Good stuff for sure. One thing I do differently is - after I've loaded the powder in a case, I remove the funnel, and then place a projectile into the case mouth upside down. Then I never miss an empty case. The first 10 or 15 rounds are usually not a problem with forgetfulness. but by the end of a 50-case process, I can get into day-dreaming or get distracted.
I charge say all 50 cases then visually inspect them for uniform powder charges. I have never not had a case with a full powder charge doing this method.
Just set up my Zero press. I have been reloading for years with an RCBS rock chucker. I cannot believe the repeatability of the Zero press, it's amazing and in a class like no other. Everything I have been using for years seems like child's play next to this thing. Area 419 keep inventing and I will keep buying. Your products are amazing
I recently got a Zero and had been using an RCBS Rebel for a long time. The Zero is seriously an amazing precision machine. I swear it’s like a work of art that also pumps out match grade ammo.
This is a service to the precision rifle community. Describing your personal reloading process to us from the armorers workshop that you’ve created is awesome. Thank you Area 419!!!
Great video , thanks for sharing your process with your high end tools . I have been loading for 50 years. Tools have come a long way since I started. I can only put some of these on my wish list after I win the lottery lol
Excellent video, good work guys! Really easy to follow, relevant and not at all condescending. For my 6BR match ammo, I personally: - Deprime cases before dry tumbling with a hand tool - Use imperial sizing wax for full length sizing in the Zero press, have had some issues with spray on lube - Use an expander mandrel to reset neck tension - Use an arbor press with force pack for seating to get a better feel of seating anomalies - Wipe down everything afterwards
Excellent. I haven't read all of the comments, but the viewer should take note that factory chambers are often throated extremely long. In some cases, touching the lands may result in an over mag length round. In other cases you may not reach the lands at all.
This is the 3rd reloading video I’ve seen where they don’t talk about cleaning the case lube off. I’m trying to find out how everyone else does it. I deprime, wet tumble, anneal, lube, size, dry tumble to remove lube, prime, chamfer debur, charge/seat. I charge and seat in the same step so there’s no chance I have an empty case. I use an auto powder pour, so while it’s weighing out my charge, I seat the bullet and I’m ready for the powder right as it finishes.
Thank you Craig. Made me rethink wet tumbling as my ocd won’t let cases stay dirty more than a day.lol. I hand polish all mine with brasso but only have Lyman sonic for insides. Time doesn’t matter to me all that does is the best cartridge I can produce period. Love my hellfire on dd5v3..keeps me on target for follow ups and opens my sinuses all at same time..😉matt in ky
We hope they don’t either! That’s why we did a video a few months ago of the basic needed equipment and were sure to include/note more budget friendly options
I've cleaned brass both ways. The steel pins are a pain especially when 2 get lodged in the flash hole but corn cob media does the same thing. Then I started cleaning before decapping and that was fine both ways. I've never seen or experienced what you're talking about at the case mouth with wet tumbling but I've never let it run more than 3 hours. Problem with the cases is after you size them, you have to clean again to get the lube off. For awhile I'd just lay the cases out and spray with carb or brake cleaner which works to get the lube off after sizing but just costs more money. Most of the time I clean the neck with 0000 stainless steel before sizing but that doesn't work as well as tumbling a few hours. What I do like about wet tumbling is it cleans the inside of the brass and neck where media doesn't seem to I know your video is regarding competition shooting but in my experience, with many of my hunting rifles, both factory and custom, I don't need to FL size. I will chamber every fired case and nearly 100% of the time, they go in just as easy as they did before firing. Unfortunately, many people will FL size cases like this and are bumping the shoulder back 0.002 even more when it's not even needed - thus, all of those cases only get neck sized with a bushing. I've been testing my sizing process using neck sizing only with a bushing and no expander of any type, and also doing that with a slightly tighter bushing followed by using a turning mandrel inside the neck. So far I've noticed no difference in handload neck tension consistency. This is with once fired brass or more than one firing. In the event a fired case is on the stiff side when chambering, I will FL size and I keep those separate. Again, this is only for my hunting rifles. I do have a PRS rifle in 6.5PRC but so far haven't needed to FL size any fired cases in it and the Lapua brass has been fine neck sizing only up to 2 firings each. At this point, for me, only time I have any use for all the turning mandrels I recently bought is on new brass. I'll neck size everything with a bushing, no expander, then use the turning mandrel
Hi Craig, how's it going? 1st off I want to thank Jon for creating Area419. The staff is super friendly and knowledgeable. I love using your quality made tools and products, I have a few 😂. I refer friends and club members to your web site. As far as another tip for reloading. I like to decap and clean the primer pockets, get rid of the carbon before I tumble the brass. This eliminates that crunchy feeling when priming on the CPS. This also allows the primer to be fully seated against the flash hole. Just another step for PRS prep lol.. Using the Zero press along with the CPS are my 2 favorite steps when reloading. Thank you for making our hobby more enjoyable 😊 Have a great one... Nick
It’s a step that a lot of people like to add, and nothing wrong with it! Just not something we have seen the benefit in and don’t dedicate the time to.
Same things I’ve found also on brass markings…on outside of cases it smears in my dies. Have 2 hornady 6.5prc with 22 magnum charges through em and still look great. Pockets of course loose but they both touch every time fired. Wish I could come visit and meet you guys someday brother. Y’all are and inspiration to a blue collar man with big dreams.
Nice vid. After I charge a case, I immediately move the funnel over to the next one but leave my hand on it and use the other hand to grab the charge tray. Never leave the funnel alone on a case, my hand is on it till it's charged. My hand is always on the case that's being charged next.
I like to bulk towel wipe and blow off the dust with compressed air after initial tumbling. I started this after a die developed grooves in the body that may have been attributed to contamination in the media. This also gives me the opportunity to clear any media out of the primer pocket. I will also tumble/wipe/blow again after sizing to clean off the lube residue. Wearing gloves when handling the brass and finished cartridges is also helpful especially if it is intended for longer term storage. Another step, maybe I missed it but... I will clean the primer pocket as part of the brass prep process.
