If people didn't agree that Piaget and Chopard should be in the established HH realm, it would be a real sign to me that they don't know all that much lol. Incredibly underrated high horology brands. I made a video recently on Chopard, so it is fresh on the mind, but the calibre1.96. One of the most incredible movements ever made! Thanks for this video, Bill! So informative as always!
Hi Britt, you're right about overlooked appreciation of both of those brands-some Piaget watches are now sporting ValFleurier movements and may be the reason that some overlook their top quality watches in the higher tiers. Chopard is still overcoming earlier models like the Mille Miglia with ETA movements (now Chopard in-house) and the imagery of the less expensive. However, their L.U.C. are easily in the higher tiers. It's all perception. Join us for a live stream this morning 1300 London time: ruclips.net/user/liveIa72hxgrbp0?feature=share . Enjoy your videos with charm, fun and lack of pretension. Take care, Bill
Good video. Yes Bill you were one of the first few commentators to point out the fashion brands that have 'important' and good horology- especially Hermes and Chanel. I guess that is the power of the internet and free access to information and deep knowledge. Thank you for these videos. The learning curve for any new collector is now shorter and less steep...while it is good to know that powerful fashion brands are also getting wholly onto the High Horology bus, and giving us better value propositions!
One thing of note.: LVMH is a stock exchange listed company. Will they dilute high horology for the pursuit of profit. Don't be surprised if they spend heavy on marketing to persuade the masses that luxury is affordable and obtainable only to use low quality material in high horology watches. Buyer beware springs to mind!
That Chanel looks very Genta inspired. The thing that strikes me when looking at these is that we are talking high end. Regarding who is making the engine they are not messing about. The Hermes looks fantastic.
At first I thought you were talking about the case, but then realized your were pointing to the retrograde minutes and jumping hour, and you make a good point Mark. Take care, Bill
That does sound odd, doesn't it Joker? In the period from 1975 to around 1988 when Daniel Roth helped revive Breguet from virtual hospice it seemed to have been restored to its former glory. After Roth left, the brand seemed to have hit a slump, and when Swatch bought them 1999, there was little development that I could see beyond aping Roth's work-at its best.At the time Swatch bought the controlling shards of Groupe Horloger Breguet, it was made up of Montres Breguet SA. which sells Breguet’s timepieces under the Breguet brand name, Breguet S, the French distribution company, Nouvelle Lemania SA, a Swiss company which produces all of Breguet’s watches and also carries out third party high-end mechanical movement production for customers of this particular market, as well as Valdar SA, a Swiss company involved in the manufacturing and supply of micro-mechanical components, mainly for the watch and clock industry. So what's happened to Breguet since Swatch took over-besides silicon hairsprings? That's why I'm hoping it will continue with development of the 'Tradition' models (and lose the silicon for at least their Traditions), but in the last several years new models are promising-does sound odd for a company founded in 1775. Take care, Bill
Bill, I think you're very right here. I think as mechanical time pieces become even more unnecessary, we're going to start seeing the independents replace the large houses such as "the holy trinity" as the more desired brands. I think wealthy individuals who are not watch connoisseurs will continue to buy Patek, AP, and Rolex (not HH I know) for the status and great marketing efforts by those brands. I understand your issue with silicon hairsprings, but can you explain why you're open to a silicon escapement? I just assumed silicon as a whole is a fragile material and mass produced making it less desirable in a HH timepiece. Thanks, I've learned so much from your channel over the years.
Right now Paul (AFAIK), the Foundation of the Geneva Seal (www.poincondegeneve.ch/en ) does not allow silicon hairsprings ... so there may be something they're looking for in a watch that does not include silicon in their hairsprings. Take care, Bill
Good point Paul. The wealthy elite favour exclusivity and in todays market that often means independents. Or commissions from the holy trinity. We can but dream!
Amo84, several brands that could have been included, but the change for JLC wasn't necessary for the better-dumping their Geophysic line. Love JLC, but their Masters at Richemont ... not so much. Take care, Bill
Thanks Bill for the great video, I think the watch community should come up with new categories. As there are some exceptional horology out there. Thanks Bill 🙏🏽
Thanks Bill for the informative video. Taking your view I’ve recently purchased a few “fashion” brands. The value to the buyer in the pre-owned market is quite remarkable.
