Your work and the work of all Meshtastic developers is awesome and I really love Meshtastic. That you implement PKC for DMs now is another great step forward and you did it with the right balance of security and usability which is not easy when it comes to encryption. BTW in your video you mention a few times PKI where you meant PKC. In general I also love watching your videos and you should definitely do more ... Keep meshing👍👍
As a new owner of a Meshtastic device this is exciting, and it's only slightly dampened by me not having found any other Meshtastic users near me yet. lol
If its a heltec v3 and you are on latest firmware you wont see any nodes more than a few 100m away in my experiance. Yet if i downgrade to 2.3.2 or earlier i can traceroute nodes 40+km away. I dunno what they did to break it, but my mate is having same issue with his heltecs
@@ZonkedCompanion Fortunately, (or unfortunately?) I have the Lilygo T3S3 v1.2. It's worth looking into a potential firmware issue though, I'll do some googling, I appreciate the info! I was thinking that I should get a second Meshtastic device (maybe a more portable one) to do some range testing, and just to confirm that my first one works. But if I really have no one around me to communicate with, then getting a second one seems like a waste.
@@CoryMT try getting it up higher if you can as you definately require line of sight for long distance. Id say go for it and get another one, have yourself a base and a mobile that's what a lot of people do. Then you can ping yourself messages and tinker at least while you wait for other nodes to pop up. I deployed a remote mode hidden up a tree, gorrilla style, which helps me hop over a ridge about 12km away
@@ZonkedCompanion I currently have it as high as I can without taking it out of the house and away from an outlet. I got an ESP32 based model (instead of nRF52) specifically for keeping it plugged in long term. I'm planning on taking it for a drive in the next few days to see if I can find any other users, depending on the results I may get a larger antenna I can mount on the roof.
Installed firmware, first bug I noted was when you set a fix position it will not save it, even after a wipe and flash the firmware. This is using the Android app on the Heltec V3 board.
Is there a possibility to mark some node as supernode for example on an hill top or a tall building giving them more priority. And also a configuration were i have two site far away, in each site one node with omnidirectional antenna and a directional to the other site and the two node are connected not by the mesh but via a wire (like serial or spi) and maybe the direct link working on another frequency to free and some rf band?
yes. Look at other modes than 'client', maybe repeater or router would be better for various uses you have. Info at Meshtastic web site under documentation.
This is major for remote admin, the PSK setup has been a serious headache since getting physical access to one remote node and connecting it via serial will usually give the attacker access to the PSK and then be able to compromise the entire network using that same admin channel.
Ummmm Yes and NO....... Having access to the PSK and actually finding it is two VERY different things. "Could" one of the 3 letter agencies find it? Yes............But it would take a while. But if you were smart and equipped the node with physical intrusion alarm (like the accelerometer available for wisblock) you would already know that node is compromised, and would exclude it from the network, and re-auth a new PSK........ There by nullifying any PSK stored in the compromised node.... But I also agree that this is a big boon for remote admin. (even with a compromised node you won't have to re-auth a new PSK)
Things are sounding good! Thanks to all the hardworking developers that work on this fantastic product. I've now got, I believe 9 devices for when, excuse me, I mean 'if' something really bad happens. Things are going so amazing well however, I could never imagine that. 😵💫 Thanks for the update, and hopefully Garth figures out his shirt "issues." lol I Mesh, therefore, I am.
It would be nice if you would help beginners put together a system kind of a regular mid range system not too pricey, but give us some options. Show us how it works. There’s a lot of beginners out here, but not one person has actually shown us how it works using your phone, and connecting the parts together
Thanks for a great video. New sub here. Been using meshtastic since before 2022. I’m no programmer here but was able to follow though. Any chance there be videos showing exactly what you’re saying? For noobs like me. More power!
is there separate work for versions of meshtastic on devices with a screen/keyboard like the T-Deck, that will add more features specific to those devices?
