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@@BlackBeltBarrister do you have an email I could ask you a quick question on
Not sure if it is an English law but definitely not a UK wide. As far as it has worked for myself, I received tickets from the so called blue meanies in a certain Scottish city from a private company working for the local council. I have never paid any of those. I did receive a council your bill has doubled, tripled and then threat letters from a debt collectors company stating they are sheriff officers. They are not acting as such as there had never been a court issued cash grab.
These are civil processes not criminal and the letters stopped.
If it is a police or police parking warden with yellow check those must be paid. The exact same for extortion companies saying you must pay like Costa, Starbucks, Mcd, Tesco and other car parks run by private companies we can not be forced to pay and will not be extorted by private companies with no contractual obligation to myself, my company or vehicle. I'd tour all paying these private companies your the reason they exist.
Vast difference between criminal and civil court proceedings as you well know. A private company can send as much threat letters as they wish we can not be forced to hand them money unless a court states so
Why don't you tell them to discharge bills (invoices) like any other for gas, electricity, water, rates, etc.? That is why the Cestui Que Vie trust was established in 1666. Is it only intended for organizations like the City of London? Or at the very least, you could show them how to nullify these claims by restoring them to their status quo ante? Are you really trying to reach one million followers? Followers of what-someone who directs them away from the truth?
Did you say your name is Shensmith, or "Shen," which can mean "spirit of the dead" in Chinese? Is "Shen" your first name, while "Smith" is your surname, or is it all part of the same name? You should know that such names are considered "dead" in legal contexts-whether on paper, plastic, or computer screens. They are not truly dead; they come to life only when someone responds to them, particularly when they are written in all capital letters. Yet, you use Latin, a "dead" language, within your legal system (including Legalese and Sign language).
1. The name "Shen" means "spirit of the dead" in Chinese.
2. In your line of work, you utilize a dead language-dead because there are no native-born speakers, or cultures raised using it.
3. "Surnames" are considered dead in legal contexts, whether on paper, plastic, or computer screens.
4. You expect people to argue on behalf of the dead or to pay lawyers to argue for the dead in those same contexts.
5. To make matters worse, you are affiliated with that "State within a State," the City of London. Which of the four inns of court do you belong to? It must be Lincoln's Inn, or perhaps Middle Temple or Inner Temple.
Confucius once said, "Signs and symbols rule the world, not words or laws." He also stated, "We all have two lives; the second begins when we realize we only have one."
Clearly, you are not a criminal barrister; otherwise, you would tell the "person," "Why argue?" If you don't argue, then it's "dead in the water," as all criminal cases require both parties to agree before they can even be heard. This is how it should be approached.
Ever thought about helping the living, to navigate the world of the dead?
@@salahad-din4114That's the same in England.
Anybody who pretends private parking charge notices can't be enforced in Scotland might want to do an Internet search for Carly Mackie and how that belief played out for her.
@peterthompson6651 Thanks for sharing that comedy nonsense, Pete.
I genuinely LOL'd.
Have you ever considered inventing your own cheques to "discharge" these bills? Probably a decent grift in there for someone.
Is there a day in UK you can wake up and not expect to be punished or pay for anything?
No
No. Constant unrelenting vigilance is the only way.
At this point, you just have to expect to see a fine in the post. I wake up everyday with ptsd when I see the postman come to my door.
@@ayesha583 Is that POST traumatic stress disorder? :)
Feb 30th
I hate these car parks. Recently we went to watch a film at a cinema and had only 10 minutes to get out of the carpark along with everyone else all pushing to get out. It is an absolute imposition.these fees are turning our country into a money grabbing s hole.
It's been a money grabbing s hole for at least 25 years and it's not going to get any better.
Turning, I think it's well around the bend now!
It's been that way for ages now. Either keep away from business that make these sort of charges, or be prepared to fight them.
Agreed. Brits everywhere, waiting to screw you and rip you off. It's in the culture, as is "getting rid of everything else that used to be good about Britain".
That's what happens in our local cinema. Some choose to beat the rush by leaving 5 minutes before the end of the film.
I owned a haulage company for many years & have had many many run-ins with many of these shysters. All I used to tell them was that I had passed the charge/invoice notice over to the DRIVER of the vehicle at that time but I also reminded them that I had absolutely no legal obligation to confirm the name of the driver or their contact details. By doing so I had discharged all financial liability from myself & my trucks were safe from clamping or seizure. At one point I had Debt Recovery Plus chasing & threatening me with all kinds of heinous threats for £22,500.00 in "charges". They never recovered a single penny & I did this perfectly legally. And to add further insult to these shysters, one of the enforcement agents who came round threatening to clamp my trucks actually ended up working for me & confirmed pretty much everything they threatened people with at recovery stage was absolute utter BS.
22.5 k is impressive I only managed 5.5k
How did you do it mate
given the fact that the company that control the car park have signed a contract with the pub, surely it’s not possible for a member of staff to change a contract on behalf of another company! Just a thought!
People are making money from the misery of others . This country is lost
Yes. That is how the system works. It's a zero sum game. People can't gain without someone else losing.
that's literally how a solicitor/barriater earns their living
That's Capitalism . Have you not noticed ??? Then again, if anyone mentioned Socialism, you would run a mile !!!!
Every company thinks your money is theirs .
But if you park within the guidelines and agreements then you don't pay anything extra. They can only take action if you break the agreement. In the case of parking it's hardly a "misery".
