I'm a great grandmother and have been playing tabletop pen-and-paper RPG since they were invented. In fact, I still have the original gray D&D books, Eldritch Wizardry, World of Gray Hawk, etc. I love new players. When playing, focus on the story with a Narrativist approach. Everyone knows how to make a story and they get "into it" very quickly. Avoid excessive "crunch." In fact, I often just play using 3D6 (as there is a curve in probability). - Plus 3d6 is easily found in other games or around most houses....Yatzee? - - This is with brand new players obviously. The best games with new players and vampires is to play a group that just woke up after being turned. They are hungry. They are at a huge party with expansive grounds, and it is midnight - I typically have them play - - themselves as characters. - - The huge party is a large home. I often use a clip from a movie, like "Interview with the Vampire" where Brad Pitt eats the poodles of one of the party guests. If the game is instead modern, use a modern movie. Basically, a large home, with large grounds. The characters are in the wine cellar and wake up. They are a group of friends, know each other and, again, they wake up hungry. I give the players Rank 2 Obfuscate, Rank 3 Auspex, Rank 1 Fortitude, Rank 3 Potence. This allows the characters a certain degree of auto-stealth, and a way to "see" evil people via auras (not exactly in the rules, but its helpful for new characters who don't want to feed on, and possibly kill an innocent person.) They also have night vision as the place is dark, but they can see in the dark. The above makes the characters similar so that everyone can learn their powers as "new vampires." They are tough enough that they can overpower victims and feed. I typically have one or two of the characters shot with firearms at some point. They are either not harmed, or not harmed very much. They feed and heal instantly. I never play "frenzy" though it can be sprinkled in to force the characters to feed, building narrative tension. "You are more hungry than you have ever been and all you can think of is drinking blood." (Push, push, rinse and repeat). I also usually use "the vail" from Werewolf, or similar phenomena out of Mage - basically victims/witnesses forget about the weird things, rationalizing a "Men in Black" De-Neuralizer effect. These games are super fun, can be started anywhere, do not require character sheets as the players are playing themselves and don't know what powers they have. The explore being a new vampire as a group. I have turned these into campaigns that run for months or longer. For some, later, they make new characters or we start a real VtM campaign with character sheets and so on. These games can also be used at the drop of a hat with any group, from (older) teenagers to adults, and you can immediately get into roleplaying and storytelling without confusing anyone. It is VERY immersive and instantly engaging. The same "system" or approach can be used for any genre, any game system/world. I have used it to run Sci-fi adventures on a space station, Wild West, but it works best for World of Darkness for obvious reasons. Most people know vampires and the above powers make them very physical and the powers are easy to understand. Have fun ! ! 🙂 .
Wow, this is a super helpful post!. It encourages me! I want to introduce my two childs to RPG (10 and 9 years old). Of course i'll not introduce to Vampire RPG yet (they already know the "brand" because they played a board game of it). But i'm planning to introduce to D&D. Reading the books and memorizing the rules is daunting, but i'm into it!.
You don’t have to memorize everything just get the general rules down well and then you can do just fine. These are not board games in that you can bend and change the rules as needed to ensure everyone has a great time! Hopefully that helps make it feel less daunting! Don’t be afraid to try it out. I’m sure your players will love it!
You don't need to memorize all the rules,@@LordJorMagi. Of course, there is nothing bad in doing so, if it pleases you particularly, but I am sure most great narrators I know have not done that. With Dungeons & Dragons there is some appeal it going deep in the rules, it is part of the fun. However, with Vampire the Masquerade (at least up to the last book I saw) the best things about the mechanic is that it is simple to grasp in the level you need to get things going. The combat system is really NOT where the World of Darkness shines, so to speak. It was never good. Mostly, people ignored the books and invented their solutions following the basic logic of difficulty as circumstances appeared. I suppose that's the main reason why some of the concerns about subjects "heavy" for certain publics sound silly overthinking to me. The players seldom want to start by reading the books, ergo: make zero difference what the books say. The narrator will present a story, and you will certainly NOT put in your story, to your children, anything that will make them traumatized for life. Waking up screaming in the middle of night with nightmares. (if nothing else because if you do, you are presumably the one who will have to wake in the middle of night to comfort them) No! You will present the themes of the setting in a context and tone designed to be fun, and interesting, for your players (who happen to be your children). Include anything you think will interest them. Leave out any stuff that you think is "a bit too much" for their ages and personalities.Your "loyalty" so to speak is NOT to the books, or setting, or White Wolf, etc. It is to the players. The contract is "for the sake of fun" no holly cow beyond that. And it has always been a contract between narrator/game-master in one side and players in the other. The books of rules are just a tool, and never intended to be more than that (I think). I digress now. Thank you for your patience! Good luck with your adventures in the World of Darkness.
@@LordJorMagithat's great that you're introducing the childs to RPGs! Might I recommend GURPS? It looks daunting when you see all the books, but they do have a GURPS lite available for free as a pdf. The rules are basically to roll 3d6 under your target number. 3-4 are critical successes, 18 is always a fail. Plus the variety of splat books makes it a huge win for idea harvesting.
I’ve never played table top games, but I’ve been playing some Vampire videogames and am enthralled in the lore. It’s fascinating to hear you discuss organizing a Vampire game. Amazing how imagination and interaction can “create” a game between people. I might take it up! Thanks so much!
In my experience it's significantly easier than Revised or V20. They've simplified a lot of the crunch a reasonable amount, but not so much that it put me off as a veteran player.
I've been lead to believe that V20 had all kinds of crunch to it, and having read and played a little V5, there wasn't that much crunch to it. But everyone's mileage may vary there.
