St Etienne 1907
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- Опубликовано: 1 окт 2024
- The St Étienne machine gun of 1907 was developed by the French Government and saw action during WW1. For political reasons,the French did not want to rely on machine guns developed by private firms e.g. Hotchkiss, and by 1905 had developed the Puteaux APX MG. This design avoided, as far as possible, mechanisms patented by Hotchkiss, Maxim and Vickers. The Puteaux was not a success, and was then refined at the St. Étienne Arsenal to become the Model 1907. The Model 1907 fired the standard French 8mm Lebel cartridge.
The most distinguishing feature of this Gas Operated gun was that the gas piston was driven forwards on discharge, which necessitated a rack and pinion system to operate the loading cycle.
The gun incorporated a rate control allowing the firing rate to be varied between about 8 per minute to 600. In 1907 the tactical use of mass fire seen during WW1 had not been developed and this concept (originated by Maxim in his earliest designs) suited the need for conservation of ammunition supplies and the 25-round metallic cartridge strip. The gun also has a mechanism to adjust the foresight during sustained fire, when the air-cooled heavy barrel and brass casing would expand and so alter the geometry of the sights. The Model 1907 was manufactured until 1917, but was phased out by the superior Hotchkiss Model 1914 heavy machine gun.
Animation made using Cinema 4D, Quicktime and iMovie
Music: 'Mirage' Chris Haugen
A beautiful visualization. This weapon is far more complicated then one would think. Excellent choice of music too.
Some trivia for everyone about _why_ this thing is so "stupid" as someone already started saying
The M1907 was made like this because the French Army wanted a Heavy MG, but wanted a state owned company to make it, Hotchkiss was a private one and already had a great and _simpler_ patent for gas piston operation, Saint Etienne tried to use it without enfringing the patent so they worked around it, mainly by reversing the piston's direction of travel.
And now Monsieurs the Comittie 'as designed the Mark 2 Cheval- We call it the Camel.
To be fair, most of the French small arms were traditionally developed and manufactured by state owned arsenals in the past. It's only because the outbreak of WWI which made this strategy unfeasible.
It is a complicated design, but I wouldn't say it is stupid. When the St Étienne was designed, the MG was supposed to be used like a field artillery in support of the advancing infantry. No one expected that the next war would be fought in muddy trenches for 4 years.
@@therake8897 I still think its magazine safety feature to be really ugh.
Thank you, I've been waiting for this one. I remember watching the video Ian McCollum did and thinking "Were the French trying to Out over-engineer the Germans and Swiss cause I think they succeeded", it doesn't seem so bad looking at it here.
When i saw Ian McCollums video i thought " so now more jokes about german overengieering" :-)
6:53 what is that? front sight compensation for barrel heating? never seen one such thing
According to ian McCollum from Forgotten Weapons, yes it is.
It is actually make sense if you consider it suppose to be fired continuously with an air cooled barrel.
Here's a challenge/request:
40mm bofors hopper system
Please good sir....
I am currently gathering drawings of 40mm..... May be some time yet
vbbsmyt *I love you.*
@@vbbsmyt oh thank you so much!!!
No matter how hard i study the diagrams, i could only understand at least half of the mechanism of the fabled bofors.
(my best approxiamtion is that it uses the short recoil action from the maxim series bit instead, it is a push through feed rather than a pull..)
In keeping with the WW1 theme, perhaps the 37mm Sockelflak might be worth looking into?
Fantastic Video! I love these for how overcomplicated they are and all the weird features. Love seeing an in depth look at them, thank you
I never thought I'd see a machine gun with a tube-loader style cartridge lifter, but in 8mm lebel, it makes sense.
Madsen LMG uses this kind of mechanism too.
I like your fursona.
Grat video, Rob. You bring to life, these old systems, in a way that even the real one stripped can't produce. Thanks!
The components themselves look quite complex, but the mechanics of how they all work together is actually surprisingly simple.
Thanks for another great video! I think that only the Madsen is weirder than this machine gun.
Designed by Monsieur Rube Goldberg
Great video
Pretty cool machine gun design. Has that steampunk look with that cog in the mechanism.
I think this is like: how did some guns works for dummies
Saludos desde mexico
A clockwork death machine with variable slaughter control. Everyone should have one.
So rad to see this animation, fantastically well done!
Fingers crossed we'll come across one to live test some day!
