Actually, you can disabled jarmen stealth ability through scripts so that every player can see him. Though maybe the devs still wants the stealth effects to remain active while jarmen can be seen by the player
It's not uncommon in games for the map to actually be larger than it is shown and for the area's that are out of bounds to contain something like a command center or power plants for level mechanics. I'm trying to think of what rts it was years ago but one example I can think of is Red Alert 2 had buildings out of bounds like a soviet construction yard in the 4th mission of the Allied campaign in Chicago. It existed solely to construct the nuclear missile that destroys chicago.
@@thirstyserpent1079 It also has out of bounds ore miners on the allied mission Dark Night, because the AI literally breaks if it doesn't have any apparently
I love how the map keeps pulling at the camera like it's going "Come on, you should be looking at this thing over here..." and "Hey stupid, we should be over there looking at that rock dying. Let's get moving." Like, no thank you, I want to explore the map for a bit. It's interesting how just off the camera the map is completely barren and without any sort of development. They really were trying their best to save on resources. You just missed it, but there are cars going round and round in circles atop the cliff next to where the infantry spawn on the beach. It's just out of shot when the shell is played. It's a pretty random thing to have there, lol
Yeah lmao, a bit lazy removing all those cam movements xD Ikr, like in the menu they looks fine if not amazing, but once you see inside it and you just "what in the hell is going on here?" Huh is there?, aww should have captured it in the video :(
@@gramantio2586 It's quite sad that zero hour never gets to it's full potential due to the devs being given a shit time to develop it and we're being rushed by EA. I mean don't get me wrong it's still a good game and it's a miracle they managed to finish it and made it good and serviceable but you can definitely see that something feels off about it like there's something unfinished with it. Especially since it has lesser missions than the previous one generals but that's due to again the devs being rushed. Now imagine if they got all the time in the world and resources they need to produce their vision for zero hour and complete it. Maybe the game could've been even more amazing and bigger than it is today but unfortunately it didn't. Another reason to hate EA yet again.
I remember when i was younger i tried to replicate the defensive set up against AI, just units dashing against my units on guard, only to realize that its straight up impossible to have such unit formations without having to constantly replenish them as they get picked off, paper cut to death or be aggroed and leaving their positions to chase enemy units around, only to get picked off. And that is not even speaking about them just being straight up sniped by the support powers and aircraft attacks.
Promotion Sounds, HP Bars, and Veterancy Chevrons don't show up in the Shellmap because it has scripts that do so. In fact, the Shellmap has scripts that manages the music while navigating the menus. Hence why when you quickstart without the shellmap you get no music. Also, some units are marked Invulnerable here (Hence why Kell cannot target them) as well as their Physics disabled via scripts. In particular, the Tanks guarding the middle base. The Battleship isn't actually shooting anything(unlike in the campaign) , it picks targets on fixed spots on the beach and has the firefx but nothing actually comes out. Explosion effects appear to where those spots shortly after are and kills the GLA infantry around those spots. Also funny bit: those Gatling Tanks are actually Tank General's Gatling Tanks, so if you have a mod the replaces them, they'll be placed there.
The reason stuff respawns and despawns is because they knew they couldn't rely on pathing to have perfect timing, that and vehicles have momentum and steering simulated so they rarely follow the same path multiple times over, most patrols in game are infantry for this reason.
My man, this game is almost 2 decades old, and you've basically shown us a piece of a childhood we never got to see back when. Thanks for this, man. Just hit my early 30's, and ypu've made me miss my early teens. Cheers.
I always wondered how scripted maps like this are made , could be refreshing to start a campaign or even just a level in the middle of action instead of having to always set up base before anything
Considering that we play RTS, it probably rare because well you need to build stuff just like the usual rts gameplay. though some maps do have that kind of style
@@LeQuack147 Yeah exactly most missions are like that Some even start with just troops then you proceed capture a base or smth and then you start building
First mission in the Supreme Commander: Forged Alliance had you come straight in the middle of the action as reinforcements seconds before the vase you arrived to was destroyed
@@Ricky_Spanishh It's also too "hot". It was an awesome product of its time, but if they tried anything like it these days? You'd have everyone from pro-Chinese people complaining about China's portrayal (despite being one of the two "good guys"), Alphabet Soup activists demanding that the commandos (especially Lotus and Burton) be gay or lesbian, et cetera. Modern culture is too hypersensitive.
