If only every DIY video were this concise, yet thorough. I really appreciate how much trouble you went through to explain everything (including the specs for distance and angle) and light every shot. THIS video is what RUclips University is all about. Bless you, Kelly
bro you explained in the video all the smallest details. That was beautiful, and that is what distinguishes you from the rest. Even though I did not speak English well, I understood everything
if you put your upper links closer together at the axle youll create more angle at the upper links which will help with side loading and greatly lengthen the life of your upper heims.
So much good info, Im glad I clicked on this video. My situation is a bit different. I have a lowered 2wd street truck that I want to get completely rid of the leaf springs and convert it to coilovers. The geometry is so important and I haven't been able to find a good video on that anywhere.
Pro tip for welding .. I’ve welded brackets near my whole life on boats. And you don’t have room. Practice using a mirror and for welding use a bent low hydrogen rod (for strength). In a restricted position this will work.
This is the step by step, how too, with tips and tricks I have been looking for!!!! Amazing video, great job!! now it’s time to spend some money!!! Thanks again!
Ive got the titanium 200 unlimited. I love mine. Welds amazing. Crazy what kinda performance it gives vs its price. Nice link setup man.its got me thinking
Dude! This was a great video. Helpful info and quality how to with what you showed. totally something I can do now that I have watched this. Thank you!
Super good job. I know it is too late but have you heard about the Weld Through Primer. I wished I had it when I did my axle truss.Keep up the great work. P.S. I found you on Dirt Lifestyle.
awesome video.. cant find the coilover setup vid :( did you 4 link the front as well? would love to see that. You explain things very well so it would be cool to see how to do it with steering and oil pans etc.
I have been getting emails about this lately. I believe I will make a video finishing up the rear and also explaining the front setup as well. Thanks for watching🤟🏻
They were not available when I was doing my project, but they are a little more expensive, less noise and rebuildable. So I would have preferred to use those, but I couldn’t get them at the time. But I can always upgrade to them later on.
I am thinking of leaving my leaf springs in for as long as possible while I build it ,that way it holds it exactly where it should and I won't cut them out until the last possible moment when I have to ,what do you think of that idea?, I forgot to add I'll be working on a 98 Toyota Tacoma 4x4
Robert Keefer nice, so did you center your axel so that your springs are directly on your axel and then do all your measurements of that ie uca angles on frame and truss? Asking because I’m going 4 link in rear and want to know how to center the axel and do I need to relocate the spring buckets on axel thanks!
So the inner frame link mount (upper link bracket not on truss) is set at 20 degrees from the factory, that is you have to weld it together and is there tabs so the bracket goes together only 1 way so you can weld it? Thanks !
They have 0,10 or 20 degree brackets. There are no tabs to hold it into place to accommodate different mounting widths. So you just install your joint, tack it together and take the joint out and fully weld it.
Does the lower link bracket on the axle have to be below the center line of the axle? Having problems getting my arm separation on the axle correct. Thanks!
What are the benefits of the 9 inch over the 8.8? Also what is the width difference of the two? Awesome video man. I have been considering that exact 4 link kit from Barnes.
Nice, I am planning on doing a video on this, but I am a little overwhelmed trying to get everything done before Easter Jeep Safari. I will get to it eventually.
Im probably going to have a lot of questions because im in the process of trying to lift my jeep but i need some guidance as to how to do it i want to run 38s on it but i want to do it correctly 😅
Excellent video, one question is the top link flat at ride height and how did you determine that. If a guy was starting from scratch on a project would it be best to order springs first?
I live in Yelm. Figure it's fairly close to where Muddy Beards live. Anyway, want to get into fabricating my own Jeep stuff like you. Where do I get tubing, plate steel, etc.? Tacoma, Lakewood? I'll go where you guys go. Thank you.
Thanks, a known spot on the axle and frame. So measures and make a mark in the same spot on both sides of the axle. I would actually recommend getting a laser, they are only like $60 and makes life easier. I bought a laser and checked it after I was all done and it was all perfectly centered so the plum bobs do work.
Would a set-up like this be street legal and if so would you recommend it... Love the idea of all this for my daily driver that hits the trails and rocks as well. Just looking for some advice on it all beforehand.
As far as legality you would have to look up your local laws as I do not drive this on the street. This would definitely be an upgrade compared to factory.
