Is Ky Kiske Struggling In Guilty Gear Strive?

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  • Опубликовано: 28 сен 2024
  • #guiltygearstrive #guiltygear #fightinggames
    Ky Kiske is one of the main characters in Guilty Gear, and boy did he get a rough start in Strive. That being said, we've gone through a couple of patches - how good is he now, and is he really struggling or not?
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Комментарии • 259

  • @nawafgazi1
    @nawafgazi1 Год назад +49

    Ky is really struggling, they need to remove the hurtbox on all his moves so that he only gets damaged by throws.

  • @Kizzie_Kay
    @Kizzie_Kay Год назад +83

    Thank you for sharing the light of our struggles LK

  • @aja9924
    @aja9924 Год назад +36

    Yeah I agree with you that his offense being very committal. I’ve always compared it to you have to read to defender and predict what they are going to do instead of the other way around with them predicting what you as the attacker are going to do.

    • @daikoooo
      @daikoooo Год назад +11

      Ky's offense is one of the worst in the game imo. High risk/low reward. You can take his throw 5 times and you're still alive. Jump it once and delete 50% of his hp.

  • @emeraldmann1329
    @emeraldmann1329 Год назад +64

    Honestly one thing I sorta want them to explore at least, is an idea I heard online. Rather than continue to make DI better and better to make people want to use it, one thing I heard of was that, instead of the HP barrier, you can use DI at any time, but when you use it, it sets you to 30% HP. So if you're at 420 hp, you're all the way down to 30%. But if you're one hit from death, you get a little bit of bonus health.

    • @eugene9211
      @eugene9211 Год назад +7

      Dragon install will forever suck

    • @Caulin_
      @Caulin_ Год назад +8

      I think dragon install is fine where it is, It’s a plus on block move that makes you the best character in the game. Maybe the change where it always sets you to 30% hp is good so you don’t get locked out of using it at 31% hp but besides that they did a really good job with it.

    • @CJnosa
      @CJnosa Год назад

      So kinda like the pandora mechanic in sfxt without the timer?

  • @nanashi-gaming
    @nanashi-gaming Год назад +17

    One thing to keep in mind is how strongly he is affected by FD. It kills his strike throw pretty hard, making it so his time to rps in a semi safe manner is extremely short. Either you commit hard and die to abare or you reset to neutral with two hits. Against characters who are fine playing neutral vs him it's just tough. Great vid btw

  • @boredomkiller99
    @boredomkiller99 Год назад +15

    Overall a pretty accurate summary with only two things I would add.
    One pro not mentioned of Ky is that he has more consistent access to hard knock down then a lot of the cast and generally has good post combo situations since he is either get a hard knockdown into fireball Oki, A safe jump, a meaty shock state 214K or at worst a okay Oki after a stun dipper. Of course he lacks the strong mix ups to make as good use of said oki as others but that is the Ky lifestyle since the early games.
    Also I wouldn't say Ky's biggest weakness is committal offense though his offense is extremely basic but still layered. The issue I find bigger and what makes his offense feel meh is that despite all of Ky's positives he doesn't really have a super strong win condition so he never really has a situation where he feels like he is unstoppable. He doesn't really snowball either. Like in many regards Ky currently has better tools then Sol in several key areas but Sol only really needs to get his plan going once and he explodes while Ky often needs to keep his plan running through multiple reps.
    At the expense of Ky always feeling at least competent in a match up, he never feels dominating.
    He has a lot of tools that even strong characters would want but doesn't get the big pay out for having them.
    I still like playing him though

  • @eduardoserpa1682
    @eduardoserpa1682 Год назад +24

    They have also tried buffing his chip damage on multiple occasions to try and compensate how committal his strike-throw game is, but I don't know how relevant that is to Strive Ky compared to Xrd Ky with the grinders. Between Testament, Ky and Ram, I think we got a nice spread of midrange characters that will always be relevant if not top tier.

  • @courage7895
    @courage7895 Год назад +10

    Ky has a lot of good things on paper, but in practice he had a lot of issues. His biggest issue is his weak pressure which gets completely screwed by fuzzy jump, and FD. Yes he has 6K and SS Foundre Arc which has plus frames but they're both extremely slow, and they are both susceptible to FD.
    Then when it comes to neutral he has trouble catching people like Chip, Millia, and then he gets outranged by characters like Axl and Nago. Then he has things like his 2P his best abare button being low profiled by several characters 2K and then also being able to be 6P'd by several characters as well.
    The people who downplay him downplay him too much, but anybody who thinks he's high tier is probably on some sort of copium.

  • @jonathanhuynh4540
    @jonathanhuynh4540 Год назад +17

    KY MAINS UNITE !!
    Love your content LK, I recently got into fighting games this last year and you have been a huge part in my journey into the FGC so thank you so much for all you do! Your work is well appreciated

  • @deathdanish
    @deathdanish Год назад +6

    I-no next please!!! I think players in the West think she's pretty low tier, but that's not so in the East, and is kinda borne out by her changes over the last year. Would be interested to hear your thoughts.

    • @Pherna_1
      @Pherna_1 Год назад

      People in the West think I-No is bad because there aren't any top tier I-No players. The East has to deal with Daru. Personally, I think I-No is solid and her mix is absurdly good. Anyone who thinks she's bad is smoking it haha

    • @HellecticMojo
      @HellecticMojo Год назад

      I guess the big question would be why is Sol fine with vortex being negative, but Ino population got the Chicxulub asteroid treatment after stroke the morning wood got nerfed.

    • @SpawnPirate
      @SpawnPirate Год назад +2

      @@HellecticMojo Completely different characters with a different set of tools. STBT doesnt need to be plus or anything, but you cant really compare tools like this, the characters are far too different.

