Disclaimer: This is *not* the way to do it! Charging to 100% is not representative of how long it typically takes an EV to DC fast charge. The Bolt EV is an older design and limited when it comes to DCFC; nonetheless, our charge stops on long trips are usually 40-50 minutes. The new EVs mentioned in the video are closer to 30-40 minutes, while Tesla, Kia-Hyundai, and Porsche/Audi get things down to 15-20 minutes. Technology is moving fast and we're close to the point where road trip delays will be minimal compared to combustion, while locally most EV owners will actually save time by simply plugging in at home, at work, or while running errands.
I own a 2019 chevy bolt and what you said above really depends on the temperature outside and from what percentage to what percentage you are charging. At 22celcius I went from around 30 to 80 percent in 54 minutes... sometimes I get 30 minutes from 20 to 80 percent only on warmer days. In level 3
true but if you have to use the range and need 100% its something to be aware of. its the worst tier fast charging. my kona gets 75kw up to 80% then slows to 50kw. i would be unhappy if it were slower.
@@danielroden9424 For sure, there are locations and scenarios where the next fast charger (or destination) is going to push every mile of range and the upper 10-20% of the pack is a necessary evil. Hopefully that ends up being a sit-down meal stop and the charge rate becomes less important. The main thing is that potential EV owners don't watch this and think "oh, I have to wait more than an hour every 200 miles, that's not happening!"
I’m 55 all of my adult life I’ve been in this huge hurry on trips. I made the decision to buy a Chevrolet Bolt ev 2023. I had to travel to show i could. after few months had a good selection of charging locations. I have discovered a new joy in never noticed before. Not being in a hurry taking a breath 30-45 minutes charging and i love it!
I would never watch someone fill up their gas tank yet I find these charging videos to be fascinating. Thanks for sitting around so long to make this happen! Bolt EV drivers are surprisingly intrepid and patient. Despite the slow charging speeds, Bolt EVs get road tripped like crazy.
Indeed, it's a bit into the weeds but I think the fact that EVs are new tech and developing every year keeps it fresh...for now! That development is sort of emphasized by the Bolt EV, which a few short years ago could charge (slightly) faster than most of the public CCS infrastructure. With the Model 3 at $40k, then V3 Supercharging + Electrify America's expansion and other networks adding 100kW+ charging, that quickly flipped and made the Bolt's hardware the pinch point. On the subject of trip patience, we have an interview coming up with a Bolt owner who drove it from Mass. to Arizona, then switched to a Model Y for his distance EV and took it back East. His travel style was actually right in line with the Bolt (400-500 mile drive days, long breaks for food and rest), but he found the ease of use of the Tesla ecosystem the big difference-maker. As the public network improves, I can see even the Bolt matching certain types of road trip drive styles, and at a very accessible price point.
@@plugandplayEV I'm hoping that GM makes a ton more Bolt EV/EUVs for the refreshed version. They'll be a very useful component of the EV transition as they enter the secondary market at a very reasonable price point. Over an hour for 10-80% won't ever work for mass appeal as a primary car but for people interested in an EV as a second vehicle for use around town at $10k it should get snapped up.
'I use mine as a daily commuter back and forth to work . The only issue I have is the current recall. And am thinking of returning to a ice vehicle. Do to the inconvenience
We've had our 2017 Premier Bolt for a week and we are loving it. We charge it at level 1, but that works great for us. At 12 amps we reach a full charge overnight, if it's already 1/2 full. I've been driving just because it's so much fun to drive 1 pedal driving. Thanks for all your help. My wife is also loving it. Hugs Steve
Great to hear, congratulations Steve! We did the first couple of years with only L1 at 12A and it worked okay. Lots of local charging kept us topped up and overnight L1 easily got us to 100% ahead of road trips. Definitely prefer L2 for the driveway, but L1 is viable for low mile daily driving. Look forward to hearing more about your Bolting!
Dear Steve, We love our 2017 Bolt that we have had for 3-3/4 years now. We use the same 12 amp charger for daily overnight and we use hilltop reserve so the battery only charges to 88% that way the battery life is extended and it's safer. Long trips are easy if you change your habits and charge with breakfest, lunch and possibly dinner and then make sure your hotel has level 2 charging and it's usually free overnight. We can usually travel around 600 miles a day that way with 2 long full 100% charging stops and the overnight 100% charge. Oh and FYI we only charge to 100% on long trips if the distance to the next stop calls for it and we make sure we have plenty of safety net charge just in case the charger is not working and we have to travel to another charger. We use PlugShare as our trip planner, we find it's better than the MyChevy app. PlugShare also shows you elevation changes as they can effect your range a lot. Have fun.
@@Jeff-wb3hh Thank you for your welcomed advice. We are in central Illinois and we have to curb ourselves from charging the batteries too full, too often. I know the car will last longer, if we only charge to 80- 90 %, but the urge to charge it to full is still a strong temptation. The guess-o-meter already is reading 300 miles per charge on full, I just need to remember I'm retired, this car is for the wife to get back and forth from work, but I love gallivanting so much, and so I find myself recharging .. It's an obsession. I feel like I'm a kid, again.
Steve, yes charging at Level 1 is very manageable for many and should not be a deterrent when thinking about an EV purchase. Everyone’s situation is different of course. It’s really nice to charge nightly and to avoid gas stations for fuel. Electric ⚡️ is a much better experience. ✅
I'm so with you Steve! I'm a happy Bolter, too, really love the car - and was disheartened to hear about all those recent Bolt fires. I don't want anything like that to happen to my Eva, so I am following GM's recommendations and try not to charge her overnight or leave her unattended when charging. Also, most of my driving is local, so keeping her charged at about 80% works just fine for me.
8:30 50% 10:40 per minute vs per kwh 11:10 taper pretty visible at 70% 14:15 paying per minute makes the 2nd 1/2 cost 2x the 1st 1/2 16:10 takeaways Really good video for ppl learning about fast charging. KEY FOR LONG TRIPS: have big enough battery that length of each trip leg allows you to stay in bottom 60% of your pack and avoid taper/slow charging.
A bigger battery is only going to make your car more expensive to operate especially during long trips. A fool and their money is easily parted holds more true with each passing year. Lmao Hopeless consumers
@@samusaran7317 and I'm on electric cars number four and five. Haven't had a gas car since 2015. Took my Bolt on a 700 mile round trip and it was a disaster Took my model 3 on a 3300 mi trip and it was amazing. Took my model y on a 4800 MI trip in March and it was a blast.
Appreciate the video! Despite having an ICEV available we seem to always want to take the Bolt on road trips. Something about the more leisurely pace and going point to point makes it feel shorter even if actually takes longer. Sure our next EV will charge 3-4x faster, but I bet one day we look back nostalgically at these early days. Back when we had to plan our stops and wait, before there was 500 kW off every exit and the world went and got in one big hurry.
Thanks! We feel very similar, with the slight caveat that there are some scenarios where getting back on the road after 20-30 minutes would be preferable... when there's nothing much at the charge location, for example, or traveling solo and 400+ miles into a long trip. From families to tourists, I think there are plenty of scenarios where slowing the trip down and adding more breaks certainly makes it more pleasant, without adding major delays to the trip.
I have been doing my cross country drive and drive through 7 states so far! I am loving life and not feeling so tired after long trips. Stopping to recharge also helps us humans recharge too! I take naps or go on walks while my bolt is on the charger.
I agree too. I don't think I'd want to drive beyond the 200-mile range without stopping, even in a gas car. However, there are some caveats: 1) We need more reliable charging infrastructure. Needing to try several chargers to find one that works is never good. 2) Waiting 20 minutes for someone else to finish a charge, then waiting again to charge your own car sucks. We need more capacity at busy charging sites. 3) Sometimes, the place with the food I want doesn't have a charger, and the place with the charger doesn't have my type of food, thereby necessitating separate stops for food and recharging. Being able to get the car charging stop over and done with in 10 minutes is nice, given that I just stopped for a longer break anyway. 4) DCFC coverage in rural areas away from interstate highways is nearly non-existent, which should be fixed.
Thank you very much. That was faster than I thought at 1 hour and 49 minutes, from essentially 0% state of charge to 100%. When I go on long trips, I usually charge my 2017 Bolt (bought new in Sept 2017) from 20% to 100% and it takes about 1 hour and 30 minutes at a 150kW station and it is fine with me because I always have a nice relaxing breakfest, lunch or dinner with each full charge, no problem. I hate rushing. Of course I try not to let it go below 15% when road tripping. It's nice to see that going from 0% to 100% does not take much longer.
Thanks Jeff, glad it's of interest. As you know (but it's worth noting in case others read), the step down of the 2017-'19 models means it would take longer to get that final 20% than a 2020 or later model year. However, the post-recall update looks like it will also bring the gradual taper to those earlier years, so hopefully this video applies to every former model year once they have they update performed. Look forward to seeing how that plays out in real-world charging this next few months as people hit the road again.
@@plugandplayEV That is more good news that the battery "fix" update for the 2017 model will possibly bring the same faster charging curve as the later models. It would be nice if the update also brought the ability to charge anywhere from 50% to 100% instead of just having Hilltop Reserve which charges to 89%, but I don't think it will. I'll be getting the "fix" update early next week.
Thanks for this. We just got a 2021 bolt and are loving it. Its going to be my wife’s daily commuter and used for occasional road trips from Seattle to Portland or Vancouver. I installed a L2 charger for home last year. Hope to keep the car a long time
Thanks and congrats. Sounds like the perfect use case for the car. Daily driver use is ideally matched to the one-pedal driving and nippy acceleration, while regional travel is really not much different to faster-charging EVs. With L2 at home, you'll probably only think about the range a few times a year at most. Happy Bolting!
Hey Steve - thanks for taking one for the Team (Bolt owners)! I know I could never sit and wait for 100% while sitting on a fast charger. That’s just too much lost time. But if you can find a way to space out the charging stops at about 80-120 miles (10-60%) depending on terrain and weather, the Bolt travels ok, and you’re not really held back by charging time, unless you’re trying to cover more than 500 miles in a day, or you frequently take longer trips.
It was a real hardship, Dennis... I even had to get great coffee and my sandwich of choice from a favorite lunch spot to make it through...! It really does emphasize the timing aspect of fast charging though. Knowing the car's profile and when it's time to move on is a big part of optimizing journey time.
Who goes to zero miles and who goes to 100% on a public charger? Both ends tend to be much slower. And I'll guess 10% or less charge this way unless they have a DCFC close to work or something. And few will ever need to have that much charge to get to the next charger. It does happen, as I charged to 90% for winter cold/snow tires range the other day and just made it home with the 260 mile battery.
@@kujo49 - I think this story was about taking one for the team (how long will it take?) as the Bolt charges very slowly past about 70%, and a typical Bolt owner just won’t go there. Someone who is on a trip would never charge to 100% unless they absolutely needed it to make the distance to the next available charger. We do figure out that the 2+ hours of your life that you’d lose - on a good day - just isn’t worth it.
@@kujo49 - agree that 1 hour of charging will add about 50% to a starting charge level of 15-20%. But that last 30-35% on a fast charger just isn’t worth waiting for in a Bolt.
Cheers Derek. It certainly gets low later on in the pack, but it's an improvement in the old step-down model where we lost chunks of charging power at halfway and two-thirds point for no real reason. Just generally a vehicle that you need a bit more patience with than the current crop of EVs. But then we did a trip around England in a Type 2/22-kW max Renault Zoe, so I guess that's us!
Totally agree. It's marginally better than before if you absolutely have to have the range, but generally much better to get on the road, use some more juice, and plug in again well below 50% where possible.
Thank you for the video, it explains greatly what the Bolt EUV is. But, it should be noted, a trip of 400 miles in the Bolt EV/EUV is very well doable with about 1 hour of charging session. 200 miles on the first leg @ 70 mph is very doable, then the rest of the 200 miles, split the charging session in two : 35 mins from 10 tp 55% is enough for 120 miles and 25 mins for the last 80 miles. I don't think this would be a problem for the majority of people. And I hear talking about waiting after a Bolt EV at a DCFC - well, not many are the EV who charge on 150 kW DCFC. Most of them are looking at 350 kW. I doubt a Bolt EV will be the bottle-neck, unless all the 350 kW are not working.
Thanks, I would agree. I now make the distinction between long-distance road trips and regional trips... over 500 miles is a big drive day and can drag in a Bolt unless you're sightseeing, but the journey you describe is a natural fit for a short snack stop and the meal time that it inevitably crosses. From Boston, 400 miles gets us to every location in New England, down to NYC/Philly, up to Montreal, almost to Niagara Falls... all in the time it takes to do a regular journey with a leg stretch and short meal break.
Great to see. As you mentioned, almost no one would ever do that, but I always wondered how long it would take. :-) In almost 5 years owning our Bolt, we've fast charged less than 20 times. Usually we are 30%+50% and charge to 85%. Takes 45 minutes to an hour, and usually while we are eating, so it hasn't been an issue for us.
Thanks, yours is a great example of why the Bolt's DCFC "limitations" aren't always a failing. For those who mostly use it for local duty - or even those on regional road trips or who enjoy longer pit stops - 50kW is a perfectly workable maximum.
Thanks for sharing. I usually aim for 60% SOC (55-65) when road tripping my 2020 Bolt. Rarely charge above 70% on DC Fast Chargers unless it will save me an extra stop before reaching my destination for the day. Even then you’re probably better off doing an extra stop in the middle to put in an extra 10-15% rather than waiting to charge to 80+%
Right, when the charge rate is half what it can be in the upper portion vs. lower portion of the pack, it makes more sense to get that full power whenever you can. Some time has to be factored in for getting off the Interstate and finding the additional charge location, but if that's only a few minutes then it's still a better option.
Good to know, thanks! Sorry about the wait... May turned out to be absolutely crammed with filming opportunities, so June will be about actually publishing the backlog.
Havn’t needed even lvl2 charging even though I have it mostly set up in my garage! 2020 Bolt Premier and driving all the time as I am retired! Just going to work someone would only need to charge occasionally!
A regular outlet can certainly work in some use cases, as the Bolt is pretty efficient and the juice goes a long way, especially around town. There will always be the potential to need a quicker top up though (we found it was tough in winter, for example), where access to L2 -- or even nearby DCFC -- is a valuable resource.
I’m sorry, and I love all EVs but this made me so thankful for superchargers. It quite litterally takes me like 15 minutes to go from ~10%-70%. No initial ramping.
