HOLY SHIT NIANDRA you cant pretend you didn't just drop a fire TWENTY minute winston juggle montage. All the chill talking and music won't distract us from your tank skills
Seriously. New hero additions used to be majorly exciting because it meant new cinematic and potentially the overall story progressing. Now it’s like they just drop them in and that’s it. They don’t even get cosmetics anymore lmao
I mean I was attracted by the how the character was portrayed in a fantasy world that is not a typical shooter, that’s why I, who never liked playing any fps games, decided to give Overwatch a shot. I feel like recent new heroes didn’t have a tight relations with other heroes as the older ones do (e.g. Venture, Juno), and they also do not play a critical role of the lore, which makes them even more irrelevant and less exciting, for me at least. Not to mention they ‘gutted’ PVE, an immersive storytelling experience which I was very excited about, but we don’t go there.
@@razrv3lc they get released so close together too. It’s hard for the community to become attached when there’s always something new looking for attention
They're not unfortunately. The Devs have said that it isn't canon because it wouldn't make sense to have Talon and overwatch on the same team for example. It's just a glimpse of what their interactions would actually look like. Heck even the game itself isn't canon. @@anthonyreddude4713
I'm not going to lie, the lack of lore has been a huge part of my growing disinterest in playing the game. It really makes me so sad. Especially when I go back and read all the lore drops from the little PVE we did get.
What do you mean we got plenty of lore! We got those birthdays! You know, kiriko being half the shimadas age when training alongside them, McCree being canonically 3 different ages, and Sojourn becoming a captain at 19 years old while her 14 year old sister was getting preggers! At this point lets be real, if they can't do the most basic thing like getting the characters ages correct, do we really want in depth lore?
@@darcidious99Oh let's not forget about that one fanfiction being promoted as official canon lore of Reaper not being only a self-pittying simp that decided to get a child during his most sociopathic and unstable phase of his life, pulling off suicide-missions while also being in his mid40-early 50s but also being a great stereotype example of a brown angry cop with anger issues that was ooc obsessed with small crime in a crime filled city than with the literal genocide that happened during that time...all ofc before he joined the military. As if it didn't already overcomplicated the spaghetti timeline anyways! Like when did he found the time to go through police training + years of a career background to be able to join the undercover force just to join the military in his early years. Like when?! Especially when stating in Retribution that he already worked with blackwatch/overwatch atleast for 20 years at that point. So he was in his 30s at that point when joining atleast. Legitimately when did he find the time for all of that. I absolutely despise the new lore and also don't see code of violence as canon. Not mentioning that me and my friends used to call his potential exwife maria just for the jokes (before she got a official name we called her the most uncreative stereotypical latina name) just to be hit with "Martina" (hahah still cracks me up to this day) Also the author of that story also went on a huge Twitter rant after the initial backlash and shitstorm of Reaper fans alike ( lets not mention the reaper76 shippers who went overboard with their harassment and yapping of their favorite ship being "ruined" by a wife everyone was atleast aware of existing at some point) and called everyone a hater and bots and that he is aware of his abilities and skills and won't listem to any haters (btw his "writing' is again another can of worms, to leave it short, dude was making beginner mistakes and also stepped over chus initial lore bible that he followed in which he tried to seperate reapers identity from his previous life and never called him reyes. This dude not only used the name "Reyes" in a shortstory up to 200 tines but also never used any other synonyms. It gets tiring to read in every sentence "Reyes said. Reyes nodded. Reyes thought." That's some elementary school level of writing. But hey atleast he tried to bait the reaper76 fans to chill out bcs there is so much more lore coming they don't know about. Oh yeah and also google translator sombra was my favorite. This was the coup de grace that made me drop the lore entirely. I mean i find some of the new additions nice, like the declassified lorebook or the mauga backstory but those are also lorebits and pieces you can tell got their origin from Chu's feather. 100%. They were in the making before he left and remained in his secret lore vault. I personally miss his ingenious writing alot and the fact that he took his writingstyle and inspiration from Finalfantasy storytelling style makes so much sense to me how he is able to give stereotype designed characters such complex and deep stories to flash them out. The lore of some of the new cast is pretty pathetic to me. Kiriko, weaver...illari omg illari. They don't fit the universe at all and are so blant and unutilized in the characters we see in game. Like does anyone remeber how weaver got potrayed as a badboy terrorist in his origin story but is the most harmless and optimistic character dialogue wise? I just can't give a damn anymore.
It's so nice to have a video discussing the state of Overwatch that doesn't just focus on the balance, there is so much more to this game than just its competitive aspects.
Like what? It’s a PvP game where the vast majority of people play 5v5 either quick play or comp. Most people don’t care or play arcade or limited time modes
One of the most intelligent, nuanced, down to earth, and sensible takes on overwatch I've heard in a long time. I'm so over the endless whining and debating and trying to be perfect. Make a call that is best and most fun for most people not the loudest people and go with it.
@@_V.Va_ Nah they should do it with Illari, Mercy, Juno, Kiriko, Mei, Sym, Dva. We don't need male heroes getting them and magical girls as a concept isn't inherently Asian so idk why you grouped all the Asian heroes who are different ethnities together lol. Magical girls as a genre is about girl power and fantasy. Genji getting a Magical Girl skin would be pretty icky for what the genre stands for IMO.
At the Monetization part right now, and I have to agree : Yes Overwatch is not the worst and gets more thrown into its face than other games that deserve it as much, and it's an industry-wide problem. But you're also right in pointing out that it's still egregious. (and goddamn, Venture didn't even get a Legendary skin since their launch)
Literally they could release one new story mission each year to progress lore the way they used to. They wouldn’t have to work on it but once a year which seems perfectly doable.
Cosmetics are wildly overpriced. It isn't greedy to want a skin for 2-5 bucks when the quality is mid. I want to support OW2 but I can't stand the exchange rate so I'm just not paying for it right now.
@@ckamo10 honestly I don't play many and I rarely spend money on them unless they seem to give good value. Like honestly their mythic skins(or at least the good ones) are a great value. High quality, lots of options. But then you have fucking mid tier but going for $20. CSGO skins because of the market are amazing in terms of price. I guess I am a bit out of date, my reference is things like WOW Guild wars, and TF2. It just seems ludicrous the cost for several skins. They are so bullshit quality but charged like the same price as truly amazing skins. I would honestly buy more of they knocked the price down 50%
@@zadinal I agree with you like recolour shouldn’t be 20$ or a skin that’s clearly an epic shouldn’t be priced as a legendary one. I’m just saying all these companies be doing all these things yenno
@@ckamo10in helldivers 2, battle pass with 3 skins is 9.99$, 3.33$ for each. Considering they come with 3 premium weapons, some poses, it would be cheaper than that.
I love OW. I don't care about balance that much. I have some heroes I like, some I don't like anyone else. I guess I'm pretty casual but I play it a lot. I don't touch comp that much because I don't like attack/defense maps (it feels to long). I'm satisfied with the seasonal content because it's what I always wanted since OW1 (specifically after Apex launched. I always saw those early seasons they had and all we got was the same junkenstein and lucio ball every year). What I hate is the negativity about OW everywhere on the internet. I just want to watch some gameplay and maybe some funny/interesting things about the game. I'm tired about the "dead game", "the balance team should be fired", "Its just a cash grab" and everything else. Some complaints are valid I understand that, but it gets so annoying. When everyone says the game I love is shit I end up feeling like I'm wrong for liking the game and I know that I'm not. I know its hard but I just wish people were happier about the game. Its not that bad as people say. I know there are points the devs can make better but the way people talk its like the sky is falling. Also WTF 18:07. More gameplays or clips like that please. You're really good playing tank. That's one fact for hte "10 facts about Niandra playing OW you dont know"
Overwatch has NOTHING aspirational outlined for the future. Warcraft has a new expansion coming out this month AND Diablo 4 has one coming in Oct. I wish Blizzard would give us something to look forward to for OW.
@@ValeOverwatch I get what you mean. What does Overwatch have now to look forward to besides skins and events, events where people are most excited for events BECAUSE of skins?? I know there's the promise of new characters, maps, etc. but what about something BIG??