I have had several of these private parking fines,ignored them all as per honest johns advice in the telegraph, one was at Taunton services as I overstayed two hours, but the sign said “if your tired take a break” and I did but fell asleep for more than two hours. Absolute madness
If you fell asleep in your car , you were not parked , merely stopped . There is case law regarding this .
* you’re
I've ignored at least half a dozen issued by private companies. Nothing was ever done about it. Never had a knock on the door, never been issued with a summons. Nothing.
I used to regularly get them outside work for parking in a disabled bay even though my blue badge was on display. Went all the way to court and had a binder full of evidence. Solicitor for the parking company offered me a settlement before the hearing £800 when they were claiming £1500, politely refused. Magistrate threw it out straight away as a she had with all their other cases that day 🤣
Should have offered them the same . Only your settlement would be £1500 😂
So did you get nothing?
@@100Mickl no but I was happy enough with seeing them embarrassed and their solicitor squirming when the magistrate tore strips off him and the company
@@bry_en but they do this every single day - they dont care because they make profit if only 10% of them are successful
U should have sued them for stress and threatening letters
A few years ago I used a car park the day after the clocks had gone forward. Ticket printed the wrong time therefore it appeared I and others had stayed longer than we had payed for.
Got a ticket ,letter through the post challenged it and told them I would not pay. Much communication , told them I would not pay.
So I took two days at work and protested at the car park handing out and placing fliers protesting my innocence. I managed to convince at least a hundred cars to park elsewhere.
They still wouldn't give in. So I went to nearby shops to see if they had CCTV. Luckily one did and was happy to provide the CCTV if it went that far.Told the car park attendant, he looked at the CCTV and sorted the cancellation of the ticket. I lost two days annual holiday but my God it was worth it.
The consoles ask you to put your registration number in and then hit, 'enter'. They then ask you to hit, 'confirm'. If one were not being generous, one might think that this additional step is an attempt to trick people into walking off and thinking that they had registered their vehicle.
Exactly!!
Whenever I have to visit Britain, i take pictures of EVERYTHING. Confirm screens, traffic lights with a box junction if I'm driving, parking notices, till free receipts.
My working assumption is that every commercial entity you come across in daily life is trying to screw you and empty your wallet. And that's why I visit only when I absolutely have to.
@@SampleTracks2224why?
I do none of that, and have no bus lane/yellow box/parking charges at all.
About the only thing I ever photograph is where I've parked so I can find it again.
@@SampleTracks2224 I also photograph the confirmation screen because I don't trust these machines or the parking companies. If there is no confirmation screen then I enter the reg again and video the whole process. Better to be safe than sorry.
@Acquittal yes but when its already stated its completed on the screen and yet still says confirm in a small box at the bottom - you could argue its been specifically designed to be misleading
I've seen you do these before. They are really good! Thanks 👍🏻
These companies go a long way towards the problem of high streets dying. I was at a shopping centre with a 3 hour time limit. Plenty of time unless you need the toilets and then something to eat and drink. Going to write to several of the shops giving them my story of why they lost my custom the other day. Looking at some pendants and rings, window shopping and then went inside to find very little so went outside again to have another look. Just about to go back inside to make some purchases and the wife asked how long we have left... Only 14 minutes and its a good 10 minute walk to the car. So we left and I got home and looked online and found the items cheaper missing out on several other shops.
You know the maximum time you can stay in the car park but still want to stop and eat?
@@stephenleader-s9x I know stupid right. Maybe I should go into a diabetic coma instead? Should make the journey home on the motorway more interesting... Lets play can we reach the next junction before I blackout?
I did wonder when car parks have signs saying they do not accept liability for anything that happens to your car when parked there and how that works in the law
The signs are illegal. They provide false info on law. If the property owner landowner etc cause damage, loss or harm by their own negligence they become liable to provide compensation & may be liable to prosecution if criminal negligence is evident.
Saw a local aerospace company car park sign denying liability for any harm caused to car park users even if caused by employees & contractors of the company.
I pointed out to them the possible problems including putting their employees at risk of criminal prosecution if those employees thought they were immune from criminal prosecution for negligence & a month later all the signs were replaced by a simplified sign saying.
*_???? Aerospace_*
*_Private property_*
😅
Yep at my old employment they had a barrier and we had to pay for the privilege of going through the barrier. A case cropped up a car was damaged the company refused to pay up but did on the steps of a court as the payment to them was a contract for the security of your vehicle whilst parked that's why you pay it.
The car park owner is not responcible if some idiot drives into your car or someone smashes your window to half inch something.
This chatbot idea is first class. BBB, you are "The Martin Lewis of Law". You deserve a million subs.
50+ years ago I received my first (and only) parking ticket. It was a Sunday, no-one ever got a ticket on a Sunday. A passenger in my car promptly ran down the line of cars, removed every ticket and put them in the litter bin. Never heard a word.
I would not be happy at someone taking the ticket away. So those poor souls ended up having their fines rise up to "full price" because they had nonidea that they had had a ticket and so the first that they know is when it was too late because the cheaper 14 day period had expired and they are forced to pay twice as much.
Don't interfere in other people's business.
Even when its a blatant attempt to defraud ? ' could even get to demanding with menaces .@notsurewhattobelieve2990
@@notsurewhattobelieve2990 bruh, can you read? 50+ years ago... How they gonna find out 😂
@@benjaminjones2956 'notsure' is not talking about that specific occurence, but generally. If anyone removes a parking ticket, it is doing nobody except the issuer any favour. Barryjones's passenger was an idiot.
@@jdb47games I agree in the modern era. Use your brain, how are they going to track all those cars down 50 years ago? No photo evidence, no tickets, no convictions. 🤷🏼♂️
They sent me a letter before claim 5 years and 6 months after the first 'invoice'.
