This is the best video on scrapping I've seen. I'd love to have subtitles as I feel I might be missing some subtle explanation. Thanks for sharing this.
To scrape a flat surface from scratch you need to have three pieces. They are scraped against each other in rotation thus eliminating any concavity or convexity. You will only scrape a flat surface by this method to an accuracy equal to or less than the master plate you are using. The old ways still remain.
@@davidswanson9606 I agree and haven't heard these MIDI tunes in ages! Must have been early 1990's since I have. I for one ENJOYED THEM! Just turn the speakers down, not off ;)
I am using traditional Lead Oxide. TRUSCO in Japan. It is not good for occupational safety but still many brands are available. I am looking for good alternatives.
@@093tatsu7 Seems, that many Japanese crafsmen are using this type of marking medium. In Europe, we use either water based stuff, or classical Prussian blue oil based paint. The oil based paints are not easy to clean, and the water based stuff promotes corrosion on metal surfaces. No ideal variant.
This music, like all things, is meant to be enjoyed in moderation and in the proper setting..... Unfortunately this is potent stuff and is too much for many people to take either at high volume or for extended periods of time. Mario successfully incorporates this type of sound into the video game at low volumes and it serves as background noise while navigating the various levels but the low volume blends with other sound effects in game play to break up the repetitious music. This is a balanced application for such music, here, the video content being precision scraping to achieve a flat surface" your viewers are likely of a certain demographic of machinist and fine craftsmen and women who would scoff at such obnoxious music being used in an otherwise good video. I suspect that 093 tatsu has deliberately used this track and adjusted the volume intentionally to patronize the viewer and because the content is solid he can care less about the music so he either adds no music or adds music that will stand out and be so unfit for the application that common critics will state the obvious and comment on the music. If i understand the sense of humor and personality of the individual (such as myself) who sees only the brilliance and comedic relief that intentionally ruining a video with such horrible noise as this presents then i have done my service by posting this comment, if not, it was just a thought and is meant to justify the videos music rather than condemn it. Without the creator's direct statement as to why the music was chosen, anything said regarding the music is either opinion or speculation. In my opinion it's great and i speculate the creator hasn't ruined his video by accident but by design.
Wow what an interesting read! If I may suggest a title.. An Extensive Analysis Nobody Asked For: Making Wild Assumptions With Alarming Certainty By atz123ify 🥴🌚🌝🤓
+093 tatsu Thanks I have a few larger scrapes already but the size of this one interests me. Any chance you have the product number or a link(I searched but cant seem to find it). Thank you
hello, Can you tell us what "bluing"/marking substance do you use ? Occident rather use prussian blue to do that. And it seems (from youtube videos) that Asian people prefer this orange solution. ? Thanks a lot
+093 tatsu Thanks you very much for your answer ! Why don't you use prussian blue instead ? Or for exemple iron oxyde ? Your pigments are mixe with some oil don't you ?
All very well and nice, but the flatness is measured against a reference surface, i.e. the granite. How was the granite made to be flat? How do you create the initial flat surface against which to measure?
+swillswill I think it is possible to make a flat surface when you have three pieces. You compare them with each other, scrape, and repeat. It should converge to a flat surface on all of them.
+swillswill Uh, the "granite" is a surface plate. It's sold as a reference surface for inspection and machining. A high quality surface plate will be flat to within ±0.000025".
Check out Federal Specification GGG-P-463c, It sets the Metrology standards for surface plates. For an 18 x 18 or smaller surface plate it can't be anything over .000050" out in flatness or it's rejected. A modern, good quality, granite surface plate usually beats that. You're correct that it's smaller than some optical wavelengths, they use inferometers to check the flatness. It's crazy, but it's true.
no the "to scrape steel" has to be soft. When you try to scrape on harden steel the carbid tip will run over the surface. You can scrape alu steel and cast iron, brass works to. But harden steel is to grind. Why are you asking?
@@fearlyenrage I'm a woodworker. Hand plane blades need to have their backs lapped flat, which I do by hand. Occasionally, I will encounter one with a hump. In addition to this being a bunch of material to work off, I think there is a tendency for the work to teeter-totter on the hump so that lapping doesn't focus on the high spot. I was wondering if I could scrape down the hump. These blades are typically hardened O1. What I have done in the past when a blade was particularly bad was to use a handheld grinding wheel to try to focus on the hump, but at least in my hands, this is crude. That's the background.
