I dont know if anyone else has read Brad's link to the essay by Dan Leighton but its really outstanding...requires two or three readings to absorb it completely. Here is my favourite paragraph: But the most prominent Caodong teacher in the century before Dogen was Hongzhi Zhengjue who also talks about space. Hongzhi was a strong influence on Dogen, as he is quoted very often in Dogen’s Eihei Koroku. Hongzhi uses the image of an empty field as a way of talking about space. In one place he says: “The matter of oneness cannot be learned at all. The essence is to empty and open out body and mind, as expansive as the great emptiness of space. Naturally in the entire territory all is satisfied. This strong spirit cannot be deterred; in event after event it cannot be confused. The moon accompanies the flowing water, the rain pursues the drifting clouds. Settled, without a grasping mind, such intensity may be accomplished. Only do not let yourself interfere with things, and certainly nothing will interfere with you. Body and mind are one suchness; outside this body there is nothing else. The same substance and the same function, one nature and one form, all faculties and all object-dusts are instantly transcendent. So it is said, the sage is without self and yet nothing is not himself.”
Master Dôgen presents us nearly endless variations - in the form of "serious play" with "language" (-> Wittgenstein, Austin, Searle, Vervaeke) - of the "holistic paradigm", which in the sinio-mahayanic contect is often illustrated by Indra`s net or the mirror-cabinet (-> Huáyán-school). Amazing, that Dan Leighton doesn`t mention it explicitly at all. In this respect, the analysis lacks sharpness, i.m.o. He also seems not to be aware of the deep-structure of the language Dôgen works with - nolen volens, that is, in a mixed active-passive mode. He labels the linguistico-mental jumps,or register-changes, as a sign of "humour", which I would contest. I don`t know how much humour Dôgen had in private; his writings, at least, are rather not very funny in any ways, so my impression. Master Dôgen, as a "psychonaut", often wanders at the fringes between wake-consciousness and sub-consciousness, respectively alternative states of consciousness, like that of dream, and fantasma. Modern psychology of perception holds that especially "dark" sub-consciousness follows its own rules - and humour doesn´t seem to be a part of it. It rather resembles, to use a metaphor of the (tendentially transhuman) "Cyborg-age", a machine-code, which "we" (the adult, common-sensical, rationality prone homo sapiens) cannot understand in a even nearly proper way without doing some "decoding work" - part of which we, moreover, accomplish already automatically, like: We do "natural holistic heuristics" when wandering through a maze or mirror-cabinet by, e.g., intuitively orienting ourselves in the given "lived space" (-> phenomenology of perception) to make sense (with the aid, among other things, of some "deep grammar", which is at least partly transcultural) of what is just going on, here and now. This would be some, hopefully constructive, points of critique regarding DL`s essay on concepts of vital space-time in Dôgens writings, from my side. Thank you for sharing.
One thing I always think About is the “mistake” we make in our perception when we interpret the time and space seems to be an inherent aspect of the universe as if the universe produces life to evolve more complexity in finite experience (feeling seperate,feeling like an individual). Buddhism is almost like a guidebook the universe gives itself to remind itself it is one vast being.
I have read that the various realms of the Buddhist cosmology can be conceived as the reality that we experience as our mind states change -- e.g., if we're overcome by insatiable attachment we're in the realm of the preta or hungry ghost. This way rebirth into these realms can likewise be conceived not as reincarnation from life to life but instead from moment to moment. Now, having read your books and listened to your talks I cannot help but wonder if that conceptualization is a way to reconcile Buddhism with the material view, as in your discussion of Buddhism is Always True.
So our "moods" are the springboard for life death, and rebirth? What happens if we are in a coma? Is this a place in-between realms? What happens if we have an out-of-body experience, are clinically dead, then brought back to life? Are we momentarily in limbo before reawakening in a new realm? Is there a limit to the number of moments I get -- and what process or entity determines the number? Is any of it influenced by ethics, intention, or circumstances? As I move through these mood life/death states can I earn more moments like points in a game? I am completely enthralled by your view. Look forward to hearing more.
