I always remembered it by thinking how it tells you to approach 2 signals ahead. So, think of it like this: A single yellow means the next signal. 2 yellows means 2 signals ahead.
I've watched a lot of your ideos. You are clear, concise, intelligent and have a great voice for broadcasting. I grew up in Eldon Iowa, back when the Rock Island Railroad actually existed and ran right through the middle of town. I've learned a lot from your videos and appreciate the level of knowledge you display. I've wondered about so much of the things you answer for most of my life. I currently reside about a mile from an Austin to Mexico railroad hosted by the BNSF or formerly Atchison Topeka and Santa Fe, a great name for a railroad if ever there was one !!! Thanks again for the great stuff !!!
This is a nice series, Danny. I'm a first responder in my town (Fire/EMS) and we have a CSX yard in my response area (Selkirk). The signals here pretty much match what you're teaching, at least I haven't found any major differences.
Thanks Danny . Your expert narration throughout this series of signal videos is greatly appreciated . We think seeing and interpreting the signals as the crew does in real time movement is pretty darn cool . You help us do that . Thanks again old boy
Repairman for Amtrak that is also MDZ qualified, so this helped me get through the signal part of my NORAC test. Knowing the Amtrak color positions help me with these freight signals. Only thing I had an issue with, was the if it ain’t all Red it ain’t red at all………we see stop and proceeds. Red over white. (Amtrak color position)
The Canadian Pacific and Canadian National railways in Canada use the same signal system as CSX, but in the UK a different signal system is used where only a single coloured light is displayed (except for the Advance Approach, which displays two yellow lights). But the signals basically mean the same thing: Red means Danger (Stop), yellow means Approach, green means Clear
The PTGRail RUclips man, in his video titled "Train Simulator 2015 - British Signalling Guide," explains more what various British rail signals mean, including what various flashing signals mean. RUclipsr NormProbably came out in mid-June a video titled "How to Read Canadian National US Operating Rules Railroad Signals in Rockford, IL" with a flashing yellow on the highest signal head (or signal head if there's only one) often an equivalent to the British prelim caution (double-yellow) signal. This is very different from signals used by the TTC, the main public transport agency that serves Ontario's provincial capital, with that agency only using 3 colours of light, except with a high green or equivalent indicated by: - a single green - yellow over grey - yellow over green/yellow over grey (yellow in the middle indicating a diverging route) - 2 greens
think this is confusing? try being a conductor on shared joint track between two or three different rail roads. I worked for cp rail in southern penn. and we would go on the Sunbury main to harrisburg on NS track. you cannot even fathom some of the confusing old seaboard signals we would see. three diagnal flashing yellows over a solid green with a lunar white on a extended arm, I mean shit like that. was insane. stuff like medium medium approach advanced medium slow!!!! break out the chart boys. It was nuts. I'm exaggerating slightly but it was really confusing. I hated that run.
I had similar experiences when I was a switchman for the CNW/UP. But I would ask for a pilot till I got the hang of the run. Asking for a pilot gave you some cover just in case.
A quick question for you if time permits? How DO you adjust for lines used by several road names? Which aspect is leading the run - if I'm a UP grain train on BNSF tracks used also by CSX how do I follow the signals? Thanks in advance!!!
I'm proposing a set of speed signalling rules designed to be a fully standardised set over all of Canada, the US, and Mexico. And I think multi-headed colour-position lights should be the _de facto_ standard signal type. This would eliminate any confusion anywhere in North America.
It’s pretty simple. If the top head has a color it’s either green “clear”, or yellow “approach”. If the top head is red, the signal displayed will start with the speed. The next head down, or “B” head if flashing is limited clear or approach depending on color. If it’s solid lit, no flash, it’s medium clear or medium approach. If the A and B heads are red, color on C head, it’s a slow clear or slow approach. If the color is flashing upgrade the speed by one. So in the case of the red/yellow/flashing green = medium approach medium.
Interesting series, Danny. I don’t know why I am just finding it. Interesting info on the yellow over yellow on the CSX. Here in Kansas on the BNSF or UP, if the approach is yellow over yellow, it’s telling the engineer that at the control point (crossover on a double track or siding entrance on a single track) that he is to go no faster than 40mph and then the control point signal will be either green under red meaning he can proceed at normal speed once the has cleared the switch or yellow under red which means he will have to stop at the opposite end of the siding. If he is on a double track, it means he needs to proceed at 35 mph through the switch then be prepared to stop before the next block signal. BNSF and UP are notorious around here for getting trains backed up for many miles to come through the Kansas City Metro area. BNSF has Argentine yard to handle trains off of four different subdivisions. UP has a yard here in Kansas City that also handles trains from four different subdivisions. CSX, NS and CN/KCS also come through town as well as the Amtrak SW Chief between Chicago and LA, twice a day and the KC to St Louis River Runner that also runs twice a day. There is always railroad action around the KC Metro area if you are willing to go find it. They are increasing the size of many sidings in both Kansas and Missouri for the reason you mentioned plus, with some trains now being up to 16,000 ft long (around 320 cars and at least 12 locomotives distributed through the train, they can be a little more than three miles long at times. Yes, it really does happen. We call them super trains, almost always they are unit trains. What I don’t understand is how the rear engines get there orders by remote control from the engine on the point three miles away. That seems like a stretch to me. Oh, they are double tracking the south half of the Emporia sub from three miles southwest of Ellinor Jct down to Wellington, KS where it terminates and becomes a different subdivision. The Emporia Sub has gotten far more busy and the definitely needs to be double tracked for the entire length.
The block between signals are normally two miles in length, if it’s less than two miles it is considered a short block and signal progression is advanced approach then an approach signal to a stop signal.
SIGNAL INDICATION + LOCATION TIMESTAMPS ~~~~~~~~~~ 0:00 Medium Clear at Lakeland Connection 0:50 Approach Medium at Lakeland Connection 1:12 Medium Approach at South Lakeland 1:52 Clear / Medium Approach at Dinsmore Connection / Jacksonville 2:03 Medium Approach Medium at Folkston GA 2:35 Slow Approach at Honeymoon Wye / Beaver Street / Jacksonville 3:53 Restricting at Honeymoon Wye 4:22 Approach at Honeymoon Wye 5:02 Advance Approach at Sanford (Don't know the exact name of the signal) Ex-CSX but still uses same indication 6:35 Clear at Rockport Wye 7:02 Clear at Sandler Junction 7:08 Clear at Dinsmore Connection 7:12 Clear at Distant to Winston/Plant City
For us brits, advance approach is easy to remember because it is similar to the preliminary caution that we see, two yellows. Means the next signal is yellow.