@@ef2b aha. Ok well it is possible to apply water to a running, best works on a slow running, beltsander. But a warning here that works safe as long as no water enters the motor housing! Why add water to a beltsander? To cool down the grind so the steel wont heat up. I dont know how hard your steel is maybe it is a chrommoly then it is very unlikey to scrape it. But when it is a japanese sanmai steel sandwich then the softer steel could be scraped. When you would film the blade steel and show us the plane maybe we could come up with an idea.
Yeah yeah ! Everybody's an expert. Scraper this, scraper that, burrs this & that. What about the grinding? Dunno, don't care, its the finished article that counts. A perfect (within human parameters) is impossible to achieve, it is NEVER completely flat (one of life's little setbacks) however, a 'Gas tight' fit could be classed as a perfect surface and this is why Surface plates, Vee blocks and other measuring devices cost so much. I cannot read Japanese, if that is the subtitles language but the airtight seal on the final product speaks volumes. Try taking in the method.
um airtight seal has no relation to flatness. you ever hear of metal crush gaskets, they deform to the surface and get air tight seals, used for high pressure high temp stuff, clearly the crush gasket is about as far from flat as you can get.
In that it can be smooth and curved, for instance, yes. But that still doesn't answer why scraping is best, if it is. All the attempts at explanations say "it just is", which isn't what explanation means. It calibrates against a standard flat surface, so how was that flat surface produced in the first place?
If you want to know how to make a surface plate without having one already you use the 3 plate method (you can look it up on goole), this was invented by Sir Joseph Withworth. Scraping is often superior to surface grinding because first of all you are not limited by the size of the surface grinder you have (you can take a scraper to a machine) Secondly a scraped surface makes a better bearing surface than a ground surface (ground surfaces tend to push all the way oil out en stick together, thus making the machine wear out quiker) this is why scraping is used primarely on machine ways that have to slide accurately. And at last you can scrape very accurately (the only limiting factors are the skill of the scraper hand and the flatness of the surface plate, and the surface plate like i said earlier can be made to any flatness wanted by repeating the 3 plate method) while a surface grinder can never make a part more accurate than itself, also with scraping you don't have any heat build up or clamping force that can distort a part.
I had to file a steel block to size with all six sides flat as an apprentice, and I didn't manage it. I find it hard to believe that this fitter could do it either. And RUclips is so full of adverts now, I may just stop watching.
Yes method I was shownn indicate HIGH and LOW SPOTS.. scrape high spots that is it... Why not surface grind?? way easier cheap and fast... scrap high spots not every spot..
go here to see how equipment is handscraped to fine tolerance, instead of surface ground: ruclips.net/video/REeGn4hN1Bg/видео.html no surface grinder can match the flexibility and accuracy of hand scraping, especially on the awkward surfaces of most machines
Lol a lapped surface is no good for parts that need to move against each other. Thats why scraping is used as it DOES leave peaks and valleys. It is extremely flat over a number of points in a square inch.
Dear Sir, Good day. It is our pleasue writing to your esteemed company. Please allow me to introduce our company BTL to you. Dongguan City Betterly New Material is specialized in silicone paints and inks with all colors, platinum catalyst, silicone colors, silicone(rtv&htv, tin and additional), ect. Our company stresses on R&D which takes example of Dowcorning, Momentive, ect. Assure high quality at low costs is our aim.
What the fuck? Some people are trying to get babies to sleep or watch RUclips while someone else is sleeping in the same bed. Dont put this loud ass surprise music on here.
![Quando Rondo - Life Goes On [Official Music Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/eIf3fhMXAow/mqdefault.jpg)
Someone please convince AvE to use this music in his videos
shits giving me brain cancer
Can just imagine all the lemmings traversing AvE's shop
This is the best video on scrapping I've seen. I'd love to have subtitles as I feel I might be missing some subtle explanation. Thanks for sharing this.
Good video but almost blew my brains out till I turned the sound off hah!
I really enjoyed the background music, great scraping job!
