Amen brother. I just love her character design and personality so much. That's the reason why I picked her up in the first place. I wasn't one of those WR 3, 2 spammers anyways. The only nerf that irks me is her 1, 1 nerf. I don't know why it has to be -10 on block....
@@DrunklotusI’m not gonna say I’m a crazy player or anything but I’m a hwo and a Reina player. I played hwo since launch until about a month ago and was only able to get to garyu and barely touched shinryu. Meanwhile I play Reina for like 2 weeks and I’m already almost in purple. What I’m saying is, hwo feels like he was unnecessarily nerfed, but I don’t play him anymore so I’m coolin
If my main gets nerfed, I just stick with them anyway and adjust. I know some characters I play are hated by their communities whether it's because grappler (lol) or because it happens to be a top tier (not my fault, I just liked the design, man). I expect nerfs every patch and I'm always ready to adapt and re-learn. Feels like that's a healthy mentality that keeps me from getting tilted or needlessly angry. Stuff happens, modern day of patches is here. Gotta adapt and keep on trucking on. I'll keep getting better even if they take my tools away. I'll just find new tools. Oh, and yeah, I'm speaking in general. I have this mentality for all the games I play.
"characters you don't like getting better" I feel that lmao 90% of my time in Tekken is friendlies and my homie mains Claudio so seeing him get buffed gave me shivers
@@LotusAsakura yes, both characters are still very good, lili is super annoying to deal with both playstyle wise and average player attitude. Hwo has always been kind of a noob stomper but he wasnt too strong, didnt really need the nerf IMO
7:35 generally speaking, try to keep in mind that chat, or any group of people, are not a hive mind. Some will like X some will dislike X. Most aren't changing their minds on a whim and it's really just different people complaining or praising different things.
Despite people shitting on your characters, i really like this style of meta commentary vids after patches. Especially as someone new to the fgc but familiar with yugioh, hearing how y'all handle nerfs/bans is interesting to compare
>be me >coming from starcraft and counterstrike >tekken players discuss how they never experienced a nerf of their characters >patches are scary >takes sip from coffee > > >my sweet summerchild
All things being debatable, depending on player level and how things relate… I will always think that tuning down a power crush is a good idea. The fact that your character relies on being able to bypass neutral by blocking with his face means that there are other problems with the character that I would rather see fixed before the implementation of power crush as a cornerstone tactic.
I am not someone who can lab or do stuff like that, but I enjoy exploring stuff with the character I play. I learn what I can from people who played the character I play and try things out off that. Reina got nerfed (which were fair nerfs) but I don't feel it's affected my playstyle much. I know the nerfs were targeted for the spammy movements she had, but I've put a fair bit to learning her. I don't have the skill to really do her best stuff any time, but I enjoy playing Reina oppressive in a different way. I'm not high level but I enjoy trying to make it work. I also picked up Asuka lately cause I wanted to see how she feels now after two major patches, and she feels pretty fun to play. And I am looking forward to Lidia
did watch half way through the video yet, but i gotta say as a player who just started tekken/fighting games 3 month ago: its not about who is strong or not on a objective level, it's about who is annoying af and knowledgechecks you the most, for me at least. i never minded nina, yoshi etc cause you don't face really good ones that abuse what makes them s tier on my level. you fight knowledgecheck spamming hwo's, lars, zafina.. idk who im forgetting but yea. i guess thats where the hwo hate comes from, it feels so carried when ppl mash you down on him and i guess most ppl from the general community are roughly on my level tenryu-mightyruler'ish
I think the problem with balancing regularly, is the fact that changes aren't inherently understood fully, before its already changed again. The opposite end is doing what Capcom did with Street Fighter, which is not updating the game for a year... thus everyone invested understands everything, and the game isn't interesting anymore...
Tekken 8 is a hard game but it's a game that everybody has the ability to learn. The cry baby comments should be ignored the ones who are saying 'coping' together or 'cope harder' are the crybabies separate from the people who having meaningful criticism and opinions. I donf like Hworang, and that being said the nerf didnt help me either as i just got destroyed the other night. This morning, i got whopped and told myself to go into replays and practice the strings in my replays and practice reacting, its not ALWAYS the character, its the players too. Casuals need to get off or get good 😎.
I labed him, he's the only character I had to look up a Guide for. I'm probably never going to be able to beat him constantly. But seeing people cope over a nerfs is so damn satisfying. YALL need to get in the lab and find out new options to use. But making a entire video about nerfs is literally coping. At the end of the video he's literally doing damage control. "I got some things in the patch I asked for" bro talk about that. Stop crying over nerfs and we'll stop pointing it out
My lower rank take, jokes aside, while sure Hwo can be annoying there are way more aggregious and more obnoxious characters imo. Personaly going through the Rank trenches, I fight way more more Alisa, Nina, Drag, and Law players that are imo more annoying. Not sure how much the character pick rate is between regions (im playing Eu and not US), i don't often play many Mishima's surprisingly. Hwo is more patient zero in that a lot of low and mid rank players struggle against characters that are very aggressive and heavy on strings, and Hwo is sort of an obvious example. Especially when players aren't great at counterplay or are still inproving their punishment. It also was more annoying when movement and defensive options felt a lot more limited. I'm still adjusting from T7 and having to learn a whole new character since non on the characters i used to play are here. EDIT: I do agree though that Nina and Alisa got away with murder this patch when conpared to someone like Hwoarang. Unfortunantly expecting to see way more.
