They used to be better at hitting their marks than they are nowadays. Walter ray jr and his 47 wins or the 40 wins of norm duke. Less power and more accurate.
Keep up the good work. While I do subscribe to several of the PBA pros channels, I find yours has some of the best content. Hearing your thought process and seeing the differences in terms of margin of error between the patterns is really cool and the interviews are great.
Man you KNOW I was tuning in for this 🤣🤣🤣🤣 Yeah BIG difference between amateur and a pro, I wish the PBA allowed more behind the scenes access so people CAN SEE and RESPECT the SPORT of bowling P.s. one important thing I've learned is BALL SPEED. I think if you were able to slow down your ball speed it would've been able to make the corner, especially when you missed right
I used to put a lot of effort on ball speed and what I've found is that it impacts my timing so much that I can't be as consistent at the bottom when my pace is interrupted. You're probably right in what would have happened with a ball speed adjustment, but for my game, I tend to have better results if I can just keep the same rate towards the line and keep my timing in tact. Glad you liked it. And one note on the behind the scenes stuff, it's on its way...
@@jimnewton5904 I agree and disagree. Consistency is really important in bowling but you gotta be able to adjust on what the lane is telling you. Personally, i think it's good to have different speeds and revs for different lane conditions. A few throws down the lane and I can tell if I need to adjust the speed, angle, or amount of hook I put on it.
To adjust my ball speed, I shorten my backswing a little. Doesn't mess with my timing too much and I can still be natural with my forward swing and follow through.
Great stuff! X years ago in our local bowling alley there were some complaints that the lane conditions were too easy, so the staff decided to try something else for a tournament: 40 feet flat, which was one of the US Open patterns that year. It was a very interesting experience. Also, zero complaints of the lanes being too easy to bowl :D
This Was another awesome video. 👌 & goes to show us that league is definitely easier than these sport patterns on tour . When the best players in the world are barely averaging 200 that's saying something.
I have bowled in 4 regional events (On Cheetah, Shark, Dragon, and Chameleon) and I have average 182, 199, 192, and 196 respectively. I bowl in them for the experience and I have so much appreciation for the Professionals and what they do.
I feel that I'd do okay, not great but okay, on the flat pattern because I don't have a ton of revs ( I feel that I could at least be around the pocket). The other pattern though, yeah forget about it.
I'd like to see you make a video of each oil pattern, what type of ball to start with on each pattern (RG, DIFF, SYMMETRICAL or ASYMMETRICAL) and the layout and pin for each pattern. I don't believe I've seen anyone do that. It would be helpful to alot of people.
Hey Joseph! Thank you for the idea. Although I do agree with you in principle in sharing more information, I will be approaching that from a little different angle soon to make those concepts more consumable to the learning bowler. Stay tuned!
Thank you for doing this video ! It was an awesome idea to show people. Way too many people have no idea how much harder bowling on the PBA Lane Conditions is than bowling on a typical House Shot. Great Job.
Phenomenal video, and the fact that it’s this hard with only one person shooting on it, I can’t imagine over dozens and dozens and hundreds of people bowling on different lanes every day. Great way to show how difficult being a Pro bowl really is!
My personal opinion and preference on flat patterns… Benchmark or controllable cover and stay up the back and roll as much as possible. Not everyone can do it but that’s how I attack flat. Thanks for sharing this from an amateur point of view!
I bowled on a 37' Red Square tonight. Let me tell you there's nothing like having thumb release issues on a flat pattern! I spent half the night trying to get my thumbs to release out of the ball taking tape out doing all kinds of crap just to be able to throw the ball and then work on the shot. It never fails. Started out with a 172, then a 193 still having some issues. It was to the point where all I wanted to do was throw the ball normally off my hand just once! My spare ball was okay because I throw it straight so I was making spares but, I left a lot of spares that were close chops or barely misses, splits that went around the pin. All-in-all I thought my spare shooting was good it was good. I was putting good shots on every spare but I threw a couple with Strike balls and had 2 chops After about 8th frame in the second game I was just pulling balls out of my SUV to see if I could get any ball of fit my thumb! I didn't even care if it was the right ball for the lanes! Finally I threw a shined up astrophysix about 2,000 Grit with extremely light polish on it. It came off my hand and I was thrilled! I could actually work on what I was supposed to do and figure out what to do. Last game standing 41 throwing over 23 at the arrows I shoot 231. I must have changed six balls trying to find one that fits. That's a case for interchangeable thumbs which I do have on a idol solid. But what I really discovered is I think I have the wrong pitches in my thumb holes. When you got all the tape out of your thumb hole and you still can't release/hanging, you know you got a serious issue going on! I've changed my base release slightly had I think now my thumb pitches are incompatible with it but when I tried to go back to my other releases they really were not working. Considering all the problems I had, averaging almost 200 is a huge accomplishment
Great clips and movies...... one tip from a certified trainer..... ( at least i have the certificates...) youre end posture / when you do the release and followthrough needs some tweaking..... then it would make it easier to deliver it on the spot
I know this old but I pitched on this pattern last night and the tour dynamix looked damn good on it with surface.. only problem was when it shined up it labored getting back
I was a two finger bowler before, it was very hard to control and manipulate on how I want my ball to react, I was not a double handed either. Maybe adding a thumb hole to yours will be great for you.
When you said 18 mils is forward and 8 is reverse so more would carry down, how does the direction of oiling affect that? I've always been under the impression the urethane/plastic equipment influenced that.
That's more of a personal observation than anything, but what I've seen in competition is that forward oil has a greater tendency to carry down and reverse oil stays put a little bit better. I wish I could tell you why but I don't have the science to back up that observation. However, when I look at lane graphs, that's basically the one ratio I look at to better understand how transition is going to go. Low flaring balls definitely impact it a lot as well, but it's just another variable that I've found that makes a difference for me.