  • @uzernamefail
    @uzernamefail Год назад +11

    I think Strive Ky is the definition of "not exploitable". On paper, he has a lot of solid tools and his committal offense can be approached at his own pace instead of being a situation forced on him (like Zato/Potemkin defense), so instead of being checkmated he just doesn't win by a huge margin. Unfortunately for Ky, he has to go up against characters like HC or Ram that maintain the same amount of control for even less commitment, or characters like Nago/Leo that just send it and tear through your health quickly. Ky doesn't get enough interactions in most match ups for his suite of defensive tools to play out, and the weaknesses built into his offense give everyone a chance to fight through it.

  • @lunchables5094
    @lunchables5094 Год назад +18

    You had me until the very end where you said that he is gonna do well against characters that keep getting buffed like Faust. Ky v. Faust is some ass lmfao.

    • @pian-0g445
      @pian-0g445 Год назад

      Eh sort of. Not the greatest match up. I’ve found you have to play very meticulously due to Faust great range for high and low attacks, as well as him being able to keep pressure with items. He’s most annoying in the air. But, if you figure out the player’s pattern and they’re slow to change, it’s doable

  • @thelemonadestandman
    @thelemonadestandman Год назад +2

    I overall really like Ky in Strive, but I do wish that Ky's Shock State did more than it does. It makes him less punishable when landing his special moves and adds a bit of chip damage. But other than that it doesn't really affect his gameplan as much as say Testament's Stain State. If the devs made it so Ky's Foudre Arc was always plus on block or his Stun Dipper was always safer, I don't think he or his placement in the tiers would really change that much, as they'd both still be pretty vulnerable to opponents catching on to patterns and he'd still suffer from his difficulty continuing pressure/offense. Ky's Stun Dipper from the Beta I believe would only hard knockdown with shock state on the opponent, and I really wish that had been the direction they'd gone with the state. I mean it's still a little there in his DP, if shock state is on the opponent they'll be launched high enough for Ky to convert it into a combo. But for the most part, rather than having Ky's specials change how they effect his opponent, they just have better frame data and a tiny bit of chip.

  • @hagoryopi2101
    @hagoryopi2101 Год назад +1

    I love melee-oriented neutral control. Having better oh-shit options and general close-up threat than a true zoner, but most of the neutral advantage a zoner would have against more committal classes like rushdown and big bodies. It lets me feel like I can always keep a step ahead of enemies. Testament is pretty good at this, and Anji has some nice tricks which keep him at advantage when used right, but Ky feels like the absolute king of this niche. So I choose him. He may struggle, but he feels very good to play regardless.

  • @sylascole5254
    @sylascole5254 Год назад +12

    A few unmentioned strengths as well:
    Stun dipper is surprisingly good at steal turns in places where other characters cannot. Against Testament, Ram, and Bridget (to name a few) you can often stun dipper gaps in their block strings where most characters would have to settle for dash blocking/IBFDing.
    He gets quite strong reward off of throw, with both access to 4 way mix (left/right & overhead/low) via FDC, or relatively safe chip via shock state foundre arc after CSE.
    He gets safe jumps/safe meaties quite easily with DE and 5k, with 5k being one of the stronger options for both being a plus on block meaty as well as reversal safe.
    Shock state in the corner can lead to some silly RPS with DP now launching, letting him turn steal into wall break in silly ways.
    Dragon instal dipper does lead to hard knockdown with enough frame advantage for the aforementioned left/right & overhead/low mix.
    Generally, I think Ky is held back by his player base. Strong players like Skyll, Stankboys, Zippy, and Flashmetroid have showcased quite good results with him, but his status as a 'easy' character tends to attract lots of folks that pick him up, put 60 hours into the character, and proclaim that he's bad when they played against a Nago or Ram that invested equivalent time. He's far from weak, but for a generalist/all rounder character to succeed, I still believe they need a more fleshed out gameplan for most matchups, as generalist characters tend to BENEFIT from more character specific knowledge about their opponent, but also REQUIRE it if their general tools are simple or honest. I strongly encourage anyone interested in the character to check out Crow's youtube content on him, as it is gold for learning about his more underutilized options.

  • @pian-0g445
    @pian-0g445 Год назад

    An issue I’ve faced with DI (and this is just because I like to try it out sometimes for fun), is that it isn’t invincible.
    An example, I knew the Leo would do a wake up DP because I’d been of my game and kept getting hit by it. This time, I was like “holy crap, he’s gonna dp” and I was also like “haha, DI”. So I did it but 1 cause DI takes a few frames to start up, Leo had already gotten his dp animation started, and 2 one my DI activated and did the explosion, both of us hurt each other.
    This is more prominently experienced when you’re on the defence, especially against someone like Nago or HC who can create long block strings if they want to, you don’t have much opportunity to use it effectively.
    I like using DI because it’s just fun playing the game like a super saiyen, but here, usually, there are better alternatives such as any of his other supers or using RC and such.
    This would be asking too much but what if DI changed his move sets and it’s properties. Sort of like how Sol’s fireball is changed in past games.
    Maybe in DI, foudre arc becomes the flipping blade move (forgot it’s name). Maybe instead of a stun dipper, he has the portal thing from Xrd in which if his fireball touches, changes it’s properties.
    How they could make DI good and useful tool is not by making Ky stronger, but rather make him different. An opponent having to adapt to a new move set could be something interesting, like when fighting Leo. So basically, make ky DI a stance move.
    Or remove DI so they can focus on his base form.
    He’s an incredibly solid character nonetheless. If I lose, it’s probably cause I suck… which I do

  • @zabatasd9461
    @zabatasd9461 Год назад +3

    The only think that Holds back Kyle is probably Shock state, also the frame data on some of his moves is horrible, Please 5P foudre arc btw

  • @shinygekkouga52
    @shinygekkouga52 Год назад +38

    I think the most unfortunate thing about Ky is that Leo exists. If you want a character with a full screen projectile, meterless reversal, and a far reaching low, Leo is your guy.