@@mina-min we are talking about overwatch, the core gameplay is good, they can only expand it with new maps, modes and heroes. The only big big thing they can bring, is PVE or similar, at least that's what I personally think
Niandra I love your mercy content but I’m very happy you branch out to general OW stuff too cause you provide a very normal perspective on the game it’s refreshing lol By normal I mean you’re not doomposting or being overly optimistic that you ignore the issues
HEAVY on your tank point with when tank becomes unfun it’s because the enemy tank is literally just staring at me all game and doing nothing else. Orisa or Mauga are like the biggest culprits for this. I love eating abilities, challenging highground or outplaying ults but then the whole time the plat enemy tank is just shooting my face the whole time it’s so boring. Like the devs and community seem to think tank is unfun bc 5v5 or supports abilities but actually no tank is unfun because of other tanks and their counter swapping plus the endless cc they can throw at the other tank all game.
my hot take is: Sigma is not a successful poke tank because his damage is ranged, but because his shield is ranged. He has no mobility, but can protect people at a distance, and his rock keeps people away. Orisa and Mauga fail to achieve this, their mitigation is very selfish, and everyone universally agrees they are brawl tanks. Ram could achieve this if they shifted more power into Omnic form. And I think Flying Orisa is ridiculous, but I also think she potentially could be made an interesting poke tank, if they figured out a way to either Javelin spin at a distance or... Fortify an ally?? idk
I've stayed quiet mostly over a lot of these discussions because people are being weird about it, and also because I wanted to take the time to find my own blind spots, as you've mentioned in the video. And the main thing I can say is that while I am not having the best time with this format, I would rather wait a while for the developers to make 6v6 a real contender in this game rather than rush it. Not to mention I've been telling people that if you don't like the way the game is for you on a personal level, and it still makes you miserable, you can find other games that scratch that itch (for me, that's Marvel Rivals). Just because you aren't enjoying the game, it does not mean you have the right to take away others' enjoyment of the game just to prove your point. A lot of the games that are trying to be the "Overwatch Killer" or are perceived to be as such is unfair to developers of both games, who ultimately want people to have a good time playing. You can have both games exist. You can enjoy or not enjoy the games you want without taking it too personally. And if you want to boycott, just don't play the game. It's your life. Great video.
Ehh I disagree with the second half. You are not their mother. The companies benefit only from competition and constant criticism. Giving props never helps anyone besides your child or something (and I don’t think you’re an entire company’s mother lol) It’s fine to say “Oh this is gonna kill that!” because the companies now feel obligated to not coast and they have to one up the other. I personally think it’s healthy. But overall I completely agree with your comment. I just think having people be “negative” is a good thing.
@@RIP_ZYZZ1738 With all due respect, while I don’t really take being seen as “motherly” as an offense, I fail to understand what I stated gave off any energy other than providing a relatively simple solution to a persistent issue. You can’t teach someone who doesn’t want to learn. I respect other people’s choice to continue their efforts for change, as it is surely needed. I only ask that people respect my opinion that I’ve bigger, more pressing issues beyond this and it’s better for me to step away while people like Niandra take the reins. And honestly? I’m seeing the line blur between healthy and unhealthy competition in this space that helps literally no one and makes everyone miserable. As radical as it sounds, I’m not the biggest fan of finding much joy in others’ failures-even, and sometimes especially-when they deserve it.
@@Briggsycakes I think you took the “motherly” think too seriously 😂. I was just making a point in a funny way and I didn’t elaborate, my bad. My point was that giving props to a company and not constantly criticizing them does nothing but make them worse. It’s not like we’re their parents or something and that we have to pat them on the back. I was unclear before, sorry. And I think failure is not necessarily a good thing, but the POTENTIAL for failure makes people, (especially companies) better. I agreed on the point that the fans themselves get too emotionally attached to a video game and they do more than just “criticize”. I personally think it’s a sacrifice that I’m fine with if it means keeping constant competition and criticism as a standard. But I agree with everything else you said
I really wish they would rework 2CP maps into payload or whatever because they are extremely nostalgic for me. I enjoy playing 2CP as a card in arcade and I want it to stay there
I went into custom games and just set the map to the old 2cp maps to go explore them and felt so weird seeing them again. Those maps were amazing and it’s such a shame they’re just languishing in the workshop.
I main symmetra and I've noticed that I can get by in most games without swapping, and when I can't there's another dps or healer who can. Sym's hardest counters are flying heroes she can't hit like Pharah and Echo. If the enemy team goes one of them my other dps can swap to a hitscan to cover for me. When enemies counter swap for the tank, they have to swap, there's no one else to cover their bases. 6v6 *could* easily fix this, simply allowing another tank to cover the other's faults. I think a potential other solution to discuss that could work with 5v5 is simply making the counters to certain hero's abilities less cut and dry. The 2 most egregious tank counters in my opinion is ana into hog or mauga and sym and zarya into dva. Dva being completley unable to block beam damage at all and mauga and hog having little to no defenses while anti healed make these matchups so impossibly painful. I think changes from the community made mode a while back such as dva's matrix reducing beam damage a little bit but still not blocking it completely are a step in the right direction. Beams would still be her weakness but she wouldn't be helpless against them
Big agree with the story/lore take. The PvE cinematics were nice, but I also in a way worried about how they would manage all the characters. I think, some form of soft reset or reconstruction of the story would be good.
This is why you're my favorite content creator. Well reasoned and not all up in your feelings because you just got tilted after reading patchnotes or watching Group Up. I don't watch ow news daily, and definitely prefer a more thoughtful information and analysis stream which necessarily means slower. You're the best!
Very nice vídeo, specially by tapping out of the game topics like the story and the value of the cosmetic content. I LOVE IT! The only thing i would add in the 5v5/6v6 thing is that people on the 5v5 team don't usually make content because it's the current format but because they're only driven by the past 6v6 flaws. Everytime someone step forward and try to make a point is either queue times or non format based problems, so the discussion just gets more and more shallow over time
everything i see about overwatch online is straight doomposting and im so exhausted. ive loved this game as my special interest for 7 years im so tired of hearing constant ooo it sucks ooo its a cash grab like can we focus on the bigger picture of this game
This video was really well thought out and presented. Amazing content P.s: I don't mind other content besides overwatch facts and educational mercy because you have a very soothing voice and nice personality
I had the opposite experience going from ow1 to ow2. I played more tank in ow1 because there was less pressure as a tank because there were 2 tanks. Now I don't really want to play tank at all
theres so much responsibility when youre the only tank. people will blame you automatically and if you lack in any way there isnt another person to help you unlike with dps and support. like if youre struggling to heal enough you have another support or if you need more utility, or if you need help finishing off kills you have another dps. tank doesnt have that and now its so much pressure on the one player
I've been playing from the beginning for the lore, and built my FPS skills specifically so I could keep playing it, and even got competitive for a while. Blizzard's broken promises and lack of story updates made it kinda painful to keep playing, especially around when OW2 launched, but after taking -checks watch- a dozen seasons off and deciding fuck it, maybe I'll play heroes in-character, it's brought the fun back a little. Deconstructing a fight through the lens of "everyone is their character in this fight," vs "I'm in a lobby full of randos" has made things a lot more engaging, and it's even brought back some memories of when PvP OW stories/memes/etc would get shared widely across the webs. I've put a lot more hours into the game recently, which hasn't happened in a while. That being said, I'm still cringing at the thought of paying $15 for story missions just yet, and I'd rather just grind for the pennies (equivalent) that they throw you for free than fork over cash for skins.
When you check voice lines on the wiki is surprising the amount of PvE voice lines that are already there but never saw the light, with ramattra there is A LOT, and he even has a special line when reviving zen, honestly id rather PvE than that mastery heroes thing
in regards to 6v6 queue times, i do wanna mention that i consistently have 10 minute queues in 3 stacks anyways. the queue times can get really long already.