I think overall character power in this game is pretty strong so you can definitely still excel with a weaker character and not just have zero chance of winning. But there are absolutely still differences in power regardless of how big or small the gap is.
@@cl0wnr732bro devil jin has an electric,a launching hellsweep,laser canon, flash punch,demon steep pedal,a broken wall pressure tool that also gaurd breaks if you charge it,demon paw,he does half life without wall and .... and you say he is weak!he is just bottom tier not weak!
As someone that has reached raijin with hwo, jin and jun and recently fujin with paul. I think paul was already strong (just wasnt as flashy as others), hwo was maybe around mid-high tier. now post patch, hwo from the top of my head is below 20 characters i can name off right away. He lacks any panic moves (his recently nerfed crush was the best he had) other than that all he has is pressure strings and the one that starts from a low feels like a death sentence when its avoided. Too many of his moves are now high risk for mediocre reward
as a victor enjoyer his nerfs made me sad but i do understand why they had to be nerfed, i just wish he got a little more compensation. his new playstyle is pretty fun, i like having the options in stances and whatnot but my biggest gripe with the new update is it made his staple combos have even more wall carry which kinda sucks cause with how small t8 maps are the combo routes you can have to do in smaller spaces aren't that good in comparison with his staple and even just compared to what every other character can do in the same amount of space. he definitely shines on yakushima and colloseum though so it's not all terrible, and he's definitely not unusable for sure when pros like meo-il definitely make him work
Sup y'all, great talk so far (bout half way in). One piece of constructive criticism is the sound levels. I've had to adjust up and down a couple times to make sure I can hear Phi, then turn Lotus down. A sound check is always appreciated, but either way great subject matter and will be subbin up.
Ngl although the Reina nerfs still left her viable as a new player who committed to her I could feel them hard (w/ the crouching status stuff specifically)and it was enough to drop her for now. It’s pretty frustrating but I’ve picked up Asuka and leo(partially) and I will say it’s kinda crazy how much quicker I’ve been able to make progress as them. It doesn’t feel like I get as stuck like I did with Reina and especially with asuka I feel like I can actually play defense and do literally everything more consistently.
Hwo is primarily a noob stomper. When you hit purple and blue rank, you start to realise hwoarang isn't that strong. Mainly because he risks his life for very little reward, especially after the nerfs. I'm currently raijin with hwo and I've learned that its best to just commit to the mix up while making minor adjustments when your opponent figures out a counter play. Its kind of a guessing game to be honest.
@@DaWhisper I will sound harsh but most of hwos reach some highranks due to the lack of knowledge that the players of low rank have. So when they reach the high ranks and fundamentals need to be used, deffence knowledge has to be know on another characters then hwos player's understands that hwo as a character was through the low ranks. How do you know that? You can find hwos at purple ranks still spamming d 4,4. And yes when you know how to deffend hwo he is not that good of a character and you need to be good at him to excel on high ranks
As a Kazuya player, we all have these times. Some of us stick with the character and some abandon them to pick them up when they get buffed to Heavens again.
How Alisa didn't get nerfed is beyond me. Plus frames, after plus frames, after plus frames. And it's not scrub talk because even the highest level players complain about her
As a player who gets washed by Hwo on the regular, it's still crazy they nerfed him. I just struggle on figuring out how to deal with Hwo's pressure with Shaheen, but that's a me problem.
He’s not under the radar. He has an unblockable, fast, low launcher that tracks, and flash. Plus he has Tekken 8 damage and he retains all his yoshi garbage. He’s bull shit, and the community knows it. His nerfs are coming.
Good video guys. I agree with you lotus, I think dvj and hwo are prob the worst characters. They deserve better. I don’t think I can ever drop dvj tho. Too much sauce.
I'm glad yall prolly wont be dropping your characters. It always feels weird watching ppl stop playing a character because of nerfs, even though I do understand it (especially if you play at a pro level). But if y'all are thinking of switching gears a lil, I'd be excited to see more Reina vids from Lotus or Phi labbing out the Yoshi
I will still play Reina. I have the most fun with Reina. I still think she's in a good spot. That being said, making Manji-Geri a STANDING move was a smooth brain decision
As someone who doesn't like fighting against Hwoarang I don'y understand the passionate hate people who play him gets. Like it doesn't take much to learn how to fight against him or recognize patterns to adjust for.
Wouldn’t say hwo deserved the nerf but it wasn’t too bad they kind of just reverted the changes because in tekken 7 (not sure about the games before that) the power crush was launch punishable and they just made it not launch punishable in tekken 8 for some reason
This is why you ahould play Victor. Even when he is nerfed, he isn't nerfed. And now that he is "fixed", he's never going to get a major nerf ever again.
This was me the whole T7 with Lee he gets buffed but nerfed the same patch and he was still a low teir in that game but dosent matter I love him Edit : Lee 1+2 has a lot going for it but he needs mid homing move but cmon thats his most broken move some characters have more broken shit tbh Edit : Yea I agree with the statement with picking up Lee can just pick a button and ch lmao.
So far the buffs and nerfs created interesting dynamics. Even huge shifts in character play count. 🤔 . Personally I like it . Even when a character I play gets nerfed(maybe not Dvj ). Wat r your guys thoughts?