    • @DoctorGalactor
      @DoctorGalactor Год назад +11

      Leo is much different than Ky. His booms require a charge input, while Stun Edge doesn't. He can't run while Ky can. Even his damage isn't as high as Ky's damage.

    • @Mr.Faust3
      @Mr.Faust3 Год назад +4

      Lmao no

    • @boredomkiller99
      @boredomkiller99 Год назад +29

      Leo legit can't run full screen and throw though. We all know that is the real reason people play Ky.

    • @cylondorado4582
      @cylondorado4582 Год назад +4

      Yeah, he’s kind of like Guile to Ky’s Ryu. Interestingly enough, Guile also pretty much invalidates Ryu in SFV.

    • @DoctorGalactor
      @DoctorGalactor Год назад +4

      @@cylondorado4582 there's no way that Leo invalidates Ky. They have different strengths and weaknesses. Leo is a stronger character sure, but Ky has better damage, better midrange buttons, and his fireball isn't locked behind a charge input. Also Stun Dipper is a thing.

  • @StormHowl
    @StormHowl Год назад +23

    Overall I agree with your assessment, Ky is mid tier. He has no winning match ups but he also has no losing match ups if you are on top of your game. But imo the biggest thing that hurt him was giving him dragon install, because they locked his best tools behind his comeback mechanic that they so desperately want you to use. But because of the way damage is so high in this game getting to DI range in the first place is almost always a death sentence. Ky is my favorite character in Guilty Gear and I've used him since accent core; I played him for the first year and a half of Strive. But I have given up on him being anything close to how he is in +R, my favorite rendition of the character.

    • @jarrettdecker4276
      @jarrettdecker4276 Год назад +1

      He definitely has winning and losing matchups, does really well vs sin and gets bodied by hc for example

    • @ratedr7845
      @ratedr7845 Год назад

      They were trying to give a trade off

    • @ratedr7845
      @ratedr7845 Год назад +4

      @@jarrettdecker4276 everyone gets bodied by hc

    • @sylascole5254
      @sylascole5254 Год назад +1

      Holy downplay batman

  • @yasagani
    @yasagani Год назад +2

    I've been a Ky player since day 1 and let me tell you, he is definitely struggling. As some others have put it, his character design is on paper good, but in reality it doesn't fit with Strive at all. He basically suffers from being probably the first and most traditionally designed character, where they actually respected the new game's initial constraints while porting him from Xrd very closely to his previous form, before they threw all that out the window with subsequent characters. And the worst part is, he would be in a much better state even with his limitations if he didn't get nerfed in the beta, which was in reality a very bad idea, shocker.
    While it's true his pressure is very risky, committal and lackluster, a very big weakness is his crap gameplan centered around his horrible risk/reward midrange and specials, and his general buttons that look good on paper but are in reality not enough. He has to win many more interactions compared to the other cast to get a win, in most match-ups.
    He has to make up for his mediocre risky midrange with his even riskier fireballs. Great in theory, but in practice ground Stun Edge has awful damage, hitstop and most of all recovery and you're in CH state for the entirety of it. The recovery is so bad, some characters can literally run and IAD at you from almost fullscreen and punish you (stuff like Baiken jS).
    His air fireballs (with or without Shock State) are even worse, Ky is stuck in CH state + recovery until he (slowly) lands, unlike pretty much every other character in the game, who is able to act in the air immediately after using an air move or projectile.
    Every time a fireball doesn't connect, he absolutely gets destroyed for using them. Hell, depending on positioning, some characters can even CH punish you after being hit by the ground one...
    Stun Dipper (with or without SS) is total ass, only being relevant due to how good Stun Dipper + RC is. The 2nd hit to-combo range requirement is still too big, it doesn't even combo off a counter-hit or anti-air trip outside it's required range, it's minus forever on block (with or without SS),
    Don't even get me started on Fraud Arc, an incredibly slow and punishable aerial (but not really) special that is not an overhead, gets stuffed by most lows at its aerial apex, does very poor damage and worst of all, even if you actually manage to land it, it's variably + or - depending on if opponent is in Shock State or he's crouching... They need to decide if it should be either always +2 on any sort of block if it's gonna stay this slow and stuffable, or be made much faster, so people can't stuff it on reaction.
    Ky is extremely meter dependent for any sort of decent reward. His midrange conversions and opportunities without meter are poor, lacking in both situational frequency and reward. In fact, he is so meter dependent, that wallbreaking with supers is generally a very bad idea unless opponent is very near death and you can probably kill him off the post-super-break HKD with a meaty 5K mix, and that's ignoring the fact that his supers do pretty much no damage to a wallstuck opponent.
    Stun Dipper RC looks even better in comparison with his crap supers, basically being his best way of using meter almost always aside from niche scenarios. RTL having decent corner carry is meaningless when Stun Dipper RC has the same (actually a bit more) corner carry and gives him like 20-30% more damage on top of that. Hell, his supers being so bad, if I was forced to choose between supers ala SF3, the only one I'd keep would be Sacred Edge for some specific match-up punishes/contests, arguably his better super.
    His H DP is hella risky, it's the slowest DP in the game, in startup and flight, and on top of that it travels so much even after the move ends, you can potentially corner yourself in many situations, doing the opponents' job for them. I wish it would land much faster and not in CH state and travel less horizontal distance. His S DP has some identity problems in that its specific usages are very few, niche and rare, and is almost always not used in favor of his big brother.
    Dire Eclair is actually probably his best special, (unless the opponent smells it as a blockstring ender and IBs it into a punish but that's fine I guess) I just wish it wouldn't push me back to China on a successful HIT in some situations, so I could actually convert into a combo off of it.
    A big part of his strength also being gatekept behind DI is another story, but DI will never be good in a game with such absurd levels of damage, where 30% health might as well mean 1% health. They need to either make it auto-activate OR make it an invincible reversal that also either heals and/or massively increases Ky's defense and guts.
    But none of those are ever going to get fixed if Arcsys just pays attention to the Japanese meta, where Ky is considering erronously top tier, and the biggest proof is in last patch's Ky changes, where he basically got meme'd on with guard crush Sacred Edge(*).... Japanese tierlists have always been way behind the rest of the world, which is why we had to deal with HC, Nago and Ram so way above everybody else for such a long time...
    And to be clear, I'm not saying, fix all of the above or the character's unplayable, but man, it would be great if at least half of them were not a thing. Sorry for the wall of text.

