The Northern Irish troubles | British Army | Northern Ireland | This Week| 1972
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- Опубликовано: 30 сен 2020
- This is a shortened version of the original programme
The British Army prepares to face its fourth Christmas in Northern Ireland. Since the troops were sent in 1969 the army has suffered more casualties than in any other operation since the second world war. Peter Taylor talks to soldiers on the ground about their job and what they have to do - it is the first time since direct rule that any television team has been given unrestricted access to the Army.
First shown: 21/12/1972
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In 1985, we had a kid from Northern Ireland join my school on a military base in Canada. I still remember him telling our class about life as a kid in Northern Ireland. He made us appreciate how peaceful and safe our childhood was in Canada.
Must not have lived in Quebec I suppose :P
Canada isnt looking good with the sick government it has the NWO is making an example of it people are getting passports and getting out look what they did too the truckers sick .
@@ZackFrisbee that time was a dangerous time in ni......pure sectarian cesspit of a place
Coming from N. Ireland and raised in the heart of the troubles I got involved at a young age and believed with my heart in it but as I grew I saw so much that disgusted and shocked me and I realised that its all a fucking joke It just gangsters and rats believe me that's all as how can both sides state they hate each other but I saw 2 head men from my area Shankill rd (loyalists) sitting drinking and laughing with promenent Republicans in a pub in the city centre and loyalists beating prodestant civilians for nothing more than trying to make money selling drugs just because they want that guys money for themselves and how the stand by sex offenders and peadofiles within their ranks No it's a fucking disgrace
What was his surname? Had family move out there. Thanks for the comment people don't realise, thankfully we can experience somewhat peace these days
Yeah those were the days. Door getting kicked in at 4 in the morning. Alsatians growling at the end of your bed with their handlers shouting, “up up all into one room”. House being torn apart even stairs torn up. Having guns pointed in your face, searches as you entered town.
Two very profound moments I will never forget. Going to school one morning and a bomb exploded, I felt the shock wave through my body. A soldier was killed in the blast, yet my main concern was getting to my sports day. The other moment was brief but it’s stuck with me. On one of the occasions of having our home raided a red haired soldier was moving us from one room to the other and telling us not to be frightened. I remember my mums tears and his gun guarding us. A few weeks later I was walking to school when a street patrol was passing, I looked up and there passing me was the same red haired soldier. We locked eyes and in that moment there was many feelings. Although I was a child, remembering back I can still see his expression. He looked sad and sorrowful about what I went through. I felt confused.
I often think of him and whether he’s alive. To me he was a grown man, but really he wasn’t much older than 19-20 a kid really.
Tough and scary times for all, but my goodness was there a sense of community back then. A different world.
@Paul Bishop I’m well thank you Paul. I hope you are also.
I’d really like to hear about your time as a soldier. I’m left wondering… what if…
@Paul Bishop Thanks Paul. It’s interesting to hear it from your point of view. Your story sounds so similar to mine. Yes you could have been him!
Can I ask was the army a career choice or a pay check for you? I hope that doesn’t sound rude.
You were only 18 it’s incomprehensible to me now at 48 how a boy, because you were a boy of 18 made the choice to join an army knowing you could be posted here. I wonder how your family felt.
Did you get a choice of where you went when you were deployed?
I feel like I’ve a million and one questions for you.
@Paul Bishop Judge you, absolutely not! Sounds as though you left the frying pan and leapt into the fire. Sounds a cruel environment all round. Not the character building environment they made out then, or maybe it was in its own way. Unfortunately it’s through our own pain do we gain a sense of self awareness not only about ourselves, but how to treat others how we’d truly like to be treated.
Not unlike my own childhood to be honest minus the army part.
I appreciate you sharing snippets of your experiences. It’s gives some insight from the other side.
@Paul Bishop I’m pleased you were able to make a change for others. Can you recall entering and leaving the barracks? What was it like for you? If we as kids were walking past and those gates began to open we’d run like mad away. We were always told to do that. I know now why. Shocking now when you think about it. A sign of the times I suppose. In our own ways we both lived it, me for longer but then traumas subjective ey! How long did you serve here?
@Paul Bishop It’s good to hear you never took it personally, you’re right it had more to do with the uniform and what it stood for.
Omg you describing bringing sweets with you during your patrols brought back a flood of memories for me. I recall soldiers actually doing this in the estates with the kids. I suppose befriending them made the kids less hostile.
Quite often you’d see a clatter of kids clambering to see their gun. It’s really what you see on the news, ie kids in Afghanistan with troops.
Just wondering whether you see the war in Afghanistan as a game? There always seems to be a war somewhere or talk of a war. Sad really. It’s as though governments prefer the people in a perpetual state of fear and uncertainty.
Can I ask about PTSD, did it affect you serving here?
Amazing footage. From the whine of the armoured vehicles, to the kids wandering around in a warzone...
Its not a warzone its their home
@@JackedBiker It was both.
@woodzy it was a war. Even Margaret Thatcher called it that, but later said it was a slip of the tongue.
@@Denis-tg6jw war is two armys fighting , imagine germany invaded england took its land and gave it to german nationals then killed the people that lived there for bieng different ... well you get the picture
I was born this year. When you've always had the army there, they're part of the furniture. We took no heed as we were too busy being kids.
I grew up with these troubles. Had Catholic friends, live in a loyalist area. I remember some crazy times that were surreal. Left NI around 97 when troubles were almost over, just when the bombing was crazy for a bit, I lived up the road from the forensic lab the IRA blew up. When I was abroad I realised I was affected by being raised in NI, I used to think thunder was bombs! It took a while to remove certain preconceptions and live like a normal guy.
I hate conflict and bigotry. It's pointless and does nothing.
You've got PTSD
@@johnmurphy9688 most of NI probably have without realising it. So many suffer today because of it and yet in typical NI fashion they soldier on because it really was just 'normal' life during those times.
@@johnmurphy9688 Associating a noise with another that you're more used to isn't PTSD.
@Anglus Patria No, but I know a bit about PTSD and living in NI lad.
@@PaddyInf ok lad!
“He dies doing his job as a British soldier perusing the policy of the government he serves” one of the most British things you can say.
