What about cleaning out the threads with a synthetic bottle brush and light solvent before inspection to clean out any lube and manufacturing swarf? I’m not VIP certified for cylinders, but something I learned inspecting aircraft components is that sometimes you think there’s a crack, but then you find more cracks. Usually that comes from manufacturing. If they used a three flute tap the “cracks” are 120 degrees from each other. It’s where the tap stopped threading when they backed it out of the cylinder. Many of the tasks I did were Required Inspection Items (RII), and the regulatory agencies like the FAA mandate that a second person verified my findings. Great to see you doing the same thing to give your customers the best service and getting the full life from their equipment. Great video!!! Thanks for sharing.
Hello Caleb Mcelhaney, you most certainly can clean the threads before you perform an inspection. I typically will use a microfiber cloth and simply wipe it down before the inspection. The brush can work, as long as you prevent any debris from falling down into the cylinder.
This video got me thinking about other people who asked me, someone condemned my cylinder and already destroyed it. What do I do now? My best advice would be, before you leave your cylinder for inspection, ask the shop what their policy was and if they would call you before they permanently damage my cylinder. I love your procedure and how you won't just immediately destroy a cylinder without telling the customer and having a second inspector look at the cylinder. You and your shop are awesome. Thanks for all the videos.
Hello Darrell Grainger, thank you for the kind words. Another thing that we do, is have the customers fill out a service form, which explains the process we conduct during the visual inspection process, and the condemning process. Though we do condemn cylinders from time to time, it is rare. Thankfully, we have never had a single complaint from any customers. Most divers understand the importance of making sure their equipment, including cylinders, are in the best shape possible.
Tool marks are often mistaken for cracks , having found cracks in several aluminum cylinders confirmed by manufacturer I'm a Cvpi and PSI certified , we started using the VIP + machine when it came out , it is great for confirmation of a crack ,
I wish you were my teacher in high school or college (haha I'm 63 now), I would have passed any subject. You sir are a natural teacher. Love this channel. I recommend it on every dive trip to people I meet.
Sorry to hear that Bill Hazel. Another thing we do for our customers, prior to condemning them, we show the customer the issue. This means if we find a crack, we show it to the customer.
Hello @skirblah, we have done several in the past, and we were even joined by Mark Gresham from PSI PCI, who trained us on how to perform visual inspections. The pesky 6351 alloys continue to cause divers to have their cylinders condemned during inspection time. Over the years, I have had more of my own cylinders fail their visual inspections, than me failing customer's cylinders. I have even had non 6351 cylinders fail an inspection. But at the end of the day, I am still here to dive again, and the fill operators are still here to fill my cylinder. We have another renewal with PSI PCI coming up in June of 2024, and I will see if Mark can help us produce an in-depth video on SLC for you.
I thought SLC was only a problem with 6351 Alloy - here in Australia you can no legally no longer fill an AL6351 tank regardless of it's test status. Is this different in the USA?
Hello @peterjulianphotos4659. Here in the states, certain 6351 cylinders can still be in active service if they receive a current Eddy Current test. Most shops choose not to do this test for safety concerns.
Hey where abouts in NC are you located? I have an old tank that was dumped off and a friend's junkyard, and he gave it to me, because I am a commercial diver and he thought it would make a good conversation price... And left a huge question mark on how it got there in the junk yard. I'm doubtful it would pass vip, but I would like to look inside it to see if it has any cracks or if there is a chance I could put a K valve... That I have in my spare stuff already.. and maybe get it tumbled if it needs it. I'm just one. Of those half full guys I guess, but if it could be saved, it would match my newly viper and hydro'ed tank I bought today. Lol
This is a fault in the machining prossess. Chipped thread due to the thread mill is worn or not being set properly. It happens the threa in this situation is fine and won't fail. They can become rounded as well. Hope it helps
@@LakeHickoryScuba Bryan thank you for that, and agree with you overtightening can also cause this I used to be an engineer, in many different areas from marine navy engineer to production of diesel system used on things like Rolls Royce engines to caterpillar whartsilla and many others including formula one racing engine's.
Hello Steven Rogers, great question. We are discussing making a video on that very topic. In short, we disable the treads so a valve can not be reinserted back into the tank. The problem with drilling a hole in the tank is, it can be repaired and covered with a sticker. This is why all stickers must be removed during the inspection process. We look for thinks like that, both internally and externally.
Hello Yuio Poli, rust would only be visible on a steel cylinder, not on an aluminum cylinder. Depending on how much rust, and whether it crossed a threshhold, would the cylinder be condemned. Typically, on a steel cylinder, the place you would see the most rust on the outside, would be the bottom of the cylinder underneath the tank boot. This more than likely would cause a steel cylinder to be condemned.