I think this video is beyond good. Sure, there are things I don't fully agree with, but you can just not argue with the well-roundedness of your arguments. This is what the community needs more of. (also, coming from Flats' reaction video I still let this run in the bg just to get you the engagement ^^)
Lowkey feel like 6v6 is a massive drain on dev resources atp. I like both formats, but what are we missing out on to make this experiment work? I agree it’ll be fun for the first few days, then the cracks will start to show when players get tired of shooting barriers, bubbles, and matrices…
8:35 I couldn't agree more. Im drained from the INTENSE looking skins that are clearly catered to the genji soldier rien side of players and not the tracer sym mercy side of players if that makes sense. another thing that knocks my rocker is off-theme skins in the pass and on-theme skins in the shop. its so obviously a money grab so they get ppl who like the theme to purchase things in the shop as well as the pass
every cutesy skin weve gotten is like a recolor or something. i want a calmer cute skin, like cool and intense skins do look nice, its just not my style. i wish i could just get something cute so bad lol
There’s been a lot of change going on in my life, but aside from that I think that my growing apathy for the game is that the story mode has been dead in the water for a while. The recent characters haven’t progressed the story as well, I remember when Ramattra came out and he brought the story forward, just playing him felt like overwatch’s story has evolved with his release. the newer characters like Juno and venture aren’t bad, they are fun to play and I do like their design but it just feels like lots of the recent characters aren’t really involved in the main story. It’s okay to have characters that aren’t right in the main story but it feels like most of the recent ones aren’t from the story. if we aren’t getting a PVE mode why not try to use characters and cinematics to progress it instead? I’m glad that Juno got a cinematic but what about story cinematics? Say we get a 10-15 minute video every 2 seasons (maybe the season when the map comes out to make it more exciting?) overwatch has such an amazing story and people for a long time have wanted a show, I think this is a good way to not split developer team with the story mode while still progressing the story
oh my god ive never agreed so much while watching an overwatch CC video before. i feel EXACTLY the way you described in so much of this - tanking in 5v5 and the PVE in particular. i also dont like getting into the 5v5 vs 6v6 debate because in the end noone is changing their minds and the devs will have to make the most practical decision anyway (at least i would hope!) and that requires analysis of a lot of statistics and decisions that we just arent privy to. and i also feel like i like tank more in 5v5 than 6v6! i had a bit of burnout when the season 9 changes happened, but overall i feel so much freer to try tank in 5v5 than 6v6 because i hated feeling like i was throwing whenever i didnt match my other tank in whatever tank meta was happening in ow1 - i basically only ever enjoyed playing dva and zarya, but there were months where i didnt play tank because the meta was orisa hog or orisa sigma and i didnt like any of these heroes. i liked off tanks, but id get games where my other tank was also an off tank lover and then where would that leave us? 5v5 has its own issues, but personally its less worrisome to me to have to consider the enemy team comp than my own tank lineup. it feels more flexible in that regard. with the ow pve i agree too that i dont trust a big show or movie just yet. i miss cinematics, but frankly speaking the old core overwatch storyline is...weak. having omnics be this awkward racism metaphor is something id be more than happy be scrapped and left in the past or completely reworked because as the lore stands, the implications are ugly. i think overwatch shines with character writing, giving each hero a fun backstory and personality and writing interesting and entertaining conversations between them. but like you said, especially with layoffs of the writing department in particular, i just dont want to have to suffer through an underfunded, underdeveloped, and understaffed attempt at something that could be really cool thank you for the video i love ur content so much💛💛💛
clicked because of the fire juno art in the thumbnail, stayed because this video is so brilliant and so digestible. amazing stuff, especially for someone who just got back into OW!
What a great video overall! There is a lot i agree with and it was just so satisfying and calming listening to you because it's not someone screaming in my ears how 6v6 is better than 5v5 and how the game sucks.
THANK you for bringing up how absolutely low the lows of 6v6 were. there were so many times among my friends where it was either me or nobody queueing for tank, and i have never been good at any of the "main tank" characters nor do i find them fun. such a frustrating experience. that being said, the most recent patch is starting to turn me into a 6v6er if this is how the team thinks tank is gonna be solved. the DPS passive was a mistake, tanks either feel like punching bags or raid bosses with no in-between, and i am extremely sick of Mauga.
im sick of watching my tanks get in endless counterswap battles... like. i remember 6v6. it had horrific lows. its just getting to the point id rather take that trade off of low lows than continue in this raid boss/punching bag direction. because its honestly just boring and it feels like the lows did and im not even the tank player. like in some ways its better and in some its worse and its the same with 6v6. in my head theyre evenly matched but outer circumstances change that. for example how the devs balance 5v5 vs. 6v6 is going to be the main decider for me on what is there. in an ideal world id wish you could have both but thatd be impossible lol
@@peiithos i do totally agree! i just wish people would acknowledge the failings of 6v6 so everyone doesn't get their hopes way up for the 6v6 test and remember all the bad parts of the format.
I can't cultivate a healthy relationship with ow2 when I see people actually buying stuff day 1 from the shop, being counterswapped and lose a match because of it, it feels like im trying to ignore some stuff and enjoy but the big issues of the game are just there directly in front of me spitting in my face.
The lore of overwatch means so much to me. Watching those cinematics when they first came out did something to my brain and it’s changed my relationship with animation and storytelling. I love the potential that overwatch’s lore has and it physically pains me to see the state of it. PvE saddens me so much. I’ve never been huge in gaming, I honestly suck at the game, but god it’s so fun. I desperately need this game to do good.
Just got into the game as a Mercy main a few days ago and I hear a lot of things about balance but I don't really see them since I only play casual. Maybe it'll show later. Good video ^-^
I feel the lore needs to be rebooted with less factions (no new ones) and develop the remaining ones with more characters. Kiriko, Illiari, Juno, and Venture for example, all have throw away factions that serve no purpose. In addition some the preexisting characters also have this problem. By reducing the amount of factions the more attention they can give the remaining ones.
I honestly stayed up until 3am last night because assault maps were in the arcade. This is saying a lot because I'm a devout "in bed by 10 pm" person. I think the reason I enjoyed playing 2cp so much last night was familiarity with the maps but the novelty of having not played them in over a year (or longer, in the case of Paris and Horizon). It was the most fun and fresh OW has felt in months for me, but I think that's actually more of a sign that I need to take some breaks than anything else. It's getting stale and I'm getting tired. I log on hoping for magic and it never happens. Happy to see an upload from you and really enjoyed your insight as always!
Ya know I saw the mercy and was like nice, BUT THAT WINSTON GAMEPLAY WAS INSANE Like genuinely the discussion was awesome and eloquent and well thought out, but gah damn those juggling skills
The game has such a large female player base that it's actually INSANE that there aren't more skins pandering to them. Like there's the joke that "Blizz needs money from the she, they, and gays so they dropped another Mercy/Kiriko skin" but like... we'd do that for OTHER characters if the skin was cute enough. I'm not a strong girl, ANY of the characters in a magical girl outfit would have me pulling out my wallet.
People don't remember queueing tank and having your co-tank lock hog and feed fishing for hooks all game. I REALLY do not want that "solo tank" experience back
I have loved the characters and the bits of lore we get and the Fandom of for overwatch 1 did a great job of making greatness of what little we got from skins events and the few shorts we got Ow 1 Fandom was Peak but with how little lore we got since and how they changed so much stuff its just sad with how it had the potential and the Fandom backing it for something great hopefully if we do get more they don't fumble what's left
Tbh i counter your argument on the Mythic Skin Design! I love the darker twisted spin on these skins they’ve released so far! A Moira who doesn’t look to science for the answers to Life and Death but a False God. Vengeance the Archangel of Talon’s Design! A Simulacrum of a fellow friend turned into another drone fit for Ramattra’s Army… It makes me think of a Potential Multiverse direction that they wanted to take they’re story in! But now we’re getting scraps… it’s like these skins were what was meant to be…
Hi Niandra! It’s so good seeing someone’s opinion about the state of this game that is more on the lore side of things. It’s always good to see someone bringing out an new pov on the situation. Keep up the good work Also I wanna add that if I call you she without noticing it is because my native language (Portuguese) hasn’t neutral pronouns, so sorry about that ):
Playing 2CP on Arcade definitely feels better than playing the Robot mode. Hope they'd rework 2CP maps and get rid of robot, perhaps make it a control map.
I did buy lootboxes simply to support the development in OW1, though I already had everything. But charging 20-30 for a single skin, when I did pay that to own the entire game before free2play and also still is a range that includes a lot of AAA games on PC - especially on discount when of course OW2 skins are always on 'discount' - is not expensive but has to be considered a scam. I am sure they'd sell way more if skins were the price of a cup of coffee at a cafe - a tenth of what they are now, esentially - they'd sell probably a hundred times more. I know I'd have bought many at this point, and happily given them my support, but it really feels like supporting a scam rn. I WANT to buy skins for my favorite game. But it feels insane to do so currently, no matter how much money one has to burn.
The thing about OW is the internet seems to be perpetually wanting it to fail. When the game was first announced it was gonna be “dead on arrival” and “team fortress clone”, when the game wasn’t getting any updates it was “dead” and the sequel wouldn’t save it, and now it’s dead because a third person game is coming out at some point. The problem is OW has been consistently going for 8 years where other games have come and gone. It’s outlasted it’s contemporaries and I just wish the internet could accept its not going anywhere so we could talk about the actual issues with the game
The actual issue is how strict they are on comms. So many people get banned for very mild stuff like saying “easy gg” can get your perma banned if people report you enough
Lightning fast opinion time: 5v5 is better for queue times, 6v6 is better for gameplay, both matter a fuck ton. The monetization is out of control and actively contributes to me playing less, makes me feel dirty for even opening the game. I liked this video
Regarding a lore reboot/reset, some characters could benefit from it; Hanzo and Sigma come to mind first because it's apparent the writers are struggling to include them in anything. And then there's Lucio who has minimal backstory before joining up with Overwatch. But aside from that I'm not sure if it'll be worth it considering it's an enormous undertaking and most character backstories are fine as is.
twoooo things, 1, it's kinda fair when people base their opinions on the season based on the battle pass- patches come and go. 2-3 at the most. the BP is something we're actively trying to grind. If it's bad/not up to standard of course it's going to be something people don't want to grind for. and if there's nothing to grind aside from those mini events (that have been slowly getting worse), then what? 2, the theming debating is kinda eh? I get more want cutesy skins, more want badass skins, etc. but it's something no one is going to be satisfied with. other than that, this video was great!! agreed with everything else you brought up!