Underrated comment
@@---675 sangfroid mate, sangfroid…
It's his job, it's what to be expectedlys
He dies for english nobility, like a serv
Imagine afterwards a superior butted in and said: “Alright, you’re enlisted on the front lines. Move it soldier!”
Lol
6:20 That is perhaps the most reasonable explanation a Soldier could say during a Rebellion like The Troubles. You support neither side, you're just doing your job.
Colonizers always are just "doing their job". Too bad that job involves controlling and taking stuff that isn't theirs. No way to distance yourself from that.
Peter Taylor is a superb journalist and has written some excellent books on the troubles. His questions to the general at the end showed his professionalism. There are many so called journalists today that could learn something from him as they crave to be the centre of attention and give their opinions as if the public cares.
There is on RUclips his doc on the War from Rhodesia. He's a cut above the rest.
@Celtic Bhoy no he didn't, your confusing him with another British journalist Roy Greensdale which created a lot of controversy
@Celtic Bhoy yes, Taylor's work is good but I always got the feeling that his sympathies were with the provies.
@@jimmyjohnson7027 I thought so too but I think he's more of the "we need to hold ourselves to the higher standard than the provos".
Do you know who the general is?
Thames made some incredibly high-quality documentaries. UK residents in the 1970s were blessed.
As long as you weren't being blown up or shot of course.
Especially the programs where the beleaguered Irish in ireland like Gerry Adams etc 'spoke' through a discombobulated English voice over. Cowardly English yellow journalism at its finest.
@@CollieJenn Just so you know it was nothing to do with the journalists, it was a government ban on the broadcasting of the voices of certain republican AND loyalist associations. And not just by the British government, the Republic of Ireland government had a similar ban.
@@this_is_a_tiny_town And thanks to Britain's Brexit calamity its looking like 'hated' irish republicans are about to have the last laugh.😅
@@CollieJenn Not our fault no one can understand you
It's strange to think this was 50 years ago, the thing that strikes me is, as you are watching these soldiers cover each other and sweep up the road and check every alley, this was the place where the Army learned (the hard way) how to conduct urban warfare, when they went into Iraq and Afghanistan, that experience was invaluable.
All you could hope was a few more British gone each day
But they still got sent home in body bags 🤣
500,000 dead Arabs . Western losses wasnt even 5000 . You suck at maths muppet
My sergeant major in the US army was retired British SAS SGM eyer. And what he learned in Northern Ireland he taught us before Iraq and I swear to this day he was the reason so many of us came back.
@@Themmy1 : Well, of course, we took some casualties we weren't out there playing "Catchy fukn Kisses" but 1 things for damn sure. We killed WAY more of them, that's a categorical fact.
As a Brit I was working in Dublin when the company asked me to go to Belfast. The people in Dublin didn't want me to go however I was to be met at the station and taken to a hotel. Unluckily the new Belfast railway station opened that day and the driver went to the old station! The train was stoned on the way to the station, I moved into the center isle as the windows were smashed! I waited for the driver for more than 1 hour then asked for directions to the hotel on Upper Newtownards road. I decided to walk! I walked with my case past the British troops in the doorways along 'Madrid Street'. I eventually got to the hotel and they were simply 'amazed' at what I had done! I did make my appointment and finished the small instrument repair job I needed to do and returned to Dublin. All people I met both South and North of the border were 'great'! So sad to see all that nasty stuff on the streets! Hopefully they will stop all the parades and flag waving ? Forget the troubles and 'move on'!
The Bloody Sunday? How to forget it!! Only a bigot could do it
@@Sereno44 And Bloody Friday as well 30 bombs by the IRA in an hour against civilian targets.
@@peaceformula5830 maybe had your "super Intel led army and corrupt police force" acted on the warnings that day, it wouldn't have happened, and BTW these all where the repercussions of bloody Sunday, the ballymurphy massacre, springhill etc you even murdered Catholic priests in Broad daylight.
@@TheNinyo77 Two wrongs don't make a right. 700 years them people have been living there. You can't just blow them out of there. It didn't work.
@@peaceformula5830 no one tried to blow them out, in spite of how they treated the minority community since partition, 700yrs wtf are you smoking, they only came during the plantation, and then a lot moved onto America, Canada to excel in their bigotry there aswel, clearly you haven't understood any of the history here, or you'd see your reply bears little or no significance.
The most amazing part of this video is the lack of vehicles parked on the street compared to today
Wasn't much point in owning a vehicle as it will be in flames within a week!
@@user-lf3wr8rh7r or stolen.
@@grimreaper649 Unless it was the paramilitaries that requisitioning your car for official "business". car theft by joyriders was punished severely by them so wasn't nowhere near uk levels at the height of the joyriders era!
Well that and a giant armored saracen driving down the street.
Twat
As someone who was brought up in Belfast during the 60s and 70s life was very disturbing. I remembered walking down the street to go to my local newsagent and out of nowhere a local pub was blown up behind me killing 9 people. Just like that.
Excellent question by the interviewer at the end
And a rather good answer from the general. He was sincere.
@@Dustshoe he was stuck, so just gave an objective, factual answer as he was probably trained to do.
I agree with Dustshoe tbf. Trained, sure, but I really can't imagine getting a sincere response like that today!
@@Dustshoe Sounds like the same that same "Stock' answer they would just give regarding wherever those British Soldiers are tasked to Serve... Basrah or Belfast ... same outcome for a many a Squaddie...
that is peter taylor who was a good reporter in n ireland experienced .respected by both sides
I had a coworker from Belfast, NI. He was living in Oklahoma City, Oklahoma in the late 1990s. He and his wife were sitting on their back porch, and he heard this loud noise. Being from where he was from, he stated.."that was a bomb!". He lived in Edmond, Oklahoma a suburb of Oklahoma City, about 20 miles from the downtown area. He and his wife went inside and put their TV on. Sure enough, Terry Mcvey had just committed the Oklahoma City bombing.
OMG! what a coincidence.
@@eileenboles8645 thats not a coincidence thats knowledge
@@garethjones6082 Coincidence is the wrong word there but knowledge comes from experience also.
Close, the FBI committed it.
That is the one which was prepared by feds, right?
So refreshing to hear people answering real questions and people giving real answers.