I have purchased (all pre-owned) a Charriol Columbus (with a 150 hour pr), a Van Cleef with day date sub dials in 18G (super bargain) and Chaumet Dandy Arty. Also own a Bvlgari octo 38. All of these are great deals that in other brands would cost 2 to 3 times the price. Thanks again for the insights.
I truly hope that the glitterati move on to some other obsession so that watch collecting can become cool again. When the Starbucks lady starts to spout Patek references you know it’s a bubble.
Love the channel, but have heard him speak poorly of silicon hairsprings (and doesn't sound very fond of escapements either) before. Given that they're highly accurate, what's the issue with them? Any videos on this specific subject?
Hey Zach ... I'm right here. If you're concerned about accuracy, a Quartz watches does better and an Apple watch even more so. Check this out and let me know what you think: ruclips.net/video/-Z7zc33SzGY/видео.html Take care, Bill
Hi Michael, a lot of changes came to Blancpain when Swatch took control. They were once linked to Frederick Piguet and that seems to have slipped. They happen to be watches I like but could not include them in the upper tiers just because of personal likes. Maybe I should have, but just not certain. What do you think? Take care, Bill
Daniel, I am indeed a fan of JLC, but when they dropped their iconic and horological-classy Geophysic line of watches, they seemed to be turning away from rising horology and going towards more mass market at the behest of their Richemont masters. The watch I'm hoping to get someday is their (now dropped) Geophysic World Timer. Take care, Bill
@@watchartsci maybe. But still deserve to be considered when talking about high brand. They master all complications. They have always been innovating. Etc.
@watchartsci Bill, i truly respect and appreciate your chanel and your inputs. I want to discuss something with you. Whats the best way to get a hold of you? Id really like to 'talk' to you and probably take 10 mins of your time. PLEASE do me the favour and give me that!
Hi Bill, as usual I can’t disagree but wonder if HH applies to models and not Brands these days. More broadly, will enthusiasts accept a brand that predominantly sells quartz as high horology? Regards, Ed
Great point Hero. Some brands like Jaeger-LeCoultre, have some solid offerings plus others that are sky-high horology like the Duomètre Unique Travel Time . Take care, Bill
That's what I'd like to know Amatrice! I intentionally omitted those that were so hard to get and created in such small numbers-but, yes Roger Smith is among the great contemporary watchmakers. Take care, Bill
@@watchartsci Hi Bill. I really appreciate you taking time to respond to my comment. I meant a few companies are formed relatively recently that have the name of legends of horology, but have vague connections, if at all to those legends. Like Breguet or Moritz Grossmann. I'm not slighting and of the watches they make, because they are magnificent, but I'm starting a discussion about acquiring a name for prestige.
@@davidthom7127 Understood and agree. Breguet was revived by Daniel Roth and Moritz Grossmann by Christine Hutter-both excellent examples; but there are other well-known names of your that haven't exactly lived up to their namesake like Leroy.
If people didn't agree that Piaget and Chopard should be in the established HH realm, it would be a real sign to me that they don't know all that much lol. Incredibly underrated high horology brands. I made a video recently on Chopard, so it is fresh on the mind, but the calibre1.96. One of the most incredible movements ever made! Thanks for this video, Bill! So informative as always!
Hi Britt, you're right about overlooked appreciation of both of those brands-some Piaget watches are now sporting ValFleurier movements and may be the reason that some overlook their top quality watches in the higher tiers. Chopard is still overcoming earlier models like the Mille Miglia with ETA movements (now Chopard in-house) and the imagery of the less expensive. However, their L.U.C. are easily in the higher tiers. It's all perception. Join us for a live stream this morning 1300 London time: ruclips.net/user/liveIa72hxgrbp0?feature=share . Enjoy your videos with charm, fun and lack of pretension. Take care, Bill
Good video. Yes Bill you were one of the first few commentators to point out the fashion brands that have 'important' and good horology- especially Hermes and Chanel. I guess that is the power of the internet and free access to information and deep knowledge. Thank you for these videos. The learning curve for any new collector is now shorter and less steep...while it is good to know that powerful fashion brands are also getting wholly onto the High Horology bus, and giving us better value propositions!