I genuinely stopped playing at the start of Overwatch 1.5 due to 5v5. It's just not fun to me and i loved Overwatch for the Synergy and Chaotic moments. I come back occasionally play 1 or 2 matches in a season and uninstall it again. The other thing is what's weird to me when i heard the Devs talk about the competetive nature of the game and what not. To me from Overwatches release it was never meant to be a competetive game it got shoved down over the course later on with Overwatch league, Role Que etc. step by step. And let's be real here balance wise you can have 2 heroes and you would still have issues it is a hero shooter after all. But the Devs took away from me something which i loved Overwatch for which makes me still salty and bitter. When i for example recently took part in the Marvel Rivals test it scratched that old Overwatch itch that i miss since 1.5. I really do hope they bring it back in some form. Like nobody even forced them to completely remove it, i would have been fine if it had been left as an optional card in arcade for example and i would still play it.
Great video! In general, I agree there are a lot of things that OW could do to be better. I think the game is in a really good state right now though which is pretty cool because it's felt like things have been really rocky since like.... halfway through OW 1's life lol
Loved the video!! I think you've become my favorite RUclipsr to hear talk about the game. Your takes are well thought out and down to earth, and even when I disagree with you I can always see where you're coming from. I'd really like to hear you talk about the game more often, but I'm sure this type of video takes a while to make. Sooo have you thought about making a second channel with more frequent uploads but lower effort content? Improvised videos, clips from streams maybe, ramblings, etc. Stuff like what KarQ does where he answers reddit questions from r/competitiveoverwatch. It's up to you obviously, but I think there might be an audience for that. At least I know I'd love to hear you yap about the game once a week or something like that while I do chores. Anyways, good video! It's clear you put a lot of effort into articulating your ideas as well as you can.
The point said about the story is a good one! With the lack of old writers it is a real possibility, and a fear of mine, that a show would absolutely trash the current/intended characterisations. A soft reset could be the right choice if done properly.. oh so many things could be nice is done well
I love 5v5 and think the tank exp is way better. Counterwatch can suck but it's not happening as much or as bad as everyone says. One less player on the map makes it easier to get through chokes and makes the action more free flowing. I guess I prefer the shooter OW to the moba OW, even though both parts make it the great game it is. Great Vid!
12:37 It should be noted that while Gavin Jurgens-Fyhrie was laid off, T4 does have a new narrative lead now with Miranda Moyer, who joined the team in 2020.
I haven't played the game for a few days now just playing other games, but I still have been following everything as well as just thinking about OW1 vs OW2 and talking to friends about it. One of my friends said that 6v6 is 100% the solution as it looked very fun in custom games (certain streamers were playing it for a while), but I told him that those 3 days that they played that just isn't enough to tell you whether it really is the solution or not. Sure it may start well, but as you said in the video, months will go by and people might complain again as 6v6 comes with its own variety of issues that most people are either ignoring or aren't noticing. I understand both sides, but saying 6v6 will fix the game is definitely wrong in my opinion. It's never just that simple. Totally agree on the battlepass themes as well. It's been a lot of villain type of stuff and it would be nice to have a very different theme. Also, the highlight intros.. are all so boring. It feels like most of them is the character doing barely any movement and just looking into the camera. The entire animation in that highlight intro could most of the time even be a victory pose or an emote. It feels very lazy and boring in comparison to the old ones we used to get. And onto the reason I haven't been playing, I just have personal beef and anger towards the balancing team or whoever writes the blogposts. I know you didn't go into any specific heroes here when it comes to the balancing, but I've been getting increasingly frustrated with Mercy since last year April (since they nerfed GA and added this weird activation cd), even worse after they said they would buff her if they increase the DPS passive again (which they did, yet no buffs in sight and she is probably in the worst state she's ever been- besides the infamous 15 nerfs in a row after her rework in OW1). The blogpost will say something about buffing or reverting a certain change - but they just don't do it? Has this happened with other heroes? I genuinely want to know, because surely Mercy isn't the only one who gets these empty promises in those blogposts.
I play it for fun, sometimes with 3 friends, sometimes alone, and its been pretty fun. The main thing is ALL CHARACTERS ARE ALWAYS LIBERATED, and thats amazing, lets you try other characters, strategies and counters and keeps it fresh (other games where you need to unlock the characters you might slog until the next unlock and just drop out, my fear with Marvel Rivals being that, because any free game that you have to unlock characters nowadays make it an absolute grind to unlock even one). Im really eager to see the new stuff to come, and I think they will become even more daring with Marvel Rivals on the horizon.
I agree with a lot of these things . I miss the overwatch animators and the fact that we have to spend money to play a pve + animations just doesn’t seems fun or fair. Thanks for making this!!
In League of Legends some of the characters have skins that are very similar to one another. They aren't recolors, but veeery close. For example, any of the star guardian skins that have a pajama guardian variant (Lulu, Ezreal, Miss Fortune, Lux, Soraka), or dark cosmic Lux and cosmic Lux. If you buy one of the counterparts, you get the other one at a discounted price, or you can buy both in a bundle that is cheaper than buying them individually. I wish Overwatch would implement something like this with the amount of recolors they keep releasing.
I just recently convinced 3 of my friends to either start playing Overwatch or come back so I’m happy that I can play with some friends I actually know in person, but that won’t change my feelings on how they canceled pve. A lot of my friends want to play pve because they know I have it but they can’t spend much money on the game and so they can’t get pve. Also pve queues are so slow. Really sad yk.. cause I want to finish my hero lore.
HOLY SHIT NIANDRA you cant pretend you didn't just drop a fire TWENTY minute winston juggle montage.
All the chill talking and music won't distract us from your tank skills
i love winston!!!
@@Niandramy respect for you just doubled
@@Niandramore important question did you draw that gorgeous Juno art?
++++
@@Niandrawinston or winton ?
The current state of the lore is so so frustrating and how ppl downplay the importance of it makes it worse.
Idk if interactions count as true lore but they give so much life to the characters
Seriously. New hero additions used to be majorly exciting because it meant new cinematic and potentially the overall story progressing. Now it’s like they just drop them in and that’s it. They don’t even get cosmetics anymore lmao
I mean I was attracted by the how the character was portrayed in a fantasy world that is not a typical shooter, that’s why I, who never liked playing any fps games, decided to give Overwatch a shot.
I feel like recent new heroes didn’t have a tight relations with other heroes as the older ones do (e.g. Venture, Juno), and they also do not play a critical role of the lore, which makes them even more irrelevant and less exciting, for me at least.
Not to mention they ‘gutted’ PVE, an immersive storytelling experience which I was very excited about, but we don’t go there.
@@razrv3lc they get released so close together too. It’s hard for the community to become attached when there’s always something new looking for attention
They're not unfortunately. The Devs have said that it isn't canon because it wouldn't make sense to have Talon and overwatch on the same team for example. It's just a glimpse of what their interactions would actually look like. Heck even the game itself isn't canon. @@anthonyreddude4713
I'm not going to lie, the lack of lore has been a huge part of my growing disinterest in playing the game. It really makes me so sad. Especially when I go back and read all the lore drops from the little PVE we did get.
What do you mean we got plenty of lore!
We got those birthdays! You know, kiriko being half the shimadas age when training alongside them, McCree being canonically 3 different ages, and Sojourn becoming a captain at 19 years old while her 14 year old sister was getting preggers!
At this point lets be real, if they can't do the most basic thing like getting the characters ages correct, do we really want in depth lore?
@@darcidious99 mccree/cas has what...
@Fresh-ql8sd what if 3 different McCrees all live in the same timeline at once
What if 3 different mcrees/cass are like joker, in which there is no real 1 mcree, but they're all mcree.
@@darcidious99Oh let's not forget about that one fanfiction being promoted as official canon lore of Reaper not being only a self-pittying simp that decided to get a child during his most sociopathic and unstable phase of his life, pulling off suicide-missions while also being in his mid40-early 50s but also being a great stereotype example of a brown angry cop with anger issues that was ooc obsessed with small crime in a crime filled city than with the literal genocide that happened during that time...all ofc before he joined the military.
As if it didn't already overcomplicated the spaghetti timeline anyways!
Like when did he found the time to go through police training + years of a career background to be able to join the undercover force just to join the military in his early years.
Like when?!
Especially when stating in Retribution that he already worked with blackwatch/overwatch atleast for 20 years at that point.
So he was in his 30s at that point when joining atleast.
Legitimately when did he find the time for all of that.
I absolutely despise the new lore and also don't see code of violence as canon.
