Your video was incredibly helpful and thorough. I appreciate your analysis of LL. I especially loved how you sat down with your daughter to get her thoughts on each program you have used in the past. I think that is great advice that I will be putting to good use with my oldest learner as we are struggling to decide on what program(s) to use for language arts next school year.
Thanks for the video. My daughter will be in 3rd grade, and I have been on the fence about LL. The sample unit on their website only shows poetry, which I thought looked pretty good, but I wanted to know more about the literature units. My other idea was to find novel studies on Teachers Pay Teachers individually. I was also excited about the integrated writing with LL, but from your description, I think I'll look for something else.
This was so helpful, I was very intrigued by this curriculum at one point, thinking it could be good for independent work, but I know we would have come across the same issues you have spoken about, I'm glad I didn't! We use Blossom and Root, the books are amazing, and we adore the questions, rabbit trails and projects!
This video really effectively articulated my issues with the curriculum as well. I have tried off and on to utilize their grade 1 for my 8 year old (her reading abilities far exceed this level, but her grammar and literary elements do not) and we just kept losing steam and dropping it without really understanding why (on my part). The books for level 1 are probably appropriate for the target age, but they were not engaging enough for us to continue. I did enjoy the questions, but it really was like a guided narration. I was highly excited for the writing component, but it does not explicitly teach writing. I didn’t have this reasoning before, but when you spell it all out like you have here, it all makes sense. I’m sorry if you’ve already tried and didn’t like Brave Writer, but if you haven’t, I think it would really work well for you in what you’re looking for with excellent reads, great conversations and questions regarding the reads, and discussing grammar and literary devices. I haven’t explored it enough myself yet to vouch for the writing programs, but I think it would address what you were looking for with reading, especially if you’re already using MCT to teach parts of speech, etc. I have personally been struggling for a while with language arts. There doesn’t seem to be one nice, neatly packaged open and go curriculum for the secular homeschooler that is strong in all areas of LA. Maybe we’re asking too much. 😅 I’m really hoping to find better options for “grammar and mechanics” and “composition” in the coming school year. I think this video finally put words to how I was feeling and helped me make peace with stepping away from lightning lit.
@@liljdw1 That’s why I haven’t tried any of their writing programs yet personally! The expense deters me. We have been purchasing Darts individually (they’re $10-$15 each) and that has allowed us to check them out without the cost of a full bundle. If you’re considering BW I would encourage you to get a single issue of whichever level is appropriate for your needs (Dart, Arrow, Boomerang, etc.) and go from there. Additionally, because I prefer an “open and go” approach, I sat down one weekend day and wrote out directions for myself for each day of the entire 4 week guide with how I intended to implement the material. It’s not a necessary step, but it has made it so easy to grab and use without having to think too much about it. I think once we get a few more under our belt, this won’t be necessary at all, but it’s made it very simple for me.
This is how I feel too. I actually really love their Darts/Arrows. But I have a hard time justifying the cost of an entire year of that plus one of their writing programs. I did try Jot It Down way back when we started homeschooling, but again it didn’t feel like we were doing much for the cost.
I hit play on this as soon as I saw the topic, as Lightning Literature was a major consideration for 4th grade. It was an "extra" though, as I just wanted to talk about great books. I love the idea of a "Book Discussion Guides!" If we find good ones along the way, lets share!:)
@@darlinglittlethree5860 I ended up going with neither and created me own. We had already read most of the books for this curriculum and I wanted to expose them to new books.
I thought about it but had some concerns about the books for my 2nd grader and being too difficult for him to read independently. So I appreciate this video because it confirms perhaps what I was thinking and I also appreciate the confirm to stick with what works for our family. We are going to try MCT this next year after wathing your videos and my 5th grader is already thumbing through them
Last year when we used lightning literature I started both my boys at level three and did it as read aloud then they just worked on their work independently that worked for us for a little bit but then they got bored with the book selection.
If you’re looking for a guide to assist with book discussions have you tried any of the brave writer book units? It’s a shame when those purchases don’t pan out how we see them. It’s all part of the experience isn’t it. We really liked the gentleness of LL in the lower grades but yes I pointed out in my flip through and review video that it is not an explicit writing program and that most people would need to add to it for that.
