From UCSB Shooting to Sydney Mall Stabbing: The Violence of Misogyny | Amanpour and Company
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- Опубликовано: 24 апр 2024
- Misogyny often goes unrecognized and can certainly be deadly. We saw this on April 13th in Sydney, Australia, where a man killed six people at a busy shopping mall. Five of the victims were women. While police admit the attacker may have targeted woman, Kate Manne says there is no doubt about it. Manne is an associate professor at Cornell University and author of the book "Down Girl: The Logic of Misogyny." She joins the show to tell us why we must reckon with this dangerous ideology.
Originally aired on April 25, 2024
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Amanpour and Company features wide-ranging, in-depth conversations with global thought leaders and cultural influencers on the issues and trends impacting the world each day, from politics, business and technology to arts, science and sports. Christiane Amanpour leads the conversation on global and domestic news from London with contributions by prominent journalists Walter Isaacson, Michel Martin, Alicia Menendez and Hari Sreenivasan from the Tisch WNET Studios at Lincoln Center in New York City.
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Profoundly Important Interview; thanks Michele and Amanpour for bringing the Expert to the public.
Fathers need to teach their sons to respect women. Having a girlfriend is not an entitlement.
And coaches need to quash locker room talk (I call it locker dick talk), this is where it really gets out of hand.
Fathers need to teach their sons that abortion is not healthcare, and no one is entitled to free anything.
@@bkm2797 Or in the bar after work with his buddies. It's the common unifying denominator when men meet in a group these days - trash women. No matter what you are or what you aren't, at least they're not one of those...
@@imperialmotoring3789and those same fathers should teach their sons that every time they have penetrative sex without a condom, they should be prepared to raise and fully fund the upbringing of a child. Every single time they have sex.
@@imperialmotoring3789as long as those fathers do this: explain to their sons that every single time they have penetrative sex, even with a condom - accidents happen! - those boys should be prepared to raise and fully fund the upbringing of a child. A child. Every single time they have sex.
The path to mental health for these types of young men is to have something to Affirm, that is both relatable and positive. Strength and Control don't have entirely negative connotations; each has its time and place. Honorable forms of these can be taught early and often for those that most need to hear about them.
Time is overdue to get young people off social media and out from behind their screens to interact with other people and build those social skills. Kids need grit and the skills to handle uncomfortable situations. We need to stop trying to make everything easy, comfortable and fun. Sometimes life is just difficult.
Thank you, Amanpour for this much needed discussion.
And here in America we have an entire political party trying to bring back those atrocities towards women! Great discussion, we definitely need more of this in our schools. Thank you!👍
Women are between Scylla and Charybdis in this election. The creep who wants to allow boys into our spaces and sports, or the creep who wants to force us to bear children?
Here in America we are making our boys grow up to be women! No joke the Democrats really want this!
Well they already locked up children so I guess women are next.
Men randomly punching women in NY is horrifying also.
margo3367,
Agreed!
The Guardian in the UK has published a list of women who have died due to “rough sex” over decades, often due to strangulation or blunt force trauma. The recent US article about increased strangulation during teenage sex is very disturbing. Sexualized violence and violence against women is not going away. We need to spearhead this issue.
A very good discussion. Thank you for this perspective.
I think Andrew Yang wrote a great chapter on men in his book the War on Normal People. We need to teach young men how to form healthy relationships including friendships; not just teaching consent. Some people don't just naturally evolve social skills as adults.
No one needs to wonder why there's a growing fear of men.
Women choosing to remain single.
Mainstreaming porn and violent sex scenes has permeated views of what's normal in a relationship.
Exactly!
Add to that politics and religion.
There's a great speech by Andrea Dworkin from 1978 (?) where she addresses pornography and why it is so harmful to women and society as a whole.
@@badomaji What about lesbians and gay men with porn? Not a problem.
@@Rage_Harder_Then_Relax Look up the speech and read it. You may find your answer there.
Fine, crucial discussion, thank you both. Seems clear to me that boys, from a young age, should have overt training, specific class time just for them, to learn about controlling themselves, about all the areas of interacting with girls and women. Not a class with homework and grades; a time for questions, answers, discussions, arguments about power and boundaries. Too many males feel they own their girlfriends/wives. Let's hope the male of our species continues to evolve in acceptance.
Teaching young children that they can change gender and that men give birth is ruining a generation of Americans.
I would label your fine idea as, community mental health. I believe that we need to invest more in activities such as what you have suggested. I am a senior, and it seems that opportunities for men to head successful families have diminished over the years, with the US lost of factory and manufacturing jobs. I also the anti abortion movement as seeking to hold back the advances of women outside of the home.
