Learn Norwegian: Norwegian Tones/Pitch Accents - Subtitles/Transcripts
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- Опубликовано: 2 окт 2024
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www.learnnorwe...
Learn Norwegian and learn about the little nuances in Norwegian pronunciation that can completely change the meaning of what you're trying to say.
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This series will hopefully help you in your quest to learn Norwegian. This series is suitable for anyone learning Norwegian, or wants to learn Norwegian. The episodes are all in Norwegian but every episode has both Norwegian and English transcripts provided. If you have any questions regarding Norwegian or anything else, don't hesitate to ask them. The NorwegianLearning-channel also has an active Facebook-community where you can practice more Norwegian and socially interact with the other members of the community.
Good luck with learning Norwegian! Work regularly and steadily, and suddenly you will know how to talk Norwegian fluently.
Best of luck,
Peder
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The confusing part about this is that when you first pronounce accent 2 in isolated words (ie outside of a sentence) your pitch drops at the end which makes it seem like the distinction is very clear between the two accents but when you pronounce the accent 2 for the same word in a sentence, your pitch rises at the end which is very confusing because now the distinction becomes extremely subtle.
Agreed. The modelling in isolation clearly demonstrates a rise for Tone 1 and a fall for Tone 2. However, other sources on RUclips model Tone 2 as being fall-rise.
På tonelag 1 går den berre opp på slutten. På tonelag 2 går den litt ned i midten for så å gå litt opp på slutten. Dette er kva eg høyrer i alle fall.
having said that, this guy has made me shit scared that one day i will be in norway and tell someone i love to eat farmers lol
If you accidentally say it, they'll understand by the context. Obviously you don't love eating farmers! Or...
@@Babagrillennot on Tuesdays
been learning norwegian for 7 years and i have to say that was really good. i learnt most of mine by listening daily so i think it has more or less become intuative with me. no one ever really touches on the two tones when you learn norwegian and to be honest, it is probably best that you don't focus on it in the early days. great video though
Tusen takk! Please don't take this badly, but your explanation (as most of the explanations in books for foreigners), is not as helpful as it could be. For Eastern (Oslo) Norwegian, for recognition of words, the most important thing is to notice the pitch of ONLY the first syllable, that is, the stressed syllable. You need to give people practice with only the first syllables of each pair (lengthen them as much as you can so people have time to hear the pitch). Tone 1 words begin with a low pitch on the first syllable, and they go straight up (because all words in Eastern Norwegian end in a higher pitch anyway). Tone 2 words have a high pitch on the first syllable, then they have a slight dip in pitch along the word, and end again in a high pitch. The key is the pitch of the FIRST SYLLABLE. The only book for foreigners I have ever seen that explains this properly is ASSIMIL's Norsk Uten Strev (Le norvégien sans peine). Cheers and sorry for criticizing, but as I said, you are explaining it the way everybody does, it's just that it is not the best way :-)
Wow, that was actually really helpful! Thank you.
jaletta
My pleasure. Hopefully it is not wrong :-) I must stress that this only applies to the Oslo region. Other regions have different patterns. And it doesn't actually apply to every single word in a spoken sentence. Even though all non monosyllabic words have lexical tones, words that do not carry phrasal stress in a sentence tend to lose their tone, at least that is my (imperfect) understanding.
brunilda Thank you for the extra details :) I conducted an experiment with a Norwegian speaker, and it worked (both pronouncing and understanding tones)! Luckily they were from Oslo region.
Experiment? Are you a linguist?
Bruno Estigarribia I am indeed a linguist, but it was a joke :) I just asked someone I know to say different tonem 1 and 2 words slowly, fast and multiple times, and then tried to recreate the tones.
Wow, this is fantastic! I'm beyond the point of learning basic Norwegian now, and I've been frustrated that most videos I find are for beginners. I've been looking for ways to help me improve my Norwegian at the level I know now, and this was wonderful! Thank you so much!