I was wanting the same things for my soon to be 6th grader. Have you looked into or ever tried BJU? It looks like they do an amazing job at breaking down literature discussions and elements. 😊
I found your review very interesting and useful. I would appreciate your input on my thoughts on how to use this in our homeschool! I think you make a lot of valid points about the student work not being as in depth as some other programs. I enjoy language and literature and enjoy going in depth on these topics. That being said, I can be very disorganized. Lightning Literature seems to offer great value in the quality book selections and the way it is paced and laid out over the course of a school year. I was wondering if it would work to use it as a spine, and add in some of the Michael Clay Thompson materials to expand on it. I find Michael Clay Thompson very appealing conceptually. Do you have any thoughts on this?
I’m probably not a good person to ask given how much we have loved using MCT 😆 I think Lightning Literature could work very well on its own if you didn’t feel MCT would be a good fit and if your kids do a great job reading/following directions independently. I’m not sure the grammar components really complement each other. LL seems to focus on one detail at a time, while MCT is a more rounded approach. I hope that makes sense.
Thank you this was so helpful! I actually had this in my cart but was torn because I’ve read and watched probably all the same reviews. We do grammar and writing separately but I thought I would pick out just parts of it. This helped me decide to stick to my CM choices.
We are still using Build Your Library, which includes read aloud literature that we discuss together and independent readers. We take a very laid back approach to the independent readers. My 13yo usually annotates and summarizes in the book while my 10yo keeps a small reading journal that he adds to after each day’s reading. Hope that helps!
We are going to use MCT next year for my 10-year-old. I have read through all the books and LOVE them. I really hope my daughter will love them as much as I do! I am considering EIW for extra grammar practice with MCT. Would you consider that reasonable or necessary? I think the grammar portion explanations in LL 5th grade are helpful but extremely wordy. We will add some of the recommended books to our collection, but sadly, we will not be using LL. We are using level 2: MCT next year, but I am considering purchasing Building Languages and The Music of the Hemispheres before introducing my daughter to Caesar's English I/II and Building Poems. Do you think that is reasonable to consider and would it work? If that makes sense. Thank you!
I have no experience with EIW, but I feel like MCT grammar is extremely thorough and doesn’t need any supplementation at all. We used a few weeks of Caesar’s English I around the time my daughter started Grammar Town (and she had completed Building Language prior to that). There is quite a jump in workload from BL to CE! I honestly don’t think it is too much for her, but she seemed overwhelmed and I am prioritizing other L.A. skills over Latin-based vocabulary. So we decided to shelve it until next year. Just to give you an idea: BL has ten stems total, while CE has 5 new stems every other lesson and new vocabulary words in each lesson. There are lots of extra activities that reinforce the vocabulary, so many that you pretty much have to pick and choose. Anyway, I think BL is a fun, gentle way to start working in Latin stems especially if she is at all resistant to language arts.
How do you like the build your library independent selections? Is it not enough with MCT? I’m thinking of using brave writer with build your library and MCT next year. We also like writing and rhetoric for the writing portion.
That sounds like a solid plan! We have liked almost all of BYL’s independent readers. I’m not sure what you mean by not enough, but I feel like BYL language arts and MCT compliment each other nicely. I can’t speak to Brave Writer other than to say that I do like their approach, but I found it hard to justify the cost.
@@RegularSecularMama I definitely understand with the cost in BW. Honestly what made me reconsider is it’s really about the BW community which you get lifetime membership to. I did the read aloud revival for 3 months and liked it but overtime could not justify its cumulative cost, I also felt it a little young for my older kids. BW is a one time thing plus you hopefully do get some things to use. If your looking for an easy writing curriculum I would highly suggest writing and rhetoric your kids are my 2 oldest age and they enjoyed it the first book is on fables. It may be overkill with MCT but I just pick and choose what writing they actually complete from the MCT suggestions. And we work on the writing and rhetoric about 2wice a week. Also I meant that BYL readers hopefully have enough of the comprehension type questions built in for them to notebook etc ( I don’t know I’m just hoping because I’m buying level 3 for my son next year) sorry for the long post we just have similar homeschool styles.
