Majora's Mask is probably my favourite Zelda game, so they had focused on Ura instead we would be living in a world without MM. So I'm glad they decided to go with making a new Zelda rather than adding dungeons to OoT (which is already a masterpiece)
@@DarkPsychoMessiah Might have ended up with one of the best Zelda games even (considering if that half year gave us the full one week that was originally planned)
Wish they would of Done both this is trhe game I grew up witth I got it righht when it came out I was about 8-9 years old man this game helped me with life it speaks to the soul man
@@Earth11111 Realistically if they did both, then you'd have repeat of areas or rather Majora's Mask would have to be delayed to the GameCube at that point as the team would be too busy with Ura Zelda... which might have worked well enough since Majora's Mask with some darker cel-shading might be neat
Ura zelda is master quest in the Gamecube, is just that the since the planned extra dungeons where added on majora's mask they had to scale back the project
From the bits and pieces that I've heard over the years, this is almost in-line with what I thought happened to Ura Zelda. My suspicions were a bit off though in that I thought the unused assets went to Majora's Mask and unused Dungeon layouts ended up being used for Wind Waker. I actually thought that Master Quest was something that they put together particularly to spice up the Wind Waker release and teased the Ura Zelda elements to stir attention. Neat to have a better idea of what actually happened with that.
Wind Waker dungeon wise; it's still possible something of it was repurposed for that too. It's really hard to say what wasn't and was used. I mean boss rush mode didn't appear until the Remaster on 3DS afterall. Otherwise glad you found this informative.
@@TheObsessiveGamer An app is something that sits on your desktop to be used when needed. A program has many lines of code and a lot more robust/developed. What your referring too is actually the latter. 🙃 Apps load with the OS of choice. External code is a program and needs to be loaded/installed after the OS.
Zelda Ocarina, Master Quest and Majora’s Mask is URA if you combine them. It is the easiest way it might actually be. After Ganondorf’s defeat you will go on a new adventure and has the same ocarina from Zelda to protect and use.
It’s funny how history repeats itself, although this case is more of a rhyme. New Zelda game (MM) needs assets so it takes from last Zelda game’s dlc (Ura), and now dlc for new Zelda game (BotW) is stopped because they have so many ideas to make a new game.
It also kind of rhymed with the past. The Legend of Zelda is made for a jpn- only add-on to the Famicom/NES: the Famicom Disk System, but it actually comes out. They later bring this to the system on a cartridge. Zelda ii aswell.
Does anyone else just like... still wish this game was real? I'm 30 and my first zelda was oot. I used to explore the hell out of this game and just thinking about the possibilities gets me excited like when I was first playing it as a kid.
29 here. Also first Zelda. I would have loved to see more N64 Zelda as the N64 feels like home to me. But if we piece things together logically with the info we have we can assume what Obsessive Gamer mentioned in the video; that Ura Zelda was reused in Master Quest and MM. Would I have loved another game? Of course! But we can take solace in the ROM community for "DLC."
I SUGGEST you try randomizers. It MAY not be for you, but chances are great that you will LOVE this shit. Seriously, its ALMOST like playing the game for the first time again having to explore every doors, even those you dont remember existing, and it pushes you to explore and find all these keys and boss keys, to be creative all over again to find how to get to certain places, and it will push you to play the game for real instead of by memory. I am having WAY too much for with these right now and I tought it wouldnt be for me as I dont know any glitches or dont consider myself a true scholar of the game like these speedrunners. Give it a try =) Maybe you can tap a bit in that nostalgia
I remember it was really easy to get through certain dungeons in Master Quest, like Jabu Jabu's Belly and the Fire Temple. Great vid!!! Whatta ending. Hit us with the feels. Your conclusions are becoming more legendary !
Thank you! I do feel some dungeons were easier in Master Quest (Water Temple for example), but Spirit Temple definitely was upped in difficulty. Glad you enjoyed the conclusion there :)
Thank you for watching everyone! and I hope this does clear up a lot of the misconceptions of Ura Zelda while also answering any questions on what it was and why it never came out. Also a small correction on the Randnet pricing. Thanks to Luigiblood who gave us a better insight vs much of the internet, it seems the 23.50 included a rental 64DD with it actually, while what I mentioned was the store price if one bought the 64DD. So one could in a way play it in a cheaper way but you wouldn't own it in the end so much. ZethN64 did also want to make it clear that this wasn't his Link model in the footage of his recreation mod that we were showing. The rooms are the main focus tbh. Also if you enjoyed this video, please hit the like button! it really assists us with this algorithm
LuigiBlood really knows his 64DD stuff. Lol Even prior to Giga Leak, I remember him looking into OoT cartridges for the 64DD "hooks", and determining it was mostly pointing towards the Master Quest remixed dungeons concept.
@@TheObsessiveGamer Thanks for mentioning that, I excitedly dug through the comment section and found the conversation. Haha Really interesting.. The mystery of Aunoma's disinterest in Ura Zelda may be solved. Lol
I think what happened is it got split into master quest and majoras mask and beta OOT elements that went unused in both OOT and MM were probably shafted to some vault to later be used in future Zelda games like Twilight Princess and BOTW, take the beetle in SS for instance it works pretty similar to how Navi was going to work in the OOT beta
This was a lovely and comprehensive video. Personally, I'm of the opinion that while there will likely always been some part of Ura Zelda that remains an unsolved mystery (unless Nintendo decides to release a documentary on the making of OoT someday...that would be amazing!) we have been, and will be playing bits of Ura Zelda as we experience the other Zelda games as Nintendo loves to take concepts that they couldn't include in one game and implement them in some way into a newer game. Some examples of this would be the horse riding and grass whistle mechanics in Twilight Princess, as well as some things we see in Breath of the Wild as well.
Thank you! Yeah we can only go so far to know how much of Ura Zelda was a thing, so some may stay a grand mystery (like how much did Majora's Mask actually take from it?)
It took Nintendo 4 years to try to match Sega's Lock on Technology campaign and they didn't even make it to market Meanwhile, Sega releasing actual fully realized DLC for Dreamcast games later that year
I always put Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask together as the same game on any Fav Game list. Mostly because I often saw Majora's Mask the extra quest that would have happened if Ocarina of Time's 64DD was complete as intended. Also fits in with the internal clock function.
Ocarina of Time is TRULY one of the greatest games of all time. It was a game changer when it came out (True 3D/massive world for the time, characters, music, etc) and side quests. I used to go fishing alot when I just wanted to travel Hyrule and chill. They really did a GREAT job of making the world feel like a REAL world with the limited space they had to deal with. And you got a HORSE to ride (In 3D) and the day and night dynamic just added to it greatly. Love this game like millions of others and will always hold a special place!
I wonder if some of the dungeons found in the partially restored beta of OOT were originally going to be used for Ura Zelda, since a few were noticably harder/different/more complex than final, possibly requiring the Expansion Pack to prevent lagging. Beta Deku Tree being the standout example.
As much as i'd love it, I doubt that was the case as the Master Quest dungeons were indeed the dungeons that were going to replace the old dungeons in Ura Zelda.
Really awesome story to discover, never knew back then when I missed out all the information about Zelda 64. Never had Nintendo Power magazine or internet. Wanted to know more about it. Sense I wasn't able to have a copy of Wind Waker, I see you could buy Master Quest, so I got myself a copy and enjoy playing it. Having Majora's Mask was exciting to have, I thought it was better then Ocarina. What got to me the most about Ocarina of time, is about the development of Zelda 64 beta. I remember look up on magazine pictures of the game see how the game would have look like when they start developing. Even I saw it once and never saw it again, I thought it would show in the final version. How ever it never show. So maybe it was all seeing and lost. Until finally I found out it wasn't all just first look and never again. Ocarina of time deserve to be something more, sad it never have every work in the game. If they were planning of bring it to HD, they should remake it
I agree, I would rather see this game remade from the ground up kinda like the way FF7 Remake was... except complete lol and this way they can incorporate so many of these ideas too
@@TheObsessiveGamer First off, great vid. I'm assuming by "complete lol" you didn't like the FF7 remake? If so, I understand because even I don't think it's perfect but I really enjoyed it for what it was. I'd imagine Nintendo would change up OoT or MM too much if they did a complete remake of it as well.
@@sublime_tv Thank you! No I liked FF7 Remake, I beat it even on Hard Mode. I just mean that if they made OOT Remake, I imagine they'd make it a complete game rather than split it up like they are with FF7 Remake
Depending on the cartridge, N64 cartridges can also hold up to 64MB of data as well -- possibly more than this if you use multiple chips/banking techniques, but the largest game ROMs were 64MB, and that includes the N64 Resident Evil 2 port. In fact, none of the ROMs I have in my folder are any smaller than 8MB... 4MB was the size of the N64's internal RAM, and also the size of the Expansion Pak (adding an additional 4MB to the system for a total of 8). This might also be the reason why the 64DD failed to catch on, it's only doubling the amount of available game data you can have (unless you can hot-swap disks, which could allow for multi-disk games) while also killing the fast load times they had as justification for the limited cartridge space in the first place. Also, magnetic storage was likely not very cost-effective. I wonder, if the 64DD was optical-based, would it have had better luck? The 64DD seems to be a throwback to an older era, when in Japan, the Famicom Disk System was a similar add-on for the Famicom (that is, the Japanese version of the NES). It was in response to a both a chip shortage that at the time made it not cost effective to put games on cartridges, and a limitation in the ability to actually make mask ROM chips with high enough capacity to store games like... the original Legend of Zelda, which was first released on the FDS. It only came to regular cartridges years later. My suspicion is that they believed they could just do the same thing twice and get the same results, not taking into account how technology and market conditions change over time. By the time the 64DD was to be released, what incentive did developers have for releasing their game to require the 64DD, an expensive piece of add-on hardware that only grants them double the extra game data space (which loads slowly), also requires the Expansion Pak (also sold separately), and has slow load times that completely defeats the purpose the N64 was arguably made for (there's an argument to be made that the prevalence of high action games on the N64 ties in very well to its nigh instant load times, whereas conversely the Playstation got a lot of RPGs like FF7 that required its massive storage space and FMVs that the hardware was suited for)? You're aiming at a very small and niche market of mainly enthusiasts. In the words of Tony Stark, "Not a great plan." On top of that, it likely requires a lot of well thought out programming to properly take advantage of both storage media, and cleverly allocating data between the faster cartridge ROM and the slower disk. Plus, I don't think it solved the N64's infamous texture cache problem, did it?
Oh this I know, but at the start 64MB carts weren't available. That didn't' come until much later when we got masterpiece ports like the Resident Evil 2 port on one of those. As for the Rom files, 4-8 MB was the start. Automobili Lamborghini and Dr. Mario 64 were 4MBs, while Super Mario 64 was 8. It slowly increased over the years to 32 becoming more a standard later for games like OoT and MM. Yeah I agree the 64DD is a throwback to what Nintendo did with the Famicom Disk System and the SNES Sataview. Problem was it didn't have the juggernaut audience or market it once did and was delayed constantly too (price didn't help it as well), and the disk size eventually became obsolete once the 64MB carts came out. In the end, as you say, it still didn't solve the N64's texture cache problem I either I believe, and in terms of storage stayed quite inferior to the PS1.