Saw a video with your products. Had to check you out. I thought your comments on wet tumbling were spot on. Always had my doubts on the pins being too harsh. I use Flitz media prep in my tumbler. Their whole line of products work great. Again glad I found you . Great video. Thanks!
Primal Rights is onto something with proper order of operations. I've tried it out and can attest to it working. You should anneal first as it creates an oxidation layer on the brass that almost feels sticky. This can cause inconsistencies in your seating force. After annealing then run through your sizing process. Lastly, dry tumble to clean everything off and leave a slicker feeling on the brass removing that sticky oxide layer.
I used to have concentricity issues. I started seating my projectile 1/4 of the way, pull it out and spin it a 1/4 turn, pull it out and spin it another 1/4 turn, pull it out 1 more time and sent it home with a full stroke of the press handle. Sold my concentricity machine.
Get a forster benchrest micrometer die. it will align the bullet before start seating it. I still use your method with regular dies. for my precision calibers, Forster al the way. don't even measure concentricity anymore, just like you.
After sizing I like to to give the brass another quick tumble to get the lube off in case the spray on line I use could contaminate the powder. Also I typically hit the necks with graphite prior to bullet seating but I don’t know if that does anything yet as I haven’t tested with or without.
Nice video. I liked how you tried to keep things simplified. I still wet tumble my brass, but found that I could reduce my time way down (15 minutes) and not have the brass issue.
Keeping that time down is huge. Like we note, it’s not that you can’t do it successfully, it’s just not something we do as it adds a step that we’ve screwed up in the past
@@area419I've wet tumbled for a decade mainly because of apartment living and the noise and mess from dry tumbling. Are their any effective dry tumblers out there that don't make a mess and aren't very loud? I use a Rebel 17 wet tumbler and love how clean the brass comes out (including the primer pockets), but it's a lot of water to tumble and rinse and the whole process including drying takes longer than I'd like it to so I'd consider moving to dry tumbling if anyone can point me in a good direction for that
@@DanielReyes-hz1qk Most dry tumblers are about the same. They will all be a little dusty (though a lid, plus throwing in a dryer sheet will help that a lot) and the noise is the vibration that comes from the unit. There are some with spring/anti-vibration carriages you'll see, but they all vibrate.
Regarding the cleaning - I have gotten to where I only wet tumble with some dish soap and a dash of citric acid. No pins. I can not tell a single difference in cleanliness, yet I don't have to deal with getting the pins out of the cases. And to help me with forgetting to turn it off, I use one of the outlet timers I use for the Christmas lights. 15-30 minutes (depending if it was shot with a silencer or not) with some hot water, a squirt of dish soap, and a 9mm case of citric acid and they're sparkly clean. Then I just rinse them off with the hose and toss them in the air dryer. I just got to where I was scared of the lead dust in the dry tumbling. With the water, I pour it out through some charcoal to hopefully filter out some of the lead and I am not worried about breathing it in. Just my method.
Love that stack of alpha in background also…my choice also and love there nice box you get. Wish they’d do 6.5prc as I load/shoot slot of with some amazing performance and wow moments when hyper fast bullets impact targets that react to them.
Hej! Good video and nice products. Im on the budget side with the press. And have upgrade others. I woild like to have a progressive and or a multi tool press like the Zero. Less time you touch the brass = more range time 😊 One thing that I do aftrer priming. I aet the primed case with primer faced up. Then I know all are primed. Then the charge is ready I Flip one case, funnel it, pour powder, remove funnel and plant the bullet. And reapet. This way I know that every case is ready for seating.
Question on neck tension…..Understand that neck sizing is no longer a preferred practice for many, but do you ever run expander mandrills for consistent neck tension? Guessing no since it was not included in this video? If not, do you just go with the full body resize and seat the bullet at whatever neck tension is given by the full length die? Great video and thanks so much
We did use an expander, there a ground mandrel in our die that does it all on the sizing stroke, and can be had in various sizes that let you control your neck tension
We've used the product from Southern Shine media and it's solid stuff. Much less of a debacle than pins. We still prefer the dry media but this is certainly an option worth consideration.
same here ; sometimes when I take the cases out of the sonic cleaner I give the neck a quick rub with an old T-Shirt on the outside, gets rids of any loose material not removed.
Wet tumbling 100% I leave it in there for +8 hours. I also chamfer and debur my brass that would get rid of any “bulbing”. Dry tumbling leaves carbon in the neck and affects neck tension. All my necks are squeaky clean and I have super consistent neck tension.
Please explain the concept for Crimping. I know there are a few different steps when shooting semi automatic as to bolt action. I shoot only semi automatic at this time.
Ive wet tumbled for years due to my OCD of having the primer pockets cleaned. Do you deprime before cleaning in dry media? And is the residue left in the primer pockets not cleaned by dry tumbling something to worry about? I’m deep diving into reloading due to innovations in last 10 years and I feel like I’m learning all over again.
The more we load, the more we try to discern what matters from what doesn't. On primer pockets, unless they are building up some sort of excess crud, they're not something we obsess over. Decapping in this video is done in the sizing stroke. A person could always take an extra look at the primers after that step and hit them with a brush before priming again, but in general a small amount of leftover carbon there hasn't been enough of a bother to add a step. That said, a meaningful portion of accuracy on target comes from confidence, and if making those primer pockets squeaky clean builds confidence for you, then go nuts.
Hey Craig & Area 419. GREAT video. Question: do you bother cleaning brand new (Peterson) brass? Same question with annealing. My Peterson brass came clean, in cases, and annealed. Thanks!
Do you consider cleaning the brass again to get rid of the lube especially on the inside of the case? also when do you consider depriming? Do you deprime after cleaning and cleaning the primer pocket seperately to avoid getting any tumble media stuck in the flash hole?