Awesome work, I just flashed 2.5 on some of my devices, I didn't realise that this encryption was implemented, I will have to have a play and see how well it works, on a side note, what we also need is an improved app for both Android and IOS, they are both very clunky and quite different to use, scanning QR codes on IOS is completely missing, instead I have to create the network on the IOS app and scan into the Android app, if I was a dev I'd help, maybe you guys could charge a small fee for the IOS app to help fund the development of both apps?
Where does the random come from. I have a number of nodes doing the "random" gps offset for inaccurate position and more often than not they all say they are at exactly the same location down the street. That makes it look like there will be about 5 unique public/private key pairs for all the users on Earth.
@@johnpublic6582 GPS Offsets are not random, because actually randomizing position will give away the precise position over time. Very different problem.
@@JPBennett Good. So then there is a cryptographically secure PRNG source on the various toys running meshtastic. As soon as 2.5 moves out of the pre-PoC phase I'll load it on our nodes.
In my day it was fortran, cobol, pl/1, and some forms of basic. You younger folks have languages and capabilities so far advanced, and demanding, that the options are dizzying. I miss those days, but not the nights, chasing down causes of bad data and the moron who wrote the code that produced it. I don't miss the 2am pager calls, though. Do any of you still carry pagers?
@@bluenetmarketing Being Gen X… all we have is sarcastic smart ass humor. To make sure it’s understood as such we put a 🤣 at the end. I guess you missed that part. 🤣
@@DaCooyon Stop "identifying" and start just being normal. It worked for millions of years before the lies of the left separated us into groups. We aren't born with a group name tattooed on our ass, smart or otherwise.
Your description of encryption methodology is a bit off. ALL "symmetric" algos use a single key for both encryption and decryption. (Rijndael-AES, Twofish, Blowfish, ect. ) Whereas ALL "asymmetric" encryption algos use a "public key" combined with a "private key" to encrypt and decrypt (SSL/TLS - RSA, PGP, ect.) The problem with asymmetric encryption is its REALLY SLOW. And I mean orders of magnitude slower than symmetric, that's even setting aside hardware acceleration that's built into most every CPU today. Now in the context of meshtastic as it is today, our data thruput is low enough that it's not going to make a meaningful difference. However, when/if we are able to start pumping significant amounts of data over our networks, asymmetric encryption will become an absolute showstopper for a low powered IOT device/network. (assuming all auth users are using it) With that being said (as mentioned in the Vid); the use case of using asymmetric purely for network admin is VERY attractive. That adds a VERY appealing level of security from physical Aquisition attacks, and a few side channel attacks as well.........
@@training2523 Well that does address some of the performance issues that popped into my head. Assuming that the re-auth rate is kept reasonable, and it's a reasonably efficient implementation. I haven't gotten a chance to look at the code yet, so I can't comment on either of the last two points. But I'm optimistic.....
It would be nice if you would help beginners put together a system kind of a regular mid range system not too pricey, but give us some options. Show us how it works. There’s a lot of beginners out here, but not one person has actually shown us how it works using your phone, and connecting the parts together
I though meshtastic was dying but then these guys out do themselves with a massive update ...love your work team 👏
thank you and all the developers for your hardwork!
Your work and the work of all Meshtastic developers is awesome and I really love Meshtastic. That you implement PKC for DMs now is another great step forward and you did it with the right balance of security and usability which is not easy when it comes to encryption. BTW in your video you mention a few times PKI where you meant PKC. In general I also love watching your videos and you should definitely do more ... Keep meshing👍👍
Hi Friend!
Thank you JP for picking up #1509 and getting this new PR merged. Appreciate your work!
Very Cool, I cant wait to try this version!
Very cool. Love the implementation of user defaults, as I start deploying in my state this will be clutch! Appreciate you and the devs!
Outstanding! Thanks for the update!
Good information. Thank you for the update.
Deeper dive would be awesome😊
Great video as always 👏. This is exciting news for sure! Thank you to all the devs involved
Very cool, it works very nice. A HS student organized the local mesh.
