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Wax Slugs (Neat Novelty But Not Safe)
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- Опубликовано: 24 июн 2013
- www.tngun.com/wax-slugs/
www.amazon.com/Lee-Precision-S...
If you are in a hurry here is the summary -- homemade wax slugs -- don't do it...
However, when I am told don't do something, unless I know WHY I should not do it, my nature directs me to do it, and so this post will describe the common RUclips practice of homemade wax slugs and why they are incredibility dangerous (as well as a bad idea).
Basically a number of RUclips gun channels describe this process in some detail and many are led to believe wax slugs are a cheap alternative to conventional slugs and/or some devastating defensive or hunting round.
Basically a wax slug is where someone takes a shot round, pries open the crimp, and mixes hot wax with the shot. Either they drip wax into the shell, or they dump out the shot mix it with wax, and then repack it.
What then happens is the wax holds the shot column together longer so that it does not expand as much, therefore acting more like a slug than shot.
However, wax melts, and as it travels down the barrel it leaves a thin coating of wax on the bore. In a previous post about rifling www.tngun.com/differences-bet... we talk about the catastrophic effects of constricted barrels. Any observation of the thickness of a shotgun barrel compared to any rifled barrel will show the thin nature of smoothbore barrels. They have NO tolerance for construction, and wax will very quickly build a dangerous level of coating on your bore.
If you shoot waxed slugs in your shotgun you will eventually blow your gun up, this will not only ruin your gun, but will also likely maim you for life.
I have a very high tolerance to dangerous projects because I am very confident in my own judgment and research skills, but just because something is cool and DIY does not always make it a good idea.
Commercial slugs are not very expensive, are readily available, do not contaminate the meat of game if you are using slugs to hunt, and will not open yourself up to very serious legal questions about intent in a self-defense shooting. They are also much more efficient and useful than wax slugs.
Additionally, shotguns are notoriously finicky about loads, they just do not have the same tolerances for home loadings as rifles or pistols do. Even if you are meticulous about cleaning all the wax out after every shot (which as a candle maker, I know how close to impossible wax is to remove), the changes to the weight of the load will also increase pressures inside the gun.
If you want to make your own loads -- buy a shotshell reloader and get the satisfaction and self-reliance capabilities of making your own shells the safe way. Something like a lee load all is very inexpensive, makes a decent quality of shotshell, and allows you to make shot, slug, and buckshot rounds in your own home without risking turning your gun into a pipebomb.
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Every single user who shoots wax slugs has shown the inside of their barrel and there is zero wax buildup.
Hold up wax melts at low temperatures.. the temperature and pressure of shooting will force residue out or burn it up. Wax also is a lubricant your idea makes little to no sense.
You don't have the issue. The barrel will stay incredibly clean.
I had the same mindset as you when I first heard about wax slugs. Even a few people in the gun business told me the same thing. ONLY AFTER I had run a whole box of waxers I made (25) and checking my barrel, did I realize there was absolutely nothing left in the barrel but a bit of unburnt powder. IMHO a lead slug thru anything tighter than cylinder bore will create more of a pressure spike than any wax slug would.
Also like to point out the idea of wax slugs is the same as cut shells, it's turning something you already have into something more useful. like during the great depression when people couldn't afford slugs they modified bird shot by making cut shells to take out large game ect.
the comment about shooting someone with afford waxers, and the backlash you would get is somewhat true, as I imagine it would be harder to fish all the paraffin wax out of someone's body instead of shot or a slug.
Also it's been shown in a home defense situation birdshot is the best way to go, unless you live alone away from other houses waxers can have just as penetration as solid lead slugs
I understand what you are saying, and respect your research. I still don't feel it is worth it in 90% of situations, but don't get mad at someone who disagrees. I am just glad you bothered to make a reasonable decision based upon intelligent research. I will stick to my #4 buck for inside the home and not use wax shells for slugs.