I found this hilarious when the movie and video game rental place in my town was closing I was able to buy one of the early numbered ocarina of time as saying it still has the chanting I got it just in time because as soon as I got it paid for someone asked if it got rented or bought I heard that they were planning on buying it so a few minutes later I wouldn't have noticed that when everyone was saying all the things that were changed in other N64 releases and re releases on different consoles
Funny how the original legend of Zelda and ocarina of time have many development similarities *both were made for disk (then came to cartridges) *both were made alongside a Mario game *both were intended to have larger worlds *both took around 2-3 years to develop
So it seems Majora's Mask miraculous 1 year development cycle was a success thanks to re-using OoT's engine, models and more (something we already knew); and applying ideas and assets from Ura Zelda (like those cut maps and a clock feature). And I thought Miyamoto was an evil villain (1 year is still crazy to think about but development was different 20 years ago, especially sequels).
Well, Miyamoto did give them _one_ year only to begin with when Aonuma expressed it would be smarter to make a new game instead. Not very smart though, and that lack of polish definitely shows If we judge the OG Japanese release. I would've been interested in lying to Ganondorf about where Zelda ran off, had that idea stayed.
I don't think he was like trying to deceive us. He means the ultimate concept they decided on. All the previous iterations ideas are not part of this. The stuff from prior stages that they experimented on DD.
@@TheObsessiveGamer I mean that discarded boss rush maybe became (at least the concept since you only face the mini bosses and not the main bosses of the temples) in that mission in zelda majoras mask and then they implemented it in the remake of 3ds of ocarina of time
@@carajorex6666 To be fair, having the major bosses there would have been nonsense. Because one can rechallenge them at any time as often as one likes to.
Thanks for the feedback! and thanks for the sub too! May I ask if you can direct me to a specific part where the music may have been a bit too loud? Just to use as reference
In my opinion, the whole video length. It’s a little too loud just to be ambient background noise IMO. I listen on apple earbuds, maybe that’s a factor. Yea audio mixing is tough
@@eink-reviews No you got a point. Thanks for the feedback, I always am questioning if the audio may too loud or not. I'll plan to tone it down next time a bit. Always appreciate the feedback to improve the channel :)
This was an exciting video! One of my favorite videos that you've done. Do you think those two MM maps from URA might be the ones Aunoma mentions here? "I secretly started making new dungeons that weren’t in Ocarina of Time, and that was much more fun to me [than remixing dungeons for Ura/MQ]. So, I grew up the courage to ask Miyamoto-san whether I could make a new game, he replied by saying it’s ok if I can make it in a year.”
Thank you! That sounds exactly the situation that happened here actually, though these weren't dungeons but just new areas. As I said in the video, the dungeons of MM may have been in Ura Zelda originally, which may be what Aonuma is talking about here
@@TheObsessiveGamer I see what you mean. I saw someone talking about those 64DD maps loading in place of OoT dungeons like Deku Tree so it made me wonder if it may have been what Aunoma worked on off to the side. Though as unlikely as this idea may be, it also makes me imagine Master Quest only with brand new dungeons completely redesigned from ground up.
I highly doubt those were meant to load in place of the Inside the Great Deku Tree (for the Swamp map) and Jabu Jabu's belly (for beneath the well in Ikana Canyon). I imagine those were just place holders until they decided where they want to direct the entrance and exit to later... I mean I highly doubt the intention was to have the inside of Jabu Jabu look like Beneath the Well. I imagine these were going to be part of the new scenarios that Miyamoto was speaking of as a side story or side quest or expanded story even. Maybe a new area in hyrule might have been unlocked even with some of these blended in
@@TheObsessiveGamer My bad, I meant Aunoma using the Ura dungeon functionality to test those maps out inside OoT, maybe that's why he referred to his secret work as "dungeons". Completely new dungeons would definitely need to match OoT's themes better than a well inside a fish though. Lol
@@shadowledastray Oh then yeah maybe. I know personally that it's not hard to replace maps in OOTs data (i've done it myself) so it would be like the ideal place to test it.
Another great video, I loved the editing and effort you put into this video :D I wonder if there's even more in the gigaleak that we haven't seen yet about Zelda 64 or even the early stages of Majora's Mask development, but, at least, we can confirm that we indeed got Ura Zelda in Majora's Mask, a game that I love!
Thank you! Really glad you enjoyed the editing I did on this too. Well we explored everything in the Gigaleak to its full extent at this point, so Zelda 64 has been fully documented and also made into video here too. Majora's Mask... I need to further research considering we had a folder there too. Ura Zelda being in Majora's Mask is the truly happy ending I say :)
well this was a very interesting video. glad to know what they made for Ura Zelda wasn't wasted, and instead became one of the other best games of all time.
Here's what I firmly is the actual reason for Ocarina of Time and Majora's being converted into a regular N64 games. The N64DD was meant to be released worldwide in 1997 with Zelda 64 as its launch title. According to Doshin the Giant producer, Nintendo decided to delay the add-on so it wouldn't with the Nintendo 64 itself. It most famous titles were cancelled, converted into cartriges or released on the PS1. By the time of its release in 1999, it was too little too late. MetalJesusRocks said that the N64DD had potential. That's what I keep saying. Nobodo listens. I don't think even Nintendo themselves fully grasped its potential. I would have killed to play Zelda 64DD, Ura Zelda and Zelda Gaiden. As well as having online gaming.
Maybe that could have been a part of the reason, but Nintendo did confirm loading times are the very reason the team decided to move it to a cartridge. The biggest problem was its price really. People wouldn't wanna pay more than the N64 itself for a simple add on. Heck people didn't do that for cheap adds on to the Sega Genesis even
Here's what I could find. The Giga leak's production logs indidate that A Link to the Past's Palace of Darkness was meant to be appear in the the URA Zelda expansion disk. According to a gossip stone, it was to be hidden in the Gerudo Valley. I'm 100% certain it went on to become the Ikana Castle and Graveyyard in Majora's Mask. The Woodfall Temple in MM has a lot in common with another dungeon from another Zelda AlttP: the Swamp Palace. Was it meant to appear in URA Zelda A possibility. The Ice Temple I'm sure was meant to appear,: An Ice Medallion having been found. in the files of OoT. My theory is that in Ura Zelda, the Zora Domain would unfreeze after beating the Ice Temple. The latter became the Snowhead Temple in MM. I'm also positiitive that an Earth, Light and Wind Temples were set to appear as well, and got merged into the Stone Temple in MM. ùMy theory: After slaughtering all 100 all Skulltullas.in Ocarina, URA would unlock optional skulltullas dungeons. A Mask-Making feature was in the works. It'd be possible thanks to the Gameboy. Adult Link would use the Blade Beam in a similar manner to Fierce Deity Link in M. My theory is that you'd acquire the Blade Beam after the Light Temple.
Tbh, Zeth64's team gave us a really cool vision on what they tought Ura Zelda would've been. The music, scenarios and story was just amazing. I'm kinda sad it was nothing like that legendary game most of us tought 🤧
The ZethN64 team definitely had a lot of heart in taking what Miyamoto said and made what they would have if they were put in charge of expanding upon Ocarina of Time. The product definitely did look amazing too. I imagine it would have been quite legendary if they hadn't made Majora's Mask here, but I guess that's the trade off
Lmao, I remember that shitshow. I remember when every few weeks a trailer would be announced, and then when it was supposed to come out it was always conveniently delayed. Turns out, there was barely any work done to begin with, and all of the stuff shown in trailers was actually REALLY old stuff. Not to mention it pretty much stopped being an Ura Zelda restoration and was its own game instead. Thank god I never donated to it, though I wanted to at first.
@@Weedbongz I wasn't following it closely, but all that happened eh? Feels like a trend with a lot of Zelda recreation mods sometimes. I mean based on what I saw, it does seem to be the idea of "if Miyamoto told me to make an expansion to OoT, how would I do it?" which I guess he made these areas that would have to add onto OoT?
Majora's Mask was great, I'd rather have that than an Ocarina of Time expansion. Nintendo released the Ura Zelda/Ocarina of Time leftovers in Master Quest (I felt like the Master Quest's version of the Water Temple was actually easier), so overall I am pleased with that. My main disappointment with OoT was that Link couldn't collect the entire Triforce for facing off against Ganon.
My theory is that they used "ura zelda" in the next 3d main games (MM, TP, SS and BOTW) + master quest. And maybe the BOTW sequel as well, that's a possibility after all
Great video! I've been following the many pieces covered here like the N64DD, Ura Zelda, the Gigaleak, and the recreation mods; but this paints a much clearer picture of virtually everything. I hadn't heard about the boss rush stuff at all, or that Master Quest maps were actually grouped with the leaked Ura files. Hell, this was the best explanation of why the DD flopped as hard as it did that I have seen. $299 for an add-on, and Zelda being a full priced expansion that required the original, AFTER the Dreamcast was already out? The Gigaleak has given so much insight on long hanging questions and development processes. I wish more developers had similar troves of beta content. Capcom seems like it's be the most interesting to me.
Thank you! and glad it was very informative on giving that clear picture. Hopefully devs open up one day. Capcom's original concept for Devil May Cry is what I want to see when it was the original Resident Evil 4
I played majors mask but I found the whole game mildly depressing and I couldn’t shake the feeling of checking the time. I once tried to force myself to see what would happen if the time ran out but I couldn’t do it. The pressure of needing to save people was too strong. Ocarina of time was happier for me - slowly but surely you were setting places straight.
My theory is Ura Zelda is just a mixture of Master Quest and Majora's Mask into one, along with additional new ideas and features utilising the power of the Nintendo 64 DD.
Club nintendo MX reporter Conejo (Rabbit in english) interviewed once for his section of the magazine either Miyamoto or Aonuma and it was said, word for word, that MM was made from recycled assets of ura zelda.
@@TheObsessiveGamer I'd need to spray with insecticide the place where I store the magazines to dig it up, I have like a decade worth of Club Nintendo Magazines to check through. If I find it, I'll take a scan of it, mind you the interview is in spanish so I'd need to TL it. But its one of those clear things I remember, in order to meet the 1 year deadline they had to recycle elements from ura zelda.
@@TheGoodWillSpreader Hopefully you can get it and send me translation too! Always can contact me via Twitter to send it too whenever you grab it. Would love to share it to everyone (With you fully credited of course)
It was interesting to watch these videos since the beginning. From the very first stream of Beta cut content to the final video about Zelda 64 OOT Cut Content Ura Gaiden Limited Edition Remaster HD Remake The Official Video Game - I may have added a few words - But I must say you did a really good job on this series. Any chance you'll do a big compilation video with all of this content? Like one big video that covers all of this from start to finish? I know the playlist exists for a reason but I think it'd be awesome to have a big "Zelda Beta Cut Content REWIND" video. That and I think if enough people watched it, it might help you with that algorithm. Longer watch time, audience retention - you know the game playa. I also think having some Zelda remixes might spruce things up a bit, the originals are great but who doesn't like to hear an old favourite in a new way? I noticed that Zeltik guy always has some Zelda remixes going on in his videos which is why I bring it up. Even if I tune out of the video the music always catches my attention, because well it's a Zelda remix and the music is great! Just wanted to give my $0.05 - I'm Canadian we don't have pennies anymore! 💎
Thank you very much! and glad you've been here and supporting the channel since then! I do want to do a big compilation video (might make it a full doc on Ocarina of Times history in combo too, still deciding), but it might a little while later since such a video requires quite the planning as it's a VERY long and deep development process. Stay tuned! and for now I got Majora's Mask planned. Also as one Canadian to another, I feel your pain (or lack thereof) of not having pennies anymore LOL
Majoras mask was horrible. Everything keep resetting and u just wait for specific times over and over again then you need to try to talk to everyone with different types of masks instead of just talk to the NPCs. The plot was horrible and the execution was bad. In OOT the difference made sense since it was different time periods (young and adult) but just standing by an npc and keep changing masks to get different outcomes is just weird. would have been better off creating a ocarina of time 2 where you keep the same adventure idea.
