Hi, great video! I have similar WFCO stock converter in my trailer and thinking doing lithium upgrade in similar way. I have looked at your wiring diagram and got a bit confusing on the connection. I can see you had Renogy Charger output B+ and battery positive wired to the stock converter. What are exactly the VCC+ and POS+ terminals in the stock converter? Thanks in advance!
Great question! I actually got pretty confused with this myself. VCC+ and POS+ are actually both physically connected on the converter, and they're both essentially "battery positive". That's what connects to the 12v bus that powers all the 12v appliances in the trailer. The CO+ terminal is what's "hot" when the converter is running. What I've did was a bit of a hack, but it actually ends up working quite well. That said, the WFCO eventually bit the dust, and I replaced it with a cheaper, simpler converter. If that ever happens to you, check this video: ruclips.net/video/8fg6S5PqxA8/видео.html :)
Great question. We don't remove ours, but a) we live in the lower mainland in BC, so winters are fairly mild, b) the batteries are inside the rig, so we can keep them warm fairly easily, and c) we've spent the past 2 winters down south in warmer weather. Generally, for lithium batteries, you shouldn't charge them below freezing, and you shouldn't discharge them much below -10 deg C. So unless they're self-heating or you can install them somewhere you can keep them above freezing, you may have to remove them in the winter.
@@HomeARoam I'm doing the witch this spring and I'll just remove them as I'm placing mine under the bed. I'mnot sure if I trust the self heating ones and where I live we get -30 C quite often. It was just a thought.
I don’t know if this has been asked or answered but when you connect to “shore power” from your home does it charge your batteries or did you need a voltage adapter?
Hi Brandon, yes we hooked it up to our existing converter such that when we could charge quickly either off shore power or our gas-powered generator we bring with us as a backup. However, since we installed the 400W of solar, we haven't had to use it. In fact, our converter is currently our of service and needs to be replaced, but the solar provides all of the battery charging capacity we need!
Great lot learned, I am wondering where your lead-acid battery were stored, why took so much effort making new space. As far as I know, lithium battery is more less space occupied. Thanks for the video again !
Thanks Victor, our lead acid was stored on the tongue jack, but since we do a fair bit of winter camping, we didn't want them outside of the trailer since you can't charge most Li batteries below freezing (0°C). They're also pretty expensive, so we didn't want to risk theft. The most common place to install them in in the trailer's "garage" but ours is fairly small so we didn't want to take up space there. Since we noticed there was a large unused space right behind the converter, and all of the wiring was already there, it seemed like the most logical choice. Although it did turn out to be quite a tight fit! 😀
Thanks for the excellent videos (this and Part 1), and thanks for the wiring diagram and parts list. I'm trying to increase my knowledge about the electrical system, LiFePO4 batteries, connections, etc. Looking at the diagram made me wonder why you didn't connect the batteries in parallel. That way (I think, based on my limited but hopefully growing knowledge) there'd be only one pos cable running to the ANL fuse and one neg cable running to the shunt (B-). (-: Thanks!
Hi there Sallie, we did actually connect the batteries in parallel, meaning that positives and negatives for all batteries are connected together. That keeps the system voltage at 12v, and actually, the Renogy Smart batteries can _only_ be connected in parallel. The other option is connecting in series. This can be done with other batteries, but makes things a bit more complicated since you then need to _add_ the voltages for each battery. So a 2-battery system connected in series will be 24v. In systems like these, you then need a DC-DC converter to bring the voltage back down to 12v to run all of your 12v lighting and appliances. The benefit to series is that the higher voltage means that you can use thinner wires and lose less energy to waste heat in the system as a whole. Be sure to check out our RV Electrical video too if you haven't already! bit.ly/har-rv-electrical
@@HomeARoam Thanks! I wasn't considering connecting mine in series when I switch to LiFePO4, but maybe I need to learn more about that too. Thanks for the video link! I'm heavily consuming videos on electrical systems right now. 😁
So…the lithium batteries can run all DC power in the trailer, but not the microwave or air conditioner, right? And when you plug into shore power, you can then run your air conditioner and microwave; and your existing converter can transfer charging over to the lithium batteries? Is that correct? Sorry…just trying to learn. And this system allows you to add solar charging to it if you’d like…great setup if i’ve got this correct. The only thing i wish it had was the ability to tie into current outlets installed across entire camper…have you thought of doing that somehow?
