture, and it contradicts the very notion for truth as an absolute thing. Christ either commanded something, or He didn’t.
@@joshuatcharles Yes I respectfully understand and am not trying to strawman you which is hard in the YT comments, but the reformation wasn’t attempting to start a new church. It’s congruous with the church Christ established. It was to correct errors which accumulated through centuries. For example, the infallibility of the pope or sinlessness of Mary is nowhere to be found in the new testament so to require it as essential would be an error. This wasn’t official RC doctrine until the time of the American Civil war at Vatican I. Not all things are equally clear in Scripture, but the essentials are which all Protestants agree upon. (Not all non-Catholics are Protestants -Mormons for example aren’t Protestants) There is also variance in beliefs of RC believers in many areas, but they agree on essential biblical doctrine and have unity. -the church of Christ is united in Christ and by faith in Him.
Thank you for the expression of respect, which I take at face value. I accept your intention is sincere.
However, I’m not here to debate with you the entire “reformation.” And sincerity does not undo the fact that your statement has many errors, and unpacking all your presuppositions (which you assume, but don’t argue for) won’t be done via RUclips comments. Truly, it does not seem like you even listened to what was in the video, which means engaging in a drawn out debate would be even more foolhardy on my part. For example, the idea that all protestants agree in “essentials” is not just absurd, but laughably so. I address that somewhat, and you haven’t responded to anything that was said.
This episode was not about apologetics for the Catholic position. It was explaining how the protestant position is unsustainable, and how I experienced that in the lead up to my own conversion. You have provided no answer to any of it, and I think good faith people who read your comments will see that.
@@joshuatcharles yes the historical facts of the development of the papacy is there for anyone who wants to research it. I just wanted to at least assert that there is no unsolvable dilemma of Protestantism. Unless you are coming to scripture with the presuppositions that lead you there.
I grew up in the RCC and my reading of scripture and church history couldn’t allow me to continue in it. I would love to talk to you or any RC at length, but the information of history and scripture is accessible for anyone who wants to see it without my YT comments. -also, I appreciate your standing for what you believe, we need more of this sort of conversation and not less.
Laura, I did not grow up Catholic. I had no Catholic presuppositions that led me to this. So again, your statement is false. You continue to state your conclusion, but provide no arguments for any of it.
I am reading the documents of the ancient Church Fathers everyday. The evidence of the papacy is everywhere. Your comments have already shown that you don’t understand the very thing you reference. For example, papal infallibility was asserted and affirmed by ecumenical councils of the Church long before Vatican I.
I hope you come back Home to the Church one day.
Again, thank you for your final comments.
❤