Okay, I'm an active Storyteller that runs a V5 cronicle, about three years in the making. My players were complete noobs when we started out. So, here are my thoughts: 1) I don't like the offical D10s. They are overpriced and last time I checked they were low quality and only came in one design. As a new player, get yourself some normal D10. Interpreting the numbers is no harder to learn than interpreting the symbols, especially for a new player that has to learn one or the other method anyways. Practically infinite diversity to pick from. 2) My number one tip is: A new player should make a fledgeling vampire. This way they don't need to know anything about Cain or the Antedeluvians. If you like, you can bring it up later, organically. The same thing holds true for clans: If none of your players is a tremere, there is no reason to know about their backstory upfront. If all players belong to the camarilla, no need to know up front about tzimisce or ravnos. But, like you, I give my players usually only an overview of the "core"-clans. 3) Yeah, you've said it yourself. No need to know any of the signature characters. 4) I also enjoy the V5 dice system. It's a bit on the complicated side, but it's very versatile for it's complexity.
Awesome! Let me know if there are any other subjects I could cover to help! I am looking at focusing more on VtM with our vids so I’m open for any requests! 😁
Awesome! This vid was one of my most popular so I will be covering V5 more in the coming months! Let me know if you have any questions! I’m always happy to give out my two cents! 😆
afaik, caines first childer (2nd generation) where devoured by their own progeny (3rd generation). upon discovery of this caine put a curse on all of them and these 13 are the core of the bloodlines to the 13 clans. going down the generations to 13th and eventually 14-16(thin blooded vampires). "cainites" is what the sabbat refer themselves to in refference to their devotion to caine as the dark father. "noddist" is also a common term used mainly by sabbat on the path of caine. most other vampires refer to themselves as "kindred" or "licks" if you want to be vulgar. as far as antediluvians go.. if you look at the feeding chart in the core book, it is hard to imagine how these could even keep themselves out of torpor, considering how strict the feeding rules get with increased blood potency. should one manage to awaken, imagine their hunger.. thats what gehenna is all about.
Its taken me years to get a group together and attain the influence of a GM. Im starting my first chronicle with the lads tonight. V5. But some imports from V20. You cant take Dementation away from me lol.
Oh my, aren't I late to the party? I run an old school VtM game for oh too many years now. But my tips may be helpful, too. A newbie to VtM and/or rpgs in gereral would start out as one of my regular players new child. If I don't have a player of the clan the new player wants, the fledgling gets a vampire godparent. Ingame: The Prince insists in the spirit of the masquerade that newly acquired childer are supervised and properly educated in the traditions and etiquette. (I run a old city in Europe with the potential of very old elders who might show up to any gathering, or not at all.) Not every clan is possible for (new) players. I had for example some extremely bad experiences with Malkavian players so I don't want them as PCs at my table. Ingame: The Prince is Malkavian and doesn't tolerate other Malkavians besides her. There are two exceptions. One is a elder who currently is an torpor and stored in a vault. The other is an about twelve year old looking choir boy who haunts an old monastery and graveyard, accompanied by his gargoyle friend. They will probably kill every strange vampire setting foot in their domain. So don't go there. 😅 After the first few game nights, urban exploring is encouraged. Go and no go zones will be explained. Or we do something fun like attending the Nosferatu Ball we are invited too under the city. Imagine candle lit tunnels deep under the city full of Nosferatu dressed in fancy rococo attire. (As stated above, my city is very old some of the elders are... something.) Burns probably down to, we get into the dark stuff slowly.
Okay I shall be honest, I dislike people that say "It has too much crunch." Whats wrong with crunch?? Crunch is why some people play TTRPGs, crunch, rules and rolling is part of the hobby. 5e is already dumbed down a lot compared to other WoD or CoD books.
This is very subjective for sure and depends on the player group. But when you have too much crunch you will know it. Your combats become mathematic and/or repetitive slog fests that players dread instead of look forward to. All of the extra rules/feats/abilities/powers start to constrain them instead of making them feel powerful.
That is very common! Hope this helps some and if you have any questions about VtM or D&D the Tyrants are always here to help! Just ask us in the comments! 😁
I kind of like the hunger dice thing. However, they ruined a lot of uniqueness you could develop on a character with the disciplines. In previous editions they was individual and robust abilities. For gaming purposes they streamed lined it and watered them down and blood potency is interesting however, weakens alot of the characters. Story line in werewolf and mage and vampire I don’t think it should have progressed the way they have.
I agree they did heavily mute a lot of the disciplines. BUT as I do in my games just un-mute them by using the old book versions (or if you are ADD obsessively creative like some you rewrite the whole v5 core disciplines to be your version!?) 😆 RPG police won’t show up to stop you. Just ask your players after a session or two how they like their abilities and tweak as needed!
I've heard a lot of good things about V20 and all the customization in it that got stripped out in V5. How would you recommend a new storyteller learns the system and how would you teach it to a group of new players?
Always keep it simple starting out. I recommend only using what I consider “the original 7 clans” for players to choose from for their first game: Brujah, Gangrel, Malkavian, Nosferatu, Tremere, Toreador, Ventrue. (Maybe also Giovanni cause they have a soft spot in my heart)😆 The V5 dice system is really great for both social and combat so I really recommend V5 having played them all over the years. To prepare yourself you need to get used to reading the dice rolls. Run a combat playing as one or two PCs yourself and use this dice roller cftarbay.github.io/VTM-V5-Dice-Roller/ To prepare the players you can do that during character creation and at the start of play. Give them easy/quick social and combat encounters that let them get used to how the system works early on. This really depends on your group but I always recommend diving into the “dark struggle” of the person they were and the monster they will slowly become. This part of the game is what sets VtM apart from a D&D style adventure so lean into that and try to get that struggle in front of your players as much as possible. You can do this by being very descriptive when they are resisting their need to feed and when they lose control. Tell them their victims names. Have those they end up ending beg for their lives. They may win the battle against the first light agents but it’s possible they could feel really bad about the humans that were devastated as their friends were killed. Hope that helps!? 😆 let me know what other questions you have or that come up and I’m sure we can help out! I’m gonna focus on VtM with my next vids (coming soon!)