Hi Mae, I do hope you can get hold of a fireable example of this 'iconic' gun. I wonder if the variable firing rate controls will still be operational. Regards Rob
адская конструкция. понятно, почему русские солдаты, использовавшие Сент-Этьен в годы гражданской войны, бросали его при первой возможности
Он весит как спящий носорог и очень метеозависим.
Thank you for such beautiful work. I finally have an inkling how theis Dogs Dinner of a piece works.
That is real clockwork!
I've been waiting for this animation for a long time. It's such a wonderfully complicated mechanic - and I finally understand it. Many thanks
I need 100 boxes of those to buy ok
This is pretty complicated stuff
Could you do a Video about the 8,8 cm flak?
Impresionante animación al despiezarla como siempre. Un saludo.
Excellent as always . No book could ever do what you do. Thank you.
How much did this cuckoo clock cost, who knows?
I can't even imagine, not to mention how the French even made this in the first decade of the 20th century
The _cuckoo clock_ was made like this for a reason, the State wanted a Heavy MG but wanted a state owned company to make it, Hotchkiss was a private one and already had a great patent for gas piston operation, Saint Etienne tried to use without enfringing the patent.
Better question is how long did it take to make one... lol
@@ToastytheG More important , how long did it keep going Bang when you fired it?
@@51WCDodge
Pretty much forever actually, you might need to sponge the barrel with water every now and then but it'll work great, it still has a gas piston so it's pretty reliable, "Heavy" MGs of WWI didn't suffer a lot from battlefield conditions because they were on tripods, Maxims are far more complex yet they can run forever.
The Forgotten Weapons video on this machine guns does not do justice to how beautifully complex yet simple the mechanisms are. I cannot imagine the machine gun being cheaper to make than the Hotchkiss designs, even with royalty fees. The machining in this thing is intensive, especially the rotating mechanism for the clip feed. Not to mention the heat calibrated front sight system. Definitely a French gun through and through.
The Greek Army acquired a lot of these HMG's after the Great War and used them to defend their forts along the Metaxas Line at the onset of WW2. They were well made, but tended to overheat with prolonged usage and the main piston spring tended to lose temper. It really was an obsolete design by the end of WW1 and certainly by WW2, but the French were selling them after the Great War at cheap prices and Greece needed weapons.
Yep, it a gun.
the name is associated with a ribbon making city and placed it my story in 2019.
Dear god, that feed mechanism! HTF were they able to machine the splines in that thing!?
Uninformed speculation: couldn't they have been a separate element? You could start by drilling a hole (possible with grooves), insert the "channel separators", and then somehow attach them at the cylinder ends.
@vbbsmyt: Do the drawings you have indicate if the splines and the cylinder (both used to rotate the magazine gear) were a single part?
The heavy beast of Saint-Étienne
please make a chain gun like L94A1 or M242 or anything similar. The only video i can find is of some dude hand crank the thing slowly with a dummy round in it. Which doesn't help much
Kind of unique and strange system and that music made feel to be in India.
Sounded more North African to me.
Sounds like the Designers at St Etienne were on something at the time.
Could you do a video on the German g 11
Hmm What do you think about make special video in 100k subs. - Mg42?
Or not because max age is end of great war and you never make exceptions?
A clockwork machine gun.
Metro Last Light Bastards Great Grand father.
What a beautiful piece of work. Only the French could make such a complex, resource hogging gun like this actually work.
If I understand the mechanism.
This is gas operated with a delay feature in the turning of the cam and rotation of the locking pin that holds the breach closed?
God I love Victorian technology!
Comme quoi faut pas faire chier Étienne 😂😂😂
Excelente despieze , espero publiquen algo asi de la LEWIS , NO la de infanteria , SI la de defensa de aeroplanos ...
ruclips.net/video/Xp6KkxOdUK8/видео.html
Keg is made of explosives, bombs, nuclear bombs, and all kinds of explosives.
It is interesting to see the animation of weapons: Mondragon M1908, Johnson M1941, Winchester Model 1910.
Who else thinks this guy and Ian from forgotten weapons should do videos together
always curious about how this French Trench Magic works after finding out its existence from Forgotten Weapons.
Its hard to imagine the amount of care and craftsmanship and mathematics that went into making these weapons. And its hard to imagine how much effort and care you put into recreating it.