Using One Shot we do not remove it. Hornady made it so that you don’t have to. We deprime on the sizing stroke. Unless something extraordinary is going on with gunk buildup we don’t bother with cleaning out primer pockets.
Thank you very much for the question. I was wondering because with primers removed before the dry tumbling i did get a lot of problems with tumbling media stacked in the primer case. So now I prefer to deprime my cases after the cleaning in the resizing stroke. Thank you very much for the helpful video ! PS i love ma Zero Press. Its The best for consistent reloading time after time! Jan Cremers
@@190264jmc if you really want to decap and then tumble (which is a perfectly fine thing to do) just leave the decapping pin in your sizing die when it goes through that step, will knock out any little stuck media and not add more work
I’d like to add something about when you mentioned stainless wet tumbling peens the brass yes it does but the peening goes away after you trim your brass . Second of all if you have pins getting stuck in your necks , you are using the wrong size pins . I been doing this process for 6 years now and not once in the 6 years have I ever had a stuck pin . Run a q-tip into your freshly dry tumbled brass , I assure you that you will find a light powder inside your brass even on the surface . Eventually your media will be contaminated ,the powder will consist of dry media and carbon . That contaminated powder is not good for your annealing machine and your nice expensive sizing dies and yes it will make its way into your sizing dies . Also after running hundreds into your annealing machine some will make its way in there . When you find a good system with stainless tumbling it’s the best way to go . One more thing the carbon build up inside your brass casing on firing number 10 is going to be different than firing number 2 . Stainless tumbling gets rid of all this carbon build up every time .
First of all what an excellent video. Thankyou for this wonderful resource. I was just curious. With all of that one shot lube you used during the sizing process. What stops your powder from sticking to the residual lube on the inside of the neck? and is it a problem if you do have powder stuck to the inside of the neck? I think im selling my wet tumbler... general consensus is dry is better, even though i have grown to love my shiny brass haha.
Using stick powders it has never been a problem. If 1-2 kernels decide to stick they are very easily knocked down into the case when the bullet enters during seating. Glad you enjoyed!
Great video. Keep up the good work. I am wondering if y'all would make a smaller portable 4 station turret press with 1 and 1/4" holes, so that the Hornady LNL quick change die bushings could be implemented?.
Do you run your brass through a decapping die to remove spent primers before cleaning, or do you do it in the resizing die after cleaning and annealing?
If you dry tumble after depriming, the media can get lodged in the flash hole then you have to punch it out. I wet tumble my brass after I deprime, however I don't use SS pins. I use just hot water,dawn, and lemishine.
great video , old school meets 21st century , never understood why guys wet tumbled , to sloppy and messy for me , looking to purchase a zero press in the near future, seems to be an awesome piece of machinery !!!
Do you not worry about cleaning the brass again after resizing? I figured the case lube would introduce unwanted contaminates, especially if you use like a sizing wax.
Those are V3 AutoTricklers, though there are units from RCBS, Hornady, SuperTrickler, Frankford, etc - it's all about how much speed/time and granular accuracy are worth to you.
Being new to precision rifle ammo reloading, there is ONE item that lacked explanation, that is .050 last mentioned and not explained what in the world are you referring to? Please explain with clarity. Otherwise the remainder was very good.
We note in the video that we are not going to get into the minutiae of developing a load, so we pick a nice round number - .050" - for our "jump" or space that the bullet is seated away from the lands. There are ALLLLLLL sort of theories on how much you should jump or jam a bullet, but again, not digging into that here. Most people can start with a load .050" off and have solid results.
Awesome video, I think it's great information and thank you. Context: I am non an amazing ELR competitive shot or a bench rest expert. I choose to just seat a buppet to a consistent COL as e.g. per sami because is its repeatable (I know the throat erodes etc but its 308....) Is that a sin?
Nope, not a sin at all. Often times a moderate jump of .040-.060 can be set and not see a lot of change. As long as you're somewhere in there, and are measuring length to the bullet ogive (not the tip) then you'll be just fine.
Uniforming isn't something we have messed with in quite some time - starting with premium brass makes that a lot less of a variable. Cleaning the pocket is something you could do, though we have not observed this as being a big deal, so it's not something we regularly spend time on. Certainly inspect to see if there are any major issues, but brushing out each one isn't high on our "things to spend extra time on" list
I know it’s another step but what about de-priming before cleaning and measuring the headspace? I’ve seen some primers cause bad readings because they are being referenced and not the actual base of the case.
Certainly something that could be done. Some people like to decap before cleaning to ensure there is no buildup in the primer pocket. While we don’t consider the extra steps necessary, you’ll not cause harm if you do them with care
@@rsquared9703 As we are producing dies, we chose not to do bushings. We think FL dies are the only way to go, vs neck sizing, but bushings are not our favorite.
I'm sure someone will disagree and demand you remove it, but we have never removed OneShot. It's made without petroleum, teflon, or other synthetic silicons, so it does not contaminate powder.
Ive never tumbled brass. If they are dirty a simple whipe has been enough for me. I think the neck welding to the bullet really only applies to people who run max or close to max pressure
I love how expensive and beautiful the primal rights priming tool is. Then everyone has to use a 10¢ rubber band to make it work easier. Somebody needs to make a nicer fix for this.
Sry, I missed the de-priming part. Notice that the tumbled brass still had the primer, but the Annealed brass had no primer. You use a dedicated "Universal" de-primer after the tumble? r/
@@area419 Many thanks. Do you clean the primer pocket then? Reloaded a lot in the 80's and 90's (Gale McMillian got us started) - I recall de-priming/neck sizing only (neck size only for new brass) then tumbling to clean brass (do not remember if we tumbled new brass to clean off the lube - dont think so). Then just checking for media stuck in the pocket. We trimmed and outside turned the necks by hand. Weighed bullets. On board now with FL sizing and annealing. Great video, very informative - thanks again r/
@@rak7101 unless there is something really nasty happening in a primer pocket we typically wont take extra steps to clean them. It's not time that we have found worth taking. If brass ever ends up really nasty it's not unheard of for the process to change a little and maybe start with a decap and then wash (wet soapy water) operation, but that's not terribly common.