@@BottomTableTyrants Thanks for the help! I've watched a ton of lore videos on VtM and have played the crpg a couple of times. WoD is probably my favorite fictional universe other than maybe Fear & Hunger, so if I can actually convince some people to play with me that'd be great. Have you ever played Mage or Wraith and if so do you have any plans to make videos about them. I've heard a lot of things about them but I've never actually seen anyone play them.
@@asturias0267 yes I love Wraith and I run a D&D home brew version that I call “Chains of Limbo” where I kill the PCs in the first five minutes and they play the rest of the session being ghosts working to get vengeance on the one who betrayed them and caused their death (or find peace with their passing and move on.) I will cover it soon!
One tip that I would give storytellers is to focus on vampires as parasitical to power. See where the power lies in a city, whether that's economical, cultural or political, and see what vampires would thrive in that.
I have to admit Vampire storylines always scare me away from running the game. Is there a good source to help new storytellers to grasp what makes a good vampire story? I think because they are so powerful and alien to me… I just can’t sit and design a story
Alien is a great way to describe how VtM can feel to new players. They are playing as people who are having to come to grips with the fact that they are now monsters…and they can only become more monstrous. Unfortunately, I don’t have anywhere I can direct you for ideas BUT what I will say is here is my advice and my promise. Advice: find what fascinates you in vampire and explore that with your players. For me the clans and Camarilla vs Anarch fights for supremacy in a city are my favorite so that is where my ideas for stories spark from. Promise: I will make some vids that have some “adventure ideas” to explore different ideas covered by VtM.
Maybe I'm a little blind, but I didn't end up seeing the card of the magic that you use for the tremere. It sounds very interesting and I would definitely like to check it out.
If you're a new Storyteller looking for advice, I'd take some of this with a huge grain of salt. BTT is running Vampire much more like D&D then the rules as written and has modified the game to fit that tone. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that but most vampire games might have 1 optional quick combat per session with the majority being politics, investigation and roleplaying. There's nothing inherently wrong with the combat, social scene, combat flow of play though and if that's how you want to play go for it.
Turns out people like D&D (like kind of a lot) so if making it kind of like that gets new players to try out VtM then you are doing it right. Then once they have seen that other games that aren’t D&D can be fun you can show them the other more social spells they could try out.
@@burtward8082 I had no intention of gatekeeping and apologies if that's how these comments were taken! I love that this video exists to show players how to hack the game for this specific playstyle. It's good for the hobby and, as BTT pointed out above, a good way to introduce players to games outside of DnD. I only wanted to make it clear to potential storytellers that these modifications are necessary to run the game with this action focus. Nothing is worse than introducing your players to a new game you're really excited about only to watch a party of a Tremere, Ravnos and Ventrue get absolutely melted in their first encounter, which will happen if you just pick up the game and run it like DnD.
Why do so many people want to play a game so specific? What is it about vampires that makes them interesting? More importantly, why would anyone want to willingly subject themselves to something that's "supposed to be unpleasant"?
It’s partly that it’s not an “adventurer” like in D&D. Also it is partly that you are playing a monster. The players are constantly battling their monster half that wants to give in to the hunger and violence. To many that is a fun balance to try to maintain. (And I’m sure there are other reasons that others have that I’m not thinking of!)
To be fair, I didn't enjoy D&D either (it has way too many mechanics that do not relate to what the game promises to be). And while "it isn't for me" is a common answer, I find this type of answer irritating. @@BottomTableTyrants
For the (mostly) uninitiated, what is V20? I'm aware of Masquerade ("original" World of Darkness) and Requiem ("new" World of Darkness)...which is the only one I've actually played a bit in years ago. I know enough that the new-new-WoD is V5 (back to Masquerade), but where versions 3 and 4 are, I don't know, nor what a version 20 would be.
@@scandalousdeity V5 is so called because it's 5th Edition, V20 (20th Anniversary Edition) is this V4, Revised is V3, and then there's Second Edition (aka Vampire meets Call of Cthulhu because Reasons) and First Edition. Requiem is not the same universe as Masquerade. V20 is largely regarded as the most cleaned up and comprehensive version, hence my recommendation.
I am really lost on a complaint on tremere you had. I can't tell 100% if you have a problem with there discipline of blood sorcery (or thaumaturgy if you want to be accurate) or the rituals. Because you talked about how you don't like how specific tremeres are about magic. But I cant tell if you are talking about the powers or rituals .... but you talk about rituals being fine so you where talking about the powers. But .... I dont know, you did not make that clear at all. But with that out of the way, I am going to guess you where saying you dont like the "discipline powers" of blood sorcery. Well the book even explains that the powers are a lot weaker than the rituals because the rituals are usually very powerful, and if you have a "think out side the box" player play tremere they will break your game sometimes. Now are the homebrew things you give tremere for "Discipline powers" or rituals? Because a power can be used in one action per turn, and rituals will always take time "5 X the level of the ritual" in mins to cast. Do you 100%, but the ideas explained sound like you would like to play v20 tremere. V20 tremere play more with paths (just powers that can branch to "schools of magic" for a simplification) instead of rituals. I also heard a bit that you keep saying Geovanni, but in V5, the geovanni are now mixed with the other lower bloodlines of necromancers and now go by "Hecata" clan. You can find how to play hecata and how players play hecata in the "Cult of The Blood Gods" book. Unless you just ignore the hecata lore, you do you.