Not mentioning that me and my friends used to call his potential exwife maria just for the jokes (before she got a official name we called her the most uncreative stereotypical latina name) just to be hit with "Martina" (hahah still cracks me up to this day)
Also the author of that story also went on a huge Twitter rant after the initial backlash and shitstorm of Reaper fans alike ( lets not mention the reaper76 shippers who went overboard with their harassment and yapping of their favorite ship being "ruined" by a wife everyone was atleast aware of existing at some point) and called everyone a hater and bots and that he is aware of his abilities and skills and won't listem to any haters (btw his "writing' is again another can of worms, to leave it short, dude was making beginner mistakes and also stepped over chus initial lore bible that he followed in which he tried to seperate reapers identity from his previous life and never called him reyes. This dude not only used the name "Reyes" in a shortstory up to 200 tines but also never used any other synonyms. It gets tiring to read in every sentence "Reyes said. Reyes nodded. Reyes thought." That's some elementary school level of writing.
But hey atleast he tried to bait the reaper76 fans to chill out bcs there is so much more lore coming they don't know about.
Oh yeah and also google translator sombra was my favorite.
This was the coup de grace that made me drop the lore entirely.
I mean i find some of the new additions nice, like the declassified lorebook or the mauga backstory but those are also lorebits and pieces you can tell got their origin from Chu's feather.
100%.
They were in the making before he left and remained in his secret lore vault.
I personally miss his ingenious writing alot and the fact that he took his writingstyle and inspiration from Finalfantasy storytelling style makes so much sense to me how he is able to give stereotype designed characters such complex and deep stories to flash them out.
The lore of some of the new cast is pretty pathetic to me.
Kiriko, weaver...illari omg illari.
They don't fit the universe at all and are so blant and unutilized in the characters we see in game.
Like does anyone remeber how weaver got potrayed as a badboy terrorist in his origin story but is the most harmless and optimistic character dialogue wise?
I just can't give a damn anymore.
It's so nice to have a video discussing the state of Overwatch that doesn't just focus on the balance, there is so much more to this game than just its competitive aspects.
Yes I love the rose toy collab 😍
oh god not potnoodle 😭
@@MarshPlays I can’t escape it.
Like what? It’s a PvP game where the vast majority of people play 5v5 either quick play or comp. Most people don’t care or play arcade or limited time modes
@@oscar3153that’s not even true. Qp is not competitive and many people play arcade and customs
One of the most intelligent, nuanced, down to earth, and sensible takes on overwatch I've heard in a long time. I'm so over the endless whining and debating and trying to be perfect. Make a call that is best and most fun for most people not the loudest people and go with it.
Magical girl skins is so obvious I'm surprised they haven't done it yet. Good point
Magical girl hanzo
They should do them with Dva, Juno, Mei, Kiriko and Genji.
@@_V.Va_ Nah they should do it with Illari, Mercy, Juno, Kiriko, Mei, Sym, Dva. We don't need male heroes getting them and magical girls as a concept isn't inherently Asian so idk why you grouped all the Asian heroes who are different ethnities together lol. Magical girls as a genre is about girl power and fantasy. Genji getting a Magical Girl skin would be pretty icky for what the genre stands for IMO.
@@SirenRyan I said what I said. Genji slays.
@@SirenRyancounterpoint, who gives a shit when magical girl roadhog would be funny as shit?
“i fall to my knees in tesco with gratitude”😭😭😭😭
“Hello horse, I shall call you tesco” - Jeremy Clarkson, UK’s sexiest man
At the Monetization part right now, and I have to agree : Yes Overwatch is not the worst and gets more thrown into its face than other games that deserve it as much, and it's an industry-wide problem. But you're also right in pointing out that it's still egregious.
(and goddamn, Venture didn't even get a Legendary skin since their launch)
Was the candy skin not legendary?
@@zadinalnah it was an epic, they’ve only gotten two new skins. The ice cream parlor one and the pride one
@@ivyproductions7097 oh, that is such a shame! To be fair though it is a great skin
@@zadinal Agree! It just sucks one you had to pay for while the other was a twitch drop, I don’t have a twitch so I unfortunately couldn’t get it 😭
@@zadinal Nope, epic. With an emote.
And characters come out without Epics or Legendaries in the hero gallery since Mauga.
This might not work with the algorithm, but if you want to start posting winston content I'm there lmao
I just want the archives back. But then again, they'll probably charge ppl 20 bucks for them.
Bring archives back!
++ Archives must comeback! It’s the least they can do for cancelling PVE
Literally they could release one new story mission each year to progress lore the way they used to. They wouldn’t have to work on it but once a year which seems perfectly doable.
@@razrv3lc imagine selling skins with it 👀
@@DankPit it baffles me they’re not doing it like this already lol. The old events used to be the great skin sellers anyways.
Cosmetics are wildly overpriced. It isn't greedy to want a skin for 2-5 bucks when the quality is mid. I want to support OW2 but I can't stand the exchange rate so I'm just not paying for it right now.
If you play any other games with cosmetics ow2 skins are the cheapest
@@ckamo10 honestly I don't play many and I rarely spend money on them unless they seem to give good value. Like honestly their mythic skins(or at least the good ones) are a great value. High quality, lots of options. But then you have fucking mid tier but going for $20. CSGO skins because of the market are amazing in terms of price. I guess I am a bit out of date, my reference is things like WOW Guild wars, and TF2.
It just seems ludicrous the cost for several skins. They are so bullshit quality but charged like the same price as truly amazing skins. I would honestly buy more of they knocked the price down 50%
@@zadinal I agree with you like recolour shouldn’t be 20$ or a skin that’s clearly an epic shouldn’t be priced as a legendary one. I’m just saying all these companies be doing all these things yenno
@@ckamo10 true, though we can work at pushing back so there will be cheaper options or heck, give us a market so we can trade them.
@@ckamo10in helldivers 2, battle pass with 3 skins is 9.99$, 3.33$ for each. Considering they come with 3 premium weapons, some poses, it would be cheaper than that.
Wake up babe, Niandra just posted a video!
LMAO that clip at 9:21. The bait on that doom. I fucking dying.
I love OW. I don't care about balance that much. I have some heroes I like, some I don't like anyone else. I guess I'm pretty casual but I play it a lot. I don't touch comp that much because I don't like attack/defense maps (it feels to long). I'm satisfied with the seasonal content because it's what I always wanted since OW1 (specifically after Apex launched. I always saw those early seasons they had and all we got was the same junkenstein and lucio ball every year).
What I hate is the negativity about OW everywhere on the internet. I just want to watch some gameplay and maybe some funny/interesting things about the game. I'm tired about the "dead game", "the balance team should be fired", "Its just a cash grab" and everything else. Some complaints are valid I understand that, but it gets so annoying. When everyone says the game I love is shit I end up feeling like I'm wrong for liking the game and I know that I'm not.
I know its hard but I just wish people were happier about the game. Its not that bad as people say. I know there are points the devs can make better but the way people talk its like the sky is falling.
Also WTF 18:07. More gameplays or clips like that please. You're really good playing tank. That's one fact for hte "10 facts about Niandra playing OW you dont know"
Honestly OW isn’t dead, but OW RUclips is dead. No one plays the game they always have to just kind of play intellectual businessman and game designer
@@Sandman10032 overwatch is death, what made the game special is no more, is just another game with expensive skins
Overwatch has NOTHING aspirational outlined for the future. Warcraft has a new expansion coming out this month AND Diablo 4 has one coming in Oct. I wish Blizzard would give us something to look forward to for OW.
Juno lol
@@arnauargelich1113 not really the level I'm talking about
@@ValeOverwatch I get what you mean. What does Overwatch have now to look forward to besides skins and events, events where people are most excited for events BECAUSE of skins??
I know there's the promise of new characters, maps, etc. but what about something BIG??
@@mina-min we are talking about overwatch, the core gameplay is good, they can only expand it with new maps, modes and heroes. The only big big thing they can bring, is PVE or similar, at least that's what I personally think
@@arnauargelich1113 You get it.
Niandra I love your mercy content but I’m very happy you branch out to general OW stuff too cause you provide a very normal perspective on the game it’s refreshing lol
By normal I mean you’re not doomposting or being overly optimistic that you ignore the issues
0:08 you got an achievement, well done Niandra!
niandra flexing her dps skills
HEAVY on your tank point with when tank becomes unfun it’s because the enemy tank is literally just staring at me all game and doing nothing else. Orisa or Mauga are like the biggest culprits for this.
I love eating abilities, challenging highground or outplaying ults but then the whole time the plat enemy tank is just shooting my face the whole time it’s so boring.