I understand that Majora's Mask wasn't always for everyone for that exact reason of the time limit. An Ocarina of Time 2 is something I have always wanted however taking place after Majora's Mask
Good video, incredibly well researched, definitely surpassed my expectations. Nice! The only issue I saw was at the end where you say that the early MM dungeons in the Ura/MQ files were originally meant for Ura Zelda. That is most likely false. They were probably the secret dungeons that Aonuma were making during his time on Ura's development since he disliked remixing his old dungeons. I only say this because he explicitly mentions it in a MM3D Iwata Asks. YT won't let me post the link, but it's the first page of the MM3D Iwata Asks. In short, Ura Zelda is not a husk of what it was meant to be. It's exactly what we were always intended to get.
Thanks! Aonuma was probably experimenting on making Ura Zelda maps, so these very maps were likely meant for Ura Zelda originally before being pushed to Majora's Mask. These weren't dungeons and were just maps of random areas, so I believe these were indeed being made for Ura Zelda before being moved to Majora's Mask.
@@TheObsessiveGamer I very highly doubt it, considering the code of the OOT only calls for dungeon layouts from the disk data. You can ask all this stuff on the TCRF Discord server, there are people there who are very knowledgeable on how this stuff works.
@@evdestroy4121 The code calls only for replacing maps. New Maps could still be inserted as seen in the Disk Mod "Dawn and Dusk" which did exactly that. Its creator did mention it was a rather tough process still, but proved none the less it is possible to do so. Therefore Nintendo making these maps for Ura Zelda originally still stands but its difficulty in execution map have also been another reason (aside from Aonuma just not wanting to make to update a game) that they moved them to Majora's Mask. As for the Aonuma interview you mention, I am well aware of that and the only reason he mentioned dungeons was cause he was the dungeon designer of OOT so naturally he'd be in charge of the section that involved remixing dungeons, while others would handle any other aspect of it (which still wouldn't be enough). Thus why he moved on
Its funny because if ocarina of time had been fully developed for the DD then there might have been a chance that Majora's mask wouldn't have been developed.
Keep in mind, the Gigaleak's currently released contents are only a 10th of the overall infodump; there are multiple mysterious leftovers in both some earlier trailers and the final game that are not reflected in the stages of development that have been leaked so far. One would think that these artifacts were added at a later stage, but were ultimately cut and some may not have even been considered for use in URA Zelda, despite investigators' theories. I would like to see what leaks next, particularly pertaining to the Unicorn Fountain, the Light Temple and the areas depicted from 3:23 to 3:31 of this video.
If you actually watch the last video I posted, that area you quoted was never meant to be ingame actually and was made for a tech demo (though using the N64's power). Unicorn fountain is what I really wish to see and yeah there is still ALOT of we have yet to see.
After 20 years, the legend behind Ura/Beta Zelda 64 created groups of coders and modders, and now they're all searching and struggling to re-create that lost treasure..It seems like the story of the pirates of One Piece. Anyway, great video! Deeply full of details!
>1000 episodes later and the search for Ura Zelda is still not successful Fits that it's been well over 20 years as the search continues :P and thanks!
LoZ:OoT was released legitamently on my birthday, I was born on 11/21/1997 and I turned 1 year old on 11/21/1998 when LoZ:OoT released...I'm 23 years old and LoZ:OoT is 22 years old legit.
Thank you for not being dumb like literally every other person on the subject. Everyone else always pretends that Ura and Master Quest are two different names, but you actually tell the truth and say that "Master Quest" is just NoA's localized name for it. Again, thank you. :)
@@TheObsessiveGamer Exactly. Plus, while some of the earlier interviews made it sound like a much bigger expansion than we got, later interviews clearly stated it would have harder dungeons, and didn't say anything about altered stories or overworld. At least, not that I can find.
Hey! Your videos are great, and I've enjoyed this one in particular! The slow dawning realization before you got to that actual point of realizing Majora's Mask, thought for a long time that as Zelda Gaiden it was just another expansion like Ura Zelda, actually is *in part* Ura Zelda itself was both freeing (because we finally known we actually have gotten it, just not in the way we expect) and upsetting (because it means if Eiji Aonuma hadn't had that talk with Miyamoto and began work on Zelda Gaiden we would never get one of my favorite Zelda games). I don't think you're too far off in thinking they likely pulled new dungeons meant from Ura Zelda to help put Majora's Mask together. Tho I would have liked to see Ura Zelda in a complete form, I am ultimately satisfied with what we did wind up getting.
I mean while I would love to see Ura Zelda as they were intending, I imagine it'd still be less new content than what we got in MM as that is an expansion vs a full new game, so i'm glad with what we got
Something tells me Ura Zelda was split in two due to hardware limitations and the failure of the 64dd. The second quest being Master quest and the side story being Majoria's mask. Fans of the series never saw this because we're looking for a single game not three.
Amazing video, this are some thinks that you can do later (if you want) the source code of The Simpson hit & run was leak some early plot and documentation of Shadow of the colossus was also leak if you want, you can document this in a video great work
Sorry but that 64DD price calculation is entirely false, you overlooked a huge part of the Randnet subscription: It was 2500 Yen (~$23) per month to use the Randnet service, AND renting a 64DD at the same time. You absolutely did not need to buy a 64DD for $299, this was when the 64DD was released in stores much later. There's also the fact that almost every 64DD game were sent for free as part of the Randnet subscription, almost none of them were released in stores. There was even an alternate Randnet subscription for 3300 Yen (~$30) a month where you could rent a 64DD and a N64 Clear Black unit for those who didn't have it. It is much cheaper than you think it was, even if the store version of the 64DD has a batshit insane price. ...that said thanks for saying Ura Zelda is Master Quest, because while the Gigaleak did imply there was more to it, at the end of the day, all that was truly implemented were the alternate dungeons. But one other reason why Ura Zelda would not have been much, is also because of the 64DD implementation in Ocarina of Time, it was very limited, and in fact they had a disk ready for it for when they sent OoT for approval, it was replacing the dungeons already, with just the original OoT dungeons though, it was just a way to test it to make sure it actually works when they would release something. The limitations were like you could only replace a bunch of dungeon maps and minimaps and also text, but you could technically replace almost anything... but only replace stuff. The problem however, this alternate way to replace any content aside from maps and dungeon minimaps and text, is incompatible with all revisions of the original game which had 3 versions (1.0, 1.1 & 1.2). Developers found a hacky way to deal with this by embedding ROM information of every single version of the game into the disk, you would just then detect the version to properly deal with this, and seemingly wanted to do something with Keaton Mask & Gerudo Mask and Child Link's model, this might still have been implemented in the actual disk had it come out, but it's still genuinely not much. I personally think that Ura Zelda's fate was already decided by the implementation of the 64DD expansion support into Ocarina of Time, as even when I did the magic of Zelda 64 Dawn & Dusk as a disk, it is still a very hacky mess that stepped outside of the limitations of the implementation constantly.
Oh wow LuigiBlood! glad to see you here and love what you did with that that amazing mod using real 64DD hardware to make Dusk and Dawn. While you do say that the OOT was basically made to just have its material replaced, you did still add full new maps and scenarios to it too, so technically with enough work couldn't they have done something like this too? I imagine with it taking alot of work as it did for you that it could have been another reason why they went against expanding further? Pretty fascinating learning this here too. and ooh did not know that the subscription also let you rent a 64DD and get games too. Information on it being so scattered didn't lead me to that lol Mind linking me to this actually? I could use this source for a future video actually if you don't mind :)
@@TheObsessiveGamer Technically all maps in Dawn & Dusk, and in fact, for all OoT hacks, replaced already existing maps. The detail is just that we can fully replace them all the way and not just do small changes, but as much as I changed maps for Dawn & Dusk, while it is possible to do a lot, I highly doubt Nintendo would have done the way I did with game hack insertion into the engine code in real time. Changing the music would be impossible without some really hacky tricks that I am entirely convinced that Nintendo wouldn't even bother, I haven't seen evidence of any hacks like that in the Gigaleak, just that they would insert information of every revision to help file replacements as a whole, and nothing else. For Randnet, Wikipedia does have base information for this with sources, but there's a couple contradictions after checking around. So I would like to say what's the deal with Randnet: What you are paying with the Randnet subscription (details on the fee after), you receive a Randnet Starter Kit (64DD + Modem), as part of the subscription you also have paid for 8 64DD software. This is important to detail, because the subscription fee would pay for all of this, which I did find 2500 Yen (~$23) and 3300 Yen (~$30) with a N64 Clear Black unit. It also turns out that the Randnet website does mention a 12-month flat rate of 30000 Yen (~$290) and 39600 Yen (~$380) with the N64 Clear Black unit. IGN says this was revised, but only IGN mentioned this, and I could not find any additional evidence if the service actually changed to this, or if it was an additional plan for registration (basically choosing either monthly or yearly?), but this is still an important distinction, for roughly $300, you technically bought the 64DD, the Randnet service access and 8 64DD software, so this is definitely not the 64DD price. There were also talks of the 64DD pricing in 1997 from Miyamoto, roughly about $120, which honestly, might sound about right. Sources: web.archive.org/web/20000226213125/www.randnetdd.co.jp:80/apply/index.html (Application Information, still mentions monthly payments) web.archive.org/web/20000419022955/www.randnetdd.co.jp/tempo.html (Flat rate payment information) pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/article/20001124/randnet.htm (Basic Application Fee) www.ign.com/articles/1999/12/16/ign64s-ultimate-64dd-faq (This does have a lot of basic 64DD and Randnet info) www.ign.com/articles/1997/07/26/64dd-to-sell-for-120 (64DD Pricing)
@@LuigiBlood But I thought real time insertion was what it was supposed to do since the idea was to have both your game cart and Ura Zelda plugged in at once? Infact I don't think they even got that far to try it? Gigaleak wise yeah we don't have enough info. Might have even been to make maps first and insert them later. I imagine with this, music would have been entirely reused. I mean alternatively they could have always shoved all of the vanilla Ocarina of Time + new content onto a single 64DD Disc since it would have twice the size of what the OOT cart had. Or maybe they didn't plan ahead how difficult a task the real time swapping would be at first? I know Miyamoto said it would be possible to do a cart release, so maybe it was them realizing how tough it was and might just do a single cart instead? (I think 64MB carts later were available too) Thank you for all the Randnet info there plus the links. I do want to make a new 64DD video on Super Mario 64 2 where I plan to recap this, so this updated info is very useful in explaining what the 64DD was. Anyways, it's been a good talk with someone who has directly worked with a 64DD game, keep up the good work! (and I absolutely wish I could buy a cheaper 64DD to play your mod the way it was meant to be played instead of the "cart hacks")
@@TheObsessiveGamer Replacing maps was the easy part, but pretty much all ROM hacking is usually replacing something with something else. The problem with OoT's 64DD implementation was that it had things that was easier to replace than others, there are what I call 64DD hooks within parts of OoT's engine that makes it easier to replace data, when it comes to the maps, that tends to be easy, but then when you deal with minimaps, it turns out there's only a 64DD hook to the Dungeon minimap info loading, and not the one for the rest of the maps. This already should say a lot on their plans for Ura Zelda. Even the scene table had some of the dungeons already marked for 64DD loading straight out of the box. Basically any time there's a 64DD hook into the engine it tends to make it easier to sideload something, but then there's also a 64DD hook for almost all game data loading (not music & sound though) but that one is actually quite limited, because it pretty much tends to limit you to replace almost any file but also has to be the same size or less. This does not happen for other hooks, and this is what makes it harder if you actually intend to do something more ambitious than a dungeon replacement, because then you'd actually need to hack the game's code in real time but then you'd need to know the assembly language, and also, the code is different for each version of the game so like, I was constantly fighting with what was intended to do, and figuring out everything. I'm pretty sure a lot of what I did for Dawn & Dusk, Nintendo developers wouldn't dare doing it. While the developers do have all of the info for every version of the game, it is still hard to hack the game and ensure stability if you intend to do more, so the fact that a special cartridge ROM was considered is already pretty telling, and in fact, was certainly a better way to be able to put everything into one package. But they didn't really do that in the end, since all they did pretty much is put the new dungeons instead of the old ones, change the Title Screen, and that's it. The way 64DD is implemented in OoT is also unlike every other game that supports it like F-Zero X, Mario Party 1 and Pokémon Stadium (Japan only). The other games tend to use an alternate executable and then reboot the game with the new executable. This does give a lot more control over what you can do in the game, because you could have implemented anything from there. F-Zero X got the track editor and the machine editor, but if they wanted to, they could also have implemented something else on top, that stuff was never in the cartridge ROM data, it just leverages the ROM data when it sees fit. If OoT had this method of expansion reboot from the start of the game, a more ambitious Ura Zelda would certainly be possible.