My queen Reina didn’t need all those nerfs , they were brutal. FF2 was justified but all high crush on FC4! ? Jin still can WS 2 you for free. Must be nice to have a WS launcher
I play jun so I feel u I always felt that jun was good but not perfect heat was a big part of her so even I called for a nerf to it (also jun df1 I felt that comment lol ) but yea I just luv jun she is fun and never goin to drop her but now I been playin eddy a lot and never in my dreams eddy I thought I would play him in 7 he never was for me plus he was trash and now in 8 he still trash but I like that he less gimmick heavy ihave fun playin him even tho his he'll sweep needs a fix omg and tracking for him is so bad lol but yea it's just fun this only my 2nd tekken but I been playib fighting games and rpgs my whole life was might ruler in 7 now im tekken king in 8 so just tryin out here man keep ya head up man your a strong player so yea that's for anyone man we all learning together
Nothing hurts like having your character nerfed because of a meme. *cries in Ssjku* But I say that as long as the changes arent extreme, it's best to push through because character knowledge and intuition will carry you so far. That's how I felt woth Goku and Hit at least
I’m biased on this one as a Paul player, but Hwoarang is not deserving of the hate. He’s a lab character that can do a ton of cool stuff and one sign to me that he was not that OP in this game is his reliance on a few moves and flow charts. Doesn’t feel like I see a lot of use of his full kit. Then again I’m mighty ruler so maybe ppl at my level don’t know his full kit.
As someone who played Eliza and Kazumi from the start of T7, you will get used to it. Kazumi was beaten to death for most of that games life. I do find the Hwo players upset is funny just like when Mishimas get any nerfs. Idk I understand the pain but just find it funny
What I don't like about the patch culture is that they nerf characters instead of balancing them. Like for example when fahk was released he was strong as hell obviously but did they really need to kill him? And for 1.5, hwo's d3,4 I get it like it shouldn't have been the way it was before u know I think they should do that more, *looking at u rage art*, but the other nerfs was unnecessary imo. They did a great job with the rest of the cast tho except for some who needs more balancing but just pls balance characters and not kill them
I still cant get over the fact that they addressed that hes not performing as well as he should and they nerf him. The funny part is that the players celebrating this nerf for Hwo are still losing to him because they never labbed the character. This nerf primarily benefits players that already properly punished Hwo. Side note, F the nerfs, I still got my boi to GoD! And F the haters, stay getting bodied by Hwo!
Azucena and Devil Jin were nerfed more than Lili and Hwo and people still played. Lili is still very good and Hwo will always be a mashers worst nightmare. Competetive wise none of these 4 characters will move the needle unless a new patch buffs them, except maaaaybe Lili, since her mix ups are still very good
A lot of the nerfed characters are no at the same level as anyone who wasn't top 10. Aka. Not bad or a struggle to play, just not autopilot as much anymore.
i don’t understand why they nerfed Hwo. i honestly feel bad for Hwo mains. as far as Lili goes, its not like she’s unplayable now. Phi is a highly competent player and it seems like he should be able to adjust. iirc, the main thing she lost is the ability to abuse feisty rabbit mixup in certain situations. in regard to WHEN patches get dropped - with tournaments being held almost every two weeks or so, there seems to be no “off season” for Tekken. i don’t think there is any ideal time to drop a patch
i say what i say about Hwoarang because knowledge and labbing can help you overcome that matchup, whereas Lili fights seem to always devolve into 50/50s over and over ( i am only red rank, so i can’t speak on high level play)
My biggest nerf till this day was Lars Tekken 6 to Tekken 7 it was like literally going from top 1 to bottom one but hey I didn’t really have WiFi until last Tekken 6 life span so I was genuinely playing Lars cause I like him so when T7 came out I didn’t know he sucksd until like 2018😂😂
It's Persona 3 OST, specifically When the Moon's reaching Out Stars. It may be the Remake ost version, the game ost is very Acid Jazz influenced if that's your thing.
@@LotusAsakura love your conversation! but my honest take: i think people hate "low risk high reward" characters/moves and people who abuse that balance approach (no matter if there pros or casuals)
@@LotusAsakura no absolutly not i meant this in general for fighting games (low risk high reward) Hwo is a great character i love him and honestly i like it if my fav character is nerfed/low tier
It’s funny they(complainers) think nerfing characters causes balance. Why have some characters lose their strongest traits so others can keep theirs. The devs need to Just leave characters as is the game as is and force people to actually lab Instead of making it easy for them
Just like Arslan Ash said, instead of crying about nerfs. Just play a top tier character. You guys get PAID to play tekken, why tf are u having character loyalty tf
Hwo was never that good guys I’ve tried Jin, Hwo, Reina, and Steve. I main Steve but out of the characters I’ve played Reina and Jin were giving me wins easy. Jin and Reina are leagues better than Hwo and Steve but that won’t stop me playing Steve he’s now my best character 😌
I'm upset, Xiaoyu and Hwoarang got nerfed give me back Hwoarang and Xiaoyu.... It takes me so long to learn Tekken 8 and they brutalized my only characters in the game. It's just rude and messed up, I have to do a hundred button combos to even win matches and some people do like 5 to 7 moved and I get defeated. I have to do 17 to 30 moves to defeat any one how is that even right...