I never understood why the bottom green flashes on a Medium-Approach-Medium on CSX. On NS the green stays solid, which to me makes more sense, because a flashing green under a yellow is Approach Limited, place that under a red and then you should get Medium Approach Limited, which, of course, wouldn't make any sense.
Because a solid signal means you are authorized for the speed associated directly with the head. middle head=medium speed, low head=slow speed. Flashing the signal upgrades the signal to the next speed up. a solid green in the middle head is a medium clear which means no faster than 30, now if you were authorized for limited speed: 45, the only way to convey that message to the crew is to use flashing aspects.
That's a good point but the bottom green in a Medium-Approach-Medium is still solid on NS (whereas this is apparently a Medium-Approach-Slow on CSX-never heard of this). Despite the differences, the effects of the rule are still exactly the same (no slow speed involved).
It's because it's the only way to show it. _Medium Advance Approach_ throws everything off. Because *R/Y/Y* is taken by that, then _Medium Approach Slow_ has to be *R/Y/G* and _Medium Approach Medium_ becomes *R/Y/fG.* NS is the way it is because of Conrail and NORAC standard signaling. The signals shown in this video are not descendant from that.
Holy cow, no wonder we will be go to autonomous trains...just like cars and planes. No job will be performed by a human that is better suited for a machine.
So what speed is Slow Approach (R/R/Y) limited to? Does that downgrade the approach to 15 mph? I don't believe the video specified. Great series, learned a lot. Thanks, Danny.
This makes British Rail Signalling look easy. Our old semaphore signalling is this but in a much more confusing arrangement as they don't indicate speed and if you have enough routes you could have several signals for one track. We use conventional speed boards for _every_ change. One thing I have to criticize speed-based signalling like this is that for a signal protecting multiple junctions with multiple routes, how does a driver/engineer know he has been set the correct route, say in the dark, or when the junction is out of sight. If there's at most one route requiring a specific speed, it's easy, but what happens if two have the same speed. Say it's dark and I'm getting a full clear, my train may not notice the wrong route is set until it's too late.
The "old semaphore signaling" is nothing like this. The old semaphore signaling is what's known as Route Signaling. Even the colorlight feathers of today are a form of route signaling. To answer your criticism, that's generally a non-issue. It's up to the dispatcher to know what they're doing, and they generally do. Additionally, the equipment on the tracks is interlocked, so it is not possible for a train to accidentally get a full _Clear_ aspect when they are switching through a 30 MPH switch (for example).
Basically it's Proceed at section speed, proceed with caution, be prepared to stop at next and Stop. I think US Railway signalling aspects are more complicated than they really need to be.
In Canada, red over yellow over flashing green is replaced by red over green over green, and the red over red over yellow demonstrated here is replaced by red over red over _flashing_ yellow, as red over red over yellow is a restricting signal in Canada. "Advance approach" is known in Canada as "advance clear to stop", and is signalled by flashing yellow over red over red.
In Canada, Advance Approach is a flashing yellow on top, and yellow/yellow means Approach Slow. 1:18 I think colour position lights would be a lot better because they clearly represent a colour in two ways at once. Colour-blind people can tell by the semaphore position whereas most of us could read both the colour and the position. In this case, the Medium Approach signal looked like Stop at first because the yellow light looked like orange.
The color on video can vary due to changes in the sky. If the sky cats a different shade it can throw off the camera's white balance and make lights look funny.
I'd imagine that the gentleman whose channel this is, and other American commenters, might not like me for saying this, but it makes me wonder whether this ridiculous level of complication is one of the causes of the accident rate in the US as compared to the UK.
@@w0033944 North American-style speed signals are inherently more complicated than the rather simple route signals found in the UK, and in the western half or so of the US (BNSF has 12 or 13 signal rules, and they use a route-based system). Mind you, the CSX signals shown here are nowhere near as complicated as those in Canada, which has about 35 different signals, with a couple light combinations for each signal rule
Amazing video Danny!! I have a question. Lately I’ve been seeing a lot of flashing Red over red on Union Paciifc area and can’t find what it means? Can you explain what it means please. - The socal Railfan (Edan)
Thanks for the kind compliment. I'm not a UP Signal expert, but I believe a flashing red over red is a RESTRICTING indication. Same meaning as our lunar RESTRICTING over here on the CSX: Proceed at restricted speed, prepared to stop in half he distance of an obstruction or mis-aligned switch.
I am always left puzzled when seeing North American signals: why choosing "speed signaling" or "route signaling", when you can have BOTH at the same time, as we do here in Italy? Most of the aspects are identical to "route" signals in the US, but the "speed" part of it is left to indicators and/or to the blinking phase of the aspects. There is also no need to have an extra, third light to indicate all the slow speed movements: to us Italians, a red-over-green signal -- with no further indication -- is a diverging clear, as per the "western roads". Diverging means 30 kph -- our slowest speed indication -- unless "upgraded" to 60 kph or 100 kph by the previous distant or ABS signal, and/or by employing a symbol indicator just below the aspect. (In case the symbol indicator is extinguished, the signal keeps being cleared to a slower speed.) Speed approaches are indicated by changing the flashing phase of the same yellow-over-green aspect you employ. That is: non-flashing yellow-over-green means 'approach next signal not exceeding 30 kph'; simultaneous flashing yellow-over-green means the same, but to 60 kph; and alternating flashing yellow-over-green means 100 kph.