I sent them a DSAR asking for all details including those of my appeal and they dropped it as they held no records.
Car parking charges are a Grift
Some are - some aren't.
We use one PPC at a couple of our sites, and they are instructed by us to take legal action against everyone not paying the charges.
It's literally the only way to stop commuters parking in spaces paid for by our clients, and reserved for their customers.
Same as our offices, we bought a site and built offices with sufficient parking - the fact neighbouring businesses didn't doesn't give their staff the right to park on our land...
I got a PCN for overstaying at a motorway services, didn't pay and went through all the appeals process and lost. Still didn't pay, two years after the PCN was issued on the day I was due to attend court to plead my defence they dropped the case. A moral victory for me but with hindsight I wish I'd just paid it and saved myself all the hassle.
I saw a french car with a ticket from a traffic warden in Britain today, good luck collecting that one!
We got a ticket using a hire car in the USA and 3 month later we got a demand for £250 and if we did not pay, we faced court action from the federal authorities, and the car hire company as in the agreement you agree to pay all speed fines parking fines etc, the car hire company had a photo of the driving licence with my home details on, alongside my photo, so they knew exactly where to send things to, as the hire company got the ticket, being the owner of the car, but as the hirer I was responsible, so that ticket will be chased up in France and they will get their money, as any costs incurred goes on your bill, also most of the uk car parks are owned by a company in Australia, I would love for the man to get away with the charges but knowing how tight their contracts are and also how money driven they are, it’s a minimum of £60-75 for the first 14 days jumping to £150 after and they will not want to lose that money
Mind you, it's such a mine field to retrieve money from another country unless there is an inter country agreement 😊
Be careful. I was perused in the UK for a medical bill from the US. The hospital in question never gave me a bill so I left and returned to the UK forgetting all about it
I must say the American debt recovery company were very professional and in fact friendly. Nothing like the cowboys I've dealt with in this country.
I happly paid up minus the recovery charges. I argued that the hospital never presented me with a bill, if they had I would have paid there and then.
Worked for parking services temporarily 2 years ago for 7 weeks. Many many people spawn in from elsewhere on holiday, get fined and then go back, whilst the post keeps circulating
@@timetraveller9321it's different with hire cars, but it's extremely difficult for authorities (or cowboy car parks) to chase speeding/parking infractions committed by foreign registered private vehicles.
There was a pan EU data sharing agreement to chase down fines across the EU, but for the UK that's gone since Brexit.
This tells me there isn't enough parking for the area.
Sounds like a parking mafia with abuse.
As a Scottish solicitor, I agree with your legal advices. However, in practical reality the economics of a private parking company taking someone to court over a parking charge of say £170 is often remote. The customer has the option to gamble by not paying the charge and the risk of the company raising a small claims action in the Scottish Sheriff court and then, if this happens, to then pay the charge and the small legal expenses before any court hearing without having to instruct a solicitor. The court action would then be dismissed since the debt and expenses have been paid prior to a court hearing. In my experience no such action for such a small amount has been raised in my area unless there is an accumulation of charges which makes it then economical for the parking company to outlay the initial cost of going to court. As I said, this is a gamble and not legal advice and really only for small charges and those strong willed. This seems to be only relevant to private companies and not local authority parking penalties.
Or just decline to name the driver as the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 doesn't apply in Scotland.
How can it go to a debt company when it hasn't been to court to confirm you owe the debt
Because court is the final port of call.
They'll use intimidation tactics first. That's debt collectors. But they are powerless. Only after a hearing in court does anything then become enforceable.
a Debt company is not necceseirlaly a bailiff or enforcement agent.
So the carparking company goes to Debt company "I have all theses people who I belive owe me money, im in carparking and not really intrested in enfrocement stuff so I will sell you the £100 debt to you for say ... £10 up frount and it becomes your responsibility to get as much of the £100 back as you can; and if you feel the need take it to court to prove the debt. The car park comany gets £10 of a potential £100 but dosent have to worry about courts etc though they may have to provide evidance. the Debt company gets the potential to collect on a £100 for £10 and the legal right to go to court to prove and enforce the debt. A lot of people will pay up as the debt starts to get higher and higer due to added admin fees. meaning that in this particular instance as long as one person in 10 pays up they are breaking even (well on the debt portion, not on the staffing cost, printer ink etc.) The attuly cost of the debt varies widely depending on the risk, evidence avalilbe, probability that the debtor can pay up etc etc.
This means that you can at least in theory go to a debt agency that your friend has a debt for and ask to buy your friends debt for a % of the attul debt, then you can forgive the debt to you friend for that %. Its all about risk effort and reward. if they feel the cost and risk of going to court is higher then the offered value. they will most likely sell the rights to the debt.
Nothing to do with a court. They are just a company that collects payments for other companies.
@quantisedspace7047 so they could just make it up and say you owe. Where is the proof
I just hardly bother to go out, no incentive anymore unless it's for work, to visit a friend or relative or food shopping and then I'd be prepared to drive 5 miles further to avoid these parking places and the constant threat of putting a foot out of place.
And that my friend, is EXACTLY what they want…..
@@RWVegan if cowboy parking companies are preventing you from going out and enjoying life, there are professional counsellors who can probably help you.
I really appreciate your educational videos, especially with the busy workload you must have.
I've got a £298 bill for over staying in a Wickes store whilst shopping in the Wickes store!
What a joke, hope you get it appealed off
Outrageous goings on.
They're sending you credit I'd say that's a good thing.