I don't quit my favorite characters I've played them always since Tekken 3 I can't say that I have not tried other characters because I have but I either don't like their style, their or how their moves work or I hate their moral stance in the game. I really don't like evil characters, which is why I don't play Kazuya, Heihachi, Fang, Devil Jin, Lee, Or Nina. I don't care that I like to see them in the game but I cannot play them, I don't want to aline with them. I don't hate Nina or Lee they are just characters I don't agree with. I tried to like Kazuya but he got super evil to the point of being worst than Heihachi,.. Xiaoyu literally is just a teen (now turning almost young adult) following her crush and trying to help him. Hwoarang is just some guy who enjoys a challenge and couldn't stand getting a draw with someone who he felt on equal foot with in marshal arts. They don't fight to do evil, and are probably the most extreme version or near normal humans as they can be, they have 0 super natural powers and only Marshall arts but they don't side with evil, although Xiaoyu was tricked by Heihachi for a time and even tricked by Claudio, she still stayed true to her goal find and help Jin. Jin on the other hand, gave in to evil for a time...
The thing about hwoa is that hey took literally all his hellsweeps and removed all his CH mid launchers, removed all the other launches you'd get from Counters. Then they made peacekeeper extra linear so the smallest step dodges it. Then instead of adding anything new, they gave every char in the game lunging homing CH wr moves that are really difficult to step, then they added Gaurd breaks to OP characters that didnt need it. Then they gave every character more in build evasion in alot of moves. Autoparries, rage, High crushing, Knockdown's, Homing grabs (while our only panic move goes to the side) and alot of characters kept their CH utility. We risk our life for every poke we make. While every other char has safe powercrush heat engagers wich they can just throw out like its notihing. Hate this game.
Dvj mains: first time huh?
As an azu main, ultimately you gotta persevere even with the nerfs cus ultimately no matter how bad they are you’ll still love playing them
Amen brother. I just love her character design and personality so much. That's the reason why I picked her up in the first place. I wasn't one of those WR 3, 2 spammers anyways. The only nerf that irks me is her 1, 1 nerf. I don't know why it has to be -10 on block....
@@DrunklotusI’m not gonna say I’m a crazy player or anything but I’m a hwo and a Reina player. I played hwo since launch until about a month ago and was only able to get to garyu and barely touched shinryu. Meanwhile I play Reina for like 2 weeks and I’m already almost in purple. What I’m saying is, hwo feels like he was unnecessarily nerfed, but I don’t play him anymore so I’m coolin
VAMOS
@@aqueelkadri8371 ¡SABROSO! 😋
BROTHER! 🥲
If my main gets nerfed, I just stick with them anyway and adjust. I know some characters I play are hated by their communities whether it's because grappler (lol) or because it happens to be a top tier (not my fault, I just liked the design, man). I expect nerfs every patch and I'm always ready to adapt and re-learn. Feels like that's a healthy mentality that keeps me from getting tilted or needlessly angry. Stuff happens, modern day of patches is here. Gotta adapt and keep on trucking on. I'll keep getting better even if they take my tools away. I'll just find new tools.
Oh, and yeah, I'm speaking in general. I have this mentality for all the games I play.
"characters you don't like getting better" I feel that lmao 90% of my time in Tekken is friendlies and my homie mains Claudio so seeing him get buffed gave me shivers
getting destroyed by a claudio just feels extra disrespectful 😂
Coping together.
THANK YOU SOMEONE SAID IT
exactly! 38min of useless crying
"every buff to others and every nerf to my character is unnecessary" typical useless FGC conversation
Is that really what you guys think of this video? That we're just crying for 30 minutes?
@@LotusAsakura yes, both characters are still very good, lili is super annoying to deal with both playstyle wise and average player attitude.
Hwo has always been kind of a noob stomper but he wasnt too strong, didnt really need the nerf IMO
7:35 generally speaking, try to keep in mind that chat, or any group of people, are not a hive mind. Some will like X some will dislike X. Most aren't changing their minds on a whim and it's really just different people complaining or praising different things.
Yeah I also think that generally people are more vocal to complain about something and are more silent when they're happy.
*cries in devil jin* bruh
Devil Jin definitely didn't deserve this lol
@@LotusAsakura so neither king did.
Despite people shitting on your characters, i really like this style of meta commentary vids after patches. Especially as someone new to the fgc but familiar with yugioh, hearing how y'all handle nerfs/bans is interesting to compare
>be me
>coming from starcraft and counterstrike
>tekken players discuss how they never experienced a nerf of their characters
>patches are scary
>takes sip from coffee
>
>
>my sweet summerchild
All things being debatable, depending on player level and how things relate… I will always think that tuning down a power crush is a good idea. The fact that your character relies on being able to bypass neutral by blocking with his face means that there are other problems with the character that I would rather see fixed before the implementation of power crush as a cornerstone tactic.
I am not someone who can lab or do stuff like that, but I enjoy exploring stuff with the character I play. I learn what I can from people who played the character I play and try things out off that. Reina got nerfed (which were fair nerfs) but I don't feel it's affected my playstyle much. I know the nerfs were targeted for the spammy movements she had, but I've put a fair bit to learning her. I don't have the skill to really do her best stuff any time, but I enjoy playing Reina oppressive in a different way. I'm not high level but I enjoy trying to make it work.