In the United States, "speed signaling" and "route signaling" are exactly the same, except "speed signaling" prescribes specific speed limits for diverging movement signal indications, and "route signaling" does not. Speed signaling automatically limits you to three diverging speeds: Slow, Medium, and Limited. Route signaling has no such limitations. A signal aspect (or, more appropriately, a signal head) can be assigned to mean any maximum speed individually at each signal. As a route signaling example, let's say there's a junction where a single track splits into four tracks. The interlocking signal protecting the points has three signal heads. The top-most head still indicates for the through, non-diverging route. The second head might indicate for a 40 MPH route. The third head might indicate for a 20 MPH route. There's a fourth route left over yet, so it could be a _Restricting_ route indicating the exit of the signal system, with flashing red or lunar white on the second or third head. Or, it could be a second 40 MPH or a second 20 MPH route... which would cause the same aspects to be shown for both same-speed routes. The distant signal, encountered before the junction, will usually hint at the speed required at the next signal. It depends on how important it is deemed for the train driver to know. Remember that things like "pass the next signal not exceeding 40 MPH" is NOT really speed signaling-it's basic train control.
Distant signal, would there be such signal for a yellow over yellow over yellow? Almost like an advance approach, except prepared to stop at the 3rd signal ahead
This confuses the heck outta me sometimes, and yet a driver has to know all of the aspects meanings. I'm not sure what our New Zealand signals mean, but I don't see any signals as complex as the ones you have on the Seaboard line over there, twin headed signals at the most normally
I never understood why signals from the different parent RRs were not standardized after all the mergers. The signals we use on our system were finally coordinated btw the 2 divisions for consistency since operations on each required learning both signal systems as ppl often transferred btw the 2 divisions.
Med approach medium doesn't guarantee you will go thru a switch at that signal. Its being used to start braking sooner. Technically, that signal at Folkston should be Clear or Advanced Approach, depending on braking distance ahead, I.e. length of signal blocks ahead.
+flbmxdad You're right, it doesn't guarantee it, but every time I've seen that aspect there, there's been a turnout reversed. At Lakeland Junction, you can get a Medium Approach medium and stay on straight rack. So I guess it's different at each plant.
+Brian Ruhlen First off, Adv approach is still being used out here, Two it doesn't go to sgl main at the next signal, the next signal is the distant signal to Burch at the A 600.2, and Three this is an important one to you, know what your talking about first before you make yourself look like a dumbass to the rest of the world...
I wouldn't bet my life on it... but I'm fairly sure that the #2 at Folkston can and does display a high green. I've watched it start as an Approach and slowly improve to Clear quite a few times.
I think that Advance Approach with two yellows might be a relic from the semaphore era, since you couldn't really flash a semaphore blade. Why they didn't change to a single flashing yellow when colorlight signals came in...maybe they used the same wiring and didn't want to change it? Who knows? The first thing I thought was Approach Slow, and then my midwestern roots showed and thought Approach Diverging
Yellow over Yellow has also been a bit arbitrary. The semaphore explanation is as good as any, but alternatives such as _Appoach Medium_ had already begun to be used by then, too. Pretty sure about the guess on why they didn't change it: the crews were familiar with it. Changing things is hard.
I'd like to find out how many flunk out of training because of signals. They have them so complicated today I don't see how anybody learns them. Look how many episodes he needs to explain all of them, they are ridiculously complicated.
Hi Danny: It may be helpful to point out one simple logic rule in "SCL" based speed signals. Any color in the top quadrant has a simple "signal" name. For example, Clear, Approach and Stop. If there is a "pure" color, green or yellow in either the second or third (sometimes imaginary) quadrant then the name of the signal will always begin with a "speed". For example, Mediun Approach Slow and Medium Clear. Also, should there be a flashing green light in either the second or third quadrant, depending upon position, will bump up the speed to the next higjest level; Limited, Medium . Keep in mind the Restricting signal may authorize a maximum speed of 15 MPH but, in actuality that speed may be as low as 4 MPH, depending on conditions. You may also want to explain why a train has to run at Restricted Speed after a non-scheduled stop after knocking down a Clear signal in ABS territory.
Love this video. At 0:57 the signal shows Yellow over Green over Red as the next signal is Red over Yellow over Red. But if the latter signal was Red over Green over Red would the preceding signal still show Yellow over Green over Red?
Yes. The signal at 0:57 would be showing an approach medium whether the next signal is showing red-yellow-red (medium approach) or red-green-red (medium clear) or even red-yellow-flashing green (medium approach medium) They are all medium speed indications so the signal at 0:57 will always show an approach medium for those indication. There are times when a long heavy freight runs on an approach medium and has a straight approach at the next signal too
At 5:18 for a Yellow, Yellow, and Red means "Advance Approach." How come on the CSXT Signal Rules: signals.jovet.net/rules/CSX%20Signal%20Rules.pdf say that Yellow, Yellow, Red means "Approach Slow?"
Yellow over flashing green is approach limited. Proceed at authorized speed approaching your next signal not exceeding limited speed. This aspect usually indicates a diverging move at a turnout either to a new subdivision or at a crossover but also used to space trains out that are following each other.
•Approach Limited: Yellow, Flashing Green, Red on a three head or Yellow over Flashing Green. Proceed, approaching the next signal, not exceeding limited speed, 45MPH. On a three head, the red on the bottom has no meaning. The red is burning to confirm to the crew that the signal head is working.
On the ex Seaboard system the only indication where you'll see a flashing yellow is a limited approach. Red over flashing yellow over red on three head mast or red over flashing yellow on two head mast.
It depends on the railroad. On NS it'd be a _Approach Restricting._ On BNSF, it'd be _Approach Medium._ On about everything else, it'd be _Advance Approach._
Canadian signals are more complicated. They take "speed signaling" to the extreme. American signals are simpler. Quite a few American signals do not even employ "speed signaling."
Danny, the trailer train cars at 3:36, why are there not 4 axles on each car ? They seem to be only one axle and a overlapping tongue on car to car ? Is this right ?
hi, this is a rail fan in china. recently I've been playing TSW and I was confused about american railway signals. Your video is really educational. I wonder if I can get your permission to share this video to another website, bilibili, which is accessible in china. This really can help rail fans in china to understand how CSX signals work. Thank you!
I understand most of these signals except for the combos involving the bottom signal on a 3 signal mast. If the bottom one was solid green wouldn't that mean slow and flashing green would be slower than slow? lol...oh my god I feel a migrane coming on lol
signal master the only indication on the ex seaboard system that flashes the yellow would be limited approach. Red over flashing yellow or red over flashing yellow over red.
Yes. They are different indications and telling the crew to do different things at the signal. The only similarity is the approach aspect that tells the crew to prepare to stop at the next signal. YRR is an approach light telling the engineer to slow to medium speed when his engine passes the signal and preparing to stop at the next signal. RRY is a slow approach. Proceed through the signal at slow speed preparing to stop at the next signal.