I was looking at my copy of the Digha Nikaya today and reading a bit about Buddhist Cosmology. It mentions that the highest heavens in the form world, realms 23 to 27 are called the Pure Abodes and the beings born there are called non-returners as they supposedly attain nirvana without returning to any of the lower worlds first.
I’m not sure how respected Katsuki Sekida is but his translation of the mumokan and hekiganroku (which can be found under the title of “Two Zen Classics”) seems to click with me well. Sometimes everything is very clear and sometimes I don’t know what is being said but I know it’s because I still have a lot to learn (I’m barely 20, I’d hope there’s still a lot to learn). My main point here is that a recurring theme in his commentaries is that the stories aren’t about other people, they are about you. This idea fully clicked when I heard a Ram Dass lecture where he said that god comes to you in different forms to teach you different things and I thought about this idea in relation to the book of Job in the Bible and then finally to the koans. At this point I’d say that a lot of things can be given meaning if you relate them to yourself (for instance, heaven being a state of pleasure that one is in as is hell and that the middle ground between them is an ideal place to be since it is still and clear).
i've heard that story about the two monks before, but the way you phrased it made more sense than before. The best part is I'm smoking a bowl, so that's something about holding the contradictions as part of the practice I think. >.> xD
(when we act in habit and against our own growth but manage to learn something anyways? thank all divinity that this happens, or literally NO ONE would EVER get enlightened!
I am intrigued by the Buddhist views of death and afterlife. In the Buddhist cosmology, do newborn innocent babies that have died go to their own realm or are there "hell-lite" or "heaven-light" realms for them? How does one move from a bottom hell realm to a higher hell realm--is Hitler doing his "time" or is how he spends that time in the presumably low hell realm important, too? In terms of reincarnation, will Hitler always be Hitler or is there a Hitler cockroach? Is it possible to be in more than one realm at the same time? Should I put the pipe down 🤪? Thanks Brad, really enjoyed this vid. 😀
Could you tell me what the source material is in the book, where they are talking about the levels of heaven and hell and things like that? I cant seem to find much online about these subjects.
I had this weird experience minutes ago with someone... I was wondering if a video about "teacher/dharma appears when the student is ready" will be a good idea? Does not work for me anymore, but who knows! (not me)
very interesting talk , anywhere you can get the book?I can't seem to find the copy you have online. (cosmology). It is an interesting topic. I understand more and more these days that there is more to reality than science. It makes sense to me now why traditions like shinto exist. Even if objects do not have souls , the raw objects suffered to be made for our use. If it was wood , grain etc. To show respect makes sense. Yet when we only view them as raw materials we forget this. Allowing us or making it easier to be in-compassionate /show less respect to our temporary belongings. If we apply this logic to our very existence , it does mean that reincarnation is definitive. Even if it is simply joining the earth in the soil and providing nourishment for everything else , that in itself is reincarnation. I am somewhat more skeptical of my consciousness as if this logic is true , i am many other creatures minds , WE all other creatures minds , yet are all one , with the universe and ourselves. However i have no recollection of this , is it my flawed perception of reality? . So if it was true , i wouldn't even know. It is an interesting thought, and almost koan like.
Hi Brad, Please do a video on reincarnation and your double-think around it. Also, you've probably seen this given your interest in our little green friends but this guy makes a good case for why there probably aren't any aliens (which I find both relieving and sad; talk about double think!) www.ted.com/talks/stephen_webb_where_are_all_the_aliens/discussion
if you believe that there is you, you get reincarnated because you stay stuck in the wheel of samsara, you produce karma, if you stop believing it, like really, not just intellectually then you don't get reborn since there is nothing that gets reborn, the seeds of karma had ripen and faded away, you escape the wheel of samsara. That's one interpretation.