@@LuigiBlood Then yeah maybe this would further explain why Aonuma didn't want to do Ura Zelda when one thinks about it. Miyamoto had these big ambitious plans but Aonuma knew it'd be a headache and a half. Despite making these various maps for it, much of these were instead repurposed for Majora's Mask, leaving only what was feasible for Ura Zelda (the remix dungeons). I imagine they didn't bother with the special edition cartridge though in the end simply cause remix dungeons wouldn't be worth it and that these new maps had already been moved to Majora's Mask. All in all, thank you very much for such a detail insight! It kinda makes me want to slowly plan a video further documenting the 64DD in the future one day.
Great video, but there’s one thing I didn’t like, you make it seem like Koizumi was responsible for the decision of not continuing development of OoT on the 64DD, which is inaccurate, I also read that Iwata asks interview and they only talked about the problem of Link’s movement, if anything it is said in the interview that Link could have moved on the Disk Drive if only there weren’t too many movements, but Koizumi made 500 patterns. Also, Aonuma always ends up with all the credit for OoT and Majora, but in reality OoT was made by the work of 5 directors working together, and Majora, had Two Directors, Koizumi and Aonuma.
Thanks however I wasn't saying it was his sole word that got it off, but rather he commented on it. Also Iwata in that interview said it is because of how it has to take time to read the disc. That in itself is a loading time factor by definition. Now what it affected (Links movements here for example) is a different story but I didn't get into too many specifics for that since the video is mainly to tell the story of Ura Zelda rather than Zelda 64. Also I only spoke of specific employees who were relatable to the story here, so yes while I know of those other directors and staff there just wasn't much to say about them in this video
Based on whats out there roughly 30% of the game was either scrapped or repurposed to another game which a lot of em went to Majoras Mask, Wind Waker, Twighlight Princess and Breath of the Wild. Imagine if they pushed the game back to a time when the cartridges got bigger and better. They might have finished it the dungeons at least, i can see how they may drop a few gameplay mechanics such as being able to swing your sword on horseback. We dont really NEED that per se but it woulda been nice so i can see things like that being cut to save space, id rather theyd cut little things in order to fit the story and their dungeons.
Giga leak's production logs indidate that A Link to the Past's Palace of Darkness was meant to be appear in the the URA Zelda expansion disk. It later appeared in Wind Waker and A Link Between Worlds.
Great video again. That moment though when you mentioned that Master Quest was available as a pre order bonus to Windwaker. I bought the Black GameCube with Windwaker as a package deal as a kid with my mom. This package deal also included that pre order bonus you mentioned. I always thought that was a default package like the Mario Kart Double Dash pack. Fun to know!
Thanks! The default doesn't have them packed together, so you go a special edition of sorts. I never saw that one personally but I have seen their boxes online. Might have never came here in Canada I imagine?
@@TheObsessiveGamer hmm I thought I answered this but maybe because I added a link to an image of the console package. Basically I said that it looks to be a PAL region only package.
@@TheObsessiveGamer Upon looking at Yuri's newest video I think what I meant was mixing but it's really hard to tell if peaking is the issue or if it's the mic. Over all spectacular video and my apologies that your first interaction with me was based around insulting another content creator.
With that Luigi one on the Gigaleak all i can think of was that Elf Meme "You Sit on a Throne of Lies!" and for a while saying Luigi was planned and no model exist. lol
It makes sense since dd was in a pretty bad spot so to not waste their work they moved uras new content to mm boss rush might've been considered for oot but was pushed back still master quest serves it's purpose better as a harder difficulty rather than an expansion
Yeah pretty much to all that. I mean they could have still release Ura Zelda with all that MM content on a cart too technically, but I agree that it served better as getting to be used for a new game instead. Master Quest is now more or less just used as the name for "hard mode" in new Zelda games too. I do wish we could get remixed dungeons with that too.
Majora's Mask is probably my favourite Zelda game, so they had focused on Ura instead we would be living in a world without MM. So I'm glad they decided to go with making a new Zelda rather than adding dungeons to OoT (which is already a masterpiece)
Indeed I think they did the best choice yet and even then we still got Masters Quest too with the remix dungeons in addition
Imagine if Miyamoto had given Aonuma one and a half years instead of just one
@@DarkPsychoMessiah Might have ended up with one of the best Zelda games even (considering if that half year gave us the full one week that was originally planned)
Wish they would of
Done both this is trhe game I grew up witth I got it righht when it came out I was about 8-9 years old man this game helped me with life it speaks to the soul man
@@Earth11111 Realistically if they did both, then you'd have repeat of areas or rather Majora's Mask would have to be delayed to the GameCube at that point as the team would be too busy with Ura Zelda... which might have worked well enough since Majora's Mask with some darker cel-shading might be neat
I believe this video convinced me that Majora's Mask _is_ Ura Zelda, or at the very least MM picked up the mantle of what Ura would inevitably be.
Feels that way. It does like "What would happen if we could utilize the full power of the N64 on OoT", which is what happened
Ura zelda is master quest in the Gamecube, is just that the since the planned extra dungeons where added on majora's mask they had to scale back the project
From the bits and pieces that I've heard over the years, this is almost in-line with what I thought happened to Ura Zelda. My suspicions were a bit off though in that I thought the unused assets went to Majora's Mask and unused Dungeon layouts ended up being used for Wind Waker. I actually thought that Master Quest was something that they put together particularly to spice up the Wind Waker release and teased the Ura Zelda elements to stir attention. Neat to have a better idea of what actually happened with that.
Wind Waker dungeon wise; it's still possible something of it was repurposed for that too. It's really hard to say what wasn't and was used. I mean boss rush mode didn't appear until the Remaster on 3DS afterall. Otherwise glad you found this informative.
@@TheObsessiveGamer An app is something that sits on your desktop to be used when needed. A program has many lines of code and a lot more robust/developed. What your referring too is actually the latter. 🙃 Apps load with the OS of choice. External code is a program and needs to be loaded/installed after the OS.
@@kylehill3643 What are you referring to? I don't see where I mentioned app?
playing twilight princess makes it obvious that all the stuff they couldn't do on OoT was fully realized on Gamecube. Like horseback combat
@@evanvinet8773 Even the Lost Woods to an extent (not as big as the beta footage of TP though)
Zelda Ocarina, Master Quest and Majora’s Mask is URA if you combine them. It is the easiest way it might actually be. After Ganondorf’s defeat you will go on a new adventure and has the same ocarina from Zelda to protect and use.
It’s funny how history repeats itself, although this case is more of a rhyme. New Zelda game (MM) needs assets so it takes from last Zelda game’s dlc (Ura), and now dlc for new Zelda game (BotW) is stopped because they have so many ideas to make a new game.
Oh heck that is true lol. It helps that Aonuma now produces the game too so that this would repeat
@@TheObsessiveGamer thanks for the reply! Just wanna say that you’re one of the best game dev historians/beta hunters I’ve seen in a long time :)
@@T0mBr1dg3 Much appreciated! Glad you have enjoyed these. More definitely planned!
It also kind of rhymed with the past. The Legend of Zelda is made for a jpn- only add-on to the Famicom/NES: the Famicom Disk System, but it actually comes out. They later bring this to the system on a cartridge. Zelda ii aswell.
The price tag definitely killed the disk drive. I can't believe it was so expensive.
The curse of Add-ons really.
@@TheObsessiveGamer NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
I CREMD
Does anyone else just like... still wish this game was real? I'm 30 and my first zelda was oot. I used to explore the hell out of this game and just thinking about the possibilities gets me excited like when I was first playing it as a kid.
32 here and I still wish it was real
Me too …
29 here. Also first Zelda. I would have loved to see more N64 Zelda as the N64 feels like home to me. But if we piece things together logically with the info we have we can assume what Obsessive Gamer mentioned in the video; that Ura Zelda was reused in Master Quest and MM. Would I have loved another game? Of course! But we can take solace in the ROM community for "DLC."
@@sublime_tv I do hope the ROM community maybe attempts to merge some MM masks as such to get us a tad closer to Ura Zelda then lol
I SUGGEST you try randomizers.
It MAY not be for you, but chances are great that you will LOVE this shit.
Seriously, its ALMOST like playing the game for the first time again having to explore every doors, even those you dont remember existing, and it pushes you to explore and find all these keys and boss keys, to be creative all over again to find how to get to certain places, and it will push you to play the game for real instead of by memory.
I am having WAY too much for with these right now and I tought it wouldnt be for me as I dont know any glitches or dont consider myself a true scholar of the game like these speedrunners.
Give it a try =) Maybe you can tap a bit in that nostalgia
*sees Chapter 4 being subtitled: A New Hope*
I see what you did there.
Heh. I mean... I was watching Star Wars Rebels while making this video... so I may or may not have done this subconsciously :P
I remember it was really easy to get through certain dungeons in Master Quest, like Jabu Jabu's Belly and the Fire Temple. Great vid!!! Whatta ending. Hit us with the feels. Your conclusions are becoming more legendary !