I've bowled competitively at an amateur level for a while doing MSBS stuff around the Midwest. I'm also not terrible, but also not good. Never even paid attention to the forward/reverse oil combinations, but will probably have to now. Been loving listening to the podcasts and hearing the pros talk about how they view things. Thank you for the content you put out and the fast reply!
@@aimxiety6340 Glad you liked it. If you see something different, please let me know! I'm learning same as you are so hopefully we can get better together!
Ah this brings me back to the days of being the owner and managers guinea pig lol. Used to test every pattern we put out for scratch tournaments. We we're an older house with wood. This looks like like a few of the ones I tested. More specifically the 34ft we put out about 3-4 years ago.
@@TenPinLife I never took as punishment, it was always fun for me. It really opens your eyes to see where you are skill wise. More fun watching other people bowl on it though. We had a reputation in our area. We made people earn their cash. But for the most part people respected the heck out of us for it.
Thay was my initial thought. It looked like you had a pretty good reaction on a couple shots. Then you missed twice and changed balls. If you missed put that shot out of your mind and drive on. I have not bowled in a few years.
This wasn’t so much an attempt to bowl the highest score possible for three games guys. This is an experiment to see what different balls were giving me for reaction. I didn’t even put surface on any of the balls.
So you gotta get it out to the right,…but one inch too far to the right and you’re out of bounds. The ball isn’t coming back to the pocket. Then an inch too far left…and it goes high.
Very good video! I don't think you give yourself enough credit. Your spare game is very good. I wish I could shoot my spares half as good. Please don't make me shoot a 10 pin with the game on the line... #GutterWithoutADoubt
When Belmo left the 10 pin he needed to beat AJ at the US open last night, all I could think about was how bad I would whiff it lol. I appreciate the kind words George!
You are awesome in house pattern. To bowl a almost 800 is not easy! I like your channel which is very informative! Would like to hear or see more house shot tips. Keep up the good work!!! Thanks for the videos!
these videos are great!! Really makes me wanna try out these Patterns too. Sadly my homecenter doesnt have any hard PBA Patterns in their oil machines.. The flattest that they have is like 38 feet and 1:2.5 Ratio and 26ml.. Still hard but not nearly as hard as this one.
Hi, can you explain something about the numbers they mention like -40 or plus 100 in terms of the standing of each player. I know how to score a game but these numbers mean something else. Thanks.
That is the red Turbo tape. I have used the yellow VISE tape more, but I like them both. However, I don't use it to prevent callous. That's typically more of a fit issue that tape might hold off, but wont' entirely prevent. I have eczema so I use the tape to keep my skin on my fingers.
i have always wondered why pro's don't keep older balls they have confidence in from past games and success with them and use them in tough conditions, because they know how they will act. they just keep throwing the new balls they have to learn and figure out. I understand they are selling new products for there sponsors but isn't winning priority. Phase II, HyRoad, ..ole faithful balls is what i'm wondering about. Can they not throw older balls?
They can throw any legal ball. Wes Malott still throws the gold ball a ton. Norm Duke carried around a RG Menace for like 4 years. And don't get me started on how many guys still bring the Alpha Crux to events. The simplest answer is new covers carry better more often. They know how all the balls work. With their expertise and ball reps and the internal resources, there's no mystery what they're trying to do with the ball, so it's all about having the most effective tool for the job.
@@TenPinLife Thanks for reply, the only thing i may dis agree with is carry, i have a ball from 1997 Brunswick Helix and it Carries like no new ball i have and i have over 55 balls, all the great newest from storm, roto grip, global 900 etc....
I've bowled on this pattern at all types of lengths. Everything from 33ft flat to 50ft flat. Flat is tough in general so those are usually the harder ones to score on.
Some advice. Make adjustments based on good throws. Never try to adjust and or switch balls on a poor shot. Also write down what you are doing when practicing on these conditions. You will never keep all this information in your head. Remember that you are working towards what will work during COMPETITION.
I didn’t practice on this pair. The pros all only got 30 min on practice day and then whatever on the same day on the off lanes so it wasn’t much really.
Yes sir Biggest Of Daddies a little practice at least let's you eliminate stuff that won't work off the fresh when they break down thats where you earn the U.S OPEN Title.😀😃
I am FAR from a pro...hell, I'm barely a decent league bowler...but why were you trying to create so much shape on a short pattern? This one is definitely a case of straighter IS greater.
I bowl local ABT tournaments here in Vegas, and the last couple have used ABT #5. It's also 37', 28.3 mL, and 1.64:1 so very similar to US Open #2. Even as a lefty, I find myself getting lost on this pattern. I flip between the Pitch Black, Zen U, IQTS, and the Mix.
This is the condition that everyone bowled on until the 60s. Then conditioning oil was applied by hand out of a spray can. That is the reason that bowlers like Billy Hardwick or Dick Weber bowled down and in and a 220 was great score and you only needed one 16 pound rubber ball to compete. I think that ABC rules required that the oil be spread evenly across the lane and lanes where there were patterns like any of the modern patterns were considered "blocked" lanes and record scores were invalid if bowled on anything other that a flat pattern.
It’s one of the reasons I’d like to bowl in a Sport league… just to see if I could score. And I could also see guys averaging 200+ on a house pattern struggle. I’m typically averaging mid-180s.
I bowled on red square oil pattern for the first time today and it's my first time not bowling on a house shot. I had 193. Wow. I ended up using my spare for every shot because that was what actually looked the best and gave me the most strikes.
Nice video. Last year at nationals I shot 585 in doubles. Cash $286 for the tournament. That was the first time I bowled on a sport shot. I average 200 even. 4- 300's but very inconsistent. We have fun at the nationals. This video proves that we are human. Not pros. Thanks!