@Mike Baker Less "hypersensitive" more "deliberately subversive". Modern wokists are perfectly fine with all kinds of viciois degradations when it doesn't serve THE MESSAGE to complain.
So this reminds me of a bug in Star Wars empire at war. I remember once while playing the demo, where the main menu bugged out and I could control the space battle that was going on there. It wasn't much but the most interesting thing was, that when your unit died, it instantly returned to the reinforcements pool that you could use to hyperspace in more units. Meaning that yeah units could die but both sides would never run out of forces.
I don't know why they didn't use the ship design more in other USA mission, they already made a model for it and even made it's guns functional, it'll probably be a good artillery piece for the US faction
cause then they would need to have the other factions to have a "similar" unit as well which is just more work. And for them to use the ship for more missions it would have to have the missions based around the coast more, which I don't think the GLA really base themselves there.
There's evidence suggesting that they DID actually plan naval combat, considering the US has a more or less complete navy w/ full sets of voicelines and the other factions have at least SOMETHING. However, problems with certain bugs(for example, the raptors can't land on moving aircraft carriers due to pathfinding errors,) and them facing a tight deadline appears to have ultimately made them scrap that plan.
Sometimes I remember watching this titlescreen for awhile at a time to see if anything changed about it over time if left open, other times I remember having to use the shortcut command line to open the game with no shellmap because this would eventually crash the game for some reason.
@@gramantio2586 The last version of RoTR has a russian base under siege. The SHW shellmap is a homage to the ZH shellmap as it is a joint China-USA defense vs GLA but it showcases elements of SHW, like a Demo Saboteur planting explosives.
@@gramantio2586 You can find them in moddb. Also the last ROTR version's gameplay was very polished, including the AI, last time I played the MEDIUM sent a big tank column at my base...while sneaking a VDV special forces paradrop in the back while I wasn't looking, almost gutting my base. The ECA faction is really good at turtling, specially with one of their defenses having like half-map range (targets must be manually specified, has a big minimum range and a long cooldown, but build enough of them and you can rain hell on almost anything).
One thing I always wanted to see is this battlefield with all units and structures having all upgrades, just to see a more chaotic, dynamic battlefield.
This video was more satisfying that i though it would be. Very interesting indeed. How come you are USA and only unit you can select is non other then Jarmen freaking Kell 🤣. Can you break down cinematic from Generals USA mission 5 I think it's about GLA ambushing USA embessador and it's cinematic is quite spectacular. Would be nice to know what is going on in small details, like in this video.
Virtually any of the American intro's would make for a good dissection. They are full of over the top shock and awe stuff. The very first american mission where its Baghdad and it ends up with a line battle between crusader tanks and gla scorpions followed by a coordinated f 22 air strike. Similar with the commanche pilot rescue mission
Great video! Loved seeing this and I always did wonder so this is cool getting some of those questions ya ask yourself when youre younger actually get answered
There is also a custom skirmish version of this map. Has all those units as neutral to all in the middle tough. Kinda like the normal shell map but enlarged.
It's also interesting to note that the cruiser is not actually firing its guns. The sound and visual effect play, but the explosions on the beach happen in exactly the same places every single time. They are scripted explosions.
im gonna point out that Helix, how is it staying down? normally they dont stay down that long unless you make a vehicle enter them then stun that vehicle with an ECM tank
By making the unit "disabled" through the unit properties/scripts in WB, a disabled unit can't do anything. Its the same principle as the vehicle that got snipe by jarmen
Haven't opened WB in like ten years, but I also think you can set their Locomotion to None or sth like that. That's how some custom map makers have big planes in a "landed" state
Wow that's cool that you can do this. Since you seem to know a lot about this game I have a question: I want to make an AI overall mod. Any idea where I could start? Is there a way to read the game state and programmatically make commands? Kinda like an API
You just gotta press Q twice to see if there's anything selectable there. I ended up on this same thing completely randomly by adding boss general and choosing her for challenges and the game just led me to the shellmap lmao
I didn't see the Jarmen kell even though I see the shellmap many times and I know all the US and Chinese vehicles are basically invincible, but I assume the rangers is not
It did, but it spawns right at the beginning and doesn't respawn. It's only there to give a visual explanation as to where the GLA soldiers are coming from.