Hi there Flint. Exactly. In our case, we chose a smaller inverter that doesn't connect to trailer's 110v AC system. So we can plug in smaller things that run on AC power like computers, chargers, etc. but not our microwave or air conditioner. A larger system can be installed with a transfer switch, and that would let you run the microwave and all of the trailer 110v outlets on battery power. Running air conditioning on batteries requires a _very large_ battery and solar system.
@@HomeARoam agree and understood. I very rarely use micro or air conditioner, so prefer to keep them isolated and only run off of shore power if needed; but would still like to tie in the regular outlets of the camper to the lithium’s. Still new to this, but I think that could be done with the setup you did, and maintain existing wiring. I think? Still learning…
Well, yes and no. A larger inverter could tie into the camper's AC system, but that connects to all of the outlets, and the microwave and air conditioning. If you didn't have the battery/solar system to run those larger devices, you'd just have to make sure not to turn them on. You could leave those breakers switched off when on battery.
@@HomeARoam I’m probably making this too complex, but i am wondering if a “Larger inverter” costs more than it’s necessary, given I’ll rarely if ever try to pull power from batteries to run AC or micro. I wonder if it would be cheaper (perhaps not) to add a breaker - one for the “pure shore power” side that ONLY feeds the AC and Micro, but also goes to a charger for the lithium batteries. Then the other breakers are fed via shore power through the inverter but only to the breakers with the outlets; as well as pass through for DC fuse box. Sigh…I’ll quit bothering you now. Need to do more research. Thanks for your kind responses.
That's possible for sure, but one thing to note is that smaller inverters (like our 700W) do not actually have the hookups to go directly into the AC feed. So by "larger", I just meant one that had that capacity. Otherwise you'd be limited to running extension cords from the plugs on the inverter and that's not really ideal. 😁 Good luck!
Wondering why didnt you just replace inverter/charger that in the trailer with one that can charge lithium batteries and provide power to the trailer. That way you dont need that sine wave inverter. Just wondering. Thanks guys. Very informative
Thanks Mark and good question. There was no stock inverter, and we needed something that would be able to charge from solar and do a high amp charge from our tow vehicle, and also charge with a lithium profile. For all that, the one Renogy device did the trick at a cost lower than replacing the trailer charger. There was no stock inverter, so we had to buy that anyway. So basically we could have simply upgraded our stock trailer charger and bought an MPP solar charger on top of that but it would've cost about twice as much 💰😁
Our built-in trailer converter is not lithium-compatible, so that's why we ended up going with the Renogy DCC charger. That's what handles actually charging the LiFePO batteries. Meanwhile, the existing trailer converter only supplies _input_ power to the charger. It's a bit complicated, but the diagram at homearoam.com/how-to/rv-lithium-battery-upgrade/ explains how everything connects and is wired up.
Thanks guys! The back is on the mend and better a bit more everyday. 🤗 We've only tested our lithium batteries on a couple of small winter camping trips so far, but it's been great. We're really looking forward to getting out there on a long trip to really put them to the test. 👍
lol. Just do it. Awesome install guys. Very innovative. Lighter batteries are good for the back!!! Lol. Oh and those battery cut off switches get me every time. Haha PS. Outtakes rule. God bless. Kevin
GREAT Content!! watched your Lithium Conversion for newbies and found this second one! THANKS AGAIN!! Two quick questions 1) are the only AC plugs you use when boon docking and on "DC Power" those two from the Pure sine wave inverter? 2) do you have a video of the truck charger install(part 3)?? 2.b)do the batteries charge with the truck as you are travelling with out a new alternator/charger?? {maybe 3 questions} ;-D [Ignore 2) and 2.b) just read the comment to Paul]
Hey thanks Jerrold, glad you found it useful. 1) Correct! Mostly for our laptops and charging camera batteries. 2) The truck charger install has not yet been completed. The solar has been doing so well we've questioned whether it will be necessary. But if we do end up doing it, there will be a video for sure! 2.b) And yes, we can still charge while driving from the truck with the regular trailer cable at about 10a. I've also installed a disconnect since when it's sunny, the solar can do better than that. With a dedicated cable direct to the alternator, we could increase the truck charging to 45-50a. And note we also carry a small 2000w gas generator as a backup.