Belfast and indeed Northern Ireland are not like this anymore we have peace and a beautiful country please come visit us and don't filter your image of us through a 1970s filter
I completely agree. I lived in Belfast for 16 years during the 1990s and 2000s. All around Lisburn Road/Queen's University/Shaftesbury Square you'd hardly ever see soldiers. The whole Belfast docks area completely renovated. I'm gone from the place these past 12 years but the last time I saw soldiers on Ormeau Road was way back in 1997. Sure if you want to go up lower Shankill or lower Falls looking for trouble you'd find it, but that is no different to areas in Dublin, Glasgow, London. There are huge swathes of Paris where if whitey enters, he is French toast in seconds.
@Douglas Taggart Douglas, you go to Derry where the Protestants still cling on to that siege mentality. They actually celebrate their siege mentality up there.. Closed minded backward bastards. They’re stuck in the 1690’s.. Move on and get on with people.. I’m a nationalist from west Belfast and we welcome everyone with open arms.. Just don’t come banging drums and blowing flutes, leave the sectarianism at home and we’ll have a good laugh together. 👍
I can't wait to get across with my family to see the beauty of the North. Unfortunately it's just so damn expensive to get across on ferry or plane in contrast to Dublin which is really cheap. Definitely will be their soon though.
@@MartinT5600 Come across to Dublin and drive up, it’s about hour and half drive. 👍
@@JohnMcMahon. That's probably how I'll do it. More fun as well.👍
I'm Spanish, a lot of good stuff I saw as a child in the 80's came with that Thames logo, and the jingle.. part of my childhood❤
We were German schoolboys visiting Ireland and thus also Belfast in 2014. I remeber seeing armoured vehicles in Belfast the first time in my life. The atmosphere was a bit grim. The city center tho was a nice place to be with the huge town hall. Belfast was a very exciting place after all. Ireland was great, still think of it a lot.
Ich bin mit einer Gruppe aus meiner Uni in Dublin im Jahr 1993 mit dem Bus nach Belfast gefahren. Wir wollten im Kathlolischen Bezirk Falls Rd übernachten aber irgendwas ist schief gegangen und wir auf einaml standen neben einer Tankstelle ohne Obdach. Ein Auto hielt an der Tankstelle an, der Fehrer blieb im Auto sitzen und der Beifahrer ist ausgestigen und in den Laden gegangen. Ich errinere mich an seinen Gesicht. Es war hart, knall hart, ohne irgendwelche Emotion. Der Fahrer sah auch so aus. Hier ging alles um leben und tot. So war Belfast damals. Ich hoffe nur fuer die Zukunft.
strange destination for schoolboys. why not visit Paris, or any resort along the Mediterranean?
@@pizzafrenzyman it was technically a field trip as part of a seminar about ireland.
Bolano fan, eh?
@@pizzafrenzyman So they can learn how to sunbathe mayb??
The more you read into the history of Northern Ireland the more you start to realise just how complicated and not just as black and white as we are thought in British schools.
For example no catholic or even anyone with an “Irish” sounding name could gain employment in Belfast as late as the 1930s.
Now imagine being told in your own country that you cannot work in a job because your name sounds like you’re a catholic or a native person to that country! Ask yourself, How would the English have liked that? If the shoe was on the other foot?
Excellent point.
1930’s? It was still happening in the 80’s
We’re taught nothing in England. So many episodes of the troubles post-68 went completely unreported in GB.
A state that never should have been based on a Protestant state ,it was no good for Ulster ,no good for Britian ,no good for Ireland , it is my hope that our young will correct the mistakes of the past.good luck for the future
If it makes you feel better, the same may well be happening in England nowadays
crazy being an Irish person born in 2005 who grew up in a safe country not really knowing about the troubles till aged 10 and then seeing this.
How is that possible you didn’t know about the troubles until 2015 😂😂😂😂 do your eyes not work do you not look at the murals? Also if your from here how did you not hear stories? Sorry but I dont believe your from here unless your from the frigging middle of no where out in the country
@@natashaferran didn't know northern ireland existed for a long time lol
It's not like I'd ever have to go there since dublin is closer and that has everything.
I mean maybe I new about it earlier but I didn't understand the history or really give a shit about what happened in a country I've never been in.
@@NiallMcEvoy05 lol well awkward for me. I am sorry. I either read your comment wrong or got it mixed up with another comment. I thought I was having an opinion on someone who grew up here yet hadn’t known of the troubles.
@@natashaferran absolutely no problem have a nice day
@@NiallMcEvoy05 even then, its not until secondary school where i even heard the words protestant or catholic. I hate it here, i live in Northern Ireland, derry/londonderry and i want nothing more than to leave. Were gunna be in this bitter tit for tat bullshit for decades to come. Sure, its gotten better but it still sucks
i was an 80s kid. weird how normal it felt for me as a child to see soilders on every corner and road blocks, it was fun and games to us at that age. But thank god im not rareing my kids in them times
@Rory Woods Don’t know where you were fortunate enough to grow up pal but for me and mine the presence of these erstwhile jail birds represented only, terror and attrition.
a neo pagan? demn turn nation heheze
Same, I grew up surrounded by it and like the soldier in this video said, it was just part of the local scenery. I remember some soldiers would sometimes let me look through their gun sight. Thinking now, it was definitely a way more surreal experience for the soldiers than it was for me.
The bombs at night were definitely more scary than the militarised streets during the day.
Saying that, I don't think any of it had any negative impact on my psyche now as an adult.
I married that Christmas 1972. In Northern Ireland. Still here. Served here to. The best thing the army did for me I met my wife love her then and love her more now x and of course love northern ireland to
Very good video this no matter which side you take.
My brother was there in 71 & 72. I remember me ma watching the news constantly. So when I did my tour in 90/91 i didnt tell her i was there.
Proud of you both
@@union310 My mother went to her grave, not knowing I’d ever served in NI. And my brother passed a few years ago. Thank you Union310
@@anthonywalsh7613 Sorry to hear of your loss, you did your mother right by sparing her the worry.
My brother spent spent seven years in total there, so not sure how many bars that would would add up to on his NI medal if he was ever recorded as being there.
I'm sorry you had to serve there!! People were absolutely disgusting to me and my sister when we went there in 2003!! The British Army should have paved the whole place over and turned it into a giant parking lot! Would have done the world a favor!!