We are decapping in the sizing operation, not before cleaning. Unless there is something really dirty happening we don't see a major benefit to getting primer pockets spotless.
They’re from BenchDepot.com - Harding style I’m almost certain. Have had them a while, have a bunch on the shop floor and around the building. Quality stuff.
@@Levidanielz we don’t love lanolin-based, as you have to clean the inside of your die fairly often. It builds up and if you’re not on top of maintenance can cause inconsistency
So your rationale for NOT using a wet-tumbler is YOU forgot and let it tumble too long? This is not the result of a faulty product or process, but user error.
As we explain at length, this mouth damage can and does happen with shorter run times, over multiple cleanings. But if you want to do other things, then go for it. All we are doing here is showing how we do it and talking about why we do it that way!
I wet tumble with my spent small rifle primers. They don’t get stuck in flash holes and they are softer than stainless pins so less likely to damage case mouths.
Those will be great candidates for the cut-your-own die sleeves, which will be available soon. Take them to your Smith and have him run your custom sizing reamer into them
@@mckimmym it can be, via different sized mandrels. Our dies come with a mandrel that will yield you about .002” of tension, but we sell mandrels in .0005” increments to take you from barely any tension to about .0025”
Good stuff for sure. One thing I do differently is - after I've loaded the powder in a case, I remove the funnel, and then place a projectile into the case mouth upside down. Then I never miss an empty case. The first 10 or 15 rounds are usually not a problem with forgetfulness. but by the end of a 50-case process, I can get into day-dreaming or get distracted.
I personally just go ahead and seat the projectile after charging. But that's me.
But then again I am sitting at a small bench with all of my reloading supplies and press in a small spot.
Using an auto trickler, I have enough time to seat while the next charge pours.
That's how I was taught that's a good visual to see right away if the case is charged with powder. Good post.
I charge say all 50 cases then visually inspect them for uniform powder charges. I have never not had a case with a full powder charge doing this method.
Just set up my Zero press. I have been reloading for years with an RCBS rock chucker. I cannot believe the repeatability of the Zero press, it's amazing and in a class like no other. Everything I have been using for years seems like child's play next to this thing. Area 419 keep inventing and I will keep buying. Your products are amazing
I recently got a Zero and had been using an RCBS Rebel for a long time. The Zero is seriously an amazing precision machine. I swear it’s like a work of art that also pumps out match grade ammo.
Absolutely great video series that will help a ton of reloaders! Thank you for making such quality products. 👍🏼
Thank you, Ray!
This is a service to the precision rifle community. Describing your personal reloading process to us from the armorers workshop that you’ve created is awesome. Thank you Area 419!!!
Great video , thanks for sharing your process with your high end tools . I have been loading for 50 years. Tools have come a long way since I started. I can only put some of these on my wish list after I win the lottery lol
Excellent video, good work guys! Really easy to follow, relevant and not at all condescending.
For my 6BR match ammo, I personally:
- Deprime cases before dry tumbling with a hand tool
- Use imperial sizing wax for full length sizing in the Zero press, have had some issues with spray on lube
- Use an expander mandrel to reset neck tension
- Use an arbor press with force pack for seating to get a better feel of seating anomalies
- Wipe down everything afterwards
Excellent. I haven't read all of the comments, but the viewer should take note that factory chambers are often throated extremely long. In some cases, touching the lands may result in an over mag length round. In other cases you may not reach the lands at all.
My order of operations is, Dry tumble, resize and trim, dry tumble to remove case lube, prime, charge, seat.
This is the 3rd reloading video I’ve seen where they don’t talk about cleaning the case lube off. I’m trying to find out how everyone else does it. I deprime, wet tumble, anneal, lube, size, dry tumble to remove lube, prime, chamfer debur, charge/seat. I charge and seat in the same step so there’s no chance I have an empty case. I use an auto powder pour, so while it’s weighing out my charge, I seat the bullet and I’m ready for the powder right as it finishes.
Thank you Craig. Made me rethink wet tumbling as my ocd won’t let cases stay dirty more than a day.lol. I hand polish all mine with brasso but only have Lyman sonic for insides. Time doesn’t matter to me all that does is the best cartridge I can produce period. Love my hellfire on dd5v3..keeps me on target for follow ups and opens my sinuses all at same time..😉matt in ky
Nice video! I hope beginners don't feel pressured to spend $5K on their first reloading setup to recreate the awesome setup Area419 has here.
We hope they don’t either! That’s why we did a video a few months ago of the basic needed equipment and were sure to include/note more budget friendly options
No worries , no pressure lol 😆
@@area419 I feel the pressure... Can I get the purchase list? :^)
Good lord some peepells comments are too caustic. This was a well done video,thanks guys.
I thought the guy was great. Easy to listen to had good technique.
I've cleaned brass both ways. The steel pins are a pain especially when 2 get lodged in the flash hole but corn cob media does the same thing. Then I started cleaning before decapping and that was fine both ways. I've never seen or experienced what you're talking about at the case mouth with wet tumbling but I've never let it run more than 3 hours. Problem with the cases is after you size them, you have to clean again to get the lube off. For awhile I'd just lay the cases out and spray with carb or brake cleaner which works to get the lube off after sizing but just costs more money. Most of the time I clean the neck with 0000 stainless steel before sizing but that doesn't work as well as tumbling a few hours. What I do like about wet tumbling is it cleans the inside of the brass and neck where media doesn't seem to
I know your video is regarding competition shooting but in my experience, with many of my hunting rifles, both factory and custom, I don't need to FL size. I will chamber every fired case and nearly 100% of the time, they go in just as easy as they did before firing. Unfortunately, many people will FL size cases like this and are bumping the shoulder back 0.002 even more when it's not even needed - thus, all of those cases only get neck sized with a bushing. I've been testing my sizing process using neck sizing only with a bushing and no expander of any type, and also doing that with a slightly tighter bushing followed by using a turning mandrel inside the neck. So far I've noticed no difference in handload neck tension consistency. This is with once fired brass or more than one firing. In the event a fired case is on the stiff side when chambering, I will FL size and I keep those separate.
