Longsword.academy: Fühlen-less schielhau concept
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 17 окт 2017
- Schiller against middle positions, langort and thrusts, and cuts. This is a new suggestion with more effective way for schiller than a usual one. Full article with explanations longsword.academy/longsword/sc...
Спорт
I was attending a sparring camp in Pittsburgh over a month ago and I had to actually use Schielhau as a flinch respond against someone swinging like a buffel with a "Mintante"( A personalized Longsword Feder with a Montante hilt that hit like a truck).
The context is weird and not really important, but basically I unintentionally pissed the guy off by accidentally hitting his hands(wearing only lacrosse gloves by choice) when he put his hand in from of his mask to block a cut.
I felt bad at first, because I wasn't trying to hurt his hand, and then as soon as we resume fighting he takes the this bizzare Feder/Montante mix and baseball swings it at my head...luckily I was in Vom Tag and I Schielhaued it as flinch response. Not only did I hit him in the head, I hit his hand again as well(didn't feel bad the second time after that😒😅).
I still have no idea how Schielhau disperses the energy like that, but it does. That kinda cut would collapse a Zornhaw. I love Schielhau after that though, it's a very reliable weapon in a lot of situations. Mine is kinda a mix of Anton's and Jake Norwoods, I really like it although I never thought it would be stresstested like that.
Wow. Glad it worked for you! I'm surprised his weaponized feder was even allowed. I sense bad sportsmanship on several levels from that dude.
@@loyalsausages I think the guy was primarily a historical viking reenactor rather than a normal HEMA practitioner, even though he was a member of a HEMA club, I was one of the only people he fought outside of the club melee at the end. He had all kinds of weird rules, including not wanting to participate in the melee unless he got a viking shield and other stuff. The guy gave me weird vibes and when he disobeyed his instructor and didn't put on the SPES heavies she wanted him to, and yet still tried to guard with his hand anyway, I don't feel that bad. Also during the melee, he ignored all shots to his hands and still swung the arming sword like a baseball bat. I think his minetante was allowed because most of our clubs found it cool and noone, besides me, actually fought against it.
I still regularly train and stand by this schielhau ,and actually even though I didn't do great in the last tournament I was in, this schiel worked great against higher level intermediate competitors and allowed me to be competitive in matches.
Glad to see you back! Looking forward to more of your great instructional videos.
Whatever happened to this series? This is an excellent format. Very clear. Have you pursued creating a full syllabus in this style?
I think a crowd funded campaign for such a syllabus could be very succesful.
Nice! Thanks for sharing, what a fantastic study guide into the mechanics of the Schiller.
Another great video. I love your interpretations! I look forward to practicing this.
Hope to see you in France soon !
Great job as always
Nice and crisp, in a very good way. Thanks for sharing :)
Looks very interesting! I'd also want to look at your interpretation of Glutzhauw
Nice to see it after while.
@Anton, I met you on Schwabenhau this year and your teaching really inspired and helped me. Please keep going with this series. I would definitely pay for it on Patreon, ever though of that as alternative to RUclips?
Thank you very much. Now I know how to use this technique
This video's been fantastic reference for my own fencing.
How do you decide to use Shielhau false edge or Zornhau true edge strikes though? Watching your other video they both descend vertically over an incoming strike.
fabolous we will take it in our sparring session ;)
In the old one, it looks like you were contacting your opponent's sword with the strong of your sword, with the new one, it looks like it your sword was contacting more so with the hilt, hence why the strong weak matters less, and why the angle matters more. But I guess that means, the timing is even more crucial now, since you get close to your opponent's tip in the new version.
Great demonstration! The dreaded squinter, defeating those who would depend on strength alone 😂
It is great, and even though I don't want to lessen the progress they've made, but proposing this as a new interpretation brings up an interesting point: this concept may be new in its application in schielhau, but it's been understood by "sport" fencing. I use quotes around sport because, despite the huge presence of the Olympics and other competitive events, there are more classical styles of the modern sport that still value the full range of the sword. I think the rift people want to create between sport fencing and HEMA unwisely reduces the knowledge can be shared.