It's on Origin/EA play, you have to buy the C&C Ultimate Collection, I don't believe Generals/ZH is for sale individually without buying the collection.
@@Sladeraptor17I had that game but something happedned with the discs. Also I had to run it on Windows XP because it wouldnt install on my other laptop. Is that problem fixed now?
This is the 100th comment and I say that they should have built a hospital for that ambulance to come from and go from and they should not have deleted civilians from the game.
![C&C Stupid Zero Hour Facts! [🍌17]: Slow Planes, Police Lights, Teleportation and more!](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/K700a380XHg/mqdefault.jpg)
![C&C Stupid Zero Hour Facts! [🍌17]: Slow Planes, Police Lights, Teleportation and more!](/img/tr.png)
Ohh, btw i did look up in the WB itself to search some unusual scripts or cut content, but there isn't. nothing that i can see
You need the correct file type for this. Or open with an editor from a dev package.
Fun fact: jarmell kell can't be seen if he's an enemy so Devs made it it's yours so that you can see jarmen kell at the background of the shellmap
Also the damaged Chinese command center can be almost seen.
Actually, you can disabled jarmen stealth ability through scripts so that every player can see him. Though maybe the devs still wants the stealth effects to remain active while jarmen can be seen by the player
@@gramantio2586 I think yeah
@@Vagabond-h7c spectator exists to let you see everything
Fun fact I am living under your floorboards and prefer your scent when you are asleep
Now that I think about it, maybe those background buildings were there to power up the defenses and also to build the airfield
Moat definitely the reason its there
It's not uncommon in games for the map to actually be larger than it is shown and for the area's that are out of bounds to contain something like a command center or power plants for level mechanics. I'm trying to think of what rts it was years ago but one example I can think of is Red Alert 2 had buildings out of bounds like a soviet construction yard in the 4th mission of the Allied campaign in Chicago. It existed solely to construct the nuclear missile that destroys chicago.
@@thirstyserpent1079 this technique is used pretty much in every older c&c
@@thirstyserpent1079 It also has out of bounds ore miners on the allied mission Dark Night, because the AI literally breaks if it doesn't have any apparently
@@chavzone Was always wondering about the lack of miners in that map. The first base for example has like 4 ore refineries but no war miners
I love how the map keeps pulling at the camera like it's going "Come on, you should be looking at this thing over here..." and "Hey stupid, we should be over there looking at that rock dying. Let's get moving." Like, no thank you, I want to explore the map for a bit.
It's interesting how just off the camera the map is completely barren and without any sort of development. They really were trying their best to save on resources.
You just missed it, but there are cars going round and round in circles atop the cliff next to where the infantry spawn on the beach. It's just out of shot when the shell is played. It's a pretty random thing to have there, lol
Yeah lmao, a bit lazy removing all those cam movements xD
Ikr, like in the menu they looks fine if not amazing, but once you see inside it and you just "what in the hell is going on here?"
Huh is there?, aww should have captured it in the video :(
@@gramantio2586
It's quite sad that zero hour never gets to it's full potential due to the devs being given a shit time to develop it and we're being rushed by EA. I mean don't get me wrong it's still a good game and it's a miracle they managed to finish it and made it good and serviceable but you can definitely see that something feels off about it like there's something unfinished with it. Especially since it has lesser missions than the previous one generals but that's due to again the devs being rushed.