I also picked up Asuka lately cause I wanted to see how she feels now after two major patches, and she feels pretty fun to play. And I am looking forward to Lidia
did watch half way through the video yet, but i gotta say as a player who just started tekken/fighting games 3 month ago: its not about who is strong or not on a objective level, it's about who is annoying af and knowledgechecks you the most, for me at least. i never minded nina, yoshi etc cause you don't face really good ones that abuse what makes them s tier on my level. you fight knowledgecheck spamming hwo's, lars, zafina.. idk who im forgetting but yea. i guess thats where the hwo hate comes from, it feels so carried when ppl mash you down on him and i guess most ppl from the general community are roughly on my level tenryu-mightyruler'ish
I think the problem with balancing regularly, is the fact that changes aren't inherently understood fully, before its already changed again.
The opposite end is doing what Capcom did with Street Fighter, which is not updating the game for a year... thus everyone invested understands everything, and the game isn't interesting anymore...
Tekken 8 is a hard game but it's a game that everybody has the ability to learn. The cry baby comments should be ignored the ones who are saying 'coping' together or 'cope harder' are the crybabies separate from the people who having meaningful criticism and opinions. I donf like Hworang, and that being said the nerf didnt help me either as i just got destroyed the other night. This morning, i got whopped and told myself to go into replays and practice the strings in my replays and practice reacting, its not ALWAYS the character, its the players too. Casuals need to get off or get good 😎.
I labed him, he's the only character I had to look up a Guide for. I'm probably never going to be able to beat him constantly. But seeing people cope over a nerfs is so damn satisfying. YALL need to get in the lab and find out new options to use. But making a entire video about nerfs is literally coping. At the end of the video he's literally doing damage control. "I got some things in the patch I asked for" bro talk about that. Stop crying over nerfs and we'll stop pointing it out
Facts!
Telling casuals to quit the game is the most retarded sht I've ever heard
My lower rank take, jokes aside, while sure Hwo can be annoying there are way more aggregious and more obnoxious characters imo. Personaly going through the Rank trenches, I fight way more more Alisa, Nina, Drag, and Law players that are imo more annoying. Not sure how much the character pick rate is between regions (im playing Eu and not US), i don't often play many Mishima's surprisingly.
Hwo is more patient zero in that a lot of low and mid rank players struggle against characters that are very aggressive and heavy on strings, and Hwo is sort of an obvious example. Especially when players aren't great at counterplay or are still inproving their punishment. It also was more annoying when movement and defensive options felt a lot more limited. I'm still adjusting from T7 and having to learn a whole new character since non on the characters i used to play are here.
EDIT: I do agree though that Nina and Alisa got away with murder this patch when conpared to someone like Hwoarang. Unfortunantly expecting to see way more.
being bottom tier in this game doesn't mean shit!
yeah, everyones strong besides dvj
I think overall character power in this game is pretty strong so you can definitely still excel with a weaker character and not just have zero chance of winning. But there are absolutely still differences in power regardless of how big or small the gap is.
Hahahaha godamit bro 😂 @@cl0wnr732
@@cl0wnr732bro devil jin has an electric,a launching hellsweep,laser canon, flash punch,demon steep pedal,a broken wall pressure tool that also gaurd breaks if you charge it,demon paw,he does half life without wall and .... and you say he is weak!he is just bottom tier not weak!
As someone that has reached raijin with hwo, jin and jun and recently fujin with paul. I think paul was already strong (just wasnt as flashy as others), hwo was maybe around mid-high tier. now post patch, hwo from the top of my head is below 20 characters i can name off right away. He lacks any panic moves (his recently nerfed crush was the best he had) other than that all he has is pressure strings and the one that starts from a low feels like a death sentence when its avoided. Too many of his moves are now high risk for mediocre reward
as a victor enjoyer his nerfs made me sad but i do understand why they had to be nerfed, i just wish he got a little more compensation. his new playstyle is pretty fun, i like having the options in stances and whatnot but my biggest gripe with the new update is it made his staple combos have even more wall carry which kinda sucks cause with how small t8 maps are the combo routes you can have to do in smaller spaces aren't that good in comparison with his staple and even just compared to what every other character can do in the same amount of space. he definitely shines on yakushima and colloseum though so it's not all terrible, and he's definitely not unusable for sure when pros like meo-il definitely make him work
Sup y'all, great talk so far (bout half way in). One piece of constructive criticism is the sound levels. I've had to adjust up and down a couple times to make sure I can hear Phi, then turn Lotus down. A sound check is always appreciated, but either way great subject matter and will be subbin up.
This video makes me want to get back into the game, bc I don’t know my character enough to understand what the nerf/ buff actually change
Ngl although the Reina nerfs still left her viable as a new player who committed to her I could feel them hard (w/ the crouching status stuff specifically)and it was enough to drop her for now. It’s pretty frustrating but I’ve picked up Asuka and leo(partially) and I will say it’s kinda crazy how much quicker I’ve been able to make progress as them. It doesn’t feel like I get as stuck like I did with Reina and especially with asuka I feel like I can actually play defense and do literally everything more consistently.
I just made the purple ranks and I’m actually really feeling the Hwo nerfs now 😢
Same here
Hwo is primarily a noob stomper. When you hit purple and blue rank, you start to realise hwoarang isn't that strong. Mainly because he risks his life for very little reward, especially after the nerfs.