  • @maximomorel4161
    @maximomorel4161 Год назад

    I really want you to do a video on Faust
    love hearing your objective-ish commentary.

  • @ADxTygon
    @ADxTygon Год назад

    I think the overall problem with ky is that the things he excel at, those being neutral, pokes, and space control, are all things that are much stronger when put in the context of other character’s toolkits. Even if his buttons across the board were 100% better than characters like nago, ram, and hc, those characters would still outpace him because their offense and conversion tools gel so much better with their pokes than ky. Imo literally all you need to do to make ky wayyy better is give him the same buff anji’s nagiha got the most recent patch, where it pops the opponent up longer to give him real oki. Suddenly everything would click, because he actually has a scary win condition thats super strong BECAUSE of his strong neutral, and the threat of his grounded pokes make things like air approaches and closing the gap more potent as a mixup because youd be prioritizing his grounded options more.
    Oh and give him back AC+R air charged stun edge. Not because he strictly needs it, but because its silly and fun

  • @NeoBoneGirl
    @NeoBoneGirl Год назад +22

    The thing holding him back the most I feel is actually DI. Dragon Install in this game is just simply designed wrong. In other games, it was a short, limited burst of huge power, that was essentially "win the round now, or you'll lose it after DI is over". In Strive, it's a decent buff to all of your moves, which you want to get up as soon as possible. This would be way better, except you can only use this when he's almost dead, and the proportional buffs aren't good enough. And because he has DI, and because they feel like they're begging you to use DI, they don't want to buff his normal shit too much

    • @Masuo15
      @Masuo15 Год назад +1

      The thing is that this is also an extra super. Even back then DI used 1 of Sols 2 super slots, here Ky have it as an extra if you want to use it. At least Sol got a new super even if he cant truly DI anymore.

    • @boredomkiller99
      @boredomkiller99 Год назад +12

      The thing is DI is great but you will rarely see KY players use it because he has two other good supers and good RC options and the only time you can use DI is when Ky is already losing and probably needs whatever meter he has for other things.
      Like yeah you can DI but why do that when I can RTL mid screen into wall break. Why DI when I can through a super fast, quick recovering plus on block projectile that let's me win trades or get combos with shock state. Why DI when I can neutral skip with STun dipper?

    • @NeoBoneGirl
      @NeoBoneGirl Год назад +1

      @@Masuo15 Back in the day though, Sol wasn't designed around having DI, and it doesn't matter that it "uses a super slot" because having good supers in old GG is pretty uncommon. Here, it feels like they are holding Ky back specifically because they don't want DI Ky to be a problem, which hurts him because DI Ky is a very rare occurrence.

    • @h4rdtr
      @h4rdtr Год назад

      @@Masuo15 Ky's supers are kinda ass. Sure he has 3, but they all have pretty huge flaws compared to other supers that are similar. RTL is his best super, but the damage isn't great. Damage for RTL is really high in DI which would required 100 meter and you actually hitting it. Sometimes feels like they nerfed regular Ky just to make DI seem stronger.

    • @raekwonchambers2297
      @raekwonchambers2297 Год назад

      @@Masuo15 I didn’t know ky had 3 supers until last patch lol

  • @DuppyBoii187
    @DuppyBoii187 Год назад +1

    If fireballs weren't absolute shit that would be a good start. DI from 40% too would make me happy.

  • @dandycube
    @dandycube Год назад +1

    I think Ky would be better if he could activate dragon install at any time but it would run out like xrd sol dragon install

    • @raekwonchambers2297
      @raekwonchambers2297 Год назад

      Basically golden frieza except you aren’t punished when it runs out

  • @ExoDarko
    @ExoDarko Год назад

    Love your breakdowns as someone who's just now getting into GGS, but also king... why is your headboard in front of your closet? You just don't need that space huh?

  • @notthatplease
    @notthatplease Год назад +5

    Dragon install also buffs stun dipper pretty significantly. You get a hard knock down into charged stun edge.
    It's incredibly oppressive, especially because his chip damage is insane in that state.

  • @darklustgamingchannel4535
    @darklustgamingchannel4535 Год назад

    How to make ky top tier great in 4 steps:
    1. Foudre arc is an overhead.
    2. Fireball (stun edge) NOT punishable on HIT.
    3. Stun dipper second hit always hits if the first hit confirms
    4. Dragon install at 50% hp activation OR/and activation at 100% hp but health drains fast like Nagos.