Now imagine if they got all the time in the world and resources they need to produce their vision for zero hour and complete it. Maybe the game could've been even more amazing and bigger than it is today but unfortunately it didn't. Another reason to hate EA yet again.
Its not "saving resource" its just pointless, thats like painting the back of the board.
I remember when i was younger i tried to replicate the defensive set up against AI, just units dashing against my units on guard, only to realize that its straight up impossible to have such unit formations without having to constantly replenish them as they get picked off, paper cut to death or be aggroed and leaving their positions to chase enemy units around, only to get picked off.
And that is not even speaking about them just being straight up sniped by the support powers and aircraft attacks.
Same, would look so nice if it worked tho
Promotion Sounds, HP Bars, and Veterancy Chevrons don't show up in the Shellmap because it has scripts that do so.
In fact, the Shellmap has scripts that manages the music while navigating the menus. Hence why when you quickstart without the shellmap you get no music.
Also, some units are marked Invulnerable here (Hence why Kell cannot target them) as well as their Physics disabled via scripts. In particular, the Tanks guarding the middle base.
The Battleship isn't actually shooting anything(unlike in the campaign) , it picks targets on fixed spots on the beach and has the firefx but nothing actually comes out.
Explosion effects appear to where those spots shortly after are and kills the GLA infantry around those spots.
Also funny bit: those Gatling Tanks are actually Tank General's Gatling Tanks, so if you have a mod the replaces them, they'll be placed there.
It's very obvious the background buildings are there to power the bases and units, they are reactors after all.
The reason stuff respawns and despawns is because they knew they couldn't rely on pathing to have perfect timing, that and vehicles have momentum and steering simulated so they rarely follow the same path multiple times over, most patrols in game are infantry for this reason.
My man, this game is almost 2 decades old, and you've basically shown us a piece of a childhood we never got to see back when.
Thanks for this, man. Just hit my early 30's, and ypu've made me miss my early teens. Cheers.
You can download a CD key and still play the game, there is also dedicated serve to play people online!
I always wondered how scripted maps like this are made , could be refreshing to start a campaign or even just a level in the middle of action instead of having to always set up base before anything
Considering that we play RTS, it probably rare because well you need to build stuff just like the usual rts gameplay. though some maps do have that kind of style
I mean, this is basically what “no build” missions are.
@@LeQuack147
Yeah exactly most missions are like that
Some even start with just troops then you proceed capture a base or smth and then you start building
play generals campaign lol
First mission in the Supreme Commander: Forged Alliance had you come straight in the middle of the action as reinforcements seconds before the vase you arrived to was destroyed
I wish EA would give this game so much love and attention like you do. This game was decades ahead of its time.
That can't really monitize it with paid skins and weapon camos. So that's why they aren't touching it.
@@Ricky_Spanishh It's also too "hot". It was an awesome product of its time, but if they tried anything like it these days? You'd have everyone from pro-Chinese people complaining about China's portrayal (despite being one of the two "good guys"), Alphabet Soup activists demanding that the commandos (especially Lotus and Burton) be gay or lesbian, et cetera.
Modern culture is too hypersensitive.
@Mike Baker Less "hypersensitive" more "deliberately subversive".
Modern wokists are perfectly fine with all kinds of viciois degradations when it doesn't serve THE MESSAGE to complain.
So this reminds me of a bug in Star Wars empire at war. I remember once while playing the demo, where the main menu bugged out and I could control the space battle that was going on there. It wasn't much but the most interesting thing was, that when your unit died, it instantly returned to the reinforcements pool that you could use to hyperspace in more units. Meaning that yeah units could die but both sides would never run out of forces.
I remember watching this cinematic over and over as a kid.
I don't know why they didn't use the ship design more in other USA mission, they already made a model for it and even made it's guns functional, it'll probably be a good artillery piece for the US faction
cause then they would need to have the other factions to have a "similar" unit as well which is just more work.
And for them to use the ship for more missions it would have to have the missions based around the coast more, which I don't think the GLA really base themselves there.