If you wanted to know what Y Y R meant, here you go. Advance Approach: Yellow, Yellow, and Red on a three head signal. Proceed, prepared to STOP at the second signal. Trains exceeding Limited speed must begin reduction to limited speed as soon as the locomotive passes.
@@csxfloridafunnelrailfan3065 yeah I really should have known that I found out by simply railfaning and noticed that the signals were that when a train at the speed limit came
I don't think there's a Medium Approach Limited on CSX. What would be that indication? Approach this signal at Medium speed then proceed at Limited speed?
Okay look, I can simplify this for you guys in just a few paragraphs. When it comes to mast signals, start from the top and work your way down. If the top is displaying green, go no further, you have a clear track and you may proceed to the next signal, regardless of the rest of the signals. Is the top yellow? That means at the next signal you are running out of this track, unless the next lights below display something other than red. So in that case, is the middle light green? okay then that means you have another track to go to and you just have to slow to medium speed when you get there. Is it yellow instead? That means you are going to have another yellow light at the next signal, be prepared. Is the middle light red but the bottom light is green? It means the same thing as the other green light; you are running out of track and you are shifting to another track at the next light, but this one is SLOW. Is the top light red? You have run out of track. Except if the second light is Green? So you are still out of track but you are shifting to a new track, take it at medium speed and then you can proceed to the next signal. But is the second light yellow? So then you are still out of track but you are shifting to a new track, only to run out of track again at the next signal, unless the bottom light is also green, which indicates when you get to the next signal, you are shifting again, take it slow when you get there. Or is the bottom light yellow? Then this means you are out of track and shifting over to the next track where you are running out of track again after the next signal. But is the middle light also red? Yep, you are still out of track, but if the bottom light is Green then you have to take it SLOW as you shift to the next track and then proceed on to the next signal. but if the bottom light is yellow, you need to take it slow as you shift and then prepare to stop at the next signal. If it's not all red, then it's not red at all. If you are looking at all red, you must stop. Now here are the exceptions: Flashing lights are more permissive than solid lights. Therefore a flashing middle green indicated Limited Speed rather than Medium speed. Markers such as a "P", "G" or milemarker on a signal make it an intermediate rather than an absolute signal, therefore all-red only means "Proceed at Restricted Speed" Any time a Lunar aspect is displayed regardless of position, it means you are leaving CTC territory and entering other-than-main track with "Restricting" which means you do not need any additional authority beyond that signal. Speed signalling used to be referred to as Maximum speed, LImited Speed (45MPH), Medium Speed (30 MPH) and Slow Speed (15 MPH), but for the past 20 years or so, Timetable speeds overrule signal speeds. As such, CSX changed their "Slow Speed" to 20 MPH so that trains do not attempt to run at a speed that will cause harmonic rock. (13-17 MPH)
That's block signalling, depending on where you are in the country. Flashing yellow is more permissive than a solid yellow, but it's only ever seen on CSX signals when displaying a Limited Approach, red over flashing yellow. Go West with Block signalling rather than speed signalling and you have advance approach with a single flashing yellow, and a double yellow indicates approach diverging, similar to the approach limited / medium here.
The saying at 3:10 definitely helps out alot.
"If it ain't all red, it ain't red at all"
Advance Approach: it’s an approach for the approach
I always remembered it by thinking how it tells you to approach 2 signals ahead. So, think of it like this: A single yellow means the next signal. 2 yellows means 2 signals ahead.
Excellent explanations! I am an ex-ConRail engineer, so some of the aspects are new to me.
RIP Dave Felts! 6:19 - I miss ya, buddy! Hope you're running those rails in Heaven.
What happened?
I've watched a lot of your ideos.
You are clear, concise, intelligent and have a great voice for broadcasting.
I grew up in Eldon Iowa, back when the Rock Island Railroad actually existed and ran right through the middle of town.
I've learned a lot from your videos and appreciate the level of knowledge you display. I've wondered about so much of the things you answer for most of my life.
I currently reside about a mile from an Austin to Mexico railroad hosted by the BNSF or formerly Atchison Topeka and Santa Fe, a great name for a railroad if ever there was one !!!
Thanks again for the great stuff !!!
This is a nice series, Danny. I'm a first responder in my town (Fire/EMS) and we have a CSX yard in my response area (Selkirk). The signals here pretty much match what you're teaching, at least I haven't found any major differences.
Think there might be a few, that was the Chessie System
Thanks Danny . Your expert narration throughout this series of signal videos is greatly appreciated . We think seeing and interpreting the signals as the crew does in real time movement is pretty darn cool . You help us do that . Thanks again old boy
I'm so glad these videos are finally back!!! Yay!!! :-)
Really enjoying this series. Well done!
I start conductor training in Atlanta on the 9th and I was told your videos were great for study and learning 🙏🏾
Another good video Danny! If I'm ever down in CSX country in Florida I'm sure I'll find this info most helpful. Also nice catch on the MP15AC!
Repairman for Amtrak that is also MDZ qualified, so this helped me get through the signal part of my NORAC test.
Knowing the Amtrak color positions help me with these freight signals.
Only thing I had an issue with, was the if it ain’t all
Red it ain’t red at all………we see stop and proceeds. Red over white. (Amtrak color position)
The Canadian Pacific and Canadian National railways in Canada use the same signal system as CSX, but in the UK a different signal system is used where only a single coloured light is displayed (except for the Advance Approach, which displays two yellow lights). But the signals basically mean the same thing: Red means Danger (Stop), yellow means Approach, green means Clear
The PTGRail RUclips man, in his video titled "Train Simulator 2015 - British Signalling Guide," explains more what various British rail signals mean, including what various flashing signals mean. RUclipsr NormProbably came out in mid-June a video titled "How to Read Canadian National US Operating Rules Railroad Signals in Rockford, IL" with a flashing yellow on the highest signal head (or signal head if there's only one) often an equivalent to the British prelim caution (double-yellow) signal. This is very different from signals used by the TTC, the main public transport agency that serves Ontario's provincial capital, with that agency only using 3 colours of light, except with a high green or equivalent indicated by:
- a single green
- yellow over grey
- yellow over green/yellow over grey (yellow in the middle indicating a diverging route)
- 2 greens
Thanks for the teaching and amazing Quality! 🤩👍
You really know the signal system, I've learned alot from you. Thanks again.