Again, this is only for my hunting rifles. I do have a PRS rifle in 6.5PRC but so far haven't needed to FL size any fired cases in it and the Lapua brass has been fine neck sizing only up to 2 firings each. At this point, for me, only time I have any use for all the turning mandrels I recently bought is on new brass. I'll neck size everything with a bushing, no expander, then use the turning mandrel
Hi Craig, how's it going? 1st off I want to thank Jon for creating Area419. The staff is super friendly and knowledgeable. I love using your quality made tools and products, I have a few 😂. I refer friends and club members to your web site. As far as another tip for reloading. I like to decap and clean the primer pockets, get rid of the carbon before I tumble the brass. This eliminates that crunchy feeling when priming on the CPS. This also allows the primer to be fully seated against the flash hole. Just another step for PRS prep lol.. Using the Zero press along with the CPS are my 2 favorite steps when reloading. Thank you for making our hobby more enjoyable 😊 Have a great one...
Nick
It’s a step that a lot of people like to add, and nothing wrong with it! Just not something we have seen the benefit in and don’t dedicate the time to.
I always like to tumble after sizing to remove the lubricant.
Thanks for sharing your process!
Same things I’ve found also on brass markings…on outside of cases it smears in my dies. Have 2 hornady 6.5prc with 22 magnum charges through em and still look great. Pockets of course loose but they both touch every time fired. Wish I could come visit and meet you guys someday brother. Y’all are and inspiration to a blue collar man with big dreams.
Great video. I'm in awe of your wall collection lol. That's probably a small house payment worth of PRS rifle goodness!
Nice vid. After I charge a case, I immediately move the funnel over to the next one but leave my hand on it and use the other hand to grab the charge tray. Never leave the funnel alone on a case, my hand is on it till it's charged. My hand is always on the case that's being charged next.
Great video guys!
Thanks so much!
I like to bulk towel wipe and blow off the dust with compressed air after initial tumbling. I started this after a die developed grooves in the body that may have been attributed to contamination in the media. This also gives me the opportunity to clear any media out of the primer pocket. I will also tumble/wipe/blow again after sizing to clean off the lube residue. Wearing gloves when handling the brass and finished cartridges is also helpful especially if it is intended for longer term storage. Another step, maybe I missed it but... I will clean the primer pocket as part of the brass prep process.
Saw a video with your products. Had to check you out. I thought your comments on wet tumbling were spot on. Always had my doubts on the pins being too harsh. I use Flitz media prep in my tumbler. Their whole line of products work great. Again glad I found you . Great video. Thanks!
I sold med devices for a long time. You guys are like the Arthrex of reloading equipment companies.
Thank you! (We think, unless there is some underlying issue there, to which we say BOOOOO)
Primal Rights is onto something with proper order of operations. I've tried it out and can attest to it working. You should anneal first as it creates an oxidation layer on the brass that almost feels sticky. This can cause inconsistencies in your seating force. After annealing then run through your sizing process. Lastly, dry tumble to clean everything off and leave a slicker feeling on the brass removing that sticky oxide layer.
I used to have concentricity issues. I started seating my projectile 1/4 of the way, pull it out and spin it a 1/4 turn, pull it out and spin it another 1/4 turn, pull it out 1 more time and sent it home with a full stroke of the press handle. Sold my concentricity machine.
Get a forster benchrest micrometer die. it will align the bullet before start seating it. I still use your method with regular dies. for my precision calibers, Forster al the way. don't even measure concentricity anymore, just like you.
I want to do this. But geez, the time and patience needed is crazy..
After sizing I like to to give the brass another quick tumble to get the lube off in case the spray on line I use could contaminate the powder. Also I typically hit the necks with graphite prior to bullet seating but I don’t know if that does anything yet as I haven’t tested with or without.
Nothing wrong with adding these steps!
Great informational video! Love your reloading products!
Nice video. I liked how you tried to keep things simplified. I still wet tumble my brass, but found that I could reduce my time way down (15 minutes) and not have the brass issue.
Keeping that time down is huge. Like we note, it’s not that you can’t do it successfully, it’s just not something we do as it adds a step that we’ve screwed up in the past
@@area419I've wet tumbled for a decade mainly because of apartment living and the noise and mess from dry tumbling. Are their any effective dry tumblers out there that don't make a mess and aren't very loud? I use a Rebel 17 wet tumbler and love how clean the brass comes out (including the primer pockets), but it's a lot of water to tumble and rinse and the whole process including drying takes longer than I'd like it to so I'd consider moving to dry tumbling if anyone can point me in a good direction for that
@@DanielReyes-hz1qk Most dry tumblers are about the same. They will all be a little dusty (though a lid, plus throwing in a dryer sheet will help that a lot) and the noise is the vibration that comes from the unit. There are some with spring/anti-vibration carriages you'll see, but they all vibrate.
Regarding the cleaning - I have gotten to where I only wet tumble with some dish soap and a dash of citric acid. No pins. I can not tell a single difference in cleanliness, yet I don't have to deal with getting the pins out of the cases. And to help me with forgetting to turn it off, I use one of the outlet timers I use for the Christmas lights. 15-30 minutes (depending if it was shot with a silencer or not) with some hot water, a squirt of dish soap, and a 9mm case of citric acid and they're sparkly clean. Then I just rinse them off with the hose and toss them in the air dryer.
I just got to where I was scared of the lead dust in the dry tumbling. With the water, I pour it out through some charcoal to hopefully filter out some of the lead and I am not worried about breathing it in.