@@HardcoreZen I think any ideas about what ETs are like are subjective, even if educated, fantasies. I am a professional astronomer, and I have not seen a single work of astrobiology which would be more than educated speculation. Therefore, any speculation about the nature of ETs is fine by me. :)
I think there is nothing ours about this energy or consciousness of ours, so there is nothing else for us after this life. But some other body might be using this energy we cerated and have its own story about it. That is how i understand transmigration
it wouldn't surprise me that "the buddha" said that you don't need to know about cosmology....buddhism is a lick'n'stick religion, where by the religious part doesn't really matter as much because it's more like a cultural language than "buddhism." there's no authentic lineage. there's even lineages in India that historically didn't follow Shakyamuni Buddha. They followed different ones. Some how Shakyamuni got linked to Dipankara, and today Buddhism world wide stems from Shakyamuni Buddha....There is no way, or even no point, in attempting to separate all the red threads of ancient buddhist history, in order to define "orthodox buddhism." orthodox buddhism is an experiential understanding. not even the shobogenzo will get you to that understanding. nor will sitting there like a lump. buddhism is just a medium like anything else. ruclips.net/video/Xj2pdqlBC04/видео.html
Buddhism isn't cosmology, it's a description of how your mind works, what it's like to be a human being, and what makes you more and less of this, that, and the other. It's primarily concerned with the subjective experience of being a human being and how to work with that. Since we evolved far after the beginning of the universe, it doesn't have anything to say about that. It's just out of scope.
What on earth are you reading? Classical Buddhism makes it very clear that people in heaven can attain stream entry, and bodhisattas who are about to be a Buddha in their next life reside in Tusita heaven, which is a sensuous heaven. Generally it’s just a merit eater, but doesn’t have to be. The heavenly realms have had access to Buddhas and their teachings. Sakka (the current one) of Tavatimsa heaven is a stream winner. Beings in heaven are not destined for hell. Even the ones who get completely consumed by the nonstop sex and parties and intoxicants often end up with human rebirths. They certainly can end up in hell, animal, asura or peta realms, but it’s by no means a certainty or even a likelihood. It takes great merit to be born as a deva. And just as hell beings who end up as humans usually have a terrible life from residual kamma, devas often have great human lives, potentially even attaining nibbana if their karmic situation allows for it. I recommend sources that have a solid scholarly consensus (150 years to be exact) as original, because after that every other temple was just making stuff up and some of it just happens to still be around. Like the rule that watering down saké gets you sent to a very nasty hell (almost 100% that one came out of Japan). You’re welcome for the lesson. Love you
I dont know if anyone else has read Brad's link to the essay by Dan Leighton but its really outstanding...requires two or three readings to absorb it completely. Here is my favourite paragraph:
But the most prominent Caodong teacher in the century before Dogen was Hongzhi Zhengjue who also talks about space. Hongzhi was a strong influence on Dogen, as he is quoted very often in Dogen’s Eihei Koroku.
Hongzhi uses the image of an empty field as a way of talking about space. In one place he says:
“The matter of oneness cannot be learned at all. The essence is to empty and open out body and mind, as expansive as the great emptiness of space. Naturally in the entire territory all is satisfied. This strong spirit cannot be deterred; in event after event it cannot be confused. The moon accompanies the flowing water, the rain pursues the drifting clouds. Settled, without a grasping mind, such intensity may be accomplished. Only do not let yourself interfere with things, and certainly nothing will interfere with you. Body and mind are one suchness; outside this body there is nothing else. The same substance and the same function, one nature and one form, all faculties and all object-dusts are instantly transcendent. So it is said, the sage is without self and yet nothing is not himself.”
Master Dôgen presents us nearly endless variations - in the form of "serious play" with "language" (-> Wittgenstein, Austin, Searle, Vervaeke) - of the "holistic paradigm", which in the sinio-mahayanic contect is often illustrated by Indra`s net or the mirror-cabinet (-> Huáyán-school). Amazing, that Dan Leighton doesn`t mention it explicitly at all. In this respect, the analysis lacks sharpness, i.m.o.