I bless you, and hope that you will continue to speak Truth.
Can't wait to see the comments here... 🤦🏽♀️
I’ve watched Elliot Roger’s videos in which he tells how the world and women have wronged him. They were hard to watch. He was so delusional and creepy, it made my skin crawl.
Yes, I remember him sitting in a car talking about his twisted thoughts and feeling totally justified, sad.
The normalizing of using the word b***h when referring to a woman has gone a long way in promoting disrespect for the females of this world. Misogyny is a bigger problem now than it was 40 years ago and I've noticed a big surge since the 2016 election.
Is it ok to call men "dog"?
misogny is worse now? Even though sexual harassment is recognized offense; that women can borrow money and own property under their own name without a husband; that women are doing better in college than men; and nearly half of wives make as much or more than their husbands.
@@johnstewart7025 Maybe it's precisely because of those reasons.
@@badomaji THIS. many men are secretly jealous of women (all while having zero empathy for them, no less). furthermore, many men simply do not want women to have these freedoms. there is a truly pervasive male narcissism surrounding their desire for the literal worship of their genitalia which dictates that anything that threatens a man's ego should be subjugated - and, if not, destroyed! men are mad they have to work for BJs now instead of just getting them to "honor your husband" lol
i say this as a man who hears how men speak about women and girls in locker rooms. the overwhelming idea that "women are getting too comfortable and spoiled" is absolutely appalling considering how many women are going celibate in today's world simply to be safe and secure.
Not sure if calling a man a dog wouldn't be insulting to dogs. Depends on the man.
1:25 Westfield owns pretty much every mall property- surely they have some combined security insights on public space violence… their property holdings appear multinational.
The first of female targetting terrorism happened in 1989: The École Polytechnique Massacre, known also as the Montreal massacre was a school shooting on December 6, 1989. It took place at the École Polytechnique de Montréal, an engineering school. 15 women killed.
Thanks for the info.
As an Australian, I thank the professor effusively for her insights particularly into the Sydney event. Since then due to partner murders, state and federal governments have tried to sharpen their reactions to misogyny.
If you have time, could you elaborate more on what the government has done? but is it just about harsher punishments, or are thier more things?
How complicated is the human state.
E.g. Parkland school-shooter who killed 21 on Valentine’s Day because didn’t have GF/Valentine; live-streamed his plans & told a girl online trying to impress her Ubering to crime scene.
Why did that transgender woman shoot up that Christian school?
The real solution for that young man, would have been to give Valentines to others, and then wait to see if any of the receivers appreciated them. There is a passage in the Bible that says; "As you give, so shall you receive." But people are so hung up on whether a God exists, they tend to overlook such practical advice that has been around for like 2000 years.
Leverage on this subject could be increased by more abundant and in depth reporting on the link between Mass Shootings and people (men generally) that have a history of Domestic Violence, or cruelty to animals (or children).
Finally! Someone said it! Appreciated this conversation!
I'm not sure if you're referring to me, the one who wrote this comment, or to the guy who made the video. But if u meant me, thank you! I was actually in Santa Barbara visiting my gf who went to ucsb at the time, n we were just on that exact street in IV the day before that guy shot it up. So this really hit home
Misogyny is a mental health issue for those it silences and destroys...
Another poisonous gift of the internet. Add this to the thousands of years of religious abuse of women and the taboo of sex, another gift of religious dogma. We will rise above, that's a certainty. Humanity has on the whole made giant strides over last few centuries. I think of Hannah Arendts most perfect reply when challenged on her support of her birth religion. "At first i am human". It doesn't get any simpler than that....
Right. Blame religion for the fact that you can't get a girlfriend.
Don't blame much on the religion. Religion is like a tool. Its use is determined, by the heart of the holding it.
Thanks for this reporting. What's the solution?
Educating our boys, educating our girls, educating ourselves, changing the way Christianity is interpreted and practiced (I single out this religion because it is the dominant one in the US) because there is a very ugly, misogynistic version of Christianity in America, changing our pop culture (movies, TV shows, books, songs, etc). Yes I know that is a long and arduous thing to do. (Ever notice how the rape and murder of women figures heavily into our literal *entertainment*?) Changing the expectations we put on males and females to act some sort of way. Somehow figuring out how to monitor/stop the absolutely insane ideologies that are festering in cyberspace and spill over into the "real" world. That would be a start.