I am very glad to hear that, Kayla! Thank you. Good luck with your further Norwegian learning!
Actually reminded me our first Chinese lesson at school (but there are 4 tones). In such cases people should turn their imagination and associations on. For example, I hear the first tone as a clarifying question and the second one as an affirmative response. Just imagined a typical movie dialogue, something like "Deal? - Deal." and it sounds very similar to there two tones. Awesome.
U think so? So I should just fake it as if I'm asking something when I say "bønder", which is tonem 1?
Tuuusen takk for episoden! Kanksje du sier B begge gangene...? Det var så vanskelig å forstår! Jeg husker at læreren i Norge prøvde å forklare meg de samme eksempler, men uten suksess... Men jeg skal øve på dette!
I don't think tones is something that should scare you that much when learning Norwegian, it'll probably come somewhat naturally after some exposure, and people will usually understand what you mean by context.
I'm a native Norwegian speaker, and I wasn't even aware until I read about it, and I just thought it was pretty cool that my language has some minor tonal features, which I associated with "exotic" languages like Chinese and whatnot :)
I've been learning Norwegian for 7+ years and you are dead right. I have kind of picked up on these tones naturally by listening over and over. They are in no way as imporatant (as far as I am aware) as they are in a language such as Chinese. I could be wrong. I love Norwegian and I am so very glad I started and became hooked, even if only to find those real funny guys on P4 Misjonen. And RR som går ut nå på P13 lol
youandwhosearmy?
Hvis du har lært norsk i 7+ år kan jeg kanskje skrive på norsk? =P
But I'll stick to English anyway. Tones are a much more important feature of Chinese, as far as I know too. So if you learn Chinese, you probably need to consciously focus on it a bit more. But I suspect if you stop and ask an average native Chinese speaker about tones, he/she might not be that consciously aware of using them either.
"even if only to find those real funny guys on P4 Misjonen."
Yeah, quite alot of funny stuff available in Norwegian I think, despite it being a small language :) Wish I could find something like that in German, but idk if Germans are that funny..XD
Dalek Caan As a fluent speaker of Chinese, we are definitely aware of using correct tones, otherwise you won't be able to be understood. After a while it becomes muscle memory and the correct tones come out no problem, but we are definitely aware that we are using tones and which tones we are using. :D
Your channel is fantastic.
Those examples you give us are very helpful. I wish I could see more of them, because frankly speaking I think that's the best and most effective way to understand the norwegian pitch accents!
Thank you very much for that, Krassy! I am glad you liked the examples. Hope to see you around on later videos as well.
-Peder
Tusen takk for these riveting and spontaneous videos! Can we have them more often?
Well, I think the first one is A and the second one is B!!!! Ultra useful video! Now I understand that pitch is important!
Correct! :D Thank you very much! Glad it helped.
Sure it did! :)
OMG where has your channel been all my life!
Arigato so much for the detailed explanation of some particular Norwegian words ! :)
I will keep trying my best until I finally go live in Norge where my Norske grandpa lives in ! :D
Sakura fra Japan
I've never studied norwegian, only swedish for few years, but still if I hear norwegian I understand it more than swedish.
I can catch some sentences that are spoken in norwegian maybe better than swedish. Written text is the whole different story tho:D. I guess the accent is easier for finns.
at this time this is probably the only video on YT with examples aqnd explanations on the famous pitches (and it would be a great shame not to get at least familiar with it if you learn norsk... it would be like bread without salt :).
and so clear, although it's on norwegian, which I know I'll learn better if I get customed to accents.:)
thank you so much
I am so glad to hear that this episode was helpful for you! :-) Norwegian pitch accents is a very exciting topic in my opinion and I can definitely understand foreigners when they say that they don't hear a difference. If you really want to master the Norwegian language I'd say that you have to get the Norwegian pitch accents right, although Norwegian tones probably aren't things you should focus on before you are quite good in Norwegian.