  • @Rivershield
    @Rivershield Год назад

    My demands as a Ky main is as follows:
    1) make DI activation like Sol's in Xrd or you might as well get rid of it.
    2) give him 2k combo conversions or air combos.
    3) alternatively, they could give him that Xrd arch that transforms his projectyles.

  • @matthewmalcolm6143
    @matthewmalcolm6143 Год назад

    kind of a silly idea but what if ky's DI meter cost was tied to his health more directly, at 100% hp costs 100% meter etc. idunno if that would make ky players just really try to go for GBurst setups or something, also would kinda ruin the point of it being a comeback mechanic and turn it into a way more aggressive ability but IMO the health requirement is really brutal. if anything I think it should be at 50%. 30% hp isn't hard to do in one combo in strive for most characters even from stray hits especially later in the game when players have meter

  • @countchocula1250
    @countchocula1250 Год назад

    Ky's only offensive buff going to his grab is hilarious and solidifies him as a true grappler

  • @devondorr8212
    @devondorr8212 Год назад +6

    He's fine until you run into a top tier lol.

  • @txta786
    @txta786 Год назад +1

    Give my boi a gun next patch if he can't mix

  • @omegawaffles7348
    @omegawaffles7348 Год назад +3

    i think he’s high tier but not top tier. he definitely is more commital or wutever cuz i feel like u need to make some hard reads (without meter) once u have meter everything is scary. which ofc makes sense cuz yeah everyone having meter means ur better but especially with that 5 frame stun dipper, u have to be thinking ab that all game so u don’t get caught

  • @Kinma15
    @Kinma15 Год назад

    It got to be a steep battle to beat Nago, Baiken, Gol D Lewis, and Anji for me.

  • @phsquared1000
    @phsquared1000 Год назад

    On release Ky felt pretty lackluster. But he feels like he’s in a solid spot. Not high or low tier but a comfortable mid tier. His neutral is fine and his damage is respectable but not great.
    The main downside I’ve felt in my time as Ky is that he has a hard time keeping momentum after knockdown. Like LK said Ky being strike throw is a bit of a detriment since it’s his main offense. He can’t force disgusting mix, delete a health bar or keep consistent gapless pressure.
    I can agree with LK’s sentiment on Kyle being just alright.

    • @DoctorGalactor
      @DoctorGalactor Год назад +1

      His oki is actually great. A lot of his knockdowns lead to reversal safe meaties or CSE setplay. It's just his blockstring offense that's lacking, despite the good damage on a good read.

    • @sanher20
      @sanher20 Год назад

      @@DoctorGalactor that sounds like a very mediocre oki, yeah you make them block but there's no mixup, as lk said Ky will have to do a negative string and you'll be able to get out unless Ky takes massive risk

    • @DoctorGalactor
      @DoctorGalactor Год назад +1

      @@sanher20 There's a lot of possible mixups. A lot of them are also reversal safe as well. And even if you got a knockdown that doesn't allow for mixups, getting a reversal safe meaty off of a jab is not common at all. Compare this to a character like Sol, who doesn't have a reversal safe normal.

    • @sanher20
      @sanher20 Год назад

      @@DoctorGalactor Ky only has throw, what are your talking about? And there are like 4 different ways in which you can get out of the throw since it's not a command throw

    • @DoctorGalactor
      @DoctorGalactor Год назад +2

      @@sanher20 He has a left/right covered by CSE after 2D knockdown. Also high/lows, but those are easier to defend against. After corner throw or Foudre Arc knockdown in the corner he gets a jump in J.H covered by CSE, and then there's a lot of options you can go for. Go watch Crow's Ky oki video. It has a lot of info.

  • @nicky7685
    @nicky7685 Год назад +1

    okay but if he's mid-tier why I am free to him?

  • @haidenlee8869
    @haidenlee8869 Год назад +1

    I don't think Ky was the best character in the beta, I think he heavily benefitted from the unoptimized playerbase. he was still strong but I don't think the best.

  • @bezoznaught5261
    @bezoznaught5261 Год назад +1

    Both father and son strugglin

  • @mkspammer7393
    @mkspammer7393 Год назад

    What's a two step character?

    • @arachnofiend2859
      @arachnofiend2859 Год назад +2

      A character who has to get set up somehow to enter their strong situation. Testament needing stain to have the god neutral and pressure is the most obvious example of this kind of character

    • @mkspammer7393
      @mkspammer7393 Год назад

      ​@@arachnofiend2859 ohh thanks alot:)

  • @xoxoweepingxoxo
    @xoxoweepingxoxo Год назад

    give ky greed sever

  • @_Deez
    @_Deez Год назад

    LK spittin as usual

  • @Korosivv
    @Korosivv Год назад

    I just want Foudre Arc to be an overhead... That's all a man ever dreamt of....

  • @ShizuSan69
    @ShizuSan69 Год назад

    Yes yes he is

  • @Giraffinator
    @Giraffinator Год назад

    i wish his 6k wasn't so lame

  • @billyscenic5610
    @billyscenic5610 Год назад

    Ryu syndrome. Avoid this character.

  • @kahsaiharmon15
    @kahsaiharmon15 Год назад

    Algorithm Comment

  • @MrErudon
    @MrErudon Год назад

    Yes.

  • @bweansFGC
    @bweansFGC Год назад

    clearly we should give him his grinders back

  • @ImaNeedHalf
    @ImaNeedHalf Год назад +1

    No this character is fine

  • @Builimacen
    @Builimacen Год назад

    Didn't even watch (yet) and have to say.
    Yes

  • @UnoTheSmartGuy
    @UnoTheSmartGuy Год назад

    The problem is Kyle players are too honest

  • @zachpeterson9605
    @zachpeterson9605 Год назад

    Finally someone who doesnt sit there and downplay ky

  • @Mr.Faust3
    @Mr.Faust3 Год назад +4

    He’s pretty strong kizzie just downplays

  • @curupa66
    @curupa66 Год назад +1

    Yes. Easy.