That's okay, just not a direct comparison given the dated tech of the Bolt. More accurate will be something like an EV6 or IONIQ 5, which will be a similar price range to Model 3/Y and will hit 200+ kW for a time. Will be interesting to see how those charge curves and time compare, for sure.
@@plugandplayEV I agree! I’d love to see those! The only last comment I had was the prices seem a bit high $0.31-0.33/kWh, where a supercharger in my area (NH) is closer to $0.26/kWh. Anyways, happy so many people are getting on the EV train regaurdless of Bolt or Tesla or Hyundai!
Yep, electric is electric and any model is a step up from ICE! I'd say the price for public DCFC will almost always be higher than a private network. Expect to see the same with the Rivian Adventure Network, where the premium price of the vehicle offsets a low price for charging (probably similar to Supercharger rates, after a period of free use). Also important to remember that several new models now come with 2-3 years free EA charging, which will make the overall cost for charging per mile very good over the lifetime of those cars.
I can see EV's bringing people together. In the future, charging stations will charge your battery in 15 minutes or less. If you think about a rest stop or gas station we have today, you could transform those places into so many different layouts and lounge areas. Marketing will change entirely as most people will need to stick around for at least 15 minutes and they will inevitably buy something besides electricity!
It makes a lot of sense, Beau, and could actually change how places like service plazas are set up. Going to the restrooms and dining areas are typically separate from the gassing up part right now, whereas charge stations are typically part of the parking lot. So you plug in and spend that "gas time" in the main plaza instead, which equates to more spending for the main dining area and stores.
@@plugandplayEV this may be inappropriate but I can just see the cannabis industry taking advantage of this. Pull over to charge for 20 mins, go into the smokers lounge and then take off in your fully autonomous vehicle 😆
I just saw a video by "Out of Spec Reviews" and it took the Mustang Mack-E 2 hours and 32 minutes to charge from 1 to 100% with an 99kW battery with a maximum charging speed rating of 150kW! ! ! That makes the 2020 Bolt's 66kW battery and max charging speed of 50kW and a 0% to 100% charging speed of 1 hour and 47 minutes pretty good !
True, but we can go further on 80% of the Mach-E's extended pack than 100% of the Bolt's, so it's not all about the time. Just means that it's even more important to bail on the session when you hit 80% in a Mach-E! I suspect that will be fixed OTA some time this year by Ford.
@@plugandplayEV True. I guess a better test would be the time to get to 80%. The 80% range of the Mach-E extended range is around 240 miles and the range of the 2020-2022 Bolt EV with an 80% charge is 207 miles. Only a 33 mile difference, interesting. Based on your and "Out of Spec Reviews" test the time it takes to get to 80% for the Mach-E is 49 minutes and the Bolt is 71 minutes. A 22 minute difference. Depending on your budget and how often your going to go on road trips would factor into to your choice. I guess it boils down to what is important to each person. There are so many factors to weigh, it helps to have reviewers like you and others to help give us the real world facts.
Happy these are of use and the feedback has certainly been positive in the week the video has been up. From our travels, I find we broadly have two kinds of stops: 1) those where we use the facilities, grab small supplies (convenience store) + stretch legs briefly, and 2) those where we want to sit down and eat or shop (groceries). For #2, even the Bolt's charging curve is fine. It's a 45-60 minute activity and the car is ready to go before we are. It's #1 where the disconnect happens and we're waiting for the Bolt. As those stops tend to be around 20-25 minutes (because kids), even a Mach-E would still leave us some time to kill until 80%. It would take a Tesla or Ioniq 5 / Kia EV6 power level to have the car ready before we get back.
Thanks for this! You are braver than I by driving that low. I've read a few reports of some folks suddenly going from less than 5% to no propulsion. Also nice to see an actual 66kWh 2020 (mine is about 63). In the forums I follow, 66 is rare. For all those lamenting the lack of charging improvements, they need to keep in mind this is still a great entry level EV, with the older BEV2 battery tech. Hopefully we will eventually see a BEV3 successor.
Ha, thanks! I did actually read after this, on one of the forums, someone losing propulsion when they thought they had several percent left... not something we hear a lot of but reinforces the need for a buffer when traveling. The lowest we've got on the road is 3% in the 2017 and 4% in the 2020. The GOM always seems to be accurate and gives you until the last 15 miles or so before just reading "Low" and urging you to find some electrons asap. On the charge rate, I bump between the two opinions. On one hand, we probably won't stay in a Bolt EV because of the improvements in newer models that don't cost that much more after incentives. On the other, the value of a Bolt in meeting the vast majority of daily driver requirements is unmatched. I'd be sad not to have one in the driveway and wouldn't rule out adding one again as a second vehicle if they remain in the $10-15k used bracket.
Unlikely the losses amounted to quite that much. System efficiency on these 150kW DC stations is estimated at 95-98%, so perhaps 3-4 kWh at most. But yes, not everything goes to the pack itself. We did have a smidge left at 1% though, so it's not far off the rated capacity of 66kWh when all is said and done.
@@TedKidd Right, I've always heard mid 80s to low 90s efficiency for L2. The figures for DCFC come from manufacturer review papers in Germany and the US. Not marketing materials but I'd certainly prefer some independent tests to verify.
Interesting to see the difference in the 2020 pack vs my 2019. It’s nice to see that the newer pack doesn’t seem as affected by even mildly colder temps. At 69deg my Bolt would have only been charging at maybe 40-45kw at the most and running the battery heater. It doesn’t hit peak charging speed until 75deg. My 2019 doesn’t start cooling the battery until it hits 100deg avg temperature, and even when repeatedly fast charging it on a 109deg day, I didn’t see any charging speed reduction other than the energy needed to run the ac compressor for battery cooling, which was noticeable at about 6kw, but that’s not a limitation of the battery, only a limitation of the current rating of the charging plug and wiring (150A) The taper is also much better than 2019. Mine tapers to 38kw at 47-49% and down to 23kw at around 70%. At 95% it is down at 7kw and tapers down to 1-2kw as it nears 100%, so definitely much better on the 2020+. I’ve got a similar video about my 2019 Bolt on my channel, and will be posting a video comparing charging before and after the recall/software update probably next weekend.
Excellent, that will be interesting to see (subbed!) We didn't get a chance to compare the two before our 2017 Bolt EV Premier went back spring 2020, so I'm hoping the update aligns 2017-'19 models with 2020/'21 as some have reported.
I'm reading that the final recall update to restore 100% SoC to 2017-2019 Bolts has also changed the charge curve to be a smooth taper like 2020+ vs. the hard stepdowns. I haven't seen any good data like this yet for an older model, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed!
I’ll be doing a video about this on my channel hopefully this weekend. The recall is being performed Tuesday and I’ll be testing it out throughout the week.
I've seen the same on the forums but only anecdotal. Others have mentioned it on previous updates but I don't think it turned out to be the case, so hopefully this one is the real deal. Staying tuned to @Wrenching Fool channel for that update.
Great job on the video. Lots of great information. I also recognized this EA station as one I frequent. I've probably ran into you a time or two at the local spots because I've seen your RUclips channel on Plug Share checkins.
Thanks, it's our local test station (or was... EA Arlington seems less crowded and is a similar distance, so might change!) What do you drive? I'll keep an eye out and say hi next time.
Bolt does a pretty good job, especially around town. We're at 4.7 mi/kWh over the past 1k miles, mostly local driving with a bit of Interstate mixed in for regional trips.
I just bought a 2020 Bolt today. We use it in Alaska so this should be interesting. We do have a 2017 Yukon for other uses. The Bolt is really cool in a weird way.
Congratulations! There was a chap up in Denali loving his Bolt in the Alaskan winter... Kirk Martakis, if I recall. Smart to have the Yukon alongside it and pick the right tool for the right job. Enjoy! ⚡
Just found this, thanks Steve. I don't, as a rule, look at charging speed, I look at efficiency. Let's say we have car 'A' with a 77kWh pack and a range of 230 miles, the efficiency is 2.98 miles/kWh and another car, car 'B', has a 66kWh pack and a range of 250 miles. That's 3.79 miles/kWh. Now, let's say we charge to 80%. That's 77*0.8 = 61.6 kWh and 52.8kWh respectively. 61.6* 2.98 = 183.6 miles range and 200.1 miles respectively. Let's say that the larger battery charges in 45 minutes and the smaller battery charges in 65 minutes like the Mach-E and Bolt do. 45/183.6=.245 minutes per mile and 65/200.1=0.325 minutes per mile or 14.7 seconds per mile and 19.49 seconds per mile. So to go 100 miles it's 24.5 minutes and 32.5 minutes or just about 8 minutes more for the slower charging car over 100 miles or ~2 hours of driving, 16 minutes for 4 hours of driving. So what I think is that when you look at the slow charging times it looks a lot worse than it is. Only until you get to times like the Tesla and EV6 do you see real differences. There are other factors at play here, the larger pack is heavier and requires a heavier car so it will never achieve the efficiency of a lighter car like the two Bolts which come in several hundred pounds lighter than something like the Mach-E. I imagine there's a sweet spot where the battery to weight ratio is optimal but personally I favor the lighter car because I charge from my PV and the fewer watts I put in it the more my system annd battery save. For me efficiency is paramount and I'm happy with the slightly longer charge times especially since my wife and I don't travel long distances often.
Thanks for the examples, I keep meaning to come back to this topic because charging vs. efficiency is quite obscured at the moment, especially with free charging widespread. Obviously our Ioniq 5 is now significantly faster for road trips over multiple charge stops, but you're totally right that it's much closer for other models and trips that only require a single stop (~300-400 miles). The cost of charging will also have to come into the equation, eventually. Something like the Bolt or an older Ioniq uses its first charge much more efficiently than the newer, heavier models, meaning you'll go further for your money and that next charge won't cost as much, even if it takes a bit longer. We see electricity prices rising with Tesla for Supercharging and that will have to come to the public networks, once funding and free charging promotions run dry. At that point, EVs that cover more miles per kWh are likely to take back some of the advantage, as cars with better MPG than their competitors do today.
@@plugandplayEV Steve, I just got a call today from my dealer, my new battery is in and they are planning on replacing it on Nov. 1st. I'm interest to see how its charging algorithm compares to my original 2020 battery. I've heard people are complaining about 20kWh charging rates in certain situations, I think Eric ran into this on one of his outings. I don't remember if your battery has been replaced or not? My 2023 EUV might come in before the end of the year so I'll have that to measure also although I imagine it will be relatively close to the replacement if they don't do some tweaks on the new car. People have also been complaining about the adaptive cruise applying the friction breaks once regen hits 11kW and not using the full regen on the 2022 and newer Bolts with good batteries. I tested my Bolt with the standard cruise today and it does in fact use the full regen.
We have a Bolt now but had a Model 3 for years. Honestly, while supercharging is much faster, it has a massive curve. You'd be there for over an hour if you tried to charge to 100%, and mine was an SR so it had less range than any Bolt to begin with. I have also been to slow superchargers that peaked at 65 kw, which felt like charging a Bolt lol
Right, it really comes down to knowing your EV and how to maximize its potential. Our extended family drives their Model 3 LR to us from Ohio and take roughly the same amount of time as us in a Bolt, because they prefer to stop for meals at Superchargers and go close to full. As you say, that's an hour stop, as it would be in a Bolt to ~90%, and suits their travel style just fine. At the other end of the spectrum, we tried to get 250 kW in their Model 3 earlier this year and couldn't get low enough to see that max. At 15% on a V3, it was pulling 222 kW, which is obviously still excellent but quickly tapered to V2 power levels. Showing the whole curve is good as a demonstration, but it's more an exercise in why you *don't* normally do this, than a recommendation!
As long as you understand 1) one would never recharge a battery in this fashion as it's inefficient. 2) Newer batteries which will be in all Bolts for free have better charging characteristics and longer range. Also, if you charge at home, 98% or auto trips are under 100 miles and 99% are less than 200 miles, meaning most will seldom ever need to go to a fast charger more than a couple of times a year, if that.
Absolutely, the disclaimers and pinned comments are all intended to ward off any misunderstanding. The gas model of "fill 'er up" at a public station simply doesn't apply to electric vehicles in the vast majority of scenarios. The point about home charging should also be emphasized, as well as extended to cover workplace and local charging, all of which should be passive... just plug in and let the car top up while the owner takes care of other business. The time savings of passive charging in everyday life are rarely highlighted vs. gas, whereas we hear no end of the "wasted time on long trips" argument. All important things to reiterate, thanks Mark.
So one thing I noticed on my 2020 Bolt in similar DC fast charge temperatures is that if I run the cabin climate on auto and just cool enough to run the AC compressor that it proactive runs the battery cooling pump and keeps the battery cooler during the entire charge cycle. Otherwise when I force the AC off to just run the fan the bms waits for battery to get warm then cranks the battery coolant pump to the max to try to reactively catch up. Something I noticed in the torque app.
It locks during DC fast charging, yes. For L1 and L2 charging (when only the J1772 plug is used), it can be unplugged. But there are simple padlock solutions that can be used on the charge handle if you expect mischief.
Chevy Bolt is the best value EV out there. As you demonstrate a 20 min DCFC will give you enough juice to get home. At 31 to 35 thousand, it more affordable then many other EVs out there.
Price will need to be closer to $25k given the distorting factor of incentives and offers like free charging that still come with some newer EVs, but definitely agree the Bolt represents great value for money... if buyers can find one!
The only time I really got bothered by the slow charging speed of my 2019 Bolt (and later my 2022 Bolt EUV) was during winter. Unless you're in an area where DC charging is very sparse, typically you'd charge the Bolt to around 50-60% and then move on to the next charger. If you pull in around 5-10%, that charge takes about 30 minutes. In the winter, because the efficiency (and thus range) drops so much, you have to either stop more often or charge even more. Add on to that the fact that the Bolt has no battery pre-heating which means the car doesn't charge at peak speed in cold weather, you have to add more energy at a slower rate in order to do the same driving. Most of my charging stops during spring and summer would be about 30 minutes to jump from charger to charger. The same thing in the winter is typically 45-60 minutes. That gets a bit annoying. But, then again, how many road trips do I take during the winter? One...maybe 2 sometimes. So, it isn't a big deal. The Bolt EV and EUV are great cars for commuting and trips up to about 150-200 miles. They are totally capable of longer trips throughout the year, but there will be a sacrifice in how long those trips will take. In my opinion, unless you are taking those long road trips multiple times a month and absolutely cannot spare the time for some reason, the charging speed isn't really that important. Its mainly just anti-EVers grasping at straws, trying to justify their dislike for change.