That's the red Turbo tape. I have used the yellow VISE tape also but you can't buy that anywhere right now so I'm trying this stuff out. So far I like it.
the cheetah open was similar to this pattern, they either through it up the gutter with urethane or whipped it out to the 1 board to hook back to the pocket. common thing is that they all through really fast
This pattern didn't really play anything like old cheetah (35'). Cheetah had way more shape built into the pattern and a lot more hook off of the gutter. Although similar in length, the play characteristics are much different. Just look at what Ronnie Russell did on it. He was spinning a urethane ball from 20 to like 8 and just swishing pins around like mad. Completely unorthodox, but it worked! Definitely not something you'd see him or almost anyone do on cheetah.
Shoutout to the ball reps on tour. Even the best of the best rely on those extra set of eyes to figure out what's going on down the lane and what ball is gonna do the job.
@@TenPinLife classy. Show me a clip where your trail leg is on the ground one time here. Otherwise, I enjoyed the video. These patterns are very difficult.
actually you came up on my recommendation to watch I just bought a 12 pound Brunswick twist the blue and silver I can't hook the ball to save my life but my average is still 163 and my highest game is 182 any tips you can give it honestly not trying to hook because I don't know how I've watched 1000s of videos and still can't lol
No step drills to start. Figure out the feel of keeping your hand behind the ball first. Then slowly move back to one step, two step and four step drills finding your timing. Or just throw it 2 handed.
Terrible would be 111 - 135 - 98. Getting to 170 twice and even posting a 220 game is good in my opinion. Add +11 for every missed spare and you wind up at even or maybe even plus. Only thing I’d add is whether or not that pitch purple up 3 would have worked.
With how much it hooked in the first few shots, moving right wasn’t gonna happen. Would have had to have been too accurate and also too forward with it so it wouldn’t go dead Brooklyn.
Can someone help me out. I'm a two hander with a good amount of power. A lot of these shots I see from him I feel like if I had hit them in the same spot it would have definitely struck. Is this just a speed thing or is it an angle thing. Because I know my angles are probably different as well.
I typically will be 2-3 boards right of that to start and then the rest is all in vision. I can see where my ball picks up best after a relatively short time, so it's just about seeing what works best on that day, in that center or on that pair. There's no 'right' answer though. Too many variables to say 31 is always right, or any number for that matter.
First off, you never tried "real" urethane. Pitch Purple is mild resin. Pitch Black with a rolly layout would have been best. But, just like I found out when I experimented with short patterns, a polished pearl with a length layout actually works very well. You basically can get the ball clean all the way to the pocket over the long dry portion of the short pattern and then at the last second the pearl will hook into the pocket and also protect you on misses right.
@@TenPinLife I am not an amateur like you, I am just a plain old league bowler. But...you are welcome to watch me humiliate myself on the 32' Wolf Pattern. I bowl a three game series just like you: ruclips.net/video/Rrc4fmWQ0UQ/видео.html I was trying out my new Brunswick Purple Hammer that day with a polished Mix for spares. The new Purple is much different from the originals. The remake is a very flat rolling ball. Doesn't really drive very well but provides control. You will see on this jumpy pattern how even tiny mistakes are amplified down lane and there is virtually zero margin for error. Since this video I have learned a lot about bowling on sport patterns as I continue in my sport league.
The second ball of the 10th frame, game 1 was the best ball you threw, and the 1st ball in that frame was only barely worse. I'm not sure why you didn't just work to execute on that, v. changing balls over and over. In the secong game when you said 'I have no idea what to do' I was talking to my monitor saying 'you forgot about your 10th frame!' Super great videos!
@@TenPinLife if I wasn't clear, I didn't mean that in a 'hey, that was a dumb move' way...I just liked that ball reaction on that shot. Later on when you had that reactive ball on the verge of rolling out those were also great shots. Love the vids!
@@TenPinLife that's the problem with the Pitch Purple, it's too angular because it's not really urethane. More traditional urethane is earlier and smoother, and wouldve done a better job controlling the backends. I would throw urethane up ~8-5 area for as long as possible and then moved in with something bigger and use the hold from the urethane. More surface and less axis rotation are both very important for urethane on sport as well. My go to for very closed angles is a Fast Pitch at 500grit
I have bowled on several sport shots and honestly I don’t think they are all that difficult especially if you have access to a good arsenal of balls. What really separates pro bowlers is consistency. On sport shots you have to find your shot and keep that mark and adjust to lane changes amateurs will find their mark one frame then miss their mark the next where as pros will find their mark and keep it.
The thing that separates an amateur from a pro is being able to read the lane, adjust accurately, and then execute. All three of which are terribly difficult.
@@TenPinLife I know a lot of amateurs who can read the lane and and adjust accordingly. Execution I believe is the most crucial. Pros execute their shots with far more frequency and consistency than amateurs. In fact about 90% of the amateur bowlers that I know can tell you how to adjust and what boards to stand and marks to shoot at but when they go to make their shot they flat out miss right or left. Which was the case a few times in this very video. You can get away with this more often on house shot but sport shots will punish you.
With me not using my thumb, that adjustment doesn't make sense to most people when I explain it unfortunately because I can do things you can't do with your thumb in the ball.
what is your avg.? Accuracy needs a lot of work. If you watch the show you will see how close they throw the ball to the target every time. Loved the video and I hope others will realize how hard the conditions are on the tour.
@@TenPinLife thank you for the reply. I do love the video. I did not say that to be mean but to point out just how accurate they are on the tour. Even Belmonte is within 1 inch with all 10 shots in a game. It just amazes me how well the control their speed and entry angle. Thank you again and good luck. Keep up the great videos.
@@TenPinLife I loved the Idol but not the Helios. We have new lanes and a 44 foot house pattern where I bowl, and the Helios just burns up and hits flat when it goes through the pocket. I've played with the surface but it's just not working where I bowl wheras I can still use my old Idol.