Great Video, very informative. Can you clear a couple of things up though? I got lost on how you came up with the 9.5” spacing between upper and lower links at the axle instead of the 10” you mentioned in the beginning. Was this from the calculator you mentioned? Also what determined where you set the first LCA bracket on the frame? Was that set by the bracket or the kit from Barnes? Or was your LCA a set number and you just verified the measurement?
I ended up at 9” of axle link separation, the 9.5” was because of the extra 1/2” on top of the framing square. At 10” the Lca bracket on the axle was just hanging down too low. The lca bracket on the frame I located it as far back as possible, up against my skid plate and then measured everything off of that. Thanks for watching🤟🏻
Good informative video! In the process of 4 linking my tj and this helped a lot! Love the videos. Hopefully I get it done soon, I wanna hit Elbe hills before I leave Washington this summer
How are you getting away with 20 degrees on your pinion angle ??? All my research says 5 degrees is where you want it to be and honestly I’m having a problem achieving 5 degrees on my build right now. Any info would be a huge help thanks
The pinion angle doesn’t reflect the u- joint working angle. You adjust your pinion angle to achieve the proper u joint working angle which should be around Zero on a coil spring vehicle and about 2 degrees down (negative) on a leaf sprung vehicle. Adams driveshaft website has some good references in the “angle picture” tab.
Muddy B. Where is your garage located? I have a 2001 S10 quadcab with a 6 inch rough country lift. But, I want it with a link like this on the rear. Can it be done? Thanks.
With this type of four link am I correct in thinking you will have to run a bar of some kind to keep the axle centered or will the triangulation be enough?
@@MuddyBeards4X4 out of curiosity. You can do the exact same thing with the front axle as well? Or do you think having the Trac bar and "3link" is best?
The front is more complicated, I went with the 3 link and trac bar because of clearance. The oil pan and exhaust would be in the way of the link on the passenger side so a lot of modifications would need to be done. Radius arms would work, or the 3 link.
@@MuddyBeards4X4 very true. Wasn't thinking about any of that. Thank you for taking the time to explain, greatly appreciated! Great videos by the way I find them very helpful, and full of information. Also, just as a FYI, I enjoy the wheeling videos too. Seems like you have a great group of people!
Was looking for info on this as this will replace my weak IRS since my car isnt very popular there isnt much that will stop me from snapping axle stubs so a solid axle seems to be the cheapest and simplest thing to do your video is quite helpful what size tube did you use is that like a schedule 40?
Hello ! Can you explain me the difference for making 4 link suspension on reduced axle ? May be you have calculator for such process ? (Sorry for my pigeon english , a,m from Ukraine ) .
You don’t want your pinion angle pointing at the transfer case all the time. The pinion angle should be the same angle as the output of the transfer case all the time. Both your transfer case output u joint angle and the differential u joint angle should be the same. You can’t have one at 20° and one straight. Well you can but it’s going to vibrate and wear out. Also your lower links should angle inward to the center line of the truck slightly to take force off the heims joints. This will also help center the diff and takes all the lateral force off the upper links. Good video but just a few ideas to fine tune things.
If only every DIY video were this concise, yet thorough. I really appreciate how much trouble you went through to explain everything (including the specs for distance and angle) and light every shot. THIS video is what RUclips University is all about. Bless you, Kelly
Thanks man I really appreciate that👍🏻
Best 4-link explanation I've seen, hands down! Thanks for demystifying proper locations, degrees, parts, and all that good stuff.
Thanks 👊🏻
I heard 'plug weld' --smart man. You should be proud of yourself.
I've come back to watch this vid multiple times, and it's still one of the best vids for explaining geometry in a simple yet thorough way
Thanks👊🏻
bro you explained in the video all the smallest details. That was beautiful, and that is what distinguishes you from the rest. Even though I did not speak English well, I understood everything
Even after all this time I still come back and refer to this video. Thanks brother for a great DIY Lesson!!!!
Awesome 🤟🏻
THE BEST VIDEO ON THE SUBJECT ! VERY DETAILED, i WISHED TO LIVE CLOSE BY YOUR PLACE.
Thanks for the Numbers Game. Now we can get to Welding.
This is the best explanation video on 4 links I've seen. Thanks
Thanks I appreciate it🤟🏻
Excellent presentation, one of the best 4 link DIY on RUclips.
if you put your upper links closer together at the axle youll create more angle at the upper links which will help with side loading and greatly lengthen the life of your upper heims.
So it is better to make them closer?