Very true. And winter stops tend to be the ones where you least want to hang around, so it's not ideal for that. But other than the major holidays, as you say, the opportunities to travel aren't as frequent, so it's not the end of the world.
Thanks for the data. It will be useful for new Bolt owners, of which there are many. I'm disappointed that Chevy did not increase the charge rate for the new Bolt/EUV. Perhaps they shifted their resources to focus on the Ultium based cars? Even though the list price of the new vehicles is less than the old ones, IMO Chevy will have to continue to offer huge incentives to move the cars. I guess that's ok if it continues to get people into EVs. I just hope they aren't disappointed with the slow "fast" charging. Regarding the Kia/Hyundai offerings being in the "affordable" range....I guess that's true if you can get one. They are not available nationwide.
Thanks Tom. I'm increasingly seeing the 2022 Bolts as a value play, rather than trying to move the needle on EV technology. They basically used the falling battery costs to address cosmetic complaints of cost-cutting on first gen Bolts (seats, creature comforts, and styling), without improving any of the underlying EV piece. In doing so, GM can now claim two truly affordable entry-level all-electric models, while pointing to forthcoming Ultium-based models for more demanding EV drivers. I hear from enough drivers who don't want to road trip their EV - or those who simply like to travel a bit slower - that I think these new Bolts will have a role to play, even though they won't keep us in a Bolt past 2022. Re. Kia-Hyundai, I think the quotation marks are doing a lot of work nowadays for that brand's new EVs... they look amazing and the tech is great, but the budget brand status is being left behind. We don't yet know the US price of the IONIQ 5 but the launch EV6 will go for close to $60k... even with rebates and incentives, that's a lot of dough for a Kia! But ZEV states + major markets first seems fair enough for me, given the commitment to roll out nationwide by the end of next year. Production is constrained and it makes sense to sell into markets where demand will be highest first. As long as they stick to their word and go nationwide, I don't see this as much different to the 2017 Bolt taking a year or so to be available in all states.
Right, there are plenty of scenarios where per minute goes the other way and becomes a bad deal. EVgo here is around the rates you mention and typically has less powerful hardware, so we pay more for less and take longer. EA's per minute rate right now just happens to be so cheap that it makes for a temporary great deal, but eventually all states will allow per kWh pricing and it will be a uniform EA rate across the country.
I'm surprised those stations are so expensive! ~20 miles per dollar vs about 8 miles per dollar with gas, but not as cheap as I expected. Makes me glad I can charge my '17 at home!
Yep, home charging is where it's at when it comes to EV savings. Fast charging is there for road trips (or the occasional freebie, if the network is having a glitch or feeling generous!)
Left it on and locked. Filmed the whole thing so the data is pulled from the video + time stamps. Only used OBDII for Torque Pro app and the spot battery temp. readings this time.
The OBDII port does stay powered at all times (car on or off) and the data remains available during charging because the various charging-related modules have to be online and communicating while charging, so the data is available on the OBDII port. The gauge cluster will turn off though.
There were certainly some shipped with J1772 only, but the vast majority of Bolts have the fast charge option. Every model year since the introduction in 2017 has offered CCS.
@@samusaran7317 Source? IWhen the battery in the read out in my car read in the 90s*, as in the efficiency chart, I was getting a 330 mile range figure in the Guessometer, which has been very accurate. And I was getting the commensurate measure of miles per kwh to confirm it. So, what is your problem? GM is wrong on their efficiency chart? And I didn't get the confirmation on miles per kwh? And both confirm each other? Put up or shut up!
@@kujo49 Did you forget your coffee.... Are you really driving around in that heat with no air conditioning going? After 75°F your efficiency will drop unless you like tormenting yourself sweating in your seat. I can drop a link for that info if you want.
@@samusaran7317 I asked for the source. Did you forget your coffee or just being an AH! Put it out there! And tell me why GM shows that 90*+ is favorable for range on their efficiency charts. Can you do that? Please (he says to be polite and not misunderstood).
@@kujo49 I can't speak for you, but the increased degradation doesn't seem worth it. Especially considering most evs Ive seen rapidgate eventually causing more strain. In the end, its not my ride though. Cheers
Well done. This makes me so glad I sold the Bolt and bought a Tesla. The charge rate is like watching paint dry. I gripe if I drop to 70KW during a charge. I will say that EA has finally drastically reduced their prices. I have paid up to 86 cents a kilowatt when they were charging by minute 2 years ago during winter. GFM
Tech's moving fast, certainly. We'll move on to a new model to upgrade our road trips, but the Bolt EV will still be one of the best options for many drivers who prefer leisurely trips or rarely fast charge. Great value at under $25k new / $15k used, bringing EV benefits in a simple, practical package. These EA prices have been in place since last September, so old news at this point but certainly still positive.
@@plugandplayEV I did like the Bolt, although I paid almost $40,000 for a fully equipped one in 2018. Fully equipped was actually kind of a joke, and I would not recommend buying that. As most driving is local, the car worked well for my uses and with the lower prices they make an affordable option. But the slow charging is just plain stupid by GM. In order to get my car to charge at over 17 KW in winter, (yes, 17KW!), I had beat my local dealership over the head with a stick (well, not physically), to get them to upgrade the charging protocols. Legacy auto makers have a lot to learn about modern automobiles. GFM
@@plugandplayEV Every ICE manufacturer is have civil war behind closed doors. But public opinion is pulling them around. Imagine have a $90,000 car with 90 Kwhr battery and get 180 miles of range.
Technically, every cycle of discharging/recharging a battery pack impacts longevity, but you're right that DC charging (Supercharging and other forms of "fast" direct current charging) puts the most stress on the pack. However, there are EV owners that can't charge at home and use a fast charger once or twice a week to top up. So it would be easieron the battery if you could find a level 2 charge option near your apartment or workplace and leave it to charge overnight/during the day once or twice a week, but any EV pack is warrantied for 100,000 miles, so you have some peace of mind there even if you go the Supercharging/fast charging route. Also, specifically thinking of the Bolt EV, it has a very conservative DC charge rate and even those who regularly fast charge it have seen 150,000+ miles with only 5-10% of the original range lost.
@@plugandplayEV thanks , I would only charge like every 2 weeks because my job is like 8 min from me, also the warranty covers the battery for 8 years or 100k miles so I think I should be ok
Waching this 2 years later. There's definitely less per minute states now. As well as the rate per kw has changed. Interesting to see it 2 years later.
Thanks, most do seem to have made the change to the fairer price per kWh/energy delivered model, but there are still a few holdouts. Last time I checked, we would still be charged for time in New Hampshire, after being charged by energy in the neighboring states.
I charge my Bolt at my lvl 2 charger, plus I definitely like the regen 1 pedal driving experience. It's not a Tesla, but definitely not a LEAF either! and Zero to 60 at 6.7 is no turtle. Definitely love the torque, gets up and goes! Hopefully Navarra will let the Bolt charge faster & hopefully 300 mile range with the next gen, then it will definitely be a winner! It does everything that the M3 & the Y Can do for a lot less!
the very first time i charged my 2017 Bolt last September i went from almost nothing to 180 miles in about 50 minutes. I want to say it was charging over 60 kW at one point but i'm not sure. I charge at home now at night and I never think about it.
Thanks for the perspective. This is something that critics often overlook: some people just don't need their Bolt EV to be a long-range car, so the fast charging speed doesn't matter to them. As a workhorse for the week and regional driving, there really isn't a better value vehicle around. If you can plug in at home that's even more true. But for travel on long trips at speed, the Bolt will clearly show its drawbacks.
66 kWh's.... really? What do I make of this? I thought a buffer was held to help preserve the battery. It seems like GM allows you to charge to the full capacity of the battery. Or, is the capacity really higher, but GM simply advertises usable energy?
Losses to heat, cooling, and other systems running the car. Most manufacturers advertise the nominal pack capacity but the amount the driver can access is usually a bit lower than that, even if there's no significant buffer.
GM doesn't use buffers though it will park you before it completely goes dead. Might only have a couple % left. I've noticed a comment I ran across by a GM rep that the Ultium system is similar, no real buffer. And they don't care if you go to 100%. Apparently a non issue as the effect on the battery is minimal.
What sucks is, at this current time, a trip I take up north has nothing but 50kw chargers, and like 2 of them. So possibly, ironically, the bolt might be faster than the ioniq.
It's definitely a big leveler once you get away from the main cross-country routes and big cities. The I5 would still be the better option, as it would hold the almost 50kW power for most of the charge session where as the Bolt would taper off in the upper half of the pack, but charge times would certainly be much closer. Thankfully, 125-150kW hardware seems to be the minimum requirement for most new installations, so it's just a matter of waiting for the funding to flow through to these new sites in most places.
Thanks. The app is called Torque Pro, available on Android, data via OBDII reader. For Apple devices, I think most I've seen use a similar app called Engine Link. Congrats on your new Bolt⚡⚡
I checked all those boxes except the nap for this session... too much construction going on for that! Remember, though, that this is older EV tech used in a way very few people travel. Current EVs will charge to 80% in 15-30 minutes, so you'll be on your way quicker than the line in a Dunkin will serve you =)
What's the exact battery threshold where it goes from 3 bars to 2 bars, 2 bars to 1 flashing bar, and one flashing bar to no bars? This would be good to know in an emergency. From the looks of it, it seems as though 0 bars is not quite 0%.
Right, each bar is 5% but the bottom bar disappearing simply indicates that final 5% of the pack, rather than 0%. The app will show a specific percentage, but the easiest way to tell for anyone who wants to push it that low would be to set up the OBDII reader and go off the "SOC Raw" (Raw State of Charge) number displayed.
@@plugandplayEV I looked into setting up the app to get a more precise battery management, but balked when I learned that it requires paying a recurring monthly fee for OnStar service, once the free trial expires. I'm not going to pay an extra $20-40 per month just to get a more precise battery measurement.
@@ab-tf5fl Haven't done that ourselves either, just the regular "Remote Command" features in the MyChevy app that are free for several years (at least for us, I know that changed over various model years). But the app is poor anyway, so something like Torque Pro or A Better Route Planner do a much better job of feeding live % SOC data.
It wasn't on a single charge, so I can't really assign a mile total or kWh number to the previous driving, no. The 4.1 mi/kWh is pretty indicative of our driving in mid-spring though, so 260-270 miles wouldn't be far off.
So I run 800 miles in one overnight trip each month to visit my elderly parents. I generally charge only enough to make it to the next EA and it’s 12 cents per KWH. I like to stop at 50 % soc, and get down the road. Less time charging but more stops.
Bargain! We can only get it down to those levels when a free charger and only per minute EA states are involved. It would be interesting to run the same trip every month and compare stats by season and road conditions. We have the Boston to Ohio route, but only two to three times a year and we often mix up the journey between upstate NY and PA, so it's rarely an exact comparison.
@@plugandplayEV so I have a lot of these stats saved and I need to put them together and make a video. The new ioniq 5 changes everything with only one stop of 18 minutes needed now each way.
It's a good question, but any answer related to 100% EV adoption would be pure guesswork. The reality is that full EV uptake is unlikely to arrive in the next decade, so a more reasonable analysis would look at something like 50% adoption. But the short answer at that ratio is no, electric fuel won't exceed gas prices at that level. The diversity of generation sources for electricity, from hydro and wind/solar to natural gas, nuclear, and other fossil fuel options, means that we can spread the risk and defray cost of generation. Individuals can even take things into their own hands by investing in home solar and battery storage, so they control the cost of their electricity. Meanwhile, the cost of oil exploration, refinement, shipping, and final delivery to gas stations is only going in one direction. And there's simply no way to put a long term fueling solution in your driveway, for gas.
I was reading that in California, having the biggest concentration of EVs, they only use about 1% of the power. And I would assume the vast majority of that is off peak.
I would never discharge my Bolt to zero (or one) percent, and I wouldn't DCF charge to 100% either. I might level 2 charge at home to 100% before a long trip, but I ordinarily charge to 80% because I almost never need 100%, and the last 20% is slower and stresses the battery more. From 10% to 80% is a more realistic test of charging time on long trips, and it takes a bit less than an hour. I've never driven far enough on a trip to need to add more than 100 miles of range, which takes half an hour. If I ever drive more than 300 miles in a day, I'll plan on stopping for an hour every three or four hours, but I'm close enough to a major airport (Atlanta) that driving much more than 500 miles usually makes less sense than flying.
Right, per the disclaimer I'm the description, this was done purely to gather the data and share why the final 10-20% charging is rarely a good idea on DC fast chargers, especially with the Bolt EV. Based on my travels, there are plenty of adventurous Bolt drivers out there who just love to take the car across long distances. Understanding the various levels of power at any given state of charge hopefully helps new Bolt drivers with that same penchant make better DCFC choices on the road. Thanks for the input 👍
@@plugandplayEV You're right, of course. I enjoyed the video, but I'm a contrarian by nature, so I rarely write an agreeable comment. :) Someday, I'll take a 500+ mile trip to see what it's like, but if I took these trips routinely, I probably wouldn't own a Bolt and might not own any EV at this point though if I could charge at 150 kW and use the Tesla network, an EV still seems practical now. For my needs, a Bolt is eminently practical, and I love it. I've only had my Bolt for a few weeks, and I take shorter road trips several times a week.
Contrarians are the heart of healthy debate, keep right at it! Your points are exactly what people should aim for in the real world... excesses like deep discharging and fully charging on a fast charger should probably stay right where they are: here on RUclips so that they don't disrupt everyday EV drivers!
Will be interesting to see the US version charge curve after a lot of Euro coverage. IONIQ 5 seems to go as hard as it can until battery temp leaves acceptable parameters, throttles power until back in preferred range, then hits the juice again. Can't wait to see how that translates to cold weather charging conditions here
GM needs to change that charge rate. I never saw higher than 46 kw with my Bolt no matter how low soc. I’m spoiled with my Model 3. I add 170 miles of range in 15 minutes @ 250 kw chargers when I start around 5% SOC.
Not gonna happen on the Bolt any time soon, unfortunately. GM is saving the real DCFC tech for its Ultium vehicles (Lyriq, Hummer EV, Silverado EV) and keeping the Bolt range cheap and cheerful. Unfortunately, that means skimping on internal hardware upgrades that would make it possible to charge the car 2-3x faster.
@@evgrandpa365 As long as the long road trips mean more than 400 miles a day. An hour to charge for a 400 miles road trip isn't too much. You drive 200 miles in the first leg and then you charge twice 30 minutes for the next 2 x 100 miles legs.