How long did you overpark for that size of a fine?
Were you actually overstaying, and what were the times involved?
In our local town an Asda store came. At planning they told the other traders that they would bring extra footfall to the town, and the traders would see a positive effect. Roll forward a few years, my ex girlfriend took her elderly mum shopping, the spent a few hundred pounds in the Asda, then went into the town.
A week or so later a letter for overstaying landed on our doorstep. A polite letter reminding them of their pre planning promise to the other traders had it cancelled. The best thing was, the Asda was built on the site of the former multi storey car park, therefore they had reduced the parking capacity for the town by a lot.
I had the same kind of issue, I dropped off my daughter at Clapham Junction station parking in London, and as soon as I was about to leave I started shivering my eyesight was 50% gone I must mention that I am disabled also I am diabetic and have a bunch of other health issues. I had no other option but to park the car and get a can of coke from inside the station, I came back to my car and after 5 minutes rest I left the parking area. After some time I received a parking ticket from a private company asking to pay within a certain time frame. I appealed the ticket and also sent a copy of my blue badge/hospital letters and explained briefly my situation also I requested to check the camera recording to prove I was unable to walk at that time. They refused my appeal and asked me to pay I ignored the letters now I have a county court judgment (CCJ) on my credit report from the last 3 years. (Update) Before the CCJ was issued I didn't receive any letter from the court. The court didn't even give me any chance to defend myself.
Earlier this year, I was playing a gig in a venue where we could use the back door to bring our equipment in and subsequently out again at the end of the night. Whilst I never saw any signs in the car park about fees etc, the landlord said to give him my registration, which I did, and he would submit that for authorisation.
I parked my car by the rear door of the venue, not in a space (many were available the car park was practically empty) at the start of the night to load in for about 20 minutes, then moved my car to the adjacent public car park and bought an appropriate ticket.
At the end of the night, I moved my car to the back if the venue to load out for about half an hour. Then I went home.
A few weeks later, I got TWO parking offence notifications from the car park company. I ignored them (£100 each).
Then a while later, I got the second reminder. And so on. I refuse to contact them, or the debt recovery agents/solicitor company that has issued these notices as I know I followed all the rules as told to me. Obviously, either the landlord forgot to register my vehicle, or the car park company hasn’t made proper note of the registration that the landlord provided.
Hi Daniel, sorry off-topic here. Had an advert on your video a company trying to sell self defence guns that fire rubber bullets and they are claiming it’s a toy and legal in the UK. Thought I’d let you know as that’s quite concerning getting those types of ads on your videos.
Wetwipe bleater. Seen the state of the country? Everyone should have one. Unfortunately though you're likely to be in real danger from armed Rozzers believing it is the real deal.
That’s funny, I got an ad for the Calm app - basically the total opposite 😂
I've reported it to RUclips under advertisement for firearms. still seeing the ads with link to the same company.
Couldn’t help but laugh at it describing itself as a perfect self-defence weapon, even though as Daniel has described before that anything that is a weapon for self defence is therefore an offensive weapon
Grow up @@pipes9878
As you said the signage must be clear, I had a ticket but the large car park had only one sign and that was partially covered. I took photo's of each side of the area to prove there was not sufficient signage and I won. It must be added that if the car park is dark the sign MUST be illuminated to be obvious.
Now you know why I live in Thailand
You just pay the bent police directly then 😂
Thinking of move there when my kids finished university…
Because you like to Bangkok
@@nubie1100 😹
They have speed cameras now. There is a prominent one on Highway 1 before the Police checkpoint at Mae Chan.
My work colleague got CCJ after following such advice. He had parked at Halim Supermarket 2A, 2B Hedge Ln, London N13 5SH went over time
Great to see you back focusing on law.
If only because some of the comments from the FOTL-style woo advocates are hilarious!
I’ll try to keep this brief. I visited a pub and on arrival spoke to the landlady/owner about where I should park (small car park and there were gates I didn’t want to block). She told me to park behind her cars and logged my registration.
A few weeks later I received a letter from a company saying I owed £60 for parking without registering. I replied by email explaining the situation (with the pub owner in copy), the owner followed up (email) confirming my story. The company then asked to see my receipt for food and drink at the pub! I suggested they piss off and should they consider going further imagine how the story would look in Court.
They ignore several more emails from me and the pub owner until I told them my next correspondence would be a cease and desist letter from my solicitor. Not heard a thing since.
When staying at a hotel, if you pay extra for parking, ensure they record your registration correctly.
I was recently sent a photo of my vehicle along with a fine. This was due to the hotel staff entering my registration incorrectly, substituting a zero for the letter O, which automatically marked my vehicle as in breach of the terms. Thankfully, it was resolved, but not without anxiety and numerous calls.
S54 and schedule 4 of POFA 2012 are so worth learning.
Parking eye love to remind people of the Beavis case, even when it has nothing to do with what theyre trying to charge you for.
Exactly. Also the fact that it's only ever that case and no newer ones.
@@flumpaustin1994 That's because the ultimate ruling on the entire concept of private parking charges were settled by Parking Eye v Beavis.
The Supreme Court ruled on the legality of them, the ability to charge more than the loss, the fact the company can make a profit and so on.
What r the ones that r usually in hospital car parks? I got one of those once because I went into labour and was told by a midwife to go straight to the hospital and I didn't have my purse with me so I asked my sister to bring it for me but by the time she got there I already had a ticket. I wrote to them and explained the situation and I never heard anything form them ever again not even a reply to my letter.