I'm currently raijin with hwo and I've learned that its best to just commit to the mix up while making minor adjustments when your opponent figures out a counter play.
Its kind of a guessing game to be honest.
@@DaWhisper I will sound harsh but most of hwos reach some highranks due to the lack of knowledge that the players of low rank have. So when they reach the high ranks and fundamentals need to be used, deffence knowledge has to be know on another characters then hwos player's understands that hwo as a character was through the low ranks. How do you know that? You can find hwos at purple ranks still spamming d 4,4. And yes when you know how to deffend hwo he is not that good of a character and you need to be good at him to excel on high ranks
@@αλεξηςπεγιαδης trust me, i know. I'm currently tekken king with hwo.
As a Kazuya player, we all have these times. Some of us stick with the character and some abandon them to pick them up when they get buffed to Heavens again.
How Alisa didn't get nerfed is beyond me. Plus frames, after plus frames, after plus frames. And it's not scrub talk because even the highest level players complain about her
I’ve been playing Lili since she was introduced to the series. Whether she’s the best character or the worst, I’m sticking with my girl
Iont even play Tekken, but gotta show the boy some support by watching and liking and commenting
I’m a King main and yeah even I’m not too stoked about it, I verse kings too and I’m getting bodied by the wave dash it’s kinda crazy
I'm curious, so question for the both of you: how would you nerf Alisa?
As a player who gets washed by Hwo on the regular, it's still crazy they nerfed him. I just struggle on figuring out how to deal with Hwo's pressure with Shaheen, but that's a me problem.
Respect for phi dx for his opinion about hwo
Before I watch this video, Me just watching Feng get pieced apart.
PhiDX keep your grubby mitts away from Yoshi. We'd like to keep him under the radar.
He’s not under the radar. He has an unblockable, fast, low launcher that tracks, and flash. Plus he has Tekken 8 damage and he retains all his yoshi garbage. He’s bull shit, and the community knows it. His nerfs are coming.
Yoshi is anything but under the radar.
@@The_Buff_Guythen he has his cheesy parry that bails him out of any situation. he’s basically in the old patch still
@@The_Buff_Guy Yea if yoshi is so popular then you know its bullshit now
Nah compared to the other characters he's fine. He aint getting nerfs anytime soon thank goodness.
Good video guys. I agree with you lotus, I think dvj and hwo are prob the worst characters. They deserve better. I don’t think I can ever drop dvj tho. Too much sauce.
IS THAT A PERSONA 3 RELOAD OST IN THE BACKGROUND ?!!!
indeed it is
Hwoarang nerfs were so bad that I hopped on NFS Unbound lmao
Yea I’d say on the receiving end it’s not fun being jailed the entire time he deserved it
@@kiddalmatiangawd8389 but see this. once you start pressure hwo its all over for him. And now its even worse.
@@kiddalmatiangawd8389 You could always just block or like... Sidestep lmao
@@Masamoora yea like I said, not fun blocking the entire time now counter play there should’ve been counter play from the start
@@Masamoora You say that like every move he has is steppable and even punishable after step.
Good content very interesting conversation.
King main, ride or die, doesn’t matter if he gets nerfed to the ground, will enjoy doing powerbombs reguardless
I'm a steve and lars main but I'm definitely dropping them when Lidia drops, she was my main in T7
I'm glad yall prolly wont be dropping your characters. It always feels weird watching ppl stop playing a character because of nerfs, even though I do understand it (especially if you play at a pro level). But if y'all are thinking of switching gears a lil, I'd be excited to see more Reina vids from Lotus or Phi labbing out the Yoshi
I will still play Reina. I have the most fun with Reina. I still think she's in a good spot. That being said, making Manji-Geri a STANDING move was a smooth brain decision
As someone who doesn't like fighting against Hwoarang I don'y understand the passionate hate people who play him gets. Like it doesn't take much to learn how to fight against him or recognize patterns to adjust for.
Wouldn’t say hwo deserved the nerf but it wasn’t too bad they kind of just reverted the changes because in tekken 7 (not sure about the games before that) the power crush was launch punishable and they just made it not launch punishable in tekken 8 for some reason
This is why you ahould play Victor. Even when he is nerfed, he isn't nerfed. And now that he is "fixed", he's never going to get a major nerf ever again.
Regarding the Cyrax mishap I just came to the conclusion that people just wanna complain. That's it. People wait to see what to hate on next.
This was me the whole T7 with Lee he gets buffed but nerfed the same patch and he was still a low teir in that game but dosent matter I love him
Edit : Lee 1+2 has a lot going for it but he needs mid homing move but cmon thats his most broken move some characters have more broken shit tbh
Edit : Yea I agree with the statement with picking up Lee can just pick a button and ch lmao.
So far the buffs and nerfs created interesting dynamics. Even huge shifts in character play count. 🤔 . Personally I like it . Even when a character I play gets nerfed(maybe not Dvj ). Wat r your guys thoughts?
My queen Reina didn’t need all those nerfs , they were brutal. FF2 was justified but all high crush on FC4! ? Jin still can WS 2 you for free. Must be nice to have a WS launcher
Gogetas meter nerf was the beginning of the end of fighters for me. My combos were mediocre so I was building negative meter
Get better combos lmao
Im pretty sure noctis wasnt only buffed in t7. Didnt his db1+2 track way more when he first released?