He also seems not to be aware of the deep-structure of the language Dôgen works with - nolen volens, that is, in a mixed active-passive mode.
He labels the linguistico-mental jumps,or register-changes, as a sign of "humour", which I would contest. I don`t know how much humour Dôgen had in private; his writings, at least, are rather not very funny in any ways, so my impression.
Master Dôgen, as a "psychonaut", often wanders at the fringes between wake-consciousness and sub-consciousness, respectively alternative states of consciousness, like that of dream, and fantasma.
Modern psychology of perception holds that especially "dark" sub-consciousness follows its own rules - and humour doesn´t seem to be a part of it. It rather resembles, to use a metaphor of the (tendentially transhuman) "Cyborg-age", a machine-code, which "we" (the adult, common-sensical, rationality prone homo sapiens) cannot understand in a even nearly proper way without doing some "decoding work" - part of which we, moreover, accomplish already automatically, like: We do "natural holistic heuristics" when wandering through a maze or mirror-cabinet by, e.g., intuitively orienting ourselves in the given "lived space" (-> phenomenology of perception) to make sense (with the aid, among other things, of some "deep grammar", which is at least partly transcultural) of what is just going on, here and now.
This would be some, hopefully constructive, points of critique regarding DL`s essay on concepts of vital space-time in Dôgens writings, from my side. Thank you for sharing.
One thing I always think About is the “mistake” we make in our perception when we interpret the time and space seems to be an inherent aspect of the universe as if the universe produces life to evolve more complexity in finite experience (feeling seperate,feeling like an individual). Buddhism is almost like a guidebook the universe gives itself to remind itself it is one vast being.
It could be!
Hardcore Zen hey brad what books off the top of your head on ufos would you recommend?
You were in the Hell of Noisy Vehicles.
True!
Well if it doesn't annoy him, then he might not.
Your a very fair and honest young man. 🙂👍
The fact that Buddhist cosmology sounds like a 1st Edition D&D handbook may or may not have helped draw me in
It sort of does.
If you study a little bit about NDEs accounts, are you going to see that it's pretty much in sync with the Buddhist cosmology.
cosmologies are always so interesting- cool talk
For a moment, the entire universe had a pink face sponge in it's mouth.
SO TRUE!
I have read that the various realms of the Buddhist cosmology can be conceived as the reality that we experience as our mind states change -- e.g., if we're overcome by insatiable attachment we're in the realm of the preta or hungry ghost. This way rebirth into these realms can likewise be conceived not as reincarnation from life to life but instead from moment to moment. Now, having read your books and listened to your talks I cannot help but wonder if that conceptualization is a way to reconcile Buddhism with the material view, as in your discussion of Buddhism is Always True.
So our "moods" are the springboard for life death, and rebirth? What happens if we are in a coma? Is this a place in-between realms? What happens if we have an out-of-body experience, are clinically dead, then brought back to life? Are we momentarily in limbo before reawakening in a new realm? Is there a limit to the number of moments I get -- and what process or entity determines the number? Is any of it influenced by ethics, intention, or circumstances? As I move through these mood life/death states can I earn more moments like points in a game? I am completely enthralled by your view. Look forward to hearing more.
I was looking at my copy of the Digha Nikaya today and reading a bit about Buddhist Cosmology. It mentions that the highest heavens in the form world, realms 23 to 27 are called the Pure Abodes and the beings born there are called non-returners as they supposedly attain nirvana without returning to any of the lower worlds first.
I ought to study that stuff. Thank you!
@@HardcoreZen Your''e welcome. The Pali Suttas are interesting. I need to study more Dogen.