Did you watch the same video I did? I moved right, and then it was gone after that. Also, traditionally these types of patterns are won by those move left and can control their down lane reaction best (See PDW 5x)
@@TenPinLife You keep right with a weaker ball so you leave easier spares in the beginning. You move down as the pattern breaks down. Because the pattern's so flat, the lower you play on the boards the bigger your mistakes get amplified. No one does great on these types of patterns. Hence it's the ones that have less breaks that win in the long run. If you're playing match play it's usually the more accurate one that takes the cup. If you're going to have to play several games on a pattern like that, the guy who leaves less splits will most likely win.
I bowled the Ebonite winter classic and it was 35ft 28mils 1to 1. Nick Pate just had made team USA and shot 163 on it . It was brutal took -83 to make match play.
Averaging 225 in league you would get murdered on the pro tour. I think you gotta average 240 to consider trying out. Averaging 240 would mean your accuracy gotten really really good.....but that's only the first step. What you are doing right now is the best way to approach becoming better. League shots hide your weaknesses. I suggest you and maybe some of your friends to practice on these pro patterns.....but until then get that average to 240 and then and only then are you ready for the next step.
I disagree. League average has nothing to do with how good you actually are. Most pros will say they hate house shots and score better on harder patterns.
@@SirJoelsuf1 I don't understand why any pro would say a tougher shot is easier to play then a league shot. League shots you can getaway with bad shots tougher shots you can't. We've just seen in the video if you make a poor shot you get penalized. I always thought and still do pros never wanted to compete on high scoring shots with amateur pros. Who wants to compete with other people shooting 278. He shot 573 right now because it was harder not because he isn't a pro.....What do you think?
It’s actually easier solo, imagine the transition and crossing pairs. Professionals are extremely skilled
Oh it's 1,000,000,000x easier solo.
Dealing with the oil burning up especially, makes it way harder
Also the production lights and body heat from the crowd on televised events make the oil break down quicker as well!
Thats what he was saying haha nice try
They used to be better at hitting their marks than they are nowadays. Walter ray jr and his 47 wins or the 40 wins of norm duke. Less power and more accurate.
Keep up the good work. While I do subscribe to several of the PBA pros channels, I find yours has some of the best content. Hearing your thought process and seeing the differences in terms of margin of error between the patterns is really cool and the interviews are great.
I really appreciate that! Happy to do it and am excited to see what else I can do!
Man you KNOW I was tuning in for this 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Yeah BIG difference between amateur and a pro, I wish the PBA allowed more behind the scenes access so people CAN SEE and RESPECT the SPORT of bowling
P.s. one important thing I've learned is BALL SPEED. I think if you were able to slow down your ball speed it would've been able to make the corner, especially when you missed right
I used to put a lot of effort on ball speed and what I've found is that it impacts my timing so much that I can't be as consistent at the bottom when my pace is interrupted. You're probably right in what would have happened with a ball speed adjustment, but for my game, I tend to have better results if I can just keep the same rate towards the line and keep my timing in tact.
Glad you liked it. And one note on the behind the scenes stuff, it's on its way...
@@TenPinLife Ball speed needs to be the constant not something you play with....lift angle and everything else are the variables
@@jimnewton5904 I agree and disagree. Consistency is really important in bowling but you gotta be able to adjust on what the lane is telling you. Personally, i think it's good to have different speeds and revs for different lane conditions. A few throws down the lane and I can tell if I need to adjust the speed, angle, or amount of hook I put on it.
To adjust my ball speed, I shorten my backswing a little. Doesn't mess with my timing too much and I can still be natural with my forward swing and follow through.
@@nevinkinzel exactly
Great stuff! X years ago in our local bowling alley there were some complaints that the lane conditions were too easy, so the staff decided to try something else for a tournament: 40 feet flat, which was one of the US Open patterns that year. It was a very interesting experience. Also, zero complaints of the lanes being too easy to bowl :D
Those old 40’ patterns were savage. I love bowling on ‘em.
This Was another awesome video. 👌 & goes to show us that league is definitely easier than these sport patterns on tour . When the best players in the world are barely averaging 200 that's saying something.
Glad you liked it!
Bowled in a PBA shot league last summer. Results similar to yours. Very difficult and challenging but fun in a frustrating way. 😀
Fun-strating!
I bowled on it a few weeks ago and it is really hard! A lot weirder than I expected
Very hard! Glad you got to give it a run though!
I have bowled in 4 regional events (On Cheetah, Shark, Dragon, and Chameleon) and I have average 182, 199, 192, and 196 respectively. I bowl in them for the experience and I have so much appreciation for the Professionals and what they do.
They certainly aren’t easy! Amazing how good these guys are l!
I feel that I'd do okay, not great but okay, on the flat pattern because I don't have a ton of revs ( I feel that I could at least be around the pocket). The other pattern though, yeah forget about it.
You think if nick added these patterns to the summer series his alcohol sales would go up?? Lol
They would just from me alone!
@@TenPinLife now I don't doubt that at all
I'd like to see you make a video of each oil pattern, what type of ball to start with on each pattern (RG, DIFF, SYMMETRICAL or ASYMMETRICAL) and the layout and pin for each pattern. I don't believe I've seen anyone do that. It would be helpful to alot of people.
Hey Joseph! Thank you for the idea. Although I do agree with you in principle in sharing more information, I will be approaching that from a little different angle soon to make those concepts more consumable to the learning bowler. Stay tuned!
Quality info, superb banter, and genuinely entertaining! Stoked for more, excellent work!!!
Thank you!
11:05 "There's no pride in bowling" - truer words have never been said... 😎
You know it!
this was great to watch I would love to you bowl the various pro patterns. Your commentary is great and seeing every shot is very helpful. Thank you
Glad you liked it Jim!
Thank you for doing this video ! It was an awesome idea to show people. Way too many people have no idea how much harder bowling on the PBA Lane Conditions is than bowling on a typical House Shot. Great Job.
Thanks Chris!
Great bowling. -27 on that for a 3 game set is good bowling.
Thanks Sydney!
Phenomenal video, and the fact that it’s this hard with only one person shooting on it, I can’t imagine over dozens and dozens and hundreds of people bowling on different lanes every day. Great way to show how difficult being a Pro bowl really is!