Gregory Foresi I was attending a sparring camp in Pittsburgh over a month ago and I had to actually use Schielhau as a flinch respond against someone with a "Mintante"( A personalized Longsword Feder with a Montante hilt that hit like a truck).
The context is weird and not really important, but basically I unintentionally pissed the guy off by accidentally hitting his hands(wearing only lacrosse gloves by choice) when he put his hand in from of his mask to block a cut.
I felt bad at first, because I wasn't trying to hurt his hand, and then as soon as we resume fighting he takes the this bizzare Feder/Montante mix and baseball swings it at my head...luckily I was in Vom Tag and I Schielhaued it as flinch response. Not only did I hit him in the head, I hit his hand again as well(didn't feel bad the second time after that😒😅).
I still have no idea how Schielhau disperses the energy like that, but it does. That kinda cut would collapse a Zornhaw. I love Schielhau after that though, it's a very reliable weapon in a lot of situations. Mine is kinda a mix of Anton's and Jake Norwoods, I really like it although I never thought it would be stresstested like that.
jesus christ, I hope you got the poor man a beer afterwards
It's so satisfying... it's my new bedtime video, it helps me relax 🤤
I know I'm late but props to the fencer who acted as the dummy. Imagine spending a day just walking into schiels on purpose!
The chillhaw is a great strike in this demostration
This is amazing.
We are looking for further videos.... :)
very good video
Hi Anton! I'm struggling with this against the Oberhau. I was looking at your counter frame-by-frame in sequence 38, and it looks like you cut with the long edge? I tried looking at the article you linked in the English version, but the important bit on the Oberhau seemed to need translation. Anything you can provide would help immensely.
Hi. It's a short edge. 2:20 my thumb is on the flat facing towards us. Proper extension and full rotation could help you. Until it's translated I have to say it's much harder to write about it against cuts. It would be much better show you.
We are currently trying to adapt this version of the Schielhau and we encountered an issue against an Oberhau. The one throwing the Schielhau very often seems to get his fingers cut. Are we missing something or is that just something we have to deal with? We are mostly not using a Feder, but regular Longswords, so we don't have the additional protection of the Schild. Does anyone know how we could tackle that problem?
Yes. It can happen if it is not offensive enough and you don't go into fully extended arms. Mail me a video or message. Maybe I can help you.
@@AntonKohutovic Thank you for your quick reply.:-)
We will play around with it more in the coming weeks and see if we get rid of the problem with stepping up the intensity and better posture.
Thank you again for answering on an older video.👍
I would have loved a more detailed version but from what I can observe it's a lot about the second hand. On sequence 6, instead of moving the left hand as a false edge swing, you keep your hand as a normal strike, right? Hence the verticality.
Or am I missing something?
Nice display. I'd be nicer if you add lines perpendicular to the red one : to judge the 'in depth' mouvements.
Yeah! Also it would be nice to look at this scene directly from top to bottom
Yes ! Or right behind and above the person who does the schielhau.
Excellent. A Zornhau relys on force and a weaker opponent to hit, also it starts to lack when the opponent blocks higher, while a Schielhau due to its much better angle does not.
I personally use Zornhau and Zornort in a Zwerchhau way, because it has longer reach and is more confortable/ a bit faster than a standart reverse edge Zwerchhau, and has better head protection (against an opponents Zwerchhau and prevents him from winding against my head) than a Zornhau done in the Oberhau way.
I like Schielhau in the vorschlag because it has great defence at the high left side but compared to Zwerchhau when missing also can close mid and low left side, where the Zwerchhau is verry open.
I was used to get good arm hits with the Schielhau. But now started using it as a Zornhau alternative with much better angle against high blocks. While ofcourse a Scheitelhau could be used for that, it seems to have not as good side defence in the vorschlag as well as being terribly open at the low left side when missing, an tends to be harder to execute cleanly.
What are your thoughts on that?
Great video.
