Riot Debunked League's Biggest Conspiracy Theory
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- Опубликовано: 15 фев 2024
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Игры
"There are 4 give-uppers on your team, don't make it 5"
May I remind you, that FF is still 4 to 1
somehow i have 10 or 20 percent surrender losses in my climb i think, and I don't ever remember hitting yes
One game we were winning 30-4, then my team surrendered "cause it's fun"
guess I have to analyze my gameplay to find my fault.
@@LaNoir.Are you not entertained?
Funny that he mentioned "getting a coach." I once had a challenger coach (former Greek league pro) who told me that my account was doomed and in losers queue.
Coaches are still people and can still be flawed and believe in myths or wild theories, even them being "good" at the game doesn't mean they actually know how to teach others or have all the right info, just like Messi might be the best football player in the world it doesn't mean that he could teach another player to be as good as he is nor it mean that he won't believe in certain things that aren't real
when you lose 5 placement on fresh everyone tells you its doomed and to get a new one
A coach needs to teach you how to play better. Just like the Tweet says. Not give you LP. If you want to rank up, hire a booster, not a coach. Really bad comment.
@@pasta5818 While this is true, it's also a more valid metric than the company itself releasing a "study" to prove that company isn't dishonest.
This is like Hershey's releasing a study saying chocolate with high amounts of sugar doesn't cause health problems.
Its like that one teen who said he started smoking while being 14 on twitter,the top reply was someone telling him he is no making it past 16 years
"There are 5 potential giver-uppers on the enemy team and only 4 on yours. Don't make it 5."
Your team start surrender vote -> 4 vote for yes -> you vote for no -> the game ends.
Well Riot Games, I guess I should just type Karthus ult right?
A Karthus player half his worth will never ult because you asked him to, be realistic.
sorry im chat banned. whats that... just ping his r? oh... they got rid of team pings too
@@LoLSquid163 but why are you chat banned tho?
@@liefbreadi got chat chat banned for saying dmb fk
@@mazhermehdi8793 that's pretty tame tho
...
my friend was on a 78% WR streak. he was in plat 1. Last game til emerald.
On said last game, his entire team has sub 50% WRs, with one having a 36% WR.
The enemy team is all positive.
He loses.
This continues for the next 12 games. then he wins one. He thinks that his loss streak is over. It is not.
He is now gold 3. He earns 18 LP and loses 32.
Yeah I have the same story regarding the 30 percent win-rate players when I was about to promote, happened a lot of times since I had 1600 games last season.
Ouch
Yeah I reached plat last season and got such a 35 game loss streak and ebeded silver 4
i demoted from emerald to gold in a similar way
There is NO War in Ba Sing Se !
perfect comment
That's good Joly
SECRET TUNNEL
Yup, same energy
true -- of course they will not admit that there's a loser's queue. I've noticed so many times after having a 4-5 win streak, I get a 5-6 loss streak after that. It's to maintain the rank because if every one's winning, every one's going to rank up.
idk this sounds like something a company trying to hide losers q from us would say
I actually had a 12 games lose streak when I was 2 games away from master and in every game I stomped my lane and was the only one with positive kda but my team was non existent. This vid doesn’t change my mind . It exists. It exists. It exists. It exists. It exists. It exists. It exists. It exists . It exists. It exists. It exists…
I love how all the winning tips are basic generalized: “Do the things and don’t make mistakes.”
I mean..... thats kinda of the point
That's how league is. It's a game about capitalizing on enemy mistakes. People are higher elo because they make far fewer mistakes than their lower elo counterparts.
Like, sure, it sucks that you got dove by 3 people. But that outcome can be minimized by better warding, good wave management, getting enemies lower health so it's riskier to dive etc.
But instead of saying, " yea I should have done that instead."
It's easier to say, "follow your mid, I can't stop a 3 man tower dive."
@@Blackoutdmc actually its a jg diff😂😂
I mean that's exactly advice from T1 Faker...😆
That's exactly how you should view it. Everything has a stochastic effect on the outcome of the game. Best advice is to very critically review your games and see what you could have done different
"If you loose, its probably cuz u are doing something wrong" yea like playing a Ranked game in the first place.
The only thing that's our fault is continuing to queue up and playing this game...
You mean like the time they "debunked" smurf queue only for it to have been in the game the whole time? They just named it something else to avoid responsibility????
It's like the "Totally Not" skin line
"We don't have a smurf queue, what we do to prevent smurfs from playing with low rank players is to put them in the 'Totally not the smurf queue'".
Yeah XD. If they can put 5 silver smurfs against 5 silver smurfs. They can put 2 silver smurfs vs 5 sliver smurfs for 5 games and create losers q. Which would explain why your teammates consistently forget what the right click on your mouse does. Now apply the same logic to every rank, and you get a reliable method to hold people back.
I mean multiple master+ streamers who does challenges are themselves saying that Emerald is elo hell, they wouldnt be saying that if they managed to fly by the rank..
Emerald Elo: biggest ego meets worst mechanics
@@puddingsimon2626 I wouldn't call it the worst mechanics, ppl in Emerald know how to play their champs (micro), but they don't know how to play the game as a whole (macro). But the ego part is certainly true
even worse in bronze, in solo q if anyone steals my kill it is doomed because then they get the gold, maybe a lead and just die due to some stupid reason, when I have a lead I basically never die, even though I also dont do enough cos I dont want to give the enemy team a huge shutdown, especially when my team is loosen
@@I3eXe It varies from person to person. Some people let their macro play carry them to higher ranks without being great at mechanics, and vice versa. Its not really a good idea to generalize an entire rank's playstyle.
@claudeheinrich3613 in that situation try giving shutdowns to useless Champs that's what I do I play assassins so I have a lot of mobility so it might be difficult for you but I can usually end up dying to the support in plat-gold don't know how easy it would be in higher elo though. Or who knows maybe be a kda player idk which is better I'm still in low elo.
I miss the days when the term 'Conspiracy Theory' meant: something crazily entertaining that potentially challenged your critical thinking, and not used as a buzzword to gaslight people
that's because it IS indeed conspiracy theory by definition. and it's the copium sniffers that are gaslighting themselves. show this theory to any statistician in academia and they will laugh your arse out of the campus, for even suggesting something that can be explained by random chance alone. you haven't even beaten the null hypothesis.
The problem is the truth and conspiracy theories are one in the same these days so the definition has been dilluded
I always feel like it get the opposite of this. I have some great games, maybe one of them is a total stomp, then the next few games go the other direction. Overt Plats on their main accounts mangling rank 30 doe-eyed noobie accounts or Plats on their smurf accounts in a premade on a pubstomping crusade. As if Riot is saying, "You are getting too full of yourself. Time to bring down a peg. Here is a teammate that licks the frozen wall in Howling Abyss."
Are you talking about normal games?
@@TheGRAclan Any.
@@Jinkaza1882 normal games barely have mmr. The matchmaking is incredibly loose because the point is to get people into a game as soon as possible and is not really relevant to this discussion.
There's a reality nobody wants to admit either. That we all have good or bad days, that we can go all out in 1 game and be exhausted and fail terribly in another. That we understand 1 matchup but not another. That we have a good team and in the next, we don't. There is so much more than just "we lose, team mates bad because I won last game".
I mean yeah, that's kinda what it used to be at least, as in both teams mmr must be close to equal, if yours is way higher than your rank, or the few divisions, you can guess who the counterbalance needs to be to make the collective team avg mmr equal within "X" division XD.