@@voldar70 I think the Bolt is a great car for around town and. Commuting 200 miles round trip without charging. I don’t think GM built it for long range driving. But it is still one of my favorite ev’s
I think it’s great for long and short comments. You just need to have patience for road trips. As long as you aren’t taking one every month or week I would enjoy this car.
It's too bad Chevy has not upgraded the charging for the bolt. It would be such a great little car if it could charge at 120 or 150 KW. My car will go from 10% to 50% in 10 minutes. 10% to 90% is 35 minutes
It still holds up for many use cases, given the fact that some model years can be obtained for half the price of a competitor with similar range. I know folks who have never fast charged, as well as some who don't need them for long trips beyond 300-350 miles or so. In those cases, the fast charge rate makes no difference and it's a very practical, affordable little hatchback with good range. The flip side is obviously folks like my family, who use it as the primary car, and now have CCS-equipped options on the market that will charge to 80% far quicker. Unlikely that we'll stick with a Bolt beyond 2022 for that reason.
@@plugandplayEV very true my car charges like a boss but 95% of the time I'm charging at home overnight anyway so the bolt is a good value for people that aren't excessive road trippers you're certainly correct.
Eric of News Coulomb charged his Bolt almost completely using DCFC charging and at 150k miles concluded he less than 8% total degradation. He has had the battery changed out due to the replacement program recently.
If that's already available, I think it makes sense for a certain type of traveler. We have family members who appreciate electric vehicles but want to crank out hundreds of miles in as few hours as possible. For them, their older gas cars tend to be the primary option for long trips. With kids and pets, though, we're stopping regardless and charging doesn't disrupt too much.
Coming from a Volt which had a max charge of 7kW, 50kW will probably feel awesome for a couple of hours. But knowing that the Ioniq 5 could do 6x that, it will pale pretty soon. Of course in the Volt, you could Cannonball probably 10 hours faster than a Tesla Model S plaid just by ignoring the battery altogether, Bolt doesnt have that option.
Yeah, it's an interesting evolution on two fronts, where electric range has become the advantage of a full BEV, improving their utility over PHEV for local use, but also fast charge times attempting to get close to gas fill ups to rival combustion away from home. The likes of the eGMP cars and Lucid Air get closer on the latter, but sheer energy density still works in favor of the PHEV. Totally depends on use case, really. Regular long trips? A PHEV or fast-charging EV will be the pick. Mostly local use and ability to charge at home? An efficient BEV with 250+ miles starts to make more sense.
@@plugandplayEV Yeah, I had my Accord for 13 years and made 1 out of state trip with it. Even if I took 1 trip per year, the difference in price between the I5 Limited and the Bolt Premier comes out to about $500 extra cost per minute of charge time saved over ten years. Not that thats a completely fair comparison, theres a lot more differences between them than just charge rate.
In car display there is a 8amp and 12am option. What does this mean. I’m in LA and just got a 2018 bolt. I use EVgo network chargers. What is the most efficient setting to use for this charging network. I’m New to this and really don’t know what the 8 or 12 amp options are for.
Hi Armando. 8 amp / 12 amp options only relate to level 1 charging with a portable cable that plugs into a regular household outlet. You probably have one that came with the car. If you use that to charge at home, setting to 12 amps will give you a bit more power but you'll need to ensure the circuit the charger is using can take that extra load. The setting doesn't have any impact on DC fast chargers or anything else you'll need with EVgo.
@@arandomyoutubechannel2940 Agreed. Except for the inevitable battery degradation that any phone experiences, the 3a is still performing as well as the day it came out of the box. Previous three all had significantly diminished performance at 2-3 year mark. Have to go back to the Nexus 5 before that to find one that compares.
I wanted a M3 or MY but the price was about half for the Bolt 2021. Now Tesla has raised the price so the new tax rebates are all wiped out. What a game of Wack a mole. I have not needed DC charging yet and have 4,000 miles. The cost is also 3x higher than the .11 I pay at home which is a big disincentive to use DC fast charging.
Tesla flirted with the Bolt's early price range of $35-40k in 2019, but quickly moved back to competing in the Audi/BMW mid-level premium area. Nothing wrong with that given the tech of the cars and Tesla's EV advantage, but it did make the Bolt and Leaf the only affordable options for a time. The ID.4 changes that a little bit, especially with the current tax credit situation and three years free charging, but Tesla seems likely to remain a higher-end option until the rumored $25k arrives. The Bolt certainly gives up plenty in terms of charging speed and interior quality, but it's a very capable EV for most local/regional use cases and represents great value, once the recall inconveniences are finally resolved.
@@plugandplayEV We get good value from Bolt 2021 and it is fun to be in the EV driving experience which most people have never experienced. Buyers of expensive EVs have also paid the price as early adopters as they have seen their share of EV issues. As for now I have had no problems with the Bolt and hope GM gets production going again in 2022
Definitely a better option in that scenario. 60 minutes at per minute rates would cost you $7.20 + tax here in Mass, so more than $1/kWh! Clearly shows the less equitable side of per minute pricing.
i have a 2020 bolt and i do really like it, but to honest i only purchased it because i have solar that produces much more than i need about 8 months out of the year. i dont think i would have purchased it if i didnt have, basically, free electricity to put in it. my previous car was a hyundai elantra that got 35-40mpg and doing the math i just dont see how you will ever recoup the premium you pay for an ev. its also a huge inconvenience to me, when i travel, to only get a 200mile range then wait an hour to charge and maybe get 150mi range, even worse in the winter. my elantra had a 400 mile range and takes 5 minutes to refuel to get another 400 miles. i personally think that ev's are great if you dont travel much. if you travel, get a 40mpg gas car. just another fact, ev's also cost more to plate and insure.
Thanks for the honest perspective, Dan. It's appreciated to hear someone who prefers the efficient gas option offer a reasoned response, rather than just dismiss EVs out of hand. I think it also comes down to *how* you travel, as well as the range and charging ability of the vehicle. My brother-in-law has your requirements, for example, and wants to crank out 600+ miles in a day with as few stops as possible. His Volt works best for him to have cheap, efficient electric driving locally and quick gas refills on road trips. With kids and a dog, we're stopping every 125-150 miles anyway for restrooms and food or exercise. Cranking out 400 miles in a sitting is never going to happen for us, so an EV fits into that travel style. We'd enjoy a quicker charge rate so that quick 15-20 minute breaks are also an option, but the frequency of stops is going to happen one way or another. Factor in almost no maintenance and free charging on road trips and the cost savings are significant.
@@plugandplayEV of course you are right, everyone has their own particular needs, wants and beliefs. who am i to tell people what to buy. we should all have the freedom to make our own choices, which sadly are diminishing with out of control government. i would love to know how to get free charging, please let me know.
Volta Charging is one option, if they're in your area. It's an ad-supported network that typically installs at malls, grocery stores and movie theaters. Then there's the "Requires Fee" filter on Plugshare, which when unchecked shows all free stations. Electrify America also waives charging fees on select dates, such as Earth Day or the recent July 4th holiday weekend. Planning a full video of the subject at some point but those are the most common ways we've found.
Have to think about this. Smartphones supposedly charge fast now but now a an ev can charge faster ... thats really something. DC charging for phones please lol
It comes down to the car's battery management system, not so much the charging network or hardware. Assuming the station is capable of giving the Bolt's maximum of 55kW, roughly the same taper you see here will occur. Other models obviously differ, including 2017-2019 Bolts that haven't had the recall update, but on a capable charge station it's usually the vehicle defining the charge power from the station, rather than the other way around.
It takes so long to charge over 80 and 90 percent it is a waste of time. It's better to stop more frequently, besides you never know if the next charger is working or not.
I'd agree most of the time, except that we just finished a 550 mile drive day with a couple of 90% charge sessions that worked out perfectly. The first crossed lunchtime and the other we grabbed dinner, in which case 60 minutes is pretty standard (at least with two kids). In both cases, the car was ready before we were.
@@plugandplayEV I hear ya, but to the uninitiated that extra time might be a waste. I know I'm too cautious but I also don't dare go so low on state of charge, 1 percent is pushing your luck.
Why does the new Chevy Bolt still charge at only 55 kW, when the VW ID.4 and Mach-E charges so much faster? GM really hasn't done an impressive job speeding up the charging times for the new Chevy 2022 Bolt.
Nope, they chose to get the price down into the low 30s rather than stump up for more capable internals for the Bolt range. So the EV and EUV come in with the lowest MSRP of any 250 mile electric car on the market, but unimpressive DCFC rates and still no AWD. Buyers will decide what matters most, I guess?
@@daviddrake6875 It depends what compliance means to you. Leaf was a compliance car. The Bolt EV with a range of over 300 miles during summer in city driving and with a 30-45 minutes charge to drive 350 miles to your camp site, I don't call it an appliance.
@@daviddrake6875 GM wasn't too far behind Tesla in running out of tax credits and still producing them. Ramping up with a waiting line. And 260 mile range. I don't classify it as a compliance car as they have continually incrementally improved it. Last I heard the EUV was going to be exported to Brazil. What I would say is GM was determined to create a better cell with a better cost margin and that is the Ultium cell and chassis, booth being designed as modular, as the leap forward. Meanwhile the Bolt is the best range for the price and a solid car. The interface was designed well enough that it will go on to the Ultium system without major changes.
@@kujo49 Hopefully it has a better BMS. The last was so bad they could not pinpoint which cells were defective and went into thermal run away, so had to change the whole battery. Again because it was a compliance car. The only reason it is so good is that Chevrolet engineers put their jobs on the line to make I to so.
Yep, the temps aren't too hot or too cold in this session, so it's almost as good as it gets in a Bolt EV. The limitation here, aside from the fact that the BEV 2 platform is now more than five years old and will soon be replaced by Ultium, is supposed to be the wiring/charge port hardware. GM has shown no interest in upgrading that equipment or raising the DCFC rate in Bolt, preferring to keep the model a cheap and cheerful budget EV, so newer (more expensive) models inevitably beat it on those specs.
Well, it's not often the Bolt wins on charging but this would certainly be one of them! I'd love to drive a 500e though... seems like a fun town runaround and the new European update looks pretty slick.
Yeah, I guess find a free level 2 at that point and enjoy some complimentary electrons! Or a friendly local Nissan dealer? Either way, you have a place in the early days of EV adoption for your patience! ⚡⚡
Yep, nothing has improved on the DC charging side. It's 55kW peak and a gradual taper down throughout the upper half of the pack. AC charging did improve to 11kW but that's only handy in limited scenarios.
1hr and 48 minutes to charge!? LOL, EVs are so broken. I'm gladly fill up my 15MPG Hummer in 3 minutes than waste my life around EV charging stations. Tesla is so far ahead of the competition.
Disclaimer: This is *not* the way to do it! Charging to 100% is not representative of how long it typically takes an EV to DC fast charge. The Bolt EV is an older design and limited when it comes to DCFC; nonetheless, our charge stops on long trips are usually 40-50 minutes.
The new EVs mentioned in the video are closer to 30-40 minutes, while Tesla, Kia-Hyundai, and Porsche/Audi get things down to 15-20 minutes. Technology is moving fast and we're close to the point where road trip delays will be minimal compared to combustion, while locally most EV owners will actually save time by simply plugging in at home, at work, or while running errands.
I own a 2019 chevy bolt and what you said above really depends on the temperature outside and from what percentage to what percentage you are charging. At 22celcius I went from around 30 to 80 percent in 54 minutes... sometimes I get 30 minutes from 20 to 80 percent only on warmer days. In level 3
true but if you have to use the range and need 100% its something to be aware of. its the worst tier fast charging. my kona gets 75kw up to 80% then slows to 50kw. i would be unhappy if it were slower.
@@danielroden9424 For sure, there are locations and scenarios where the next fast charger (or destination) is going to push every mile of range and the upper 10-20% of the pack is a necessary evil. Hopefully that ends up being a sit-down meal stop and the charge rate becomes less important.
The main thing is that potential EV owners don't watch this and think "oh, I have to wait more than an hour every 200 miles, that's not happening!"
I’m 55 all of my adult life I’ve been in this huge hurry on trips. I made the decision to buy a Chevrolet Bolt ev 2023. I had to travel to show i could. after few months had a good selection of charging locations. I have discovered a new joy in never noticed before. Not being in a hurry taking a breath 30-45 minutes charging and i love it!
I would never watch someone fill up their gas tank yet I find these charging videos to be fascinating. Thanks for sitting around so long to make this happen!
Bolt EV drivers are surprisingly intrepid and patient. Despite the slow charging speeds, Bolt EVs get road tripped like crazy.
Indeed, it's a bit into the weeds but I think the fact that EVs are new tech and developing every year keeps it fresh...for now!
That development is sort of emphasized by the Bolt EV, which a few short years ago could charge (slightly) faster than most of the public CCS infrastructure. With the Model 3 at $40k, then V3 Supercharging + Electrify America's expansion and other networks adding 100kW+ charging, that quickly flipped and made the Bolt's hardware the pinch point.
On the subject of trip patience, we have an interview coming up with a Bolt owner who drove it from Mass. to Arizona, then switched to a Model Y for his distance EV and took it back East. His travel style was actually right in line with the Bolt (400-500 mile drive days, long breaks for food and rest), but he found the ease of use of the Tesla ecosystem the big difference-maker. As the public network improves, I can see even the Bolt matching certain types of road trip drive styles, and at a very accessible price point.
@@plugandplayEV I'm hoping that GM makes a ton more Bolt EV/EUVs for the refreshed version. They'll be a very useful component of the EV transition as they enter the secondary market at a very reasonable price point. Over an hour for 10-80% won't ever work for mass appeal as a primary car but for people interested in an EV as a second vehicle for use around town at $10k it should get snapped up.
'I use mine as a daily commuter back and forth to work . The only issue I have is the current recall. And am thinking of returning to a ice vehicle. Do to the inconvenience
Tbh when a race car gets refilled with fuel and you can see how fast the fuel is flowing, that’s fascinating. 18 gallons in 7 seconds
What's the app you're using on the phone that showed the 1.1% of the battery? That's cool too have.