(*Background why i didnt started to use Schielhau in a Zornhau way earlier: The trend in our group towards using a lot of Zwerchhau as vorhau made the normal Zornhau in the Oberhau way almost useless, therefore i started using Zornhau with high defence which means in the Zwerchhau way but with true instead of flaseedge due to that being a bit longer and more comfortable. I could have used a proper executed Scheitelhau instead, but at that time stepped too straight forward instead to the side, therefore it lacked defence. What prevented me at first doing the Schielhau as a Zornhau was that my Zornhau in the Zwerchhau way was faster with the right foot infront and torso aligned slightly left, but that sucked for the Schielhau, which functions far better with torso facing slightly towards the right, or/and left foot forward. So the Schielhau felt akward, which lead to just not using it often. Luckly i later got my eyes opened when changing stance and torso position, this kind of Schielhau is incredible usefull.)
So you called a very high true edge unterhau/mittelhau zornhau?
Interesting interpretation.
I might misunderstand you but that's what it sounds like.
You can cut zornhaw in same angle as schielhaw just with true edge it is slightly different but with similar deffensive effect. I cannot understand how zwerchhaw could be used as firts attack with its short reach... you could beat it with oberhaw...
It seems really similar to the Zornhau. Can someone explain why you are supposed to hold it in reverse (back edge) whenever performing the cut?
Jolly Leprechaun because Zornhaw with long edge cannot stay so easily on the center line. And short edge is the basic attribute of Schiller. If you overstretch arms with long edge downwards you will be weak. With short edge you are much stronger with stretched arms than bended.
Awesome, thank you.
@@AntonKohutovic Why are you with short edge and stretched arms stronger than with long edge and streched arms?
Just try to resist a pressure if you have stretched arms in longpoint with facing short edge upwards and downwards. It's a completely different feeling. I am not able to explain it from the biomechanical point of view but you are using different muscles and different geometry helps you.
oookay I might be a bit dumb begginer, but I am not sure if I got the difference between old and new version.
old: firstly knock away the oposing blade and then proceed to stab the poor guy.
new: just stab the poor guy as he is. measure the height of his blade but otherwise don´t care about it - if rotated right, he WILL find his blade uselessly off the target.
did I get it right?
Yes, you got the basic idea quite precisely.
@@AntonKohutovic ďakujem za potvrdenie :)
Super!
Watching this, I cannot help but wonder, though: In most sequences, the attacker, or opponent, doesn't really threaten or at least doesn't even try to win the center.. his point is aimed to the side. Would the technique - as presented - even work? Or would it require more footwork to the right?
That's the trick of this version. For opponent is almost impossible to regain the center line. It's described in article but not translated yet. No footwork to right is necessary. His point definitely does not aim to the side it's deflected there.
Ah alright. Maybe it is just the camera angle then. I'll be happy to read the article.
Either way, you are mightily fast with your Schielhau.
Great video! How important is lateral movement to your interpretation? Often times it appears that you're just cutting into the center, but other times you clearly push more to your left side.
Michael Chidester
No, I never push to the left side. It may look like that but it is only a result of blade flex and two forces pushing against each other. I need to release my wrists otherwise I would break them. The most important intention is to cut to the center with maximal possible reach and never cut to the side. Maybe I need to translate the article with description. Video alone is not enough.
@@AntonKohutovic It would be greatly appreciated if you did! Your Zornhau article was great!
@@AntonKohutovic please do! Would be much appreciated!
I love you
Где мечи купить?
Ищем в ВК: "Владимир Мэй", "Kvetun Armory" или "Pike Armory". Это 3 основных производителя федершвертов в РФ
This is basically a glide, a technique used in modern sport fencing.
Henry goh I don't think so. Because gliding motion is not desired in the execution. If you glide you are giving your opponent a signal and he can much easier react.
In my experience, a glide can be done with a vertical action of the blade while stepping in to close the distance for an attack. It's easily done from the guard position and can be followed immediately with a thrust. In that regards, it's quite similar to an opposition, though an opposition is usually an angled thrust that displaces the blade, rather than a vertical sliding motion.
So basically same thing just much less movement.
why you have got such a dirty weapon?
Because he uses it a lot
you are kidding me? :-)
+TheWizard Actually this is the reason why it should be clean ;P
because he uses it for full contact training and sparring
it has a lot of slight dents, uneven metal surfaces show up as looking dirty to camera
You can tell who watches too much anime and who actually uses swords on this thread lmao