  • @noname-ym2gl
    @noname-ym2gl Год назад

    Nah, ky is good, it is just that people don't know how to win without exploiting cheap movements or setups in this game, it is honest, and i like the way it is

  • @skyespadl978
    @skyespadl978 Год назад

    LITERALLY all they need to do is give 5d a meter less followup into a combo, then characters like KY and Sol could have another layer onto their pressure and mix-up game besides strike/throw.

    • @unsolol
      @unsolol Год назад +1

      no , get meter

  • @heracrossz7701
    @heracrossz7701 Год назад +1

    No he is not

  • @webweaver13s
    @webweaver13s Год назад

    Imo no not really. He seems just fine if not really good.

  • @lololllololololol
    @lololllololololol Год назад +79

    Like a few people said in the comments already, I think him having Dragon Install function the way it does it part of the problem.
    In a vacuum, Kys' DI is a really cool concept, but in reality the requirement to get access to it is such a downside that it's almost never worth the risk of activation. I think in this last patch the devs really tipped their hand that they really want people to use Dragon Install, and I think having so much focus on that takes away from his other tools being as tight as they could be.

    • @davidburke4101
      @davidburke4101 Год назад +9

      If they want people to use it, remove the health requirement. DI makes comebacks easier but by no means does it immediately put the opponent on the back foot. Being a single combo away from losing the round is too big of a punishment for how weak the buff is.

    • @esdeath5301
      @esdeath5301 Год назад +18

      @@davidburke4101 Go straight to jail for suggesting this

    • @davidburke4101
      @davidburke4101 Год назад +3

      @@esdeath5301 Watched too many DI meme videos and think it's OP?

    • @esdeath5301
      @esdeath5301 Год назад +12

      @@davidburke4101 nope, played the game and have experience with install supers enough to know that what you’re suggesting is absolutely bonkers and should be left in the “kusoge character idea” shelf in people’s heads. not in the actual game.

    • @OccuredJakub12
      @OccuredJakub12 Год назад +7

      I had the idea of making it so applying Shock State slightly raises the treshhold for DI. So if you use it enough times, you can get DI usually within 40 or 50% health, even potentially 100 though not realistically. It would tie Ky's two main mechanics into each other. I'd add an indicator on his HP bar as well to show the treshhold.

  • @lightning_rook
    @lightning_rook Год назад +16

    yes, Lets go Ky mains! may our bread remain unbuttered and our water be tepid!

  • @servebotfrank4082
    @servebotfrank4082 Год назад +52

    Ky's Dragon Install gives me really big Golden Frieza vibes where the devs just hyper focus on the install to the detriment of the character's other tools. Though tbf, Ky is a much stronger character than Frieza in terms of character power.
    They're obviously scared of creating a Devil Trigger type install where there's no reason not to go into it and create "lol I win" situations but at least Dragon Install in Xrd was crazy crazy fun because it was specifically meant to just give you hype combos and change the OST to the banger that is "Ride the Fire."

    • @TheOtakuKat
      @TheOtakuKat Год назад +8

      A.B.A sends her regards. 🤣

    • @Kinma15
      @Kinma15 Год назад +3

      @@TheOtakuKat our punishment for the instakills in +r

    • @lemone630
      @lemone630 5 месяцев назад +1

      Honestly man even now that DI is pretty handy, I STILL want it to play a new Holy Orders IV (Maybe with lyrics who knows)

  • @mreko108
    @mreko108 Год назад +20

    Worth noting that Foudre Arc is plus on crouch block and minus on stand block when not in shock state, it's not only plus in shock state. And also that Dragon Install gives him back HKD on stun dipper, which is one of it's strongest buffs imo since it makes it much more common to get effective okizeme on stray hits. It's still probably worse to DI than to use either other super but 🤷

    • @h4rdtr
      @h4rdtr Год назад +6

      If someone crouch blocks feudre arc they are literally asleep. Go to bed gamer.

    • @HellecticMojo
      @HellecticMojo Год назад +6

      @@h4rdtr yeah, and no one ever gets hit by Faust 6H, right.

    • @null-wq5cp
      @null-wq5cp Год назад +7

      @@HellecticMojo You doing legends work man. But don’t bother continuing this discourse, it’s a never ending battle.
      People say this but get hit with a fully charged dust, full screen run up throw, etc etc.

    • @Possiblylowtier
      @Possiblylowtier Год назад +1

      @@HellecticMojo faust 6h is faster than foudre arc

    • @null-wq5cp
      @null-wq5cp Год назад +1

      @@Possiblylowtier Actually Faust 6H is slower by one frame and is less active for 2 frames.

  • @raionbomber75
    @raionbomber75 Год назад +3

    I ain't good at Strive like that, but Kyle my guy. From my casual player view, I picked him up cause I could just do the basic shoto things but he feels like system mechanics the character instead aiming for a win condition.
    Great video, I learned some things.

  • @Yessir-yl8iu
    @Yessir-yl8iu Год назад +4

    Love the character breakdowns !
    Only thing I wish for Ky was his projectile recovery not being so punishable. Maybe not to what they did with testament but just a solid projectile that will help him control neutral a little better

  • @aganaom1712
    @aganaom1712 Год назад +15

    literally nobody i know who knows anything about ky has been able to agree on where he is relative to other characters and considering how japan and na disgree on his placement overall, that sounds like par for the course
    i do think he's kinda boring though regardless of how good or bad he actually is

    • @nouvelle147
      @nouvelle147 Год назад +3

      "Boring" is a good answer.