Impressionnante vidéo détaillant le mécanisme de cette mitrailleuse. Un travail d'animation vraiment magnifique. Un immense bravo
why arabic music ????
This is a WW1 machine gun I would love to take apart just for the fun of how crazy the internals are.
I LOVE your channel, highest respect for these detailled animations. Tried it myself, damn, it's work! I would PAY to see a Curta Mechanical Calculator from you ;)
Hi
What software are you using? Amazing!!
Can you make a vid. About another wild west weapon pls
Can you make a video on the M1875 42mm mountain gun?
Фактически сложная машина
So it has 2 kind of control systems for controling the rate of fire... Gas control and mechanical trigger control... It is kinda what it is... If gas control "gear" set to 10 its already slow why try to use the other one? idk im re watching... WLEP...
@FlushRoyal. The Gas Control allows the gunner to alter the force applied to the piston. If the gun is fouling up, or has dirt in the mechanism, turning the dial to a low number increases the force on the piston to overcome the additional friction. On the other hand if the recoil spring has overheated, it becomes weaker and the piston rod slams into the feed drum, so gunner turns to the higher numbers as less force is needed to operate the cycle. The gas control does not (significantly) alter the firing rate. With rate control disengaged, firing rate will be about 500-600 rpm. With rate control engaged, there will be an appreciable pause between shots - allowing between 8 round per minute to (say) 300-400. A low firing rate does not heat the gun so much, is more suitable for a 25-round clip, and was expected to be less wasteful of ammunition. Rob
music? please thank you
Mirage by Chris Haugen. This information is shown at the end of the movie.
This machine gun is too complex than it needs to be.
Автоматика с отводом пороховых газов, но питание с обоймы!.. Это что-то!..
Could I get a little clarification about the locking on this machine gun. I was under the impression that the crank arm moving over center and bottoming in the slot locked the bolt into battery. But on watching this, it looks like the front-most protrusion on the rocking transfer rod locks the bolt to the receiver as the arm trips the sear - is this correct?
All in all, there are lots of brilliant little mechanical ideas in this machine gun that, one by one, aren't too bad. It's just that there are so many at once.
It is the locking bar at the top that physically locks the breech.
Excellent work! Could you possibly do the Parabellum MG14 in the future?
If I had the drawings....but I cannot find any.
Such a very unique and beautiful firearm
Oh no, french national arsenals... Sometimes they LITERALLY messed around firearms design...
This doesn't exactly count, it was still reliable and a great gun, it's just this weird because they were avoiding patent infringement.
@@CaptainGrief66 yep, that is often the case when you see a design that is going the long way around so to speak. They could use the other way but that would require paying royalties out on it.
Спасибо!
Прекрасная информативная визуализация!👍
C&R collaboration soon??
Can you do martini-Henry
I love these. How much work and time is it to produce one? Cool music,too.
That one was about 5 weeks, after I got documentation. Rendering took about 100 computer hours.
What a great animation, it is fascinating watching the mechanics of these weapons
Yo amazing video again! :D
This is a bomb. Super !!!
What software is used to produce these animations? I have some ideas for a semiautomatic pistol that I would love to render in 3d and animate. I'm ready for a challenge.
Cinema 4D
@@vbbsmyt Thank you. Beautiful work!
too complicated.
Да,сделать просто это очень трудно.Французы пошли по легкому пути)
Слабаки.
This weapon must have been hell in mud.🤪
Designed before WW1
Great animation! Thanks!
What a fantastic animation
This gun look neat and special, and not so arduous like the chauchat I believe
It was actually worse than the Chauchat. It was literally an attempt by the French to rip off an actually functional gun that had patent protection. They reversed the pistons direction of travel and crammed a bunch of clockwork into the receiver and called it good. I don't think the gun can be field stripped for cleaning, I'm pretty sure it weighs twice that of a Chauchat for a similar volume of fire, and is, honestly, about as reliable as a Chauchat.
@@korbetthein3072 so you saying that during WWI, there were some inadequate French guns that was produced? I think some of these guns are still being used by other countries until the 40s or early 50s actually.....
Rarement ont parlent de la mitrailleuse Saint-Etienne 1907?! Avec un mécanisme assez complexe rien que le voir, merci pour ce formidable documentaire!!!
Next Kar 98k please
You can change the music whenever you feel. Don't feel like you have to use that song for the whole video. Trust me you don't.