Oh I see! The independent readers do not include discussion questions, but the kids are asked to complete narration assignments/projects. We usually just do oral narration after each day’s reading unless writing is light that week. The literature books that are read aloud do include vocabulary words and discussion questions. We also do this orally, but notebooking would be a great idea! From what I understand, Writing and Rhetoric is not secular so I have not considered it.
I looked pretty closely through the levels I bought and found nothing religious. I had not heard that it wasn’t secular. Perhaps they meant the company and not the curriculum?
@@amandamellen6937 I think it is meant to be secular. I'm using grade 2 with my 5 year old son. We skipped grade 1. But just a heads up.. In Grade 2, week 8 (which is the first poetry week) there is a poem called "All Things Bright and beautiful" in the student Workbook. It says "the Lord God made them all" as in all the creatures etc. And "how great is God Almighty"... I honestly thought it was a strange choice because it's the poem they used as an example to teach different poetry terms... Anyways I just wanted to let you know that... ☺️ At the moment we are on week 11 and haven't seen any thing else that might raise any eyebrows! I hope that helps 😊
So I've been having the same problem with Lightning Literature and thought about keeping it just for the literature part for next year but decided that would be too wasteful. I looked at Brave Writer, but it seems so expensive for what it is. I will have to look at BYL because I didn't think of using it for that aspect. I'll have to see what all it comes with. I have pruchased a few novel studies on TPT as well, and I may just do that for more novel studies if I don't find anything else for next year. Thank you for the review!
BYL is amazing for literature and independent readers, especially that tie into history topics! It’s not quite as detailed as Brave Writer darts and arrows, but she still includes plenty of copywork passages and discussion points. IMO it’s well worth the cost of the PDF even just for the book selections, copywork passages, and reading schedule.
Might want to do audio books that can be downloaded. Back in the day I was growing up mid/late 90”s early 2000”s had cassette types for listening to book’s music church stuff, the crazy thing I still have some of them. I been seeing people selling boom boxes the old type with type player you played on the top area & bottom area Cd 💿 no iPhones 📱 or android phones. I keep hearing jokes about that lately I laugh so hard my cheeks go red. Yes my boyfriend & decided to do homeschooling from the beginning. I don’t trust public school perfonsals especially special Ed child study team. What I keep reading & hearing from news stuff. So no public school for my feature kids. The school system really mentally had me eaten alive not physically mentally. I tend to use figure of speech when talking or writing texting emailing, doing Instagram messaging my boyfriend. It’s pretty scary what’s been happening in special Ed. I could have nonverbal kids like I was for 6 years. Or high functioning. The school system as I realized it’s not meant for kids & teens young adults with special needs it’s just not.
I'm sorry for your underwhelming experience. Always a bummer when you're excited for a new curriculum and then realize it's not for you. Lightning Literature has always been one of those that every spring I wind up coming back and taking a peek at it and consider it, but wind up just choosing my own novels and buying different literature guides from various companies and creating my own literature curriculum that way. I've definitely heard amazing things from all over youtube and instagram about BYL!
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Your video was incredibly helpful and thorough. I appreciate your analysis of LL. I especially loved how you sat down with your daughter to get her thoughts on each program you have used in the past. I think that is great advice that I will be putting to good use with my oldest learner as we are struggling to decide on what program(s) to use for language arts next school year.
Thank you for your kind words. I’m so glad you found it helpful!
Thanks for the video. My daughter will be in 3rd grade, and I have been on the fence about LL. The sample unit on their website only shows poetry, which I thought looked pretty good, but I wanted to know more about the literature units. My other idea was to find novel studies on Teachers Pay Teachers individually. I was also excited about the integrated writing with LL, but from your description, I think I'll look for something else.
I’m glad it was helpful. Thanks for watching, and I hope you have a wonderful week-and school year! 🤗
This was so helpful, I was very intrigued by this curriculum at one point, thinking it could be good for independent work, but I know we would have come across the same issues you have spoken about, I'm glad I didn't! We use Blossom and Root, the books are amazing, and we adore the questions, rabbit trails and projects!
The resources Blossom & Root pulls together are amazing!
This video really effectively articulated my issues with the curriculum as well. I have tried off and on to utilize their grade 1 for my 8 year old (her reading abilities far exceed this level, but her grammar and literary elements do not) and we just kept losing steam and dropping it without really understanding why (on my part). The books for level 1 are probably appropriate for the target age, but they were not engaging enough for us to continue. I did enjoy the questions, but it really was like a guided narration. I was highly excited for the writing component, but it does not explicitly teach writing. I didn’t have this reasoning before, but when you spell it all out like you have here, it all makes sense.