  • @james0644
    @james0644 Год назад +142

    I haven’t watched but if he says he’s struggling the downplay is real

    • @jayhit4212
      @jayhit4212 Год назад +37

      Found the man who cant block SD

    • @HellecticMojo
      @HellecticMojo Год назад +59

      @@jayhit4212 its a 5 frame low. You are straight up lying if you claim to block it on reaction

    • @kickin477
      @kickin477 Год назад +4

      💀 is this a meme or are you actually that tight?

    • @james0644
      @james0644 Год назад

      @@kickin477 I fucking hate ky 💀💀

    • @sanicboi9187
      @sanicboi9187 Год назад +23

      @@HellecticMojo 5 frame point blank. If you're not holding down back when he's that close to you, that's is all on you.

  • @dizzyspellss
    @dizzyspellss Год назад +2

    I don’t think Ky is bad by any means. He is just the only human in a world of gods. Sort of like Ryu in UMVC3. I like the direction they are going with DI buffs. All they should do to him (in my opinion) is just buff his forward and backwards walk speed. Just make his footsies even better than it already is and he’s golden

    • @Uooooooooooooh
      @Uooooooooooooh Год назад +1

      maybe if you're only looking at the top tiers, there are characters that are worse off than ky

    • @dizzyspellss
      @dizzyspellss Год назад

      @@Uooooooooooooh oh for sure, although now that this new patch is out, they aren’t worse off by all that much. Everything seems pretty balanced at the moment besides Happy chaos and Nagoruyki still being buff as all heck

  • @Syrup4prez
    @Syrup4prez 8 месяцев назад

    New to strive but ky certainly hasn’t been a problem yet… lol the problems for me personally are Bridget, happy chaos, and Axl.. mostly because it seems you need match up knowledge to beat them.

  • @TitosTheSalty
    @TitosTheSalty Год назад +6

    Really enjoyed this vid. As a Ky main, I think he has everything he needs and nothing he doesn't, kinda like Testament pre patch (my secondary). The issue is, a few characters get to have their cake and eat it. Arcsys seems to get this because the buffs they gave him this patch are meh, they just incentivize a few different ways to play. He's a good character with some insane players, but like pre patch Testament, why invest the effort to master him over someone like Ram, HC, or Leo?
    Also, really glad you mentioned that Ky's more committal strike throw game plan will by nature always be risky.

  • @IchimanVRSNA5
    @IchimanVRSNA5 Год назад +1

    My biggest problem with ky’s stun dipper is that why the heck are both hits not fully guaranteed to connect?? Seriously that will never make sense to me and why the hell no one says anything about it?

    • @LegateSprinkles
      @LegateSprinkles Год назад +4

      Because the majority of us just learned spacing. The 2 hits are static timing and the first hit only gives so much hit stun.

    • @raekwonchambers2297
      @raekwonchambers2297 Год назад +2

      We’ve been complaining since release and they have made it a lil more consistent so I think most ky players just got used to it

    • @IchimanVRSNA5
      @IchimanVRSNA5 Год назад

      @@raekwonchambers2297 ah understandable

  • @synthesize9068
    @synthesize9068 Год назад +3

    I have multiple reasons why Ky is struggling but a main reason is def stun edge. Stun edge is fucking terrible

  • @Atebitbacon
    @Atebitbacon Год назад

    Things I Wish Ky had:
    Overhead on Foudre Arc (hell make it OH on shockstate only if you think its broken)
    more plus and damage on the super slow 6K that nobody uses
    access to 2 stun edges on screen only if he PRC or BRC one of them. (idk if this is broken)
    Sacred Edge gives speed boost = to DI for the duration of shock state
    a less punishable far slash because of faster recovery
    That 53HS launcher from Xrd Rev (yeah I know thats never happening for this game)

  • @Caulin_
    @Caulin_ Год назад

    I always felt like Ky’s pressure was never about forcing decisions as it is reacting to your opponents choices. The problem is that many of the callouts you have just leave you in a bad spot.
    Foudre arc sucks, it’s minus on block and very very easy to stuff (which leads to air counterhit combo). It also very rarely actually low crushes
    Stun edge being the safest option to keep your opponent locked down, is only advantageous if you hit the opponent at mid or further ranges. It is so ridiculously minus for no reason, that you’re better off very rarely using it.
    DE is fine, if you are mixing it up well, it should be safe on block and not IB’d and the reward for a counterhit is very strong.
    Ky’s normals are very very good, but they’re at the trade off of having some of the most underwhelming specials in the game. If his Foudre Arc or Stun Edge got some love, he would really flourish.

  • @Pejinkajink
    @Pejinkajink Год назад

    Ky doesn’t have the ‘it’ factor that makes the non top tiers as competitively viable. He’s got a rough matchup spread and risky offense with lower damage (comparatively)

  • @fracture4047
    @fracture4047 Год назад

    I always come for the info. I stay for the Persona bops in the background

  • @vexzel5550
    @vexzel5550 Год назад

    Ky is struggling and always has in strive.
    They need to buff the activation window for Dragon install to 50 HP so he can get the buffs Ky needs

  • @Zendariel87
    @Zendariel87 Год назад

    I think you could have mentioned he gets a hard knockdown on stun dipper when in Dragon Install, unless he lost that.

  • @donue1726
    @donue1726 Год назад

    Good video and i really impressed that "School Days" somewere is used

  • @TK_TK811
    @TK_TK811 Год назад

    I love these type of videos because everyone has said all that can about the best and the worst but if its in the middle they kinda get ignored or opinions vary wildly.

