ACTA Ancient Greek boxing at Dijon 2009
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- Опубликовано: 3 окт 2024
- This demonstration was part of ACTA's wonderful presentation of reconstructed antique martial arts at Dijon 2009. This is boxing according to the style and rules (precious few of them) of ancient Greece. The fighters are wearing cestae of hard leather to protect their hands and make them more dangerous weapons.
I love this shit it's so awesome...different from today's boxing.. Very unique using elbows and hammer fist..Greek boxing rocks..
@cloudyyonot really wing chun is all about protecting the center line
@cloudyyo Also in muay thai (long guard.)
Everybody only have 2 arms, and 2 legs.
@@zetareticulan321 yeah, if youre not unlucky
To bad it's garbage compared to real boxing
This is honestly very impressive - I didn't even know that such a reconstruction was possible.
You guys need to keep this sport alive. It's living history.
Incredible performance by these two, they should be proud of what they're doing.
Wonderful. Watching fights like these would surely be alot more interesting then watching modern Boxing.
I wish there was a school of this close to where I live.
bruh
I am a Boxer, also i love boxing
Very impressive-!!!
Boxing sure has come a long way since its conception, its really nice though to see how our predecessors fought and even nicer to see is how adaptive boxing is and how it is constantly evolving. Boxing has stood the test of time and it will continue to do so.
The ancient greek style of "boxing" is not related to modern boxing.
No one will read this specially the OP.
But boxing did not look like this and these are make belive reconstructions.
It has evolved to be more and more dangerous, with gloves and headgear. They are lethal.
@@temujin5743it’s all punching each other in the face whether or not it’s Queensbury rules
Some people can't see the forest for the trees. This is a demonstration of what ancient boxing might have looked like, kids. All the mma that you guys wet your pants over came from this. There is nothing new under the sun.
@cloudyyo it was called pankration
I don't think that's how they fist fight back then. There's only one way to truly fist fight..fight or flight takes over. Instinctively. Fist fighting is what is it. Never will change. Always been always will be
@@Eldonvrga So, when people say "styles make fights" in boxing, they are mistaken? If there is only one way to fist fight, how can there be multiple styles of boxing?
@@chaos_omega I was just saying when it's instinctive fighting. Like fighting for your life. I was incarcerated for a good while and all the fights I saw.. were like survival fights and I truly just saw there was one way to fight and that's fight for your life type of fighting
@@Eldonvrga I'm thinking that's what you saw because none of them were trained in a fighting discipline. Also, just because it's supposed to be ancient doesn't mean that they hadn't developed any techniques or styles yet.
Ive watched this several times. Cant find anything more on this particular type of boxing. Amazing
If you do, let me know. ;)
Pygmachia is only boxing, as shown above. Pankration includes strikes with fists, elbows, knees and wrestling.
That's because this is not historically accurate and is rather ridiculous and ineffective.
@@peaceonmars Looks pretty effective to me, shit looks much more hardcore than regular boxing
@@mrtheluckybucketit would be more effective even without the Pankration side of it, the grappling and wrestling
Modern MMA is a safer more culturally diverse version of Greek Pankration 🙂
@m9ronaldo There was boxing also in ancient Egypt, Sumeria, Rome etc and almost every european nacion has it's own form of boxing but Greece is one of few to have it's boxing turn into sport together with english, roman, french and russian boxing to name some. I would love to see more greeks and other Europeans in boxing because it's our sport, it's sad that it's not more popular ...
I see a lot of semblance to wing chun,baji, Irish bareknuckle boxing and filipino dirty boxing here. It's so interesting. What's most unusual to me is the cross guard that almost resembles a philly shell but closer to how George Foreman uses it, what was its purpose?
Beautiful, very interesting.
It's beautiful thank you very much for this ! I am tottaly amazed and surprised, I never expected it to be like this. It looks like boxing like that on cretan vases I saw once. I would love to know if it looked like this in olimpian games because I expected it to look more like todays boxing. Well I love martial arts and Greece and it's myths and history so I'd like to learn this.
Love the hand defenses and faints
Nice! Like the elbowblocks followed by hammerfist.