HE'S NOT LYING ABOUT THOSE TJ FRAMES !!
I just got my rear 4 link done on my xj and love the way it rides now!
what did you do for springs? coil overs or did you weld in spring perches?
So much good info, Im glad I clicked on this video. My situation is a bit different. I have a lowered 2wd street truck that I want to get completely rid of the leaf springs and convert it to coilovers.
The geometry is so important and I haven't been able to find a good video on that anywhere.
Go to RideTech on RUclips
Pro tip for welding .. I’ve welded brackets near my whole life on boats. And you don’t have room. Practice using a mirror and for welding use a bent low hydrogen rod (for strength). In a restricted position this will work.
Great video. My son just bought toyota axles for his 91 trooper project and he wants to link them under it. He is 10 years old with wheeling passion.
Nice video! This actually gave me some confidence that one day I could 4 link swap my montero sport. Just gotta learn to weld now..
Very good video. U explain so well. Doesn't seem so foreign now.
Thanks 👊🏻
This is the step by step, how too, with tips and tricks I have been looking for!!!! Amazing video, great job!! now it’s time to spend some money!!! Thanks again!
Thanks, lol. Yes, lots of money🤟🏻
Lots of great info here, thanks for putting this vid together!!!
Great job! Greetings from Brazil!
Good stuff right here! I'm planning a similar 4 link setup for a mud truck I'm building.
Nice 👊🏻
@@MuddyBeards4X4 good knowledge on this video!! I'm trying to learn as much as I can get before I attack this project. Haha
Good job..next proj..thanks for this video
Awesome. This has been on my mind lately. I hope to get it done this year
Nice 👍🏻
This really makes me wanna 4 link my truck, I don’t offroad it but
4 link is always a good idea 👍🏻
Awesome job. Very clean !
Awesome man! Explained very nicely 👌.
Just found this video. Great detail. Very much appreciated. Thank you!!! Like, subscribed, etc.
We dig the content Kelly, you guys keep it up!
Yea a few things that a DIY could mess up. Thanks for spelling that out.
Awesome video going in depth on four linking the rear. 👊🏻
Thanks👍🏻
Awesome video!!! I would not have the patience for 4linking...lol!!!!
Ive got the titanium 200 unlimited. I love mine. Welds amazing. Crazy what kinda performance it gives vs its price. Nice link setup man.its got me thinking
Yep, I love it so far too. No problems. Works great every time I use it.
They do awsome on aluminum as well!
Nice setup!
Thanks👊🏻
Really great tips. I’m gonna have to learn how to do this
Barnes 4WD makes a 3 link kit for the JK, Get on it!
thanks for sharing this amazing video.
God bless you n your family .
This video is going to help my son a lot on his TJ build, thanks! (I like the leafs on the back of my XJ, they’ll be staying😂)
Thanks, well done. Very useful. I'll be doing this to my 73 mustang in the near future. Doesn't look too complicated.
Nice man, good luck
Great video, Kelly! Can't wait to see it work. Thanks for all the information
Me too👊🏻 lol
Dude!
This was a great video. Helpful info and quality how to with what you showed. totally something I can do now that I have watched this.
Thank you!
Thanks, good luck with the build.
I'm gonna do this on my Minitruck
Great video! I’ll be saving it for later!
Great vid. Very helpful
If you have 30 degrees on the top links in 10 degrees on the bottom links that still gives you 40 degrees overall
Hello from Tri-Cities Washington
I run open gear lube on my joints... no squeak no rust
Wow amazing man grate job kip it up .. awesome
Im put 9 inch in,done with d44.2000 tj ls soon
Looking great Kelly!
Thanks👊🏻
Perfect timing . I'm starting to plan a 4 link in the rear of my xj. I know it's not the same, but the theory should be . Thanks
Yep, theory’s the same but you will have a few more steps for sure, lol.
Great video man!!! Loved it!!
Thanks man, appreciate it🤟🏻
Just make sure POR 15 undercoating / paint underneath everywhere .
Very nice and good job 👍
Super good job. I know it is too late but have you heard about the Weld Through Primer. I wished I had it when I did my axle truss.Keep up the great work. P.S. I found you on Dirt Lifestyle.
Thanks man, I never heard of it either, I will check it out👊🏻
Nice congrats for your channel
Great video.
Thanks
Be nice if you had the facility to pull the body off. Doing it this way is brutal, as opposed to bare frame.