Great video. Can I ask about the alternator power? Did you run a separate line to the vehicle other than the one that comes from the normal trailer light/brake connector?
Hi Paul, thanks, and excellent question! We're currently just using the normal trailer "trickle charge" cable and it provides about 8-10a max, which is ok if you're driving a lot each day, but not practical for a "quick charge". What I have planned is an upgrade that will run a very thick wire with a special plug all the way from the truck alternator back to the DCC charger in the trailer. This will allow for much faster (50a) charging. Stay tuned for that build :) In the meantime, we'll be carrying a generator with as as a backup power source if we're in a season or location where we won't be able to get enough sun.
Even though we Boondock occasionally, I don’t think we do it enough yet to justify buying lithium batteries. Instead we have 1000 Jackery. Will go with that for now. Good luck.
Thanks, Jerry! Yeah, the return on investment might not be as good if you don't plan on being off-grid very much. There are so many off-grid camping options here in BC and the West coast that having lithium installed opens up our options in an area where competition for campsites is really high.
![Yeat & Quavo - 5BRAZY [Official Music Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/4XxnTAwyxus/mqdefault.jpg)
Man, I wouldn't even know where to start. You are the man.
Thanks Kone!
Thanks for sharing! Y’all are good eggs!
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed the video.
Hi, great video!
I have similar WFCO stock converter in my trailer and thinking doing lithium upgrade in similar way. I have looked at your wiring diagram and got a bit confusing on the connection.
I can see you had Renogy Charger output B+ and battery positive wired to the stock converter. What are exactly the VCC+ and POS+ terminals in the stock converter?
Thanks in advance!
Great question! I actually got pretty confused with this myself. VCC+ and POS+ are actually both physically connected on the converter, and they're both essentially "battery positive". That's what connects to the 12v bus that powers all the 12v appliances in the trailer. The CO+ terminal is what's "hot" when the converter is running. What I've did was a bit of a hack, but it actually ends up working quite well. That said, the WFCO eventually bit the dust, and I replaced it with a cheaper, simpler converter. If that ever happens to you, check this video: ruclips.net/video/8fg6S5PqxA8/видео.html :)
Do you remove the batteries in winter? I'm in Canada with old winters.
Great question. We don't remove ours, but a) we live in the lower mainland in BC, so winters are fairly mild, b) the batteries are inside the rig, so we can keep them warm fairly easily, and c) we've spent the past 2 winters down south in warmer weather. Generally, for lithium batteries, you shouldn't charge them below freezing, and you shouldn't discharge them much below -10 deg C. So unless they're self-heating or you can install them somewhere you can keep them above freezing, you may have to remove them in the winter.
@@HomeARoam I'm doing the witch this spring and I'll just remove them as I'm placing mine under the bed. I'mnot sure if I trust the self heating ones and where I live we get -30 C quite often. It was just a thought.
👍 Yes, if you're storing the trailer for the winter in -30 C, it's a good idea to remove them.
I don’t know if this has been asked or answered but when you connect to “shore power” from your home does it charge your batteries or did you need a voltage adapter?
Hi Brandon, yes we hooked it up to our existing converter such that when we could charge quickly either off shore power or our gas-powered generator we bring with us as a backup. However, since we installed the 400W of solar, we haven't had to use it. In fact, our converter is currently our of service and needs to be replaced, but the solar provides all of the battery charging capacity we need!
Great lot learned, I am wondering where your lead-acid battery were stored, why took so much effort making new space. As far as I know, lithium battery is more less space occupied. Thanks for the video again !
Thanks Victor, our lead acid was stored on the tongue jack, but since we do a fair bit of winter camping, we didn't want them outside of the trailer since you can't charge most Li batteries below freezing (0°C). They're also pretty expensive, so we didn't want to risk theft. The most common place to install them in in the trailer's "garage" but ours is fairly small so we didn't want to take up space there. Since we noticed there was a large unused space right behind the converter, and all of the wiring was already there, it seemed like the most logical choice. Although it did turn out to be quite a tight fit! 😀
@@HomeARoam thank you so much for the detailed explanation ! I gotta say you are really powerful !