Please make your viewers aware that text messages that notify the receiver of a PCN and invite them to pay by entering their debit/credit card number are a scam. A text is not the same as a written notification.
You will get your 1Mill subs. Easily one if the best channels in YT for both laws and current events.
Something to check is planning permission for the site, all of these private parking sites that have charges come under the classification of a pay to park scheme, this requires planning permission but many do not bother to obtain it, do your checks!
I received a fine from a car park where the payment machine was not working so drove out. I was supposed to scan an image and contact them to pay. I am a pensioner and not very tec with phones.
I hate these things. The car park next to my work is huge and mostly empty. It only costs £1 for the day but I was in a hurry one day and forgot to pay. Got slapped with an £80 fine. How is that cost in anyway justified? That's 80 days of parking for a simple mistake. go into the office like once a week so that's about two years of parking for me. The car park was mostly empty, it's not like I was taking a spot from anyone. I think there should be some kind of cap on how much you can get charged relative to the car park cost.
You can usually ignore them and they eventualluy go away
It's good to have a regular parking attendant who can watch for thieves and vandals, and cover for you if he knows you as a regular (Personal relationships are important in life!), but it sounds as though that car park doesn't have enough business to employ an attendant.
90p an hour currently near me
Not since Parking Eye v Beavis.
While driving to work my phone rang so I pulled over into a pub car park unknown to me it was managed by a parking enforcement agency. There was a enforcement sign I didn't see it though The sign was on the entrance but way above the line of eye about 15 feet from the ground.
I finished the phone call, i was there and it is stated in the letter they sent me for 8 minutes and I didn't get out my car at any time and left. Now they want £100, am I legally obligated to pay this charge?
If you were there for 8 minutes, that implies acceptance of terms. If you are there just long enough to read the terms and then depart (say two minutes), then there is no offer and acceptance, but 8 minutes will probably be regarded as much longer than needed for that.
You're usually granted a 10 minute grace period to accept the terms, so you should have a good case and should appeal.
No fine or forfeiture before being found guilty by a trial by 12 of your peers jurors. This was confirmed by the speaker of house of commons 1689 bill of rights is still fully in force. The name penalty charge or parking fine, makes no difference.
@@kalaspera12 You understand the Supreme Court have ruled on this...?
It's not actually a fine - it's a payment of damages you make for breach of contract.
Get yourself a proper knowledge of the law, and stop believing clowns on RUclips
@@jdb47games That is the law,so stop clowning around with bad advice.
A PCN is a civil matter not a criminal offence. You won't get a trial by jury.
PCN charges have also been tried in court and found to be compensation for a breach of contract and NOT a fine.
Before giving advice, check your facts.
Local Tesco has timed parking, after spending 20 mins finding a space entered packed store, saw lines halfway to the back of the store, walked out, they are only shut for 1 day!
Can you train an AI assistant to get Labour out of power ? 😃🥳
What is the law when entering a private car park if you covered your number plate. I feel like it's getting to that point with them Parking cameras.
Would it not be easier just to stay within the T&C's of the car park, you know, actually read the sign for the maximum stay etc.
It is also a motoring offence (nothing to do with carparks) to obscure your number plate.
It is a small price to pay to enter your car reg for free parking for users of the establishment. It is actually a good idea else people who are not users of the establishment will use it leaving those who need it with no parking space.
On another note, there is a very small shopping area I use which has a large supermarket, 2 coffee shops, a gym, 2 eat in/takeaway places, 2 clothes shops, a diy shop, a cardshop, a electronics shop a sports shop, a £shop and a daycare but your only permitted 3 hours of free parking by UKPC. I have written to UKPC saying it is not enough time but it remains the same - just 3 hours which I find ridiculous.
similar Happened to me, took my sister somewhere parked & waited. She did not put my plate in (i did not know that was a requirement) and then 3 weeks later £60 fine or £100 in 10 days.
If i had gotten out with her then i would have known. Whats worse is they did say to her to put car reg in when i asked her about it and she declined. Couldn’t fight it as by law thats my responsibility. it was a sad day
I got a CCJ from evil parking eye. I dropped my mum off at Burton on Trent Eye Hospital front door, left and went to McDonalds, came back to collect her when they phoned me and picked her up and left. Parking Eye took my first entrance and my last exit and said I’d been there for hours. I don’t know anything about it going through court. PE sent me the fine initially, I disputed it (not appealed) in return writing. I heard nothing at all. Then I had a CCJ whenever the court hadn’t included me in the process. I had to pay it to get it changed to “satisfied” on my records. 7wats.
If using a console to input your vehicle’s details, I would recommend that you take a photo of the screen.
It’s ridiculous! The amount of PCNs I’ve been issued with, without justified grounds! I think they love receiving contentious letters from me!
Worth noting these parking ccjs are so common now that many mortgage underwriters allow them / ignore them, certainly on btl products. And most likely on other financial products.
If I enter the car park as a criminal trespasser, and have no intention to pay the charges, because I'm a criminal trespasser, there will be no contract and the charges will be invalid. Now will they prosecute me for criminal trespass ?
No, They won't listen, and will just repeat that I agreed when I clearly didn't. Legal hierarchy is just dogmatic.
Cool theory.
Never worked in court.
This has been tested in the courts. If you enter a carpark with the intension of using the car park then you are bound by the T&C of the car park.
If you enter as a criminal trespasser, presumably to do something criminal, then the operative word here is "criminal" and are quite likely to be arrested.