Noticed the same in this season too, and for the past like 5, as in account wr goes to 75%-> division higher matchmaking-> sudden division lower matchmaking while about 2 of your team mates and indeed wondering if they should lick the forbidden ice cube, while gains stay stupid.
Easiest fix to that is to swap accounts and come back to that one after a week or so, seems like the algorithm takes a while to process or forget what's going on.
This ones important and gets it's own comment,
why the absolute FUCK is the league tutorial on and ONLY ON an employee's twitter?
why is it not in the game?
why is it almost 15 years after release?
Like legit, reword this so its more newbie friendly and put it in the tutorial. Hell, put it in loading screens. PLEASE
I've been asking for a full revamp of the tutorial since s6. The current one doesn't even explain what roles exist, even though you have to choose one to play normals after you finish the tutorial...
It isn't in their best interest for ppl to reach their rank, be content, and stop playing.
Those players wouldn't spend money on skins.
So good onboarding is of low priority, if of any
@@HighLanderPonyYT that's the stupidest thing ever. Everyone gets to the rank they deserve, it's just that most people can't accept the fact they play like a lower rank than they think they actually are
@@HighLanderPonyYT skins help you to get a higher rank or what, i dont get it
that riot said the most stupid thing ever: if u put a top 250 player of all the fucking server they will stomp a low elo game. SERIOUSLY???
Well it does illustrate that one player can be the difference to win and it’s not about an algorithm premaking games
@@teiten3806 yes a top level pro vs 99,8% of the population of the server its the most empty statment ever.
Point being ? It does show that a good player can win regardless of their team, invalidating the concept of loser’s queue
Its really not about losing, its how you lose.Time and time again you lose to diamonds wile you are paired up with autofilled golds
Especially when you get autofilled on any lane who plays a completely different lane like an ADC for jungler... Unless you and your team wins hard you lose cause one player is like birck in that role...
i love the irony of getting an ad before this video for a league coaching software that specifically talked about getting out of losers queue haha
Lul ads, what are those?
Anybody who doesnt believe losersqueue is real is delusional. Literally everyone that plays tons of games, reached high ranked ladder or knows how to capitalize on the queue's system will tell you losersqueue is real. Of course the fcking casino that rigs the machines will tell you they dont righ the machines lmao. Is not a coincidence now they stopped you from checking your teammates stats so you cant dodge
This
I found the best tip to climb is by muting yourself. Especially in emerald. Even if you have good intentions anything you type will tilt any of your teammates. One time I said glhf then my teammate for some reason did a background check on my history then said gg we have a losing streak Shen then the mid afk'd.
Lmao that's hilarious. I remember when those tools came out, I'd be checking the lobby mmr during pick phase
True. Muting yourself keep yours and your alies' mental in check. Chances are if your teammate is typing something usually it's shittalking or infighting, so you're better off without it. Just learn to keep track of your team's actions and you'll be set to go. As a bonus you'll learn to keep track of the map if you didn't already.
Muting myself helped immesurably, enabling me to get diamond rank while almost not playing league at all
Emerald as well. I got tilted last season if I saw you pick shen . I'm tilted already and I dont even have the game anymore on my computer. glhf is like telling me that you are here to relax and not carry the game. and since i have ptsd form playing jg, i bet you would blame me for your suboptimal pick when you have an illaoi taking tower in your face, or when you ult bot and trundle took two of your turrets.
@@user-hf6go4se6m last season understandable. Shen was so bad that the community had to boycott him. He's really good now tho with the new items
@@kevinkarlimperial4717 I see, good luck on your climb then, wish I could still play but I cant buy another computer and have a separate network for the malware ( van gord) that they plan to roll out
Honestly as a vet league player, I learned a long time ago to not value kda. I see my mistakes and try to slowly improve. But there is unfortunately one hurdle that cant be crossed (as a support / top main). If the team's mental collapses, they will blame and then make more mistakes. You can preach, try to give calls, try to improve mental. It sadly just happens, you can't always wins and its a coin flip. I am personally more of an objective and teamfight player, setup situations for my team. At the end of the day though, each person has their own decisions and view. One may see opportunity, where another sees death.
Conclusion : i should have a challenger level gameplay if i want to win my games in diamond because the matchmaking is dogshit but doesn't intentionally want me to lose
The challenger coaching response was the worst one, of course a Challenger would win a Bronze game, but what about a Bronze player wanting to climb to Silver? They need to be a Challenger for that?
Progression for what, ain't am I right?
the example is bad i agree, but if u are a gold lvl player u should be able to consistently carry games in silver and bronze, since u are playing against people below ur lvl. makes sense no ? im only dia, but i can stomp emerald lobbies easily. ofc ill also lose games in emerald, but i can consistently carry most games in emerald without a problem.
taking the low ranks as example is also kinda bad though since the difference in skill between bronze and plat is prolly as big as the difference in skill between a low dia player like me and a master player and further a master player gets shit on by a challenger like a gold gets shit on by a diamond player. the higher u go up in rank the bigger the difference in skill gets. so its way harder for a gold to carry in silver than it is for a master to carry in dia, since the difference in skill between dia and master player is way greater than the difference of skill between gold and silver player.
@@user-tp5jm7th3n I was emerald last season. Had 1600 games last season. I believe riot has certain mechanics in place to help people go back to the rank they reached before. Gold was hard. Platinum was hard. Emerald was hard. Almost got to diamond. I had no job. I played league almost every day and watch streams on my free time. Like me there are many others. I don't think it is fair or healthy for the community to belittle their achievements. Also the game gets harder every year. A silver from last season is technically a higher skilled player the next season even if he is still silver. That's why many feel bad, since its hard to visualize their progression if the visual representation doesn't change.
@@user-hf6go4se6m i dont know if thats belitteling. people just have differen opinions on what is considered a "good" player. e.g. if u tell me u play soccer in the 3rd division in romania i wont really consider u a good player, others would.
Ah yes. Its my fault mid is running it down causing the enemy team to get fed and making it easier to gank me.
Riot obviously knew your mid would run down and put him in your game on purpose 🥱
Its easy! Just dont get 0/11 yasuo on your team!
@@Kaygu_ They gather a lot of data, that is entirely possible, and if they wanted you to lose lp and you still won, good luck next game because they have the perfect yuumi bot to garantee that you lose, since they put you with three other players that the system knows surrender as soon as an afk appears
@@user-hf6go4se6m There no losers queue, take off your black glasses
@@yulian545 Black glasses? Really?
Why would anybody believe what Riot says especially when they give no evidence?
source: trust me bro
It’s the same both ways. They wont tell you 100% if it exist but we cant prove it exist 100% either. Imo it’s just a statistical conjecture, you need a lot of games to even out the truly unwinnable games but that’s not something everyone can do and ends up in something that resembles a losers queue. And that’s a totally different thing from elo hell, people are just making those two terms similar when they are not
y como va a tener pruebas de algo que no existe? Literalmente te puso los argumentos de porque pasa, sos demasiado boludo
@@kivori3438 you can tell just by playing, they give you four 30% wr team mates and their team is 55%+ wr
@@Primimimimimimimi how many times? And how many times its the opposite? And how many times its balanced? In the long run it will be balanced but in the short run its flawed. Its not losers queue its simple statistic. Also even if it was losers queue (which i highly doubt cuz the statistic show it is a short term bias) we still have no 100% proof of it
@@kivori3438 nah, we do have proof, I had 1600 games last season. every time you are about to promote you get the 30 percent win rate players and the snakes that try to make everybody mass report you, plat 2 60 lp, emerald 2 60 lp, gold 2 60 lp, if every time you get to this range the first jg diff comment appears. Is there some sort of tradition that all lol players do, that I didn't know?