@@miel1074 omg I’m so sorry you had to experience that. I admit I met some fine folk but it was a very dangerous place bk when I was there
I was a Coldstream Guardsman in 1976 and was stationed in Belfast , I can now tell you that we never got any thanks from our government for serving and putting our lives on the line. I was injured there and I feel it was all in vain. Now I suffer from PTSD I am now 67.
I'm sorry Mate I hope you find peace.
@@swordsmen8856 Thank you I guess shall. ?
@@kevinmason5140 Good Luck too you
Why should anyone thank you for harassing innocent people and murdering people because they want to be and out from under the crown. You go into someone's country and take away there freedom and can't figure out why they shoot at you. You should have stayed in england.
Good, serves you right
That’s in the grounds of St Teresa’s Roman Catholic Church on Glen Red Belfast @3:35, the exact spot is now a Youth centre next to the Church. They run out here onto the Glen Rd @3:45..
The Roundabout bottom of Monagh by pass @3:53..
Gransha Park @4:57..
Gransha Drive where it meets Gransha Gardens @5:06..
Amen USA American N.Y.
I was born in Dublin in 77, lived in the north in Derry city for 3 years in 1998. Even then it was tense.
1:32
Both of the kids that were overtaken here by the soldiers ..will still have in mind this single second ..
That was just normality to the kids. You would walk out your front door to go to school and there’d be a soldier knelt down taking cover behind your garden gate.. You’d just walk on past him and toddle off down the street. The troubles were just a constant in the background of everyday life.
yep IRA killed KIDS
Why would they remember that?
This video was so amazing, Peter Taylor is a great journalist and has written some books on the troubles 👌
Just stop the fucken frighten & just get along with each other,! Cause we all bleed the same & we are all brothers and sisters,,! Born 23rd May 1968 from northern Ireland UK 🤝🇬🇧
fucken' leprechaun 🍀
That diesel engine in the Saracen APC at the start sounds absolutely amazing especially with the slight whine from the transmission. My father served in the Royal Engineers and drove/repaired these.
8 cyl petrol.
@@aaa111912 Oh you are right my bad. Thanks for the correction. 👍
What a tragic time. Can see the issues from both sides, not easy to resolve. Events that go back hundreds of years is never an easy fix.
toured 73 75 77 with the REs infantry role Belfast ,well put together video.
May yea burn in hell for your crimes against the irish people
73-75 as a sapper out of Girdwood.
Sappers dont burn, we explode!
Thank you for your service, we appreciate your courage and bravery. CHEERS
Ha, my tours with 20 Sqn and later (Dirty Thirty) 30 Sqn, alternated with yours. I did 72, 74, 76 and 78. Two tours as R.E. and two in the infantry role. Search Team for all four. I'll never forget those times.
When the guy said I'm just here to do a job thats all, when asked if he knew that the army was not wanted there, makes total sense, I feel bad for soldiers like him, he doesn't necessarily want to be there,but he was ordered to be in Ireland.
A war without end like any war the aftermath still lingers on there on all sides
I grew up near Red Rocks Amphitheatre in the US where U2 filmed their Sunday Bloody Sunday video in the early 80's. Kind of a weird way to learn about The Troubles, but there you go.
A lot of my school friends joined the British army and were deployed to northern Ireland . They didnt know what had hit them they were only young lads who joined up as the were very little job oppurtunities and got a bit more than they could chew off .
They must have done okay. The Ulster Provos couldn't beat the British Army in 38yrs.
@@cq1903 Not yet!
@@cq1903 You sound like Hans Christian Anderson or a Catholic priest.
Please upload more of this, you must have an awful lot of video on the troubles
When talking about modern Ireland, one thing that needs to be mentioned was how a Protestant Irish Parliament successfully gained independence for Ireland between 1782 and 1800, during which time Catholics got most of their rights back, with most Irish people of different faiths uniting under the ideologies of either constitutionalism or Republicanism, with both in favour of varying degrees of Irish sovereignty/autonomy and increased personal rights.
This independence ended when a failed Republican Revolution in 1798 led British prime minister William Pitt to intimidate and bribe the Irish Parliament into merging the Kingdom Ireland into the UK after an initial Union vote failed. Ireland’s Parliament was forced to merge with The British one (though the courts and civil service of Ireland remained separate, but nominally subject to Westminster from now on).
People on both sides seem to have completely forgotten this chapter in Irish history, because Protestants and Catholics fighting together for an independent Irish Kingdom doesn’t fit anyone’s narrative, and yet it had a major impact on the island. Unionism, Republicanism and Constitutionalism all originate from the original Irish volunteers that used the opportunity of the American Revolution distracting Britain to revolt in 1782. This heralded the independence and has shaped all aspects of Irish politics, ever since
The wail of the Alvis Saracen APC's was probably the most distinctive sound you could hear on the streets of Northern Ireland during The Troubles.
When you were waiting to be picked up in the early hours of the morning you could hear the Saracen coming and it was miles away
Bloody cold in the winter and not a comfy drive
There are reasons on why this conflict invokes nostalgia, and it's because of a lot of the old stuff used. Old FN FAL rifles, old APC's, old Land Rover utility jeeps, down to even old equipment.
Nice wood furniture SLRs there...
A bit long for urban warfare but you know whatever shoot is going down!
@@user-lf3wr8rh7r Ideal for shooting unarmed disgruntled natives with. As in the Monty Putin sketch
@Anglus Patria You shouldn’t be allowed smart phones In borstal.
I could pick one up now 30 years down the line and still do the drills on it...👍
@@jamesbussey2911 Funny, cos I was in thirty years ago, and we all had SA80's
in 1964 John Hume wrote an open letter to the Irish Times detailing a three strand strategy for a peace agreement in the north of Ireland. In 1998, this strategy was the basis of the Good Friday Agreement. What does this tell you about the intervening 34 years?
Jeremy Corbyn reviled for what he did for the peace process, got the provo's to the table and I believe he was the single most pivotal character in getting both sides to sit at the peace table. Trouble with Corbyn is he was that rare beast who never took a dodgy fiver, believed in diplomacy above all else and the worst they could throw at him was his working to get Gerry Adams to accept overtures from London.
Why would John Hume be writing a "Peace Agreement" in 1964, four to five years before the troubles even began? And how could he have possibly foreseen what the situation would be there in 1998? You're talking nonsense.