Hey Austin! Yes I mean their discipline power “Magic” is boring and does not so amazing stuff like “make a vamp hungry.” (Which turns out is not very useful against a werewolf, or human, or ghost, or any of the other myriad denizens of my World of Darkness.) Their many boring powers are to me not worth it. Every group is different but mine is very combat oriented so having Tremere magic that isn’t useful in combat left my Tremere players feeling left out. So I made changes! TTRPGs are not a board game (thankfully) so you can add or takeaway any thing you wish to make it better for your players. Finally, yes I know Giovanni are now integrated into the Hecata but (in my opinion) the the Giovanni fit my American story best. I love the idea of mafia vamps that play all sides so because I’m the GM and write the adventure outlines they show up in most of my stories! 😁
@@BottomTableTyrants I definitely got that from your video. I know V5 as written is not really a combat oriented game and, unlike DnD, is not balanced for every Clan to be equally viable in a fight. It's written to be more of a political game, where being able to mess with another kindreds hunger or know in depth information from a single drop of blood is a big deal. I do appreciate that you've been able to hack the game and Tremere specifically to work with your group though! I would however warn any players looking for the personal and political horror that the game advertises to take the advice to swap out the Tremere spells with a grain of salt.
Noted! 😁 agree that my group is more “swashbuckling adventure” oriented so yes the spell swapping worked for them but I think a lot of groups would likely be very similar especially if you are coaxing them to VtM from the main game they are likely to have played first/most (D&D). It’s hard to get folks to play games that aren’t D&D (trust me it’s pretty much what I do as a past time!?) so anything that helps ease that transition is a win for getting them to not just jump back to D&D
@@BottomTableTyrants Blood Sorcery might not be useful in physical combat, but holy damn the ability to assign enemies hunger dice in social/mental combat is huge. Dominate can carry its weight there anyways and is useful in both, unlike Banu Haqim which are better in physical combat but don't have a trump card in mental.
@@DracoSuave that makes sense of course so it seems that I must put a lot more combat in my games (about 50% social and 50% combat is what I strive for) so my spellcasting vamp players felt left out for half of my sessions. Which led me to create the more combat oriented spells for them to use. I was raised on Shadowrun 2e so going mostly social is pretty tough for me to do BUT every GM has to build their games to fit their players. They are the reason we do this! 😁
@@Razamaniac out of curiosity did you like the older system(s) and books of lore more? And if yes what/why did you find to be better? I’m genuinely curious! I do think SOME of the old Sabbat lore was better than what has come out for V5. But it seems now that Renegade is in charge of creating V5 content they are finally making really good stuff regularly! (In my opinion of course) 😁
@@BottomTableTyrants The old books had their good and bad moments but the lore was also huge, with the back up of decades of supplements, that the new version cannot compete, and I don't think it will ever manage to compete. The action system of the old was better and more interactive, while the new one is more of a means to say a story rather than actual action. Maybe that fits vampire but then you exclude detailed interactive action from the game this way. Hunger system looks interesting but it works by chance rather than being a Stat that the player knows that it will go down when they use it. I mean waking up and not being hungry is possible, but if that happens every night by sheer luck of the Hunger Checks, it might hit bad on the progress of a story. There are many other things that look unstable in the new system, like perception, movement, this whole new willpower system, the decreased wound penalty system, which also gave great flavour to the old game. I mean adding willpower damage to the system , rather than the old classical willpower expediture may give a second skin to the game, but on the other hand it doesn't work very well when you have the same stat for Roleplaying health levels + power activation + roll enhancement with the only punisment a -2 dice penalty while in the old game you litteraly became catatonic with no further energy to keep going which made players to grit their teeth and using their last willpower in a last great heroic endeavor. I mean willpower worked fine as an optional wellspring of second chancing as it was. In general, I find the new game more Role Play heavy which is not a bad thing but at the same time less interactive which creates a huge emotional gap and lack of heart pounding. That for Vampire which didn't change much as a game, its more of the system interaction and lore that impacted the game the most. (E.G. Malkavian, Lasombra etc etc) For Werewolf is even worse 😆, the transfer from 20th to 5th was smoother for vampire, which still feels somewhat disconecting but still it has some merits, but for werewolf it went a lot worse 😝
Basicaly: You do you, but that mature warning in VTM rulebook is there for a reason.
I'm a great grandmother and have been playing tabletop pen-and-paper RPG since they were invented. In fact, I still have the original gray D&D books, Eldritch Wizardry, World of Gray Hawk, etc. I love new players. When playing, focus on the story with a Narrativist approach. Everyone knows how to make a story and they get "into it" very quickly. Avoid excessive "crunch." In fact, I often just play using 3D6 (as there is a curve in probability). - Plus 3d6 is easily found in other games or around most houses....Yatzee? - -
This is with brand new players obviously. The best games with new players and vampires is to play a group that just woke up after being turned. They are hungry. They are at a huge party with expansive grounds, and it is midnight - I typically have them play - - themselves as characters. - -
The huge party is a large home. I often use a clip from a movie, like "Interview with the Vampire" where Brad Pitt eats the poodles of one of the party guests. If the game is instead modern, use a modern movie. Basically, a large home, with large grounds.
The characters are in the wine cellar and wake up. They are a group of friends, know each other and, again, they wake up hungry.
I give the players Rank 2 Obfuscate, Rank 3 Auspex, Rank 1 Fortitude, Rank 3 Potence. This allows the characters a certain degree of auto-stealth, and a way to "see" evil people via auras (not exactly in the rules, but its helpful for new characters who don't want to feed on, and possibly kill an innocent person.) They also have night vision as the place is dark, but they can see in the dark.