Fwiw Strictly speaking i dont actually believe "losers queue" exists in the sense that it causes streaks. But the system feels stacked like crit chance in game. They want you at 50% winrate so the matchmaking tries to give you the most statistically even probability of that then its up to your skills.
But im sitting 70% winrate starting bronze and every time i get more than three wins in a row my next game the avg elo of my team is iron 1 and enemy team is silver 2 and my iron bot and mid literally have no idea what do.
Lost count of the number of times ive seen people type "why are there silvee players in my game!?".
Ive been in a bronze game with gold players on the other team
true, while trying to get out of silver multiple times if i got a to good of a streak i saw and recorded how the enemy team got higher and higher in rank from game to game to the point that i am silver 1 on a 6 game win streak and the enemy team gets borderline platinum players playing like they are on the same room, meanwhile my team gets 1 other silver if i am lucky with the rest being bronze with 0 teamwork nor objective control, like what the hell riot
i know i am not good enough to win games alone like that, i have done it once or twice with a miracle mistake on their part just to get the same type of hard game or even worse the next time i play and my team gets stomped so hard they don't even bother to spam FF they just trow a heavy insult to the usual(if it's the top or mid they attack the jungle and both the adc and supp attack each other) and leave the game
i don't buy the excuse of "the mmr is getting inflated because of the wins" because the LP gains/loss ratio would reflect it i but it barely moves and doesn't even get to +30 at the best case and doesn't go below -23 at worst, the matchmaking is way to on the nose that they want to drag me back to 50% WR lol
and to be fair i have been on the other side of the coin from time to time, where the enemy team is just so bad for their rank that the win just feels artificial and dirty, at least is funny seeing their team implode in chat like rabid hamsters attacking each other, it's nice to be outside of that beast cage for once
I feel that. i am B4, was Autofilled ADC (Main Jungle), my Supp has been Iron 2 and enemy Botlane was premade (adc G4 and Supp B3). So much fun to play
It's prob also an anti smurf type of thing. Systems can't perfectly rate player's perfomance so they might just put "unexpectedly" good player (luck or skill whatever) against stronger (rank, wr, etc. But ideally comparable in some stats) players.
As well as overall weird matchmaking shenanigans like when someone got a bad day/streak of lossess and gets into lower rank lobbies, some from lower rank are on a hot streak and get put a bit higher, some who barely play rank and their data is skewed and not that accurate, etc. Loads and loads of factors, bullshit, tilting messes up everything
They want you at 50% winrate so the matchmaking tries to give you one-sided games to bring your winrate to the desired 50% sooner or later🙂
Companies can just lie... and this is for sure one time
Riot straight up coming out with the most obvious lie ever? Hell nah thats never ever happened
can you prof this is a lie ?
@@xminus5561in 2020 every time i enter a promo of a division or league, my teammates would always come from a lost game and enemies from a win.
Besides promos, entering a losing streak would put you with teammates that were losing the same amount
@@xminus5561 Many players can see Riot is lying because many are addicted to the game. They are bigger authorities in the game than most riot employees will ever be. Some players play more than 8 hours in a day for an entire year. You don't think they will be able to see trends? Nerds in school represented your school in math competitions. Are you going to tell them that even though they are geniuses they are not allowed to draw conclusions on the math problem they have spent the most time in?
@@user-hf6go4se6m this is not an answer to my question. People think they can win in a Casino or don't know how chances work. I asked for a prof.
no one said loser's queue has to be intentional or a 'conspiracy', it could be an unintended bug in the matchmaking algorithm that riot isn't even aware of.
Bug? Players are reaching now, even Vandiril won't make that claim lol.
@@cye2310 yea because vandiril makes no unsubstantiated claims. as @uberneanderthal pointed out, "it could be". it could very well be intentional, they'd definitly NOT tell us, and it could very well NOT be intentional. There is an incentive for riot to give you loses and/or wins in a row, and it isn't a super farfetched idea that they maybe do (or don't). Vandiril wouldn't report on it because if you know anything about Vandiril, whenever he posts anything, it is with footage and forms of direct proof. Without seeing something like the algorithm for matchmaking and mmr, you couldn't really proof or deny it's existence 100%.
There is no losers Queue, just a special military operation queue
There is no way to debunk the losers queue in wild rift its wild out there
Bro it does exist, I was top 20 Darius one time, i won 8 in a row and then i kept losing 6-7 in a row with a 10/4/7 avg kda, can't tell me it doesn't exist there
@@Artem-gg6bq bro you understood nothing from this video. you literally wasted 20 minutes of your life
The video is 13min 56sec long. How did you rounded it up by 6 minutes? Lmao@@turtumurtu3295
@@turtumurtu3295 assuming he even watched the full thing
@@turtumurtu3295 The point of this video is that if you'd put a Challenger in, say, Silver 4 queue, he'd win most of the games.
Which is an absolutely room temperature IQ take on the issue.
I've done that personally, where I'd be single-handedly responsible for 80+% of kills in the game and no enemy turret or inhibitor was ever taken without my explicit permission and ultimately win by literally 1v5 pentakill'ing the enemy team under their Nexus, but, you know what... WHY I WAS IN THOSE MATCHES IN THE FIRST PLACE?
Wasn't the system supposed to give me people with similar MMR, thus some semblance of similar skill level and balance?
If I can so thoroughly outclass people who are supposed to be at the same level as I am, then why it can't happen the other way?
Why does it happen?
What's the chance that 9 out of 10 people in the same match have "a bad day"?
The amount of times im on a lose streak and see that the enemy team is constantly getting higher ranked and better premades than my team is shockingly high. When I start losing I start paying more attention to the "quality" of players on each team and very often ill see the enemy team be plat+ and premade(with like one silver or bronze) while my team is around silver/gold and all randos.
Excuses
Git gud
@@kingofdragons7 ok you try to carry a team full of random silvers and gold vs a team of premade plat and diamonds. They are just fundamentally better at the game.
It's even worse when there's people who tilt more than tilted towers and start raging at each other
@@MSusername69get better
yea yea sure dosent prove shit you aint fooling me riot
So ur telling me I reached emerald-1 94 LP in 15 games with a new account but kept getting matched up with Silvers and Golds on a Solo Queue is normal? Huh ok.
Next time when ill have a 2-16 Yasuo mid i will say "Is oky mate, is not you, is me, i am the bad one."
He just trying for the 20 death power spike so he can giga carry
Honestly thats even greater mystery. Not everyone agrees that loosingq exist, but yasuo, teemo, yone, kata on your team plays 10 times worse compared to average enemy yasuo, teemo, yone, kata. Thats sounds unbeliavable on paper by any common logic, but thats literally how it feels.
@@sinner5452If this phenomenon really existed, it would be immediately identified as fucking mathematical anomaly
Yasuo can still ult the enemy team with 20 deaths and capitulate on your proper plays, so yea, it really is your fault.
Do you happen to be a Yas main?@@Relhio
uh no they blatantly said that winning or losing games will impact what kind of players you get. so when you lose that one game youre going to get people who are worse than what you were before you lost and if those people are worse than you whose to say that the wont be the determining factor to your next loss? which means now youre getting team mates that are substantially worse than you causing you to loss more. RIOT confirmed said they are making MMR and ELO 1 thing and no longer 2 systems. the more you lose the worse team mates you get giving you a losing streak.
source?