Great video thank you.. Question, does the same apply to build a street suspension for a little truck? Please, it is my project. Thank you
Same concept applies for any 4 link suspension
Great job
awesome video.. cant find the coilover setup vid :( did you 4 link the front as well? would love to see that. You explain things very well so it would be cool to see how to do it with steering and oil pans etc.
I have been getting emails about this lately. I believe I will make a video finishing up the rear and also explaining the front setup as well. Thanks for watching🤟🏻
well done to say the least! i wish you many views and large you tube kick backs
Excelente video!! Se aprende mucho! 👏👏
Are the upper and lower control arms the same length?
What are the pros/cons of running Barns' Enduro joint as opposed to heims?
They were not available when I was doing my project, but they are a little more expensive, less noise and rebuildable. So I would have preferred to use those, but I couldn’t get them at the time. But I can always upgrade to them later on.
I am thinking of leaving my leaf springs in for as long as possible while I build it ,that way it holds it exactly where it should and I won't cut them out until the last possible moment when I have to ,what do you think of that idea?, I forgot to add I'll be working on a 98 Toyota Tacoma 4x4
This is great I’m getting ready to do this to my yj thank you
Robert Keefer how did it go? I’m thinking about doing this
Mike Plant so far so good it’s a lot of work but it will be worth it 90 percent done with the rear
Robert Keefer I have a question so in the rear are you doing coil overs as well or are you leaving stock springs and or what is your axel?
Mark Brites I am doing coil springs whole way around my rear axle is a Dana 44
Robert Keefer nice, so did you center your axel so that your springs are directly on your axel and then do all your measurements of that ie uca angles on frame and truss? Asking because I’m going 4 link in rear and want to know how to center the axel and do I need to relocate the spring buckets on axel thanks!
So the inner frame link mount (upper link bracket not on truss) is set at 20 degrees from the factory, that is you have to weld it together and is there tabs so the bracket goes together only 1 way so you can weld it? Thanks !
They have 0,10 or 20 degree brackets. There are no tabs to hold it into place to accommodate different mounting widths. So you just install your joint, tack it together and take the joint out and fully weld it.
Does the lower link bracket on the axle have to be below the center line of the axle? Having problems getting my arm separation on the axle correct. Thanks!
I have the same welder works great🤟🏼💯
Stick to a good welder and you'll never be sorry. Good vid...
What are the benefits of the 9 inch over the 8.8? Also what is the width difference of the two? Awesome video man. I have been considering that exact 4 link kit from Barnes.
Nice, I am planning on doing a video on this, but I am a little overwhelmed trying to get everything done before Easter Jeep Safari. I will get to it eventually.
Fantastic video! Did you go to a trade school to learn this or school of hard knocks?
Thanks🤟🏻
Very informative thank you! Someday I hope to do this in my xj.
Im probably going to have a lot of questions because im in the process of trying to lift my jeep but i need some guidance as to how to do it i want to run 38s on it but i want to do it correctly 😅
Would it be advisable to use a welding blanket to cover the fuel / brake lines?
Yes, anytime I was near there I had everything wrapped in a welding blanket👍🏻
Is it basically the same basic rules with a trailing arm that the shock mounts in the center vs what u did
(For prerunner)
Excellent video, one question is the top link flat at ride height and how did you determine that. If a guy was starting from scratch on a project would it be best to order springs first?
I live in Yelm. Figure it's fairly close to where Muddy Beards live. Anyway, want to get into fabricating my own Jeep stuff like you. Where do I get tubing, plate steel, etc.? Tacoma, Lakewood? I'll go where you guys go. Thank you.
Oh, yeah, this is my wife's account. My name is Jack.
Jack, I don’t know anywhere out there, but I get my metal from interwest metals in fife.
great video i will be doing this soon but i do have one Newbe question, when your using the plumb bob, what are measuring or lining up with it?
Thanks, a known spot on the axle and frame. So measures and make a mark in the same spot on both sides of the axle. I would actually recommend getting a laser, they are only like $60 and makes life easier. I bought a laser and checked it after I was all done and it was all perfectly centered so the plum bobs do work.
Great was really hell lot of information with this I get confident to convert mine as well
Would a set-up like this be street legal and if so would you recommend it... Love the idea of all this for my daily driver that hits the trails and rocks as well. Just looking for some advice on it all beforehand.
As far as legality you would have to look up your local laws as I do not drive this on the street. This would definitely be an upgrade compared to factory.