I think some people mistake this for a match (stupidly) it's a demonstration, and if they had been to a HEMA seminar they would know what this is all about, ie. showing a bunch of people techniques from a system. Not fighting it out to see who's best.
So this is the style that started at all huh? I am very impressed
Dude, that was Incredible, love it
Love the hammer fists
Was the elbow strike part of Ancient Greek boxing?
This is so cool!
I love this so much!
It might be. It did happen that pankration matches ended in death. As did boxing matches, sometimes. In neither case was it very common, but yes, it did happen.
This video doesn't show pankration, it's boxing. And it's not a match, just a technique demonstration.
J'aime votre chaîne, votre reconstructions de les antiques art martials sont le plus beau que j'aie jamais vu. Pardonne moi si mon francaise n'est pas bon, mais je ne suis pas francaise.
Adorei 🏆💪
@Entheobotany They have made them themselves, with traditional materials. Leather and hardened leather.
I love anicent boxing
Damn, that's awesome. Imagine having such a long contest getting hammer punched on the head and elbowed all around.
where do you got the informations about the techniques???
wow awesome I was looking for something like this.
I may be wrong and maybe my more learned peers can help me.
It seems that the ancient boxers were strictly headhunters and never struck the body?
It depended on the kinds of wraps they were using because there was no real standard for equipment back then. Some fights were bare knuckle and thus had more body shots so as to not incur hand injuries. Also there were no rounds so quick knockouts weren’t entirely necessary. Also these guys in the video probably had more traditional modern martial arts training (boxing, striking techniques) and so were more likely to go for the head on instinct, although I could be wrong about that last bit.
knocking someone out being the main perpous of the sport is more of a modern boxing concept back then it was more of a rounded kind of martial art.
they did go for the body and other stuff. rules weren't so straight foward.
and i agree this is a recreation of the style so they probably got the fighting engine or mechanics from modern boxing. i think that it could have been WAYY different back then.
Maybe these guys are just head hunters to begin with? There's the martial arts style that you practice, but also your own personal style. Everyone has their own input, for better or worse. ;)
there was boxing in ancient Italy too.
Not only Rome but also Etruscans, and even the cultures in Sardinia and Corsica had their own style of boxing.
Now this is what i call Boxing
@3ng4n: I would love to see the pankration, could we see this also?
btw, looks very interesting.
If this is highly accurate, then it would have been cool to see it used in the colloseum
So this is why iam feeling to box like this naturally because thats how it was in ancient times
I really like it diffirint full respect
I think this shows us that ancient boxing was safer than modern boxing.
The blows are downward and there is no jerking of the head or twisting of the neck.
Even safer without gloves.
Wrestling was not allowed in boxing contests, no. You're probably thinking of Pankration, where (almost) anything was allowed.
And of course they're pulling their punches. This was just a short friendly demonstration in the middle of a lecture.
This is insane, how did these guys get the knowledge to this demonstration?
I wonder
they work from texts, depictions on vases and expérimentation.
And exactly how does it differ from modern boxing?
How was this style kept alive & not lost after thousands of years?
Either by generation to generation or it was lost and was rediscovered by a historian. There are statues of ancient boxers too, I've seen one, so we know they definitely did box and wrestle.
Não se manteve. Isso é uma recreação do estilo baseado nas pinturas encontradas
That was pretty cool to watch
Reminds me a little of Jeet Kune do
Whoever talked about fighting without getting hit?
even tho the handtrap, framing, parrying is great. ancient greek boxing use a lot of footwork, since back then people believe that war is decided bt positiin
@Theseus1000 yh true but the greeks invented it and started it in the olympics, they wore leather round their hands and fought until one was left standin, usually to the death.
@greygooseification
Umm... The romans would be a lot more stricter, I think. Colosseum matches were much more heavily regulated.
awesome how you could reconstruct this! Just wondering, where did most of your information come from? Was it mostly from pottery or are there also some literary sources?
Nice work, guys.
Fascinating.