I play jun so I feel u I always felt that jun was good but not perfect heat was a big part of her so even I called for a nerf to it (also jun df1 I felt that comment lol ) but yea I just luv jun she is fun and never goin to drop her but now I been playin eddy a lot and never in my dreams eddy I thought I would play him in 7 he never was for me plus he was trash and now in 8 he still trash but I like that he less gimmick heavy ihave fun playin him even tho his he'll sweep needs a fix omg and tracking for him is so bad lol but yea it's just fun this only my 2nd tekken but I been playib fighting games and rpgs my whole life was might ruler in 7 now im tekken king in 8 so just tryin out here man keep ya head up man your a strong player so yea that's for anyone man we all learning together
The thing people forget is that every character in this game is viable especially at a lower and mid level
Nothing hurts like having your character nerfed because of a meme. *cries in Ssjku*
But I say that as long as the changes arent extreme, it's best to push through because character knowledge and intuition will carry you so far. That's how I felt woth Goku and Hit at least
Really wish they played against each other.
Nah deal with it like everyone else did tf Claudio ,askua kazuya nerfed since cnt cbt and beta so yea deal with it
I’m biased on this one as a Paul player, but Hwoarang is not deserving of the hate. He’s a lab character that can do a ton of cool stuff and one sign to me that he was not that OP in this game is his reliance on a few moves and flow charts. Doesn’t feel like I see a lot of use of his full kit. Then again I’m mighty ruler so maybe ppl at my level don’t know his full kit.
As someone who played Eliza and Kazumi from the start of T7, you will get used to it. Kazumi was beaten to death for most of that games life. I do find the Hwo players upset is funny just like when Mishimas get any nerfs. Idk I understand the pain but just find it funny
As a hwoarang throughout the years I was always A-B tier.....I think it's the first time we are bottom 10 ☠️
What I don't like about the patch culture is that they nerf characters instead of balancing them. Like for example when fahk was released he was strong as hell obviously but did they really need to kill him? And for 1.5, hwo's d3,4 I get it like it shouldn't have been the way it was before u know I think they should do that more, *looking at u rage art*, but the other nerfs was unnecessary imo. They did a great job with the rest of the cast tho except for some who needs more balancing but just pls balance characters and not kill them
I still cant get over the fact that they addressed that hes not performing as well as he should and they nerf him. The funny part is that the players celebrating this nerf for Hwo are still losing to him because they never labbed the character.
This nerf primarily benefits players that already properly punished Hwo. Side note, F the nerfs, I still got my boi to GoD! And F the haters, stay getting bodied by Hwo!
Damn honestly I main Jin and Devil Jin but I felt Lotus on Hworang he’s strong but not as strong as the top tiers
This is all real talk, they nerfed our boy. But Nina and Alisa are happy to run around freely
Azucena and Devil Jin were nerfed more than Lili and Hwo and people still played. Lili is still very good and Hwo will always be a mashers worst nightmare. Competetive wise none of these 4 characters will move the needle unless a new patch buffs them, except maaaaybe Lili, since her mix ups are still very good
A lot of the nerfed characters are no at the same level as anyone who wasn't top 10. Aka. Not bad or a struggle to play, just not autopilot as much anymore.
I hope phi picks up yoshimitsu. Then yoshi will actually get a desevered nerf into the ground
It would be interesting to see him play Yoshimitsu. Not a character you see very often compared to some of the others on the roster.
Shout out to the Nina mains! We having a great time! 😂 She’s so awesome and pretty 🤩
some of the commenters fr just didnt watch the video 💀
What's new lol
i don’t understand why they nerfed Hwo. i honestly feel bad for Hwo mains.
as far as Lili goes, its not like she’s unplayable now. Phi is a highly competent player and it seems like he should be able to adjust. iirc, the main thing she lost is the ability to abuse feisty rabbit mixup in certain situations.
in regard to WHEN patches get dropped - with tournaments being held almost every two weeks or so, there seems to be no “off season” for Tekken. i don’t think there is any ideal time to drop a patch
i say what i say about Hwoarang because knowledge and labbing can help you overcome that matchup, whereas Lili fights seem to always devolve into 50/50s over and over ( i am only red rank, so i can’t speak on high level play)
14:33 “im sad that its fair cause i need something unfair” LMAO at least Phi is hella self aware
Why did they have to hit our boy
They did Hwoarang dirty! The complainers made it easy for them too tone Hwoarang down! Hwoarang was good the way he was before the patch🤦🏾♂️
Feng... naw, you are tripping, mate. Feng is fine
Only time I ever dropped a main was when siege made Jager a 2 speed😭😭
I just came here to say that Azucena is in a really good place😃
My biggest nerf till this day was Lars Tekken 6 to Tekken 7 it was like literally going from top 1 to bottom one but hey I didn’t really have WiFi until last Tekken 6 life span so I was genuinely playing Lars cause I like him so when T7 came out I didn’t know he sucksd until like 2018😂😂
This Hwo nerf got me switching to Steve. I need my boy back. The hate honestly is gross
I just need more Leroy buffs maneeeee
Lotus my guy I need to Now this song or if you made it how you make songs like this let me know mane
It's Persona 3 OST, specifically When the Moon's reaching Out Stars. It may be the Remake ost version, the game ost is very Acid Jazz influenced if that's your thing.