Just my method.
Love that stack of alpha in background also…my choice also and love there nice box you get. Wish they’d do 6.5prc as I load/shoot slot of with some amazing performance and wow moments when hyper fast bullets impact targets that react to them.
Hej!
Good video and nice products.
Im on the budget side with the press. And have upgrade others. I woild like to have a progressive and or a multi tool press like the Zero.
Less time you touch the brass = more range time 😊
One thing that I do aftrer priming. I aet the primed case with primer faced up. Then I know all are primed.
Then the charge is ready I Flip one case, funnel it, pour powder, remove funnel and plant the bullet.
And reapet.
This way I know that every case is ready for seating.
Question on neck tension…..Understand that neck sizing is no longer a preferred practice for many, but do you ever run expander mandrills for consistent neck tension? Guessing no since it was not included in this video?
If not, do you just go with the full body resize and seat the bullet at whatever neck tension is given by the full length die?
Great video and thanks so much
We did use an expander, there a ground mandrel in our die that does it all on the sizing stroke, and can be had in various sizes that let you control your neck tension
Great video. Thanks
I use chips instead of pins to wet tumble, never had any issues with media getting stuck.
We've used the product from Southern Shine media and it's solid stuff. Much less of a debacle than pins. We still prefer the dry media but this is certainly an option worth consideration.
Good video
My process:
Inspect
Decap
Ultrasonic clean
Dry
Anneal
Lube
F/L Resize
Dry tumble (to remove sizing lubricant)
Measure, trim, chamfer,debur
Prime
Powder
Seat bullet
Inspect
same here ; sometimes when I take the cases out of the sonic cleaner I give the neck a quick rub with an old T-Shirt on the outside, gets rids of any loose material not removed.
Wet tumbling 100% I leave it in there for +8 hours. I also chamfer and debur my brass that would get rid of any “bulbing”. Dry tumbling leaves carbon in the neck and affects neck tension. All my necks are squeaky clean and I have super consistent neck tension.
It would helpful to start from the start. Most of us will start by buying new brass to start and I have no idea those should be prepped/trimmed, etc…
Any chance yall can go into how neck tension plays into the reloading process? And what's better mandrel vs neck bushing?
Check out this video we did not too long ago! ruclips.net/video/OC72ZhpSqsw/видео.html Hopefully it can answer a couple things!
After doing all the resizing of the case, I would anneal it again before handloading.
An excellent video. Is ‘piece of brass’ now the cumbersome way of saying ‘case’?
Please explain the concept for Crimping. I know there are a few different steps when shooting semi automatic as to bolt action. I shoot only semi automatic at this time.
I lube the neck before loading the bullet. I use grafite
Realy nice way. The really nice way costs a really expensive price
Reloading is very dangerous.
Just one time can cause a crippling addiction.
Stay safe.
Ive wet tumbled for years due to my OCD of having the primer pockets cleaned. Do you deprime before cleaning in dry media? And is the residue left in the primer pockets not cleaned by dry tumbling something to worry about? I’m deep diving into reloading due to innovations in last 10 years and I feel like I’m learning all over again.
The more we load, the more we try to discern what matters from what doesn't. On primer pockets, unless they are building up some sort of excess crud, they're not something we obsess over. Decapping in this video is done in the sizing stroke. A person could always take an extra look at the primers after that step and hit them with a brush before priming again, but in general a small amount of leftover carbon there hasn't been enough of a bother to add a step.
That said, a meaningful portion of accuracy on target comes from confidence, and if making those primer pockets squeaky clean builds confidence for you, then go nuts.
Hey Craig & Area 419. GREAT video.
Question: do you bother cleaning brand new (Peterson) brass? Same question with annealing. My Peterson brass came clean, in cases, and annealed.
Thanks!
On new brass, you may run it through a trim and size, but that’s all I’d do with it before getting into prime/charge/seat
Do you consider cleaning the brass again to get rid of the lube especially on the inside of the case?
also when do you consider depriming? Do you deprime after cleaning and cleaning the primer pocket seperately to avoid getting any tumble media stuck in the flash hole?
Using One Shot we do not remove it. Hornady made it so that you don’t have to.
We deprime on the sizing stroke. Unless something extraordinary is going on with gunk buildup we don’t bother with cleaning out primer pockets.
@@area419 super thanks for the quick reply. Keep up the great work.
Thank you very much for the question. I was wondering because with primers removed before the dry tumbling i did get a lot of problems with tumbling media stacked in the primer case. So now I prefer to deprime my cases after the cleaning in the resizing stroke.
Thank you very much for the helpful video !
PS i love ma Zero Press. Its The best for consistent reloading time after time!
Jan Cremers
@@190264jmc if you really want to decap and then tumble (which is a perfectly fine thing to do) just leave the decapping pin in your sizing die when it goes through that step, will knock out any little stuck media and not add more work
I’d like to add something about when you mentioned stainless wet tumbling peens the brass yes it does but the peening goes away after you trim your brass . Second of all if you have pins getting stuck in your necks , you are using the wrong size pins . I been doing this process for 6 years now and not once in the 6 years have I ever had a stuck pin .
Run a q-tip into your freshly dry tumbled brass , I assure you that you will find a light powder inside your brass even on the surface . Eventually your media will be contaminated ,the powder will consist of dry media and carbon . That contaminated powder is not good for your annealing machine and your nice expensive sizing dies and yes it will make its way into your sizing dies . Also after running hundreds into your annealing machine some will make its way in there .
When you find a good system with stainless tumbling it’s the best way to go . One more thing the carbon build up inside your brass casing on firing number 10 is going to be different than firing number 2 . Stainless tumbling gets rid of all this carbon build up every time .
First of all what an excellent video. Thankyou for this wonderful resource.
I was just curious. With all of that one shot lube you used during the sizing process. What stops your powder from sticking to the residual lube on the inside of the neck? and is it a problem if you do have powder stuck to the inside of the neck?