Thank you! I do feel some dungeons were easier in Master Quest (Water Temple for example), but Spirit Temple definitely was upped in difficulty. Glad you enjoyed the conclusion there :)
Thank you for watching everyone! and I hope this does clear up a lot of the misconceptions of Ura Zelda while also answering any questions on what it was and why it never came out.
Also a small correction on the Randnet pricing. Thanks to Luigiblood who gave us a better insight vs much of the internet, it seems the 23.50 included a rental 64DD with it actually, while what I mentioned was the store price if one bought the 64DD. So one could in a way play it in a cheaper way but you wouldn't own it in the end so much.
ZethN64 did also want to make it clear that this wasn't his Link model in the footage of his recreation mod that we were showing. The rooms are the main focus tbh.
Also if you enjoyed this video, please hit the like button! it really assists us with this algorithm
Wow classic Nintendo. Making you play on a rented 64DD so that you would want to buy a permanent one when the rental time was up.
@@mrpuglover77 yeah figures lol but I guess this was the best some could go with since the actual console was quite pricey
LuigiBlood really knows his 64DD stuff. Lol Even prior to Giga Leak, I remember him looking into OoT cartridges for the 64DD "hooks", and determining it was mostly pointing towards the Master Quest remixed dungeons concept.
@@shadowledastray Yeah I was speaking with him in the comments earlier, and he mentioned the hooks. Really fascinating stuff he mentioned
@@TheObsessiveGamer Thanks for mentioning that, I excitedly dug through the comment section and found the conversation. Haha Really interesting.. The mystery of Aunoma's disinterest in Ura Zelda may be solved. Lol
I've already seen this but yet I still watch it over and over again
you gave me something to listen to while I draw and i never get tired of it bruh
another great video
Agreed
Thank you very much Jesse! :)
Another Awesome game
I wish u could also wear the green and brown tunic as well as the green tunic
I literally just came here from your 5 OOT secrets😂
URA zelda has always been legendarily mysterious, I cant wait to finally get a clearer picture of how it might've looked and played
Tried to make it as clear as I can! Hope you enjoy!
I think what happened is it got split into master quest and majoras mask and beta OOT elements that went unused in both OOT and MM were probably shafted to some vault to later be used in future Zelda games like Twilight Princess and BOTW, take the beetle in SS for instance it works pretty similar to how Navi was going to work in the OOT beta
Sadly until someone takes the assets left behind and properly finishes them, we won’t ever get a completely clear picture bro.
@@Maya-ls3ky Yeah that's reasonable as that has been confirmed what they do at Nintendo when they don't use an idea.
@@jokesonyoumyguy5086 Indeed, but it's the best we can piece together for the moment
This was a lovely and comprehensive video.
Personally, I'm of the opinion that while there will likely always been some part of Ura Zelda that remains an unsolved mystery (unless Nintendo decides to release a documentary on the making of OoT someday...that would be amazing!) we have been, and will be playing
bits of Ura Zelda as we experience the other Zelda games as Nintendo loves to take concepts that they couldn't include in one game and implement them in some way into a newer game. Some examples of this would be the horse riding and grass whistle mechanics in Twilight Princess, as well as some things we see in Breath of the Wild as well.
Thank you! Yeah we can only go so far to know how much of Ura Zelda was a thing, so some may stay a grand mystery (like how much did Majora's Mask actually take from it?)
There are more viewers here than there ever were Nintendo DD owners...
If that ain't a milestone :P
It took Nintendo 4 years to try to match Sega's Lock on Technology campaign and they didn't even make it to market
Meanwhile, Sega releasing actual fully realized DLC for Dreamcast games later that year
Guess Sega did want Nintendon't here :P
This was so cool. I loved seeing the assets used in Majora's mask. The editing was really good too.
Thank you! Glad you enjoyed it! and i'm really happy about how the editing went with the video too
I always put Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask together as the same game on any Fav Game list.
Mostly because I often saw Majora's Mask the extra quest that would have happened if Ocarina of Time's 64DD was complete as intended.
Also fits in with the internal clock function.
Ocarina of Time is TRULY one of the greatest games of all time. It was a game changer when it came out (True 3D/massive world for the time, characters, music, etc) and side quests. I used to go fishing alot when I just wanted to travel Hyrule and chill. They really did a GREAT job of making the world feel like a REAL world with the limited space they had to deal with. And you got a HORSE to ride (In 3D) and the day and night dynamic just added to it greatly. Love this game like millions of others and will always hold a special place!
Wow that link between MM and Ura was somewhat mind blowing. I feel slightly guilty since Majora's Mask was my favorite now haha.
Blew my mind too when I first noticed and only fitting for Majora's Mask is one of the best.
I wonder if some of the dungeons found in the partially restored beta of OOT were originally going to be used for Ura Zelda, since a few were noticably harder/different/more complex than final, possibly requiring the Expansion Pack to prevent lagging. Beta Deku Tree being the standout example.
As much as i'd love it, I doubt that was the case as the Master Quest dungeons were indeed the dungeons that were going to replace the old dungeons in Ura Zelda.
Really awesome story to discover, never knew back then when I missed out all the information about Zelda 64. Never had Nintendo Power magazine or internet. Wanted to know more about it. Sense I wasn't able to have a copy of Wind Waker, I see you could buy Master Quest, so I got myself a copy and enjoy playing it. Having Majora's Mask was exciting to have, I thought it was better then Ocarina. What got to me the most about Ocarina of time, is about the development of Zelda 64 beta. I remember look up on magazine pictures of the game see how the game would have look like when they start developing. Even I saw it once and never saw it again, I thought it would show in the final version. How ever it never show. So maybe it was all seeing and lost. Until finally I found out it wasn't all just first look and never again. Ocarina of time deserve to be something more, sad it never have every work in the game. If they were planning of bring it to HD, they should remake it
I agree, I would rather see this game remade from the ground up kinda like the way FF7 Remake was... except complete lol and this way they can incorporate so many of these ideas too
@@TheObsessiveGamer First off, great vid. I'm assuming by "complete lol" you didn't like the FF7 remake? If so, I understand because even I don't think it's perfect but I really enjoyed it for what it was. I'd imagine Nintendo would change up OoT or MM too much if they did a complete remake of it as well.
@@sublime_tv Thank you! No I liked FF7 Remake, I beat it even on Hard Mode. I just mean that if they made OOT Remake, I imagine they'd make it a complete game rather than split it up like they are with FF7 Remake
So, Ura Zelda became Majora's Mask with some of the Scrapped ideas, they had left over for master quest.
Dang I remember when you had less than 2 thousand subscribers, congratulations for all the new subs!!
Thanks! How time passes quickly
Depending on the cartridge, N64 cartridges can also hold up to 64MB of data as well -- possibly more than this if you use multiple chips/banking techniques, but the largest game ROMs were 64MB, and that includes the N64 Resident Evil 2 port. In fact, none of the ROMs I have in my folder are any smaller than 8MB... 4MB was the size of the N64's internal RAM, and also the size of the Expansion Pak (adding an additional 4MB to the system for a total of 8).
This might also be the reason why the 64DD failed to catch on, it's only doubling the amount of available game data you can have (unless you can hot-swap disks, which could allow for multi-disk games) while also killing the fast load times they had as justification for the limited cartridge space in the first place. Also, magnetic storage was likely not very cost-effective. I wonder, if the 64DD was optical-based, would it have had better luck?
The 64DD seems to be a throwback to an older era, when in Japan, the Famicom Disk System was a similar add-on for the Famicom (that is, the Japanese version of the NES). It was in response to a both a chip shortage that at the time made it not cost effective to put games on cartridges, and a limitation in the ability to actually make mask ROM chips with high enough capacity to store games like... the original Legend of Zelda, which was first released on the FDS. It only came to regular cartridges years later. My suspicion is that they believed they could just do the same thing twice and get the same results, not taking into account how technology and market conditions change over time.
By the time the 64DD was to be released, what incentive did developers have for releasing their game to require the 64DD, an expensive piece of add-on hardware that only grants them double the extra game data space (which loads slowly), also requires the Expansion Pak (also sold separately), and has slow load times that completely defeats the purpose the N64 was arguably made for (there's an argument to be made that the prevalence of high action games on the N64 ties in very well to its nigh instant load times, whereas conversely the Playstation got a lot of RPGs like FF7 that required its massive storage space and FMVs that the hardware was suited for)? You're aiming at a very small and niche market of mainly enthusiasts. In the words of Tony Stark, "Not a great plan." On top of that, it likely requires a lot of well thought out programming to properly take advantage of both storage media, and cleverly allocating data between the faster cartridge ROM and the slower disk. Plus, I don't think it solved the N64's infamous texture cache problem, did it?
Oh this I know, but at the start 64MB carts weren't available. That didn't' come until much later when we got masterpiece ports like the Resident Evil 2 port on one of those.
As for the Rom files, 4-8 MB was the start. Automobili Lamborghini and Dr. Mario 64 were 4MBs, while Super Mario 64 was 8. It slowly increased over the years to 32 becoming more a standard later for games like OoT and MM.
Yeah I agree the 64DD is a throwback to what Nintendo did with the Famicom Disk System and the SNES Sataview. Problem was it didn't have the juggernaut audience or market it once did and was delayed constantly too (price didn't help it as well), and the disk size eventually became obsolete once the 64MB carts came out.
In the end, as you say, it still didn't solve the N64's texture cache problem I either I believe, and in terms of storage stayed quite inferior to the PS1.
I found this hilarious when the movie and video game rental place in my town was closing I was able to buy one of the early numbered ocarina of time as saying it still has the chanting I got it just in time because as soon as I got it paid for someone asked if it got rented or bought I heard that they were planning on buying it so a few minutes later I wouldn't have noticed that when everyone was saying all the things that were changed in other N64 releases and re releases on different consoles
This is the best video about Ura Zelda that I’ve seen. Now I finally have closure. xD Thank you
Thank you! tried real hard to make this the ultimate answer to it
Those prices are absolutely nuts for that time. I think people would pass on that even now.
From what I can tell too, the big games never even came out for 64DD further cementing the fact that the hardcore didn't even need to purchase it.
1:50 good reference
I love your videos! I cannot wait for the next one! I didn't know we got new info on Ura from the Gigaleak.
Thanks and glad you enjoyed it! yeah Gigaleak was a goldmine for all of this
This is amazing! Great job man!
Thank you very much!
Hey its Jack. Just subscribed. Great job and very impressive talents in quality.
Hey Jack! Glad you're here and thank you very much and all the support!
Funny how the original legend of Zelda and ocarina of time have many development similarities
*both were made for disk (then came to cartridges)
*both were made alongside a Mario game
*both were intended to have larger worlds
*both took around 2-3 years to develop
And both have Second Quests.
@@allideni836 i forgor 💀
both have a sequel that takes place right after
both have link
So it seems Majora's Mask miraculous 1 year development cycle was a success thanks to re-using OoT's engine, models and more (something we already knew); and applying ideas and assets from Ura Zelda (like those cut maps and a clock feature). And I thought Miyamoto was an evil villain (1 year is still crazy to think about but development was different 20 years ago, especially sequels).