To scrape a flat surface from scratch you need to have three pieces. They are scraped against each other in rotation thus eliminating any concavity or convexity. You will only scrape a flat surface by this method to an accuracy equal to or less than the master plate you are using. The old ways still remain.
absolutely right!
I try to not comment on music, but you made a great video and demolished it with that noise. Good Lord, that was annoying.
Mute button works every time, I am certain of it.
jajajajaaja
Daniel Bandera jaaaaaaa
Joe Hurly - I actually liked the music; Chopin and Mozart sound good in 8 bit.
@@davidswanson9606 I agree and haven't heard these MIDI tunes in ages! Must have been early 1990's since I have. I for one ENJOYED THEM! Just turn the speakers down, not off ;)
WOW I LOVE THAT MUSIC! 🤣
THE BEST MUSIC EVER! 😱
Dear Sir, can You plese share what kind and brand of marking paint You are using to highlight the high spots
Thanks in advance!
I am using traditional Lead Oxide. TRUSCO in Japan. It is not good for occupational safety but still many brands are available. I am looking for good alternatives.
@@093tatsu7 Seems, that many Japanese crafsmen are using this type of marking medium. In Europe, we use either water based stuff, or classical Prussian blue oil based paint.
The oil based paints are not easy to clean, and the water based stuff promotes corrosion on metal surfaces. No ideal variant.
This music, like all things, is meant to be enjoyed in moderation and in the proper setting..... Unfortunately this is potent stuff and is too much for many people to take either at high volume or for extended periods of time. Mario successfully incorporates this type of sound into the video game at low volumes and it serves as background noise while navigating the various levels but the low volume blends with other sound effects in game play to break up the repetitious music. This is a balanced application for such music, here, the video content being precision scraping to achieve a flat surface" your viewers are likely of a certain demographic of machinist and fine craftsmen and women who would scoff at such obnoxious music being used in an otherwise good video. I suspect that 093 tatsu has deliberately used this track and adjusted the volume intentionally to patronize the viewer and because the content is solid he can care less about the music so he either adds no music or adds music that will stand out and be so unfit for the application that common critics will state the obvious and comment on the music. If i understand the sense of humor and personality of the individual (such as myself) who sees only the brilliance and comedic relief that intentionally ruining a video with such horrible noise as this presents then i have done my service by posting this comment, if not, it was just a thought and is meant to justify the videos music rather than condemn it. Without the creator's direct statement as to why the music was chosen, anything said regarding the music is either opinion or speculation. In my opinion it's great and i speculate the creator hasn't ruined his video by accident but by design.
Wow what an interesting read! If I may suggest a title..
An Extensive Analysis Nobody Asked For: Making Wild Assumptions With Alarming Certainty
By atz123ify
🥴🌚🌝🤓
Thanks:) Id be interested to know where you got your scraper tool from?
+Adam Donovan I purchased it from Tungaloy. Also you can make scraper from old file.
+093 tatsu Thanks I have a few larger scrapes already but the size of this one interests me. Any chance you have the product number or a link(I searched but cant seem to find it). Thank you
I would be interested to know where you got your sound track. It is so good I can't get it out of my head.
Oxtool has a good video of having his granite surface plates adjusted and certified.
Share the link
It is interesting how were made spindles of the first machine tools in the world?
Is it possible to get a cylindrical part
using this method?
It is possible for hand scraping to make spindles by employing tapered shaft/sleeve bearings.
@@093tatsu7 Can you explain more in detail what do you mean by employing tapered shaft/sleeve bearings?
hello,
Can you tell us what "bluing"/marking substance do you use ?
Occident rather use prussian blue to do that. And it seems (from youtube videos) that Asian people prefer this orange solution. ?
Thanks a lot
+ty dji This orange substance is red lead (minium). If you use it, please take care of your health.
+093 tatsu Thanks you very much for your answer ! Why don't you use prussian blue instead ? Or for exemple iron oxyde ?
Your pigments are mixe with some oil don't you ?
@@TJ-ed8xg i used ink pad filler and a tiny but of grease mixed to it to make it non drying and thicker .