Thanks for all your videos. They're very slick and helpful.
Great video!!! Very helpful information!
think this is confusing? try being a conductor on shared joint track between two or three different rail roads. I worked for cp rail in southern penn. and we would go on the Sunbury main to harrisburg on NS track. you cannot even fathom some of the confusing old seaboard signals we would see. three diagnal flashing yellows over a solid green with a lunar white on a extended arm, I mean shit like that. was insane. stuff like medium medium approach advanced medium slow!!!! break out the chart boys. It was nuts. I'm exaggerating slightly but it was really confusing. I hated that run.
I had similar experiences when I was a switchman for the CNW/UP. But I would ask for a pilot till I got the hang of the run. Asking for a pilot gave you some cover just in case.
A quick question for you if time permits? How DO you adjust for lines used by several road names? Which aspect is leading the run - if I'm a UP grain train on BNSF tracks used also by CSX how do I follow the signals? Thanks in advance!!!
@@RantzBizGroup As far as I’m aware, it depends only on who owns the line. They don’t speak your language: you have to speak theirs.
@@beeble2003 I suspected so....
I'm proposing a set of speed signalling rules designed to be a fully standardised set over all of Canada, the US, and Mexico.
And I think multi-headed colour-position lights should be the _de facto_ standard signal type.
This would eliminate any confusion anywhere in North America.
On two of my railroads around here in Wisconsin, a double yellow is an approach-diverging.
I'm surprised to see Union Pacific locomotives in Florida @ 4:36!
It’s pretty simple. If the top head has a color it’s either green “clear”, or yellow “approach”. If the top head is red, the signal displayed will start with the speed. The next head down, or “B” head if flashing is limited clear or approach depending on color. If it’s solid lit, no flash, it’s medium clear or medium approach. If the A and B heads are red, color on C head, it’s a slow clear or slow approach. If the color is flashing upgrade the speed by one. So in the case of the red/yellow/flashing green = medium approach medium.
Loving the content!
Thanks Danny. Keep up the great work!
I’m going through conductor school right now and these videos are a massive help. Thanks
Glad to hear they're helping you!
Really enjoying your videos Danny.
I love ur shows
Interesting series, Danny. I don’t know why I am just finding it. Interesting info on the yellow over yellow on the CSX. Here in Kansas on the BNSF or UP, if the approach is yellow over yellow, it’s telling the engineer that at the control point (crossover on a double track or siding entrance on a single track) that he is to go no faster than 40mph and then the control point signal will be either green under red meaning he can proceed at normal speed once the has cleared the switch or yellow under red which means he will have to stop at the opposite end of the siding. If he is on a double track, it means he needs to proceed at 35 mph through the switch then be prepared to stop before the next block signal. BNSF and UP are notorious around here for getting trains backed up for many miles to come through the Kansas City Metro area. BNSF has Argentine yard to handle trains off of four different subdivisions. UP has a yard here in Kansas City that also handles trains from four different subdivisions. CSX, NS and CN/KCS also come through town as well as the Amtrak SW Chief between Chicago and LA, twice a day and the KC to St Louis River Runner that also runs twice a day. There is always railroad action around the KC Metro area if you are willing to go find it. They are increasing the size of many sidings in both Kansas and Missouri for the reason you mentioned plus, with some trains now being up to 16,000 ft long (around 320 cars and at least 12 locomotives distributed through the train, they can be a little more than three miles long at times. Yes, it really does happen. We call them super trains, almost always they are unit trains. What I don’t understand is how the rear engines get there orders by remote control from the engine on the point three miles away. That seems like a stretch to me. Oh, they are double tracking the south half of the Emporia sub from three miles southwest of Ellinor Jct down to Wellington, KS where it terminates and becomes a different subdivision. The Emporia Sub has gotten far more busy and the definitely needs to be double tracked for the entire length.
The block between signals are normally two miles in length, if it’s less than two miles it is considered a short block and signal progression is advanced approach then an approach signal to a stop signal.
You can remember Advance Approach by counting them, 2 yellows, two signals away.
Some lines use a flashing yellow signal...
SIGNAL INDICATION + LOCATION TIMESTAMPS
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0:00 Medium Clear at Lakeland Connection
0:50 Approach Medium at Lakeland Connection
1:12 Medium Approach at South Lakeland
1:52 Clear / Medium Approach at Dinsmore Connection / Jacksonville
2:03 Medium Approach Medium at Folkston GA
2:35 Slow Approach at Honeymoon Wye / Beaver Street / Jacksonville
3:53 Restricting at Honeymoon Wye
4:22 Approach at Honeymoon Wye
5:02 Advance Approach at Sanford (Don't know the exact name of the signal) Ex-CSX but still uses same indication
6:35 Clear at Rockport Wye
7:02 Clear at Sandler Junction
7:08 Clear at Dinsmore Connection
7:12 Clear at Distant to Winston/Plant City
For us brits, advance approach is easy to remember because it is similar to the preliminary caution that we see, two yellows. Means the next signal is yellow.
Most US & Canadian railroads use Flashing Yellow for _Advance Approach._ CSX is an odd holdover for the more-expensive aspect.
I never understood why the bottom green flashes on a Medium-Approach-Medium on CSX. On NS the green stays solid, which to me makes more sense, because a flashing green under a yellow is Approach Limited, place that under a red and then you should get Medium Approach Limited, which, of course, wouldn't make any sense.
Because a solid signal means you are authorized for the speed associated directly with the head. middle head=medium speed, low head=slow speed. Flashing the signal upgrades the signal to the next speed up. a solid green in the middle head is a medium clear which means no faster than 30, now if you were authorized for limited speed: 45, the only way to convey that message to the crew is to use flashing aspects.
That's a good point but the bottom green in a Medium-Approach-Medium is still solid on NS (whereas this is apparently a Medium-Approach-Slow on CSX-never heard of this). Despite the differences, the effects of the rule are still exactly the same (no slow speed involved).
I have never seen NS use any flashing lights or lunar in former N & W or Southern Railway territory.