I think im selling my wet tumbler... general consensus is dry is better, even though i have grown to love my shiny brass haha.
Using stick powders it has never been a problem. If 1-2 kernels decide to stick they are very easily knocked down into the case when the bullet enters during seating.
Glad you enjoyed!
Great video. Keep up the good work.
I am wondering if y'all would make a smaller portable 4 station turret press with 1 and 1/4" holes, so that the Hornady LNL quick change die bushings could be implemented?.
This isn’t something on our product development roadmap
Do you run your brass through a decapping die to remove spent primers before cleaning, or do you do it in the resizing die after cleaning and annealing?
Real question…why shouldn’t someone deprime, and then clean the brass?
Can be done either way, as addressed, we don’t see any harm either way. We deprime after cleaning to save a step
👍
If you dry tumble after depriming, the media can get lodged in the flash hole then you have to punch it out.
I wet tumble my brass after I deprime, however I don't use SS pins. I use just hot water,dawn, and lemishine.
great video , old school meets 21st century , never understood why guys wet tumbled , to sloppy and messy for me , looking to purchase a zero press in the near future, seems to be an awesome piece of machinery !!!
Are you using a seating die that is not released yet in this video?
It's one that we made and have out in testing. Making sure it's perfect as we refine out process/output on sizing dies to keep up with demand.
Do you not worry about cleaning the brass again after resizing? I figured the case lube would introduce unwanted contaminates, especially if you use like a sizing wax.
We don’t worry about it because we use OneShot, which is specifically made to not contaminate powders
What about cleaning the primer pockets ?
When is your M-Series Seating Die coming out?
Can you give me the details on your auto dispensing powder drop and scale? Thanks for the videos.
Those are V3 AutoTricklers, though there are units from RCBS, Hornady, SuperTrickler, Frankford, etc - it's all about how much speed/time and granular accuracy are worth to you.
@@area419 thanks for the reply!
great
Being new to precision rifle ammo reloading, there is ONE item that lacked explanation, that is .050 last mentioned and not explained what in the world are you referring to? Please explain with clarity. Otherwise the remainder was very good.
We note in the video that we are not going to get into the minutiae of developing a load, so we pick a nice round number - .050" - for our "jump" or space that the bullet is seated away from the lands. There are ALLLLLLL sort of theories on how much you should jump or jam a bullet, but again, not digging into that here. Most people can start with a load .050" off and have solid results.
I have been told that you should brush the necks if you anneal. Do you have thoughts on that?
What are the two rifle stocks on the bottom right rifles on the wall behind the press?
@@LucasE269 both are Manners stocks, one is a TCS, the other is probably an EH1
Awesome video, I think it's great information and thank you.
Context: I am non an amazing ELR competitive shot or a bench rest expert.
I choose to just seat a buppet to a consistent COL as e.g. per sami because is its repeatable (I know the throat erodes etc but its 308....)
Is that a sin?
Nope, not a sin at all. Often times a moderate jump of .040-.060 can be set and not see a lot of change. As long as you're somewhere in there, and are measuring length to the bullet ogive (not the tip) then you'll be just fine.
@@area419 thank you*
Only had time to watch to 17:15 just before priming, but I didn’t see you use or mention a mandrel. Did I miss something?
Decapping and mandrel for neck size are all part of the sizing stroke with our sizing dies
What about re-cleaning after the resizing and trimming process to get all that lube off.
One-Shot does not require this step, one of the key reasons we like it
Im surprised you didn't do any primer pocket work on your brass, chamfer and clean primer pocket. I think its an important step. So what do you think?
Uniforming isn't something we have messed with in quite some time - starting with premium brass makes that a lot less of a variable. Cleaning the pocket is something you could do, though we have not observed this as being a big deal, so it's not something we regularly spend time on. Certainly inspect to see if there are any major issues, but brushing out each one isn't high on our "things to spend extra time on" list
Thanks for your response,I will consider it. Thank you.
who makes the hangers for the guns you have on the wall?
Almost all of the display items in there are from Hold Up Displays - we are pleased with them, would buy again
Do you de-prime before tumbling or at sizing brass
Decapping is done here during the sizing stroke
So y’all don’t find fire forming a piece of brace to a specific rifle is better than a full length sizing?
For consistency from firing to firing, full-length sizing provides a better result.
I know it’s another step but what about de-priming before cleaning and measuring the headspace? I’ve seen some primers cause bad readings because they are being referenced and not the actual base of the case.
Certainly something that could be done. Some people like to decap before cleaning to ensure there is no buildup in the primer pocket. While we don’t consider the extra steps necessary, you’ll not cause harm if you do them with care
@@area419 what is your opinion about FL bushing dies? Pros and cons?
@@rsquared9703 As we are producing dies, we chose not to do bushings. We think FL dies are the only way to go, vs neck sizing, but bushings are not our favorite.
Mostly Mad Men Like Robert Brantley 😂, He's a damn national treasure! 😂 He's definitely doing something right .
So when loading precision ammo you don't need to wipe off Hornady One Shot case lube after sizing?
I'm sure someone will disagree and demand you remove it, but we have never removed OneShot. It's made without petroleum, teflon, or other synthetic silicons, so it does not contaminate powder.
Ive never tumbled brass. If they are dirty a simple whipe has been enough for me. I think the neck welding to the bullet really only applies to people who run max or close to max pressure
I love how expensive and beautiful the primal rights priming tool is. Then everyone has to use a 10¢ rubber band to make it work easier. Somebody needs to make a nicer fix for this.