Just do it , that’s my strategy. Great video
Mine (Mel), too!
Thanks for the excellent videos (this and Part 1), and thanks for the wiring diagram and parts list. I'm trying to increase my knowledge about the electrical system, LiFePO4 batteries, connections, etc. Looking at the diagram made me wonder why you didn't connect the batteries in parallel. That way (I think, based on my limited but hopefully growing knowledge) there'd be only one pos cable running to the ANL fuse and one neg cable running to the shunt (B-). (-: Thanks!
Hi there Sallie, we did actually connect the batteries in parallel, meaning that positives and negatives for all batteries are connected together. That keeps the system voltage at 12v, and actually, the Renogy Smart batteries can _only_ be connected in parallel. The other option is connecting in series. This can be done with other batteries, but makes things a bit more complicated since you then need to _add_ the voltages for each battery. So a 2-battery system connected in series will be 24v. In systems like these, you then need a DC-DC converter to bring the voltage back down to 12v to run all of your 12v lighting and appliances. The benefit to series is that the higher voltage means that you can use thinner wires and lose less energy to waste heat in the system as a whole. Be sure to check out our RV Electrical video too if you haven't already! bit.ly/har-rv-electrical
@@HomeARoam Thanks! I wasn't considering connecting mine in series when I switch to LiFePO4, but maybe I need to learn more about that too. Thanks for the video link! I'm heavily consuming videos on electrical systems right now. 😁
So…the lithium batteries can run all DC power in the trailer, but not the microwave or air conditioner, right? And when you plug into shore power, you can then run your air conditioner and microwave; and your existing converter can transfer charging over to the lithium batteries? Is that correct? Sorry…just trying to learn. And this system allows you to add solar charging to it if you’d like…great setup if i’ve got this correct. The only thing i wish it had was the ability to tie into current outlets installed across entire camper…have you thought of doing that somehow?
Hi there Flint. Exactly. In our case, we chose a smaller inverter that doesn't connect to trailer's 110v AC system. So we can plug in smaller things that run on AC power like computers, chargers, etc. but not our microwave or air conditioner. A larger system can be installed with a transfer switch, and that would let you run the microwave and all of the trailer 110v outlets on battery power. Running air conditioning on batteries requires a _very large_ battery and solar system.
@@HomeARoam agree and understood. I very rarely use micro or air conditioner, so prefer to keep them isolated and only run off of shore power if needed; but would still like to tie in the regular outlets of the camper to the lithium’s. Still new to this, but I think that could be done with the setup you did, and maintain existing wiring. I think? Still learning…
Well, yes and no. A larger inverter could tie into the camper's AC system, but that connects to all of the outlets, and the microwave and air conditioning. If you didn't have the battery/solar system to run those larger devices, you'd just have to make sure not to turn them on. You could leave those breakers switched off when on battery.
@@HomeARoam I’m probably making this too complex, but i am wondering if a “Larger inverter” costs more than it’s necessary, given I’ll rarely if ever try to pull power from batteries to run AC or micro. I wonder if it would be cheaper (perhaps not) to add a breaker - one for the “pure shore power” side that ONLY feeds the AC and Micro, but also goes to a charger for the lithium batteries. Then the other breakers are fed via shore power through the inverter but only to the breakers with the outlets; as well as pass through for DC fuse box. Sigh…I’ll quit bothering you now. Need to do more research. Thanks for your kind responses.
That's possible for sure, but one thing to note is that smaller inverters (like our 700W) do not actually have the hookups to go directly into the AC feed. So by "larger", I just meant one that had that capacity. Otherwise you'd be limited to running extension cords from the plugs on the inverter and that's not really ideal. 😁 Good luck!