I’m sorry if you’ve already tried and didn’t like Brave Writer, but if you haven’t, I think it would really work well for you in what you’re looking for with excellent reads, great conversations and questions regarding the reads, and discussing grammar and literary devices. I haven’t explored it enough myself yet to vouch for the writing programs, but I think it would address what you were looking for with reading, especially if you’re already using MCT to teach parts of speech, etc.
I have personally been struggling for a while with language arts. There doesn’t seem to be one nice, neatly packaged open and go curriculum for the secular homeschooler that is strong in all areas of LA. Maybe we’re asking too much. 😅 I’m really hoping to find better options for “grammar and mechanics” and “composition” in the coming school year. I think this video finally put words to how I was feeling and helped me make peace with stepping away from lightning lit.
I've been looking for the same things and have been looking at Brave Writer. However, it seems so expensive for what it is.
@@liljdw1 That’s why I haven’t tried any of their writing programs yet personally! The expense deters me. We have been purchasing Darts individually (they’re $10-$15 each) and that has allowed us to check them out without the cost of a full bundle. If you’re considering BW I would encourage you to get a single issue of whichever level is appropriate for your needs (Dart, Arrow, Boomerang, etc.) and go from there.
Additionally, because I prefer an “open and go” approach, I sat down one weekend day and wrote out directions for myself for each day of the entire 4 week guide with how I intended to implement the material. It’s not a necessary step, but it has made it so easy to grab and use without having to think too much about it. I think once we get a few more under our belt, this won’t be necessary at all, but it’s made it very simple for me.
This is how I feel too. I actually really love their Darts/Arrows. But I have a hard time justifying the cost of an entire year of that plus one of their writing programs. I did try Jot It Down way back when we started homeschooling, but again it didn’t feel like we were doing much for the cost.
I hit play on this as soon as I saw the topic, as Lightning Literature was a major consideration for 4th grade. It was an "extra" though, as I just wanted to talk about great books. I love the idea of a "Book Discussion Guides!" If we find good ones along the way, lets share!:)
Yes, definitely! There’s always Teachers Pay Teachers, but there’s just so much to choose from on there.
@@RegularSecularMama yes I tend to only go on there when someone recommends something specific
Thank you for this review! I’ve been going back and fourth between this curriculum and LLATL. I found this video very helpful!
I’m so glad to hear that!
I'm curious which one you decided to go with and how it's working for you? I'm trying to decide between these two as well😅
@@darlinglittlethree5860 I ended up going with neither and created me own. We had already read most of the books for this curriculum and I wanted to expose them to new books.
I thought about it but had some concerns about the books for my 2nd grader and being too difficult for him to read independently. So I appreciate this video because it confirms perhaps what I was thinking and I also appreciate the confirm to stick with what works for our family. We are going to try MCT this next year after wathing your videos and my 5th grader is already thumbing through them
I could see how the lower levels would be hard to do independently. I feel like by upper elementary, many kids’ reading levels kind of even out?
Last year when we used lightning literature I started both my boys at level three and did it as read aloud then they just worked on their work independently that worked for us for a little bit but then they got bored with the book selection.
If you’re looking for a guide to assist with book discussions have you tried any of the brave writer book units?
It’s a shame when those purchases don’t pan out how we see them. It’s all part of the experience isn’t it.
We really liked the gentleness of LL in the lower grades but yes I pointed out in my flip through and review video that it is not an explicit writing program and that most people would need to add to it for that.
I really do like the Darts/Arrow guides from Brave Writer, but I’m too cheap to use them all the time 😅
@@RegularSecularMama you and me both and I won't buy a full bundle again. I will just pick and choose the odd book here and there
I was wanting the same things for my soon to be 6th grader. Have you looked into or ever tried BJU? It looks like they do an amazing job at breaking down literature discussions and elements. 😊
I mainly stick to secular curricula and resources, but thanks for the recommendation 😊
I found your review very interesting and useful. I would appreciate your input on my thoughts on how to use this in our homeschool! I think you make a lot of valid points about the student work not being as in depth as some other programs. I enjoy language and literature and enjoy going in depth on these topics. That being said, I can be very disorganized. Lightning Literature seems to offer great value in the quality book selections and the way it is paced and laid out over the course of a school year. I was wondering if it would work to use it as a spine, and add in some of the Michael Clay Thompson materials to expand on it. I find Michael Clay Thompson very appealing conceptually. Do you have any thoughts on this?