Thanks man! For us collectors Ardi, the expansion of the availability and variety of true HH watches is a good thing for us! Take care, Bill
One thing of note.: LVMH is a stock exchange listed company. Will they dilute high horology for the pursuit of profit. Don't be surprised if they spend heavy on marketing to persuade the masses that luxury is affordable and obtainable only to use low quality material in high horology watches. Buyer beware springs to mind!
That Chanel looks very Genta inspired. The thing that strikes me when looking at these is that we are talking high end. Regarding who is making the engine they are not messing about. The Hermes looks fantastic.
At first I thought you were talking about the case, but then realized your were pointing to the retrograde minutes and jumping hour, and you make a good point Mark. Take care, Bill
That the galaxy of high horology is expanding rather than contracting is made evident every year when the GPHG nominations come around.
Great observation Howard! I had not looked at it in that way, but you are absolutely right. Take care, Bill
What is your top 10 watch brands that are high HOROLOGY Under 10k? With beautiful see through back for movement mechanism. Brand new *
I interpreted "rising" a bit wrong at first and thought the idea of Breguet as an up and coming newbie was funny
That does sound odd, doesn't it Joker? In the period from 1975 to around 1988 when Daniel Roth helped revive Breguet from virtual hospice it seemed to have been restored to its former glory. After Roth left, the brand seemed to have hit a slump, and when Swatch bought them 1999, there was little development that I could see beyond aping Roth's work-at its best.At the time Swatch bought the controlling shards of Groupe Horloger Breguet, it was made up of Montres Breguet SA. which sells Breguet’s timepieces under the Breguet brand name, Breguet S, the French distribution company, Nouvelle Lemania SA, a Swiss company which produces all of Breguet’s watches and also carries out third party high-end mechanical movement production for customers of this particular market, as well as Valdar SA, a Swiss company involved in the manufacturing and supply of micro-mechanical components, mainly for the watch and clock industry. So what's happened to Breguet since Swatch took over-besides silicon hairsprings? That's why I'm hoping it will continue with development of the 'Tradition' models (and lose the silicon for at least their Traditions), but in the last several years new models are promising-does sound odd for a company founded in 1775. Take care, Bill
Thank you for sharing all the knowledge with us!@@watchartsci
Bill, I think you're very right here. I think as mechanical time pieces become even more unnecessary, we're going to start seeing the independents replace the large houses such as "the holy trinity" as the more desired brands. I think wealthy individuals who are not watch connoisseurs will continue to buy Patek, AP, and Rolex (not HH I know) for the status and great marketing efforts by those brands. I understand your issue with silicon hairsprings, but can you explain why you're open to a silicon escapement? I just assumed silicon as a whole is a fragile material and mass produced making it less desirable in a HH timepiece. Thanks, I've learned so much from your channel over the years.
Right now Paul (AFAIK), the Foundation of the Geneva Seal (www.poincondegeneve.ch/en ) does not allow silicon hairsprings ... so there may be something they're looking for in a watch that does not include silicon in their hairsprings. Take care, Bill
Good point Paul. The wealthy elite favour exclusivity and in todays market that often means independents. Or commissions from the holy trinity. We can but dream!
🎉Just surprised JLC was not mentioned…excellent video.
Amo84, several brands that could have been included, but the change for JLC wasn't necessary for the better-dumping their Geophysic line. Love JLC, but their Masters at Richemont ... not so much. Take care, Bill
@@watchartsci Thank you Bill. Agree with you. A
Thanks Bill for the great video, I think the watch community should come up with new categories. As there are some exceptional horology out there. Thanks Bill 🙏🏽
You've absolutely right Abdul. How to bell the cat is always the problem for us mice, though. Take care, Bill
Thanks Bill for the informative video. Taking your view I’ve recently purchased a few “fashion” brands. The value to the buyer in the pre-owned market is quite remarkable.