The above makes the characters similar so that everyone can learn their powers as "new vampires." They are tough enough that they can overpower victims and feed. I typically have one or two of the characters shot with firearms at some point. They are either not harmed, or not harmed very much. They feed and heal instantly. I never play "frenzy" though it can be sprinkled in to force the characters to feed, building narrative tension. "You are more hungry than you have ever been and all you can think of is drinking blood." (Push, push, rinse and repeat).
I also usually use "the vail" from Werewolf, or similar phenomena out of Mage - basically victims/witnesses forget about the weird things, rationalizing a "Men in Black" De-Neuralizer effect.
These games are super fun, can be started anywhere, do not require character sheets as the players are playing themselves and don't know what powers they have. The explore being a new vampire as a group. I have turned these into campaigns that run for months or longer. For some, later, they make new characters or we start a real VtM campaign with character sheets and so on.
These games can also be used at the drop of a hat with any group, from (older) teenagers to adults, and you can immediately get into roleplaying and storytelling without confusing anyone. It is VERY immersive and instantly engaging.
The same "system" or approach can be used for any genre, any game system/world. I have used it to run Sci-fi adventures on a space station, Wild West, but it works best for World of Darkness for obvious reasons. Most people know vampires and the above powers make them very physical and the powers are easy to understand. Have fun ! ! 🙂
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Wow, this is a super helpful post!. It encourages me! I want to introduce my two childs to RPG (10 and 9 years old). Of course i'll not introduce to Vampire RPG yet (they already know the "brand" because they played a board game of it). But i'm planning to introduce to D&D.
Reading the books and memorizing the rules is daunting, but i'm into it!.
You don’t have to memorize everything just get the general rules down well and then you can do just fine. These are not board games in that you can bend and change the rules as needed to ensure everyone has a great time! Hopefully that helps make it feel less daunting! Don’t be afraid to try it out. I’m sure your players will love it!
You don't need to memorize all the rules,@@LordJorMagi. Of course, there is nothing bad in doing so, if it pleases you particularly, but I am sure most great narrators I know have not done that. With Dungeons & Dragons there is some appeal it going deep in the rules, it is part of the fun. However, with Vampire the Masquerade (at least up to the last book I saw) the best things about the mechanic is that it is simple to grasp in the level you need to get things going.
The combat system is really NOT where the World of Darkness shines, so to speak. It was never good. Mostly, people ignored the books and invented their solutions following the basic logic of difficulty as circumstances appeared.
I suppose that's the main reason why some of the concerns about subjects "heavy" for certain publics sound silly overthinking to me. The players seldom want to start by reading the books, ergo: make zero difference what the books say. The narrator will present a story, and you will certainly NOT put in your story, to your children, anything that will make them traumatized for life. Waking up screaming in the middle of night with nightmares. (if nothing else because if you do, you are presumably the one who will have to wake in the middle of night to comfort them)
No! You will present the themes of the setting in a context and tone designed to be fun, and interesting, for your players (who happen to be your children). Include anything you think will interest them. Leave out any stuff that you think is "a bit too much" for their ages and personalities.Your "loyalty" so to speak is NOT to the books, or setting, or White Wolf, etc. It is to the players.
The contract is "for the sake of fun" no holly cow beyond that. And it has always been a contract between narrator/game-master in one side and players in the other. The books of rules are just a tool, and never intended to be more than that (I think).
I digress now. Thank you for your patience! Good luck with your adventures in the World of Darkness.
@@LordJorMagithat's great that you're introducing the childs to RPGs! Might I recommend GURPS? It looks daunting when you see all the books, but they do have a GURPS lite available for free as a pdf. The rules are basically to roll 3d6 under your target number. 3-4 are critical successes, 18 is always a fail. Plus the variety of splat books makes it a huge win for idea harvesting.
I’ve never played table top games, but I’ve been playing some Vampire videogames and am enthralled in the lore. It’s fascinating to hear you discuss organizing a Vampire game. Amazing how imagination and interaction can “create” a game between people. I might take it up! Thanks so much!
In my experience it's significantly easier than Revised or V20. They've simplified a lot of the crunch a reasonable amount, but not so much that it put me off as a veteran player.
I agree. And having run games for 25 years I learned the HARD way that less crunch is better.
I've been lead to believe that V20 had all kinds of crunch to it, and having read and played a little V5, there wasn't that much crunch to it. But everyone's mileage may vary there.
Okay, I'm an active Storyteller that runs a V5 cronicle, about three years in the making. My players were complete noobs when we started out. So, here are my thoughts:
1) I don't like the offical D10s. They are overpriced and last time I checked they were low quality and only came in one design. As a new player, get yourself some normal D10. Interpreting the numbers is no harder to learn than interpreting the symbols, especially for a new player that has to learn one or the other method anyways. Practically infinite diversity to pick from.
2) My number one tip is: A new player should make a fledgeling vampire. This way they don't need to know anything about Cain or the Antedeluvians. If you like, you can bring it up later, organically. The same thing holds true for clans: If none of your players is a tremere, there is no reason to know about their backstory upfront. If all players belong to the camarilla, no need to know up front about tzimisce or ravnos. But, like you, I give my players usually only an overview of the "core"-clans.
3) Yeah, you've said it yourself. No need to know any of the signature characters.
4) I also enjoy the V5 dice system. It's a bit on the complicated side, but it's very versatile for it's complexity.
Just started playing recently, and your videos have been hugely informative and helpful. Thank you!
Awesome! Please let us know if you ever have any topics you want us to cover! 😁
this is the only video i’ve seen on this topic, it’s very interesting!!
