Fly Fishing Tech Tips: Some Reasons Why We Lose Fish on Barbless Hooks
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- Опубликовано: 8 июн 2022
- In many places barbless hooks are required by regulation and where they're not, we often use them anyway. Barbless hooks allow us to release fish moer quickly, causing less stress.
The downside of using barbless hooks is the tendency to lose more fish. In this video we'll explore how the design of the hook can affect our results. 
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The most scientific, intellectual, intelligent fisherman I’ve ever seen!
Very interesting. Thanks Peter
Very interesting and well worth noting. Thanks from down-under in NZ.
This is a brilliant topic to cover, and so well done. I use scud hooks (Tiemco 2499spbl) to tie as many nymph patterns as possible. It appears to have a configuration (long point and slight angle toward shank) that keeps the hookset well. I really appreciate this kind of video that is designed to improve success while at the same time helping to preserve the resource. I'm a subscriber. BRAVO.
Thank you. This is great advise
Nice insights 👍
Right On Peter !!!!!!
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Thanks for this!
Good video
Hmmm... interesting. Thanks!
Peter: Wouldn't a barb require a push in the direction opposite the direction of fish-to-angler to be useful at all? I recall being surprised ~45 years ago when I last used barbed hooks. I thought at the time that the rate of fish escape seemed equal between barbed and barbless. Some days, they were/all landed, and some days most escape. It probably depends on the voraciousness of the fish on any particular day. In any event, valid tests of whether barbed or barbless hooks hold better would seem impossible to devise.
There are lots of factors that affect the ability to keep a fish on. In this video I was only concerned about how the geometry of a barbless hook might affect its ability to hold onto fish.
I fish a wild trout stream in upstate NY and I jig nymph using a tandem rig. Usually a size 14-16 pointer fly and a size 6-8 stonefly. Barbless competition hooks. The amount of trout I’ve hooked and lost this season has driven me absolutely insane. I was thinking about bending the hook end a bit to the side. I’m so sick of losing monster wild browns. They slam the nymph, I set the hook, and within a second or two they’re gone. Driving me mad.
Competition anglers wouldn't use them if they were unreliable as their entire game is built around landing fish, so I doubt the problem is the hook, more likely your hookset.
I assume that you're using a sighter, not an indicator. With a sighter, just hookset directly opposite to the angle that the sighter is entering the water to avoid creating slack.
Don't do a tentative hookset in case it was the bottom. I lost a nice fish the other day for exactly this reason. It was a slow run and I had a two fly rig that was more appropriate to the faster runs I had just been fishing. If I had been smart, I would've removed the dropper fly. I expected to hit bottom a lot, so on the first bump in that stretch, I just made a tentative lift as I was sure it was bottom. It wasn't and the fish came off.
The last thing is to keep your line straight and avoid a curve in the line by getting too much of the sighter on the water.
One problem I recently ran across involves the drag of heavier mono. Last year I had been using a leader meant for Euro nymphing heavy bass flies so the mono was thick. I forgot about having that leader still on the reel and started trout fishing with it. The drag from the water on the thick mono coupled with the small, light trout nymph, meant that I was battling a curving leader all day. That creates slack and virtually guarantees a poor hookset and a lost fish.
Bottom line, keep the line straight, hookset opposite to the andle of the sighter and hookset firmly.
@@hooked4lifeca I appreciate the correspondence. Yeah, using a sighter. The only thing is, I’ve been fishing the runs in this stream for a while now and in previous years I never lost so many fish. I feel like my drifts are fine. But maybe you’re right. Perhaps I’m getting lazy with the way I’m holding the rod while drifting my rig thru a run or something.
@@lorimeyers3839 I've gone through those dry spells that were just probabilities in action or where cases where I wasn't paying attention. Most recent problems occurred when I'm off in Lala Land and I made a sloppy hookset.
Isn't the barb for holding the bait on
Its primary job is to hold onto the fish. Keep in mind that most barbed hooks are not used with bait. Bait hooks often have additional barbs on the shank for holding the bait. One interesting role of the barb is actually during manufacturing. Apparently it is easier to make a barbed hook vs. a barbless hook as the barb helps in the making of the hook.
There is another knot that one could try. On the hook. The salmon hook that is.