What did you get Paul? Take care, Bill
I have purchased (all pre-owned) a Charriol Columbus (with a 150 hour pr), a Van Cleef with day date sub dials in 18G (super bargain) and Chaumet Dandy Arty. Also own a Bvlgari octo 38. All of these are great deals that in other brands would cost 2 to 3 times the price. Thanks again for the insights.
@@paulzarookian7363 All of those sound like great deals, Paul!
I truly hope that the glitterati move on to some other obsession so that watch collecting can become cool again. When the Starbucks lady starts to spout Patek references you know it’s a bubble.
Hi Ivan. Haven't heard the Starbucks lady laude Patek with its silicon hairsprings.... and I don't want to. Take care, Bill
I only recently discovered that version of the Bulgari finissimo and it immediately competes strongly for the next watch I purchase.
Eiki, the Bvlgari Octo Roma is one of the best values around-new often under $5k; pre-owned around $3k. Take care, Bill
Great topic Dr.! You can’t go wrong in owning any of these brands 😊
I certainly wouldn't mind having any of them! Take care, Bill
Love the channel, but have heard him speak poorly of silicon hairsprings (and doesn't sound very fond of escapements either) before. Given that they're highly accurate, what's the issue with them? Any videos on this specific subject?
Hey Zach ... I'm right here. If you're concerned about accuracy, a Quartz watches does better and an Apple watch even more so. Check this out and let me know what you think: ruclips.net/video/-Z7zc33SzGY/видео.html Take care, Bill
Blancpain has no place in any of your slides in this video?
Hi Michael, a lot of changes came to Blancpain when Swatch took control. They were once linked to Frederick Piguet and that seems to have slipped. They happen to be watches I like but could not include them in the upper tiers just because of personal likes. Maybe I should have, but just not certain. What do you think? Take care, Bill
I'm really surprised you didn't include JLC in the rising or established HH.
Daniel, I am indeed a fan of JLC, but when they dropped their iconic and horological-classy Geophysic line of watches, they seemed to be turning away from rising horology and going towards more mass market at the behest of their Richemont masters. The watch I'm hoping to get someday is their (now dropped) Geophysic World Timer. Take care, Bill
JLC has many very high end watches. They make the ultra expensive reverso with a tourbillon as well as the durometer line. All in house movements.
JLC?
Which way Moon? Getting rid of the Geophysic line was a heartbreaker ... probably Richemont's idea. What do you think? Take care, Bill
@@watchartsci maybe. But still deserve to be considered when talking about high brand. They master all complications. They have always been innovating. Etc.
@watchartsci Bill, i truly respect and appreciate your chanel and your inputs. I want to discuss something with you. Whats the best way to get a hold of you? Id really like to 'talk' to you and probably take 10 mins of your time. PLEASE do me the favour and give me that!
Use PM on HHL Gurasis. Take care, Bill
Hi Bill, as usual I can’t disagree but wonder if HH applies to models and not Brands these days. More broadly, will enthusiasts accept a brand that predominantly sells quartz as high horology? Regards, Ed
Great point Hero. Some brands like Jaeger-LeCoultre, have some solid offerings plus others that are sky-high horology like the Duomètre Unique Travel Time . Take care, Bill
Oh boy. Where is Roger smith here ?😂😂
That's what I'd like to know Amatrice! I intentionally omitted those that were so hard to get and created in such small numbers-but, yes Roger Smith is among the great contemporary watchmakers. Take care, Bill
A prodigy of George Daniels if you weren't aware.
I'm aware that there a few companies with names that were great, but really have no connection to that watch making, they have their name.
David, are you saying that some watch companies that used to make great watches are now just a name? Let me know. Take care, Bill
@@watchartsci Hi Bill. I really appreciate you taking time to respond to my comment.
I meant a few companies are formed relatively recently that have the name of legends of horology, but have vague connections, if at all to those legends.
Like Breguet or Moritz Grossmann.
I'm not slighting and of the watches they make, because they are magnificent, but I'm starting a discussion about acquiring a name for prestige.
@@davidthom7127 Understood and agree. Breguet was revived by Daniel Roth and Moritz Grossmann by Christine Hutter-both excellent examples; but there are other well-known names of your that haven't exactly lived up to their namesake like Leroy.