Thanks McLazer! More to come!
Thank you so much for this great piece of advise and wisdom sharing! +45 minutes of Vampire DMing Tips!
Awesome! More Masquerades content coming soon! 😁
So happy to see this. Ive played VtM before but im about to run my own game...gonna need all this advice
Awesome! Let me know if there are any other subjects I could cover to help! I am looking at focusing more on VtM with our vids so I’m open for any requests! 😁
Thanks! This helped me a lot. I appreciate the straightforward advice you give. As someone new to the system, it was a great video to watch.
Awesome! This vid was one of my most popular so I will be covering V5 more in the coming months! Let me know if you have any questions! I’m always happy to give out my two cents! 😆
afaik, caines first childer (2nd generation) where devoured by their own progeny (3rd generation). upon discovery of this caine put a curse on all of them and these 13 are the core of the bloodlines to the 13 clans. going down the generations to 13th and eventually 14-16(thin blooded vampires). "cainites" is what the sabbat refer themselves to in refference to their devotion to caine as the dark father. "noddist" is also a common term used mainly by sabbat on the path of caine. most other vampires refer to themselves as "kindred" or "licks" if you want to be vulgar. as far as antediluvians go.. if you look at the feeding chart in the core book, it is hard to imagine how these could even keep themselves out of torpor, considering how strict the feeding rules get with increased blood potency. should one manage to awaken, imagine their hunger.. thats what gehenna is all about.
Its taken me years to get a group together and attain the influence of a GM. Im starting my first chronicle with the lads tonight. V5. But some imports from V20. You cant take Dementation away from me lol.
Oh my, aren't I late to the party?
I run an old school VtM game for oh too many years now.
But my tips may be helpful, too.
A newbie to VtM and/or rpgs in gereral would start out as one of my regular players new child.
If I don't have a player of the clan the new player wants, the fledgling gets a vampire godparent.
Ingame: The Prince insists in the spirit of the masquerade that newly acquired childer are supervised and properly educated in the traditions and etiquette. (I run a old city in Europe with the potential of very old elders who might show up to any gathering, or not at all.)
Not every clan is possible for (new) players. I had for example some extremely bad experiences with Malkavian players so I don't want them as PCs at my table.
Ingame: The Prince is Malkavian and doesn't tolerate other Malkavians besides her. There are two exceptions. One is a elder who currently is an torpor and stored in a vault. The other is an about twelve year old looking choir boy who haunts an old monastery and graveyard, accompanied by his gargoyle friend. They will probably kill every strange vampire setting foot in their domain. So don't go there. 😅
After the first few game nights, urban exploring is encouraged. Go and no go zones will be explained.
Or we do something fun like attending the Nosferatu Ball we are invited too under the city. Imagine candle lit tunnels deep under the city full of Nosferatu dressed in fancy rococo attire. (As stated above, my city is very old some of the elders are... something.)
Burns probably down to, we get into the dark stuff slowly.
super informative!!
Thank you! Please let me know if there are any Vampire (or other TTRPG) subjects you would like covered! 😁
Okay I shall be honest, I dislike people that say "It has too much crunch." Whats wrong with crunch?? Crunch is why some people play TTRPGs, crunch, rules and rolling is part of the hobby. 5e is already dumbed down a lot compared to other WoD or CoD books.
This is very subjective for sure and depends on the player group. But when you have too much crunch you will know it. Your combats become mathematic and/or repetitive slog fests that players dread instead of look forward to. All of the extra rules/feats/abilities/powers start to constrain them instead of making them feel powerful.
I’ve actually wanted to but there so much to get into for a new player and in general new to dnd style games i feel like it’s pretty big to jump into
That is very common! Hope this helps some and if you have any questions about VtM or D&D the Tyrants are always here to help! Just ask us in the comments! 😁
I kind of like the hunger dice thing. However, they ruined a lot of uniqueness you could develop on a character with the disciplines. In previous editions they was individual and robust abilities. For gaming purposes they streamed lined it and watered them down and blood potency is interesting however, weakens alot of the characters. Story line in werewolf and mage and vampire I don’t think it should have progressed the way they have.
I agree they did heavily mute a lot of the disciplines. BUT as I do in my games just un-mute them by using the old book versions (or if you are ADD obsessively creative like some you rewrite the whole v5 core disciplines to be your version!?) 😆
RPG police won’t show up to stop you. Just ask your players after a session or two how they like their abilities and tweak as needed!
Where on earth did you get that pic of the Voerman Twins at 18:25? That's fantastic.
Ha! I’m sorry but don’t remember. I bet it was a google search for Malkavian art most likely 😁
I've heard a lot of good things about V20 and all the customization in it that got stripped out in V5. How would you recommend a new storyteller learns the system and how would you teach it to a group of new players?
Always keep it simple starting out. I recommend only using what I consider “the original 7 clans” for players to choose from for their first game: Brujah, Gangrel, Malkavian, Nosferatu, Tremere, Toreador, Ventrue. (Maybe also Giovanni cause they have a soft spot in my heart)😆 The V5 dice system is really great for both social and combat so I really recommend V5 having played them all over the years.
To prepare yourself you need to get used to reading the dice rolls. Run a combat playing as one or two PCs yourself and use this dice roller
cftarbay.github.io/VTM-V5-Dice-Roller/
To prepare the players you can do that during character creation and at the start of play. Give them easy/quick social and combat encounters that let them get used to how the system works early on.
This really depends on your group but I always recommend diving into the “dark struggle” of the person they were and the monster they will slowly become. This part of the game is what sets VtM apart from a D&D style adventure so lean into that and try to get that struggle in front of your players as much as possible. You can do this by being very descriptive when they are resisting their need to feed and when they lose control. Tell them their victims names. Have those they end up ending beg for their lives. They may win the battle against the first light agents but it’s possible they could feel really bad about the humans that were devastated as their friends were killed.