It might be primitive but it works. Add with wrestling techniques and joint locks. That's why Spartans were feared. Wing chun looks good only in a movie. Pankration has some similar moves to 52blocks and panantukan. More primal more practical.
obviously they weren't trying to hurt each other.
@fund4ment Not really in wing tsun they have very weak punches so they would need a week or so to punch an boxer to knock him out :D Of course leg techniques are much better in wing tsun than it's hand techniques ... but it is similar somewhat.
The elbow movements make me think of Keysi
Similar to Wing Chun chain punches.
Good stuff
Buenisimo
@Marx047 if u look at vases or sculptures this is how the squared off though many modern interpretors interpret the techniques from modern sports while these guys are objectivly using what sources they have.
@Marx047 It's not pankration, it's boxing. They showed some pankration as well in another part of the demonstration.
Very interesting! Show more video please! Where it is ,Greece?
How nowadays boxing is becoming????
Where did they get the gloves from
@Theseus1000 thanks.
Almost looks like wing Chun
Err.. perhaps not? What are you actually trying to say? You said you couldn't get how anyone can fight without ever getting hit. No-one has said that anyone can, so what is it that you don't get?
Is it possible to apply these techniques to professional boxing?
Ancient greek boxing allowed any strike with the fist, but the hammer fists & spinning backfists used in thjs video are illegal in modern boxing.
good job
Is kicking allowed in this kind of boxing?
It's almost like a futuristic way of boxing. Except it's 2,000 years old lol.
@170GMS μα το ξερω απλα σου εγραψα οτι αντι να ερευναμε το δικο μας παρελθον το ερευναν οι αλλοι και εμεις ψαχνωμαστε με τα νυχια του τιγρη και αλλα αρχαια παραδοσιακα συστηματα αλλων λαων. χωρις αυτο να σημαινει οτι πρεπει να ειμαστε κολλημενοι σε κατι.
Damn Imagine getting struck by them hard leather wraps
Sometimes the wraps would be lined with metal studs or even spikes. I think the spiked ones were used in Egypt.
this is awesome.
What are your Himantes constructed of? Did you make them or buy them?
interesting style.... i wonder if teh "'sweet science" of combat arts we know today can utilize any of this? Or has boxing evolved so far ahead that this is just not that useful anymore
the thing is that in ancient greece they would fight with pieces of metal incide their leather gloves. that is why you see them be so ''scared'' of the other ones punches, it does more damage than a boxing glove or even bare knucle. so nah it woudnt be useful, but not because its antiquated, but because the phisics are different.
@@bjjkickboxing7876 Is it true that a fight could last for hours? I heard one Olympic winner went home so scarred that his own dad couldn't recognize him.
@@throughthoroughthought8064 YEEEEEP. Hours long fights were a thing up until the 1930's. There are stories of fighters losing 10+ pounds and fainting out of dehydration after hours of fighting.
Looks like wingchun
while ur standing ima be dancin around u flikin dat 1,2
Well the rules were very different for the sport then.
Yeah like "no dancing" and no "1,2"
wow you can strike legs too
Hanayama
@Marx047 Are these ancient techniques in Pankration?
This isn’t Ancient Greek boxing, they used to stay in a small circle and likely didn’t move their feet at all. Blocking and head dodging were the only movements permitted. They literally took swings at each other until the other was knocked out cold. Ancient Greek boxers would be confused at both this and modern day boxing
Não se sabe como eles lutavam ao certo
@@guilhermao8178 whilst you’re right, we can estimate from the size of the circles that they did fight in and then understand from their hand wraps. There’s a lot of suggestions to be inferred from many historical sources that enable us to say that they more or less stayed fairly stationary
So it was more like modern slap competitions than boxing, but with leather wraps and punches instead of slaps with bare hands?