I bet your comment sounded better in your head.
in the US its even simpler.., if its a private "fine" your under no obligation to pay it at all.. people just get tricked into it. I think here in the NL , its more similar to the UK
That’s one of the basic differences in culture between U.S. and Europe. I’m European, but reckon they do lots of things better over there. Essentially they regard self reliance more highly than we do ?
@@bookmuppet Would they tow or clamp you in the US though?
Those are banned here (except in limited official circumstances) and what exists now is the replacement.
@@pup6728 private towing is crazy, and yes it happens here to. it should be illigal
Surely if you were actually in the pub giving them your custom while you were parked, and probably recorded on CCTC, isn't that what matters? If they fined me anyway, I would launch a campaign to warn other customers and would-be customers how the pub and its contracted parking company treats its customers. I would picket the place with a sign. Why would we support such a mean-spirited business?
well they left for a holiday and just left the car there as well but also its not on the pub is its the parking company who are the ones pressing you and demanding you pay while not protecting you car if something happens.
There would be a maximum stay time period, say three hours. If you stay for a week or two then that would clearly be an overstay.
The car owner probably didn't want to pay for airport car parking as this is very expensive. They chanced their arm with the pubs car park. I do not believe that the person asked a member of staff for permission to park there for at least a week.
I bet the car owner just said "Your terminal is not working, can I stay here?" and the staff member assumed for the max 3 hour stay and not for over a week.
Don't you go on. I keep falling asleep before you get to the point
Yeah. Know what you mean. But that’s the law for you. It has to be complicated, or it wouldn’t work - too many ‘exit routes’ otherwise.
Parking eye got me. Drove into Aldi, did a weeks shopping drove away. Realised I forgot something drove back to the shop and bought more things. They fined me for staying more the 2 hours. It was not 2 hours parked but yes the 2 visits were over 2 hours… hardly fair. Never been back to that shop again, will ever shop there again.
I have had a couple of tickets from Aldi, if you go on their website you can send a scan of your receipt and they usually cancel the charge.
Oh Daniel Dear Daniel thank you for proping up the system its much appreciated! Lets keep it going! The economy needs it! Top bloke! P.S as you are into martial arts have you seen the video of the Scandinavian guy who had a theory that Brazilian Jujitsu only works if you play along with it!? He entered a competition as a novice didn't play along and one a trophy! Its on you tube saw it a few weeks ago! Interesting outcome! His theory was proven! You would throughly enjoy this viideo I am sure. Once again thank you for all you do for us! :^)
It is so easy to get rid of any private parking charge. Just name the driver , who happens to be your long lost cousin who was over on holiday from any other country, the keeper has fulfilled their responsibility and transferred liability to the driver. The parking company can no longer chase the keeper as they know the identity of the driver.
Make sure the fictional driver is named Mohammed. They won't bother to check up.
All this reminds me why I gave up driving 20y ago.
@@quantisedspace7047 Yawwwwwwwwnnnn……….
Many times it's down to the IT running these consoles being faulty. I park once a week in my local town and the car park payment works on number plate recognition & payment into a console. I get three or four non-payment notices every year despite having paid. Luckily the payment machine has an email receipt system so I can prove I paid each time and then go through the appeal process. It is a real pain having to do all this admin & paperwork every few weeks.
What a vile and shameful way to make a living, causing misery to others. Whilst ruining their own karma as figures of hatred. Disgusting.
Much of this just emphasises why the law is different here in Scotland .
Under Scots Law , no one is obligated to read or take notice of such private signage , and in order for such signs to be enforced , the pursuer has to be able to show evidence that the signage was drawn to the attention of , and accepted by , the defendant . Incidentally , there is no law of trespass here in Scotland , so that part does not apply .
There are several easily foreseen scenarios whereby signage could be ineffective , and therefore invalid :
a foreign visitor who does not have a good command of the English Language may not have been able to read the sign , therefore had no idea what it said ; such a person could not have been held to have entered into a contract . Also related , if signage is placed to the right side of an entrance , a foreigner , or any driver , in a left hand drive vehicle , may easily miss it , and thus the sign would fail the conspicuity test . Similar may also apply in certain parts of Scotland and Wales , where I believe there is legislation requiring signage to be displayed in Gaelic or Welsh as well as English .
The same would apply if a driver was illiterate ; this would not prevent someone from being able to drive since virtually all road signs are pictograms , and indeed are mostly standardised around the world ; hence foreign drivers , as above , also will understand them .
Perhaps most commonly of all , in the scenario of a pub car park , parents with young children may have their attention , quite rightly , focussed on their children , ensuring that they are not running around in the car park , that they are not misbehaving etc .
My youngest is now a teenager , and when my children were younger , parking notices in such places were unheard of ; I'm struggling to see why such hinderance should be needed now , when such car parks were always busy and there was never any problem . Given a choice of two pubs : one with all this nonsense in the car park , and one without , I will always go to the one without .
I have only once fallen foul of such practices : when my partner arrived on a late flight into Edinburgh Airport , circa 1am , along with her sister who was travelling on to Aberdeen in the morning , she went into one of the airport hotels where her sister had a room . I duly arrived to collect my partner , drove up to the main entrance of the hotel , where my partner was waiting , picked her up and left - in and out within two or three minutes . About a week later I received a letter with a poor image of my number plate and demanding money . Because it was completely dark at the time I saw no signage ; and subsequently checking Google street view , I saw that the sign by the entrance was obscured by foliage , and that others were high up on the walls of the building , and not illuminated . Anyway , I did not engage with the parking company , instead calling the hotel and asking to speak to the duty manager , taking a note of her name . Upon explaining politely what had happened , and giving my sister in law's name so that the manager could verify she was a guest that night , I was assured the matter would be dealt with , and I never heard anything further . I did tactfully suggest they needed to trim the bushes in front of the sign .