I’m probably not a good person to ask given how much we have loved using MCT 😆 I think Lightning Literature could work very well on its own if you didn’t feel MCT would be a good fit and if your kids do a great job reading/following directions independently. I’m not sure the grammar components really complement each other. LL seems to focus on one detail at a time, while MCT is a more rounded approach. I hope that makes sense.
Thank you this was so helpful! I actually had this in my cart but was torn because I’ve read and watched probably all the same reviews. We do grammar and writing separately but I thought I would pick out just parts of it. This helped me decide to stick to my CM choices.
I’m so glad it helped! I hate to dissuade anyone from trying something that may work great, but I felt it important to share our perspective.
Going to try Brave Writer this coming year.🤞 I really want to love it. My boys will only be 5 and 3, so super casual.
Brave Writer is very casual, so it sounds like a great fit! ☺️
Is there a different literature program you'd recommend?
We are still using Build Your Library, which includes read aloud literature that we discuss together and independent readers. We take a very laid back approach to the independent readers. My 13yo usually annotates and summarizes in the book while my 10yo keeps a small reading journal that he adds to after each day’s reading. Hope that helps!
@@RegularSecularMama it does! Thank you!!
We love Memoria Press literature guides. My first grader did story time treasures this year and did really well.
Thanks for the recommendation!
Thank you for thia review. It really helped me. My 13 year old is reading Rickshaw Girl. I cant imagine my younger kids reading it
I highly recommend The Diary 📔 of Anne Frank.
Thanks for the helpful review! I considered this but think I’d have a similar with my kids. Thanks for saving me the time and money 😊
You’re so welcome! 😊
We are going to use MCT next year for my 10-year-old. I have read through all the books and LOVE them. I really hope my daughter will love them as much as I do! I am considering EIW for extra grammar practice with MCT. Would you consider that reasonable or necessary? I think the grammar portion explanations in LL 5th grade are helpful but extremely wordy. We will add some of the recommended books to our collection, but sadly, we will not be using LL. We are using level 2: MCT next year, but I am considering purchasing Building Languages and The Music of the Hemispheres before introducing my daughter to Caesar's English I/II and Building Poems. Do you think that is reasonable to consider and would it work? If that makes sense. Thank you!
I have no experience with EIW, but I feel like MCT grammar is extremely thorough and doesn’t need any supplementation at all.
We used a few weeks of Caesar’s English I around the time my daughter started Grammar Town (and she had completed Building Language prior to that). There is quite a jump in workload from BL to CE! I honestly don’t think it is too much for her, but she seemed overwhelmed and I am prioritizing other L.A. skills over Latin-based vocabulary. So we decided to shelve it until next year. Just to give you an idea: BL has ten stems total, while CE has 5 new stems every other lesson and new vocabulary words in each lesson. There are lots of extra activities that reinforce the vocabulary, so many that you pretty much have to pick and choose.
Anyway, I think BL is a fun, gentle way to start working in Latin stems especially if she is at all resistant to language arts.
I haven’t used the poetics portion of MCT at all (although I want to!), so I can’t speak to how those work out.
How do you like the build your library independent selections? Is it not enough with MCT? I’m thinking of using brave writer with build your library and MCT next year. We also like writing and rhetoric for the writing portion.
That sounds like a solid plan! We have liked almost all of BYL’s independent readers. I’m not sure what you mean by not enough, but I feel like BYL language arts and MCT compliment each other nicely. I can’t speak to Brave Writer other than to say that I do like their approach, but I found it hard to justify the cost.