Hope that helps!? 😆 let me know what other questions you have or that come up and I’m sure we can help out! I’m gonna focus on VtM with my next vids (coming soon!)
@@BottomTableTyrants Thanks for the help! I've watched a ton of lore videos on VtM and have played the crpg a couple of times. WoD is probably my favorite fictional universe other than maybe Fear & Hunger, so if I can actually convince some people to play with me that'd be great. Have you ever played Mage or Wraith and if so do you have any plans to make videos about them. I've heard a lot of things about them but I've never actually seen anyone play them.
@@asturias0267 yes I love Wraith and I run a D&D home brew version that I call “Chains of Limbo” where I kill the PCs in the first five minutes and they play the rest of the session being ghosts working to get vengeance on the one who betrayed them and caused their death (or find peace with their passing and move on.) I will cover it soon!
Awesome!
One tip that I would give storytellers is to focus on vampires as parasitical to power. See where the power lies in a city, whether that's economical, cultural or political, and see what vampires would thrive in that.
I have to admit Vampire storylines always scare me away from running the game. Is there a good source to help new storytellers to grasp what makes a good vampire story? I think because they are so powerful and alien to me… I just can’t sit and design a story
Alien is a great way to describe how VtM can feel to new players. They are playing as people who are having to come to grips with the fact that they are now monsters…and they can only become more monstrous.
Unfortunately, I don’t have anywhere I can direct you for ideas BUT what I will say is here is my advice and my promise.
Advice: find what fascinates you in vampire and explore that with your players. For me the clans and Camarilla vs Anarch fights for supremacy in a city are my favorite so that is where my ideas for stories spark from.
Promise: I will make some vids that have some “adventure ideas” to explore different ideas covered by VtM.
@@BottomTableTyrants Thank You, I will… and I will eagerly await the campaign hook videos.
I love Mr. Shark
He is a player favorite! Running Spire right now and one of my regular players was sad that he had not made an appearance. 😆
@@BottomTableTyrants The Mr. Sharkverse could extend to Spire I'm sure! Thank you for this incredibly helpful and insightful video
Maybe I'm a little blind, but I didn't end up seeing the card of the magic that you use for the tremere. It sounds very interesting and I would definitely like to check it out.
Yeah! I will post a pic of them on our Instagram (please be sure to follow us! 😁)
Post is up if you wanna check it out!
@Bottom_Table_Tyrants on Instagram!
@@BottomTableTyrants just followed, Thanks!
Can you upload the clan chart please
You can see the doc I edited here:
docs.google.com/document/d/19JRI0IjZlgoeb7Oi1xbmFpzy-_XFcoNQRgkknrhvK6E
If you're a new Storyteller looking for advice, I'd take some of this with a huge grain of salt. BTT is running Vampire much more like D&D then the rules as written and has modified the game to fit that tone. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that but most vampire games might have 1 optional quick combat per session with the majority being politics, investigation and roleplaying. There's nothing inherently wrong with the combat, social scene, combat flow of play though and if that's how you want to play go for it.
Turns out people like D&D (like kind of a lot) so if making it kind of like that gets new players to try out VtM then you are doing it right. Then once they have seen that other games that aren’t D&D can be fun you can show them the other more social spells they could try out.
Why bother commenting and gatekeeping if, like you say twice, there is nothing wrong with it? That’s lame.
@@burtward8082 I had no intention of gatekeeping and apologies if that's how these comments were taken! I love that this video exists to show players how to hack the game for this specific playstyle. It's good for the hobby and, as BTT pointed out above, a good way to introduce players to games outside of DnD.
I only wanted to make it clear to potential storytellers that these modifications are necessary to run the game with this action focus. Nothing is worse than introducing your players to a new game you're really excited about only to watch a party of a Tremere, Ravnos and Ventrue get absolutely melted in their first encounter, which will happen if you just pick up the game and run it like DnD.
awesome cool video
Why do so many people want to play a game so specific?
What is it about vampires that makes them interesting?
More importantly, why would anyone want to willingly subject themselves to something that's "supposed to be unpleasant"?
It’s partly that it’s not an “adventurer” like in D&D. Also it is partly that you are playing a monster. The players are constantly battling their monster half that wants to give in to the hunger and violence. To many that is a fun balance to try to maintain.
(And I’m sure there are other reasons that others have that I’m not thinking of!)
To be fair, I didn't enjoy D&D either (it has way too many mechanics that do not relate to what the game promises to be). And while "it isn't for me" is a common answer, I find this type of answer irritating. @@BottomTableTyrants
PROTIP: Get into V20 instead
Or you can just run it how you want. It’s your story. Tell it how you want.
For the (mostly) uninitiated, what is V20? I'm aware of Masquerade ("original" World of Darkness) and Requiem ("new" World of Darkness)...which is the only one I've actually played a bit in years ago. I know enough that the new-new-WoD is V5 (back to Masquerade), but where versions 3 and 4 are, I don't know, nor what a version 20 would be.
@@scandalousdeity V5 is so called because it's 5th Edition, V20 (20th Anniversary Edition) is this V4, Revised is V3, and then there's Second Edition (aka Vampire meets Call of Cthulhu because Reasons) and First Edition. Requiem is not the same universe as Masquerade.
V20 is largely regarded as the most cleaned up and comprehensive version, hence my recommendation.
@@OdhinnAwake Thanks. I didn't realize Requiem was so separate from Masquerade.
@@BottomTableTyrantsor just play the better game.