We've had our 2017 Premier Bolt for a week and we are loving it. We charge it at level 1, but that works great for us. At 12 amps we reach a full charge overnight, if it's already 1/2 full. I've been driving just because it's so much fun to drive 1 pedal driving. Thanks for all your help. My wife is also loving it. Hugs Steve
Great to hear, congratulations Steve! We did the first couple of years with only L1 at 12A and it worked okay. Lots of local charging kept us topped up and overnight L1 easily got us to 100% ahead of road trips. Definitely prefer L2 for the driveway, but L1 is viable for low mile daily driving. Look forward to hearing more about your Bolting!
Dear Steve, We love our 2017 Bolt that we have had for 3-3/4 years now. We use the same 12 amp charger for daily overnight and we use hilltop reserve so the battery only charges to 88% that way the battery life is extended and it's safer. Long trips are easy if you change your habits and charge with breakfest, lunch and possibly dinner and then make sure your hotel has level 2 charging and it's usually free overnight. We can usually travel around 600 miles a day that way with 2 long full 100% charging stops and the overnight 100% charge. Oh and FYI we only charge to 100% on long trips if the distance to the next stop calls for it and we make sure we have plenty of safety net charge just in case the charger is not working and we have to travel to another charger. We use PlugShare as our trip planner, we find it's better than the MyChevy app. PlugShare also shows you elevation changes as they can effect your range a lot. Have fun.
@@Jeff-wb3hh Thank you for your welcomed advice. We are in central Illinois and we have to curb ourselves from charging the batteries too full, too often. I know the car will last longer, if we only charge to 80- 90 %, but the urge to charge it to full is still a strong temptation. The guess-o-meter already is reading 300 miles per charge on full, I just need to remember I'm retired, this car is for the wife to get back and forth from work, but I love gallivanting so much, and so I find myself recharging .. It's an obsession. I feel like I'm a kid, again.
Steve, yes charging at Level 1 is very manageable for many and should not be a deterrent when thinking about an EV purchase. Everyone’s situation is different of course. It’s really nice to charge nightly and to avoid gas stations for fuel. Electric ⚡️ is a much better experience. ✅
I'm so with you Steve! I'm a happy Bolter, too, really love the car - and was disheartened to hear about all those recent Bolt fires. I don't want anything like that to happen to my Eva, so I am following GM's recommendations and try not to charge her overnight or leave her unattended when charging. Also, most of my driving is local, so keeping her charged at about 80% works just fine for me.
8:30 50%
10:40 per minute vs per kwh
11:10 taper pretty visible at 70%
14:15 paying per minute makes the 2nd 1/2 cost 2x the 1st 1/2
16:10 takeaways
Really good video for ppl learning about fast charging.
KEY FOR LONG TRIPS: have big enough battery that length of each trip leg allows you to stay in bottom 60% of your pack and avoid taper/slow charging.
A bigger battery is only going to make your car more expensive to operate especially during long trips. A fool and their money is easily parted holds more true with each passing year. Lmao
Hopeless consumers
@@samusaran7317 so go back to gas...
@@TedKidd I own both thanks. I just see reality unlike most people.
@@samusaran7317 and I'm on electric cars number four and five.
Haven't had a gas car since 2015.
Took my Bolt on a 700 mile round trip and it was a disaster
Took my model 3 on a 3300 mi trip and it was amazing.
Took my model y on a 4800 MI trip in March and it was a blast.
Appreciate the video! Despite having an ICEV available we seem to always want to take the Bolt on road trips. Something about the more leisurely pace and going point to point makes it feel shorter even if actually takes longer. Sure our next EV will charge 3-4x faster, but I bet one day we look back nostalgically at these early days. Back when we had to plan our stops and wait, before there was 500 kW off every exit and the world went and got in one big hurry.
Thanks! We feel very similar, with the slight caveat that there are some scenarios where getting back on the road after 20-30 minutes would be preferable... when there's nothing much at the charge location, for example, or traveling solo and 400+ miles into a long trip. From families to tourists, I think there are plenty of scenarios where slowing the trip down and adding more breaks certainly makes it more pleasant, without adding major delays to the trip.
I have been doing my cross country drive and drive through 7 states so far! I am loving life and not feeling so tired after long trips. Stopping to recharge also helps us humans recharge too! I take naps or go on walks while my bolt is on the charger.
I agree too. I don't think I'd want to drive beyond the 200-mile range without stopping, even in a gas car. However, there are some caveats:
1) We need more reliable charging infrastructure. Needing to try several chargers to find one that works is never good.
2) Waiting 20 minutes for someone else to finish a charge, then waiting again to charge your own car sucks. We need more capacity at busy charging sites.
3) Sometimes, the place with the food I want doesn't have a charger, and the place with the charger doesn't have my type of food, thereby necessitating separate stops for food and recharging. Being able to get the car charging stop over and done with in 10 minutes is nice, given that I just stopped for a longer break anyway.
4) DCFC coverage in rural areas away from interstate highways is nearly non-existent, which should be fixed.
Thank you very much. That was faster than I thought at 1 hour and 49 minutes, from essentially 0% state of charge to 100%. When I go on long trips, I usually charge my 2017 Bolt (bought new in Sept 2017) from 20% to 100% and it takes about 1 hour and 30 minutes at a 150kW station and it is fine with me because I always have a nice relaxing breakfest, lunch or dinner with each full charge, no problem. I hate rushing. Of course I try not to let it go below 15% when road tripping. It's nice to see that going from 0% to 100% does not take much longer.
Thanks Jeff, glad it's of interest. As you know (but it's worth noting in case others read), the step down of the 2017-'19 models means it would take longer to get that final 20% than a 2020 or later model year.
However, the post-recall update looks like it will also bring the gradual taper to those earlier years, so hopefully this video applies to every former model year once they have they update performed. Look forward to seeing how that plays out in real-world charging this next few months as people hit the road again.
@@plugandplayEV That is more good news that the battery "fix" update for the 2017 model will possibly bring the same faster charging curve as the later models. It would be nice if the update also brought the ability to charge anywhere from 50% to 100% instead of just having Hilltop Reserve which charges to 89%, but I don't think it will. I'll be getting the "fix" update early next week.
2 hours and counting with the new battery pack
Congrats! 🎉 Hope it continues well for years to come.
Thanks for this. We just got a 2021 bolt and are loving it. Its going to be my wife’s daily commuter and used for occasional road trips from Seattle to Portland or Vancouver. I installed a L2 charger for home last year. Hope to keep the car a long time
Thanks and congrats. Sounds like the perfect use case for the car. Daily driver use is ideally matched to the one-pedal driving and nippy acceleration, while regional travel is really not much different to faster-charging EVs. With L2 at home, you'll probably only think about the range a few times a year at most. Happy Bolting!
Hey Steve - thanks for taking one for the Team (Bolt owners)! I know I could never sit and wait for 100% while sitting on a fast charger. That’s just too much lost time. But if you can find a way to space out the charging stops at about 80-120 miles (10-60%) depending on terrain and weather, the Bolt travels ok, and you’re not really held back by charging time, unless you’re trying to cover more than 500 miles in a day, or you frequently take longer trips.
It was a real hardship, Dennis... I even had to get great coffee and my sandwich of choice from a favorite lunch spot to make it through...!
It really does emphasize the timing aspect of fast charging though. Knowing the car's profile and when it's time to move on is a big part of optimizing journey time.
Who goes to zero miles and who goes to 100% on a public charger? Both ends tend to be much slower. And I'll guess 10% or less charge this way unless they have a DCFC close to work or something. And few will ever need to have that much charge to get to the next charger. It does happen, as I charged to 90% for winter cold/snow tires range the other day and just made it home with the 260 mile battery.
@@kujo49 - I think this story was about taking one for the team (how long will it take?) as the Bolt charges very slowly past about 70%, and a typical Bolt owner just won’t go there. Someone who is on a trip would never charge to 100% unless they absolutely needed it to make the distance to the next available charger. We do figure out that the 2+ hours of your life that you’d lose - on a good day - just isn’t worth it.
I've never taken two hours. 1 hour or when I get back from eating. I don't go to down '0' or to 100%.
@@kujo49 - agree that 1 hour of charging will add about 50% to a starting charge level of 15-20%. But that last 30-35% on a fast charger just isn’t worth waiting for in a Bolt.
Great video. Lots of data, thanks for doing this. The Bolt ramps down HARD. The price per min difference is crazy too.
Cheers Derek. It certainly gets low later on in the pack, but it's an improvement in the old step-down model where we lost chunks of charging power at halfway and two-thirds point for no real reason. Just generally a vehicle that you need a bit more patience with than the current crop of EVs. But then we did a trip around England in a Type 2/22-kW max Renault Zoe, so I guess that's us!
Keeping the charge between 20 and 80% is usually the best for time and charge rate.
The battery charge rate taper is generally not worth the wait.
Totally agree. It's marginally better than before if you absolutely have to have the range, but generally much better to get on the road, use some more juice, and plug in again well below 50% where possible.
Thank you for the video, it explains greatly what the Bolt EUV is.
But, it should be noted, a trip of 400 miles in the Bolt EV/EUV is very well doable with about 1 hour of charging session. 200 miles on the first leg @ 70 mph is very doable, then the rest of the 200 miles, split the charging session in two : 35 mins from 10 tp 55% is enough for 120 miles and 25 mins for the last 80 miles. I don't think this would be a problem for the majority of people.
And I hear talking about waiting after a Bolt EV at a DCFC - well, not many are the EV who charge on 150 kW DCFC. Most of them are looking at 350 kW. I doubt a Bolt EV will be the bottle-neck, unless all the 350 kW are not working.
Thanks, I would agree. I now make the distinction between long-distance road trips and regional trips... over 500 miles is a big drive day and can drag in a Bolt unless you're sightseeing, but the journey you describe is a natural fit for a short snack stop and the meal time that it inevitably crosses.
From Boston, 400 miles gets us to every location in New England, down to NYC/Philly, up to Montreal, almost to Niagara Falls... all in the time it takes to do a regular journey with a leg stretch and short meal break.
Great to see. As you mentioned, almost no one would ever do that, but I always wondered how long it would take. :-)
In almost 5 years owning our Bolt, we've fast charged less than 20 times. Usually we are 30%+50% and charge to 85%. Takes 45 minutes to an hour, and usually while we are eating, so it hasn't been an issue for us.
Thanks, yours is a great example of why the Bolt's DCFC "limitations" aren't always a failing. For those who mostly use it for local duty - or even those on regional road trips or who enjoy longer pit stops - 50kW is a perfectly workable maximum.
Good rundown, thanks for taking the time to do the full charge!
Thanks Brian, appreciate the watch and comment!
Thanks for sharing. I usually aim for 60% SOC (55-65) when road tripping my 2020 Bolt. Rarely charge above 70% on DC Fast Chargers unless it will save me an extra stop before reaching my destination for the day. Even then you’re probably better off doing an extra stop in the middle to put in an extra 10-15% rather than waiting to charge to 80+%
Right, when the charge rate is half what it can be in the upper portion vs. lower portion of the pack, it makes more sense to get that full power whenever you can. Some time has to be factored in for getting off the Interstate and finding the additional charge location, but if that's only a few minutes then it's still a better option.
Thanks for posting. I’ve been anxiously waiting for this since you posted about it a while back on Instagram .
Good to know, thanks! Sorry about the wait... May turned out to be absolutely crammed with filming opportunities, so June will be about actually publishing the backlog.
Havn’t needed even lvl2 charging even though I have it mostly set up in my garage! 2020 Bolt Premier and driving all the time as I am retired! Just going to work someone would only need to charge occasionally!
A regular outlet can certainly work in some use cases, as the Bolt is pretty efficient and the juice goes a long way, especially around town. There will always be the potential to need a quicker top up though (we found it was tough in winter, for example), where access to L2 -- or even nearby DCFC -- is a valuable resource.
I’m sorry, and I love all EVs but this made me so thankful for superchargers. It quite litterally takes me like 15 minutes to go from ~10%-70%. No initial ramping.
That's okay, just not a direct comparison given the dated tech of the Bolt. More accurate will be something like an EV6 or IONIQ 5, which will be a similar price range to Model 3/Y and will hit 200+ kW for a time. Will be interesting to see how those charge curves and time compare, for sure.
@@plugandplayEV I agree! I’d love to see those! The only last comment I had was the prices seem a bit high $0.31-0.33/kWh, where a supercharger in my area (NH) is closer to $0.26/kWh. Anyways, happy so many people are getting on the EV train regaurdless of Bolt or Tesla or Hyundai!
Yep, electric is electric and any model is a step up from ICE! I'd say the price for public DCFC will almost always be higher than a private network. Expect to see the same with the Rivian Adventure Network, where the premium price of the vehicle offsets a low price for charging (probably similar to Supercharger rates, after a period of free use).
Also important to remember that several new models now come with 2-3 years free EA charging, which will make the overall cost for charging per mile very good over the lifetime of those cars.
I can see EV's bringing people together. In the future, charging stations will charge your battery in 15 minutes or less. If you think about a rest stop or gas station we have today, you could transform those places into so many different layouts and lounge areas. Marketing will change entirely as most people will need to stick around for at least 15 minutes and they will inevitably buy something besides electricity!
It makes a lot of sense, Beau, and could actually change how places like service plazas are set up. Going to the restrooms and dining areas are typically separate from the gassing up part right now, whereas charge stations are typically part of the parking lot. So you plug in and spend that "gas time" in the main plaza instead, which equates to more spending for the main dining area and stores.
@@plugandplayEV this may be inappropriate but I can just see the cannabis industry taking advantage of this. Pull over to charge for 20 mins, go into the smokers lounge and then take off in your fully autonomous vehicle 😆
I just saw a video by "Out of Spec Reviews" and it took the Mustang Mack-E 2 hours and 32 minutes to charge from 1 to 100% with an 99kW battery with a maximum charging speed rating of 150kW! ! ! That makes the 2020 Bolt's 66kW battery and max charging speed of 50kW and a 0% to 100% charging speed of 1 hour and 47 minutes pretty good !
True, but we can go further on 80% of the Mach-E's extended pack than 100% of the Bolt's, so it's not all about the time. Just means that it's even more important to bail on the session when you hit 80% in a Mach-E! I suspect that will be fixed OTA some time this year by Ford.
@@plugandplayEV True. I guess a better test would be the time to get to 80%. The 80% range of the Mach-E extended range is around 240 miles and the range of the 2020-2022 Bolt EV with an 80% charge is 207 miles. Only a 33 mile difference, interesting. Based on your and "Out of Spec Reviews" test the time it takes to get to 80% for the Mach-E is 49 minutes and the Bolt is 71 minutes. A 22 minute difference. Depending on your budget and how often your going to go on road trips would factor into to your choice. I guess it boils down to what is important to each person. There are so many factors to weigh, it helps to have reviewers like you and others to help give us the real world facts.