It won't change the outcome of this experiment dramatically. Mikael Frodin recommends the steering knot. On those up-turned single salmon irons. The reason for the hook eye being turned up in that way. Is really to accomodated a connection to the line. Using the steering knot. The shank steel axis. And the axis of the leader line. Are the same. What it matters for is presentation. When we tie out lines on to the round eye itself. On these salmon hooks. It's problematic from a point of view of fly presentation. And flies as they swim underneath the water. Using careful skill in making leaders and tippet ends. Depending on what size of salmon hook you are using. You can create a tippet end of just the right amount of diameter size and stiffness. So that you get a pretty much 'in line' connection. From the line and leader to the fly. And I think it matters. In fly presentation and how it swims. From the hooking perspective too. I think it matters. I think it even matters from the hookset point of view too. The last thing that one should do maybe. Is to tie the line directly to the round eye. On those up-turned salmon hooks. The steering knot is a better bet. It's worth trying and comparing it to the usual method. That we all used for years. It's only when I saw that steering knot a while back. It made me think. I had been doing it wrong for lots of years. What the steering knot does too. It avoids that thing. Of where the leader knot is allowed to bend and twist and move. Wherever it wants to move to. The steering knot instead, gets rid of all of that.
Another thing that I will mention about hooks. As it is something that Frank Scalish brought up. In relation to his hooks for bass fishing. If you notice on the single salmon hooks. The round eye of the hook. Does not finish like hooks normally do. Which is to turn around and you have a piece of steel that butts tightly against. The steel shank. You see it on most hooks that are out there. In the salmon hooks. There is this tapered piece of steel. That folds back around and lines up with the shank (and the fly dressed when making the fly covers that with lots of wraps of thread). What I noticed Frank Scalish do in his bass hooks. Is he wraps turns of thread and varnish or super glue. Around all of his regular bass fishing hooks. That he uses for soft plastic baits and things. The reason for that Frank explained. Is that when the monofilament or fluorocarbon. Gets twisted around and lodged into that space. Where the hook's eye turns around. And it leaves a narrow gap. Where the hook eye is formed. He explained that is where the line breaks. It gets cut off. So he wraps thread around his bait hooks. At the eye. So as to prevent the monofilament or fluorocarbon. From getting into that tiny gap and getting cut, or weakened. It's how his line has broke off in playing bass. So much so, that he goes to the trouble and expense. Of doing it to his bait hooks.
What is impressive about the single iron salmon hook. Is that it anticipated that. We just have forgotten now. The reason why it was done to begin with. We think it is just a limitation of the manufacturing process. In the old days. Which they kept doing. Because they did not have machines. That were capable of making a real hook eye. This is not the case. They could make a hook eye like on any normal hook. But the single salmon hooks have that feature to them. Where the fly dresser wraps over the tapered steel piece. With the thread wraps. There is nowhere then for the monofilament line to get stuck in. And break off. When playing large salmon in rivers. Who make very fast runs. If one looks carefully at expensive hooks used in saltwater. You'll notice too. There is no gap left at the hook eye. When they bend around the steel to make the eye. That part is welded up and carefully rounded. So that the line has nothing that will cause it to break. I was looking at this recently. In some large saltwater hooks. That are obviously used for very large fish too.
Frank made the very same point though. About 'split rings' on crank baits etc. Where Frank always wants his line to be tied. I was amazed because I would have guessed differently. He always ties directly to the split ring. On his crank bait lures. And the part of the split ring on the crank bait. That he ties the fluorocarbon line to. Is the part of the split ring. That is only one steel diameter. He does not tie the line to the double steel diameter part of the split ring. Why? Because when fishing then. What ends up happening. Is the line falls into the portion of the split ring. Which is narrow. And the knot is weakened or cut. And you lose the crankbait and the fish again. In the exact same problem. As he described with ordinary bait hooks. And the eyes of them. The bass anglers use quite large hooks too. For their worms and baits. So it's more of a factor. Than with smaller hooks (like we would use for trout). What you're doing in bass often. Is attaching a fairly large sized bait hook. To a thin piece of line. And it's a problem. So they actually wrap thread over that part. Where the hook eye turns back, and leaves a narrow space or gap. To avoid the line getting into that and breaking. The salmon hooks avoid that by definition.
If you look at the eye on a dressed salmon treble iron or double iron. Again you'll notice the care that is gone to. To ensure there are no narrow spaces or gaps. At the eyes of treble hooks for salmon. That the leader line can get trapped into and break. We forget about all of this. And I've often complained about the added cost of salmon singles, doubles and trebles (and a few years ago started using ordinary hooks myself). As I could not justify the extra expense. However, I realize now. That the salmon singles, doubles and trebles. Have some features to them. Which are designed around the needs. Of catching very powerful fish on rod and line. Things that they learned too in saltwater. Catching even larger and more powerful fish. But most trout anglers would never have to worry about it (tournament bass anglers like Frank Scalish did, because loss of a ten pound bass in a tournament would cost them plenty). In terms of competition points, and competition winnings. So they tend to have more 'risk' mitigation things. Than fun anglers would have.
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This guy sounds like Elon musk lol