Hope to see you around on future videos as well! :)
-Peder
Thank you. I want to learn but so difficult!
You're welcome. Thank you for your comment. I understand... If you have any questions, I'd love to help! :-)
~Peder
am I stupid but I can’t tell the difference between the tones they sound the SAME
you're a handsome man
Question: are tones used on every word? If so, why aren't they usually indicated in Norwegian grammars so that we can learn the tones together with the word?
I can't see the difference between tonem 1 and 2 :(((((
I can definitely understand that it's hard to hear a difference between the two tones. It isn't very important to hear a difference because everyone will understand you either way. It's a very interesting aspect regarding the Norwegian language though.
-Peder
+Petcu Iulia-maria The difference is that the melody of the pitch is that in the first one, the melody goes from flat middle tone in the first syllable to flat high tone in the second syllable. So it's a bit like singing the first two steps of a staircase.
In the second one, you start high on the first syllable, drop down to a low tone while still on the first syllable and rise again on the first syllable, while the second syllable is flat middle high. So it's like you sing a square root sign.
TLDR; Staircase melody vs. square root sign melody.
+Amphibiot excuse but which is the first one and which one is the second one???? Bønner 1 eller 2?
Bønder vs Bønner; "Bønner" (beans) is the 'square root sign' melody, which starts highpitched and falls in pitch on the first syllable, then rises almost to it's original pitch starting point on the second syllable.
+Amphibiot thank u that was helpful! Do you know where I can read more about tonem 1 and tonem 2? I find out that many words, that are written exactly same but with different tone/pitch. Any books or videos about norwegian intonatation??
Does anyone know the same channel but in Swedish? I mean teaching Swedish like this,naturally
Thank you for this awesome videos you done. It is being very helpful! I really needed to hear some norwegian to help my studies. I can't hear the difference between the tones yet (and I'm getting a bit confused), but I'll keep trying XD
Hello Niveal! Thank you very much. I am glad they can prove to be helpful! Well, don't focus too much on it - it isn't exactly _very_ important to know about in daily Norwegian. ;-)
jeg bare nå finner dine videoer. Tusen takk! Disse er perfekt til høre og ser ord sammen. Mer, vær så snill!
Tusen takk! Jeg er glad du liker videoene mine. Jeg vil gjerne lage mer, men hver episode tar så lang tid i tillegg til at jeg har mye annet jeg driver med for tiden. Håper å legge ut en ny episode om ikke alt for lenge, men jeg kan ikke love noe. Jeg skal gjøre mitt beste!
I can't tell the difference in sound at all :(
Hello! Nice to meet you. I am learning Norwegian by myself. I completely understand but you know? Don't worry? Languages have subtle features that non-native speakers have trouble grasping... but just see the bigger picture: You are already in the Norwegian world. Learning a language doesn't mean being perfect at speaking. Even native speakers make mistakes. Anyway, when you learn a language every bit counts and those subtle differences, I think they can be overlooked. To me both "endene" sound the same... but what the heck! Whenever I use each one, the other person will get the context with the other words of my sentence so there's no problem. Language keep on evolving and no one is the owner of any language... so let's just enjoy with a smile.. that will make a difference.
me after watching one episode of skam
Please do another video that’s longer and slower. This is so hard for me and makes a big difference in fluency. I’m a fan of your videos. Thanks.
Okay, thanks! I will try to do a new video showing more examples and speaking slower. Thank you!
Sorry but I don't hear the difference between 4:27 and 4:31. I really want to get this right since it's a difficult part of the language.
That was brand new information for me. Thanks!!! Now I will try a pay more attention to the tones!
First A and then B, right?
I was trying to understand Japanese tonals, that's why I'm here...
but it seems very hard to notice the difference in both languages 💔
Hei hvordan har alle det. Jeg lærer norsk.