There is no war in Ba Sing Se
Let’s just forget the thousands of streams showcasing people throwing on purpose and all the people smurfing and people buying higher ranked accounts cause they are hardstuck and the people clearly getting boosted wether by a friend or someone being paid. None of these would ever affect me cause I’m simply just bad at the game right?😢
yeah mate, make sure you clutch onto that copium of a minor occurence as if the chances of throwers on your team isn't smaller than that on the enemy's as if the chances of you being bad at the game, isn't a more likely explanation. there are 5 potential throwers on enemy's team, only 4 on yours. do the math. don't let me ruin your copium, buddy 😂😂
Another one of rito's lies.
Are you gonna tell me that one game i get a mid that goes 0/6 in lane, lose the game, decide to go next and then get a top that goes 0/11, also losing the game, and it's just a coincidence?
While on other days, i get multiple good games with actual decent players and have a 10 game win streak?
and it's not just one-off, it's pattern-like, happening since the day i began queueing for ranked. One day, i get all inters, another day, actually good players. Are you really gonna say that things like that happen for years and it's just coincidence?
Yep, definitely a coincidence. Your fault buddy. Skill issue, get good noob
Sarcasm
I got Challenger in s11 and still playing randomly, but I'm like 95% sure loser queue exist to some extend. Just look at how many people have winning/losing streak, the stats of the people in the game, etc. It's even more obvious the lower you go in the elos, loser queue is a fact but I don't think it impacts your overall winrate if you just play 1k games per season (Which I do believe is the objective of Riot Games.
Debunking is now tweeting "NOT TRUE LOL"
fr this didn't prove anything
its tiring when riot wants you to be goku every single game and have you play as if you were 2 ranks higher just to win
I notice this. I play adc, have a match history full of mvp/svp, and the game 9/10 times spawns me with a csing, barely playing, feeding, randomly roaming during fights, or afk, support, or other teammates. The enemy team seems to be on point every game compared.
maybe if you can't play like a player from 2 ranks higher, you arent a player from 2 ranks higher?
@@zinfuldreams1709 i probably can for the most part but like i said its tiring to always be the main character in every game, this would be the only time my ass wants to be a side character and have an actual balanced match
@@Astroqualia this happens to me in emerald, but emerald is known for that stuff and i dont get why it has to be that way
There is no war in Ba Sing Se.
Tyler1 says losers queue exists and he has more authority on this than anybody at Riot.
lmfao
He actually does. It would be stupid to think otherwise.
he also states that hes 6'5. i wouldnt belive anything that man said. he only says it, coz its good for business
I was challenger for 3 different season and just last season I was stuck in emerald elo for a long time. I knew what I had to do and got out of there but it was a super hard process. Because emerald elo has both plat level players and diamond level players at the same time. If we consider a higher elo emerald player with a good game knowledge, the most likely matchmaking happening is there is 2 or 3 more players on their level and it is most likely got matched against each other pretty evenly. The problem with that is since league is a game about punishing mistakes, the losing player generally decides the fate of the game. In lower ranks, I high elo player can carry their games because even winning lanes in those games usually make the same mistakes. However in higher elos like low diamond, you ahve to play like a faker to solo carry the your games and if riot even sends you a losing streak guy in your team, u probably are doing 4v6 against players that have good understanding of the game. When I am in masters, some guy decides not to play because they are tilted and got 0 2 in the lane, everyone would just let them end because there is 0 chance that you win afterwards.When riot talks about impact of a player, they usually disregard dia+ elo and who are stuck there.
Yeah! I've seen people like alois and sinerias struggling some emerald games due to the disparity of skill levels, emerald is such a failure of a rank
They are definitely disregarding high elo in this shown post, with statements such as "if a challenge player were in your place, he would have won the game". He just somehow assumes that only iron players are complaining about losers queue, because "dia+ players couldnt possibly complain about our terrible matchmaking". What if its challenger matches, RIOT, what then huh? "Faker wouldve won the game if he were in your place"? XD
@@itachi4761 I mean it was the same shit before emerald, it was just called Diamond 5. There's nothing they can do about that transition, it's a natural mentality and skill barrier. Like he said in the video, you are the only common factor in your games. If you are good enough, you will eventually get there.
but how is it that in order to win eg. a bronze game you have to be better than bronze level, eg gold because that means only Smurfs can consistently win and for people at the actual rank it is a coin flip until they are lucky and climb up higher enough times to play against better ppl and improve or somehow learn macro even though macro in low elo is scuffed. In all guides it says you only need mechanics to get to silver but how are people like me and my duo who basically always do well (60% win rate) still stuck in bronze/low silver@@avendurree
@@xyriliawhitestrake7263 I cant talk about how it was before emerald like you said about previous Diamond 5 because i wasnt good enough to reach that far back then. But that's just one division, 100LP to grind through. The entirety of Emerald is 500LP with usually HUGE difference in skill between teams.
I agree with you that it's a natural mentality and skill barrier but keeping your mental up and grinding through 100LP is way easier than 500LP when you're struggling :D
If i have to 1v9 the majority of my games to climb im not interested
That's how I promoted to plat. As soon as I saw that my laners wouldn't rotate for first dragon, they were dead to me. I find it funny that teammates sometimes try to make you lose on purpose, but you have so much momentum that they can't reel you back. To promote to emerald I noticed that now jg's were as fast as me around plat, but I would still get laners that would't rotate, so I became a laner/ADC and rotated for drags. Was the easiest elo I got, felt like I got carried to emerald.
@@user-hf6go4se6m your comment is the dude bro equivalent of just lift bro. You cant carry most games if 3 players int
@@optamis1989 You are right. I believe the game is rigged even if my comment didn't sound like it. My promotion to emerald was very unnatural. Felt like Riot thought I had enough games and put me in a massive winners q. I've been seeing a lot of comments saying they experienced the 30 percent win rate players when they were about to promote, just like me.
Yeah, saying it doesn't exist is like Activision saying SBMM doesn't exist. There is too many evidence for it to believe them anymore.
Activision literally published an article talking about their SBMM and how it works like a week ago, they've never denied it.
@@KaiHydra Yeah, now after literally 5 fkin years. It existed since Modern warfare 2019 and they just now admitted to it. Up until recently they were denying it as well, also, they admitted only after one of their ex workers leaked it
Just an Idea, I think RIOT should have an "Honor level queue" even for just normal matchmaking which pairs Honor 5 with a lobby of Honor 5s to avoid people that quit or dodge a lot... my last 3 games consisted of 1 dodge, 1 quit early and 1 who just gave up and afked undertower.
ah yes, my 10 to 30min normal queue wasn't enough, lets add honor macthing to it !
@@moruemourue9692why is your wait time 30 min? bro just be normal and play at a normal skill level and your queues will be like 3 min anytime of fay
So you want a full support mains match?
Cuz only the support gets honor votes.
People would rather not honor a teammate than admit that someone on their team did something good.
Fun experiment. Create a spreadsheet and each game record the respective rank/win rate/mmr of each team by role. After 100 games analyze the win rate. I found i had around a 30% chance to get 3 or more players on my team with lower/negative win rates and guess who won those games...
i mean...if losers queue exists, then half of the playerbase is having a great time in winners queue lol and elo hell doesn't exist for just as many people as those who do complain and cry. you can't have a winner without a loser and vice versa. Only difference is, you may feel entitled to be the winner, which is human nature, even much more so whenever anything remotely competitive gets involved.
@@magical571 nothing about what I commented is complaining or whining. But if there is a large statistical variance of getting significantly worse players on one team it's interesting to say the least.
@@magical571 it may be too complex for your brain so I'll make it simpler. If 2 out of 5 players are good and 4 out of 5 players are good on another team, the team with 4 good player win.