It's because it's the only way to show it. _Medium Advance Approach_ throws everything off. Because *R/Y/Y* is taken by that, then _Medium Approach Slow_ has to be *R/Y/G* and _Medium Approach Medium_ becomes *R/Y/fG.*
NS is the way it is because of Conrail and NORAC standard signaling. The signals shown in this video are not descendant from that.
Holy cow,
no wonder we will be go to autonomous trains...just like cars and planes.
No job will be performed by a human that is better suited for a machine.
Your voice is impeccable
agreed
Nice catch with 5006!
Love that S5T at 3:20!
Yeah awesome sound! Many old Erie Lackawanna units had that set of horns. Miss them, miss the railroad!
Same, the Erie Lackawanna is my fav railroad
Advance Approach for us with Union Pacific signals, It's a flashing yellow.
I like this video
So what speed is Slow Approach (R/R/Y) limited to? Does that downgrade the approach to 15 mph? I don't believe the video specified.
Great series, learned a lot. Thanks, Danny.
Approach the next signal going no more than 15 mph, prepared to stop if its red. It's kind of a glorified restricting
This makes British Rail Signalling look easy. Our old semaphore signalling is this but in a much more confusing arrangement as they don't indicate speed and if you have enough routes you could have several signals for one track. We use conventional speed boards for _every_ change.
One thing I have to criticize speed-based signalling like this is that for a signal protecting multiple junctions with multiple routes, how does a driver/engineer know he has been set the correct route, say in the dark, or when the junction is out of sight. If there's at most one route requiring a specific speed, it's easy, but what happens if two have the same speed. Say it's dark and I'm getting a full clear, my train may not notice the wrong route is set until it's too late.
The "old semaphore signaling" is nothing like this. The old semaphore signaling is what's known as Route Signaling. Even the colorlight feathers of today are a form of route signaling.
To answer your criticism, that's generally a non-issue. It's up to the dispatcher to know what they're doing, and they generally do. Additionally, the equipment on the tracks is interlocked, so it is not possible for a train to accidentally get a full _Clear_ aspect when they are switching through a 30 MPH switch (for example).
Basically it's Proceed at section speed, proceed with caution, be prepared to stop at next and Stop. I think US Railway signalling aspects are more complicated than they really need to be.
Clutch vid for my test comin up
One way i remember advanced approach is it has two yellows and you stop at the second signal
Nice video
here's a trick i made for "advance approach": second yellow, second signal.
Goggles Tigerkhan You I
In Wisconsin on our railroads our Advance Approaches are flashing yellows.
In Canada, red over yellow over flashing green is replaced by red over green over green, and the red over red over yellow demonstrated here is replaced by red over red over _flashing_ yellow, as red over red over yellow is a restricting signal in Canada.
"Advance approach" is known in Canada as "advance clear to stop", and is signalled by flashing yellow over red over red.
In Canada, Advance Approach is a flashing yellow on top, and yellow/yellow means Approach Slow.
1:18 I think colour position lights would be a lot better because they clearly represent a colour in two ways at once. Colour-blind people can tell by the semaphore position whereas most of us could read both the colour and the position. In this case, the Medium Approach signal looked like Stop at first because the yellow light looked like orange.
The color on video can vary due to changes in the sky. If the sky cats a different shade it can throw off the camera's white balance and make lights look funny.
Like that old Lesley horn
Have some Amtrak locomotives been renumbered?
In Ferndale Michigan a red over flashing red means restricting
This kind of thing makes me ever more relieved that the UK signalling system has nowhere near as many aspects as this 😂
I'd imagine that the gentleman whose channel this is, and other American commenters, might not like me for saying this, but it makes me wonder whether this ridiculous level of complication is one of the causes of the accident rate in the US as compared to the UK.
@@w0033944 North American-style speed signals are inherently more complicated than the rather simple route signals found in the UK, and in the western half or so of the US (BNSF has 12 or 13 signal rules, and they use a route-based system). Mind you, the CSX signals shown here are nowhere near as complicated as those in Canada, which has about 35 different signals, with a couple light combinations for each signal rule
@@w0033944 Plus the lack of any train protection system.
3:12 true quote
Now how did Q108 get a restricting as opposed to a stop?
Thanks a million, great work.
Amazing video Danny!! I have a question. Lately I’ve been seeing a lot of flashing Red over red on Union Paciifc area and can’t find what it means? Can you explain what it means please. - The socal Railfan (Edan)
Thanks for the kind compliment. I'm not a UP Signal expert, but I believe a flashing red over red is a RESTRICTING indication. Same meaning as our lunar RESTRICTING over here on the CSX: Proceed at restricted speed, prepared to stop in half he distance of an obstruction or mis-aligned switch.
Ahhh ok thanks very much
Does a Flashing Yellow, Red, and Red on a three head signal also mean Approach Medium?
I am always left puzzled when seeing North American signals: why choosing "speed signaling" or "route signaling", when you can have BOTH at the same time, as we do here in Italy? Most of the aspects are identical to "route" signals in the US, but the "speed" part of it is left to indicators and/or to the blinking phase of the aspects. There is also no need to have an extra, third light to indicate all the slow speed movements: to us Italians, a red-over-green signal -- with no further indication -- is a diverging clear, as per the "western roads". Diverging means 30 kph -- our slowest speed indication -- unless "upgraded" to 60 kph or 100 kph by the previous distant or ABS signal, and/or by employing a symbol indicator just below the aspect. (In case the symbol indicator is extinguished, the signal keeps being cleared to a slower speed.)
Speed approaches are indicated by changing the flashing phase of the same yellow-over-green aspect you employ. That is: non-flashing yellow-over-green means 'approach next signal not exceeding 30 kph'; simultaneous flashing yellow-over-green means the same, but to 60 kph; and alternating flashing yellow-over-green means 100 kph.
very interesting comment, always good to get another perspective
In the United States, "speed signaling" and "route signaling" are exactly the same, except "speed signaling" prescribes specific speed limits for diverging movement signal indications, and "route signaling" does not. Speed signaling automatically limits you to three diverging speeds: Slow, Medium, and Limited. Route signaling has no such limitations. A signal aspect (or, more appropriately, a signal head) can be assigned to mean any maximum speed individually at each signal.