Basically, the entire culture needs an overhaul. No not easy, or practical, or even achievable. But that's what is needed.
Be careful he was mentally I’ll and had been for many years
I just had a discussion with a male friend today and warned him of the dangers that misogyny pose for society. That we need to pay more attention to that in light of the conservative maga types that seem to be a harbor for attracting men who hate women. The conversation began because he was trying to understand why certain men were attracted to Donald Trump as a viable role model and candidate across racial and ethnic groups. I said we need to know that misogyny is found everywhere and among all groups.
Interesting. Would be interesting to read
When will we pass comprehensive knife laws?
When every family dinner results in murder. What a stupid take. The guy was an adult. He was allowed to "play with knives".
@@Rage_Harder_Then_Relax "Rage Along With The Machine" is your favorite band?
oh my god.
I could see a serious problem with making pedagogy around Roger’s acts. How to problematize a particular event in an open classroom situation.
i live in australia, and this man was terribly ill. please be responsible with your reporting.
Misogyny in of it self is not an ideology but there are philosophies and religions that are misogynistic.
Don't tell these people that. That stops them from blaming other reasons. Like his paranoid schizophrenia.
Male children tend to develop aversions to all things female around age 7. (Same reason little girls prefer daddies.) Rejecting their mother's comfort and striking out on their own has proven to make them more evolutionarily successful.
A more advanced form of success can be taught once they have matured and can benefit from being friends with females again. Romantic relationships that start with friendship are good and strong.
Misogyny is for babies, and dangerous politicians who seek to divide and conquer.
❤❤❤❤❤🎉
I think two things 1/3 of the way in. It is not a bad desire to want to be in a relationship. Many people don't understand it's not the desire to be with a woman that is wrong. it's wrong to force it .... Joel should not be faulted for having a desire companionship ....when he decided to punish others because his desires went unrealised that's the problem.
Society should help those struggling with finding companionship. And it should also be pretty clear you can't hurt people because you haven't gotten what you want.
The Bondi incident is a failure of society .... an unstable man not thinking clearly in a world that feeds him rubbish like men own women.... He's not got enough scaffolding to make better decisions.
I am not saying it's not his fault .... I am saying society could easily reduce this sort of violence by getting men to see women as humans of equal worth.
Misogyny is one thing, but to kill in circumstances such as these involves mental illness.
I didn't hear any other reports
Like detectives saying hey it's pretty obvious.
Or father saying hey it was probably
I heard the stats of dead n injured
And
Thought
He attacked women on purpose
Was pissed this wasn't labeled terror.
I’m glad people are discussing this but it seems like no one is trying to see this from the male perspective.
People need a sense of purpose, not to have niceties shoved down their throat in school. Purpose, a healthy educational start to life, a disciplined mind, etc.
I don’t think it’s ever worked to say, “Don’t do this, because I said so.”
Show, don’t tell. Lead by example.
Listen to words in many Rap songs. But we can't say anything for running the risk of being called racists.
painting a schizophrenic's tragic and murderous outburst as "mysogyny" seems pointless and counter productive.
I just wrote something similar above. Mysoginy had nothing to do with this even with the father saying how much he was angry about not having a GF. Paranoid schizphrenia was the problem from the beginning. Not only that, those he killed just happened to be women who are mostly the people who go shopping. MSM just make up shit to go with their already-made-up-minds.
"involuntary celibate"... that's called life, bro. There are so many big girls out there ready and willing to love whoever shows them some attention. If you are an "in-cell" you need to work on you first and the girls will come. If you think you "deserve" a hotsie totsie but can't get one then I refer you to my first sentence... that's life, bro.
Any woman that thinks abortion is a "right" might as well be an "In-cell". Why make a life just to end it?
Most so called "incels" need to realize that they chose the path that has resulted in their predicament, and that if they don't like the results that they can choose a different one. There's nothing involuntary about what they are.
Where did Joel Cauchi get his sexist and misogynistic attitude from, his father perhaps? Joel was 40 years old, surely his father saw sexist and misogynistic attitudes from his 40 year old son over the years. How could the father be "horrified" at the actions of violent male(s), in this case his son. What did the father think would happen. Joel wasn't a boy, Joel's was a 40 year old adult male, why did the father call him "a sick boy"?. This isn't sickness; if Joel was sick how could he think up something so violent and then carry it out? Yet more excuses for violent males.
ruclips.net/video/8HGHLxuqrEI/видео.htmlsi=zIQHTMOad8I3KXrG&t=402
Brilliant interview, but Kate Manne didn’t mention the elephant in the room: internet pornography giving men the idea that they are entitled to a “hot blonde” and causing them to feel aggrieved when they don’t get one.