@@optamis1989 reread his comment captain thin skin
@@sgtpatton lol, I understand it just fine
"Losers queue doesn't exist"
Tweets Riot Phroxzon while maniacally laughing to himself
Funny how they claim it doesn’t exist yet the people that made the matchmaking probably don’t work there anymore.
that's what I was thinking, and they probably already promoted the HR people with business degrees into the IT roles, so you can even be more skeptical
I would really like to see that Challanger player trying to carry a Briar top that was 3 levels below Aatrox and died 4 times in 3 minutes, and my bot lane that did the exact same thing, and Annie mid lane who just stood under tower 24/7. Really want to see him carry that.
some games u cant win, even challengers say that. the point is that if u consistently play perfectly u will climb no matter what. u will have these games u cant carry. even faker has them, but he will def win more of them, than lose and sometimes he will even carry the "unwinnable" games. hell i can remember a game in season5 i played. it was my diamond promotion series and we literally won 3v5. my jgl and adc went afk at min 13 and i managed to win as gp with a ziggs and sona.
Anyone who’s been playing league enough experienced a huge streak of games where no matter how unfocused and little impact you have, your team just wins. Conversely the opposite is also true, you wake up feeling good, playing the best you’ve ever played in a while and lose 10 games in a row because you got two lanes feeding the shit out of the enemy.
We can’t prove it exists? You can’t prove it doesn’t.
Riot accidentally made smurf queue with matchmaking changes. I wouldn't be surprised if the accidentally made losersq and winnersq depending on your performance and mmr
Does anyone noticed that almost in every match this poor Kindred had EVERY LANE countered to death? Just look when he was filled as ADC Tristana vs. Yasuo and Teemo... He literally can only walk around them unable even to land an auto attack because of never lasting Wind Wall and Teemo's Blind Dart.
IF loser's queue doesn't exist, then there's something seriously wrong with their matchmaking algorithm.
or you just have a bad day statistically and are ranked close to what you should be. Imagine thinking that you can write a perfect algorithm to create purely balanced matchmaking that somehow accounts for the whims and oddities of 10 human beings at any given moment of the day 💀
The "loser's queue" is the issue with their matchmaking algorithm. Everyone in this conversation is arguing past one another.
Loser's queue absolutely 100% exists, and whether or not it's intentional remains to be seen.
That's exactly what's going on. Loser's Queue doesn't exist, but it just feels like it does due to how the algorithm works.
I completely agree here: so many of us are careful, considerate, ward, show up to objectives... having to carry the match is NOT or should not be the defining attribute of a winning player.
it's just survivorship bias, you only remember having 5+ losing streaks, and not the 5+ winning streaks
I understand... my bot going 0/13 in 15 minutes is my fault, will try and be better in the future
0/13 ? Casuals, my bot goes 3/24
@@FNXMARIAN your bot gets kills? Must be their good day
It's impressive. I doubt anyone would die that many times in that time while playing like a bot. It's like they're actively throwing their lives away to feed that hard.
@@HighLanderPonyYT The issue is, on bot lane in iron through gold people actively throw the game if they die once in first 5 mins, taking things for granted and then you're left with a fed kai'sa that melts your hp even if you've gotten to enemy inhib
@@phantom1a2 plat and emerald is the same
The best to avoid lose streaks is to NOT PLAYING RANKED I've been playing for more than three years and I played less than two hours of ranked and it was enough for my entire life I rather enjoy the game and be unranked or be master+ and mentaly ill
You're not wrong tho. I just quit for many reasons, and mental exhaustion is one of them. In the end it's just a game, games are supposed to be fun. I'm with you there.
I stopped playing solo queue ages ago. But I would like to know 100's of things what I could do to stop 2-3 of my teammates from going AFK at 5minutes in multiple games. Any good player that riot speaks of please tell me what I could have done other than not play the game itself.
the statistics for a whole team to be trolls or inters vs a team of smurf is so very low... why does it keep happening then?
It's very likely to happen if your mmr is increasing at a rapid pace. You get matched with people worse than you, against enemies better than your team, and if you continue to perform well, your mmr will continue to climb rapidly. If you lose, it does not increase at such a fast pace. Sometimes, you are the weaker end of your team, and the reason your team looks like they are trolling is because matchmaking expected them to carry and by performing poorly they look like they're just another feeder.
For this to happen to the same person over an extended period of time is incredibly unlikely on a natural account that does not have an inflated mmr.
I just cant really agree with riots take on this, sure losers queue doesnt actually exist but saying its my fault if i lose a game whilst the jungler isnt doing anything and my mid and top consitantly lose their lane resulting in a fed irelia, aatrox or katarina whilst we're just chilling in botlane being ahead of the enemy, how am i supposed to influence the game as a support player to win that type of game.
And no matter how fed I, an adc, is and how many items I have, there ALWAYS is some Trundle/Rengar/Yasuo and etc. who don't give a single fck about my kda, kiting skills or OP items in my inventory - they got their one item power spike after double killing my solo lane teammate and his premade jungler 🎉
Roam, ward, ping, play well mechanically in skirmishes and fights. "Chilling in bot lane" does nothing. I'm a support main and I climbed to Master with support. And it doesn't matter if you play Zyra or Milio or Braum, you can influence the game a ton outside of your lane. Not always and certainly less than other roles but it is possible.
Also, this is not Riot's take. It's Phroxzon's take. There is no official Riot statement on the matter and Necrit is kinda dumb calling it a "debunk" since nothing definitive was proven. You need to see the code to know for sure. But as far as experiment go, this is pretty much debunked. There is no loser's queue almost certainly. And when it comes to climbing, you don't need to win every match. So as a support, you'll lose plenty of unwinnable games. But you can also be the reason your team loses a perfectly easy winnable game or be the hero that wins an extremely hard match with a clutch play or ward or ping or smart itemization.
Support, according to Riot August is the least influential role BUT it is mostly about being the less bad support. The worse support loses more than any other role. Based on MMR, better supports don't win more than other roles but worse supports lose more. So as long as you play a lot and play well, you'll climb as support. Just because it seems impossible doesn't mean it is. I saved games as Lulu, as Blitz and as Nami. I solo carried plenty as Zyra. I changed the course of a terrible match with a good W and R on Renata. I can't always save the match. I have replays on RUclips where I literally have a troll teammate in low Master that simply decides to not only not play and feed but take resources from other teammates. It happens. But it's so rare. If you all play to win, you will have plenty of influence, especially if you are fed with you bot. Type "protect Twitch" and you might influence your Trindle Top to use R on the Malphite that Ult him so you can melt him, get a Triumph proc and destroy the enemy team. Will that happen? Probably not. But it could. And in the games that it does happen, is when you make those gains and climb.
You don't climb by winning easy matches. You climb by playing consistently better than the opponent and changing the odds.
S13 split2, 80 games, 59%, e4 from s2.
S14 split1, above 100 games, 44% wr, g2 from p1 and a 15x lose streak.
Riot match making? @@SiMeGamer
I agreed. One thing a support could do is roam even if it seems to look like a losing game. It rough if the game is just beginning and all of top and mid is already down 3 deaths. If they stop fighting and stand back a bit, it works quite well but if they keeps on just fighting and fighting and feeds, it will be more rough. But a good start is roaming between mid and bot. Staying with adc is a must but for example, if your adc backed and you don't need to go back, don't just stand around bot lane, try to go mid or even just wards in between mid and bot river. And if you accomplish nothing while roaming to mid, it's no big deal because you wards those bushes and gives visions for your teammates. And some games are just impossible if both of top and mid feeds the hell out of their laners and the jungler seems to be lost in the jungle. Sometimes it's good to accept defeat but don't say anything negative, play out the game and do your best. Don't let the game or people within the game dwells in your head and ruined your mood for the next game. It's just not worth a headaches. Keeps the positive mindset and you'll win more often and lose a bit but don't get discourage.