Reminds me of my Commodore 64 :+)
All very well and nice, but the flatness is measured against a reference surface, i.e. the granite. How was the granite made to be flat? How do you create the initial flat surface against which to measure?
+swillswill It's known as a machinist's table, you purchase it
+swillswill I think it is possible to make a flat surface when you have three pieces. You compare them with each other, scrape, and repeat. It should converge to a flat surface on all of them.
+swillswill Uh, the "granite" is a surface plate. It's sold as a reference surface for inspection and machining. A high quality surface plate will be flat to within
±0.000025".
I know its been 2 years but.... 0.000025" is 635 nanometers. there is NO WAY that's true. That's smaller then some wavelengths of colors...
Check out Federal Specification GGG-P-463c, It sets the Metrology standards for surface plates. For an 18 x 18 or smaller surface plate it can't be anything over .000050" out in flatness or it's rejected. A modern, good quality, granite surface plate usually beats that. You're correct that it's smaller than some optical wavelengths, they use inferometers to check the flatness. It's crazy, but it's true.
thats really some impressively obnoxious music!
Impressive work though!
I actually liked the music. Reminds me of my childhood nintendo games
Ok I have to admit I like Mario Brothers Classic soundtrack :)
Would this work on hardened steel, like O1? Would an improvised scraper, like a ground file, still work? Thank you for the video.
no the "to scrape steel" has to be soft. When you try to scrape on harden steel the carbid tip will run over the surface. You can scrape alu steel and cast iron, brass works to. But harden steel is to grind. Why are you asking?
@@fearlyenrage I'm a woodworker. Hand plane blades need to have their backs lapped flat, which I do by hand. Occasionally, I will encounter one with a hump. In addition to this being a bunch of material to work off, I think there is a tendency for the work to teeter-totter on the hump so that lapping doesn't focus on the high spot. I was wondering if I could scrape down the hump. These blades are typically hardened O1. What I have done in the past when a blade was particularly bad was to use a handheld grinding wheel to try to focus on the hump, but at least in my hands, this is crude. That's the background.
@@ef2b aha.
Ok well it is possible to apply water to a running, best works on a slow running, beltsander. But a warning here that works safe as long as no water enters the motor housing!
Why add water to a beltsander?
To cool down the grind so the steel wont heat up.
I dont know how hard your steel is maybe it is a chrommoly then it is very unlikey to scrape it. But when it is a japanese sanmai steel sandwich then the softer steel could be scraped.
When you would film the blade steel and show us the plane maybe we could come up with an idea.
紹介してくれてありがとうございます。使った定盤は買ったものですか？
It is interesting how were made first rotary parts of the first machine tools in the world
Yeah yeah !
Everybody's an expert.
Scraper this, scraper that, burrs this & that. What about the grinding? Dunno, don't care, its the finished article that counts.
A perfect (within human parameters) is impossible to achieve, it is NEVER completely flat (one of life's little setbacks) however, a 'Gas tight' fit could be classed as a perfect surface and this is why Surface plates, Vee blocks and other measuring devices cost so much.
I cannot read Japanese, if that is the subtitles language but the airtight seal on the final product speaks volumes.
Try taking in the method.
um airtight seal has no relation to flatness. you ever hear of metal crush gaskets, they deform to the surface and get air tight seals, used for high pressure high temp stuff, clearly the crush gasket is about as far from flat as you can get.
093 tats where did you get your hand scraper? Thank you
Good stuff but the godawful noise!!! Knock it off!
test your intelligence people! Find the mute button?
اي نوع من الاصباغ الذي تستخدمه
صبغة أكسيد الرصاص
I enyoed the video, thanks for sharing.
where did you get your scraper? thanks
industrial professional tool shop
Goddamn get rid of that sound.
The endwringing is the proof in the pudding
Was that a Chinese Budweiser can in the end there ?
That is oil spray can.
I wish RUclips would give you a choice to choose your own music over a video as a feature.
What is the brand of your file? All japanese machinist videos that I see, the files are much better than mine.
It seems counter intuitive that an extremely flat surface could have so many scrape marks in it. You'd expect it to be a mirror finish.
there's a difference between flatness and surface finish
You could polish it with some 3-4-5-6-7000 grit lapping compound on a piece of glass if you want?