Happy these are of use and the feedback has certainly been positive in the week the video has been up.
From our travels, I find we broadly have two kinds of stops: 1) those where we use the facilities, grab small supplies (convenience store) + stretch legs briefly, and 2) those where we want to sit down and eat or shop (groceries). For #2, even the Bolt's charging curve is fine. It's a 45-60 minute activity and the car is ready to go before we are.
It's #1 where the disconnect happens and we're waiting for the Bolt. As those stops tend to be around 20-25 minutes (because kids), even a Mach-E would still leave us some time to kill until 80%. It would take a Tesla or Ioniq 5 / Kia EV6 power level to have the car ready before we get back.
Thanks for this! You are braver than I by driving that low. I've read a few reports of some folks suddenly going from less than 5% to no propulsion. Also nice to see an actual 66kWh 2020 (mine is about 63). In the forums I follow, 66 is rare. For all those lamenting the lack of charging improvements, they need to keep in mind this is still a great entry level EV, with the older BEV2 battery tech. Hopefully we will eventually see a BEV3 successor.
Ha, thanks! I did actually read after this, on one of the forums, someone losing propulsion when they thought they had several percent left... not something we hear a lot of but reinforces the need for a buffer when traveling.
The lowest we've got on the road is 3% in the 2017 and 4% in the 2020. The GOM always seems to be accurate and gives you until the last 15 miles or so before just reading "Low" and urging you to find some electrons asap.
On the charge rate, I bump between the two opinions. On one hand, we probably won't stay in a Bolt EV because of the improvements in newer models that don't cost that much more after incentives. On the other, the value of a Bolt in meeting the vast majority of daily driver requirements is unmatched. I'd be sad not to have one in the driveway and wouldn't rule out adding one again as a second vehicle if they remain in the $10-15k used bracket.
The power it takes to charge includes charging losses.
So 66 kwh used likely means 58 kwh was added to the pack.
Unlikely the losses amounted to quite that much. System efficiency on these 150kW DC stations is estimated at 95-98%, so perhaps 3-4 kWh at most.
But yes, not everything goes to the pack itself. We did have a smidge left at 1% though, so it's not far off the rated capacity of 66kWh when all is said and done.
@@plugandplayEV
I tracked charging on my Bolt and Tesla and it seemed to be 10-12%.
Granted, that wasn't DC charging.
@@TedKidd Right, I've always heard mid 80s to low 90s efficiency for L2. The figures for DCFC come from manufacturer review papers in Germany and the US. Not marketing materials but I'd certainly prefer some independent tests to verify.
Interesting to see the difference in the 2020 pack vs my 2019. It’s nice to see that the newer pack doesn’t seem as affected by even mildly colder temps. At 69deg my Bolt would have only been charging at maybe 40-45kw at the most and running the battery heater. It doesn’t hit peak charging speed until 75deg. My 2019 doesn’t start cooling the battery until it hits 100deg avg temperature, and even when repeatedly fast charging it on a 109deg day, I didn’t see any charging speed reduction other than the energy needed to run the ac compressor for battery cooling, which was noticeable at about 6kw, but that’s not a limitation of the battery, only a limitation of the current rating of the charging plug and wiring (150A) The taper is also much better than 2019. Mine tapers to 38kw at 47-49% and down to 23kw at around 70%. At 95% it is down at 7kw and tapers down to 1-2kw as it nears 100%, so definitely much better on the 2020+. I’ve got a similar video about my 2019 Bolt on my channel, and will be posting a video comparing charging before and after the recall/software update probably next weekend.
Excellent, that will be interesting to see (subbed!) We didn't get a chance to compare the two before our 2017 Bolt EV Premier went back spring 2020, so I'm hoping the update aligns 2017-'19 models with 2020/'21 as some have reported.
I'm reading that the final recall update to restore 100% SoC to 2017-2019 Bolts has also changed the charge curve to be a smooth taper like 2020+ vs. the hard stepdowns. I haven't seen any good data like this yet for an older model, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed!
I’ll be doing a video about this on my channel hopefully this weekend. The recall is being performed Tuesday and I’ll be testing it out throughout the week.
@@wrenchingfool5284 Excellent I'll be watching!
I've seen the same on the forums but only anecdotal. Others have mentioned it on previous updates but I don't think it turned out to be the case, so hopefully this one is the real deal. Staying tuned to @Wrenching Fool channel for that update.
Fellow Brit here, road tripping my ID4 from SFO to NYC next week
Nice! Free charging will be a real bonus too. Are you planning a leisurely trip or on a deadline?
Great job on the video. Lots of great information. I also recognized this EA station as one I frequent. I've probably ran into you a time or two at the local spots because I've seen your RUclips channel on Plug Share checkins.
Thanks, it's our local test station (or was... EA Arlington seems less crowded and is a similar distance, so might change!) What do you drive? I'll keep an eye out and say hi next time.
Interesting, thank you. But that music... :(
Thanks for the feedback!
Dang! 4mi/kWh is pretty efficient - that's mighty impressive.
Bolt does a pretty good job, especially around town. We're at 4.7 mi/kWh over the past 1k miles, mostly local driving with a bit of Interstate mixed in for regional trips.
I just bought a 2020 Bolt today. We use it in Alaska so this should be interesting. We do have a 2017 Yukon for other uses. The Bolt is really cool in a weird way.
Congratulations! There was a chap up in Denali loving his Bolt in the Alaskan winter... Kirk Martakis, if I recall. Smart to have the Yukon alongside it and pick the right tool for the right job. Enjoy! ⚡
Just found this, thanks Steve.
I don't, as a rule, look at charging speed, I look at efficiency. Let's say we have car 'A' with a 77kWh pack and a range of 230 miles, the efficiency is 2.98 miles/kWh and another car, car 'B', has a 66kWh pack and a range of 250 miles. That's 3.79 miles/kWh. Now, let's say we charge to 80%. That's 77*0.8 = 61.6 kWh and 52.8kWh respectively. 61.6* 2.98 = 183.6 miles range and 200.1 miles respectively. Let's say that the larger battery charges in 45 minutes and the smaller battery charges in 65 minutes like the Mach-E and Bolt do. 45/183.6=.245 minutes per mile and 65/200.1=0.325 minutes per mile or 14.7 seconds per mile and 19.49 seconds per mile. So to go 100 miles it's 24.5 minutes and 32.5 minutes or just about 8 minutes more for the slower charging car over 100 miles or ~2 hours of driving, 16 minutes for 4 hours of driving. So what I think is that when you look at the slow charging times it looks a lot worse than it is. Only until you get to times like the Tesla and EV6 do you see real differences.
There are other factors at play here, the larger pack is heavier and requires a heavier car so it will never achieve the efficiency of a lighter car like the two Bolts which come in several hundred pounds lighter than something like the Mach-E. I imagine there's a sweet spot where the battery to weight ratio is optimal but personally I favor the lighter car because I charge from my PV and the fewer watts I put in it the more my system annd battery save. For me efficiency is paramount and I'm happy with the slightly longer charge times especially since my wife and I don't travel long distances often.
Thanks for the examples, I keep meaning to come back to this topic because charging vs. efficiency is quite obscured at the moment, especially with free charging widespread.
Obviously our Ioniq 5 is now significantly faster for road trips over multiple charge stops, but you're totally right that it's much closer for other models and trips that only require a single stop (~300-400 miles). The cost of charging will also have to come into the equation, eventually. Something like the Bolt or an older Ioniq uses its first charge much more efficiently than the newer, heavier models, meaning you'll go further for your money and that next charge won't cost as much, even if it takes a bit longer.
We see electricity prices rising with Tesla for Supercharging and that will have to come to the public networks, once funding and free charging promotions run dry. At that point, EVs that cover more miles per kWh are likely to take back some of the advantage, as cars with better MPG than their competitors do today.
@@plugandplayEV Steve,
I just got a call today from my dealer, my new battery is in and they are planning on replacing it on Nov. 1st. I'm interest to see how its charging algorithm compares to my original 2020 battery. I've heard people are complaining about 20kWh charging rates in certain situations, I think Eric ran into this on one of his outings. I don't remember if your battery has been replaced or not?
My 2023 EUV might come in before the end of the year so I'll have that to measure also although I imagine it will be relatively close to the replacement if they don't do some tweaks on the new car.
People have also been complaining about the adaptive cruise applying the friction breaks once regen hits 11kW and not using the full regen on the 2022 and newer Bolts with good batteries. I tested my Bolt with the standard cruise today and it does in fact use the full regen.
We have a Bolt now but had a Model 3 for years. Honestly, while supercharging is much faster, it has a massive curve. You'd be there for over an hour if you tried to charge to 100%, and mine was an SR so it had less range than any Bolt to begin with. I have also been to slow superchargers that peaked at 65 kw, which felt like charging a Bolt lol
Right, it really comes down to knowing your EV and how to maximize its potential. Our extended family drives their Model 3 LR to us from Ohio and take roughly the same amount of time as us in a Bolt, because they prefer to stop for meals at Superchargers and go close to full. As you say, that's an hour stop, as it would be in a Bolt to ~90%, and suits their travel style just fine.
At the other end of the spectrum, we tried to get 250 kW in their Model 3 earlier this year and couldn't get low enough to see that max. At 15% on a V3, it was pulling 222 kW, which is obviously still excellent but quickly tapered to V2 power levels.
Showing the whole curve is good as a demonstration, but it's more an exercise in why you *don't* normally do this, than a recommendation!
As long as you understand 1) one would never recharge a battery in this fashion as it's inefficient. 2) Newer batteries which will be in all Bolts for free have better charging characteristics and longer range.
Also, if you charge at home, 98% or auto trips are under 100 miles and 99% are less than 200 miles, meaning most will seldom ever need to go to a fast charger more than a couple of times a year, if that.
Absolutely, the disclaimers and pinned comments are all intended to ward off any misunderstanding. The gas model of "fill 'er up" at a public station simply doesn't apply to electric vehicles in the vast majority of scenarios.
The point about home charging should also be emphasized, as well as extended to cover workplace and local charging, all of which should be passive... just plug in and let the car top up while the owner takes care of other business. The time savings of passive charging in everyday life are rarely highlighted vs. gas, whereas we hear no end of the "wasted time on long trips" argument. All important things to reiterate, thanks Mark.
So one thing I noticed on my 2020 Bolt in similar DC fast charge temperatures is that if I run the cabin climate on auto and just cool enough to run the AC compressor that it proactive runs the battery cooling pump and keeps the battery cooler during the entire charge cycle. Otherwise when I force the AC off to just run the fan the bms waits for battery to get warm then cranks the battery coolant pump to the max to try to reactively catch up. Something I noticed in the torque app.
Interesting one, thanks. I'll have to play around with that on our summer trips.
If you leave your bolt charging, does the plug stay locked? Or do u have to babysit so no one takes it out?
It locks during DC fast charging, yes. For L1 and L2 charging (when only the J1772 plug is used), it can be unplugged. But there are simple padlock solutions that can be used on the charge handle if you expect mischief.
Chevy Bolt is the best value EV out there. As you demonstrate a 20 min DCFC will give you enough juice to get home. At 31 to 35 thousand, it more affordable then many other EVs out there.
Price will need to be closer to $25k given the distorting factor of incentives and offers like free charging that still come with some newer EVs, but definitely agree the Bolt represents great value for money... if buyers can find one!
The only time I really got bothered by the slow charging speed of my 2019 Bolt (and later my 2022 Bolt EUV) was during winter. Unless you're in an area where DC charging is very sparse, typically you'd charge the Bolt to around 50-60% and then move on to the next charger. If you pull in around 5-10%, that charge takes about 30 minutes. In the winter, because the efficiency (and thus range) drops so much, you have to either stop more often or charge even more. Add on to that the fact that the Bolt has no battery pre-heating which means the car doesn't charge at peak speed in cold weather, you have to add more energy at a slower rate in order to do the same driving. Most of my charging stops during spring and summer would be about 30 minutes to jump from charger to charger. The same thing in the winter is typically 45-60 minutes. That gets a bit annoying. But, then again, how many road trips do I take during the winter? One...maybe 2 sometimes. So, it isn't a big deal.
The Bolt EV and EUV are great cars for commuting and trips up to about 150-200 miles. They are totally capable of longer trips throughout the year, but there will be a sacrifice in how long those trips will take. In my opinion, unless you are taking those long road trips multiple times a month and absolutely cannot spare the time for some reason, the charging speed isn't really that important. Its mainly just anti-EVers grasping at straws, trying to justify their dislike for change.
Very true. And winter stops tend to be the ones where you least want to hang around, so it's not ideal for that. But other than the major holidays, as you say, the opportunities to travel aren't as frequent, so it's not the end of the world.
Thanks for the data. It will be useful for new Bolt owners, of which there are many.
I'm disappointed that Chevy did not increase the charge rate for the new Bolt/EUV. Perhaps they shifted their resources to focus on the Ultium based cars? Even though the list price of the new vehicles is less than the old ones, IMO Chevy will have to continue to offer huge incentives to move the cars. I guess that's ok if it continues to get people into EVs. I just hope they aren't disappointed with the slow "fast" charging.
Regarding the Kia/Hyundai offerings being in the "affordable" range....I guess that's true if you can get one. They are not available nationwide.
Thanks Tom. I'm increasingly seeing the 2022 Bolts as a value play, rather than trying to move the needle on EV technology. They basically used the falling battery costs to address cosmetic complaints of cost-cutting on first gen Bolts (seats, creature comforts, and styling), without improving any of the underlying EV piece. In doing so, GM can now claim two truly affordable entry-level all-electric models, while pointing to forthcoming Ultium-based models for more demanding EV drivers. I hear from enough drivers who don't want to road trip their EV - or those who simply like to travel a bit slower - that I think these new Bolts will have a role to play, even though they won't keep us in a Bolt past 2022.
Re. Kia-Hyundai, I think the quotation marks are doing a lot of work nowadays for that brand's new EVs... they look amazing and the tech is great, but the budget brand status is being left behind. We don't yet know the US price of the IONIQ 5 but the launch EV6 will go for close to $60k... even with rebates and incentives, that's a lot of dough for a Kia! But ZEV states + major markets first seems fair enough for me, given the commitment to roll out nationwide by the end of next year. Production is constrained and it makes sense to sell into markets where demand will be highest first. As long as they stick to their word and go nationwide, I don't see this as much different to the 2017 Bolt taking a year or so to be available in all states.