Great Video, very informative. Can you clear a couple of things up though? I got lost on how you came up with the 9.5” spacing between upper and lower links at the axle instead of the 10” you mentioned in the beginning. Was this from the calculator you mentioned? Also what determined where you set the first LCA bracket on the frame? Was that set by the bracket or the kit from Barnes? Or was your LCA a set number and you just verified the measurement?
I ended up at 9” of axle link separation, the 9.5” was because of the extra 1/2” on top of the framing square. At 10” the Lca bracket on the axle was just hanging down too low. The lca bracket on the frame I located it as far back as possible, up against my skid plate and then measured everything off of that. Thanks for watching🤟🏻
How would you verify, you have the right size bump stops and or the correct number of hockey pucks?
So, upper bars flat as possible and whatever max angle on the bottom, is at ride height, right?
Correct at ride height
Was your plumb bob centered to the tube center or the front edge?
Good informative video! In the process of 4 linking my tj and this helped a lot! Love the videos. Hopefully I get it done soon, I wanna hit Elbe hills before I leave Washington this summer
Thanks man, once I get back from ejs we definitely will be hitting up Elbe👍🏻
Would this work on a tube rear frame 1970s ford prerunner
I'm not getting 40 degree angle on the upper links. How can I get the 40 degree on an early bronco? Thank you!
How do you like that baur bandsaw? Been thinking about one of those....
The saw has been great not issues.
Question, do those calculations also apply to to a street 4 link? thank you
How are you getting away with 20 degrees on your pinion angle ??? All my research says 5 degrees is where you want it to be and honestly I’m having a problem achieving 5 degrees on my build right now. Any info would be a huge help thanks
The pinion angle doesn’t reflect the u- joint working angle. You adjust your pinion angle to achieve the proper u joint working angle which should be around Zero on a coil spring vehicle and about 2 degrees down (negative) on a leaf sprung vehicle. Adams driveshaft website has some good references in the “angle picture” tab.
One of the best rear 4link videos on RUclips info wise. 🚙🍆
Muddy B. Where is your garage located? I have a 2001 S10 quadcab with a 6 inch rough country lift. But, I want it with a link like this on the rear. Can it be done? Thanks.
With this type of four link am I correct in thinking you will have to run a bar of some kind to keep the axle centered or will the triangulation be enough?
The upper triangulated arms are enough, you don’t need a trac bar.
@@MuddyBeards4X4 out of curiosity. You can do the exact same thing with the front axle as well? Or do you think having the Trac bar and "3link" is best?
Thanks for the reply. I am sort of new to this stuff and was unsure.
The front is more complicated, I went with the 3 link and trac bar because of clearance. The oil pan and exhaust would be in the way of the link on the passenger side so a lot of modifications would need to be done. Radius arms would work, or the 3 link.
@@MuddyBeards4X4 very true. Wasn't thinking about any of that. Thank you for taking the time to explain, greatly appreciated! Great videos by the way I find them very helpful, and full of information. Also, just as a FYI, I enjoy the wheeling videos too. Seems like you have a great group of people!
Does the 25% of tire height apply to any and every vehicle that a 4 links going under?
I would say yes. Same concept for any vehicle with a 4 link.
Was looking for info on this as this will replace my weak IRS since my car isnt very popular there isnt much that will stop me from snapping axle stubs so a solid axle seems to be the cheapest and simplest thing to do your video is quite helpful what size tube did you use is that like a schedule 40?
It is all dom tube, much stronger than schedule 40. It’s the Barnes4wd 4 link kit. Comes with the tube.
@@MuddyBeards4X4 thanks for the reply I'll check it out and it goes to show that one can learn alot from different builds 👍
Hello ! Can you explain me the difference for making 4 link suspension on reduced axle ? May be you have calculator for such process ? (Sorry for my pigeon english , a,m from Ukraine ) .
Good informations.
Спасибо. Хорошее видео. Хоть язык плохо понимаю, но наглядно было всё.
You don’t want your pinion angle pointing at the transfer case all the time. The pinion angle should be the same angle as the output of the transfer case all the time. Both your transfer case output u joint angle and the differential u joint angle should be the same. You can’t have one at 20° and one straight. Well you can but it’s going to vibrate and wear out. Also your lower links should angle inward to the center line of the truck slightly to take force off the heims joints. This will also help center the diff and takes all the lateral force off the upper links. Good video but just a few ideas to fine tune things.