@@dodgydruid That is the biggest pile of horse-shit I;'e ever heard, total crap. All that terrorist-supporting, anti-British, borderline-treasonous little commie weasel ever did was to give encouragement to the IRA to keep murdering people. If you believe all that crap you've written then you're a deluded fool.
@@dodgydruid Jermey corbyn, are you joking? Why the hell would the IRA etc care what a 60's student protester had to say? He never even made any attempt to talk to the loyalists. The only thing Corbyn believed in was giving succour to the enemies of the UK , in this instance the various nationalist terror groups and mostly the PIRA. In Corbyns mind he was a real important person, but nowhere have i heard him mentioned in regards to the peace negotiations, the many books I've read, the many tv programmes including the recent BBC2 series in the secret history of the troubles, Corbyn isn't mentioned in the least. He was an irrelevance, indeed, I doubt he has the mental capacity to even understand the complexities of the troubles.
This is a complete lie. In 1964 John Hume, then a 27 year old history teacher wrote a few articles that could be summed up as "sectarianism is bad and discrimination is bad"
Not exactly a unique ground breaking position to take. None of the paramilitaries involved in the troubles even existed at the time. The British army wouldn't be deployed to NI for years yet. Internment wasn't even a notion yet. The problems at that time had to do with segregation between unionists and nationalists and state and police discrimination and bias against Catholics.
His articles were not "the basis for the good friday agreement" and it would the GFA would be a piss poor document that would not adress any of the systemic issues in NI if they were.
Some one being from the northern Ireland born in 2002 somthing that will all ways stick with me is how vivide the stories my dad tells about the troubles are and his humour towards it.
Look how slim everyone was...
jumpbullets its basic training
@ArtByCoylo Ya right there mate. Growing up we rarely had any money for a takeaway and if you did it would be pie and chips or fish and chips if you were lucky.
@@stephensmith4480 and you rarely had a takeaway to yourself. It had to be shared with a couple of other folk
@@carolinemcmullan5893 That`s right Caroline and a load of Bread and Butter to make up for it 😊.
7:44 and out should remind us of 20 years of 'War on Terror'. Both the journalist and the officer give excellent answers and questions.
I lived in that area, finished up with PTSD, three years ago an English pyschiatrist was trying to help me, he couldn't believe what I was telling him about that life, he had to phone my doctor in Belfast to verify it, and I don't know how those soldiers managed to keep control when the world went crazy, they saved my life so many times
Im from Andersonstown. From that time . They raided our house so I threw stones . They tried to kill me , so I threw stones. I too have PTSD. It’s not going away, and as I get older it gets worse.
Wow, such candid answers from an official, that’s hard to imagine nowadays
before the internet
must have been super weird to just be running around a standard council estate with the potential to be in a firefight at any moment.
I can't imagine it
Glad my family caught the boat . This stuff has been tamped down , but it's never going away . These people deserve each other .
My mother lived through this it’s scary
little did they know it was going to get worse, the locals would stop liking them just as much.
1972 was the worse year, it very gradually declined from then
Loved the general's interview, posh Sandhurst accent, highly political answers, he was proof that generals are the same the world over
I served in N Ireland in 1988 as a L/Cpl, and I agree with what the General said. By the time I got there, after having grown up with hearing about the Troubles on the news, and later from squaddies who had been there, the British Army and the other security forces pretty much had their act together, making us the best in the world at doing that job.
@@jamesbussey2911 what at??? Shooting innocent catholics??? Because that's all you done, persecuted those you where sent to "protect", you lot are gone from our shore, and you won't ever return!!!! "best in the world" lol, oul boys on Honda 90s with sandles on them beat you outa Afghanistan ffs, that's what proper armoury against you resulted in, our crowd took a lot longer, but given their "aid" was limited, they still got your lot out, and took your border with ye.
@@TheNinyo77 Lest we forget, the British Army deployed to N Ireland to protect the Catholic community from the Protestants. The wall that was erected in Belfast by the Royal Engineers still stands, so if our mission was to stop sectarian violence, then we failed there: that's your problem, and you're welcome to it, if that's how you want to live your lives over there. However, the Irish terrorist bombing and murder campaign against British servicemen and civilians in the UK and elsewhere has ceased, so that part was a success. Note that I wrote "by the time I got there." We were the best army for counter-insurgency in the 1980s, thanks to the hard work done earlier: in the 1970s N Ireland was a pretty rough place, and it takes several years for an army in that role to get its act together. Then it has to stay in the country for many years. The Malayan Emergency took four years to get over the worst of it, and another eight to finish the job. We got out of Iraq far too soon: we'd won the area I was deployed in when I was there. In fact, those of us who had been in NI treated it the same way. It was different in the US forces' Area of Operations, of course, but that's another story. Speaking of which, would you rather the Americans had deployed to Ireland to do the job there? Or the Israelis? Or the Soviet Red Army? Or the South African Defence Forces? Probably only the French could have done an equivalent job: they would have sent regular troops and the Foreign Legion. Someone had to go there to keep the peace: we couldn't let part of the United Kingdom descend into tribal savagery. Unlike Afghanistan, where the British Army lost the war because they didn't stick to the first Principle of War: 'Selection and Maintenance of the Aim.' ...or any of the other nine principles for that matter. The Taliban did, for the two decades it took them to win, but they are now failing because they can't govern the country. Afghanistan is likely to become yet another narco-state, 'coz that's where the greatest potential money making markets lie: in your country and mine, where large parts of our populations shell out huge amounts of dosh in order to shovel immense amounts of drugs into their bodies. 🙄
@@jamesbussey2911 you deployed to the North of Ireland because your govt agents here attacked and failed to destroy Catholic areas, the ruc, b men and the rest failed, so you lot where brought in to bolster up your govts failed policies here!!! No matter what they told you, when you inflicted pain and murder on our people!!! Did you not expect those same people would hit back???, you are gone from everywhere you invaded, your barbaric treatment of Irish nationalists brought on attacks, remember, YOU came to our country, you interned and jailed our folk, not the other way around.