@@LakeHickoryScuba Thanks LakeHickoryScuba! Hey quick question, I got a tank and it past hydro and visual inspection and the scuba store filled it.... but I've never had a valve test done in it. My question is, since the store filled it... doesn't that mean that they think I don't need a valve test? Should I get one? Thanks.
Typically, to test a valve, we verify the burst disc is still good, and that it has the proper rating for the cylinder. Lastly, we test for leaks. All this can be done during an external visual inspection which should be done at the time of fill. Your cylinder should be just fine.
@@LakeHickoryScuba Thanks! They said they replaced the o-ring too so I'm guessing that adds to me not needing to pay another $25! Thanks for everything!
tank cary handle-ok or not ok ?reason for the question i'm waiting for the corona situation to subside so i can get my OW cert ,wile waiting for that i'm buying complete gear (man with a plan .hehehe) and i try to pick the minds of those who know for information lol ps if i wood be living in the US i wood preffere to get trained by you , but am living in the Philippines (belgian expat) so i will be looking for an instructor i feel good with here.advanced thanks for anny reaction
Hello Dee Cee, tank carry handles can be handy at times. As long as the Valve has a long enough post, they are easily enough carried by the valve. Once you have your first stage attached, try not to carry by the first stage, just the valve, or handle if equipped.
Hello John Williams Scuba, unfortunately, there are inspectors out there that would describe a tooling mark as a crack. This is why we always get a second opinion prior to condemning a cylinder.
![Installing A Mask Strap Cover {[The Easy Way]}](/img/1.gif)
What about cleaning out the threads with a synthetic bottle brush and light solvent before inspection to clean out any lube and manufacturing swarf? I’m not VIP certified for cylinders, but something I learned inspecting aircraft components is that sometimes you think there’s a crack, but then you find more cracks. Usually that comes from manufacturing. If they used a three flute tap the “cracks” are 120 degrees from each other. It’s where the tap stopped threading when they backed it out of the cylinder. Many of the tasks I did were Required Inspection Items (RII), and the regulatory agencies like the FAA mandate that a second person verified my findings. Great to see you doing the same thing to give your customers the best service and getting the full life from their equipment.
Great video!!! Thanks for sharing.
Hello Caleb Mcelhaney, you most certainly can clean the threads before you perform an inspection. I typically will use a microfiber cloth and simply wipe it down before the inspection. The brush can work, as long as you prevent any debris from falling down into the cylinder.
This video got me thinking about other people who asked me, someone condemned my cylinder and already destroyed it. What do I do now? My best advice would be, before you leave your cylinder for inspection, ask the shop what their policy was and if they would call you before they permanently damage my cylinder.
I love your procedure and how you won't just immediately destroy a cylinder without telling the customer and having a second inspector look at the cylinder.
You and your shop are awesome. Thanks for all the videos.
Hello Darrell Grainger, thank you for the kind words. Another thing that we do, is have the customers fill out a service form, which explains the process we conduct during the visual inspection process, and the condemning process. Though we do condemn cylinders from time to time, it is rare. Thankfully, we have never had a single complaint from any customers. Most divers understand the importance of making sure their equipment, including cylinders, are in the best shape possible.
@@LakeHickoryScubaHello, and thank you for your video!
What if there's visible rust on the outside, does that typically get a cylinder condemned?
Tool marks are often mistaken for cracks , having found cracks in several aluminum cylinders confirmed by manufacturer I'm a Cvpi and PSI certified , we started using the VIP + machine when it came out , it is great for confirmation of a crack ,
Thanks for sharing scooter dogg.
I wish you were my teacher in high school or college (haha I'm 63 now), I would have passed any subject. You sir are a natural teacher. Love this channel. I recommend it on every dive trip to people I meet.
Thank you for the kind words Bob Lindner.
Thanks for the info on the tank inspection for thread cracks. Really enjoy your vlog keep up the great work. 👍🇨🇦👍🇨🇦
You're welcome Larry Von Zemmrich, glad you liked the video.
Why not clean the threads prior to the inspection process?
Hello Mike Ramsey, typically we will wipe them out during the Inspection Procedure. Usually this is completed when checking for any folds in the neck.
More great info to make better informed divers. Lost a tank once due to too muck speckling.
Sorry to hear that Bill Hazel. Another thing we do for our customers, prior to condemning them, we show the customer the issue. This means if we find a crack, we show it to the customer.
Have you done a video on SLCs? I recently had a tank fail visual and it was an SLC.
Hello @skirblah, we have done several in the past, and we were even joined by Mark Gresham from PSI PCI, who trained us on how to perform visual inspections. The pesky 6351 alloys continue to cause divers to have their cylinders condemned during inspection time. Over the years, I have had more of my own cylinders fail their visual inspections, than me failing customer's cylinders. I have even had non 6351 cylinders fail an inspection. But at the end of the day, I am still here to dive again, and the fill operators are still here to fill my cylinder. We have another renewal with PSI PCI coming up in June of 2024, and I will see if Mark can help us produce an in-depth video on SLC for you.