As a new owner of a Meshtastic device this is exciting, and it's only slightly dampened by me not having found any other Meshtastic users near me yet. lol
If its a heltec v3 and you are on latest firmware you wont see any nodes more than a few 100m away in my experiance. Yet if i downgrade to 2.3.2 or earlier i can traceroute nodes 40+km away. I dunno what they did to break it, but my mate is having same issue with his heltecs
@@ZonkedCompanion Fortunately, (or unfortunately?) I have the Lilygo T3S3 v1.2. It's worth looking into a potential firmware issue though, I'll do some googling, I appreciate the info!
I was thinking that I should get a second Meshtastic device (maybe a more portable one) to do some range testing, and just to confirm that my first one works. But if I really have no one around me to communicate with, then getting a second one seems like a waste.
@@CoryMT try getting it up higher if you can as you definately require line of sight for long distance. Id say go for it and get another one, have yourself a base and a mobile that's what a lot of people do. Then you can ping yourself messages and tinker at least while you wait for other nodes to pop up. I deployed a remote mode hidden up a tree, gorrilla style, which helps me hop over a ridge about 12km away
@@ZonkedCompanion I currently have it as high as I can without taking it out of the house and away from an outlet. I got an ESP32 based model (instead of nRF52) specifically for keeping it plugged in long term.
I'm planning on taking it for a drive in the next few days to see if I can find any other users, depending on the results I may get a larger antenna I can mount on the roof.
Installed firmware, first bug I noted was when you set a fix position it will not save it, even after a wipe and flash the firmware. This is using the Android app on the Heltec V3 board.
Is there a possibility to mark some node as supernode for example on an hill top or a tall building giving them more priority. And also a configuration were i have two site far away, in each site one node with omnidirectional antenna and a directional to the other site and the two node are connected not by the mesh but via a wire (like serial or spi) and maybe the direct link working on another frequency to free and some rf band?
yes. Look at other modes than 'client', maybe repeater or router would be better for various uses you have. Info at Meshtastic web site under documentation.
You and your team are doing some amazing stuff. Thank you!!
Thanks for your work on this and the video.
Amazing work, keep up the progress.
Thankyou so much for your hard work!
Thanks for the info! New subscriber and glad to have found this channel.
This is major for remote admin, the PSK setup has been a serious headache since getting physical access to one remote node and connecting it via serial will usually give the attacker access to the PSK and then be able to compromise the entire network using that same admin channel.
Ummmm Yes and NO....... Having access to the PSK and actually finding it is two VERY different things. "Could" one of the 3 letter agencies find it? Yes............But it would take a while. But if you were smart and equipped the node with physical intrusion alarm (like the accelerometer available for wisblock) you would already know that node is compromised, and would exclude it from the network, and re-auth a new PSK........ There by nullifying any PSK stored in the compromised node.... But I also agree that this is a big boon for remote admin. (even with a compromised node you won't have to re-auth a new PSK)
please tell us more about the new Admin Settings. can´t get it to work
It makes me wonder where mesh radio will be in two or three years time when more serious development has taken place
That is great news!
Things are sounding good! Thanks to all the hardworking developers that work on this fantastic product. I've now got, I believe 9 devices for when, excuse me, I mean 'if' something really bad happens. Things are going so amazing well however, I could never imagine that. 😵💫
Thanks for the update, and hopefully Garth figures out his shirt "issues." lol
I Mesh, therefore, I am.
please do the Meshtastic encryption deep dive 👍
Great explanation.
It would be nice if you would help beginners put together a system kind of a regular mid range system not too pricey, but give us some options. Show us how it works. There’s a lot of beginners out here, but not one person has actually shown us how it works using your phone, and connecting the parts together
RUclips is your friend.
🙏 Super informative 🙏
Thanks for a great video. New sub here. Been using meshtastic since before 2022. I’m no programmer here but was able to follow though. Any chance there be videos showing exactly what you’re saying? For noobs like me. More power!
is there separate work for versions of meshtastic on devices with a screen/keyboard like the T-Deck, that will add more features specific to those devices?