That video of Simonsen almost ripping off the scoring machine off the stand makes A LOT more sense to me now!
I only dream of breaking 200 in tenpin, best I got was 169. Then again, candlepin is my thing, I hold my own there.
I want to candlepin one day so bad!
@@TenPinLife If you're ever in New England, Nova Scotia, take a whack at it.
@@georgef551 Oh when life gives me those lemons, I will certainly be making lemonade
My personal opinion and preference on flat patterns… Benchmark or controllable cover and stay up the back and roll as much as possible. Not everyone can do it but that’s how I attack flat. Thanks for sharing this from an amateur point of view!
Glad you liked it!
I bowled on a 37' Red Square tonight. Let me tell you there's nothing like having thumb release issues on a flat pattern! I spent half the night trying to get my thumbs to release out of the ball taking tape out doing all kinds of crap just to be able to throw the ball and then work on the shot. It never fails. Started out with a 172, then a 193 still having some issues. It was to the point where all I wanted to do was throw the ball normally off my hand just once!
My spare ball was okay because I throw it straight so I was making spares but, I left a lot of spares that were close chops or barely misses, splits that went around the pin.
All-in-all I thought my spare shooting was good it was good. I was putting good shots on every spare but I threw a couple with Strike balls and had 2 chops
After about 8th frame in the second game I was just pulling balls out of my SUV to see if I could get any ball of fit my thumb!
I didn't even care if it was the right ball for the lanes!
Finally I threw a shined up astrophysix about 2,000 Grit with extremely light polish on it.
It came off my hand and I was thrilled! I could actually work on what I was supposed to do and figure out what to do.
Last game standing 41 throwing over 23 at the arrows I shoot 231.
I must have changed six balls trying to find one that fits. That's a case for interchangeable thumbs which I do have on a idol solid. But what I really discovered is I think I have the wrong pitches in my thumb holes. When you got all the tape out of your thumb hole and you still can't release/hanging, you know you got a serious issue going on!
I've changed my base release slightly had I think now my thumb pitches are incompatible with it but when I tried to go back to my other releases they really were not working.
Considering all the problems I had, averaging almost 200 is a huge accomplishment
When they are tough, Brooklyn is GOOD!
First year at nationals during team event I aimed for it... 10 is 10!
True that! 😂
Great clips and movies...... one tip from a certified trainer..... ( at least i have the certificates...) youre end posture / when you do the release and followthrough needs some tweaking..... then it would make it easier to deliver it on the spot
I know this old but I pitched on this pattern last night and the tour dynamix looked damn good on it with surface.. only problem was when it shined up it labored getting back
I was a two finger bowler before, it was very hard to control and manipulate on how I want my ball to react, I was not a double handed either. Maybe adding a thumb hole to yours will be great for you.
When you said 18 mils is forward and 8 is reverse so more would carry down, how does the direction of oiling affect that? I've always been under the impression the urethane/plastic equipment influenced that.
That's more of a personal observation than anything, but what I've seen in competition is that forward oil has a greater tendency to carry down and reverse oil stays put a little bit better. I wish I could tell you why but I don't have the science to back up that observation. However, when I look at lane graphs, that's basically the one ratio I look at to better understand how transition is going to go.
Low flaring balls definitely impact it a lot as well, but it's just another variable that I've found that makes a difference for me.
I've bowled competitively at an amateur level for a while doing MSBS stuff around the Midwest. I'm also not terrible, but also not good. Never even paid attention to the forward/reverse oil combinations, but will probably have to now. Been loving listening to the podcasts and hearing the pros talk about how they view things. Thank you for the content you put out and the fast reply!
@@aimxiety6340 Glad you liked it. If you see something different, please let me know! I'm learning same as you are so hopefully we can get better together!
Ah this brings me back to the days of being the owner and managers guinea pig lol. Used to test every pattern we put out for scratch tournaments. We we're an older house with wood. This looks like like a few of the ones I tested. More specifically the 34ft we put out about 3-4 years ago.
Gotta subject yourself to the punishment first, for sure! I love guinea pigging stuff like this.
@@TenPinLife I never took as punishment, it was always fun for me. It really opens your eyes to see where you are skill wise. More fun watching other people bowl on it though. We had a reputation in our area. We made people earn their cash. But for the most part people respected the heck out of us for it.
Stories please.
Stop making adjustments off a bad shot. Your making it way hard then it needs to be
Thanks for the help Pete
Thay was my initial thought. It looked like you had a pretty good reaction on a couple shots. Then you missed twice and changed balls. If you missed put that shot out of your mind and drive on. I have not bowled in a few years.
This wasn’t so much an attempt to bowl the highest score possible for three games guys. This is an experiment to see what different balls were giving me for reaction. I didn’t even put surface on any of the balls.
Don't listen to these guys....peter piper picked a pepper and hobby bobby... they don't know any better
You seem to lose your balance whenever your trail leg is up. Great job on this though, I know I'd struggle just as much, if not more.
You could have stopped that sentence much sooner. I seem to lose my balance. LOL
So you gotta get it out to the right,…but one inch too far to the right and you’re out of bounds. The ball isn’t coming back to the pocket. Then an inch too far left…and it goes high.
Very good video! I don't think you give yourself enough credit. Your spare game is very good. I wish I could shoot my spares half as good. Please don't make me shoot a 10 pin with the game on the line... #GutterWithoutADoubt
When Belmo left the 10 pin he needed to beat AJ at the US open last night, all I could think about was how bad I would whiff it lol. I appreciate the kind words George!
You are awesome in house pattern. To bowl a almost 800 is not easy!
I like your channel which is very informative! Would like to hear or see more house shot tips. Keep up the good work!!!
Thanks for the videos!
Here's my best tip for bowling on house shots.
Do it as little as possible.
these videos are great!! Really makes me wanna try out these Patterns too. Sadly my homecenter doesnt have any hard PBA Patterns in their oil machines..