As a route signaling example, let's say there's a junction where a single track splits into four tracks. The interlocking signal protecting the points has three signal heads. The top-most head still indicates for the through, non-diverging route. The second head might indicate for a 40 MPH route. The third head might indicate for a 20 MPH route. There's a fourth route left over yet, so it could be a _Restricting_ route indicating the exit of the signal system, with flashing red or lunar white on the second or third head. Or, it could be a second 40 MPH or a second 20 MPH route... which would cause the same aspects to be shown for both same-speed routes.
The distant signal, encountered before the junction, will usually hint at the speed required at the next signal. It depends on how important it is deemed for the train driver to know. Remember that things like "pass the next signal not exceeding 40 MPH" is NOT really speed signaling-it's basic train control.
1:34 I love short trains but 6:40 I love light power more
Distant signal, would there be such signal for a yellow over yellow over yellow? Almost like an advance approach, except prepared to stop at the 3rd signal ahead
No
This confuses the heck outta me sometimes, and yet a driver has to know all of the aspects meanings. I'm not sure what our New Zealand signals mean, but I don't see any signals as complex as the ones you have on the Seaboard line over there, twin headed signals at the most normally
In our state of Alabama we have a lot of trains everyday
BNSF has the advanced approach as a flashing yellow
Permissive category coming up?
Dwarf signal: *white*
Me: **sees switch wrong**
Also me: _This is helpful-_
My analysis: railroad signal aspects are like encrypted codes
I never understood why signals from the different parent RRs were not standardized after all the mergers. The signals we use on our system were finally coordinated btw the 2 divisions for consistency since operations on each required learning both signal systems as ppl often transferred btw the 2 divisions.
are the Winston search lights gone
Yes. They were taken out of service spring last year
Med approach medium doesn't guarantee you will go thru a switch at that signal. Its being used to start braking sooner. Technically, that signal at Folkston should be Clear or Advanced Approach, depending on braking distance ahead, I.e. length of signal blocks ahead.
+flbmxdad You're right, it doesn't guarantee it, but every time I've seen that aspect there, there's been a turnout reversed. At Lakeland Junction, you can get a Medium Approach medium and stay on straight rack. So I guess it's different at each plant.
Have you ever been to Folkston?
+Brian Ruhlen use to live 20 min from there, I go back multiple times a yr.
+Brian Ruhlen First off, Adv approach is still being used out here, Two it doesn't go to sgl main at the next signal, the next signal is the distant signal to Burch at the A 600.2, and Three this is an important one to you, know what your talking about first before you make yourself look like a dumbass to the rest of the world...
I wouldn't bet my life on it... but I'm fairly sure that the #2 at Folkston can and does display a high green. I've watched it start as an Approach and slowly improve to Clear quite a few times.
Double yellow appears to mean the same in CSX language as a British heavy-rail equivalent.
I think that Advance Approach with two yellows might be a relic from the semaphore era, since you couldn't really flash a semaphore blade. Why they didn't change to a single flashing yellow when colorlight signals came in...maybe they used the same wiring and didn't want to change it? Who knows? The first thing I thought was Approach Slow, and then my midwestern roots showed and thought Approach Diverging
Yellow over Yellow has also been a bit arbitrary. The semaphore explanation is as good as any, but alternatives such as _Appoach Medium_ had already begun to be used by then, too.
Pretty sure about the guess on why they didn't change it: the crews were familiar with it. Changing things is hard.
hope there aint a no book quiz on this after class thats alot to know on just one railroad
I'd like to find out how many flunk out of training because of signals. They have them so complicated today I don't see how anybody learns them. Look how many episodes he needs to explain all of them, they are ridiculously complicated.
I Love It Because I Understand It
Thank you 21 Year Vet
👍🏾
If it ain't all red it ain't RED At All 👌🏾
Hi Danny:
It may be helpful to point out one simple logic rule in "SCL" based speed signals. Any color in the top quadrant has a simple "signal" name. For example, Clear, Approach and Stop. If there is a "pure" color, green or yellow in either the second or third (sometimes imaginary) quadrant then the name of the signal will always begin with a "speed". For example, Mediun Approach Slow and Medium Clear. Also, should there be a flashing green light in either the second or third quadrant, depending upon position, will bump up the speed to the next higjest level; Limited, Medium . Keep in mind the Restricting signal may authorize a maximum speed of 15 MPH but, in actuality that speed may be as low as 4 MPH, depending on conditions. You may also want to explain why a train has to run at Restricted Speed after a non-scheduled stop after knocking down a Clear signal in ABS territory.
Love this video. At 0:57 the signal shows Yellow over Green over Red as the next signal is Red over Yellow over Red. But if the latter signal was Red over Green over Red would the preceding signal still show Yellow over Green over Red?
Yes. The signal at 0:57 would be showing an approach medium whether the next signal is showing red-yellow-red (medium approach) or red-green-red (medium clear) or even red-yellow-flashing green (medium approach medium)
They are all medium speed indications so the signal at 0:57 will always show an approach medium for those indication. There are times when a long heavy freight runs on an approach medium and has a straight approach at the next signal too
At 5:18 for a Yellow, Yellow, and Red means "Advance Approach." How come on the CSXT Signal Rules: signals.jovet.net/rules/CSX%20Signal%20Rules.pdf say that Yellow, Yellow, Red means "Approach Slow?"
Because that’s the former Conrail territory rules.
@@ACs_Trains ok thanks
Last night l was railfanning, and I saw a signal signal indicated yellow over flashing green what does that mean?
Yellow over flashing green is approach limited. Proceed at authorized speed approaching your next signal not exceeding limited speed. This aspect usually indicates a diverging move at a turnout either to a new subdivision or at a crossover but also used to space trains out that are following each other.
•Approach Limited: Yellow, Flashing Green, Red on a three head or Yellow over Flashing Green. Proceed, approaching the next signal, not exceeding limited speed, 45MPH. On a three head, the red on the bottom has no meaning. The red is burning to confirm to the crew that the signal head is working.
0:36 also CSX sd40-2
Hey I live in Jacksonville
What is a regular flashing yellow signal called?
On the ex Seaboard system the only indication where you'll see a flashing yellow is a limited approach. Red over flashing yellow over red on three head mast or red over flashing yellow on two head mast.
It depends on the railroad. On NS it'd be a _Approach Restricting._ On BNSF, it'd be _Approach Medium._ On about everything else, it'd be _Advance Approach._
Canadian train signals are really similar to American, but are less confusing I think
Canadian signals are more complicated. They take "speed signaling" to the extreme. American signals are simpler. Quite a few American signals do not even employ "speed signaling."