Finally , Daniel , you mentioned the case of Beavis vs Parking Eye . I'm not sure if this is the relevant case , but I believe there is case law going back a good many years where there was a ruling on what constituted parking . My recollection was that a driver stopped his car in a parking area , I think he might initially have stopped on the roadway , but was directed to go into the car park by a constable who was passing . I can't recall the purpose - it may have been to take a rest from driving , or to make a telephone call - but significantly he did not leave the vehicle . I don't recall the full circumstances , but the judge ruled that in order to park a car , you have to exit the vehicle and leave it unattended . By remainng in the vehicle , the driver had not parked ; he had merely stopped . I expect you know the case I am referring to ; it is quite well known .
I could , with a little research , have used the above argument re the management company trying to charge me for picking up my partner at the hotel , given I never exited , nor even stopped the engine of , my car . I would have quite enjoyed bringing that up in court !
honestly .. It is the responsibility of the car owner to make sure he types in reg numbers correctly - I think he couldn't be bothered ..tried to wing it .. and got caught ... now he is crying cos he got caught .. boo hoo .. and anyway .. instead of getting all uppity and wanting "vindication" .. wouldn't it be far better to pay the reduced £30/60 fine (within 14 days) rather the £170+, complete with CCJ .. but no in their quest to fight the system .. they will go the whole hog and end up owing £0000's .
The main issue in this case is does the notice say “Protection of Freedoms Act” and issued within 14 days?
If not they can only hold the driver responsible and not transfer the liability onto the owner. So as long as you don’t identify them there is no nothing they can do. 🤷♂️🤷♂️🤷♂️
@BlackBeltBarrister
It is not clear from your intro and transcript at 3:18 onwards, did the viewer leave the car in the car park while they were on holiday or, they went on holiday some time later, days/weeks after using the car park?
Visiting Australia atm, in Australia all they can claim is any loss of earnings, as an example I over stayed my time by 6 minutes, the dept collectors tried to claims $50 dollars but all they could claim was $4, now the thing is in Australia you can only claim cost against a person with regards to any parking depts, now the dept company can only get driver details by going through the courts and that costs a lot more than $4. So from what I see not many pay these private type fines.
* debt
My son successfully got his fine quashed by the court and now civil enforcement ltd now owe him court costs which surprise surprise they haven't paid so looks like they are going to have bailiffs attending the company property
If you enter one of these carparks with ANPR and for whatever reasons you leave without actually parking, at what point have you deemed to have parked and therefore incurred a charge ? I've heard of people being fined for driving in and out of a carpark after not finding a space but still being issued a fine.
I was fined by Euro Car Parks for picking someone up from a pub.
Max free parking was 15mins, they caught me at 19mins.
I couldn't see any sign as the only sign in the car park was at the rear and unlit (picked someone up at kicking out time during the night).
I mentioned this, tried to fight it and got no where.
Cost me £100.
I find it nuts how being 4mins over their free period can cost you a CCJ which can actually cost you a mortgage on a house.
This is the issue with the UK... its a joke!
Imagine being turned down for a mortgage because of a 4minute parking fine.
I ignored one from a shopping centre ….3 years later I have just had to pay £288 …the court letter did not even look real and it would of cost me £301 to challenge
I've had several of these private parking tickets and not paid one, never had a CCJ
Your going to be very busy when hundreds of court send out summons at same time 🥹
@Hottiger1818 They all date back years, never had a court summons or CCJ
Hi Daniel I have had a charge notice for £170s for being 15 minutes over I've called and called the car park management as that's excessive there's never an answer.
Always defend yourself. I’ve won, and been paid by private parking companies. There’s no excuse to ignore, not know what to do and get a CCJ.
I got a CCJ and my fine got to £286 for my private parking fine at riverside retail park norwich, as i kept ignoring it as private carpark fines couldn't be enforced, then the law changed.
Not payed for parking since 06. Had thousands of tickets and only had one enforcement clamp my car for about an hour. The car was on finance at the time so couldn’t do anything.
Got a £60 fine while eating at McDonald’s . Who knew you can’t spend more than 90 minutes when having a kids party
That’s disgraceful! Mc Donalds should surely realise that you need more time for a kid’s party! Was there another company managing the parking? If so Mc Donalds should speak to this company! I would try and charge Mc Donalds the fine.
Ludicrious
@@BlackBeltBarristerIt's not ludicrous at all. It's likely McDonald's didn't know that that particular car was there for a party.
In any case, you don't have to park /there/ for a party. You could have just dropped the minors off and picked them up later.
McDonald's is a fast food chain. The assumption is that you're going to stay only as long as necessary to pick up food and eat it.
Every McDonald's car park that I have seen has a time limit clearly displayed. Maybe yours didn't.
If it didn't have a limit displayed, then you'd be reasonable to assume that you could stay there essentially as long as you need to.
You don't state whether there was any such signage or not. If there was and you'be overstayed, that's on you. If there was no such sign, that's on them.
Either way it's bad business practice.
It would have made more sense for you to be reminded that you were approaching your time limit.
I got a bill for same from McDonald's in Edinburgh, thing was it was the night of the Taylor Swift concert and traffic was gridlocked for hours, we couldn't get out of the park! I wonder how much they made that night as there were many people stuck.
I got one from McDonald's and I never paid it. Nothing happened only threats. It's been about 6 years now and still not taken to court.
My friend got a ticket for imputing the wrong car Park number by one digit. They refused her appeal. Disgusting.