@@TheNinyo77 What on earth are you on about, mate? I just went on patrol in South Armagh, the Castlederg salient, and Strabane. I didn't hurt or kill anyone, and it was the best time I had in the army. The security forces knew who all the terrorist 'players' were, but we had to catch them in the act of committing a crime or offence in order to arrest them, or shoot them dead if necessary. If we were as oppressive as you think we were, they would all have been arrested within a month, and that might have gone some way towards reducing their violent criminal activities directly mostly at fellow Irish people. However, we had to stay within the rule of law, and the RUC had primacy of law enforcement over the British Army. I was a professional soldier, and professional soldiers do any job they get tasked to do without getting emotionally or personally involved in the countries we serve in.
How normal this was for so many of us growing up. Having soldiers asking you questions while saying they will allow you to look down the scope of there rifle. The helicopters flying low over estates where you can feel the wind from the propeller and armored car just casually driving around and that was the 90s for me. I can only imagine the 70s and 80s.
thats nothing, the streets round here were bombed by German warplanes with no warning given.
@@rabsmiff In the 40's for about 4 months. Stop trying to disregard other people's experiences
@@end8316 Irish trouble 1969-onwards, death toll around 3 000: WW2 death toll, at least 60 million, in a fraction of the time compared to the 30 years or so of the most recent Troubles. more than half the losses of WW2 were for innocent civilians. Weapons used in WW2: tanks, planes, warships, nuclear bombs and gas chambers. NONE of these applied to the Irish Troubles, which were more characterized by plastic or rubber bullets, there is no comparison between the two different conflicts.
Yes ,simultaneously picking your brain while using you as a human shield.
@@rabsmiff Belfast Blitz in Apr 41 and was more poorly defended in terms of anti aircraft artillery than Liverpool, London , Glasgow and Manchester in spite of the fact it was a high value target to the Luftwaffe.
What rifle are they using? That long rifle looks hard to use aiming around tight corners etc
L1A1 SLR
SLR. It was a very accurate and powerful rifle but totally unfit for urban war.
In this modern world of bull-pup configured rifles, you are right with that observation, and indeed, the British Forces could have been equipped with the 1950s 0.280in EM2 rifle, but that's another story. However...in the British Army of the 1970s and 80s, we were that used to handling and firing the L1A1 Self-loading Rifle, it really was no problem for us in any theatre of operations. A lot of Cold War tactical training was done in urban training areas, so adapting those skills and drills for N Ireland wasn't much of a stretch. It was a good all-round rifle. Not many old Brit squaddies have a bad word to say about it...and I could pass a training test on it 30-odd years on. That scene where the Jocks load and make ready brought it all back 😁👍🇬🇧.
@@jamesbussey2911the EM1 Aand EM2 rifles were the forerunner of the SA80. EM stood for Enfield Model if I remember correctly?
EM stands for 'Experimental Model.' The early and later prototypes of the SA80 took as much from the AR18 as the EM rifles. The main concepts of the Bull-pup configuration, small calibre and optical sights were more what the two weapons systems have in common. The gas and bolt systems were developed from the Stoner design for the AR-series of rifles.
The UK armed forces have used the AR15/M16 rifles longer than the US armed forces, first fielding them during the Borneo Confrontation of 1962-66, alongside the L1A1 SLR and L7 GPMG.
In 1965, an RAF Regiment liaison team advised the USAF Security Police to adopt the AR15 in order to have a better weapon for airfield defence in South Vietnam, than the overpowered M14 rifle. They also advised the SPs to adopt light armoured vehicles for mobile fire support. The US Army saw the new rifle and also adopted it as the M16 for use in jungle warfare... and the rest is history.
The British used the M16 in the Falklands War and Northern Ireland, in the latter operation with the M203 grenade launcher (or the M79 was carried in addition to a rifle if M16/203s weren't available).
@@user-he5so4gz4r
Beautiful country and beautiful people, so sad that so many people suffered and died in the name of power, on all sides. GLAD IT'S HOPEFULLY ALL OVER.
NO. NO. NO. NO... IN THE NAME OF FUCKING RELIGION. SORRY. BUT IT'S OBVIOUS.
It’s not over yet.
It's not over, hatred lives on, unfortunately. Hatred is a toxic entity, passed from one generation to the next
In the name of British occupation/ colonialism! Call a spade a spade!
@@clintireland389 : That's it, blame it all on the British, as per...
It's not our fault you can't play well together, why? Because 1 person believes in the "Virgin Mary" & the other 1 doesn't. Come on mate, the sooner you start taking ownership, of your own fukups, the sooner we can all live in peace. Good luck to ya, I really mean that.
And the ghost of Robert Nairac still haunts Ravensdale forest. 1977 seems so long away now
I just watched this for the first time. At 1:56-57 I thought that soldier resembled him, then saw your comment.
I think that's a puzzle which will never be solved.
@@JammyDodger45 The Book called Nairac is fascinating.
@@stephensmith4480 - thanks, I'll look it up.
@@JammyDodger45 👍
These reports were very well made. The reporters were none biased,.
You think? The just repeated what they were told by the Army. The British Army were not referee's. They were active in the conflict.
What was the armoured vehicle in first clip?
People.used to call them sixers as they have six wheels idk the real ne for them mate
Vincit Veritas It’s called a Saracen
Seeing these troops patrol the Belfast streets wih the L1A1 rifle I'm reminded of how long, heavy and unwieldy it was, making it far from ideal for FIBUA.
The L85A1 replacement introduced in the mid 1980s was plagued with problems which were eventually corrected a decade later, in the L85A2, but the decision to opt for bull-pup design seems justified considering how much fighting was occurring in urban areas at the time.
However, the SLR was designed for longer range engagements, which is why it proved itself in the Falklands War. It was also relatively easy to maintain "in the field", despite harsh weather conditions, which also made it well suited to both Gulf wars and deployments in Afghanistan, but by then, it had already been replaced by the SA80.
If there are any service personnel who used both operationally and would like to comment on their comparative pros and cons, please free to do so.
The L1A1 was the best battle Rifle the British Army ever had. I served 9 years in the British Infantry and the SA80 was just junk.
No British squaddie ever complained about the length or weight of the L1A1 Self-loading rifle, or any other aspect of it. A lot of us joined the British Army at age 16 or 17, so we were used to handling and firing it from our first weeks in the army. Indeed, those of us who were in Cadet organisations would have fired it on rifle ranges at the age of 14 or 15, so a lot of us 'grew up' with that rifle, and the 0.303in No 4 Mk 1 Lee-Enfield rifle as well.