Positive or negative mind set. Who cares, its lose anyway.@@hsa362
I thought when I won too much they place me with bad people so I lose.
Uh, isn't that a lie though? The "For ranked, we match you on your rating and that's all." Wasn't it confirmed that there's a game system in place to keep you around 50% win/loss ratio? If so, it's a straight up lie lol. He's making it sound like there's nothing more to it, when there could be a system wrapped in that package
“a challenger would win your unwinnable game”
yeah when the top players in the world who spend their life on this game are telling me its real, id trust them over Riot PR posting tbh
Yeah my team throwing 3 times in a row is of course solely my fault...
yes, git gud, skill issue, cope
@@ligilokranz6556 With your answer, I can't stop wondering who needs to cope with something...
I understand this here. Nothing is wrong with losing but losing when players can't manage their lanes, feed, troll, bad attitude I mean what am I to do I can carry a full team when the enemy team is steam rolling 3 lanes. But of course pple gonna say your bad and get good. It is what it is
everyone gets teams that throw the game, difference is some people are high elo and get troll teams, and some are low elo and get troll teams, if the game is unfair then get good at playing the unfair game like the players ranked higher do. There is no one with permanent winnersQ or losersQ. It is literally skill issue not saying you are bad, but you have to do better.
Having to do lots of games to even out the unwinnable ones to the stomps isnt the proof of a losers queue. More of a proof of a flawed ranking system
I've had coaches telling me again and again that I was unlucky af to be having consistently shit players on my team. Also, most of those tips don't apply to SA servers lmao
I had a Master friend make a smurf account to carry me out of SIlver, SILVER! After around 30 games he straight up gave up and said "the teams you get are uncarriable, what the fuck is wrong with your account man, just make a new one" I won't make a new one, got 12 years worth of exclusive cool shit on this lol.
@@tennolife9930 if he muted all and only focused on playing the game, it is very unlikely that he wouldn't be able to climb. My guess is he got caught up in chatting with them or at the very least was reading it (and probably pings too) and lost focus. The idea of making a new account because you lose games is also dumb.
Don't get me wrong, naturally you will get terrible teammates, especially in this elo (and he was probably not used to having that bad teammates, which can definitely affect his gameplay), but so are the enemy. If you're a master player, there s just no way you can't climb
@@anhuro8558 I'm not master, he is, and he made the account to help me get out of silver, and he gave up.
Also you're saying he isn't used to bad teammates, and am I? You think I like it when I win my lane 90% of time and lose game because even if I am 10/1, I can't do much against enemy mid who is also 10/1 and a 15/2 ADC as well, you just can't carry those.
what about autofilled jgl vs a non filled jgl ? or the fact that we get a supp filled on mid a jgl filled on supp etc etc in 1 game ?
That's not loser queue, that's just auto fill lol.
This is literally just auto-filled system. I'm a support, I will get filled from time to time. When it comes to getting filled mid, I'm able to play it no problem but if I'm filled jg, I try to swap or dodge entirely because I know jungle is not a role I can do so by dodging, I don't make losses for myself nor my teammates. I rather do this and lose some LP and wait 5 minutes out than losing more LP for myself and taking a lot of my teammates LP down along with me. But not everyone is like me, some will just play it and ruin games for you and others. It has nothing to do with other things but the auto-filled system.
Last I checked there was a 50% FORCED winrate right? At the very least the matchmaking is rigged AF. Been playing since season 3 and it has only gotten worse over time.
Yeah somehow I have an exact 50% winrate with 500+ games
No way it is not rigged
@@musicaltarrasque what? Forced wr isnt a thing at all but the more games you play the closer to 50% you will probably be because you probably get to the rank you deserve and then win about 50% of your games. Thats just how like any normal system would work and why, if you play a lot of games, a 52% wr is good because it indicates you are climbing over time. People with over 60% winrates are usually smurfing or habitually swap accounts because they do stuff to manipulate mmr to get good lp gains/losses and try to streak to a new peak instead of grinding an account. The fact is that you are probably at the rank you deserve and your win rate reflects that.
WRONG. Keep believing that.@@trendymirror
@@trendymirror The thing is . . .
This is in unrated
Which is not supposed to have mmr
@@marcr7230 ok so you keep believing that you deserve an insane wr when you don't. I am sure you will improve at the game with that mindset. You literally handicap your chances of improvement because you feel like it is rigged without evidence.
My personal experience with "Loser's Queue" was last year Split 1. I was playing pretty well and winning most of my games. My winrate was around 50-55% and I managed to get to Silver 1 and was excited to get Gold and stop playing for the season rewards. So according to Riot's MMR System, I should be matched with players of equal MRR.
For the next twelve games, I proceed to get players that are unranked, first timing a champion, inter's, trolls, or are having one of their own bad games and I fall to Silver 4. I can honestly say I was responsible for 2 of those losses. I played bad one game and took some important kills the other game (I play support). Every time I was playing to win, and would have the best stats on my team, but was powerless against the players that had more influence on the game than me. I stopped playing Ranked altogether that year cause that losing streak was just devastating.
This year, I'm playing again, but when I lose, I stop playing for the rest of the day. Seems to be working so far. I'm able to make better decisions and even able to ping or type what I need my team to do to win, when my mind isn't fueled by frustration.
Support can feel really shitty when you're not playing a glass cannon hypercarry support like Zyra or Lux and your team isn't carrying itself.
"Just dont die, ez challenger"
You were not responsible for 2 losses. You were responsible for all of them. This is Silver. The game isn't that sophisticated and you made, mostly likely, over a thousand mistakes in that losing streak. The fact that you are playing for the rank rather than to improve is the fundamental problem. You went in to get Gold instead of getting better which would get out that Gold. Perhaps it's not the rank you seek but the skin reward. Well, then don't expect anything. The skin is there to reward a certain level of skill or dedication to playing ranked (in Silver and below). I'd recommend shifting your approach.
The fact you stop playing after a loss is great, mainly for the fact you play in short focused bursts. It's usually better to play 2-3 matches regardless (because strong focus lasts for about 2 hours for us humans) but regardless it's a good step in the right direction. Taking ranked seriously and trying to play AND LEARNING! is imperative to climbing. League is a logarithmic skilled game. Getting better at CSing by 0.5 per minute on average is like getting better by 100% skill in CSing. You die to one less gank on average per match, is a huge improvement in laning and jungle tracking. It's only a tiny number but in League it's all that matters. Landing an extra skillshot and farming an extra minion can change the course of a match. And when you play hundreds or thousands of matches over years, it adds up. Challenger players don't farm 10 CS per minute and never die to ganks. They just do these things a lot more consistently among other skills. They can anticipate things because other stuff is automated. While you have to focus 90% of your brain power to farm under tower, they only need 10% and the rest is dedicated to analyzing the game state. With this 10% they not only got all 6 minions while you got 4. They also now know the enemy roamed and it gives them a window to reset and come back on the map stronger for the objective that's coming up in 50 seconds. There are so many tiny things in the game that matter, but until you learn that, you would never understand. I analyze my own games and make notes and both in wins and losses I can find at minimum 2-3 game losing mistakes and dozens of smaller optimizations I could make to clicking, skill usage, camera movement, etc.