This is really difficult for me, but I hope that soon I will be able to distinguish those two pitch accents in spoken Norwegian. Still though, norsk er en vakker språk! 😊
Ta-seen Islam "språk" is neutral, so it would be "et vakkert språk" Lykke til videre😊
OMG! Det ER vanskelig! Should be a Norwegian to hear it well😭 Still, thanks for the video 👍
99% of eddsworld Tord fangirls are here.
Bønder spiser bønner (Tonem 1 and then Tonem 2), right? How about in: Bonden spiser bønnen. (Are they both Tonem 2 here?)
This needs to be redone with the pairs pronounced in identical contexts. It was not done here. He was pronouncing them as a commated list with two words. In that context the first word will have a different intonation than the last word regardless of tonem! And he's confusing himself by describing the difference in the sentence intonation on the last syllable instead of the tonem difference, which is on the first syllable! Solution: Do it again, but this time read it as: «Bønder. Bønner.» (not «Bønder, bønner.»)
I think it could help if you think of Tonem 2 as having two stresses, whereas T1 is just stressed at the first syllable. We didn't learn this as pitch, we learned it as how they were stressed.
I think explaining them in the reverse order would make the difference clearer as in english you would use that exact intonation you used anyway, if you were contrasting two different words. the firdt would go up, the second would go down and the meaning would be irrellevant
Hej! Jag lär mig svenska nu men jag tänker att lär mig norska snart också. Tack för den här videon!
Når du har allerede har lært svensk er det veldig lett å lære seg norsk. Jeg regner med at du fort finner ut av forskjellene mellom språkene. Lykke til!
Jag håller med dig. Jag lärt mig norska sedan en månad men jag har slutat eftersom jag bestämmer mig att fokusera bara på svenska. Fast jag tycker att göra den snart ändå. (Jag är dålig på båda språken.)
your video quality and sound are low, also you speak too fast as if you are talking to Norwegian people, but you are meant to teach to foreigners Norwegian so it is a dislike from me and no subscribe either
To me accent 1 seems to have more emphasis on the second syllable that accent 2 does. The second syllable of accent 2 doesn't seem so prominent.
+Les Zsoldos Yes, I can't actually hear any difference between the first syllable in these pairs. The first syllable sounds like a falling tone (like tone 4 in Mandarin). The only difference I can hear is that with 1, the second syllable is mid-high and semi-stressed, whereas with 2 it's fairly low and unstressed.
thank you very much. i learned a lot. i hope to see more episodes soon. =)
That's great to hear, Shermaine. Thank you for your comment. New episodes will come soon. In fact, a new episode will hopefully be released this evening. :-)
~Peder
Now I know why norwegians always sound like they're asking questions
Tips I got from the internet for you ppl....
1:make your r's sound like the r in a cat purr
2:the o sounds like a u sortove....
Those are two tips. Cuz I can't explain things well for you despite me being Norwegian and can speak fluent engish
OH YEAH AND PITCHES MATTER TOO
I love Norwegian and I am learning by tiny bits. It is hard to understand those tonal differences. I think you should say them alone... not inside the words. Because since they differences are so subtle, our non-native ears won't "catch" them. It's challenging yet good that you make all of your videos in Norwegian but I think something important you need to work on is that you are not talking to Norwegian native speakers. There has to be a balance and I feel you haven't found it yet.
It’s impossible to say them alone. The word as a whole has one toneme
Jeg lærer meg det norske språket alene. Jeg liker å studere andre språk, men Det er vanskelig å se forskjell i tonen. Alle disse ordene du snakket, lyttet jeg til dem på samme måte. Tusen takk for hjelpen din. Excuse my poor Norwegian.
Tusen takk, Paulo. Jeg forstår at det er vanskelig å høre forskjell på de to tonelagene, men det er ikke så veldig viktig - alle forstår deg om du uttaler et ord med feil tonem. Lykke til med øvingen! Si i fra dersom det er noe du lurer på.