The flattest that they have is like 38 feet and 1:2.5 Ratio and 26ml.. Still hard but not nearly as hard as this one.
Glad you like them!
First time subscriber. Please keep doing these kind of tutorials videos. You’re good bowler by the way.
Glad you liked it! I appreciate the kind words!
Hi, can you explain something about the numbers they mention like -40 or plus 100 in terms of the standing of each player. I know how to score a game but these numbers mean something else. Thanks.
Plus/Minus is all based on 200 as a zero score. If I shoot 230, I'm +30. If I then shoot 160 (-40), I'm -10 for the day.
Hope that helps!
Should save this pattern for the Summer League haha, I'm sure Nick wouldn't mind putting it out. Make for a great night.
I'll stick behind the camera that night!
This was cool to watch. Do more of these
What kind of tape is that on your fingers? I might need to get that since I get calluses on the side of my fingers
That is the red Turbo tape. I have used the yellow VISE tape more, but I like them both. However, I don't use it to prevent callous. That's typically more of a fit issue that tape might hold off, but wont' entirely prevent. I have eczema so I use the tape to keep my skin on my fingers.
Can you roll on some long patterns? 46' maybe ?
It was enjoyable with your comments. Please keep it up bowling on the pros lane conditions.
Glad you liked it!
i have always wondered why pro's don't keep older balls they have confidence in from past games and success with them and use them in tough conditions, because they know how they will act. they just keep throwing the new balls they have to learn and figure out. I understand they are selling new products for there sponsors but isn't winning priority. Phase II, HyRoad, ..ole faithful balls is what i'm wondering about. Can they not throw older balls?
They can throw any legal ball. Wes Malott still throws the gold ball a ton. Norm Duke carried around a RG Menace for like 4 years. And don't get me started on how many guys still bring the Alpha Crux to events.
The simplest answer is new covers carry better more often. They know how all the balls work. With their expertise and ball reps and the internal resources, there's no mystery what they're trying to do with the ball, so it's all about having the most effective tool for the job.
@@TenPinLife Thanks for reply, the only thing i may dis agree with is carry, i have a ball from 1997 Brunswick Helix and it Carries like no new ball i have and i have over 55 balls, all the great newest from storm, roto grip, global 900 etc....
Over these two videos I've loved seeing your arsenal! It's my dream arsenal can you make a video explaining it?
I think I can make that happen Isaac!
I've bowled on this pattern at all types of lengths. Everything from 33ft flat to 50ft flat. Flat is tough in general so those are usually the harder ones to score on.
Definitely not something that I want to bowl on every day.
I hope your channel gets the exposure it deserves! Keep it up brotha!
Thank you RJ! Super happy you like my stuff so far!
Another great video!
Thanks again!
Some advice. Make adjustments based on good throws. Never try to adjust and or switch balls on a poor shot. Also write down what you are doing when practicing on these conditions. You will never keep all this information in your head. Remember that you are working towards what will work during COMPETITION.
This was practice?
News to me.
I am absolutely loving your content, just started listening to all the podcasts on Spotify.
Glad you enjoy it!
Hello just for some contrast what is your league average?
Around 225
To be fair, they get a day or two of practice. Did you practice a few shots on these patterns before filming?
I didn’t practice on this pair. The pros all only got 30 min on practice day and then whatever on the same day on the off lanes so it wasn’t much really.
Yes sir Biggest Of Daddies a little practice at least let's you eliminate stuff that won't work off the fresh when they break down thats where you earn the U.S OPEN Title.😀😃
I am FAR from a pro...hell, I'm barely a decent league bowler...but why were you trying to create so much shape on a short pattern? This one is definitely a case of straighter IS greater.
When you make your video, let me know 😉
I bowl local ABT tournaments here in Vegas, and the last couple have used ABT #5. It's also 37', 28.3 mL, and 1.64:1 so very similar to US Open #2. Even as a lefty, I find myself getting lost on this pattern. I flip between the Pitch Black, Zen U, IQTS, and the Mix.
This is the condition that everyone bowled on until the 60s. Then conditioning oil was applied by hand out of a spray can. That is the reason that bowlers like Billy Hardwick or Dick Weber bowled down and in and a 220 was great score and you only needed one 16 pound rubber ball to compete. I think that ABC rules required that the oil be spread evenly across the lane and lanes where there were patterns like any of the modern patterns were considered "blocked" lanes and record scores were invalid if bowled on anything other that a flat pattern.
There was also 3mls of oil so friction was not in short supply regardless of how “flat” it was or wasn’t.
I really like these videos, but I do wish you'd throw up the oil pattern schematic at the beginning.
Yeah that was one of those thing I thought about after hitting ‘publish’. Live and learn
It’s one of the reasons I’d like to bowl in a Sport league… just to see if I could score. And I could also see guys averaging 200+ on a house pattern struggle. I’m typically averaging mid-180s.
I bowled on red square oil pattern for the first time today and it's my first time not bowling on a house shot. I had 193. Wow. I ended up using my spare for every shot because that was what actually looked the best and gave me the most strikes.
Great video. "There is no pride in bowling", best line ever!
Glad you liked it Peter!
Why not play spares straight like the big boys... I know you are thumb out so I suppose that is reason why
Oh you mean the two times where I leave a 2-8 combination and the conversion percentage goes up substantially when you hook at it? I wonder why.
Nice video. Last year at nationals I shot 585 in doubles. Cash $286 for the tournament. That was the first time I bowled on a sport shot. I average 200 even. 4- 300's but very inconsistent. We have fun at the nationals. This video proves that we are human. Not pros. Thanks!
Glad you enjoyed it Jack. Are you bowling nationals again this year?
Yes, July 9 and 10.
@@shadowsp8888 awesome! Good luck out there!
@@TenPinLife Thanks man! Will give my best!
what kind of tape is that on your fingers?