Sry, I missed the de-priming part. Notice that the tumbled brass still had the primer, but the Annealed brass had no primer. You use a dedicated "Universal" de-primer after the tumble? r/
One of those clips was just a different piece of brass. In this process we are removing the spent primer during sizing
@@area419 Many thanks. Do you clean the primer pocket then? Reloaded a lot in the 80's and 90's (Gale McMillian got us started) - I recall de-priming/neck sizing only (neck size only for new brass) then tumbling to clean brass (do not remember if we tumbled new brass to clean off the lube - dont think so). Then just checking for media stuck in the pocket. We trimmed and outside turned the necks by hand. Weighed bullets. On board now with FL sizing and annealing. Great video, very informative - thanks again r/
@@rak7101 unless there is something really nasty happening in a primer pocket we typically wont take extra steps to clean them. It's not time that we have found worth taking. If brass ever ends up really nasty it's not unheard of for the process to change a little and maybe start with a decap and then wash (wet soapy water) operation, but that's not terribly common.
Did You use mseries siding die?
Are you de-priming as part of the sizing operation?
Yes
When and how do you de-prime the fired brass?
Cases are decapped in the sizing operation
did i miss decapping or was that part of the sizing? Did you decap before cleaning? i'm new to this and trying to get a list of equipment.
We are decapping in the sizing operation, not before cleaning. Unless there is something really dirty happening we don't see a major benefit to getting primer pockets spotless.
Anyone know what rifle racks they have in the BG?
So I have a AGS annealer , I know everyone is raving about the amp Annealer but I just can’t afford it right now .
Nothing wrong with a flame-style! As long as you have the patience and know-how to dial it in, you can get a very solid result.
how do u clean the inside seizing lube out of inside after sizing
Using One-Shot, we don't. It's formulated in a way that it's not required.
Craig what benches are those? Husky? Just curious i got one for my setup while I’m in residency. Obviously not as sturdy as my home bench but curious
They’re from BenchDepot.com - Harding style I’m almost certain. Have had them a while, have a bunch on the shop floor and around the building. Quality stuff.
this video is advertising for the most expensive reloading tools and nothing more 😂
Yeah it is and I have all of that same stuff! It’s wonderful! 😂
Most expensive and quite possiblely the best that matters to some people
@@Chris.Fitz1 maybe wonderfull,i have the Turban press ,much cheeper and do exactly the same job 😂
Bro I’m sitting here watching this thinking the same thing. All’s I have is a Lee Classic Single State Press and some other rudimentary equipment 😂😂😂
I don't need it but I'm going to squirrel away some ammo fund money so I can sneak one of your Zero Presses into my shop without my wife noticing.🐿
SMART MAN!
How do you feel about ultrasonic cleaners?
They’re perfectly fine. Never fell in love with them but no real reason.
@@area419 would it benefit any if I did both? Ultrasonic and dry tumble
@@brysonredgrave unsure what the benefit would be to doing both. Once the big chunks of grime are gone it’s ready to go
@@area419 just wondering to get that polish look
Any eta on seating dies?
They won't be specifically soon. S-Series sizers will come first.
You guys dont dry tumble before priming to get rid of the lube?
No, we don’t, OneShot doesn’t require it, and an extra dry tumble makes for another opportunity for media to be left in the flash hole or in the case
Got ya, I've never used it. I like 10/1 99% isopropyl alcohol and lanolin mix. They get sticky.
Anyway, love your products. I use em every few days. Keep rockin Area419!
@@Levidanielz we don’t love lanolin-based, as you have to clean the inside of your die fairly often. It builds up and if you’re not on top of maintenance can cause inconsistency
Haven't had a problem in about six thousands handloads since I started using it. 0.002" bump everytime.
Do you use a case check gauge?
You’ll see us measure headspace/bump as well as seating depth, but a full case gauge isn’t a part of our process.
So your rationale for NOT using a wet-tumbler is YOU forgot and let it tumble too long? This is not the result of a faulty product or process, but user error.
As we explain at length, this mouth damage can and does happen with shorter run times, over multiple cleanings. But if you want to do other things, then go for it. All we are doing here is showing how we do it and talking about why we do it that way!
I wet tumble with my spent small rifle primers. They don’t get stuck in flash holes and they are softer than stainless pins so less likely to damage case mouths.
Need to make 300WSM and 284 Shehane dies so I can use them on my Zero Press. 😀
Those will be great candidates for the cut-your-own die sleeves, which will be available soon. Take them to your Smith and have him run your custom sizing reamer into them
X2 on the 300WSM
10:05. I hope I don't bruise your guidelines, but all of those fluted barrels and muzzlebrakes and colored stocks are GAF!😂
Gucci? Glorious? Gorgeous? We’ll take it!
@@area419 zing!🤣
What seater are you using
That's our M-Series Seater, likely something we will roll out later this year.
That’s what I thought it was! Ready for it!
What Headspace Gauge is that you are using?
It’s one we are making, should be available soon
@@area419 gotcha, I thought maybe I was missing something on the site. I was going to try to take advantage of the Independence Day sale.
no neck sizing ?
We full-length size, giving us consistent dimensions for the whole case every time
Ye, I recall, sorry was not clear, meant to say, no mandrel sizing of the neck?
@@georgelza our die has an internal precision-ground mandrel that is pulled through all in the same stroke as the FL size
@@area419 Does this mean neck tension is not something that can be adjusted?
@@mckimmym it can be, via different sized mandrels. Our dies come with a mandrel that will yield you about .002” of tension, but we sell mandrels in .0005” increments to take you from barely any tension to about .0025”
ere does a guy get an adjustable bump die
Area419 and Short Action Customs make adjustable dies to bump the shoulder.
@@airborne350g thanks man I'll check it out
4 minutes in. Just got to cleaning brass. Appears to prefer dry tumbling.
You never de-primed the case LOL.
It's a part of the sizing operation LOL
1 minute in. Learned nothing other than someone loves the sound of their own voice. GET ON WITH IT!
I take it back. Start at 9.20 knowing you should full length re-size. Also bear in mind used brass should be de-primed which he forgets.
We broke the video into chapters, they're helpful to be able to skip around if you want to skip things like introductions.
also, the brass is de-capped during the sizing operation.