The SLR had many minor modifications during its service life, the last being in the the late 1980s. The L85A1 rifle should have had several mods after Operation Granby (the 1990/91 Gulf War), but these weren't done until the end of the decade, which produced the much better L85A2.
Here are a few pros and cons, in no particular order:-
SLR pros: powerful and accurate ammunition (con: 7.62mm ammo is bulky), simple to maintain and operate, easy to use battle sights (con: not a great rifle for mounting modern telescopic sights). A good all-round battle rifle which has been used effectively in all theatres of operations.
SA80 weapons:-
Pros: more ammunition can be carried; the recoil is lighter, so the rifle can be used by female soldiers (who never were issued the SLR, having the L2A3 SMG instead); accurate telescopic sights with a x4 magnification; fully automatic capability, with the rifle being controllable firing 3 round bursts. The L1A1 rifle was adapted from the FN FAL, but the latter rifle's full auto capability wasn't wanted by the British, who considered it inaccurate and a waste of ammunition in a large calibre rifle.
The L86 Light Support Weapon was never as good as the two weapons it was meant to replace - the L4A3 LMG and L7A2 light role GPMG, so the latter weapon came back into use, as well as the Minimi LMG. It was briefly a 'Sharpshooter Weapon', but was superseded by the 7.62mm Sharpshooter Rifle.
The L85A2 is a good rifle due to its H&K improvements, and really we are left with the endless 5.56mm Vs 7.62mm debate. The British were the first to buy and use the AR15 rifle during the 1962-66 Borneo campaign, and used a mix of weapons in the rain forests there like the Aussies and US soldiers did in Vietnam. Indeed, it was an RAF Regiment liaison officer who recommended the AR15 to the USAF Security Police in Vietnam (as well as the use of light armoured vehicles) in 1965. The US Army adopted that rifle afterwards, and the rest is history...funnily enough, the British Army bought the M79 40mm grenade launcher for use in N Ireland, as well as the M203 mounted on the M16 A1 and A2 later on. 🙄
In conclusion, I've used all three rifles, though admittedly never in anger, but they're all good if one looks after them and applies the marksmanship principles when firing.
This also applies to the Kalashnikov rifles: a lot of the ones we captured in the desert in 1991 hadn't been looked after by the Iraqis, and needed a good bash with a hammer on the cocking handle to open the breech, and a lot of cleaning up to return them to firing condition. 🤔
Unfortunately for the L85 rifle, it's been used in wars we've lost (Iraq & Afghanistan), whereas the SLR was used mostly in wars we've won (Malaya, Borneo, Oman (not Aden, tho'), N Ireland and the Falklands). But that's yet another argument to be resolved. 🤪
@@jamesbussey2911 Wow, thanks for sharing your experience in such a detailed and interesting reply! 👍
I'd consider posting it as a, standalone comment so more people see it.
I hope you're enjoying life as a civvy 😉
Its the fact that the shops didn't close, schools didn't close, people didn't stop working or living life while all of this chaos went on around them!
Our mums, dad's, grannies and grandas just got up and got on with it. It's unbelievable to me, and im born and reared in Belfast. Crazy.
Exactly. I grew up during these times, and now as an adult I look back and think how did we make it out of that in one piece.
It’s crazy to think of it now, but I remember constantly getting stopped and having my doll and pram searched by soldiers whilst they pointed a gun at me. It was just the norm then, but thinking of it now it’s madness. I once saw my school friend shot in the face with a rubber bullet by a soldier.
And the schools stayed open throughout all this, that’s why when covid hit and everything closed I couldn’t get it. They sent us to school during gun battles and bombings for goodness sake lol.
Im from the republic hard to believe this was happening only 50 years ago on our little island
I love Belfast. Beautiful place.
These were very, very dark times. Many kids these days don't understand just how bad things can get once just one politician decides he needs to show his gun. It all goes lob-sided from there on in..
Are you referring to Oliver Cromwell and the plantations of the 17th century?
6:13 greatest soldier opinion in any war/situation tbh
Sounds like he has no moral compass when it comes to his job.
@@foghornfoggyface Like a soldier should be
@@CarryMeh161 mercenary*
@@Ahmedkhaled-ev1jw good soldiers follow orders
@@Luke_Sandy_High_Ground sheeple*
I have a question what is this rifle 3:28 what model is it?
L1A1 SLR - The British variant of the FAL
@@tomsoki5738 Thank you!
Next year, it will be 50 years since these clips were filmed.
The people that lived through these years are more wiser than the young ones now who have not got a clue what we went through and try to stir up the hatred learn from the past
The great Brian Hannrahan! I wasn’t born when this was made, but 11 years later I was 9, watching him report on the Falklands War. Now nearly 40 years later, he is still a fantastic reporter👍
A complete arsehole in this interview chasing his own opinions and not being open enough to accept what was happening.
Met Brian Hanrahan in the gulf during the 80's when things got really hairy there for a while. I thought about how he was known in the armed forces as a bit of a dickhead and when I went to collect him and bring him and his team back to my ship he was clearly still a dickhead.
I was a 4 year old back then, but from a village called bushmills, up near the north coast, I grew up as a protestant, from my family, but my family are from both sides,, and when I was 16 , I started working as a milkman, to both sides,! Did for 10+ years, I loved working as a milkman, and had good friends from the Catholics on are round,! I started as a milkman in 1984, a 16 year old, 🤝♥️🇬🇧 ,
That higher ranking officer replied in a highly professional manner and kept his cool, unlike today's bunch.
What the fuck do you know about the British Army?
@@gooner72 A lot more than you dare to think. ☠️
Chewsday init
@@yossiallen3316 Did you serve?
@@ardakolimsky7107 Yes
As an American who visited Belfast, I noticed that there are so many government employees in Belfast it is unreal. I would venture to say over 25 percent of the population are government employees . Reunification with the republic would put tens of thousands of people out of work.
You realize your entire comment is wholly and entirely your own subjective speculation.
If you’re Catholic, Irish, and Republican (their “Republicans” not the GOP) that issue with certain individuals being out of work would most certainly come off as a problem that won’t belong to you.