@@RegularSecularMama I definitely understand with the cost in BW. Honestly what made me reconsider is it’s really about the BW community which you get lifetime membership to. I did the read aloud revival for 3 months and liked it but overtime could not justify its cumulative cost, I also felt it a little young for my older kids. BW is a one time thing plus you hopefully do get some things to use. If your looking for an easy writing curriculum I would highly suggest writing and rhetoric your kids are my 2 oldest age and they enjoyed it the first book is on fables. It may be overkill with MCT but I just pick and choose what writing they actually complete from the MCT suggestions. And we work on the writing and rhetoric about 2wice a week. Also I meant that BYL readers hopefully have enough of the comprehension type questions built in for them to notebook etc ( I don’t know I’m just hoping because I’m buying level 3 for my son next year) sorry for the long post we just have similar homeschool styles.
Oh I see! The independent readers do not include discussion questions, but the kids are asked to complete narration assignments/projects. We usually just do oral narration after each day’s reading unless writing is light that week. The literature books that are read aloud do include vocabulary words and discussion questions. We also do this orally, but notebooking would be a great idea!
From what I understand, Writing and Rhetoric is not secular so I have not considered it.
Lol I am so petty but I cannot stand that they used comic sans for the font on the cover of their books. As a computer nerd, really??
We used it and found the same thing. We only use it for the analysis portion too.
It really would be cool if Hewitt published novel studies or something!
OK so I'm also looking for material that goes into the upper levels of blooms taxonomy, let us know if you find something!
Uh oh, I just ordered this! I hope I like it more than you did!
Also- someone just told me it isn't secular! Did you notice anything religious?
I looked pretty closely through the levels I bought and found nothing religious. I had not heard that it wasn’t secular. Perhaps they meant the company and not the curriculum?
@@amandamellen6937 I think it is meant to be secular. I'm using grade 2 with my 5 year old son. We skipped grade 1. But just a heads up.. In Grade 2, week 8 (which is the first poetry week) there is a poem called "All Things Bright and beautiful" in the student Workbook. It says "the Lord God made them all" as in all the creatures etc. And "how great is God Almighty"... I honestly thought it was a strange choice because it's the poem they used as an example to teach different poetry terms... Anyways I just wanted to let you know that... ☺️ At the moment we are on week 11 and haven't seen any thing else that might raise any eyebrows! I hope that helps 😊
Good to know!
So I've been having the same problem with Lightning Literature and thought about keeping it just for the literature part for next year but decided that would be too wasteful. I looked at Brave Writer, but it seems so expensive for what it is. I will have to look at BYL because I didn't think of using it for that aspect. I'll have to see what all it comes with. I have pruchased a few novel studies on TPT as well, and I may just do that for more novel studies if I don't find anything else for next year. Thank you for the review!
BYL is amazing for literature and independent readers, especially that tie into history topics! It’s not quite as detailed as Brave Writer darts and arrows, but she still includes plenty of copywork passages and discussion points. IMO it’s well worth the cost of the PDF even just for the book selections, copywork passages, and reading schedule.
So helpful. Thank you!
Of course! Reasons why things DON’T work is just as relevant as why they DO 😄
Might want to do audio books that can be downloaded. Back in the day I was growing up mid/late 90”s early 2000”s had cassette types for listening to book’s music church stuff, the crazy thing I still have some of them. I been seeing people selling boom boxes the old type with type player you played on the top area & bottom area Cd 💿 no iPhones 📱 or android phones. I keep hearing jokes about that lately I laugh so hard my cheeks go red. Yes my boyfriend & decided to do homeschooling from the beginning. I don’t trust public school perfonsals especially special Ed child study team. What I keep reading & hearing from news stuff. So no public school for my feature kids. The school system really mentally had me eaten alive not physically mentally. I tend to use figure of speech when talking or writing texting emailing, doing Instagram messaging my boyfriend. It’s pretty scary what’s been happening in special Ed. I could have nonverbal kids like I was for 6 years. Or high functioning. The school system as I realized it’s not meant for kids & teens young adults with special needs it’s just not.
The detail you went into was super helpful, thank you!!
You’re welcome! 🤗
I'm sorry for your underwhelming experience. Always a bummer when you're excited for a new curriculum and then realize it's not for you. Lightning Literature has always been one of those that every spring I wind up coming back and taking a peek at it and consider it, but wind up just choosing my own novels and buying different literature guides from various companies and creating my own literature curriculum that way. I've definitely heard amazing things from all over youtube and instagram about BYL!
Oh yes, BYL is definitely a keeper!