Awesome work, I just flashed 2.5 on some of my devices, I didn't realise that this encryption was implemented, I will have to have a play and see how well it works, on a side note, what we also need is an improved app for both Android and IOS, they are both very clunky and quite different to use, scanning QR codes on IOS is completely missing, instead I have to create the network on the IOS app and scan into the Android app, if I was a dev I'd help, maybe you guys could charge a small fee for the IOS app to help fund the development of both apps?
very nice.
Thanks, nice snappy video, I sub'd. RIP Billy.
I'm going to flash it so fast
Get ready for some healthy injection of outsiders! New here, catching up. This is a great community tech project that's easy to scale.
Who is the CA for the PKI?
No authority hierarchy. Each node generates a keypair, and publishes the public key inside its node announce.
Where does the random come from. I have a number of nodes doing the "random" gps offset for inaccurate position and more often than not they all say they are at exactly the same location down the street. That makes it look like there will be about 5 unique public/private key pairs for all the users on Earth.
@@johnpublic6582 GPS Offsets are not random, because actually randomizing position will give away the precise position over time. Very different problem.
@@JPBennett Good. So then there is a cryptographically secure PRNG source on the various toys running meshtastic. As soon as 2.5 moves out of the pre-PoC phase I'll load it on our nodes.
In my day it was fortran, cobol, pl/1, and some forms of basic. You younger folks have languages and capabilities so far advanced, and demanding, that the options are dizzying. I miss those days, but not the nights, chasing down causes of bad data and the moron who wrote the code that produced it. I don't miss the 2am pager calls, though. Do any of you still carry pagers?
Something tells me they might use meshtastic instead of pagers now 🤭
And we walked up hill both ways in the snow while doing it. 😂
@@DaCooyon That's right, because there's a hill in between where I live and where I worked. You see, there's a good answer to every smart ass comment.
@@bluenetmarketing Being Gen X… all we have is sarcastic smart ass humor. To make sure it’s understood as such we put a 🤣 at the end.
I guess you missed that part. 🤣
@@DaCooyon Stop "identifying" and start just being normal. It worked for millions of years before the lies of the left separated us into groups. We aren't born with a group name tattooed on our ass, smart or otherwise.
huge
We really need ptt voice recording and picture like Beartooth.
Your description of encryption methodology is a bit off. ALL "symmetric" algos use a single key for both encryption and decryption. (Rijndael-AES, Twofish, Blowfish, ect. ) Whereas ALL "asymmetric" encryption algos use a "public key" combined with a "private key" to encrypt and decrypt (SSL/TLS - RSA, PGP, ect.) The problem with asymmetric encryption is its REALLY SLOW. And I mean orders of magnitude slower than symmetric, that's even setting aside hardware acceleration that's built into most every CPU today. Now in the context of meshtastic as it is today, our data thruput is low enough that it's not going to make a meaningful difference. However, when/if we are able to start pumping significant amounts of data over our networks, asymmetric encryption will become an absolute showstopper for a low powered IOT device/network. (assuming all auth users are using it) With that being said (as mentioned in the Vid); the use case of using asymmetric purely for network admin is VERY attractive. That adds a VERY appealing level of security from physical Aquisition attacks, and a few side channel attacks as well.........
The asymmetric PKC is only used for the diffie-hellman key exchange. The actual encryption of the payload is done with AES
@@training2523 Well that does address some of the performance issues that popped into my head. Assuming that the re-auth rate is kept reasonable, and it's a reasonably efficient implementation. I haven't gotten a chance to look at the code yet, so I can't comment on either of the last two points. But I'm optimistic.....
:)
Nah wasted too much time with this to install the android app which won't even let you select region. Unplugged, binned. Get bummed.
Whats with the ad from a meshtastic seller. Sponsoring?
This won’t become mainstream until it can be integrated with pornography somehow
now fix the t-deck
It would be nice if you would help beginners put together a system kind of a regular mid range system not too pricey, but give us some options. Show us how it works. There’s a lot of beginners out here, but not one person has actually shown us how it works using your phone, and connecting the parts together