That's the red Turbo tape. I have used the yellow VISE tape also but you can't buy that anywhere right now so I'm trying this stuff out. So far I like it.
Hey we live close to Westin lanes love there!
That’s home for me!
Excellent work! I used to think I was pretty good but learned that I was a good league bowler. Keep working buddy you're young you'll get there yet!
the cheetah open was similar to this pattern, they either through it up the gutter with urethane or whipped it out to the 1 board to hook back to the pocket. common thing is that they all through really fast
This pattern didn't really play anything like old cheetah (35'). Cheetah had way more shape built into the pattern and a lot more hook off of the gutter. Although similar in length, the play characteristics are much different. Just look at what Ronnie Russell did on it. He was spinning a urethane ball from 20 to like 8 and just swishing pins around like mad. Completely unorthodox, but it worked! Definitely not something you'd see him or almost anyone do on cheetah.
Nothing like cheetah whatsoever
Shoutout to the ball reps on tour. Even the best of the best rely on those extra set of eyes to figure out what's going on down the lane and what ball is gonna do the job.
We need a netflix series following top and wannabees
Well lucky for me I’m neither.
Great video man. Keep it up
Thanks Jesse!!
I’m loving these vids! Keep up the great work.
Glad you like them! Will do!
@@TenPinLife come to Tampa let’s bowl!
I like that purple x2.
Me too, even though it scared me when i grabbed it LOL
Why didn’t you just try to go straighter? Example play up the 10 not on a angle pattern is 37 feet right?
Because I suck playing straight?
@@TenPinLife 😂😂😂 have to practice
Your trail leg is all over the place. You have no balance
Your mouth is all over the place. You have no self control.
@@TenPinLife classy. Show me a clip where your trail leg is on the ground one time here. Otherwise, I enjoyed the video. These patterns are very difficult.
actually you came up on my recommendation to watch I just bought a 12 pound Brunswick twist the blue and silver I can't hook the ball to save my life but my average is still 163 and my highest game is 182 any tips you can give it honestly not trying to hook because I don't know how I've watched 1000s of videos and still can't lol
No step drills to start. Figure out the feel of keeping your hand behind the ball first. Then slowly move back to one step, two step and four step drills finding your timing.
Or just throw it 2 handed.
Great stuff
Glad you liked it!
Terrible would be 111 - 135 - 98. Getting to 170 twice and even posting a 220 game is good in my opinion. Add +11 for every missed spare and you wind up at even or maybe even plus.
Only thing I’d add is whether or not that pitch purple up 3 would have worked.
With how much it hooked in the first few shots, moving right wasn’t gonna happen. Would have had to have been too accurate and also too forward with it so it wouldn’t go dead Brooklyn.
Great Video again!
Glad you enjoyed it!
funny stuff
Glad you liked it Jim!
Can someone help me out. I'm a two hander with a good amount of power. A lot of these shots I see from him I feel like if I had hit them in the same spot it would have definitely struck. Is this just a speed thing or is it an angle thing. Because I know my angles are probably different as well.
Just go bowl on it and find out.
If not a fan of the 31 rule, how do you determine the BP?
I typically will be 2-3 boards right of that to start and then the rest is all in vision. I can see where my ball picks up best after a relatively short time, so it's just about seeing what works best on that day, in that center or on that pair.
There's no 'right' answer though. Too many variables to say 31 is always right, or any number for that matter.
@@TenPinLife good points. Looking at the graph almost pigeon holes you into a part of the lane that maybe chops miss room by more then you can afford.
@@REVTrackStaffright. Basically, don’t let some rule or a lane graph tell you your eye is wrong.
Love these
Glad you like them!
I can definitely tell a good shit from a bad shot when you pull left. Wish I could that fir myself! Haha good stuff!
Glad you like it.
I’m below an amateur bowler, only knew 5 words you were saying but I still enjoyed this
Glad you liked it Vincent
Great video. First time seeing you. Are you from Wisconsin? Keep it up!!
Glad the algorithm worked! I’m near Wausau WI!
2:19 spare ball at normal pocket shot spare? is that coz u were still lining up?
I just go straight at everything I can when I'm on flat. Especially when my execution isn't great yet.
On these types of patterns my best bet is always Urethene up the track and pray for the best lol
Every shot was just a hope and a prayer regardless of the ball in hand.
First off, you never tried "real" urethane. Pitch Purple is mild resin. Pitch Black with a rolly layout would have been best.
But, just like I found out when I experimented with short patterns, a polished pearl with a length layout actually works very well.
You basically can get the ball clean all the way to the pocket over the long dry portion of the short pattern and then at the last second the pearl will hook into the pocket and also protect you on misses right.
When you post your video showing how you'd do it, be sure to tag me!
@@TenPinLife I am not an amateur like you, I am just a plain old league bowler.
But...you are welcome to watch me humiliate myself on the 32' Wolf Pattern. I bowl a three game series just like you: ruclips.net/video/Rrc4fmWQ0UQ/видео.html
I was trying out my new Brunswick Purple Hammer that day with a polished Mix for spares.
The new Purple is much different from the originals. The remake is a very flat rolling ball. Doesn't really drive very well but provides control.
You will see on this jumpy pattern how even tiny mistakes are amplified down lane and there is virtually zero margin for error.
Since this video I have learned a lot about bowling on sport patterns as I continue in my sport league.
The second ball of the 10th frame, game 1 was the best ball you threw, and the 1st ball in that frame was only barely worse. I'm not sure why you didn't just work to execute on that, v. changing balls over and over. In the secong game when you said 'I have no idea what to do' I was talking to my monitor saying 'you forgot about your 10th frame!'
Super great videos!
You're probably right. I was leaning more into the experiment though. Glad you liked 'em!
@@TenPinLife if I wasn't clear, I didn't mean that in a 'hey, that was a dumb move' way...I just liked that ball reaction on that shot. Later on when you had that reactive ball on the verge of rolling out those were also great shots.