Like the devs and community seem to think tank is unfun bc 5v5 or supports abilities but actually no tank is unfun because of other tanks and their counter swapping plus the endless cc they can throw at the other tank all game.
my hot take is: Sigma is not a successful poke tank because his damage is ranged, but because his shield is ranged. He has no mobility, but can protect people at a distance, and his rock keeps people away. Orisa and Mauga fail to achieve this, their mitigation is very selfish, and everyone universally agrees they are brawl tanks. Ram could achieve this if they shifted more power into Omnic form. And I think Flying Orisa is ridiculous, but I also think she potentially could be made an interesting poke tank, if they figured out a way to either Javelin spin at a distance or... Fortify an ally?? idk
@@theshard5697Do you want Orisa shield back?
@@monsieurromanbedlam5101 no, I really like the javelin fantasy and I think they should focus on that
That is CAUSED by 5v5 bro
I've stayed quiet mostly over a lot of these discussions because people are being weird about it, and also because I wanted to take the time to find my own blind spots, as you've mentioned in the video. And the main thing I can say is that while I am not having the best time with this format, I would rather wait a while for the developers to make 6v6 a real contender in this game rather than rush it. Not to mention I've been telling people that if you don't like the way the game is for you on a personal level, and it still makes you miserable, you can find other games that scratch that itch (for me, that's Marvel Rivals). Just because you aren't enjoying the game, it does not mean you have the right to take away others' enjoyment of the game just to prove your point. A lot of the games that are trying to be the "Overwatch Killer" or are perceived to be as such is unfair to developers of both games, who ultimately want people to have a good time playing. You can have both games exist. You can enjoy or not enjoy the games you want without taking it too personally. And if you want to boycott, just don't play the game. It's your life.
Great video.
Ehh I disagree with the second half. You are not their mother. The companies benefit only from competition and constant criticism. Giving props never helps anyone besides your child or something (and I don’t think you’re an entire company’s mother lol)
It’s fine to say “Oh this is gonna kill that!” because the companies now feel obligated to not coast and they have to one up the other.
I personally think it’s healthy. But overall I completely agree with your comment. I just think having people be “negative” is a good thing.
@@RIP_ZYZZ1738 With all due respect, while I don’t really take being seen as “motherly” as an offense, I fail to understand what I stated gave off any energy other than providing a relatively simple solution to a persistent issue. You can’t teach someone who doesn’t want to learn. I respect other people’s choice to continue their efforts for change, as it is surely needed. I only ask that people respect my opinion that I’ve bigger, more pressing issues beyond this and it’s better for me to step away while people like Niandra take the reins.
And honestly? I’m seeing the line blur between healthy and unhealthy competition in this space that helps literally no one and makes everyone miserable. As radical as it sounds, I’m not the biggest fan of finding much joy in others’ failures-even, and sometimes especially-when they deserve it.
@@Briggsycakes I think you took the “motherly” think too seriously 😂. I was just making a point in a funny way and I didn’t elaborate, my bad. My point was that giving props to a company and not constantly criticizing them does nothing but make them worse. It’s not like we’re their parents or something and that we have to pat them on the back. I was unclear before, sorry.
And I think failure is not necessarily a good thing, but the POTENTIAL for failure makes people, (especially companies) better. I agreed on the point that the fans themselves get too emotionally attached to a video game and they do more than just “criticize”. I personally think it’s a sacrifice that I’m fine with if it means keeping constant competition and criticism as a standard.
But I agree with everything else you said
@@RIP_ZYZZ1738 Fair enough.
there is an overwatch killer, and that is overwatch itself. Overwatch killed its self and the devs are to blame for it
That sigma clip of blocking the rein’s shatter just in time with his shield made me transcend
I really wish they would rework 2CP maps into payload or whatever because they are extremely nostalgic for me. I enjoy playing 2CP as a card in arcade and I want it to stay there
I went into custom games and just set the map to the old 2cp maps to go explore them and felt so weird seeing them again. Those maps were amazing and it’s such a shame they’re just languishing in the workshop.
@@razrv3lc they feel so weird to play because they actually have soul
Came for the discussion but stayed for these insane primal juggles
WAIT STOP NIANDRA YOU USED MY MERCY CLIP AT 12:24 I'm so honored that caught me so off guard
Thank you Niandra for being an empathetic and balanced voice in the community
I main symmetra and I've noticed that I can get by in most games without swapping, and when I can't there's another dps or healer who can. Sym's hardest counters are flying heroes she can't hit like Pharah and Echo. If the enemy team goes one of them my other dps can swap to a hitscan to cover for me. When enemies counter swap for the tank, they have to swap, there's no one else to cover their bases. 6v6 *could* easily fix this, simply allowing another tank to cover the other's faults.
I think a potential other solution to discuss that could work with 5v5 is simply making the counters to certain hero's abilities less cut and dry. The 2 most egregious tank counters in my opinion is ana into hog or mauga and sym and zarya into dva. Dva being completley unable to block beam damage at all and mauga and hog having little to no defenses while anti healed make these matchups so impossibly painful. I think changes from the community made mode a while back such as dva's matrix reducing beam damage a little bit but still not blocking it completely are a step in the right direction. Beams would still be her weakness but she wouldn't be helpless against them
The quality of your videos and the way you present your points just never disappoints, well done as always!
Also that doom juke at 9:20 is hilarious
Niandra told me to have a nice day so I will listen to them.
Big agree with the story/lore take. The PvE cinematics were nice, but I also in a way worried about how they would manage all the characters. I think, some form of soft reset or reconstruction of the story would be good.
really loved this video, thank you for putting it together 💖
This is why you're my favorite content creator. Well reasoned and not all up in your feelings because you just got tilted after reading patchnotes or watching Group Up. I don't watch ow news daily, and definitely prefer a more thoughtful information and analysis stream which necessarily means slower. You're the best!
Very nice vídeo, specially by tapping out of the game topics like the story and the value of the cosmetic content. I LOVE IT! The only thing i would add in the 5v5/6v6 thing is that people on the 5v5 team don't usually make content because it's the current format but because they're only driven by the past 6v6 flaws. Everytime someone step forward and try to make a point is either queue times or non format based problems, so the discussion just gets more and more shallow over time
omg i’ve been waiting for this
“This thing is great when you don’t have someone in your rear telling you it sucks” 100000% resumes the experience of OW2 on social media
everything i see about overwatch online is straight doomposting and im so exhausted. ive loved this game as my special interest for 7 years im so tired of hearing constant ooo it sucks ooo its a cash grab like can we focus on the bigger picture of this game
This video was really well thought out and presented.
Amazing content
P.s: I don't mind other content besides overwatch facts and educational mercy because you have a very soothing voice and nice personality
I had the opposite experience going from ow1 to ow2. I played more tank in ow1 because there was less pressure as a tank because there were 2 tanks. Now I don't really want to play tank at all
theres so much responsibility when youre the only tank. people will blame you automatically and if you lack in any way there isnt another person to help you unlike with dps and support. like if youre struggling to heal enough you have another support or if you need more utility, or if you need help finishing off kills you have another dps. tank doesnt have that and now its so much pressure on the one player
I've been playing from the beginning for the lore, and built my FPS skills specifically so I could keep playing it, and even got competitive for a while. Blizzard's broken promises and lack of story updates made it kinda painful to keep playing, especially around when OW2 launched, but after taking -checks watch- a dozen seasons off and deciding fuck it, maybe I'll play heroes in-character, it's brought the fun back a little. Deconstructing a fight through the lens of "everyone is their character in this fight," vs "I'm in a lobby full of randos" has made things a lot more engaging, and it's even brought back some memories of when PvP OW stories/memes/etc would get shared widely across the webs. I've put a lot more hours into the game recently, which hasn't happened in a while.
That being said, I'm still cringing at the thought of paying $15 for story missions just yet, and I'd rather just grind for the pennies (equivalent) that they throw you for free than fork over cash for skins.
When you check voice lines on the wiki is surprising the amount of PvE voice lines that are already there but never saw the light, with ramattra there is A LOT, and he even has a special line when reviving zen, honestly id rather PvE than that mastery heroes thing
in regards to 6v6 queue times, i do wanna mention that i consistently have 10 minute queues in 3 stacks anyways. the queue times can get really long already.
I think this video is beyond good. Sure, there are things I don't fully agree with, but you can just not argue with the well-roundedness of your arguments.
This is what the community needs more of.
(also, coming from Flats' reaction video I still let this run in the bg just to get you the engagement ^^)
Lowkey feel like 6v6 is a massive drain on dev resources atp. I like both formats, but what are we missing out on to make this experiment work?
I agree it’ll be fun for the first few days, then the cracks will start to show when players get tired of shooting barriers, bubbles, and matrices…
Those are balance issues, not format issues.