@@TNGun the barrel partially cleans itself with waxers. Every Blast literally vaporizes some of the residual wax buildup. Had to clean a gun shooting lead rounds a lot sooner after inspecting barrels, than ever seen with a waxer. Not hating on you for being safe, but at the same turn don't hate on those that choose to use it. That would be like making a video about people who turn on red. Is it advisable; no. Is it absolutely safe; no. Is it illegal; also no; And if done safely; is perfectly fine...... So long as people clean their guns regularly; it's no more; and actually probably less of a risk than an unclean weapon firing solid lead in my opinion. As far as the self-defense thing goes; most areas of the US have a castle doctrine. Home defense rounds are MEANT TO KILL the intruder. It is meant to completely neutralize the threat. So the argument that "he modified his rounds to kill people" is laughable in a self-defense situation, because for home-defense the objective IS to KILL or pacify the intruder not knowing his intent in that he has entered your home with a possible ill intent. Now I would understand that argument if I shot someone with a wax slug fifty yards out off my doorstep while fleeing. But for IN-HOME SELF-DEFENSE that argument wouldn't hold at least in my opinion. I'm not a lawyer but from a jurors standpoint; I would laugh that argument out of the courtroom. At least in my state. I live in Pennsylvania where we do have a castle doctrine that if you break into my home I can defend my home and everything in it with DEADLY FORCE.🤷♂️ As to your argument that "a regular slug is a lot more effective," That is subjective in my opinion as a regular slug carries a lot of mass and deforms less depending on the range of the target meaning that there's a much higher chance of pass-through and injuring or killing someone else. Wax slugs break apart upon impact; also known as a frangible round, and have very little if any pass-through while hitting with just as much force as a regular slug to neutralize the threat without excessive damage 2 property or injuring someone else. Using a regular slug for home defense is like saying it's okay if your child in the Next Room gets shot by the bullet that went through your intruder. So as for home defense; I'd rather be a waxer and not risk hitting someone else over a regular slug that passes through the assailant. About the only part of your whole discussion I agreed with was "clean your gun regularly".
Build up of wax? Do you clean your guns ever?
David, if guys are having issues with waxing in the barrels, it means they are using cheap junk wax. I spent time trying this thinking the same thing. I could not find any wax in my barrel after 50 rounds.
However, your reasoning on this is incredibly sound and realistic as well. Safety first. People just do silly things and wind up hurt.
I agree with the other posters. Hearsay, fuddlore, poppycock
The failures I have saw on youtube lead me to think it is not wax buildup, but instead it is hung wads. The point made in this video to clean after each shot would have exposed any obstructions. Be careful with modified ammo of any type.
I've shot tons of wax slugs through my mossberg590a1 keep in mind it's a heavy walled barrel but my barrel is always spotless after shooting wax slugs I've never had a coating on the inside
I have a coating in my 870, what am i doing wrong? :( i fear i am going to ruin my shotty
If Ur barrel does somehow get all waxy here's a really weird way to get rid of it.......clean ya gun!
It is common sense to clean a guns bore after use an before use after long periods without use.
And just to point it out a lot of bullets actually have wax lube
In 2021 a box of birdshot at walmart was $5.48. Today (2022), the same box is $9.41.
In 2021 a box of 5 slugs was about $6-$7. Today (2022) I have no idea because I dont buy slugs. I make cut shells, or (more recently) I make hot-glue slugs using BBs. Never cared for wax slugs. Using hot glue is easier, less messy and doesnt melt in summer
Here we are 8 years later, no evidence of problems with wax slugs, regular slugs are nearly impossible to find, and we find are selves at a point in history where the idea of a shtf scenario where we won't be concerned with the legal implications is starting to look like a very realistic possiblity.
I know this is an old video, but I have been using a wax form slug for over 30 years.
Never hurts to take extra precaution
Wax slugs do not build wax in shotgun barrels.... infact after shooting 100 rounds of wax slugs during a test through a improved cylinder and ported barrel I barely see any fouling even around the ports. So it actually cleaned my bore. The only problem I see with wax slugs is the common way of making them and when shooting 1, the possibility of a squib load and then chambering and firing another. Such as the video "Wax slug incident". As for me I use a 11/16 hole saw and cut inside of the crimp so I leave the wad intact and have great compression. As for me and many others who actually expiremented with wax slugs, as well as those who shot them for years. I think we can agree this vid is total BS and missleading, please do some research and test before comming up with hypothesis. Besides this is a cheaper way to make slugs atm and a better home defense round then a slug. Since slugs penetrate walls
As far as cutting inside the crimp, do you mean so that after it is cut, it kind of looks like a rolled crimp?