I am really lost on a complaint on tremere you had. I can't tell 100% if you have a problem with there discipline of blood sorcery (or thaumaturgy if you want to be accurate) or the rituals. Because you talked about how you don't like how specific tremeres are about magic. But I cant tell if you are talking about the powers or rituals .... but you talk about rituals being fine so you where talking about the powers. But .... I dont know, you did not make that clear at all.
But with that out of the way, I am going to guess you where saying you dont like the "discipline powers" of blood sorcery. Well the book even explains that the powers are a lot weaker than the rituals because the rituals are usually very powerful, and if you have a "think out side the box" player play tremere they will break your game sometimes.
Now are the homebrew things you give tremere for "Discipline powers" or rituals? Because a power can be used in one action per turn, and rituals will always take time "5 X the level of the ritual" in mins to cast. Do you 100%, but the ideas explained sound like you would like to play v20 tremere. V20 tremere play more with paths (just powers that can branch to "schools of magic" for a simplification) instead of rituals.
I also heard a bit that you keep saying Geovanni, but in V5, the geovanni are now mixed with the other lower bloodlines of necromancers and now go by "Hecata" clan. You can find how to play hecata and how players play hecata in the "Cult of The Blood Gods" book. Unless you just ignore the hecata lore, you do you.
Hey Austin!
Yes I mean their discipline power “Magic” is boring and does not so amazing stuff like “make a vamp hungry.” (Which turns out is not very useful against a werewolf, or human, or ghost, or any of the other myriad denizens of my World of Darkness.) Their many boring powers are to me not worth it. Every group is different but mine is very combat oriented so having Tremere magic that isn’t useful in combat left my Tremere players feeling left out. So I made changes! TTRPGs are not a board game (thankfully) so you can add or takeaway any thing you wish to make it better for your players.
Finally, yes I know Giovanni are now integrated into the Hecata but (in my opinion) the the Giovanni fit my American story best. I love the idea of mafia vamps that play all sides so because I’m the GM and write the adventure outlines they show up in most of my stories! 😁
@@BottomTableTyrants I definitely got that from your video. I know V5 as written is not really a combat oriented game and, unlike DnD, is not balanced for every Clan to be equally viable in a fight. It's written to be more of a political game, where being able to mess with another kindreds hunger or know in depth information from a single drop of blood is a big deal. I do appreciate that you've been able to hack the game and Tremere specifically to work with your group though! I would however warn any players looking for the personal and political horror that the game advertises to take the advice to swap out the Tremere spells with a grain of salt.
Noted! 😁 agree that my group is more “swashbuckling adventure” oriented so yes the spell swapping worked for them but I think a lot of groups would likely be very similar especially if you are coaxing them to VtM from the main game they are likely to have played first/most (D&D). It’s hard to get folks to play games that aren’t D&D (trust me it’s pretty much what I do as a past time!?) so anything that helps ease that transition is a win for getting them to not just jump back to D&D
@@BottomTableTyrants Blood Sorcery might not be useful in physical combat, but holy damn the ability to assign enemies hunger dice in social/mental combat is huge.
Dominate can carry its weight there anyways and is useful in both, unlike Banu Haqim which are better in physical combat but don't have a trump card in mental.
@@DracoSuave that makes sense of course so it seems that I must put a lot more combat in my games (about 50% social and 50% combat is what I strive for) so my spellcasting vamp players felt left out for half of my sessions. Which led me to create the more combat oriented spells for them to use.
I was raised on Shadowrun 2e so going mostly social is pretty tough for me to do BUT every GM has to build their games to fit their players. They are the reason we do this! 😁
Its just the same game, in different system and with less matterial .....
Yes. Some would say those things are good! That new system has great tension and less material makes it more accessible to new players.
@@BottomTableTyrants thats debatable, we shall see in time if that works I guess
@@Razamaniac out of curiosity did you like the older system(s) and books of lore more? And if yes what/why did you find to be better? I’m genuinely curious!
I do think SOME of the old Sabbat lore was better than what has come out for V5. But it seems now that Renegade is in charge of creating V5 content they are finally making really good stuff regularly! (In my opinion of course) 😁
@@BottomTableTyrants The old books had their good and bad moments but the lore was also huge, with the back up of decades of supplements, that the new version cannot compete, and I don't think it will ever manage to compete. The action system of the old was better and more interactive, while the new one is more of a means to say a story rather than actual action. Maybe that fits vampire but then you exclude detailed interactive action from the game this way.
Hunger system looks interesting but it works by chance rather than being a Stat that the player knows that it will go down when they use it. I mean waking up and not being hungry is possible, but if that happens every night by sheer luck of the Hunger Checks, it might hit bad on the progress of a story. There are many other things that look unstable in the new system, like perception, movement, this whole new willpower system, the decreased wound penalty system, which also gave great flavour to the old game. I mean adding willpower damage to the system , rather than the old classical willpower expediture may give a second skin to the game, but on the other hand it doesn't work very well when you have the same stat for Roleplaying health levels + power activation + roll enhancement with the only punisment a -2 dice penalty while in the old game you litteraly became catatonic with no further energy to keep going which made players to grit their teeth and using their last willpower in a last great heroic endeavor. I mean willpower worked fine as an optional wellspring of second chancing as it was. In general, I find the new game more Role Play heavy which is not a bad thing but at the same time less interactive which creates a huge emotional gap and lack of heart pounding. That for Vampire which didn't change much as a game, its more of the system interaction and lore that impacted the game the most. (E.G. Malkavian, Lasombra etc etc)
For Werewolf is even worse 😆, the transfer from 20th to 5th was smoother for vampire, which still feels somewhat disconecting but still it has some merits, but for werewolf it went a lot worse 😝