8:35 I couldn't agree more. Im drained from the INTENSE looking skins that are clearly catered to the genji soldier rien side of players and not the tracer sym mercy side of players if that makes sense. another thing that knocks my rocker is off-theme skins in the pass and on-theme skins in the shop. its so obviously a money grab so they get ppl who like the theme to purchase things in the shop as well as the pass
every cutesy skin weve gotten is like a recolor or something. i want a calmer cute skin, like cool and intense skins do look nice, its just not my style. i wish i could just get something cute so bad lol
There’s been a lot of change going on in my life, but aside from that I think that my growing apathy for the game is that the story mode has been dead in the water for a while. The recent characters haven’t progressed the story as well, I remember when Ramattra came out and he brought the story forward, just playing him felt like overwatch’s story has evolved with his release. the newer characters like Juno and venture aren’t bad, they are fun to play and I do like their design but it just feels like lots of the recent characters aren’t really involved in the main story. It’s okay to have characters that aren’t right in the main story but it feels like most of the recent ones aren’t from the story. if we aren’t getting a PVE mode why not try to use characters and cinematics to progress it instead? I’m glad that Juno got a cinematic but what about story cinematics? Say we get a 10-15 minute video every 2 seasons (maybe the season when the map comes out to make it more exciting?) overwatch has such an amazing story and people for a long time have wanted a show, I think this is a good way to not split developer team with the story mode while still progressing the story
You hold some awesome points in this video.
Id love an OW show like Star Wars Visions, where they have one shot episodes in the OW universe
oh my god ive never agreed so much while watching an overwatch CC video before. i feel EXACTLY the way you described in so much of this - tanking in 5v5 and the PVE in particular. i also dont like getting into the 5v5 vs 6v6 debate because in the end noone is changing their minds and the devs will have to make the most practical decision anyway (at least i would hope!) and that requires analysis of a lot of statistics and decisions that we just arent privy to. and i also feel like i like tank more in 5v5 than 6v6! i had a bit of burnout when the season 9 changes happened, but overall i feel so much freer to try tank in 5v5 than 6v6 because i hated feeling like i was throwing whenever i didnt match my other tank in whatever tank meta was happening in ow1 - i basically only ever enjoyed playing dva and zarya, but there were months where i didnt play tank because the meta was orisa hog or orisa sigma and i didnt like any of these heroes. i liked off tanks, but id get games where my other tank was also an off tank lover and then where would that leave us? 5v5 has its own issues, but personally its less worrisome to me to have to consider the enemy team comp than my own tank lineup. it feels more flexible in that regard.
with the ow pve i agree too that i dont trust a big show or movie just yet. i miss cinematics, but frankly speaking the old core overwatch storyline is...weak. having omnics be this awkward racism metaphor is something id be more than happy be scrapped and left in the past or completely reworked because as the lore stands, the implications are ugly. i think overwatch shines with character writing, giving each hero a fun backstory and personality and writing interesting and entertaining conversations between them. but like you said, especially with layoffs of the writing department in particular, i just dont want to have to suffer through an underfunded, underdeveloped, and understaffed attempt at something that could be really cool
thank you for the video i love ur content so much💛💛💛
Great vid as always, Niandra!
I didnt know about the illari hs exception lol
As another semi-tank main that also doesn't like Rein... There's are dozens of us! DOZENS!
clicked because of the fire juno art in the thumbnail, stayed because this video is so brilliant and so digestible. amazing stuff, especially for someone who just got back into OW!
What a great video overall! There is a lot i agree with and it was just so satisfying and calming listening to you because it's not someone screaming in my ears how 6v6 is better than 5v5 and how the game sucks.
Love the nuanced and reasonable analysis
THANK you for bringing up how absolutely low the lows of 6v6 were. there were so many times among my friends where it was either me or nobody queueing for tank, and i have never been good at any of the "main tank" characters nor do i find them fun. such a frustrating experience. that being said, the most recent patch is starting to turn me into a 6v6er if this is how the team thinks tank is gonna be solved. the DPS passive was a mistake, tanks either feel like punching bags or raid bosses with no in-between, and i am extremely sick of Mauga.
im sick of watching my tanks get in endless counterswap battles... like. i remember 6v6. it had horrific lows. its just getting to the point id rather take that trade off of low lows than continue in this raid boss/punching bag direction. because its honestly just boring and it feels like the lows did and im not even the tank player. like in some ways its better and in some its worse and its the same with 6v6. in my head theyre evenly matched but outer circumstances change that. for example how the devs balance 5v5 vs. 6v6 is going to be the main decider for me on what is there. in an ideal world id wish you could have both but thatd be impossible lol
@@peiithos i do totally agree! i just wish people would acknowledge the failings of 6v6 so everyone doesn't get their hopes way up for the 6v6 test and remember all the bad parts of the format.
I can't cultivate a healthy relationship with ow2 when I see people actually buying stuff day 1 from the shop, being counterswapped and lose a match because of it, it feels like im trying to ignore some stuff and enjoy but the big issues of the game are just there directly in front of me spitting in my face.
The lore of overwatch means so much to me. Watching those cinematics when they first came out did something to my brain and it’s changed my relationship with animation and storytelling. I love the potential that overwatch’s lore has and it physically pains me to see the state of it. PvE saddens me so much. I’ve never been huge in gaming, I honestly suck at the game, but god it’s so fun. I desperately need this game to do good.
Just got into the game as a Mercy main a few days ago and I hear a lot of things about balance but I don't really see them since I only play casual. Maybe it'll show later. Good video ^-^
I feel the lore needs to be rebooted with less factions (no new ones) and develop the remaining ones with more characters. Kiriko, Illiari, Juno, and Venture for example, all have throw away factions that serve no purpose. In addition some the preexisting characters also have this problem. By reducing the amount of factions the more attention they can give the remaining ones.
Thank God there is someone who is able to put forth summaries and arguments in a civilized manner
I honestly stayed up until 3am last night because assault maps were in the arcade. This is saying a lot because I'm a devout "in bed by 10 pm" person. I think the reason I enjoyed playing 2cp so much last night was familiarity with the maps but the novelty of having not played them in over a year (or longer, in the case of Paris and Horizon). It was the most fun and fresh OW has felt in months for me, but I think that's actually more of a sign that I need to take some breaks than anything else. It's getting stale and I'm getting tired. I log on hoping for magic and it never happens.
Happy to see an upload from you and really enjoyed your insight as always!
Ya know I saw the mercy and was like nice, BUT THAT WINSTON GAMEPLAY WAS INSANE
Like genuinely the discussion was awesome and eloquent and well thought out, but gah damn those juggling skills
i love how calm u are talking over this insane movement 1:38
The game has such a large female player base that it's actually INSANE that there aren't more skins pandering to them. Like there's the joke that "Blizz needs money from the she, they, and gays so they dropped another Mercy/Kiriko skin" but like... we'd do that for OTHER characters if the skin was cute enough. I'm not a strong girl, ANY of the characters in a magical girl outfit would have me pulling out my wallet.
they make skins for women, the mercy skins. the few times i talk with someone in game and is a woman is always using a fucking mercy
People don't remember queueing tank and having your co-tank lock hog and feed fishing for hooks all game. I REALLY do not want that "solo tank" experience back
And the other team has a working duo meaning you're not just solo tanking but doing so into a more well rounded front line.
@@timbombadil4046versus ow2 where you just get the feeding tank exclusively. Idk how 5v5 is supposed to be better than 6v6 in that regard lol
@@razrv3lc It isn't lol
@@razrv3lc you don't know how bad it is having an uncooperative tank partner in 6v6? Did you not play it? This isn't hard to grasp if you did.
@@razrv3lc I wouldn't say it's better, but it feels worse having to wait longer and still get a feeding tank in 6v6.
I have loved the characters and the bits of lore we get and the Fandom of for overwatch 1 did a great job of making greatness of what little we got from skins events and the few shorts we got Ow 1 Fandom was Peak but with how little lore we got since and how they changed so much stuff its just sad with how it had the potential and the Fandom backing it for something great hopefully if we do get more they don't fumble what's left
Tbh i counter your argument on the Mythic Skin Design! I love the darker twisted spin on these skins they’ve released so far! A Moira who doesn’t look to science for the answers to Life and Death but a False God. Vengeance the Archangel of Talon’s Design! A Simulacrum of a fellow friend turned into another drone fit for Ramattra’s Army… It makes me think of a Potential Multiverse direction that they wanted to take they’re story in! But now we’re getting scraps… it’s like these skins were what was meant to be…
Hi Niandra! It’s so good seeing someone’s opinion about the state of this game that is more on the lore side of things. It’s always good to see someone bringing out an new pov on the situation.
Keep up the good work
Also I wanna add that if I call you she without noticing it is because my native language (Portuguese) hasn’t neutral pronouns, so sorry about that ):
16:39 Counter-argument: people who like 6v6 no longer play the game!!