Basically. It's a good development method really reuse old engines and left over ideas to make a new game and it's worked many times over.
Well, Miyamoto did give them _one_ year only to begin with when Aonuma expressed it would be smarter to make a new game instead. Not very smart though, and that lack of polish definitely shows If we judge the OG Japanese release.
I would've been interested in lying to Ganondorf about where Zelda ran off, had that idea stayed.
@@TheBreakingBenny I still wish that dialogue option from the OoT beta had stayed lol could have been hilarious
he is vallin he kjeep wanting paper mairo ruined he need wquit be slefish eivl fool and sotp ruinnig paper mario
Ocarina of Time is a cool game, its a shame they never released Zelda: Ura. I bet alot of people would want to play it :)
I don't think he was like trying to deceive us. He means the ultimate concept they decided on. All the previous iterations ideas are not part of this. The stuff from prior stages that they experimented on DD.
in majoras mask is a zone where you can fight all the minibosses
In what ways you referring to?
@@TheObsessiveGamer I mean that discarded boss rush maybe became (at least the concept since you only face the mini bosses and not the main bosses of the temples) in that mission in zelda majoras mask and then they implemented it in the remake of 3ds of ocarina of time
@@carajorex6666 To be fair, having the major bosses there would have been nonsense. Because one can rechallenge them at any time as often as one likes to.
I love your content. All your BEta Zeldas are always like a treasure chest
thank you! hoping to have treasure chest worthy content always
Man your videos are awesome! So relaxing and informative, also very clear. You deserve +1,000,000 subscribers 👌
Thanks! Here's hoping for that many subs :)
Making the music quieter would help a lot! Will give a sub tho for the future
Thanks for the feedback! and thanks for the sub too! May I ask if you can direct me to a specific part where the music may have been a bit too loud? Just to use as reference
In my opinion, the whole video length. It’s a little too loud just to be ambient background noise IMO. I listen on apple earbuds, maybe that’s a factor. Yea audio mixing is tough
@@eink-reviews No you got a point. Thanks for the feedback, I always am questioning if the audio may too loud or not. I'll plan to tone it down next time a bit. Always appreciate the feedback to improve the channel :)
SM64 is one of the smallest games clocking in at around 6MB. Larger games such as DK64 could be from 32MB to 64MB.
God bless the guy responsible for the giga-leak.
If Nintendo ever decides to do another OOT remake, they should add the ura content with it.
Would be neat, though I imagine they'd add whole new original content instead since a lot may have been already used for Majora's Mask
This was an exciting video! One of my favorite videos that you've done. Do you think those two MM maps from URA might be the ones Aunoma mentions here?
"I secretly started making new dungeons that weren’t in Ocarina of Time, and that was much more fun to me [than remixing dungeons for Ura/MQ]. So, I grew up the courage to ask Miyamoto-san whether I could make a new game, he replied by saying it’s ok if I can make it in a year.”
Thank you! That sounds exactly the situation that happened here actually, though these weren't dungeons but just new areas. As I said in the video, the dungeons of MM may have been in Ura Zelda originally, which may be what Aonuma is talking about here
@@TheObsessiveGamer I see what you mean. I saw someone talking about those 64DD maps loading in place of OoT dungeons like Deku Tree so it made me wonder if it may have been what Aunoma worked on off to the side.
Though as unlikely as this idea may be, it also makes me imagine Master Quest only with brand new dungeons completely redesigned from ground up.
I highly doubt those were meant to load in place of the Inside the Great Deku Tree (for the Swamp map) and Jabu Jabu's belly (for beneath the well in Ikana Canyon). I imagine those were just place holders until they decided where they want to direct the entrance and exit to later... I mean I highly doubt the intention was to have the inside of Jabu Jabu look like Beneath the Well.
I imagine these were going to be part of the new scenarios that Miyamoto was speaking of as a side story or side quest or expanded story even. Maybe a new area in hyrule might have been unlocked even with some of these blended in
@@TheObsessiveGamer My bad, I meant Aunoma using the Ura dungeon functionality to test those maps out inside OoT, maybe that's why he referred to his secret work as "dungeons".
Completely new dungeons would definitely need to match OoT's themes better than a well inside a fish though. Lol
@@shadowledastray Oh then yeah maybe. I know personally that it's not hard to replace maps in OOTs data (i've done it myself) so it would be like the ideal place to test it.
Another great video, I loved the editing and effort you put into this video :D
I wonder if there's even more in the gigaleak that we haven't seen yet about Zelda 64 or even the early stages of Majora's Mask development, but, at least, we can confirm that we indeed got Ura Zelda in Majora's Mask, a game that I love!
Thank you! Really glad you enjoyed the editing I did on this too.
Well we explored everything in the Gigaleak to its full extent at this point, so Zelda 64 has been fully documented and also made into video here too.
Majora's Mask... I need to further research considering we had a folder there too.
Ura Zelda being in Majora's Mask is the truly happy ending I say :)
well this was a very interesting video.
glad to know what they made for Ura Zelda wasn't wasted, and instead became one of the other best games of all time.
Indeed! I'm very glad we got a happy ending for this story realistically.
Here's what I firmly is the actual reason for Ocarina of Time and Majora's being converted into a regular N64 games. The N64DD was meant to be released worldwide in 1997 with Zelda 64 as its launch title. According to Doshin the Giant producer, Nintendo decided to delay the add-on so it wouldn't with the Nintendo 64 itself. It most famous titles were cancelled, converted into cartriges or released on the PS1. By the time of its release in 1999, it was too little too late.
MetalJesusRocks said that the N64DD had potential. That's what I keep saying. Nobodo listens. I don't think even Nintendo themselves fully grasped its potential. I would have killed to play Zelda 64DD, Ura Zelda and Zelda Gaiden. As well as having online gaming.
Maybe that could have been a part of the reason, but Nintendo did confirm loading times are the very reason the team decided to move it to a cartridge.
The biggest problem was its price really. People wouldn't wanna pay more than the N64 itself for a simple add on. Heck people didn't do that for cheap adds on to the Sega Genesis even
Been loving this series! Keep it up :)
Thank you very much! and glad you've been enjoying the series! :)
Here's what I could find.
The Giga leak's production logs indidate that A Link to the Past's Palace of Darkness was meant to be appear in the the URA Zelda expansion disk. According to a gossip stone, it was to be hidden in the Gerudo Valley. I'm 100% certain it went on to become the Ikana Castle and Graveyyard in Majora's Mask.
The Woodfall Temple in MM has a lot in common with another dungeon from another Zelda AlttP: the Swamp Palace. Was it meant to appear in URA Zelda A possibility.
The Ice Temple I'm sure was meant to appear,: An Ice Medallion having been found. in the files of OoT. My theory is that in Ura Zelda, the Zora Domain would unfreeze after beating the Ice Temple. The latter became the Snowhead Temple in MM.
I'm also positiitive that an Earth, Light and Wind Temples were set to appear as well, and got merged into the Stone Temple in MM.
ùMy theory: After slaughtering all 100 all Skulltullas.in Ocarina, URA would unlock optional skulltullas dungeons.
A Mask-Making feature was in the works. It'd be possible thanks to the Gameboy.
Adult Link would use the Blade Beam in a similar manner to Fierce Deity Link in M. My theory is that you'd acquire the Blade Beam after the Light Temple.
Tbh, Zeth64's team gave us a really cool vision on what they tought Ura Zelda would've been. The music, scenarios and story was just amazing.
I'm kinda sad it was nothing like that legendary game most of us tought 🤧
The ZethN64 team definitely had a lot of heart in taking what Miyamoto said and made what they would have if they were put in charge of expanding upon Ocarina of Time. The product definitely did look amazing too. I imagine it would have been quite legendary if they hadn't made Majora's Mask here, but I guess that's the trade off
Lmao, I remember that shitshow. I remember when every few weeks a trailer would be announced, and then when it was supposed to come out it was always conveniently delayed. Turns out, there was barely any work done to begin with, and all of the stuff shown in trailers was actually REALLY old stuff. Not to mention it pretty much stopped being an Ura Zelda restoration and was its own game instead. Thank god I never donated to it, though I wanted to at first.
@@Weedbongz I wasn't following it closely, but all that happened eh? Feels like a trend with a lot of Zelda recreation mods sometimes.
I mean based on what I saw, it does seem to be the idea of "if Miyamoto told me to make an expansion to OoT, how would I do it?" which I guess he made these areas that would have to add onto OoT?
Majora's Mask was great, I'd rather have that than an Ocarina of Time expansion. Nintendo released the Ura Zelda/Ocarina of Time leftovers in Master Quest (I felt like the Master Quest's version of the Water Temple was actually easier), so overall I am pleased with that.
My main disappointment with OoT was that Link couldn't collect the entire Triforce for facing off against Ganon.
My theory is that they used "ura zelda" in the next 3d main games (MM, TP, SS and BOTW) + master quest. And maybe the BOTW sequel as well, that's a possibility after all
Sounds plausible. They usually do that for cut Zelda content such as the cut temples of Wind Waker being reused later
Great video! I've been following the many pieces covered here like the N64DD, Ura Zelda, the Gigaleak, and the recreation mods; but this paints a much clearer picture of virtually everything. I hadn't heard about the boss rush stuff at all, or that Master Quest maps were actually grouped with the leaked Ura files. Hell, this was the best explanation of why the DD flopped as hard as it did that I have seen. $299 for an add-on, and Zelda being a full priced expansion that required the original, AFTER the Dreamcast was already out?
The Gigaleak has given so much insight on long hanging questions and development processes. I wish more developers had similar troves of beta content. Capcom seems like it's be the most interesting to me.
Thank you! and glad it was very informative on giving that clear picture. Hopefully devs open up one day. Capcom's original concept for Devil May Cry is what I want to see when it was the original Resident Evil 4
I played majors mask but I found the whole game mildly depressing and I couldn’t shake the feeling of checking the time. I once tried to force myself to see what would happen if the time ran out but I couldn’t do it. The pressure of needing to save people was too strong. Ocarina of time was happier for me - slowly but surely you were setting places straight.
My theory is Ura Zelda is just a mixture of Master Quest and Majora's Mask into one, along with additional new ideas and features utilising the power of the Nintendo 64 DD.
Pretty much. Thus why if you played both, you may have experienced the Ura Zelda already in a form
Club nintendo MX reporter Conejo (Rabbit in english) interviewed once for his section of the magazine either Miyamoto or Aonuma and it was said, word for word, that MM was made from recycled assets of ura zelda.
Ooh. Do you by chance have a link to this interview? Would love to use it as a source
@@TheObsessiveGamer I'd need to spray with insecticide the place where I store the magazines to dig it up, I have like a decade worth of Club Nintendo Magazines to check through. If I find it, I'll take a scan of it, mind you the interview is in spanish so I'd need to TL it.
But its one of those clear things I remember, in order to meet the 1 year deadline they had to recycle elements from ura zelda.
@@TheGoodWillSpreader Hopefully you can get it and send me translation too! Always can contact me via Twitter to send it too whenever you grab it. Would love to share it to everyone (With you fully credited of course)
Having watched this, maybe Majora's Mask is more Ura Zelda than we thought. Although that game has its own share of beta oddities.
Yeah and I do plan to cover a ton of the Majora's Mask beta soon too, so hang tight for those if interested!