And that "hot blonde" feeling entitled to an abortion after giving it up to some loser of a man!
there are a lot of generalizations here, there are a lot of assumptions about psychology here.
If this approach saves girls lives and that is a kind of rapid response strategy..
Ask Professor Sapolsky's opinion in comparison with Baboon behavior, heirachical terrorism seems to be the norm and only the females have much self control that is similar to human survival strategies. I don't know, except superficial accusations not fully researched definitely don't help.
Professor, please speak more strongly, as in louder. Can barely hear your voice, but can hear the host fine.
This is a technical issue that the show's staff are at fault for. Not the professor.
I read somewhere that now days with everything being on line, especially dating sites, 10% of the men will get 90% of the attention from women cuz of their looks n their money. Personality doesn't come into the pic, so 90% of men r ignored, so they r lonely n feel they didn't get a fair shake, because they don't get a chance to get to know these would be dates, n show their actually really nice guys. So with so much social media in our lives now days, this is creating lots of single, marginalized men, who act out in this matter because of (sexual) frustration. Also the endless amount of weird bonkers stuff online, they can go down the rabbit hole, twisting their view of what reality n can make them believe they deserve a woman, n that kind of behavior is a justified response to being rejected time after time. This is an over simplification of what I read, n I didn't do a great job explaining it, but hopefully u get the jist of it. Just a little food for thought. (I don't condone this behavior, I'm just putting out a theory that I read about)
Before social media and dating by technology, you had to practice meeting women and vice versa which should be brought back. Men and women are socially stagnant with their heads in their cell phones instead of talking to one another which cripples healthy social interactions. It's not always easy, I remember many times guys that were jerks would call me a lesbian just because I politely turned them down. If men would learn to not take it so personally, but instead understand chemistry needs to work both ways. Men also need to get off the porn, it's dangerous and addictive, and total fantasy. We are all going to be rejected, you gotta meet a lot of frogs to find your prince or princess. But most important be a gentleman, (thinking there should be classes starting in middle school), parents can be helpful or the problem when it comes to educating their sons on how to behave around girls or women, but additional education I think could be very helpful. Empathy, when you are turned down always remember to think back when you rejected someone, be Ok and move on.
Maybe your source ("I read somewhere") needs checking. Those numbers sound unrealistic to me. Looking at census data from different countries, a majority of people still get married or live in de facto monogamous relationships. That somehow doesn't work with the male-female interest ratio you cite. All those women can't get married to only 10% of men. The claim that some only focus on particular looks and disregard personality is also questionable. Where does that claim come from? I'm not sure in what context you find yourself but maybe have a look at couples on the street or in your friend group. I look around and it's mostly average Joes dating average Janes. Most women look average and date average looking people -- that's inherent to the statistical idea of average. I took a look at some research, and of course physical attraction is a factor. But somehow I doubt that this small group of hyper attractive men spends their time dating massive amounts of average looking women. And these women just fiddle their thumbs until these unreachable guys feel inclined to give them a moment of their time? The numbers just don't work. And attractiveness is in the eye of the beholder. While there is a cultural measure of general attractiveness, we see attractiveness differently in people we care about. We say to someone we care about, "you look great in that shirt". We don't say: "great shirt but you still look like sh... because you're not Brad Pitt". So, maybe men who feel that their great personality isn't recognized should join a club or another group and really let that personality shine. True kindness and friendship often wins. Transactional "niceness" however gets typically recognised as what it is. It's not nice when there is an expectation of payment. When there is an expectation of "I gave you flowers, now sleep with me", that's not nice.
Facts are that marriage rate is down, way down, divorce is steady at 50% and female headed single parent households are increasing.