You're screwed if the glass isn't flat. Machinists have different expectations with respect to flatness.
In that it can be smooth and curved, for instance, yes. But that still doesn't answer why scraping is best, if it is. All the attempts at explanations say "it just is", which isn't what explanation means. It calibrates against a standard flat surface, so how was that flat surface produced in the first place?
If you want to know how to make a surface plate without having one already you use the 3 plate method (you can look it up on goole), this was invented by Sir Joseph Withworth. Scraping is often superior to surface grinding because first of all you are not limited by the size of the surface grinder you have (you can take a scraper to a machine) Secondly a scraped surface makes a better bearing surface than a ground surface (ground surfaces tend to push all the way oil out en stick together, thus making the machine wear out quiker) this is why scraping is used primarely on machine ways that have to slide accurately. And at last you can scrape very accurately (the only limiting factors are the skill of the scraper hand and the flatness of the surface plate, and the surface plate like i said earlier can be made to any flatness wanted by repeating the 3 plate method) while a surface grinder can never make a part more accurate than itself, also with scraping you don't have any heat build up or clamping force that can distort a part.
Awesome skill right there
Thought for a moment you were coating the surface plate in grinding paste, haha
Great video but please, no more music!
I had to file a steel block to size with all six sides flat as an apprentice, and I didn't manage it. I find it hard to believe that this fitter could do it either. And RUclips is so full of adverts now, I may just stop watching.
8 bits music???? Cool
Why not use grinder?
+itanium7000 Because this is the most useful traditional method to make an EXACT FLAT SURFACE.
+093 tatsu Thanks!
+093 tatsu Actually, a surface grinder would be far more effective.
I do not have a surface grinder at home.
093 tatsu I never said you did. I just said that a surface grinder is the absolute most effective way to get a perfect surface.
Yes method I was shownn indicate HIGH and LOW SPOTS.. scrape high spots that is it... Why not surface grind?? way easier cheap and fast... scrap high spots not every spot..
if you are going to do a lot of scraping, get a power scraper.
お上手お上手、本当に良く出来みしたね。
Never press down on the workpiece
Bearing sc work is very accurate
go here to see how equipment is handscraped to fine tolerance, instead of surface ground:
ruclips.net/video/REeGn4hN1Bg/видео.html
no surface grinder can match the flexibility and accuracy of hand scraping, especially on the awkward surfaces of most machines
too bad im gonna die from the cancer I received from the music before I can even try this method
The color paste should be evenly distributed on the surface plate. Otherwise your reading is false.
but how to make a scraper?
why you make videos with "music"......................?
Circus music really!
I miss my sega genesis. :-(
Lol a lapped surface is no good for parts that need to move against each other. Thats why scraping is used as it DOES leave peaks and valleys. It is extremely flat over a number of points in a square inch.
Get a fucking annoying sound! HOLD MY BEER :
so surface grinder was out of the question? XD
still good work
+SKEL45 A surface grinder can never make as flat a surface as you can hand scraping.
+Charles Tucker Yes it can.
Sounds like Mario bros in here
Tried to watch - but I had to turn off the music!
They serious with the fucking music?
amazing
lots of downs,because of the noise...DAMMMM; thanks to the mute button,i watched it all ,and...one more like,thanks
この材料をなにか?
this was cast iron 鋳鉄
@@093tatsu7 あ なるほど、最初は鋼を思たって😃
That music basically makes this video unwatchable, and there is no way to really learn from what you are showing... :(
Seltitbus eht rof sknaht.
Dear Sir,
Good day. It is our pleasue writing to your esteemed company.
Please allow me to introduce our company BTL to you. Dongguan City Betterly New Material is specialized in silicone paints and inks with all colors, platinum catalyst, silicone colors, silicone(rtv&htv, tin and additional), ect. Our company stresses on R&D which takes example of Dowcorning, Momentive, ect. Assure high quality at low costs is our aim.
wow
there is no exact surface in the world!
Kill the music kid.
Poor taste in music
What the fuck? Some people are trying to get babies to sleep or watch RUclips while someone else is sleeping in the same bed. Dont put this loud ass surprise music on here.
totally useless due annoying noise. didn't watch it.
there is no exact surface in the world!