It was interesting to watch these videos since the beginning. From the very first stream of Beta cut content to the final video about Zelda 64 OOT Cut Content Ura Gaiden Limited Edition Remaster HD Remake The Official Video Game - I may have added a few words - But I must say you did a really good job on this series.
Any chance you'll do a big compilation video with all of this content? Like one big video that covers all of this from start to finish? I know the playlist exists for a reason but I think it'd be awesome to have a big "Zelda Beta Cut Content REWIND" video. That and I think if enough people watched it, it might help you with that algorithm. Longer watch time, audience retention - you know the game playa.
I also think having some Zelda remixes might spruce things up a bit, the originals are great but who doesn't like to hear an old favourite in a new way? I noticed that Zeltik guy always has some Zelda remixes going on in his videos which is why I bring it up. Even if I tune out of the video the music always catches my attention, because well it's a Zelda remix and the music is great!
Just wanted to give my $0.05 - I'm Canadian we don't have pennies anymore! 💎
Thank you very much! and glad you've been here and supporting the channel since then! I do want to do a big compilation video (might make it a full doc on Ocarina of Times history in combo too, still deciding), but it might a little while later since such a video requires quite the planning as it's a VERY long and deep development process. Stay tuned! and for now I got Majora's Mask planned.
Also as one Canadian to another, I feel your pain (or lack thereof) of not having pennies anymore LOL
I actually was disappointed with master quest when I first played it, it felt more tedious than challenging to me
I’ve been super excited for this one, wasn’t disappointed!
Thank you and glad you enjoyed it!
This video is amazing, thanks!
Thank you for watching!
Indeed and the leaks confirmed it a last too :)
@@TheObsessiveGamer this also completely debunks the theory of the obtainable triforce in Ura Zelda only being a rumor and nothing more
Majoras mask was horrible.
Everything keep resetting and u just wait for specific times over and over again then you need to try to talk to everyone with different types of masks instead of just talk to the NPCs.
The plot was horrible and the execution was bad.
In OOT the difference made sense since it was different time periods (young and adult) but just standing by an npc and keep changing masks to get different outcomes is just weird.
would have been better off creating a ocarina of time 2 where you keep the same adventure idea.
I understand that Majora's Mask wasn't always for everyone for that exact reason of the time limit. An Ocarina of Time 2 is something I have always wanted however taking place after Majora's Mask
Damn what I didn't realize Majora's mask came out the day after my birthday
eyy, we had someone else mention here how OOT came out on their birthday too. Really neat to see both are here :3
@@TheObsessiveGamer yeah it's funny to see that. OOT is a bit older than me but MM is 1 day younger
It'd be neat to see the beta versions of the rest of the Ura dungeons.
Maybe if one day we get another leak we might :3
Where is that clip of link at the beach with the footprints from?
Good video, incredibly well researched, definitely surpassed my expectations. Nice!
The only issue I saw was at the end where you say that the early MM dungeons in the Ura/MQ files were originally meant for Ura Zelda. That is most likely false. They were probably the secret dungeons that Aonuma were making during his time on Ura's development since he disliked remixing his old dungeons. I only say this because he explicitly mentions it in a MM3D Iwata Asks. YT won't let me post the link, but it's the first page of the MM3D Iwata Asks.
In short, Ura Zelda is not a husk of what it was meant to be. It's exactly what we were always intended to get.
Thanks! Aonuma was probably experimenting on making Ura Zelda maps, so these very maps were likely meant for Ura Zelda originally before being pushed to Majora's Mask. These weren't dungeons and were just maps of random areas, so I believe these were indeed being made for Ura Zelda before being moved to Majora's Mask.
@@TheObsessiveGamer I very highly doubt it, considering the code of the OOT only calls for dungeon layouts from the disk data.
You can ask all this stuff on the TCRF Discord server, there are people there who are very knowledgeable on how this stuff works.
@@evdestroy4121 The code calls only for replacing maps. New Maps could still be inserted as seen in the Disk Mod "Dawn and Dusk" which did exactly that. Its creator did mention it was a rather tough process still, but proved none the less it is possible to do so. Therefore Nintendo making these maps for Ura Zelda originally still stands but its difficulty in execution map have also been another reason (aside from Aonuma just not wanting to make to update a game) that they moved them to Majora's Mask.
As for the Aonuma interview you mention, I am well aware of that and the only reason he mentioned dungeons was cause he was the dungeon designer of OOT so naturally he'd be in charge of the section that involved remixing dungeons, while others would handle any other aspect of it (which still wouldn't be enough). Thus why he moved on
Part of me is glad that Ura Zelda never came to be, dlc would’ve came a lot earlier had it come to fruition.
I always thought Majoras mask was ura Zelda. Just from what I read in magazines and what limited internet we had (shocking today right?)
More that I believe a lot either didn't put two and two together, or just believe Ura Zelda was something else entirely
So in conclusion: Wanna play Ura Zelda? Play Majora's Mask and Master Quest.
Yep! and if you want Boss Rush, just play OOT 3D
Its funny because if ocarina of time had been fully developed for the DD then there might have been a chance that Majora's mask wouldn't have been developed.
Pretty much. Aonuma only suggest MM because Ura was no a true advancement to him and only an expansion
I absolutely love your content . 11/10
Thank you! :)
Keep in mind, the Gigaleak's currently released contents are only a 10th of the overall infodump; there are multiple mysterious leftovers in both some earlier trailers and the final game that are not reflected in the stages of development that have been leaked so far. One would think that these artifacts were added at a later stage, but were ultimately cut and some may not have even been considered for use in URA Zelda, despite investigators' theories. I would like to see what leaks next, particularly pertaining to the Unicorn Fountain, the Light Temple and the areas depicted from 3:23 to 3:31 of this video.
If you actually watch the last video I posted, that area you quoted was never meant to be ingame actually and was made for a tech demo (though using the N64's power). Unicorn fountain is what I really wish to see and yeah there is still ALOT of we have yet to see.
I’m quite sure OOT was in development for more than 4 years
It was indeed, but i said 1 and half year on CARTRIDGE. The rest prior was all on 64DD for a total of 3-4 years
Uggghh i love you, you are the gem of my youtube subs
Big thank you :3
After 20 years, the legend behind Ura/Beta Zelda 64 created groups of coders and modders, and now they're all searching and struggling to re-create that lost treasure..It seems like the story of the pirates of One Piece. Anyway, great video! Deeply full of details!
>1000 episodes later and the search for Ura Zelda is still not successful
Fits that it's been well over 20 years as the search continues :P and thanks!
LoZ:OoT was released legitamently on my birthday, I was born on 11/21/1997 and I turned 1 year old on 11/21/1998 when LoZ:OoT released...I'm 23 years old and LoZ:OoT is 22 years old legit.
Heck that's an amazing birthday
@@TheObsessiveGamer I'm legitimently 1 year older than LoZ:OoT The Obsessive Gamer.
Me: 11/21/1997
LoZ OoT: 11/21/1998
Thank you for not being dumb like literally every other person on the subject. Everyone else always pretends that Ura and Master Quest are two different names, but you actually tell the truth and say that "Master Quest" is just NoA's localized name for it. Again, thank you. :)
Thanks! And yeah indeed. Especially when in Japan the game boots up to the title screen literally saying "Zeruda no Densetsu: Toki no Okarina Ura"
@@TheObsessiveGamer Exactly. Plus, while some of the earlier interviews made it sound like a much bigger expansion than we got, later interviews clearly stated it would have harder dungeons, and didn't say anything about altered stories or overworld. At least, not that I can find.
*two different *games,* not _names._ 😅
Hey! Your videos are great, and I've enjoyed this one in particular!
The slow dawning realization before you got to that actual point of realizing Majora's Mask, thought for a long time that as Zelda Gaiden it was just another expansion like Ura Zelda, actually is *in part* Ura Zelda itself was both freeing (because we finally known we actually have gotten it, just not in the way we expect) and upsetting (because it means if Eiji Aonuma hadn't had that talk with Miyamoto and began work on Zelda Gaiden we would never get one of my favorite Zelda games). I don't think you're too far off in thinking they likely pulled new dungeons meant from Ura Zelda to help put Majora's Mask together. Tho I would have liked to see Ura Zelda in a complete form, I am ultimately satisfied with what we did wind up getting.
I mean while I would love to see Ura Zelda as they were intending, I imagine it'd still be less new content than what we got in MM as that is an expansion vs a full new game, so i'm glad with what we got
Something tells me Ura Zelda was split in two due to hardware limitations and the failure of the 64dd. The second quest being Master quest and the side story being Majoria's mask. Fans of the series never saw this because we're looking for a single game not three.
Well the split was cause Aonuma did not want to work on it. This was decided upon before 64DD even released.
Amazing video, this are some thinks that you can do later (if you want)
the source code of The Simpson hit & run was leak
some early plot and documentation of Shadow of the colossus was also leak
if you want, you can document this in a video
great work
Thank you! and I would love to especially do one on Shadow of the Colossus and all 24 of the its bosses. In the future I just might
Wait.. 4mb? 64 cartridges aren't that small, that sounds more like him snes game
They were that small at the beginning. SNES carts near the end were at 4MBs for the most part. N64 Carts hit 64MB by the very end itself actually.
I really wish they worked Ura Zelda into OoT3D instead of just Master Quest
Yeah same, but I imagine that would take more effort than they wanted lol
Sorry but that 64DD price calculation is entirely false, you overlooked a huge part of the Randnet subscription: It was 2500 Yen (~$23) per month to use the Randnet service, AND renting a 64DD at the same time. You absolutely did not need to buy a 64DD for $299, this was when the 64DD was released in stores much later. There's also the fact that almost every 64DD game were sent for free as part of the Randnet subscription, almost none of them were released in stores.
There was even an alternate Randnet subscription for 3300 Yen (~$30) a month where you could rent a 64DD and a N64 Clear Black unit for those who didn't have it.
It is much cheaper than you think it was, even if the store version of the 64DD has a batshit insane price.
...that said thanks for saying Ura Zelda is Master Quest, because while the Gigaleak did imply there was more to it, at the end of the day, all that was truly implemented were the alternate dungeons.
But one other reason why Ura Zelda would not have been much, is also because of the 64DD implementation in Ocarina of Time, it was very limited, and in fact they had a disk ready for it for when they sent OoT for approval, it was replacing the dungeons already, with just the original OoT dungeons though, it was just a way to test it to make sure it actually works when they would release something.
The limitations were like you could only replace a bunch of dungeon maps and minimaps and also text, but you could technically replace almost anything... but only replace stuff. The problem however, this alternate way to replace any content aside from maps and dungeon minimaps and text, is incompatible with all revisions of the original game which had 3 versions (1.0, 1.1 & 1.2).
Developers found a hacky way to deal with this by embedding ROM information of every single version of the game into the disk, you would just then detect the version to properly deal with this, and seemingly wanted to do something with Keaton Mask & Gerudo Mask and Child Link's model, this might still have been implemented in the actual disk had it come out, but it's still genuinely not much.
I personally think that Ura Zelda's fate was already decided by the implementation of the 64DD expansion support into Ocarina of Time, as even when I did the magic of Zelda 64 Dawn & Dusk as a disk, it is still a very hacky mess that stepped outside of the limitations of the implementation constantly.