I’m not sure how respected Katsuki Sekida is but his translation of the mumokan and hekiganroku (which can be found under the title of “Two Zen Classics”) seems to click with me well. Sometimes everything is very clear and sometimes I don’t know what is being said but I know it’s because I still have a lot to learn (I’m barely 20, I’d hope there’s still a lot to learn). My main point here is that a recurring theme in his commentaries is that the stories aren’t about other people, they are about you. This idea fully clicked when I heard a Ram Dass lecture where he said that god comes to you in different forms to teach you different things and I thought about this idea in relation to the book of Job in the Bible and then finally to the koans. At this point I’d say that a lot of things can be given meaning if you relate them to yourself (for instance, heaven being a state of pleasure that one is in as is hell and that the middle ground between them is an ideal place to be since it is still and clear).
Have you ever talked about pure land? Can’t find an vids on your channel.
No. I really don't know much about Pure Land Buddhism.
The totalness of the fusion is such that it might as well be called emptiness/form/emptiness/..... :)
i've heard that story about the two monks before, but the way you phrased it made more sense than before. The best part is I'm smoking a bowl, so that's something about holding the contradictions as part of the practice I think. >.> xD
(when we act in habit and against our own growth but manage to learn something anyways? thank all divinity that this happens, or literally NO ONE would EVER get enlightened!
I am intrigued by the Buddhist views of death and afterlife. In the Buddhist cosmology, do newborn innocent babies that have died go to their own realm or are there "hell-lite" or "heaven-light" realms for them? How does one move from a bottom hell realm to a higher hell realm--is Hitler doing his "time" or is how he spends that time in the presumably low hell realm important, too? In terms of reincarnation, will Hitler always be Hitler or is there a Hitler cockroach? Is it possible to be in more than one realm at the same time? Should I put the pipe down 🤪? Thanks Brad, really enjoyed this vid. 😀
Could you tell me what the source material is in the book, where they are talking about the levels of heaven and hell and things like that? I cant seem to find much online about these subjects.
just type in buddhist cosmology aggann sutta dn 27
You already readed the Lankavatara Sutra? It's really a important Sutra to Zen?
I have been wondering for the past few videos what that container on the wall behind your head is.
I think it's the stuff you put on charcoal to light it. My gf's dad barbecued a few days ago.
Hi Brad, I'm a bad Zen student that would love for you to make a video on rebirth/reincarnation
I had this weird experience minutes ago with someone... I was wondering if a video about "teacher/dharma appears when the student is ready" will be a good idea? Does not work for me anymore, but who knows! (not me)
Wow!
very interesting talk , anywhere you can get the book?I can't seem to find the copy you have online. (cosmology). It is an interesting topic. I understand more and more these days that there is more to reality than science. It makes sense to me now why traditions like shinto exist. Even if objects do not have souls , the raw objects suffered to be made for our use. If it was wood , grain etc. To show respect makes sense. Yet when we only view them as raw materials we forget this. Allowing us or making it easier to be in-compassionate /show less respect to our temporary belongings. If we apply this logic to our very existence , it does mean that reincarnation is definitive. Even if it is simply joining the earth in the soil and providing nourishment for everything else , that in itself is reincarnation. I am somewhat more skeptical of my consciousness as if this logic is true , i am many other creatures minds , WE all other creatures minds , yet are all one , with the universe and ourselves. However i have no recollection of this , is it my flawed perception of reality? . So if it was true , i wouldn't even know. It is an interesting thought, and almost koan like.
I got the book on Amazon, but that was a few years ago.
Not saying half our population are shapeshifting aliens...
Buddhism Cosmology = *Wheel aka Babylonian star of Ishtar (One symbolic Meaning)* ☸️
give me some "cessation of suffering" by dropping the cool cats intro
Hi Brad,
Please do a video on reincarnation and your double-think around it.
Also, you've probably seen this given your interest in our little green friends but this guy makes a good case for why there probably aren't any aliens (which I find both relieving and sad; talk about double think!)
www.ted.com/talks/stephen_webb_where_are_all_the_aliens/discussion
How could you reincarnate if "you" don't exist as a "you"?