Last time I saw That much juice delivered I had to clear my browser history...
But did the session last longer than an hour...?🤔
Our per minute charging in Ohio/Michigan ranges between $.30 & $.45, so I’m thankful for our $.31 per kWh rate with EA.
Right, there are plenty of scenarios where per minute goes the other way and becomes a bad deal. EVgo here is around the rates you mention and typically has less powerful hardware, so we pay more for less and take longer. EA's per minute rate right now just happens to be so cheap that it makes for a temporary great deal, but eventually all states will allow per kWh pricing and it will be a uniform EA rate across the country.
I'm surprised those stations are so expensive! ~20 miles per dollar vs about 8 miles per dollar with gas, but not as cheap as I expected. Makes me glad I can charge my '17 at home!
Yep, home charging is where it's at when it comes to EV savings. Fast charging is there for road trips (or the occasional freebie, if the network is having a glitch or feeling generous!)
What app are you using besides the Chevy app?
It's called Torque Pro. Upgraded version of Torque for Android for $4.99.
Did you leave the car on when you grabbed lunch or does the OBDII port stay powered in order to continue collecting data?
Left it on and locked. Filmed the whole thing so the data is pulled from the video + time stamps. Only used OBDII for Torque Pro app and the spot battery temp. readings this time.
The OBDII port does stay powered at all times (car on or off) and the data remains available during charging because the various charging-related modules have to be online and communicating while charging, so the data is available on the OBDII port. The gauge cluster will turn off though.
@@wrenchingfool5284 Just subscribed to your channel
How do you have a Fast charger port in a 2020? I don't in mine.
There were certainly some shipped with J1772 only, but the vast majority of Bolts have the fast charge option. Every model year since the introduction in 2017 has offered CCS.
The sweet spot for battey temps in a Bolt is in the 90+* area, as indicated by the driving efficiency chart in the car readout.
False.
@@samusaran7317 Source? IWhen the battery in the read out in my car read in the 90s*, as in the efficiency chart, I was getting a 330 mile range figure in the Guessometer, which has been very accurate. And I was getting the commensurate measure of miles per kwh to confirm it. So, what is your problem? GM is wrong on their efficiency chart? And I didn't get the confirmation on miles per kwh? And both confirm each other? Put up or shut up!
@@kujo49 Did you forget your coffee.... Are you really driving around in that heat with no air conditioning going? After 75°F your efficiency will drop unless you like tormenting yourself sweating in your seat. I can drop a link for that info if you want.
@@samusaran7317 I asked for the source. Did you forget your coffee or just being an AH! Put it out there!
And tell me why GM shows that 90*+ is favorable for range on their efficiency charts. Can you do that? Please (he says to be polite and not misunderstood).
@@kujo49 I can't speak for you, but the increased degradation doesn't seem worth it. Especially considering most evs Ive seen rapidgate eventually causing more strain. In the end, its not my ride though. Cheers
Well done. This makes me so glad I sold the Bolt and bought a Tesla. The charge rate is like watching paint dry. I gripe if I drop to 70KW during a charge.
I will say that EA has finally drastically reduced their prices. I have paid up to 86 cents a kilowatt when they were charging by minute 2 years ago during winter.
GFM
Tech's moving fast, certainly. We'll move on to a new model to upgrade our road trips, but the Bolt EV will still be one of the best options for many drivers who prefer leisurely trips or rarely fast charge. Great value at under $25k new / $15k used, bringing EV benefits in a simple, practical package.
These EA prices have been in place since last September, so old news at this point but certainly still positive.
@@plugandplayEV I did like the Bolt, although I paid almost $40,000 for a fully equipped one in 2018. Fully equipped was actually kind of a joke, and I would not recommend buying that.
As most driving is local, the car worked well for my uses and with the lower prices they make an affordable option.
But the slow charging is just plain stupid by GM. In order to get my car to charge at over 17 KW in winter, (yes, 17KW!), I had beat my local dealership over the head with a stick (well, not physically), to get them to upgrade the charging protocols.
Legacy auto makers have a lot to learn about modern automobiles.
GFM
@@electriccar3253 And they'd better learn fast, because this ship is setting sail as we type and won't be turning around...
@@electriccar3253 Remember everything said, it is a compliance car. I am amazed at how good it is! It could have been a Fiat.
@@plugandplayEV Every ICE manufacturer is have civil war behind closed doors. But public opinion is pulling them around. Imagine have a $90,000 car with 90 Kwhr battery and get 180 miles of range.
Does only supercharging hurt the battery ?? I want to get the 2023 model but I would only be able to supercharge it because I live in a apartment
Technically, every cycle of discharging/recharging a battery pack impacts longevity, but you're right that DC charging (Supercharging and other forms of "fast" direct current charging) puts the most stress on the pack. However, there are EV owners that can't charge at home and use a fast charger once or twice a week to top up.
So it would be easieron the battery if you could find a level 2 charge option near your apartment or workplace and leave it to charge overnight/during the day once or twice a week, but any EV pack is warrantied for 100,000 miles, so you have some peace of mind there even if you go the Supercharging/fast charging route.
Also, specifically thinking of the Bolt EV, it has a very conservative DC charge rate and even those who regularly fast charge it have seen 150,000+ miles with only 5-10% of the original range lost.
@@plugandplayEV thanks , I would only charge like every 2 weeks because my job is like 8 min from me, also the warranty covers the battery for 8 years or 100k miles so I think I should be ok
Not that I'm going on any road trips in the leaf anytime soon, but its nice to take it to the next town over from time to time lol
The Leaf certainly holds its own as a city hopper in some regions!
Most of my DCFC sessions are around 10 minutes.
What OBDII app are you using in the Torque Pro ??
The OBDII dongle is a Vgate iCar Pro BLE, paired to the Torque Pro Android app.
Waching this 2 years later.
There's definitely less per minute states now.
As well as the rate per kw has changed.
Interesting to see it 2 years later.
Thanks, most do seem to have made the change to the fairer price per kWh/energy delivered model, but there are still a few holdouts. Last time I checked, we would still be charged for time in New Hampshire, after being charged by energy in the neighboring states.
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Great time to take a nap in the back with the fold down seats. As long as there's no fire
Always thought a hammock between two charging stations would be rather pleasant, myself. Then any fire would just be a handy way to make S'mores.
I charge my Bolt at my lvl 2 charger, plus I definitely like the regen 1 pedal driving experience. It's not a Tesla, but definitely not a LEAF either! and Zero to 60 at 6.7 is no turtle. Definitely love the torque, gets up and goes! Hopefully Navarra will let the Bolt charge faster & hopefully 300 mile range with the next gen, then it will definitely be a winner! It does everything that the M3 & the Y Can do for a lot less!
the very first time i charged my 2017 Bolt last September i went from almost nothing to 180 miles in about 50 minutes. I want to say it was charging over 60 kW at one point but i'm not sure. I charge at home now at night and I never think about it.
Thanks for the perspective. This is something that critics often overlook: some people just don't need their Bolt EV to be a long-range car, so the fast charging speed doesn't matter to them.
As a workhorse for the week and regional driving, there really isn't a better value vehicle around. If you can plug in at home that's even more true. But for travel on long trips at speed, the Bolt will clearly show its drawbacks.
Great!I just bought a Bolt.
Congrats! Really good all around EV.
66 kWh's.... really? What do I make of this? I thought a buffer was held to help preserve the battery. It seems like GM allows you to charge to the full capacity of the battery. Or, is the capacity really higher, but GM simply advertises usable energy?
Losses to heat, cooling, and other systems running the car. Most manufacturers advertise the nominal pack capacity but the amount the driver can access is usually a bit lower than that, even if there's no significant buffer.
GM doesn't use buffers though it will park you before it completely goes dead. Might only have a couple % left. I've noticed a comment I ran across by a GM rep that the Ultium system is similar, no real buffer. And they don't care if you go to 100%. Apparently a non issue as the effect on the battery is minimal.
What sucks is, at this current time, a trip I take up north has nothing but 50kw chargers, and like 2 of them. So possibly, ironically, the bolt might be faster than the ioniq.
It's definitely a big leveler once you get away from the main cross-country routes and big cities. The I5 would still be the better option, as it would hold the almost 50kW power for most of the charge session where as the Bolt would taper off in the upper half of the pack, but charge times would certainly be much closer. Thankfully, 125-150kW hardware seems to be the minimum requirement for most new installations, so it's just a matter of waiting for the funding to flow through to these new sites in most places.
Great video. What is the name of that app you are using measuring battery temp and other information? Just bought a 2021 Bolt Premier
Thanks. The app is called Torque Pro, available on Android, data via OBDII reader. For Apple devices, I think most I've seen use a similar app called Engine Link. Congrats on your new Bolt⚡⚡
I use Car Scanner on iOS along with a VeePeak OBDII Bluetooth adapter and it has worked perfectly.
how do i get that app on my phone?
It's called Torque Pro. Upgraded version of Torque for Android for $4.99. For iPhone, I think people use EngineLink but I've never tried it.
interesting, thanks for the video.
Thanks for the comment!
I'm confused, so this took how long exactly to charge from almost empty to completely full? Over 2 hours or over 3 hours?
109 minutes from 1-100%, so 1 hour 49 minutes from charge start/empty to charge end/full.
@@plugandplayEV1 hour 39 minutes is usually 99 minutes.
My bad, edited with thanks!
Thanks for the video. Just learning about elec cars. Dang 1.5 hours I would need lunch, nap and a couple pee breaks. HA!!
I checked all those boxes except the nap for this session... too much construction going on for that! Remember, though, that this is older EV tech used in a way very few people travel. Current EVs will charge to 80% in 15-30 minutes, so you'll be on your way quicker than the line in a Dunkin will serve you =)
What's the exact battery threshold where it goes from 3 bars to 2 bars, 2 bars to 1 flashing bar, and one flashing bar to no bars? This would be good to know in an emergency.
From the looks of it, it seems as though 0 bars is not quite 0%.
Right, each bar is 5% but the bottom bar disappearing simply indicates that final 5% of the pack, rather than 0%. The app will show a specific percentage, but the easiest way to tell for anyone who wants to push it that low would be to set up the OBDII reader and go off the "SOC Raw" (Raw State of Charge) number displayed.
@@plugandplayEV
I looked into setting up the app to get a more precise battery management, but balked when I learned that it requires paying a recurring monthly fee for OnStar service, once the free trial expires. I'm not going to pay an extra $20-40 per month just to get a more precise battery measurement.
@@ab-tf5fl Haven't done that ourselves either, just the regular "Remote Command" features in the MyChevy app that are free for several years (at least for us, I know that changed over various model years). But the app is poor anyway, so something like Torque Pro or A Better Route Planner do a much better job of feeding live % SOC data.
Do you recall how many miles you had driven to run the battery down to zero?
It wasn't on a single charge, so I can't really assign a mile total or kWh number to the previous driving, no. The 4.1 mi/kWh is pretty indicative of our driving in mid-spring though, so 260-270 miles wouldn't be far off.
wow...it is 0.56/kwh now in CA😂😂
Same station here is now $0.64/kWh for non-members. Brutal!
Ahh the Burlington mall! Nice!
Top spot. Tons of food options and good coffee everywhere you turn ☕
I feel like a nerd for watching a video on charging a car.
Embrace the EV geekery 🤓🔋
Me 2
2 hours almsot. Dang.
Thanks for sharing this info
Thanks for watching and commenting!
So I run 800 miles in one overnight trip each month to visit my elderly parents. I generally charge only enough to make it to the next EA and it’s 12 cents per KWH. I like to stop at 50 % soc, and get down the road. Less time charging but more stops.
Bargain! We can only get it down to those levels when a free charger and only per minute EA states are involved. It would be interesting to run the same trip every month and compare stats by season and road conditions. We have the Boston to Ohio route, but only two to three times a year and we often mix up the journey between upstate NY and PA, so it's rarely an exact comparison.
@@plugandplayEV so I have a lot of these stats saved and I need to put them together and make a video. The new ioniq 5 changes everything with only one stop of 18 minutes needed now each way.
If everyone had EV's would the cost of electricity go up and you would basically pay the same or more than you would pay for gas?
It's a good question, but any answer related to 100% EV adoption would be pure guesswork. The reality is that full EV uptake is unlikely to arrive in the next decade, so a more reasonable analysis would look at something like 50% adoption.
But the short answer at that ratio is no, electric fuel won't exceed gas prices at that level. The diversity of generation sources for electricity, from hydro and wind/solar to natural gas, nuclear, and other fossil fuel options, means that we can spread the risk and defray cost of generation.
Individuals can even take things into their own hands by investing in home solar and battery storage, so they control the cost of their electricity. Meanwhile, the cost of oil exploration, refinement, shipping, and final delivery to gas stations is only going in one direction. And there's simply no way to put a long term fueling solution in your driveway, for gas.
I was reading that in California, having the biggest concentration of EVs, they only use about 1% of the power. And I would assume the vast majority of that is off peak.
I would never discharge my Bolt to zero (or one) percent, and I wouldn't DCF charge to 100% either. I might level 2 charge at home to 100% before a long trip, but I ordinarily charge to 80% because I almost never need 100%, and the last 20% is slower and stresses the battery more. From 10% to 80% is a more realistic test of charging time on long trips, and it takes a bit less than an hour. I've never driven far enough on a trip to need to add more than 100 miles of range, which takes half an hour. If I ever drive more than 300 miles in a day, I'll plan on stopping for an hour every three or four hours, but I'm close enough to a major airport (Atlanta) that driving much more than 500 miles usually makes less sense than flying.
Right, per the disclaimer I'm the description, this was done purely to gather the data and share why the final 10-20% charging is rarely a good idea on DC fast chargers, especially with the Bolt EV.
Based on my travels, there are plenty of adventurous Bolt drivers out there who just love to take the car across long distances. Understanding the various levels of power at any given state of charge hopefully helps new Bolt drivers with that same penchant make better DCFC choices on the road. Thanks for the input 👍
@@plugandplayEV You're right, of course. I enjoyed the video, but I'm a contrarian by nature, so I rarely write an agreeable comment. :) Someday, I'll take a 500+ mile trip to see what it's like, but if I took these trips routinely, I probably wouldn't own a Bolt and might not own any EV at this point though if I could charge at 150 kW and use the Tesla network, an EV still seems practical now. For my needs, a Bolt is eminently practical, and I love it. I've only had my Bolt for a few weeks, and I take shorter road trips several times a week.