+Matt Jones yes, but it serves as a purpose of holding the cup and slug in place. If not when the rounds get banged around like going into battery the actual slug may fall out/move
Kenny Ey Thanks. :)
Kenny Ey not if you don't cut off the full crimp
A critical thinker would know that the burning of the powder is a lot hotter than the melting point of wax. Each round will self clean the barrel. This vid would make me question everything else this guy says. He's simply not that bright.
Do you have any experience with wax? I do, I am both a paid firearm instructor and a beekeeper. I reload shotguns and make candles. I know how hard it is to clean wax off of metal even if you get it hot. But I don't know you, and don't care if you think I am not bright - but I do think you should question everything you see on the internet.
Shepherd School wasn't wax used in black powder guns to reduce fouling. I've shot a lot of waxers and i find it cleaned the barrel if anything. I don't put them in the magazine and always make sure they are seated proper. I feel if u only use lighter loads and shoot one at a time it's not a big risk especially if u have a roll crimp to keep the slug secure. Cut shells on the other hand are sketchy and i will not even think about it.
Wax in bee keeping is not quite the same as wax going 1400fps down a steel tube. You're conflating two things that shouldn't be conflated. Sure you have experience with wax and you have experience with guns, but you admit you don't have experience with waxy guns. Meanwhile the comments are full of guys that use wax slugs and say it's fine. The conclusion, therefore, is that doing your own testing on camera is warranted in order to provide viewers with solid information rather than hearsay and myths. Next you'll try to tell us that the sound of working a pump action is enough to send burglars running. Prove it.
I agree with the legal concerns about wax slugs. I'd only use them in a SHTF situation. In a normal home defense situation they'd look like you were modifying ammo to cause undue harm. Wax slugs are a surgeon's nightmare
Yes, He's spent a lot of time trying to perfect what he's doing. Wax slugs have to be done right or you can have an accident. People mixing wrong waxes or making too heavy of loads and blowing out the breach on their shotgun.
Biggest danger from wax slugs is removing all(too much) of crimp allowing wax slug to fall free from shell and falling partially down barrel. The wad retains the powder charge. The shooter then fires the defective wax slug,hears the report and thinks the projectile was launched (but sounded a little funny) but they just missed. The loose wax slug and/or wad or some part thereof is left in middle of barrel. Shooter then reloads another wax slug and fires it in the blocked barrel causing pressure overload and blames the SECOND wax slug. Same thing as when weak shell is fired in semi-auto rifle. Projectile may not exit barrel but shooter is engaged in rapid fire/trigger manipulation ---does not notice or have time to stop next trigger pull and fires ANOTHER bullet down blocked barrel thereby bursting barrel or action/receiver. I have some "Old Timey" rifle shells which appear to have a ?wax? lube on projectile from factory. They do not appear to foul barrel at all. Think they are Remington Clean Bore....go figure. But you are right ..be careful "You'll shoot your eye out Kid!" haha
so if you keep you gun clean it should be fine !!!
In reality, there could not be any "wax build-up" inside the barrel for two reasons:
1) the heat created when firing a shells would liquify anything on the walls of the barrel and 'wash it off' with the next shell you fire
2) most people clean their shotguns after they use them or at least a couple of sessions later.
You just have to know what yer doing. Don't put any wax beyond the shot cup and the barrel will remain wax free and no, you will NOT blow your gun up if you follow basic common sense rules. Smooth barrel. Cylinder choke. Clean it regularly. Make sure there's NO loose shot and do NOT over fill the round. Also make SURE the slug is tight inside the round and doesn't 'fall' out inside your barrel before you shoot.
Batfox Babe cut the shell just to the inside of the crimp addresses the "fall out".easy as pie. been running these just as long, and never had issues. I always ran smooth bore no choke, but a waxxer can handle a moderate choke. shit you can probably run em in a fully riffled barrel, but I wouldn't count on them not breaking up on the way to the target. other than that, no issues. most critical thing, aside from cutting to the inside of the crimp, is to make damn sure each shell is properly topped off with wax. just make sure no shot can get knocked loose in other words. that's why when you see us make em, we cap with just wax at the end, and got that file handy to clean the shell up after it cools. makes the wax perfectly flush to the crimp. should not see shot at the very tip of the shell. keep that in mind and no misfires. or as this guy put it, "pipe bomb" in the face lol. this video is a complete scare tactic. it has no fact to it.