There is a WHOLE LOT of Buddhist literature on that topic. The entire Yogacara school of Buddhism was basically formed around answering that question.
@@HardcoreZen Should one study all the schools of Buddhism?
@@JamesAtkerson I haven't! I don't think it's necessary.
if you believe that there is you, you get reincarnated because you stay stuck in the wheel of samsara, you produce karma, if you stop believing it, like really, not just intellectually then you don't get reborn since there is nothing that gets reborn, the seeds of karma had ripen and faded away, you escape the wheel of samsara. That's one interpretation.
@@JamesAtkerson would it even be possible?
Well, those are kind of subjective fantasies about what ETs are like.
If there are so many bazillions of stars out there, there must be all kinds of ETs.
@@HardcoreZen I think any ideas about what ETs are like are subjective, even if educated, fantasies. I am a professional astronomer, and I have not seen a single work of astrobiology which would be more than educated speculation.
Therefore, any speculation about the nature of ETs is fine by me. :)
@@fraktaalimuoto Thanks!
@@HardcoreZen I agree. I think they've likely "visited" here as well, I've heard some stories from rational people that aren't unbelievable.
@@fraktaalimuoto I wasn't trying to be critical, I just LOL'd as Brad was describing his ideas. They'd not much crossed my mind.
I think there is nothing ours about this energy or consciousness of ours, so there is nothing else for us after this life. But some other body might be using this energy we cerated and have its own story about it. That is how i understand transmigration
it wouldn't surprise me that "the buddha" said that you don't need to know about cosmology....buddhism is a lick'n'stick religion, where by the religious part doesn't really matter as much because it's more like a cultural language than "buddhism." there's no authentic lineage. there's even lineages in India that historically didn't follow Shakyamuni Buddha. They followed different ones. Some how Shakyamuni got linked to Dipankara, and today Buddhism world wide stems from Shakyamuni Buddha....There is no way, or even no point, in attempting to separate all the red threads of ancient buddhist history, in order to define "orthodox buddhism."
orthodox buddhism is an experiential understanding. not even the shobogenzo will get you to that understanding. nor will sitting there like a lump.
buddhism is just a medium like anything else. ruclips.net/video/Xj2pdqlBC04/видео.html
nothing wrong or bad about scholarship
Buddhism isn't cosmology, it's a description of how your mind works, what it's like to be a human being, and what makes you more and less of this, that, and the other. It's primarily concerned with the subjective experience of being a human being and how to work with that. Since we evolved far after the beginning of the universe, it doesn't have anything to say about that. It's just out of scope.
Did we evolve far after the beginning of the universe?
Wrong. There’s clearly a Buddhism cosmology
What on earth are you reading? Classical Buddhism makes it very clear that people in heaven can attain stream entry, and bodhisattas who are about to be a Buddha in their next life reside in Tusita heaven, which is a sensuous heaven. Generally it’s just a merit eater, but doesn’t have to be. The heavenly realms have had access to Buddhas and their teachings. Sakka (the current one) of Tavatimsa heaven is a stream winner.
Beings in heaven are not destined for hell. Even the ones who get completely consumed by the nonstop sex and parties and intoxicants often end up with human rebirths. They certainly can end up in hell, animal, asura or peta realms, but it’s by no means a certainty or even a likelihood. It takes great merit to be born as a deva. And just as hell beings who end up as humans usually have a terrible life from residual kamma, devas often have great human lives, potentially even attaining nibbana if their karmic situation allows for it.
I recommend sources that have a solid scholarly consensus (150 years to be exact) as original, because after that every other temple was just making stuff up and some of it just happens to still be around. Like the rule that watering down saké gets you sent to a very nasty hell (almost 100% that one came out of Japan).
You’re welcome for the lesson.
Love you