There is no loser's queue. There are just losers with a sht mentality. Play ranked to improve. Not for a shiny border or a skin. Those come as a consequence of proven skill. Give higher ranked players new accounts or old "broken" accounts and they will get back to their rank very quickly. The system is good. All you have to do is queue the fk up and take it seriously.
And if you don't believe me, well, prove the opposite. After every ranked match, do an analysis of your team and the enemy team. See who is autofilled, on a losing streak, a genuine trolls account, a Smurf, etc. After 100 matches, see if you results are statistically more significant than a fking coin flip. (If you do this experiment I recommend playing seriously and I promise you will climb at the same time - you'll both find that there is no loser's queue and that climbing is easy if you focus on improvement and playing well). Good luck.
I have 55% win rate and on my main 60% but I still dont climb or even demote cos I get +23 and -35 lp. Is so annoying
@@SiMeGamer preach
My brother in christ this is literally "There Is No War in Ba Sing Se" personified. Of course riot is gonna say there's no Losers Queue. It would just make them look horrid if they admitted to this
copium
*logic@@felpudini
@@HighLanderPonyYT oh yes im losing cause of riot not my fault, you are right
@@felpudini oh right yea i forgot my feeding jungler inting all game because he wants to troll is my fault or when peopel go afk for 5th game in a row but isnt banned is also my fault i guess the solution is to not play therefore i cnt be at fault for my team doing nothing
Does anyone noticed that almost in every match this poor Kindred had EVERY LANE countered to death? Just look when he was filled as ADC Tristana vs. Yasuo and Teemo... He literally can only walk around them unable even to land an auto attack because of never lasting Wind Wall and Teemo's Blind Dart.
Loser queue exists, they just won't admit it
Some say debunked, people who look at the actual data and win/lose ratios provided by 3rd party programs realize this is Riot going, "NUH UH!" It's Riot again unwilling to deal with their self caused issues in the quene and again resorting to telling players to, "Git Gud." It's crazy to see how out of touch they have become since season 1.
Today I learned it’s my fault that my bot lane is 0/20 before 15min
Maybe you aren't putting enough pressure in your own lane? If you're so good, why don't you roll dps?
I'm frustrated with Phrozon's argument because it lacks real evidence and just throws around basic facts. The game's matchmaking system seems rigged, with players going on winning or losing streaks too frequently to be coincidental. It feels unfair that the game seemingly puts players in "winners" or "losers" queues, rather than creating balanced teams from the same division. This leads to matches where one team is clearly superior, making it impossible to change the outcome based on individual performance. It's frustrating because it feels like the system is manipulating results, regardless of how well I actually play.
you are asking to prove a negative, what evidence should they use to prove that something isn't there?
@aylanamikio5912, I don't think the problem is imaginary. Many players consistently experience winning and losing streaks. This recurring pattern indicates a potential flaw in the ranked system. To demonstrate the existence of a "losers queue," we need to analyze a large dataset of player match histories. By examining how often streaks occur, whether they're wins or losses, we can uncover underlying issues. It's disappointing that Phrozon overlooked this crucial aspect, given the abundance of available league statistics.
@@Jack-kf1tn if it truly is fair, then you are BOUND to have streaks. i don't know how well versed you are in statistics, but what necrit explained about losing or winning 7 games in a row is correct. a 50/50 chance doesn't at all mean you'll win one match then lose another right after and so on.
@magical571, I'm fully aware of this reality. However, it's worth noting that the frequency of streaks might be higher than expected. In a truly random system, streaks would occur sporadically, without any artificial influence such as MMR. Herein lies the crux of the matter: MMR can lead to players winning an excessive number of matches, some of which they shouldn't, and vice versa. A completely random system, where the likelihood of winning or losing each match is equal, would mitigate the issue of streaking significantly. I don't see that the current system gives any player "fair" odds. Its either you are definitely more likely to win, or you are more likely to lose. It's rare to see the in between which is what I would like to see more of.
@@Jack-kf1tn So you want to have a "truly random independant" distribution with 10 HUMAN behind the keyboard ? Maybe loosing make some people tilt and they play worse, which brings in more loose? Maybe they discovered an OP meta champion and build and win more ? Maybe the statistical distribution is already correct and you are fixating on some"bad" streaks instead of seeing the big picture ?
Losers queue is when 3 of my teamates go 0/10 in 20 minutes
A serial killer that killed 20 ppl would always say that probably they only got missing
How many times do they want to "debunk" losers queue
The same amount of times people pretend it exists I imagine.
Probably the same amount of times the community insists on it being real and ignoring the actual creators of the game
Riot: It is most likely your fault you lost because you didn't try hard enough.
Meanwhile, my adc is afk and jungle is inting by running into the enemy turret to feed the enemy toplane.
Or maybe that time where you go on a lose streak because there is that one player that is boosted that always becomes your teammate in subsequent matches. Like, how?
but loser's queue does mathematically exist, like undeniably so, and this tweet proves it
because you are matched on your mmr and not your LP, the system will try to match you with players around your skill level, but because mmr adjusts slower than LP, no matter how good you get, you'll usually lose way more LP than you gain, even at a 50% winrate. You need a 60% or more winrate, which essentially requires someone to be a smurf several divisions higher than what they play at. Being better than your entire team consistently isn't enouhg, and that's what all these people are frustrated about.
riot lies about trolls being banned when in reality you can feed 10 kills in less than 5 minutes and not be banned. So if they lie about that, what is there to say they don't lie about anything else?
and they lie about how small of a problem smurfing is in league but of course they wont tell us that because if they did that then people wouldnt play the game and they need everyone with 50 alt accounts to keep playing
Ahh the true modern day gaming experience of being gaslit by the developers.
Idk man going on a 12 game win streak with amazing teammates that aren't toxic and do well, just to have 8 games in a row with newly bought accounts that rage quit the game against enemies all in win streaks seems kindof suspect
Also, while i dont think losers queue is a thing, saying winning a game is 50-50 is a very narrow way of looking at such a complex game with so many variables. Even your side of the map changes the winrate, so saying its equivalent to a coin toss is pretty redundant
They dont want us figuring out all the real bs going on behind the scenes to keep you playing and paying 😂 Not just riot btw
Exactly.
I don't understand the argument that "if a challenger* player were in your place, he would have won the game". Uh. Yeah. He's among the best in the world at the game I'M IN FUCKING SILVER. I shouldn't have to play at a challenger level to win a silver game. That's absolutely absurd.
*edit: typo
THIS ONE! THIS IS THE COMMENT! I play like plat (proved by my plat in flex rn) in bronze solo and that doesnnt even work
Facts.
That's just people saying that you need to learn and improve, there's very few people reaching high elo on talent alone
You also shouldnt play against smurfs, when you're climbing in low elo, where is the logic in that one? Like, "just dont die, play better against a smurf bro"? XDDDD
Also, I wonder how would they apply that statement to challenger streamers who believe losers queue exists. "Another challenger wouldve won that game"??? lmao
The interesting thing is; there have been a lot of instances where a challenger level player goes down into the depth of true shitlow to demonstrate how to perform well with bad teammates, and often times when they get one of those horrific games they end up losing the game with a nuts scoreline. While it is true that pretty much everyone is bad at correctly assessing an unwinnable game, they do actually exist.
Players: Riot is using engagement based matchmaking.
Riot: no.
Players: prove it.
Riot: if you lose you are bad.
...
Show us the code!