Balance
There's evidence suggesting that they DID actually plan naval combat, considering the US has a more or less complete navy w/ full sets of voicelines and the other factions have at least SOMETHING. However, problems with certain bugs(for example, the raptors can't land on moving aircraft carriers due to pathfinding errors,) and them facing a tight deadline appears to have ultimately made them scrap that plan.
And they are way too op as they are now
Have to make naval maps
3:49 Gramantio' dream whenever he doing a cinematic
Wow. Thanks for showing us about inside the Main Menu in Command and Conquer Generals Zero Hour.
Np, more interesting stuff is coming
Sometimes I remember watching this titlescreen for awhile at a time to see if anything changed about it over time if left open, other times I remember having to use the shortcut command line to open the game with no shellmap because this would eventually crash the game for some reason.
Its been so long sonce i played C&C
Am glad people are still playing it
My buddy and I still play it.
Will you do a an in depth view of the C&C Generals Shockwave and Rise of the Reds shellmaps? They are also highly interesting, particularly the SHW.
Hmm, I'll take a look later. though the RoTR one is basically ZH shellmap does it not?
@@gramantio2586 Its the old shellmap with the attack on the russian base
ruclips.net/video/fsr2UHksYlw/видео.html&ab_channel=surplusguy100
@@gramantio2586 The last version of RoTR has a russian base under siege.
The SHW shellmap is a homage to the ZH shellmap as it is a joint China-USA defense vs GLA but it showcases elements of SHW, like a Demo Saboteur planting explosives.
Ohh welp, i don't have that version atm
@@gramantio2586 You can find them in moddb.
Also the last ROTR version's gameplay was very polished, including the AI, last time I played the MEDIUM sent a big tank column at my base...while sneaking a VDV special forces paradrop in the back while I wasn't looking, almost gutting my base. The ECA faction is really good at turtling, specially with one of their defenses having like half-map range (targets must be manually specified, has a big minimum range and a long cooldown, but build enough of them and you can rain hell on almost anything).
One thing I always wanted to see is this battlefield with all units and structures having all upgrades, just to see a more chaotic, dynamic battlefield.
This video was more satisfying that i though it would be. Very interesting indeed. How come you are USA and only unit you can select is non other then Jarmen freaking Kell 🤣. Can you break down cinematic from Generals USA mission 5 I think it's about GLA ambushing USA embessador and it's cinematic is quite spectacular. Would be nice to know what is going on in small details, like in this video.
Hmm, its actually a very good suggestions, adding new type of content "analyzing of how a cinematic/map works" i will try it soon enough
Virtually any of the American intro's would make for a good dissection. They are full of over the top shock and awe stuff.
The very first american mission where its Baghdad and it ends up with a line battle between crusader tanks and gla scorpions followed by a coordinated f 22 air strike.
Similar with the commanche pilot rescue mission
Great video! Loved seeing this and I always did wonder so this is cool getting some of those questions ya ask yourself when youre younger actually get answered
Why has it taken me this many years for the answers I have always wanted
This video made me download the game again after years of not playing Generals
feels cool seeing how it works on the background! great video!
Back then, I couldn't care how the shell map looked like, I was just happy to play again on PC on an LCD monitor, then just watch the shell map loop.
Been playing this game for ever since it was NEW and never noticed Jarmen Kell is on this map
There is also a custom skirmish version of this map.
Has all those units as neutral to all in the middle tough.
Kinda like the normal shell map but enlarged.
It's also interesting to note that the cruiser is not actually firing its guns. The sound and visual effect play, but the explosions on the beach happen in exactly the same places every single time. They are scripted explosions.
This, together with Tiberian Dawn/RA1 are the only CnC games with a menu over a raging battlescape
im gonna point out that Helix, how is it staying down? normally they dont stay down that long unless you make a vehicle enter them then stun that vehicle with an ECM tank
By making the unit "disabled" through the unit properties/scripts in WB, a disabled unit can't do anything. Its the same principle as the vehicle that got snipe by jarmen
Haven't opened WB in like ten years, but I also think you can set their Locomotion to None or sth like that. That's how some custom map makers have big planes in a "landed" state
a "trick" can be order an unit to enter but said unit is stuck like jarmen hell , maybe that can cause game issue ?