~Peder
Peder, I see you are enjoying what you're doing. Keep going! I see that you have some fans over here also. Hilser
Hello Agnieszka! I definitely am. Thank you. :-) New episodes will come soon. See you around! Beste hilsner, Peder. =)
I actually never thought about that before...it's very interesting! I wonder, I once heard that the difference of the two tonem is harder to dectect in the Bergen/Vestland dialects. Is that true? And do you happen to know why?
That's a great question, Bettina! I don't know a lot about that. Maybe someone else who sees this has something to share?
It's easier to detect it in Western (and Northern) dialects:
1st tone is falling (High Low: HL): rota [rù:ta] definitive form of ''ei rot''
2st tone is rising on the 1st syllable and falling on the 2nd one: (LHL): rota [rú:tà] past tense of the verb '' rote''
In Bergen:
éggène (the edges) [2nd tone, plural of ''en egg''),
èggene (the eggs) [1st tone, plural of ''et egg'')
In Nordhordland and Midhordland (outside of Bergen) both tones are neutralized tho':
rota [mi] = [eg] rota, both have the Western 1st tone: High Low, that is falling
similar thing happens in eastern Finnmark.
First Teutonic language system that I see that discuss the different tones produced by the combination of different letters in pronunciation... very good material to "train the ear" when listening to speech in Norwegian. English certainly does have tones as well but it's utterly ignored when the language is taught, specially for foreigners.
Correction: intonation, not intention (0:52)
Naah mate, I'll stick to Swedish :D I noticed absolutely no difference between vannet and vanne, svenska är mycket lättare
he dwells on the last e slightly longer in vannet (or goes up as he calls it), however, this is specific to his dialect. an alternative way to spell and say the water is vatnet ;)
Thank you for making these awesome videos. they've helped me a lot!
Tusen takk!
I see no difference whatsoever between the two prononciations and I hate it!! So frustrating.
Det skulle vara intressant om du kunde relatera norskans tonem med svenskans "melodier" som jag beskriver i denna artikel:
Kjellin O. En ny terminologi för svenskans prosodi. Tijdschr voor Skand. 2010;31(2):25-58. Available from: dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/51074116/Kjellin-2010-En-ny-terminologi.pdf
Tonembeskrivningen börjar på sidan 36.
Själva tonförloppet i min svenska är mycket snarlikt din norska. Så norskans tonem 1 motsvarar "högermelodin" i min artikel (traditionellt kallad accent 1 eller akut accent) i svenskan. Och tonem 2 motsvarar "vänstermelodin" i min artikel (traditionellt accent 2 eller grav accent). Problemet med de traditionella termerna är att de anger egenskapen för *hela ordet* och hjälper inte alls den studerande. Men min nya terminologin ger melodin stavelse för stavelse från vänster till höger i hela satsen och resulterar därmed i hela satsmelodin fram till punkt. :-)
Eftersom svenska och norska låter så lika, tror jag att du kan applicera mina regler på din norska, om än med vissa detaljjusteringar.
TBBT :) yey! thanks for your videos. very helpful!
Hi. It's great to hear that the episodes are helpful. Thank you. New episodes will come soon! =)
~Peder
So the first syllable is written with a different vowel, but it's the second syllable that changes in tone?
Det är dessa tonaccenter som gör att utlänningar tycker att vi svenskar och norskar "sjunger" när vi pratar. Interessant nog så saknas tonaccenterna helt i den svenska som talas i Finland (så kallad "finlandssvenska"). Tonaccenter i språk som inte är rena tonspråk är sällsynt, ett par slaviska språk har dessa, samt japanska och de baltiska språken (dock inte estländska, som inte är ett baltiskt språk).
Det finns en liten region i Finland med tonaccenter. Västnyländska dialekter innehåller tonaccenter
Den snakka Norge bra. Bra lære, jeg veldig forstå. Ikke viste ender og ender utale endrer sin måte , bare tenke den åpenbar fra kontekst. Vor du lære snakka så bra?