Oh wow LuigiBlood! glad to see you here and love what you did with that that amazing mod using real 64DD hardware to make Dusk and Dawn. While you do say that the OOT was basically made to just have its material replaced, you did still add full new maps and scenarios to it too, so technically with enough work couldn't they have done something like this too? I imagine with it taking alot of work as it did for you that it could have been another reason why they went against expanding further? Pretty fascinating learning this here too.
and ooh did not know that the subscription also let you rent a 64DD and get games too. Information on it being so scattered didn't lead me to that lol Mind linking me to this actually? I could use this source for a future video actually if you don't mind :)
@@TheObsessiveGamer Technically all maps in Dawn & Dusk, and in fact, for all OoT hacks, replaced already existing maps. The detail is just that we can fully replace them all the way and not just do small changes, but as much as I changed maps for Dawn & Dusk, while it is possible to do a lot, I highly doubt Nintendo would have done the way I did with game hack insertion into the engine code in real time. Changing the music would be impossible without some really hacky tricks that I am entirely convinced that Nintendo wouldn't even bother, I haven't seen evidence of any hacks like that in the Gigaleak, just that they would insert information of every revision to help file replacements as a whole, and nothing else.
For Randnet, Wikipedia does have base information for this with sources, but there's a couple contradictions after checking around.
So I would like to say what's the deal with Randnet:
What you are paying with the Randnet subscription (details on the fee after), you receive a Randnet Starter Kit (64DD + Modem), as part of the subscription you also have paid for 8 64DD software. This is important to detail, because the subscription fee would pay for all of this, which I did find 2500 Yen (~$23) and 3300 Yen (~$30) with a N64 Clear Black unit. It also turns out that the Randnet website does mention a 12-month flat rate of 30000 Yen (~$290) and 39600 Yen (~$380) with the N64 Clear Black unit.
IGN says this was revised, but only IGN mentioned this, and I could not find any additional evidence if the service actually changed to this, or if it was an additional plan for registration (basically choosing either monthly or yearly?), but this is still an important distinction, for roughly $300, you technically bought the 64DD, the Randnet service access and 8 64DD software, so this is definitely not the 64DD price.
There were also talks of the 64DD pricing in 1997 from Miyamoto, roughly about $120, which honestly, might sound about right.
Sources:
web.archive.org/web/20000226213125/www.randnetdd.co.jp:80/apply/index.html (Application Information, still mentions monthly payments)
web.archive.org/web/20000419022955/www.randnetdd.co.jp/tempo.html (Flat rate payment information)
pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/article/20001124/randnet.htm (Basic Application Fee)
www.ign.com/articles/1999/12/16/ign64s-ultimate-64dd-faq (This does have a lot of basic 64DD and Randnet info)
www.ign.com/articles/1997/07/26/64dd-to-sell-for-120 (64DD Pricing)
@@LuigiBlood But I thought real time insertion was what it was supposed to do since the idea was to have both your game cart and Ura Zelda plugged in at once? Infact I don't think they even got that far to try it? Gigaleak wise yeah we don't have enough info. Might have even been to make maps first and insert them later. I imagine with this, music would have been entirely reused.
I mean alternatively they could have always shoved all of the vanilla Ocarina of Time + new content onto a single 64DD Disc since it would have twice the size of what the OOT cart had.
Or maybe they didn't plan ahead how difficult a task the real time swapping would be at first? I know Miyamoto said it would be possible to do a cart release, so maybe it was them realizing how tough it was and might just do a single cart instead? (I think 64MB carts later were available too)
Thank you for all the Randnet info there plus the links. I do want to make a new 64DD video on Super Mario 64 2 where I plan to recap this, so this updated info is very useful in explaining what the 64DD was.
Anyways, it's been a good talk with someone who has directly worked with a 64DD game, keep up the good work! (and I absolutely wish I could buy a cheaper 64DD to play your mod the way it was meant to be played instead of the "cart hacks")
@@TheObsessiveGamer Replacing maps was the easy part, but pretty much all ROM hacking is usually replacing something with something else. The problem with OoT's 64DD implementation was that it had things that was easier to replace than others, there are what I call 64DD hooks within parts of OoT's engine that makes it easier to replace data, when it comes to the maps, that tends to be easy, but then when you deal with minimaps, it turns out there's only a 64DD hook to the Dungeon minimap info loading, and not the one for the rest of the maps. This already should say a lot on their plans for Ura Zelda. Even the scene table had some of the dungeons already marked for 64DD loading straight out of the box.
Basically any time there's a 64DD hook into the engine it tends to make it easier to sideload something, but then there's also a 64DD hook for almost all game data loading (not music & sound though) but that one is actually quite limited, because it pretty much tends to limit you to replace almost any file but also has to be the same size or less. This does not happen for other hooks, and this is what makes it harder if you actually intend to do something more ambitious than a dungeon replacement, because then you'd actually need to hack the game's code in real time but then you'd need to know the assembly language, and also, the code is different for each version of the game so like, I was constantly fighting with what was intended to do, and figuring out everything. I'm pretty sure a lot of what I did for Dawn & Dusk, Nintendo developers wouldn't dare doing it.
While the developers do have all of the info for every version of the game, it is still hard to hack the game and ensure stability if you intend to do more, so the fact that a special cartridge ROM was considered is already pretty telling, and in fact, was certainly a better way to be able to put everything into one package. But they didn't really do that in the end, since all they did pretty much is put the new dungeons instead of the old ones, change the Title Screen, and that's it.
The way 64DD is implemented in OoT is also unlike every other game that supports it like F-Zero X, Mario Party 1 and Pokémon Stadium (Japan only). The other games tend to use an alternate executable and then reboot the game with the new executable. This does give a lot more control over what you can do in the game, because you could have implemented anything from there. F-Zero X got the track editor and the machine editor, but if they wanted to, they could also have implemented something else on top, that stuff was never in the cartridge ROM data, it just leverages the ROM data when it sees fit. If OoT had this method of expansion reboot from the start of the game, a more ambitious Ura Zelda would certainly be possible.
@@LuigiBlood Then yeah maybe this would further explain why Aonuma didn't want to do Ura Zelda when one thinks about it. Miyamoto had these big ambitious plans but Aonuma knew it'd be a headache and a half. Despite making these various maps for it, much of these were instead repurposed for Majora's Mask, leaving only what was feasible for Ura Zelda (the remix dungeons).
I imagine they didn't bother with the special edition cartridge though in the end simply cause remix dungeons wouldn't be worth it and that these new maps had already been moved to Majora's Mask.
All in all, thank you very much for such a detail insight! It kinda makes me want to slowly plan a video further documenting the 64DD in the future one day.
Nintendo should finish these beta versions and release them. I'm sure it wouldn't take that much man power, and would sell pretty well.
Hmmmm, to work or to call out of work, that is the question
In all honesty while I do love mm it was kind of a jerk move of miyamoto to only give them one year and yet it was still a masterpiece
I do wonder if it was partly due to budget too since I imagine they had to split the Ura Zelda budget just for this game.
@@TheObsessiveGamer actually that’s a good point I didn’t think about that
EYYYY! August 19, 1999, that was my 15th birthday!
Eyyyy
Great video, but there’s one thing I didn’t like, you make it seem like Koizumi was responsible for the decision of not continuing development of OoT on the 64DD, which is inaccurate, I also read that Iwata asks interview and they only talked about the problem of Link’s movement, if anything it is said in the interview that Link could have moved on the Disk Drive if only there weren’t too many movements, but Koizumi made 500 patterns. Also, Aonuma always ends up with all the credit for OoT and Majora, but in reality OoT was made by the work of 5 directors working together, and Majora, had Two Directors, Koizumi and Aonuma.
Thanks however I wasn't saying it was his sole word that got it off, but rather he commented on it. Also Iwata in that interview said it is because of how it has to take time to read the disc. That in itself is a loading time factor by definition. Now what it affected (Links movements here for example) is a different story but I didn't get into too many specifics for that since the video is mainly to tell the story of Ura Zelda rather than Zelda 64.
Also I only spoke of specific employees who were relatable to the story here, so yes while I know of those other directors and staff there just wasn't much to say about them in this video
Based on whats out there roughly 30% of the game was either scrapped or repurposed to another game which a lot of em went to Majoras Mask, Wind Waker, Twighlight Princess and Breath of the Wild.
Imagine if they pushed the game back to a time when the cartridges got bigger and better. They might have finished it the dungeons at least, i can see how they may drop a few gameplay mechanics such as being able to swing your sword on horseback. We dont really NEED that per se but it woulda been nice so i can see things like that being cut to save space, id rather theyd cut little things in order to fit the story and their dungeons.
I do hope if we get a true full-on remake of OOT that we can get a lot of these things with it
@@TheObsessiveGamer but then we may not get the other games remade 😂
I did know this amazing channel.
Glad you enjoy this channel! Got plenty planned.
Giga leak's production logs indidate that A Link to the Past's Palace of Darkness was meant to be appear in the the URA Zelda expansion disk. It later appeared in Wind Waker and A Link Between Worlds.
Great video again.
That moment though when you mentioned that Master Quest was available as a pre order bonus to Windwaker. I bought the Black GameCube with Windwaker as a package deal as a kid with my mom. This package deal also included that pre order bonus you mentioned. I always thought that was a default package like the Mario Kart Double Dash pack. Fun to know!
Thanks! The default doesn't have them packed together, so you go a special edition of sorts. I never saw that one personally but I have seen their boxes online. Might have never came here in Canada I imagine?
@@TheObsessiveGamer hmm I thought I answered this but maybe because I added a link to an image of the console package. Basically I said that it looks to be a PAL region only package.
@@masterkil371 ooh it was PAL? that makes more sense now lol
You got to be that Bob's Burger kid
This is like if YuriofWind had respectable mic quality
Never even considered comparing his mic quality to mine lol I should check
@@TheObsessiveGamer Upon looking at Yuri's newest video I think what I meant was mixing but it's really hard to tell if peaking is the issue or if it's the mic. Over all spectacular video and my apologies that your first interaction with me was based around insulting another content creator.
@@punishedbread4779 haha no worries! I'll took it as a compliment :) and thanks!
With that Luigi one on the Gigaleak all i can think of was that Elf Meme "You Sit on a Throne of Lies!" and for a while saying Luigi was planned and no model exist. lol
It makes sense since dd was in a pretty bad spot so to not waste their work they moved uras new content to mm boss rush might've been considered for oot but was pushed back still master quest serves it's purpose better as a harder difficulty rather than an expansion
Yeah pretty much to all that. I mean they could have still release Ura Zelda with all that MM content on a cart too technically, but I agree that it served better as getting to be used for a new game instead. Master Quest is now more or less just used as the name for "hard mode" in new Zelda games too. I do wish we could get remixed dungeons with that too.
4:20 Does anyone know what this game is?
Development blue disc, this was an empty disc that developers would use to flash games on
9 months late but here's your answer :)
@@youssef11223344thank you
Your voice reminds me of Gene from Bob's Burgers.
I do hear this a lot, but I don't hear myself with any sort of rasp that Gene has XP
I love how the Nintendo HQ is a huge GameCube
Things you can't unsee