1:14 signals in thunderstorms CONFIRMED
Danny, the trailer train cars at 3:36, why are there not 4 axles on each car ? They seem to be only one axle and a overlapping tongue on car to car ? Is this right ?
yes. those are built like that, spine flats.
+Keith Chestnut I see those all the time at the Los Angeles rail yard near my house, they're purposely built like that
hi, this is a rail fan in china. recently I've been playing TSW and I was confused about american railway signals. Your video is really educational. I wonder if I can get your permission to share this video to another website, bilibili, which is accessible in china. This really can help rail fans in china to understand how CSX signals work. Thank you!
Why do railroads use different signals?
Because they used different signalling contractors, or they had to come up with the signalling themselves.
There are different signals used in the same railroad, CSX has at least 3 different signal schemes.
5:16 that’s the one that confused me a lot!
Good 'ol Auto-Train!! Lol
I understand most of these signals except for the combos involving the bottom signal on a 3 signal mast. If the bottom one was solid green wouldn't that mean slow and flashing green would be slower than slow? lol...oh my god I feel a migrane coming on lol
The flashing green in this case upgrades it to medium.
Towards the end of the video it looks like ur intro to all of ur other vids
what dose the yellow flashing mean
signal master the only indication on the ex seaboard system that flashes the yellow would be limited approach. Red over flashing yellow or red over flashing yellow over red.
I see what you did there... "Slow down!" - "what... does... the... yellow... flashing... mean?..."
Dat rs5t tho
Where shunting signals in CSX?
0:31 CSX AC6000
Can’t lie a the signals are different in Norac like what you called slow approach is restricting in the NORAC
And the Advance Approach on CSX is an Approach Slow for NORAC / and the Medium Approach Slow on CSX is a Medium Approach Medium on NORAC 😵💫
Is there a difference between Y R R and R R Y?
Medium speed vs slow speed I guess?
Yes. They are different indications and telling the crew to do different things at the signal. The only similarity is the approach aspect that tells the crew to prepare to stop at the next signal. YRR is an approach light telling the engineer to slow to medium speed when his engine passes the signal and preparing to stop at the next signal. RRY is a slow approach. Proceed through the signal at slow speed preparing to stop at the next signal.
Red-Red-Yellow can also mean _Restricting_ on some railroads... such all of Canada.
If you wanted to know what Y Y R meant, here you go. Advance Approach: Yellow, Yellow, and Red on a three head signal. Proceed, prepared to STOP at the second signal. Trains exceeding Limited speed must begin reduction to limited speed as soon as the locomotive passes.
What does green over red mean
Simple. Clear signal. Clear to proceed at authorized speed. Meaning the maximum speed your train is allowed to go.
@@csxfloridafunnelrailfan3065 yeah I really should have known that I found out by simply railfaning and noticed that the signals were that when a train at the speed limit came
The flashing green modified the yellow so you made a mistake it’s Medium approach limited
I don't think there's a Medium Approach Limited on CSX. What would be that indication? Approach this signal at Medium speed then proceed at Limited speed?
Hey distant the bottom signals actually mean diverging signals sorry if that was kind of rude.
Yes if they are yellow, green or even restricting signals. If they are red they mean nothing in the aspect.
Csx switcher leading
In the beginning of this video, u just caught a little lightning storm
Everytime I see A red over yellow signal, to me it's like a, " stand by" signal.
Okay look, I can simplify this for you guys in just a few paragraphs. When it comes to mast signals, start from the top and work your way down. If the top is displaying green, go no further, you have a clear track and you may proceed to the next signal, regardless of the rest of the signals.
Is the top yellow? That means at the next signal you are running out of this track, unless the next lights below display something other than red. So in that case, is the middle light green? okay then that means you have another track to go to and you just have to slow to medium speed when you get there. Is it yellow instead? That means you are going to have another yellow light at the next signal, be prepared. Is the middle light red but the bottom light is green? It means the same thing as the other green light; you are running out of track and you are shifting to another track at the next light, but this one is SLOW.
Is the top light red? You have run out of track. Except if the second light is Green? So you are still out of track but you are shifting to a new track, take it at medium speed and then you can proceed to the next signal. But is the second light yellow? So then you are still out of track but you are shifting to a new track, only to run out of track again at the next signal, unless the bottom light is also green, which indicates when you get to the next signal, you are shifting again, take it slow when you get there. Or is the bottom light yellow? Then this means you are out of track and shifting over to the next track where you are running out of track again after the next signal. But is the middle light also red? Yep, you are still out of track, but if the bottom light is Green then you have to take it SLOW as you shift to the next track and then proceed on to the next signal. but if the bottom light is yellow, you need to take it slow as you shift and then prepare to stop at the next signal.
If it's not all red, then it's not red at all. If you are looking at all red, you must stop.
Now here are the exceptions:
Flashing lights are more permissive than solid lights. Therefore a flashing middle green indicated Limited Speed rather than Medium speed.
Markers such as a "P", "G" or milemarker on a signal make it an intermediate rather than an absolute signal, therefore all-red only means "Proceed at Restricted Speed"
Any time a Lunar aspect is displayed regardless of position, it means you are leaving CTC territory and entering other-than-main track with "Restricting" which means you do not need any additional authority beyond that signal.
Speed signalling used to be referred to as Maximum speed, LImited Speed (45MPH), Medium Speed (30
MPH) and Slow Speed (15 MPH), but for the past 20 years or so, Timetable speeds overrule signal speeds. As such, CSX changed their "Slow Speed" to 20 MPH so that trains do not attempt to run at a speed that will cause harmonic rock. (13-17 MPH)
Wait a minute- I thought Yellow over Yellow over Red was Approach Slow and a High Flashing Yellow was Advance Approach
It is on the Chessie system, this is CSX/Seaboard.
That's block signalling, depending on where you are in the country. Flashing yellow is more permissive than a solid yellow, but it's only ever seen on CSX signals when displaying a Limited Approach, red over flashing yellow. Go West with Block signalling rather than speed signalling and you have advance approach with a single flashing yellow, and a double yellow indicates approach diverging, similar to the approach limited / medium here.