Veldig nyttig og lærerik video for meg, takk! Jeg er særlig takknemlig for at denne episoden er litt mer avansert også. Jeg tror svarene er A, og så B?
tone 1 is like an English question, tone 2 is like the end of an English statement
Det var lättast att höra skillnad på exempel 1 och 3. Är skillnaden mellan slutet av tonem 1 och 2 i exempel 1 en minor seventh? Är skillnaden en major seventh i exempel 3?
Jeg er norsk, men sitter å ser på :p (har aldri lært norsk, sånn hvorfor noe er sånn eller sånn, så det var fint å få det forklart:)
a and then b. Great video, takk!
So, is there a rule for this, or do you just have to remember by word?
4:39 bollocks! this guy has started me worrying. on the other hand, how many times will someone come up to you and say just one word ?
no, no, another tones no, I've just got through a Chinese ones....
Omg that's something really hard! :D but tbh are they really that important? I mean do you Norwgians mind if we foreigners use the wrong tone? Anyone please answer :)
+Bart Fart They notice but they typically understand which one you are trying to say based on the context of the conversation. Given the fact that is it a quite hard to separate the two as a foreigner, Norwegians won't mind.
Tusen takk for videoen! Det hjalp meg mye.
Tusen takk for videoene! De er veldig hjelpsom og interessant.Jeg synes at du sa B Bønner først, etterpå A Loven.
Hilsen fra en nybegynner!
Tusen takk for den hyggelige kommentaren, Lubov! De riktige svarene på oppgaven er A først og deretter B, men det er en vanskelig oppgave.
Lykke til videre!
har vært i norge i over 1 år, mest i nordnorge, og kan snakke nordnorsk flytende, men får ikke helt bort min svenske accent.
Hvordan er tonelaget mellom 2 dialekter i Norge? bruker alle dialektene 2 tonemer?
Morgan Jonasson Ikke Sør-Helgeland (Brønnøysund)
Show farmers some love too
eg e allerede norsk men jeg skal vise dette til vennen min :)
Bønner kan også bety prayers
cool
Oi! Dette er veldig vanskelig!
Jeg finnes at det går bedre om jeg får litt kontekst sammen med ordene. Mange snakker jo ikke så klart som deg. Dialektene kan være for vanskelige. Jeg liker videoene veldig godt, men trenger noe mellom beginners og advanced. Stå på, kanalen er svært nyttig. :)
Det skal vel være "intonation" og ikke "intention" (of two words) på den engelske tekstingen. Uansett bra forklart! Det her er ikke bare bare å demonstrere for utlendinger.
A, B, ikke sant?
Impossible
This is so difficult but really interesting as well ☺
haha im not gonna forget boner
great vid. helps a lot. thanks :>
suggestion! maybe add subs in norwegian as well? like, both visible at the same time. :D
What did you say at the end? It sounded kinda like "Hå det bra" but it must've been Norwegian, so what was it?
"Hadet bra" it's like "the good" goodbye lol
mai anh vu
Is it "ha det bra" in Norwegian?
+J.A. Brown yepp :))
B, B
my favorite food is edamame farmersss
Impressive. Continue with them videos man. I'm learning something. Tusen takk :)
Jeg er i Norge 3 månender og vil elsker og lære norsk i et år.
Correct me if am wrong 😊
Does that “ō” you drew in “bōnner” mean something?
A handwritten ō is a variant of ø. But, you’ll never see ō in print for ø.
we need more grammar lessons bro !!
Men hvor vet man hvilken tonem å brukke når man finner et ord på ordboken?
Hun and Hunden give me a hard time differentiating between
The difference is that "Hun" is a pronoun and "Hund" is a proper noun. By context you should usually recognize them.
A og B! Tusen takk for å ha laget denne videoen! :D
Tusen Takk for the Norwegian lesson!!
Cant say any difference:/
seems like a nice guy :)
Takk t
AB?
Yes, that's correct! Good work!
you're a handsome man
1:02 gosh, this is so fast...
veldig bra! tusen takk! more information for me.