The Irish overwhelmingly voted in favor of reunification with the rest of the Republic of Ireland in 1918. The British rejected that anyway, and the only reason they managed to keep the Six Counties of the North in their possession was because the IRA ran out of ammunition before they could kick the Brits off their island way back when.
Haha. Stop getting your information from pub toilet walls.
I lived in Ballymagroarty in the early 80's. Good times.
11.29,General Sir Harry Tuzo . He was DSACUR ( Deputy Supreme Allied Commander Europe) when I was in SHAPE. A well respected officer.
Keyboard warriors and sectarian bigots will be all over this upload. Sad I grew up during these troubles and sadly enough there are no innocents all sides had blood of innocents.on their hands
It's a complicated affair that is true. I used to naively think handing N IRE back to the rest of Ireland was the answer, but have since been informed by Irish people that this is not really the solution for racial and cultural reasons amongst other things.
Nothing is ever black and white, just lots of shades of grey and people's opinion of whats right
@@EgoShredder Why should the people of NI take on the mess they have made down south? I used to want a united Ireland, but the cost for NI is too high now. The Stormont mob are toxic enough.
@Peter Doyle GDP is bullshit. Your state hospitals are a clown show. You have to send patients to Newry for heavens sake.
@Darren Richardson Yes so true, the English Government allowed an Apartheid system to establish itself in NI. It exists to this day in Uk . if your a Catholic you can’t be PM, crazy but true, only found that out recently.
Those guys where very willing to get into the back of that armoured truck?
Yes in case they got an o.b.e... Lol
LOL they knew what'd happen if they didn't come quietly!
I started primary school in 1972, new lodge area, Belfast
This happened two decades before my Ulster tours. I am so relieved not to have toured in 1972, the numbers were horrendous
Casualties due to terrorist action in 1972
Army 148 injured (106 killed)
Police 17 Killed
Civilians 248 Killed
Total number of deaths 371
Injuries due to terrorist action (Security forces and civilians) 4,876
Shooting incidents 10,631
Explosions 1,382
Bombs defused 471
Total number of explosive devices 1,853
Comments will be interesting with this upload. 😉
There are full episodes available of these people arguing over the same goddamn religion that have their comment section available for your viewing.
Anen USA N.Y. American
This War was crazy. there are children which walking on the road like nothing happened. at the same place at the same time we have british soldiers close to the children and they are moving around like they are in war.
You can see this on the video .
The British Army were ordered to stay near children so to detract from enemy fire/bombs
@@Monkeypole I doubt the IRA cared all that much
@Prkau telek I know it. but the only one who doing warcrimes is putin..... western world says.
I'm here just to do my job. How often the similar phrases might be heard during the Nuremberg trials. But what the bottom line at the end of the interview. He's really a honest man.
Think that's the point, they young British soldiers were their to protect the public and that was their job - the IRA on the otherhand killed the public because they wanted to.
@@mrfrisky6501 I'm not on thier side either.
@@dimaleoniv7987 👍
I am convinced that in 1987 I worked with the Jock section leader in West Sussex.
He was a genuine natural soldier, super-funny and a hard worker.
He got taken on by the Boss, we had to move on.
Anyone remember his tweed hat peppered with fly-fishing flys?
I wont mention his name.
That’s wee Jimmy Krankie. Good laugh he was.
Peter Taylor made a documentary on the Troubles in 2000. He is the man conducting the interview here in 1972. Now that's dedication.
it was a conflict british get out of our country
In a situation like this. Who are the civilains, the enemy and Who are the good and bad guys? I think as usual it depends on who do you ask?
The people that took boats and planes to Ireland were the enemy.
@@pedalingthru2719u make no fucking sense💀how else are the british meant to get into their own land? and u support terrorists Aswell
I first thought that there will be the benny hill show because of the opening title. Thames intro was shown every time benny hill was broadcasted in my country. The music from that show sounded all the time I watched this video. Sorry guys, this is in fact a very sad story.
So this is what journalism USED to be... real.
The suspect at 5:04 with the ginger hair and donkey jacket was possibly Brian "Ginger" "Gille" Gillen who would have been about 15/16 in December 1972 when this was first shown on television and was a Provisional I.R.A volunteer and company commander in the first battalion Belfast brigade then. He's about 63 now. He went to the top of the Provisional I.R.A's Army Council.
Thankfully my family Immigrated to America from Belfast during the famine.
There’s cities in america today that are worse than Belfast back then
that was 5 years before my birth. i am 45 now, quite old. Surprised to see colour TV. The soldiers shown must be in their 70ies i suppose
The rifle seems to be too cumbersome for such a deployment, I'm surprised they weren't using more of the Stirling?
The SMG had an effective range of 50m max , inaccurate with little stopping power... The SLR although cumbersome and unfit for vehicular use had stopping power out to 300m and beyond, optical sights were added later... More suited to the rural environment...
'' Are you aware that you are not wanted here?'' He asks. ' Why do you think I carry a loaded rifle and wear a flak jacket'
6:15 I like this guy
Great footage but I don´t understand. The parts of Sweden I live was Danish untill 1658 but you don´t see us having a go at each other. Sometimes you just have to drop things.
The bitterness runs deep here
Did the danish army go around murdering innocent children in the streets?
I grew up in the area that was being patrolled by the British army there. They took over the school that I later went to, St Teresas. They must've only interviewed the 'polite' ones because I never met a good one. They hated us!
Most people in England never even thought about what was going on across the water , it was just something that you saw on the news at 6 !...unless you had a son in the army !
That’s how it is for every war nobody gives a single shit
Was a 4 year old back then, born May 23rd 1968, have family from both sides, from northern Ireland UK, we what to stay in the UK,! Just stop fighting,,! ♥️🇬🇧
As a Scottish guy who wasnt born back then, this is crazy.
Loved the tension as the soldiers cross the road under heavy fire and then pass two children that could be the enemy.
I like the candor of everyone in this report. Everyone, from the soldiers, to the general and the reporter - everyone seems to have a dignified rationality to them.
If you can't see through this halarious, acted out and dramatized propaganda film then you must be mentaly retarded lmao
@@LivinLikeLarrry Eat shit, pal.
Thankfully things are better now and people are understanding (on the whole) to live together in peace. Northern Ireland is a lovely country.
I really enjoyed my time there a couple years ago, I'll have to visit again sometime
Wow