I do :/
It’s been forever since we last got to hear your thoughts
Playing 2CP on Arcade definitely feels better than playing the Robot mode. Hope they'd rework 2CP maps and get rid of robot, perhaps make it a control map.
I did buy lootboxes simply to support the development in OW1, though I already had everything. But charging 20-30 for a single skin, when I did pay that to own the entire game before free2play and also still is a range that includes a lot of AAA games on PC - especially on discount when of course OW2 skins are always on 'discount' - is not expensive but has to be considered a scam. I am sure they'd sell way more if skins were the price of a cup of coffee at a cafe - a tenth of what they are now, esentially - they'd sell probably a hundred times more. I know I'd have bought many at this point, and happily given them my support, but it really feels like supporting a scam rn. I WANT to buy skins for my favorite game. But it feels insane to do so currently, no matter how much money one has to burn.
The thing about OW is the internet seems to be perpetually wanting it to fail. When the game was first announced it was gonna be “dead on arrival” and “team fortress clone”, when the game wasn’t getting any updates it was “dead” and the sequel wouldn’t save it, and now it’s dead because a third person game is coming out at some point. The problem is OW has been consistently going for 8 years where other games have come and gone. It’s outlasted it’s contemporaries and I just wish the internet could accept its not going anywhere so we could talk about the actual issues with the game
The actual issue is how strict they are on comms. So many people get banned for very mild stuff like saying “easy gg” can get your perma banned if people report you enough
You hit some crazy primal juggles in this one
I really like the robot voice filter skins... it's what keeps me coming back
This video needs way more attention
Lightning fast opinion time:
5v5 is better for queue times, 6v6 is better for gameplay, both matter a fuck ton.
The monetization is out of control and actively contributes to me playing less, makes me feel dirty for even opening the game.
I liked this video
Regarding a lore reboot/reset, some characters could benefit from it; Hanzo and Sigma come to mind first because it's apparent the writers are struggling to include them in anything. And then there's Lucio who has minimal backstory before joining up with Overwatch. But aside from that I'm not sure if it'll be worth it considering it's an enormous undertaking and most character backstories are fine as is.
I had no idea illari had a different damage multiplier, that's INSANE, no wonder she is so strong right now!
Great video, earned a sub :)
twoooo things,
1, it's kinda fair when people base their opinions on the season based on the battle pass- patches come and go. 2-3 at the most. the BP is something we're actively trying to grind. If it's bad/not up to standard of course it's going to be something people don't want to grind for. and if there's nothing to grind aside from those mini events (that have been slowly getting worse), then what?
2, the theming debating is kinda eh? I get more want cutesy skins, more want badass skins, etc. but it's something no one is going to be satisfied with.
other than that, this video was great!! agreed with everything else you brought up!
I genuinely stopped playing at the start of Overwatch 1.5 due to 5v5. It's just not fun to me and i loved Overwatch for the Synergy and Chaotic moments. I come back occasionally play 1 or 2 matches in a season and uninstall it again. The other thing is what's weird to me when i heard the Devs talk about the competetive nature of the game and what not. To me from Overwatches release it was never meant to be a competetive game it got shoved down over the course later on with Overwatch league, Role Que etc. step by step. And let's be real here balance wise you can have 2 heroes and you would still have issues it is a hero shooter after all. But the Devs took away from me something which i loved Overwatch for which makes me still salty and bitter. When i for example recently took part in the Marvel Rivals test it scratched that old Overwatch itch that i miss since 1.5. I really do hope they bring it back in some form. Like nobody even forced them to completely remove it, i would have been fine if it had been left as an optional card in arcade for example and i would still play it.
Great video! In general, I agree there are a lot of things that OW could do to be better. I think the game is in a really good state right now though which is pretty cool because it's felt like things have been really rocky since like.... halfway through OW 1's life lol
Good video. Good points and well explained
19s is crazy HEY NIANDRAAAA
Loved the video!! I think you've become my favorite RUclipsr to hear talk about the game. Your takes are well thought out and down to earth, and even when I disagree with you I can always see where you're coming from. I'd really like to hear you talk about the game more often, but I'm sure this type of video takes a while to make. Sooo have you thought about making a second channel with more frequent uploads but lower effort content? Improvised videos, clips from streams maybe, ramblings, etc. Stuff like what KarQ does where he answers reddit questions from r/competitiveoverwatch. It's up to you obviously, but I think there might be an audience for that. At least I know I'd love to hear you yap about the game once a week or something like that while I do chores.
Anyways, good video! It's clear you put a lot of effort into articulating your ideas as well as you can.
Several amazing points made here.
We need more Winston montages, you are so good.
I HAVE BEEN WAITING FOR YOU TO TALK ABOUT THIS
The point said about the story is a good one! With the lack of old writers it is a real possibility, and a fear of mine, that a show would absolutely trash the current/intended characterisations.
A soft reset could be the right choice if done properly.. oh so many things could be nice is done well
I love 5v5 and think the tank exp is way better. Counterwatch can suck but it's not happening as much or as bad as everyone says. One less player on the map makes it easier to get through chokes and makes the action more free flowing. I guess I prefer the shooter OW to the moba OW, even though both parts make it the great game it is. Great Vid!
This video is amazing i have no words genuinely 😭😭
i love how this acknowledges ows downsides and doesnt completely dogshit on the game
great video! amazing winton gameplay ♥
12:37 It should be noted that while Gavin Jurgens-Fyhrie was laid off, T4 does have a new narrative lead now with Miranda Moyer, who joined the team in 2020.
if they nerf mauga and give venture a good legendary skin, I'm happy
I would really like the HP and hitbox changes from S9 to be reverted
I haven't played the game for a few days now just playing other games, but I still have been following everything as well as just thinking about OW1 vs OW2 and talking to friends about it. One of my friends said that 6v6 is 100% the solution as it looked very fun in custom games (certain streamers were playing it for a while), but I told him that those 3 days that they played that just isn't enough to tell you whether it really is the solution or not. Sure it may start well, but as you said in the video, months will go by and people might complain again as 6v6 comes with its own variety of issues that most people are either ignoring or aren't noticing. I understand both sides, but saying 6v6 will fix the game is definitely wrong in my opinion. It's never just that simple.
Totally agree on the battlepass themes as well. It's been a lot of villain type of stuff and it would be nice to have a very different theme. Also, the highlight intros.. are all so boring. It feels like most of them is the character doing barely any movement and just looking into the camera. The entire animation in that highlight intro could most of the time even be a victory pose or an emote. It feels very lazy and boring in comparison to the old ones we used to get.
And onto the reason I haven't been playing, I just have personal beef and anger towards the balancing team or whoever writes the blogposts. I know you didn't go into any specific heroes here when it comes to the balancing, but I've been getting increasingly frustrated with Mercy since last year April (since they nerfed GA and added this weird activation cd), even worse after they said they would buff her if they increase the DPS passive again (which they did, yet no buffs in sight and she is probably in the worst state she's ever been- besides the infamous 15 nerfs in a row after her rework in OW1). The blogpost will say something about buffing or reverting a certain change - but they just don't do it? Has this happened with other heroes? I genuinely want to know, because surely Mercy isn't the only one who gets these empty promises in those blogposts.
I play it for fun, sometimes with 3 friends, sometimes alone, and its been pretty fun. The main thing is ALL CHARACTERS ARE ALWAYS LIBERATED, and thats amazing, lets you try other characters, strategies and counters and keeps it fresh (other games where you need to unlock the characters you might slog until the next unlock and just drop out, my fear with Marvel Rivals being that, because any free game that you have to unlock characters nowadays make it an absolute grind to unlock even one).
Im really eager to see the new stuff to come, and I think they will become even more daring with Marvel Rivals on the horizon.
TY 4 THE VID, have a nice day everyone ^^
I agree with a lot of these things . I miss the overwatch animators and the fact that we have to spend money to play a pve + animations just doesn’t seems fun or fair. Thanks for making this!!
Fantastic vid!
In League of Legends some of the characters have skins that are very similar to one another. They aren't recolors, but veeery close. For example, any of the star guardian skins that have a pajama guardian variant (Lulu, Ezreal, Miss Fortune, Lux, Soraka), or dark cosmic Lux and cosmic Lux. If you buy one of the counterparts, you get the other one at a discounted price, or you can buy both in a bundle that is cheaper than buying them individually. I wish Overwatch would implement something like this with the amount of recolors they keep releasing.
I just recently convinced 3 of my friends to either start playing Overwatch or come back so I’m happy that I can play with some friends I actually know in person, but that won’t change my feelings on how they canceled pve. A lot of my friends want to play pve because they know I have it but they can’t spend much money on the game and so they can’t get pve. Also pve queues are so slow. Really sad yk.. cause I want to finish my hero lore.