They probably didn't believe he even tried to input his reg number in their machines. That is why I photograph the confirmation screen so they can't say that.
That's on them, and they need to take responsibility, they should have checked the registration and inputted correctly, sorry but no sympathy
I went to a bowling alley in Canterbury, Kent with my young grandson, there were a few spaces outside including a disabled of which I am qualified a few days later I got a £100 parking fine for not paying! You assume the parking is with the leisure activity, noticing not obvious to the alternative....outrageous local pubs have started this as well - be careful....appealed but of course lost!
This is probably the best use of AI that I’ve come across. Well done!
Hi Daniel
Unfortunately your preliminary introduction of the legals here isn't on point.
You've sketched over sch 4 of the Protection of freedoms act 2012 and the legal ramifications on the Notice to Keeper
If the parking company don't comply with the statutory requirements of sch 4 then they can only chase the driver and NOT the keeper and unlike with the RTA there's no legal compulsion by the keeper to name the driver (so long as the parking company has failed to comply with sch 4)
As regards clarity of signage. Back in the 1960s the government set up the Worboys committee to review traffic signage in the UK. They did such a good job that UK traffic signage became the Gold standard and was copied by other countries.
My own research into private parking company signage was that they actually designed their signs contrary to the Worboys recommendations.
Why?
Because their business model relies on non compliance.
The usual contract offered by a private parking company and the landowner is along the lines of, "we will manage your car park for free and only keep the 'penalty' fees" thus financially incentivising themselves to farm the car parks for 'penalty' income.
If the car park is private land, then why not remove registartion numbers as they are not legal obligation on private land?
Advice for people who shop at a Sainsbury's with a car park that is owned by euro carparks. The staff at customer service will have the euro car park app that can cancel parking charges. Just make sure you bring the letter so staff can type in the reference number that is on the letter
I got a ticket because my visible parking permit was at the wrong angle. My permit was even visible in 5 of the 8 evidence photos they produced. I took this up with my landlord who employed the parking company. Because I spoke to my landlord 3 times about the matter. They said I was taking up too much of their time and I was evicted from my home.
Pubs that have managed charged parking simply don’t get my money. How many pubs are closing down ?😮
Reading some of these entries I get the feeling a lot of motorists think they have the absolute right to park on other peoples property i.e. a pub car park whether they are patrons or not. A classic example is parents using pub car parks when collecting their children from school. Many landlords have real problems with people using their car parks as if it is a public car park hence the reason why they employ companies to supervise them on their behalf. If you are using the car park as a patron then there is no problem just entering your vehicle registration number. Otherwise chalk it up to experience and pay the penalty for trespassing.
Parking eye pursuit of the man who owned the fish and chip shop ended up with him paying out thousands of ££££s in court costs.
I've had my parking charge sent to a debt collector. My wife parked at a restaurant and stayed for 3 hours, where there was a maximum stay of 1hr and 45 minutes. We gave proof via a bank statement thst she was a patron and they reduced the charge to £25. I did not pay, and now I'm waiting for my court case.
Should I ignore the letters from the solicitor? It's a small car park, but the signs are everywhere (only now noticed due to this charge)
Top idea making legal chat bots !
I've had a about 10 on my vehicle in my South London council estate over the year's. I just send them toy money in the post and pay recorded delivery. Never been taken to court by these crooks.
Tonight, on Things That Never Happened.....
@@jdb47games Awwwwwwww, you’ve shattered my dream.
Make sure all planning permission is granted, and up to date, regarding signs, cameras, paint markers.
I was threatened with court for parking in a disabled bay in june2023 and after 11 letters. I sent the last one back unopened and haven’t heard any more. My understanding that the debt of 170 pounds is too low for court in Scotland so it isn’t cost effective to pursue it.
True. Also no keeper liability in Scotland so they can usually be easily quashed with one letter.
What if they fail to send you any letters or other notifications, and just hand it to a debt recovery agency three months later?
Daniel. Would be great if you could make a video on how to fight back against these money grabbers. I wasn’t able to submit an acknowledgment of service in time when I had a tribunal letter through the post while I was out of the country for 8 weeks. I ended up having to pay as a result even though I’m almost certain I would have successfully defended my case in court (signs were inadequate, font too small, no evidence of parking, only an entry and exit photo taken by ukpc, etc…). Can think of a million better ways to lose that money so would love to know if there’s a way to get it back.
I don't think the question "can we park here", could ever reasonably be expected to be "can we park here, for no related reason, for days to weeks"
So the only way they can punish you is levy a ccj, what if a ccj means absolutely nothing and has no consequence to you? Then I’m ignoring them.
I had a ccj put on me from ukpc and they were chasing me from my vehicle details. They can pay the dvla a fee and the dvla hand over the info which is quite disgusting so all i ended up doing was insuring it at my parents house. bailifs visited twice during the 6 years of the ccj and both times left after seeing the council tax bill to prove i didnt live there and that only my car was registered and insured there and they had no idea where i was 🤣🤣 6 years later 2022 they didnt get a penny and im ccj free
Excellent video as usual Simon.
Would you be able to do a video on getting Parking Charge Notices in secure car parks that are included in a residence contract?
I got a PCN after moving back from abroad several years ago. My land lady had made no mention of needing a permit and it just wasn’t a thing before I left the UK in 2015.
They tried me this way back in 2001 ish in Scotland. It was an unmarked Ford Escort belonging to the Royal Air Force Bomb Disposal Nuclear Response team. I parked it in Safeway, Rose Street in Inverness.
24 years later and nowt happened.