@@rikeag4057 the numbers were just thrown out there to illustrate a point. I don't remember the exact numbers, but it was very squed, with a small percentage of the guys getting most of the attention by a large majority of the females. Doesn't mean he's dating every one of them, I'm just saying, when all u see is a pic and maybe a couple sentences, most girls would go for the good looking guys. Plenty of average guys r getting gf's, and vice versa, I was referring strictly to dating n hookup sites, like tinder, where the slightly overweight, not so good looking guy just gets past over, time n again, or "swiped left" (or whatever direction means, "nope, not interested.") Idk, I've never used tinder or any kind of dating site before. I can't even remember if it was a RUclips vid, or an article I read, but it basically was saying that the way things r now, most younger people use social media for everything, n with dating sites n hook up sites, a lot of average guys r skipped over n not given the chance for the girl to get to know them and then decide, they like him, sure he could go out n meet a girl the old fashioned way, but I'm referring to internet sites, and the fact younger generations r relying social media for almost everything. I hate to say this, but I'm old now, just shy of 40, so social media isn't my thing, I dabble now n again, but mostly don't use it. I don't have kids either, but a lot of my friends do, n all their kids seem to only be interested in staring at screens. Be it a Smart phone, computer, PlayStation.... they never want to go outside n play with other kids, they just want screen time (I disagree with the way their parents let them do that all day, (but thats a whole other thing) that's just how a lot of younger people r these days, as far as I can tell, so less attractive guys, and I'm sure girls too, aren't given a fair chance. The point of the artical was that this new way of getting a date is leveaing a lot more guys frustrated at not getting any girls. Throw in a little mental illness n some weird fringe websites promoting violence to get what u want n u have a situation like this, . The artical said to expect things like this to happen more than it used to happen, n he thought that a heavy reliance on dating sites/social media platforms is the, cause. Sorry, that was very long winded
@@derekborow4121 I get your point, I just still disagree. I know a lot of young people and they don't just use dating apps. And it seems quite a stretch to me to argue that a few guys feeling overlooked on dating apps then shift to deep misogyny and start killing random women in a mall. Hating 51% of humanity would be a pretty extreme reaction to feeling that one isn't getting noticed on a dating app. I agree with you that fringe websites have a role to play.
What an incredibly accurate perspective. Thank you. By the way Gloria Stein, I think I have the last name right, the leading feminist of from the time I was a teenager, went too far. Definitely, a very strong position supporting women's rights and the ability to behave in some way other than what men expected of them was really an important step. But, taking it to the next level of displaying breast and pants down to the vagina went too far. Having to go to work with someone who is wearing a silk blouse with her nipples giggling during a meeting was going too far. Somehow that was rarely viewed by people who I tended to associate with as ridiculous and offensive.
Woman I know in reality you are the example in real life, of good imo, but please learn more on self defense, your children need you alive.
Most men will always come to your aid, but have a special last stand defense in store, it can be anything just something.
Could it be simply that women were seen by the killer as less of a threat at the time and more easily targetted? In the end, this is all pure speculation as the killer is dead and can't shed any light on his motivation. He therefore cannot be a point of reference for misogyny, there's plenty of deadshits getting locked up for beating and killing their current/former/never attained loves who prove your point every day.
Same thing for women that they r not entitled to make fun of men or make them feel shameful for having feelings od desire n being men for real...n just make use of them n move on like nothing happend...extremist r born out of negligence n entitlment to only one side.
Lol you mean like some men do to women? Of course people should not call each other names, but YET AGAIN shit isn't equal. We live in a world where we are called bitches, whores, THOTS, feminazis, etc ad nauseam. "bitch" is the default name for a female that many males use.
Every coin has 2 sides...a clap takes 2 hands not 1...both men n women need to learn to respect each other.
It isn't women overwhelmingly killing men. Or raping men. Or terrorizing men. Men don't carry pepper spray on their keychains out of fear of women. Men don't get security guards to escort them to their cars out of fear of being attacked by a woman. Men aren't afraid to take public transportation for fear of being attacked by a woman. WOMEN ARE and DO.
Currently, women are being punched in the face, in some cases hard enough to break their jaws, by stranger men in NYC while they are walking down the street in the middle of the day. Women are not doing this to men.
And regarding respect, women are socialized from birth to defer to men. (I am speaking in *generalities*; of course notallwomen) A major religion in America preaches that women should defer to men, indeed that we are inferior to men. So says their god.
The bullshit that men do to women is NOT matched by what women do to men. Men do not live in fear of women (of course there may be an individual man who does, but those men are rare compared to the number of women who live in fear of men, so sit down, no nuance Nancys). Men do not organize huge chunks of their lives around avoiding potentially dangerous women out of fear of being raped and/or murdered by them. Shit IS NOT equal in male/female relationships. I am so effing sick of hearing male apologetics.
And misogynists coming into the discussion to call me names and tell me how wrong I am in 3...2...1...
Ridiculous assertions. The perpetrator was a Schizophrenic. My assertion is easily as good as yours. It is thus : he was a big guy but a physical coward. He chose weaker victims. Am I right ? Am I any more likely to be so than this Ridiculous ideologue ? And who said that Schizophrenic patients are more apt to violence ? Go on. WHO SAYS THAT ?