Love the vids!
@@airtimepaintball463 you’re good my man! Glad you like em!
@@TenPinLife I forgot to mention I'd be lucky to break 450 on that shot :)
Definitely needed a "weaker" urethane ball for game 1 at least. Purple Hammer, Fast Pitch, something like those
I disagree. The last thing I needed was more angle. If I were to go back, I would have sanded the Reality and pushed that as long as I could have.
@@TenPinLife that's the problem with the Pitch Purple, it's too angular because it's not really urethane. More traditional urethane is earlier and smoother, and wouldve done a better job controlling the backends. I would throw urethane up ~8-5 area for as long as possible and then moved in with something bigger and use the hold from the urethane. More surface and less axis rotation are both very important for urethane on sport as well. My go to for very closed angles is a Fast Pitch at 500grit
I have bowled on several sport shots and honestly I don’t think they are all that difficult especially if you have access to a good arsenal of balls. What really separates pro bowlers is consistency. On sport shots you have to find your shot and keep that mark and adjust to lane changes amateurs will find their mark one frame then miss their mark the next where as pros will find their mark and keep it.
The thing that separates an amateur from a pro is being able to read the lane, adjust accurately, and then execute. All three of which are terribly difficult.
@@TenPinLife I know a lot of amateurs who can read the lane and and adjust accordingly. Execution I believe is the most crucial. Pros execute their shots with far more frequency and consistency than amateurs. In fact about 90% of the amateur bowlers that I know can tell you how to adjust and what boards to stand and marks to shoot at but when they go to make their shot they flat out miss right or left. Which was the case a few times in this very video. You can get away with this more often on house shot but sport shots will punish you.
I enjoyed your authenticity sir, salute 🫡
Thanks Sal!
Hand position would have helped a ton as well! Good content!
With me not using my thumb, that adjustment doesn't make sense to most people when I explain it unfortunately because I can do things you can't do with your thumb in the ball.
what is your avg.? Accuracy needs a lot of work. If you watch the show you will see how close they throw the ball to the target every time. Loved the video and I hope others will realize how hard the conditions are on the tour.
I’m well aware of how inaccurate I am lol. Glad you liked the video.
@@TenPinLife thank you for the reply. I do love the video. I did not say that to be mean but to point out just how accurate they are on the tour. Even Belmonte is within 1 inch with all 10 shots in a game. It just amazes me how well the control their speed and entry angle. Thank you again and good luck. Keep up the great videos.
Really enjoyed this video, very relatable. Especially how the Helios not striking.
Is that a dump on the Helios? Lol. I love that ball.
@@TenPinLife I loved the Idol but not the Helios. We have new lanes and a 44 foot house pattern where I bowl, and the Helios just burns up and hits flat when it goes through the pocket. I've played with the surface but it's just not working where I bowl wheras I can still use my old Idol.
@@machinethesun9243 the shapes of those two balls were definitely way different.
Should of tried your spare ball
That would have been boring.
2:30 “ten at the arrows”
the shot: “HOW ABOUT 13?!?”
I never said I hit it
@@TenPinLife touché…
Were you in the movie Green Lantern?
I haven't even seen it. MCU 4 LIFE
Lose the 2 finger style, stay down on the approach and develop a “pro-tuck to release swing” and you’ll be more consistent.
No.
Bruh
@@jakesnussbuster3565 just trying to help
@@TenPinLife just trying to help
That's why you keep right on a flat pattern like that.
Did you watch the same video I did? I moved right, and then it was gone after that. Also, traditionally these types of patterns are won by those move left and can control their down lane reaction best (See PDW 5x)
@@TenPinLife You keep right with a weaker ball so you leave easier spares in the beginning. You move down as the pattern breaks down. Because the pattern's so flat, the lower you play on the boards the bigger your mistakes get amplified. No one does great on these types of patterns. Hence it's the ones that have less breaks that win in the long run. If you're playing match play it's usually the more accurate one that takes the cup. If you're going to have to play several games on a pattern like that, the guy who leaves less splits will most likely win.
@@Jeon1958able When you make your video showing everyone how to play right on this pattern please tag me in it. Would love to see how you do it.
Try keeping your trail leg down on release. It might help keep your hips more in line with what you're trying to do.
Funny story. When I was editing this, I thought the exact same thing lol
I bowled the Ebonite winter classic and it was 35ft 28mils 1to 1. Nick Pate just had made team USA and shot 163 on it . It was brutal took -83 to make match play.
Joe does an awesome job with the GIBA tournaments. Great grinders for sure!
@@TenPinLife Ben have you ever bowled a GIBA tournament?
@@redcat5697 I made the trek down that way last year for one at Cadillac. It’s a pretty big haul to get that way but I hope to more in the future
Stop moving every ball. You hit a strike stay there.
Why are you here
Averaging 225 in league you would get murdered on the pro tour. I think you gotta average 240 to consider trying out. Averaging 240 would mean your accuracy gotten really really good.....but that's only the first step. What you are doing right now is the best way to approach becoming better. League shots hide your weaknesses. I suggest you and maybe some of your friends to practice on these pro patterns.....but until then get that average to 240 and then and only then are you ready for the next step.
I disagree. League average has nothing to do with how good you actually are. Most pros will say they hate house shots and score better on harder patterns.
@@SirJoelsuf1 I don't understand why any pro would say a tougher shot is easier to play then a league shot. League shots you can getaway with bad shots tougher shots you can't. We've just seen in the video if you make a poor shot you get penalized. I always thought and still do pros never wanted to compete on high scoring shots with amateur pros. Who wants to compete with other people shooting 278. He shot 573 right now because it was harder not because he isn't a pro.....What do you think?
its easier when you can hit the same spot...
Wow you’re so cool. Thanks for the awesome contribution.
@@TenPinLife anytime 😉
Dude changed balls way to much should stay with the helios with surface 1000k or so and make better shots no magic ball
You should coach.