  • @m3mori
    @m3mori Год назад

    persona 1 school days to start off the video.. LK your taste is impeccable

  • @effay3204
    @effay3204 Год назад

    I dunno why but calling him "Kyle" is really funny to me.

  • @FLYEboi50
    @FLYEboi50 Год назад

    Ky vs Nago is a 7-3 matchup based upon data from what I recall. Nago pressure is too strong. Correct me if I'm wrong.

    • @HellecticMojo
      @HellecticMojo Год назад +1

      It's 6-4 at worst in proportional category where the winrate is 46%
      Only 7/3 in this game were held by Goldlewis who lost to Axl at launch or won against Potemkin in more recent times.

  • @ElpheltStan
    @ElpheltStan Год назад

    No lol

  • @skortyspice
    @skortyspice Год назад

    I really do not like how well-rounded this character is when he's strong in the roster. He shouldn't be super high because "jack of all trades" isn't a big weakness when it means all your match-ups are stable. Also he and Baiken are 50% of tower so it becomes very stale when he's strong if you don't have a great MU vs him. He's basically the gatekeeper of who gets to be considered good.

    • @yorickvlt1021
      @yorickvlt1021 Год назад

      I assume you're talking about the lower levels, because the last time I've seen a Ky in floor 10 or celestial was ages ago

    • @skortyspice
      @skortyspice Год назад

      @@yorickvlt1021 Nope I'm in floor 10.

  • @unsolol
    @unsolol Год назад +2

    Ky is good has good winrates on ratingupdate and match ups. at least in the top 100 :D

  • @saxtonnova
    @saxtonnova Год назад

    thank you

  • @Pherna_1
    @Pherna_1 Год назад +4

    Ky is absolutely not struggling in Guilty Gear: Strive. Maybe at the top .01% of players, but at every other level he is completely fine. In fact, I would argue he has more good matchups than most.

  • @pivotmongral
    @pivotmongral Год назад

    No. Next video.
    Alright I actually watched the video. Yeah this just about checks out. I feel like unless they do something absolutely egregious to his kit he'll tend to not stick out as much as other oppressive kits. Fuck stun dipper PRC.

  • @vixen9262
    @vixen9262 Год назад +7

    LK confirmed paid off by the ky-downplayer lobbyists. No mention of stun dipper rc or his godly oki.

    • @wl4810
      @wl4810 Год назад

      The Kizzingtons lobby

    • @vixen9262
      @vixen9262 Год назад

      @@rzzz5946 strike-throw is mix

    • @raekwonchambers2297
      @raekwonchambers2297 Год назад +2

      @@vixen9262 if you call that mix then you have low expectations for mix

  • @morgansheepman2403
    @morgansheepman2403 Год назад

    If you think Ky is struggling, you've somehow missed launch Faust, Anji, Jack-O and Sin

    • @stairwaytoriven3823
      @stairwaytoriven3823 Год назад

      Jack-O and Faust are NOT struggling.. what?…

    • @jas3946
      @jas3946 Год назад

      @@stairwaytoriven3823 read "launch"

  • @sunnydartz8697
    @sunnydartz8697 Год назад

    Just wanna let everyone know in the comments that DI is really good this patch. You guys just need to experiment more. In case u didn’t know I can pretty much activate it for free if u get single hit on block since it’s plus.

    • @kuro_mori_vt
      @kuro_mori_vt Год назад +5

      ok now what happens when you aren’t given the opportunity to DI? you just die. needing to be so low to use it means you either barely see the benefits or you never get to use it, since it’s not a reversal. I would use it if it was a reversal, but it’s not, and the immediate meter gain penalty hurts its case even more.

    • @h4rdtr
      @h4rdtr Год назад +1

      problem is, usually when I'm about to die I'm probably being reset and safe jumped or blocking in the corner for dear life or saving my 50 meter for the inevitable "BRC guess for game get me the hell out of here BRC back at you". I cannot DI because that would require me not doing DP RC or stun dipper RC as a reversal/punish. It's super niche that you actually get the chance to use DI and most of the time I only need one more hit to win anyway so WHY would I DI when I can RTL??? Not having 50 meter when your opponent does can be literally a death sentence. It's why good players often don't break the wall with super when their opponent has more meter than them.

  • @HarmonicResonanceScale
    @HarmonicResonanceScale Год назад +1

    Nah I run into Kyle Cheesecake players who just fuck my shit up and fuck my shit up again once I feel like I've adjusted to their playstyle because he is incredibly flexible.
    Ky is only held back by his players.

  • @HellecticMojo
    @HellecticMojo Год назад +3

    Ky is solid middle tier.
    Ky players are mostly bottom tier.
    "Poor predictable Ky players, always picking rock"
    "Bad ol' rock, everything beats that"
    [throws rock into paper still. Cries]
    What's funny/infuriating about it is that every other character playerbase has learned to use their good moves and ignore the bad ones, but Ky players can't help themselves. Anji players learned not to use anything but Nagiha and Kou, Goldlewis players learned not to use jp or 5p, Axls learned to not use Wintermantis as a mix, Millia doesn't use bad moon but no, Ky players will continue to use moves and irregardless of the outcome, still complain about them.
    "Wow, my strikes can be blocked, garbage"
    "Wow, my strike that's positive anyway on crouch isn't an overhead, garbage"
    "Wow, my projectile is negative when I use it point blank, what garbage"
    "Wow, my strike can be instant blocked, absolute garbage"
    If Ky players had even the smallest amount of self awareness, maybe someone will take their complaint seriously instead of being known as THE downplayed character.