This is beautiful thank you for your efforts, Now i can have peace of mind.
When i was young,i thought there would be a mission as shown in the Main Menu and I wanted to play so bad as it is so organized
Even i didn’t play much of CandC still cool to revisit it
You should make a mission around this map
I wish if I can but I can't open it on worldbuilder
Hmm idk, its still basically building map from scratch since shellmap are not that big to begin with
I haven’t played generals in over 1 and a half decade but my muscle memory wanted me to click on those blinking stars
I vaguely remember the game bugging out and letting me play in the shell map for generals. Good times.
@2:32 Jarmen: No one escapes.
Oh Jarmen you've no idea how right you are. You can't escape from the cliffs either :D
This and Tiberian Sun should really be on steam
wow really making that childhood dream come true , nice vid , thumbs up and have a sub my friend !
Glad you enjoy!
Wow that's cool that you can do this. Since you seem to know a lot about this game I have a question:
I want to make an AI overall mod. Any idea where I could start? Is there a way to read the game state and programmatically make commands? Kinda like an API
Ohh shiet, i know about mapping but not modding mate, though you can join one of many modding discord server for generals
Mystery of childhood solved. Thanks!
You just gotta press Q twice to see if there's anything selectable there. I ended up on this same thing completely randomly by adding boss general and choosing her for challenges and the game just led me to the shellmap lmao
best main screen in my gaming career
my childhood game
I didn't see the Jarmen kell even though I see the shellmap many times and I know all the US and Chinese vehicles are basically invincible, but I assume the rangers is not
5:14 is better despawn and respawn Units that constantly circle and follow the same path repeatedly can stop after some time.
Can you get any of the generals powers, that has been flashing for quite a while so in theory that should be maxed out
We needed the final mission of the USA to look like this
interesting, you could also explore the main menu map of Rise of the Reds?
my RoTR is the original ZH shellmap, not the russian base
It would be cool if there where ships and other naval stuff in the game.
There are mods. But they don't really add anything to the gameplay.
Generals Shockwave mod Shellmap next?
I think It's a lot wider that this one also
Probably, i need to reinstall the nod due to my current version doesn't have any shellmap (i remove it and forgot how to get it back)
i remember there was a sneak attack during the main menu sequence, but it doesn't spawn here?
It did, but it spawns right at the beginning and doesn't respawn. It's only there to give a visual explanation as to where the GLA soldiers are coming from.
Did you try sniping the GLA vehicles?
How to download command and conquer generals zero hour on my laptop? Please i want to play it again after 10 years..
There are scripts in cinematic mode to disable veterancy fx
Do you use OBS to record it? I cant it it to work 😵💫
nope, bandicam
where can i download zero hour? cant find any site without viruses?
How did you get that resolution? I tried to play recently and it was too zoomed in.
Using gentool from gentool website or download a GameData from moddb
Anyone else disappointed the main menu wasn't an actual level in the game?
anything interesting in the OG general shellmap?
Bro you gave me so much nostalgia. Is there a way I can get that game?
It's on Origin/EA play, you have to buy the C&C Ultimate Collection, I don't believe Generals/ZH is for sale individually without buying the collection.
You can buy the individual generals and zero hour expansion as a set. But the full decade version is what everyone recommends.
@@Sladeraptor17I had that game but something happedned with the discs. Also I had to run it on Windows XP because it wouldnt install on my other laptop. Is that problem fixed now?
This is the 100th comment and I say that they should have built a hospital for that ambulance to come from and go from and they should not have deleted civilians from the game.
thats super great and all .... but why cant i update the game and play it anymore ... thats the real question
Can you do main menu from mods like firestrok contra etc
I don't have firestorm, though i will try to take a look at other mods that i have
Well deserved like 👍
How to do this please I want to mess up this map for the main menu.
By using finalBIG, open the MapsZH using it and find the desired maps and extract them to your maps folder
Its an easter egg
I have
Raaaad
This feels wrong