Contrarians are the heart of healthy debate, keep right at it! Your points are exactly what people should aim for in the real world... excesses like deep discharging and fully charging on a fast charger should probably stay right where they are: here on RUclips so that they don't disrupt everyday EV drivers!
Great info! I’m still looking at my Ioniq5 charge curve. I’ve not yet done a true 0-60
Will be interesting to see the US version charge curve after a lot of Euro coverage. IONIQ 5 seems to go as hard as it can until battery temp leaves acceptable parameters, throttles power until back in preferred range, then hits the juice again. Can't wait to see how that translates to cold weather charging conditions here
What brand dongle did you use for Torque Pro?
It's a Veepeak OBDcheck. We have the wifi version but Bluetooth is usually the better way to go.
GM needs to change that charge rate. I never saw higher than 46 kw with my Bolt no matter how low soc. I’m spoiled with my Model 3. I add 170 miles of range in 15 minutes @ 250 kw chargers when I start around 5% SOC.
Not gonna happen on the Bolt any time soon, unfortunately. GM is saving the real DCFC tech for its Ultium vehicles (Lyriq, Hummer EV, Silverado EV) and keeping the Bolt range cheap and cheerful. Unfortunately, that means skimping on internal hardware upgrades that would make it possible to charge the car 2-3x faster.
@@plugandplayEV it’s a great around town and commuter car. I think thats the way GM designed it. Not ideal for long road trips.
@@evgrandpa365 As long as the long road trips mean more than 400 miles a day. An hour to charge for a 400 miles road trip isn't too much. You drive 200 miles in the first leg and then you charge twice 30 minutes for the next 2 x 100 miles legs.
@@voldar70 I think the Bolt is a great car for around town and. Commuting 200 miles round trip without charging. I don’t think GM built it for long range driving. But it is still one of my favorite ev’s
I think it’s great for long and short comments. You just need to have patience for road trips. As long as you aren’t taking one every month or week I would enjoy this car.
It's too bad Chevy has not upgraded the charging for the bolt. It would be such a great little car if it could charge at 120 or 150 KW.
My car will go from 10% to 50% in 10 minutes. 10% to 90% is 35 minutes
It still holds up for many use cases, given the fact that some model years can be obtained for half the price of a competitor with similar range. I know folks who have never fast charged, as well as some who don't need them for long trips beyond 300-350 miles or so. In those cases, the fast charge rate makes no difference and it's a very practical, affordable little hatchback with good range. The flip side is obviously folks like my family, who use it as the primary car, and now have CCS-equipped options on the market that will charge to 80% far quicker. Unlikely that we'll stick with a Bolt beyond 2022 for that reason.
@@plugandplayEV very true my car charges like a boss but 95% of the time I'm charging at home overnight anyway so the bolt is a good value for people that aren't excessive road trippers you're certainly correct.
Is DCFC bad for the battery?
Fast charging does place more stress on the battery than L2, but the impact should be minimal unless it's the primary form of charging used.
Eric of News Coulomb charged his Bolt almost completely using DCFC charging and at 150k miles concluded he less than 8% total degradation. He has had the battery changed out due to the replacement program recently.
To me - have a small beater gas car that is paid off to keep as an open option for long trip days
If that's already available, I think it makes sense for a certain type of traveler. We have family members who appreciate electric vehicles but want to crank out hundreds of miles in as few hours as possible. For them, their older gas cars tend to be the primary option for long trips. With kids and pets, though, we're stopping regardless and charging doesn't disrupt too much.
What apps did you use for the battery status?
It's called Torque Pro and is available on Android devices. Apple has one called Engine Link which I'm told gives similar functionality.
Coming from a Volt which had a max charge of 7kW, 50kW will probably feel awesome for a couple of hours. But knowing that the Ioniq 5 could do 6x that, it will pale pretty soon. Of course in the Volt, you could Cannonball probably 10 hours faster than a Tesla Model S plaid just by ignoring the battery altogether, Bolt doesnt have that option.
Yeah, it's an interesting evolution on two fronts, where electric range has become the advantage of a full BEV, improving their utility over PHEV for local use, but also fast charge times attempting to get close to gas fill ups to rival combustion away from home. The likes of the eGMP cars and Lucid Air get closer on the latter, but sheer energy density still works in favor of the PHEV. Totally depends on use case, really. Regular long trips? A PHEV or fast-charging EV will be the pick. Mostly local use and ability to charge at home? An efficient BEV with 250+ miles starts to make more sense.
@@plugandplayEV Yeah, I had my Accord for 13 years and made 1 out of state trip with it. Even if I took 1 trip per year, the difference in price between the I5 Limited and the Bolt Premier comes out to about $500 extra cost per minute of charge time saved over ten years. Not that thats a completely fair comparison, theres a lot more differences between them than just charge rate.
In car display there is a 8amp and 12am option. What does this mean. I’m in LA and just got a 2018 bolt.
I use EVgo network chargers. What is the most efficient setting to use for this charging network. I’m
New to this and really don’t know what the 8 or 12 amp options are for.
Hi Armando. 8 amp / 12 amp options only relate to level 1 charging with a portable cable that plugs into a regular household outlet. You probably have one that came with the car. If you use that to charge at home, setting to 12 amps will give you a bit more power but you'll need to ensure the circuit the charger is using can take that extra load.
The setting doesn't have any impact on DC fast chargers or anything else you'll need with EVgo.
What phone are you using? Is that the Google Pixel 4?
Pixel 3a. Due for an upgrade early next year and will probably stick with the Pixel line.
@@plugandplayEV I don't care what everyone says, Google Pixel phones are (in my opinion) the best Android phones to exist. Point blank period.
@@arandomyoutubechannel2940 Agreed. Except for the inevitable battery degradation that any phone experiences, the 3a is still performing as well as the day it came out of the box. Previous three all had significantly diminished performance at 2-3 year mark. Have to go back to the Nexus 5 before that to find one that compares.
Why isn’t it 259?
I wanted a M3 or MY but the price was about half for the Bolt 2021. Now Tesla has raised the price so the new tax rebates are all wiped out. What a game of Wack a mole. I have not needed DC charging yet and have 4,000 miles. The cost is also 3x higher than the .11 I pay at home which is a big disincentive to use DC fast charging.
Tesla flirted with the Bolt's early price range of $35-40k in 2019, but quickly moved back to competing in the Audi/BMW mid-level premium area. Nothing wrong with that given the tech of the cars and Tesla's EV advantage, but it did make the Bolt and Leaf the only affordable options for a time. The ID.4 changes that a little bit, especially with the current tax credit situation and three years free charging, but Tesla seems likely to remain a higher-end option until the rumored $25k arrives.
The Bolt certainly gives up plenty in terms of charging speed and interior quality, but it's a very capable EV for most local/regional use cases and represents great value, once the recall inconveniences are finally resolved.
@@plugandplayEV We get good value from Bolt 2021 and it is fun to be in the EV driving experience which most people have never experienced. Buyers of expensive EVs have also paid the price as early adopters as they have seen their share of EV issues. As for now I have had no problems with the Bolt and hope GM gets production going again in 2022
My 2012 leaf lovs kWh prices 3.00 it takes an hour for 7 kwh
Definitely a better option in that scenario. 60 minutes at per minute rates would cost you $7.20 + tax here in Mass, so more than $1/kWh! Clearly shows the less equitable side of per minute pricing.
i have a 2020 bolt and i do really like it, but to honest i only purchased it because i have solar that produces much more than i need about 8 months out of the year. i dont think i would have purchased it if i didnt have, basically, free electricity to put in it. my previous car was a hyundai elantra that got 35-40mpg and doing the math i just dont see how you will ever recoup the premium you pay for an ev. its also a huge inconvenience to me, when i travel, to only get a 200mile range then wait an hour to charge and maybe get 150mi range, even worse in the winter. my elantra had a 400 mile range and takes 5 minutes to refuel to get another 400 miles. i personally think that ev's are great if you dont travel much. if you travel, get a 40mpg gas car.
just another fact, ev's also cost more to plate and insure.
Thanks for the honest perspective, Dan. It's appreciated to hear someone who prefers the efficient gas option offer a reasoned response, rather than just dismiss EVs out of hand.
I think it also comes down to *how* you travel, as well as the range and charging ability of the vehicle. My brother-in-law has your requirements, for example, and wants to crank out 600+ miles in a day with as few stops as possible. His Volt works best for him to have cheap, efficient electric driving locally and quick gas refills on road trips.
With kids and a dog, we're stopping every 125-150 miles anyway for restrooms and food or exercise. Cranking out 400 miles in a sitting is never going to happen for us, so an EV fits into that travel style. We'd enjoy a quicker charge rate so that quick 15-20 minute breaks are also an option, but the frequency of stops is going to happen one way or another. Factor in almost no maintenance and free charging on road trips and the cost savings are significant.
@@plugandplayEV of course you are right, everyone has their own particular needs, wants and beliefs. who am i to tell people what to buy. we should all have the freedom to make our own choices, which sadly are diminishing with out of control government.
i would love to know how to get free charging, please let me know.
Volta Charging is one option, if they're in your area. It's an ad-supported network that typically installs at malls, grocery stores and movie theaters. Then there's the "Requires Fee" filter on Plugshare, which when unchecked shows all free stations. Electrify America also waives charging fees on select dates, such as Earth Day or the recent July 4th holiday weekend. Planning a full video of the subject at some point but those are the most common ways we've found.
Yes and keep grandma sick or fatal and respiratory challenged children.
@@plugandplayEV Yes I thought that was great for EA to do that. It sure helped me during the 4th weekend.
Have to think about this. Smartphones supposedly charge fast now but now a an ev can charge faster ... thats really something. DC charging for phones please lol
Chargepoints is the best dc fast chargers. They stay at 45kw all the way to 90%
It comes down to the car's battery management system, not so much the charging network or hardware. Assuming the station is capable of giving the Bolt's maximum of 55kW, roughly the same taper you see here will occur. Other models obviously differ, including 2017-2019 Bolts that haven't had the recall update, but on a capable charge station it's usually the vehicle defining the charge power from the station, rather than the other way around.
It takes so long to charge over 80 and 90 percent it is a waste of time. It's better to stop more frequently, besides you never know if the next charger is working or not.
I'd agree most of the time, except that we just finished a 550 mile drive day with a couple of 90% charge sessions that worked out perfectly. The first crossed lunchtime and the other we grabbed dinner, in which case 60 minutes is pretty standard (at least with two kids). In both cases, the car was ready before we were.
@@plugandplayEV I hear ya, but to the uninitiated that extra time might be a waste. I know I'm too cautious but I also don't dare go so low on state of charge, 1 percent is pushing your luck.
Oh yeah, if you're not testing the EV, the approach in this video is a very bad idea!
Why does the new Chevy Bolt still charge at only 55 kW, when the VW ID.4 and Mach-E charges so much faster? GM really hasn't done an impressive job speeding up the charging times for the new Chevy 2022 Bolt.
Nope, they chose to get the price down into the low 30s rather than stump up for more capable internals for the Bolt range. So the EV and EUV come in with the lowest MSRP of any 250 mile electric car on the market, but unimpressive DCFC rates and still no AWD. Buyers will decide what matters most, I guess?
@@plugandplayEV Remember compliance car. Not a $60,000 Caddy.
@@daviddrake6875 It depends what compliance means to you. Leaf was a compliance car. The Bolt EV with a range of over 300 miles during summer in city driving and with a 30-45 minutes charge to drive 350 miles to your camp site, I don't call it an appliance.
@@daviddrake6875 GM wasn't too far behind Tesla in running out of tax credits and still producing them. Ramping up with a waiting line. And 260 mile range. I don't classify it as a compliance car as they have continually incrementally improved it. Last I heard the EUV was going to be exported to Brazil.
What I would say is GM was determined to create a better cell with a better cost margin and that is the Ultium cell and chassis, booth being designed as modular, as the leap forward. Meanwhile the Bolt is the best range for the price and a solid car. The interface was designed well enough that it will go on to the Ultium system without major changes.
@@kujo49 Hopefully it has a better BMS. The last was so bad they could not pinpoint which cells were defective and went into thermal run away, so had to change the whole battery. Again because it was a compliance car. The only reason it is so good is that Chevrolet engineers put their jobs on the line to make I to so.
Not even 1C... The pouch batteries could do so much more, and temps don't even exceed 33ºC in this run.
Yep, the temps aren't too hot or too cold in this session, so it's almost as good as it gets in a Bolt EV.
The limitation here, aside from the fact that the BEV 2 platform is now more than five years old and will soon be replaced by Ultium, is supposed to be the wiring/charge port hardware.
GM has shown no interest in upgrading that equipment or raising the DCFC rate in Bolt, preferring to keep the model a cheap and cheerful budget EV, so newer (more expensive) models inevitably beat it on those specs.
For me this would be awesome , I have a fiat 500e😒
Well, it's not often the Bolt wins on charging but this would certainly be one of them! I'd love to drive a 500e though... seems like a fun town runaround and the new European update looks pretty slick.
Yeah the only problem with per minute charging is it really F's us degraded Leaf owners over. Takes us nearly an hour to get like 14kwh 😅
Yeah, I guess find a free level 2 at that point and enjoy some complimentary electrons! Or a friendly local Nissan dealer? Either way, you have a place in the early days of EV adoption for your patience! ⚡⚡
@@plugandplayEV Yes in my area they are all over.
faster battery charges gets you less battery life..all evs
As far as I know the degradation is minimal from DCFC and has really never been quantified in any meaningful way for EVs as far as I know.
California $.65 per kwh price increase every year
Oof, 48kw? horrendously slow! Are the new body style Bolts also so slow?
Yep, nothing has improved on the DC charging side. It's 55kW peak and a gradual taper down throughout the upper half of the pack. AC charging did improve to 11kW but that's only handy in limited scenarios.
@@plugandplayEV 😞 Dang, Chevy could've had a real winner here.
The numbers might had been different if you weren't parked in Area 51.
Just sayin'. :>
Fair point, well made... thinking about it, that area annihilated an entire Sears a couple of years back 😳
I was lucky to make it out alive.
There’s already a major obesity problem in America. Now another excuse for Americans to stop for a meal.
Or take a walk.
1hr and 48 minutes to charge!? LOL, EVs are so broken. I'm gladly fill up my 15MPG Hummer in 3 minutes than waste my life around EV charging stations. Tesla is so far ahead of the competition.
Cool story.