Dealing With a Nerfed Character...GIT GOOD
pretty much
@@LotusAsakura love your conversation! but my honest take: i think people hate "low risk high reward" characters/moves and people who abuse that balance approach (no matter if there pros or casuals)
Hwoarang always been high risk fluctuating reward which more often than not is medium reward.
@@rain89skarlet80 I mean I agree but I don't think Hwoarang was a low risk high reward character if that's what you're implying.
@@LotusAsakura no absolutly not i meant this in general for fighting games (low risk high reward) Hwo is a great character i love him and honestly i like it if my fav character is nerfed/low tier
Lotus be playing bardock still like bro don’t have Dragon ball fighterz equivalent of Unc status 😂
this how i was when azu get nerfed 😅
Lotus its just time to start olaying bryan
24:15 like I said nothing changed for me I'm still fighting for my life in red rank he'll 😂
You play good characters because they are good
I play Jack-8 because I get to belly flop on people we are not the same
Just a joke
PHiDx is a part of why King's oki game has been turned inside out. I have no sympathy for Lili.
Ik we talking about patching Tekken but what’s this song 😂
I thought they said he was gonna quit playing her now lol
He’s on the fence it seems but for the moment will continue playing her and feeling it out.
@@LotusAsakura thanks bro.
Try playing dvj , seriously get him above 50 percent win rate and youll be way stronger with your main.
Is it just me or is this just be being blown outta proportion, Playing as and fighting Hwoarang, All I notice is he’s still good and a problem.
Azucena seems to get nerfed every patch
That point to the camera was so personal 😂😂😂
Hworang and Lili definitely deserved to be nerfs......I say they are not nerfed enough.
It’s funny they(complainers) think nerfing characters causes balance. Why have some characters lose their strongest traits so others can keep theirs. The devs need to Just leave characters as is the game as is and force people to actually lab Instead of making it easy for them
Being an old fart I remember when you just had to deal with whatever Tekken came out of the CD case & just played the damn game.
I tried rawdogging ranked with DJ. Actually the most miserable experience I’ve ever had.
as a DJ main, as soon as I got to Fujin, I hung up my DJ belt. At this point, it's too much nerfs.
Dvj’s hard to pilot but super fun when you can fr, don’t give up!
@@nx47 I’ve been playing Mishimas for 15 years, piloting isn’t the issue. Now if you’ll excuse me I’m gonna go pop some adderall and try again.
being bottom tier in this game doesn't mean shit!
Hahah ey, if them pills don’t work lemme just put this by your side for ease of access after your ranked sesh 🦽🦽 I know I need mine
Just like Arslan Ash said, instead of crying about nerfs. Just play a top tier character. You guys get PAID to play tekken, why tf are u having character loyalty tf
Hwo was never that good guys I’ve tried Jin, Hwo, Reina, and Steve. I main Steve but out of the characters I’ve played Reina and Jin were giving me wins easy. Jin and Reina are leagues better than Hwo and Steve but that won’t stop me playing Steve he’s now my best character 😌
I'm upset, Xiaoyu and Hwoarang got nerfed give me back Hwoarang and Xiaoyu.... It takes me so long to learn Tekken 8 and they brutalized my only characters in the game. It's just rude and messed up, I have to do a hundred button combos to even win matches and some people do like 5 to 7 moved and I get defeated. I have to do 17 to 30 moves to defeat any one how is that even right...
I don't quit my favorite characters I've played them always since Tekken 3 I can't say that I have not tried other characters because I have but I either don't like their style, their or how their moves work or I hate their moral stance in the game. I really don't like evil characters, which is why I don't play Kazuya, Heihachi, Fang, Devil Jin, Lee, Or Nina. I don't care that I like to see them in the game but I cannot play them, I don't want to aline with them. I don't hate Nina or Lee they are just characters I don't agree with. I tried to like Kazuya but he got super evil to the point of being worst than Heihachi,..
Xiaoyu literally is just a teen (now turning almost young adult) following her crush and trying to help him. Hwoarang is just some guy who enjoys a challenge and couldn't stand getting a draw with someone who he felt on equal foot with in marshal arts. They don't fight to do evil, and are probably the most extreme version or near normal humans as they can be, they have 0 super natural powers and only Marshall arts but they don't side with evil, although Xiaoyu was tricked by Heihachi for a time and even tricked by Claudio, she still stayed true to her goal find and help Jin. Jin on the other hand, gave in to evil for a time...
Trauma bonding 😅
Pick a top tier
The thing about hwoa is that hey took literally all his hellsweeps and removed all his CH mid launchers, removed all the other launches you'd get from Counters. Then they made peacekeeper extra linear so the smallest step dodges it. Then instead of adding anything new, they gave every char in the game lunging homing CH wr moves that are really difficult to step, then they added Gaurd breaks to OP characters that didnt need it. Then they gave every character more in build evasion in alot of moves. Autoparries, rage, High crushing, Knockdown's, Homing grabs (while our only panic move goes to the side) and alot of characters kept their CH utility. We risk our life for every poke we make. While every other char has safe powercrush heat engagers wich they can just throw out like its notihing.
Hate this game.
😢They nerfed my Steve Fox every other character is faster then him i cant even do a jab, im getting hit first or being lounge in the air 🤣
Lili my main ok with me 🤷🏾♂️