@samluke8121 more or less; same type of fighting and the same philosophy, but different rules
have you ever seen the relief of pankration in BC400? have you ever seen the depiction of boxing defense on amphora which was made about BC550? both of them are really close to modern boxing stance and UFC stance. they never fought like this. sorry guys. its not ancient boxing. it looks like streek fight or highschool students fight. greek boxers are known for their technical skill
Stfu you dont know
@@40savv45 no u
You are not looking at enough sources (or you are dismissing them due to confirmation bias.) A quick Google search and I found enough evidence to prove you wrong. There is plenty of pottery showing similar stances to what they are using here. Just because they are using strikes and strategies that aren't used in modern boxing, doesn't mean that they weren't used in ancient boxing. Many of the blows and defensive techniques they use here are also used in other martial arts such as karate, muay thai, modern combatives, etc... so, ust because it doesn't look like the boxing you are used to, or the boxing you prefer, doesn't mean it is not ancient boxing. You sir, need to do more research. It's been 4 years, so hopefully you have.
@@chaos_omega
Thank u for ur reply
I guess you have never practiced boxing.
When u see the greek amohora that depicting boxing or pankration. That doesnt mean how they fight. Because the depictions show just the moment they were hitting.Not the stance.
If you see the nowadays boxing photo you can realize that the photo is same as ancient depiction and just shows the moment they are hitting. If someone who has never seen the boxing bout saw the photo. he would think that's the boxing stance.
I have three Arvanitis's books and other ancient sources like Thomas. R Martin's book, Written by Colin Renfrew, Andrew Dalby and I majored in ancient Near Eastern archeology also googling hundreds of times
Thank you for reading
@@junsungreeves7324 But it doesn't mean it's NOT how they fought either.
Why don't you look up ACTA, email them and ask them what their sources for this reconstruction are. It would be a much better idea than trying to argue with me based on appeals to authority and ad hominem attacks.
they forgot you have to be naked and whipped when breaking rules
@TamerlanKuzgov one think we can be sure off. i porabably didnt look like modern boxing as the evolution was from different circumstances
why the hell arent they punching? you expect ppl to believe that anicent boxers didn't throw punches too, you know like the bare knuckle boxer of the victorian age. and what about the clinch i thought anicent boxers also fought well in
the clinch? this looks crappy.
what did they study about ancient boxing?Greek walked on tip-toe as a step and there were much movement to avoid facing sun directly.even thogh ancient greek fully didnt understand the important of step they clearly used small step.
two guys only use straight and they punch into eachothers with their back of hands. there are no hook, uppercut, downward punch. they sould find more historical researches,
in archaic period. classical period, greek had been boxing over 500 hundreds years. there must have been much more improvements
I think boxing in the ancient Greek is the way of teaching soldier how to use sword without actually injuring them. The guard and the attack looks silly, but if they wield a sword (xiphos, for example) then this boxing became an effective martial arts. The same could be said for another old Martial arts, like wing Chun. If they're barehanded, it might look silly. But if they wield their intended weapon (butterfly sword) then their movement become a legit effective martial arts.
it is strange how similar this looks to wing chun
It is a form of pugalism that is not directly related to modern boxing: which is British.
Cool; is this pankration? Because that Fight Quest show was talking about Greek boxing/wrestling and it looked pretty much like this
Looks like jkd concepts stuff to me. Pankration used more boxing shield blocks like muay chiay according to historical accounts.
Very Wing Chun esque
if greeks fought the romans hand
to hand. its not even a fair fight.
@adui448
You know there's unwritten rules about unisex decency, right? That you can't perfectly replicate AGB by having them strip completely naked?
Also, this is a bloody exhibition, not a full-on match. I thought there're rules against fighting people in the same gym.
what are they wearing over there hands?
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cestus
upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/70/Boxer_of_quirinal_hands.jpg/1920px-Boxer_of_quirinal_hands.jpg
greeks invented boxing aswell, more greeks need to realise this nd we shall takeover boxing once again!!!
But it didnt carry over to england
je trouve les blocages avec les coudes efficaces ya pas de soucis par contre les attaques je trouve sa desordonnee
@Marx047 ie. archeology athropology.
This is not Ancient Greek boxing, this is just wing chun.
@170GMS αυτονοητα ολα αυτα
@epic0wnag ppl generally come to the same conclusions when certain methods are effective
never take this video down this is the crux to all those frauds passing off MMA as greco roman Pankratos
@statsme88
Exhibition, mate, EXHIBITION. Not a full-on match.