Proof? Your thumbnail shows a blown up shotgun, that would suggest that you have one to show us from wax? Not a problem to caution people to stay safe, but you are giving specific scenarios and don't seem to offer any evidence that this has happened.
Clickbait
been shooting wax slugs for years, the only problem is those few idiots who cut the whole crimp off and feed them through the mag till one slips and "squib" other than that there perfectly safe guys!
I've heard/read from others that I deem as credible that wax slugs should be made out of only target loads because they are less powerful. I don't think I'd ever want to shoot a 3 1/2 inch high velocity 12 ga. waxer! But a 2 3/4 bird shoot light target load I'd shoot.
I wonder if the velocity stays the same as the un-waxed target loads? Some target loads are rated @ more than 1200 fps. That would be like a shoulder fired artillery round.
sssshhhh101 I'd say 1200 fps is more that effective here. you want it to have a lot of energy. velocity isn't as critical, as the optimal range is up to 50 yards with these. they can do 100,but you would really need to know your Kentucky windage. it's the energy of the round that makes it deadly. it disperses all of it on impact, so the more it has when it hits, the harder it's gonna punch. but most if not all wax loads I seen are at 1200 fps. think 1800 would be the upper limits. again, we are not going for long range with them so they don't nessisarily need to be hualling ass at Mach 4 lol.
been using these for years. I mean like 15 to 20.it's an old concept. and this is down south in triple did get heat. never once did I get a fouled barrel or have a blown up gun. have to absolutely call bullshit on all these myths. if you had an issue, you clearly fucked up. and if you don't know what your doing with reloading or modifying loads, don't shoot at all. and yes if I had to in a home defence case, I absolutely would use a wax slug in the house. they don't over penetrate. do your research before spewing bullshit
Barrel
This video is full of theoretical problems most of which just don't turn out to be correct. Instead look for advice from folks actually experienced with this and judge for yourself. If you decide to do it make sure you do it right.
......um a lot of guns are owned to kill people(defense of course). I want my ammo to be lethal.
Yeah, what he's talking about is the aftermath of defense. A $1.20 slug will save you thousands of dollars trying to convince a jury that wax slugs are totally cool. A defensive shooting is pretty much one of the worst things that can ever happen to you. Why make it worse by using homemade ammo?
@@regularfather4708 i home load buck shot for defense so your saying my homemade ammo is some how going to make a difference if i have to use it . lmao
@@bobsyouruncle8052 your homemade ammo is going to have the prosecutor drooling. You really think the average person in the jury is gonna care that your hand loads are legit? Why make your legal defense more difficult?
@@regularfather4708 jury lmao called castle law in my house even if my door is left wide open can use lethal force i dont live in shit state like kommifornia ,Illinois , new york. you do you guarantee anyone walk in my house uninvited they will be in a morgue and i will be sharing pics and the story with friends and family that night
So basically clean your gun after Shooting it, like you're supposed to, and only use off the shelf ammo for defense. This is just horse sense and shouldn't deter anyone from using wax slugs. It's fine to let folks know "oh, by the way," why do you have to pretend that this is so dangerous as to be not worth it? I'll save money all day long if all it means is that I gotta clean up after myself.
This is a complete BS gun myth.. The wax and shot are poured into the shot cup, and just like lead shot, never come into contact with the barrel..
Nothing to do with mind set lmfao you modify ammo because you can make 100 wax slugs for the price of 50 factory slugs it's about money not hurting ppl
Easy to sit back and state your opinion. Then again as proven by numerous videos available, your opinion, not valid. Maybe go out and shoot some before commenting
People do dangerous things all the time and video themselves. You are playing the odds. I stand by what i said feel free to disagree. I have a lot of experience in both shooting and cleaning up wax residue.
@@TNGun Nobody asked you to be a parent. I don't think you have any experience doing wax shot.