Wondering why didnt you just replace inverter/charger that in the trailer with one that can charge lithium batteries and provide power to the trailer. That way you dont need that sine wave inverter. Just wondering. Thanks guys. Very informative
Thanks Mark and good question. There was no stock inverter, and we needed something that would be able to charge from solar and do a high amp charge from our tow vehicle, and also charge with a lithium profile. For all that, the one Renogy device did the trick at a cost lower than replacing the trailer charger. There was no stock inverter, so we had to buy that anyway. So basically we could have simply upgraded our stock trailer charger and bought an MPP solar charger on top of that but it would've cost about twice as much 💰😁
is that a lithium converter?
Our built-in trailer converter is not lithium-compatible, so that's why we ended up going with the Renogy DCC charger. That's what handles actually charging the LiFePO batteries. Meanwhile, the existing trailer converter only supplies _input_ power to the charger. It's a bit complicated, but the diagram at homearoam.com/how-to/rv-lithium-battery-upgrade/ explains how everything connects and is wired up.
@@HomeARoam thank you
💯 Great video! Thanks so much for sharing! Happy trails!
You bet! Thanks for watching and taking time to comment 😃🙏
I tend to have the same strategy as Mel 😂 great job though! I’m impressed, we want to do this in the future too! Hope your feeling better! Stay safe 🤗
Thanks guys! The back is on the mend and better a bit more everyday. 🤗 We've only tested our lithium batteries on a couple of small winter camping trips so far, but it's been great. We're really looking forward to getting out there on a long trip to really put them to the test. 👍
@@HomeARoam glad your back is getting better! Have a great week!
@@TilFurtherNotice Thanks, you, too! Have you moved to Washington yet?
@@HomeARoam Soon! Getting truck issues fixed
Great video guys. Really good project. Looks great. Thanks for sharing. Kent and Tami
Thanks, guys! We're really looking forward to putting it to the test this season
lol. Just do it. Awesome install guys. Very innovative. Lighter batteries are good for the back!!! Lol. Oh and those battery cut off switches get me every time. Haha PS. Outtakes rule. God bless. Kevin
Thanks for watching guys! It was a bit of a tricky one, but we got it done 💪
@@HomeARoam well stellar job in the vision of where the batteries would go.
@@WeretheRoberts That was all Jay's wonderful planning 😁
GREAT Content!! watched your Lithium Conversion for newbies and found this second one! THANKS AGAIN!!
Two quick questions 1) are the only AC plugs you use when boon docking and on "DC Power" those two from the Pure sine wave inverter? 2) do you have a video of the truck charger install(part 3)?? 2.b)do the batteries charge with the truck as you are travelling with out a new alternator/charger?? {maybe 3 questions} ;-D [Ignore 2) and 2.b) just read the comment to Paul]
Hey thanks Jerrold, glad you found it useful. 1) Correct! Mostly for our laptops and charging camera batteries. 2) The truck charger install has not yet been completed. The solar has been doing so well we've questioned whether it will be necessary. But if we do end up doing it, there will be a video for sure! 2.b) And yes, we can still charge while driving from the truck with the regular trailer cable at about 10a. I've also installed a disconnect since when it's sunny, the solar can do better than that. With a dedicated cable direct to the alternator, we could increase the truck charging to 45-50a. And note we also carry a small 2000w gas generator as a backup.
Great video. Can I ask about the alternator power? Did you run a separate line to the vehicle other than the one that comes from the normal trailer light/brake connector?
Hi Paul, thanks, and excellent question! We're currently just using the normal trailer "trickle charge" cable and it provides about 8-10a max, which is ok if you're driving a lot each day, but not practical for a "quick charge". What I have planned is an upgrade that will run a very thick wire with a special plug all the way from the truck alternator back to the DCC charger in the trailer. This will allow for much faster (50a) charging. Stay tuned for that build :) In the meantime, we'll be carrying a generator with as as a backup power source if we're in a season or location where we won't be able to get enough sun.
Even though we Boondock occasionally, I don’t think we do it enough yet to justify buying lithium batteries. Instead we have 1000 Jackery. Will go with that for now. Good luck.
Thanks, Jerry! Yeah, the return on investment might not be as good if you don't plan on being off-grid very much. There are so many off-grid camping options here in BC and the West coast that having lithium installed opens up our options in an area where competition for campsites is really high.