I thought SLC was only a problem with 6351 Alloy - here in Australia you can no legally no longer fill an AL6351 tank regardless of it's test status. Is this different in the USA?
Hello @peterjulianphotos4659. Here in the states, certain 6351 cylinders can still be in active service if they receive a current Eddy Current test. Most shops choose not to do this test for safety concerns.
Hey where abouts in NC are you located? I have an old tank that was dumped off and a friend's junkyard, and he gave it to me, because I am a commercial diver and he thought it would make a good conversation price... And left a huge question mark on how it got there in the junk yard. I'm doubtful it would pass vip, but I would like to look inside it to see if it has any cracks or if there is a chance I could put a K valve... That I have in my spare stuff already.. and maybe get it tumbled if it needs it. I'm just one. Of those half full guys I guess, but if it could be saved, it would match my newly viper and hydro'ed tank I bought today. Lol
420 Taylorsville Beach ct, Taylorsville, NC 28681
Come by
@@LakeHickoryScuba thanks. As soon as I get back to NC I will try and work out a convenient time.
For some reason, I find this stuff interesting.
This is a fault in the machining prossess. Chipped thread due to the thread mill is worn or not being set properly. It happens the threa in this situation is fine and won't fail. They can become rounded as well.
Hope it helps
You would be correct Kurt Steiner, we have also seen this being caused by over tightening the valves from other visual inspectors.
@@LakeHickoryScuba
Bryan thank you for that, and agree with you overtightening can also cause this
I used to be an engineer, in many different areas from marine navy engineer to production of diesel system used on things like Rolls Royce engines to caterpillar whartsilla and many others including formula one racing engine's.
Hey Bryan... Welcome back. When you condemn a tank, do you drill a hole in it or stamp it condemned (sp?)
Hello Steven Rogers, great question. We are discussing making a video on that very topic. In short, we disable the treads so a valve can not be reinserted back into the tank. The problem with drilling a hole in the tank is, it can be repaired and covered with a sticker. This is why all stickers must be removed during the inspection process. We look for thinks like that, both internally and externally.
@@LakeHickoryScuba wow... I dont know if I would want to be near a tank that had a hole repaired while it's being filled
I definitely would not want to be.
When you another inspector do advise them of issues with the tank(s)?
Typically no, I don't want them to have a biased opinion on the cylinder prior to the inspection.
What if there's visible rust on the outside, does that typically get a cylinder condemned, or rejected?
Hello Yuio Poli, rust would only be visible on a steel cylinder, not on an aluminum cylinder. Depending on how much rust, and whether it crossed a threshhold, would the cylinder be condemned. Typically, on a steel cylinder, the place you would see the most rust on the outside, would be the bottom of the cylinder underneath the tank boot. This more than likely would cause a steel cylinder to be condemned.
@@LakeHickoryScuba Thanks LakeHickoryScuba!
Hey quick question, I got a tank and it past hydro and visual inspection and the scuba store filled it.... but I've never had a valve test done in it. My question is, since the store filled it... doesn't that mean that they think I don't need a valve test? Should I get one?
Thanks.
Typically, to test a valve, we verify the burst disc is still good, and that it has the proper rating for the cylinder. Lastly, we test for leaks. All this can be done during an external visual inspection which should be done at the time of fill. Your cylinder should be just fine.
@@LakeHickoryScuba Thanks! They said they replaced the o-ring too so I'm guessing that adds to me not needing to pay another $25!
Thanks for everything!
The neck O-ring is what they are referring to. This is required during a visual inspection.
tank cary handle-ok or not ok ?reason for the question i'm waiting for the corona situation to subside so i can get my OW cert ,wile waiting for that i'm buying complete gear (man with a plan .hehehe) and i try to pick the minds of those who know for information lol
ps if i wood be living in the US i wood preffere to get trained by you , but am living in the Philippines (belgian expat) so i will be looking for an instructor i feel good with here.advanced thanks for anny reaction
Hello Dee Cee, tank carry handles can be handy at times. As long as the Valve has a long enough post, they are easily enough carried by the valve. Once you have your first stage attached, try not to carry by the first stage, just the valve, or handle if equipped.
The same people that tell you your plastic second stage has a crack when it's a mold mark.
Hello John Williams Scuba, unfortunately, there are inspectors out there that would describe a tooling mark as a crack. This is why we always get a second opinion prior to condemning a cylinder.
Visual plus
Thankfully, this is only required on any cylinder that is suspected of being a 6351 alloy. None of these are.
Steel tanks rule
Thanks for sharing your thoughts with us petergrenville-merry7164.