No way necrit, who doesn't experience the 30% wr teammates on ranked, brings up tft meta (you rank up playing by the strongest comp, it has always been the same)
I think that the narative that "a challenger player reaches challenger" is so stupid. I mean, I guess there are iron players that think they should be diamon, but I suppose that is more of an outlier. Anyway, I think more iron people think they should be bronze/silver (same goes for others, like a gold player think he should be platinum/emerald, so comparing them with the challenger players is dumb)
Of course most of the times your are the common factor in your losses, and you should focus on improving your play, as it is the only one you have controll over.
And there are games, where the worst enemy players got carried by 1 people. Who cares, if 3 from 5 played well in your team, and enemy have 2 dogshits. Somehow a 2/1 dia 1 hitted 3 people, got fed, and we couldnt do anything with it. Those 2 dogshit didnt deserved that win, and we deserved it. And than what about that 1 diana?
In wildrift, losersQ and winnersQ are a thing and they stated it. The better stats you have, including kda, damage deal per match, you the worst your teammate are. Its to keep players engaged. Its disgusting and i would not be surprised if there is something similar on pc, just more advanced
It's very disgusting in wild rift, i gave up on the sovereign grind and can hardly chall every season with solo q, I've had more countless one sided matches than ones that are actually fair and another factor I've noticed is that the lack of playtime for around 2 or 3 days puts you in winners queue
thats not losers/winners Q, thats just the ranked system doing its job, theres no 2 players that are exactly as good or bad, everybody has players better than or worse than themselves
so the system has to average 5 peoples rating against another average, if you are good you sill get bad teammates to average out 1 rank to match against another 5 players, where they also have some good and bad players
@@victoralejandrotrimmerestr3672 that's just one of the factors with it and I'll tell you been playing since beta this is just how this game works that's get worse with every season. It's no pure coincidence that you are up against 4/5 grandmaster challenger peak players while it's 2/5 in your side with some fresh masters (and vice versa) and not to mention that they happen consecutively. This could be alleviated by simply just climbing to the highest elo but it still doesn't change the fact that the problem exist. The addition of a rank above chall and the previous pts system above masters way before in the earlier seasons where already signs of what kind of looping system they are up to
That's literally the opposite of loser's queue.
Loser's queue is about putting all the losers together to make sure they keep loosing and the winners keep winning. What you are describing is putting good player with bad player to balance the teams, that's just the basic job of any matchmaking system.
@@tetri90 nah you guys get it all wrong haha. Let me explain
So basically the better you play, the worst teammate you get, so that the game keeps you at 50% Winrate. This on its own it's already bad since the bad players are already elo inflated and same elo than you but those are the players you just carry. Now the worst part is, people abusing this matchmaking and picking champs like Sion or tryndamere, running down top just split pushing and AVOID ANY interaction with later to artificially put down their own kda and damage deal to champions. So you have people with 0.2 kda (3/4kda is average in wildrift) who have a 80% Winrate and are higher ranked than you. It's ridiculous. So players with low kda get inflated hard because they get put with 4 decent teammates and you, with good stats and kda, get kept at 50% Winrate because you have 4 people running it down. It's not fair and riot already admitted that the match making is like that but they don't wanna change it.
Putting a challenger with the teammates I’ve had is not going to make them win
Nah, even as a casual player no one can tell me Losers Queue doesn't exist. I've been on winstreaks only to be placed on teams that run it down in literally every lane and never respond to pings or possess any kind of fundamental game sense.. Winning would raise your MMR as far as I'm concerned, meaning the people you are matched with should get smarter too.
One of the things that Riot once mentioned and hasnt ever come back at again is that almost every single game is a 'griefer diff'; according to Riot's own statistics about 1 in 10 players frequently show gamedisruptive behaviour (around 1 in 8 in lower ranks, less so in higher ranks)... And then, also according to Riot's own data, almost no games where a player shows game disruptive behaviour the game is won by the team with the disruptive player. How many players does a match have? 10? One in ten players being griefers? Hmmm....
The problem is not losers queue or something like that, the problem is that LoL has an absolutely insane unfathomably large problem with griefers.
That's what muting is for. Everyone should mute to prevent griefing/tilting.
@@khalicocatmuting someone won't prevent them from running it down though
This theory is as old as when in app purchases started. There is no evidence to proof it but... You keep getting matched against players with better skills until you make an in app purchase then you get matched against players with lower skills. Coincidence or insanity? So riot dismissing this claim? Riot calming people down or riot covering themselves?
Necrit totally missed the line:
Losers' Queue does exist, we placed you with 4 bad teammates so that you can improve.
They specifically stated that. They force you to review and improve.
Yeah sadly Necrit is hard on Riot side
And all of the salt was in this videos shown tbh
In practical sense losers queue exist no matter how much u want to deny it, the precentages of the game cant be good for you all the time
I like this comment on twitter.
"The term losers queue exists as long as people are not punished for griefing & trolling.
An indivdual is only 10% of the lobby. Even playing consistently it's technically possible to lose more than you win.
Just because odds are in your favor doesn't mean that the outcome is."
and about coin flip
"The same way I can flip a coin and the more I flip its more likely to get close to 50/50.
Yet it is completely possible to throw a coin 1000 times and have heads 100 times while having tails 900 times.
Number of games makes it more likely but doesn't guarantee it."
the best tip for winning games where you could improve little is communicate with your team, even though it becomes more difficult with every other patch it seems, tell your team where you place a ward and ping when enemies pass it, communicate to the best of your ability above just pinging "back off"
i dont give a flying shit how Riot "debunks" losers queue, fact of the matter still is i lost 15 games in a row as soon as i got out of placements because literally every other lane takes a nosedive and now my MMR is turbo cucked for the rest of the year. (i lose 40lp and gain 20 on a win ((was placed plat 3 now im gold 2)))
LQ exists, its just not what the developers intended.
If LQ didn't exist then the millions of players complaining about it would be wrong then. It's easily reproducible and consistently so.
Even when playing DOTA 2 or MLBB, its actually tough to get a 7 or 9 lose streak. In LOL or WR, that happens quite frequently after something like a ludicrous 8-10 win streak or even a 5-7 win streak.
The way the community defines LQ as if Riot had intended it is not entirely accurate either. It's a natural phenomenon rather than a nefarious scheme. The devs however like to brush it off as if its an urban legend despite the overwhelming evidence of it's existence.
They might not even know how their algorithms even work.
The problem is when all your lanes are being obliterated early for 10+ games in a row before you even can have any impact on teamfights.
Started season really strong and got into insanely long losersQ. Lost enormous amounts of unwinnable games in low diamond and later below. Finally it stopped and then hit master without any problems winning steadily :)
1:24 you got it wrong, it's not if you lose you get worse teammates. It's if you keep winning you get worse teammates
If i lose, i get the same bad teammates. If i win, i have a normal team, who can make coordinated moves, and help each other, and win they own lanes.
There isnt any losers queue. The system is simply bad enough to give you 3 autofilled people and 1 lvl 30 account that isnt a smurf possibly in multiple games in a row if you are unlucky enough. But, it can also do the same the other way around.
BUT, that never happens!
Autofill itself is only meant. To balance win rates.
@@nyfol9142 It can. There are games you cannot carry, because you get bad teammates and you are not on a skill level to turn such games. Bad luck will Happen, just like good luck. But it will only boost or drag 1-2 tiers at best.
Yeah my last match had the enemy lux go 1/15/8 and was unranked lvl 30 account (now ranked bronze 1) in like high silver low gold. That and sometimes matchmaking will give one team all the higher ranks with the other time having a fucking iron and I don't get how or why it happens.
@@sticksstickerson the game also puts new players in Plat and Emerald for some reason.