I was about to buy a whole new ZWO set up like you did and will now have to think about it. You have been very fair in your conclusions. Thank you for your feedback.
Absolutely, let me know if you’d like additional help. I offer 30 minute gear consults now on my webpage. Some of the links and codes I have that nobody else does usually makes it so you actually profit from booking it lol. on top of saving time and frustration trying to figure out the best stuff on your own
Thanks for the review. It's warned me off investing more deeply in ZWO. But that said, my experience has been quite good, although I've only used the ZWO cameras and filter wheel. Aside from my 2600mm developing the dreaded oil leak and the filter wheel which I dropped onto a concrete floor, all my ZWO equipment has worked flawlessly. And they resolved my oil leak issue quickly and without complaint by replacing the camera.
Yeah, it seems like if there is a big known issue, that’s basically like the equivalent of a recall they will take care of it because they know what little reputation they do have would get completely destroyed. If thousands of cameras that went bad weren’t handled appropriately it’s more of the one off issues that seem to get brushed under the rug. It’s really sad because you have somebody that spent about $10,000 on just their products alone in a two week timeframe. You think that would be somebody you would be working really hard to keep but I guess not.
Fingers crossed, I have a shed load of ZWO gear, mostly still unused due to health issues, so I am hoping that when the AM 5 mount arrives, it will work with the other gear. Sad to hear about your struggles with after sales service (lack of), this can be of top priority for my buyers living in remote locations. Greetings from Tasmania Australia.
P.S. I do think this Video and review will go viral in the astro community, as it should ! If ZWO is a crap company then they need to be called to an accounting.
I do think we need to be honest when things are good and not so good. Almost every Astro review is positive as are mine, and just because one little thing goes wrong doesn’t mean you can make a whole video but when it’s a systemic issue and all of the people are agreeing with the same problem that are commenting and clearly there’s a bigger issue here that needs to be called out.
I just made the jump to ZWO and had to send the AM5 back twice. The first issue was a loose power port, would disconnect if you only wiggled the cord and the second was a clicking noise in the RA while slewing fast. I'm crossing my fingers the rest of the equipment doesn't crap out like you're mentioning here. I did buy through High Point Scientific, who's been amazing with the returns as well as Agena. ZWO's two year warranty holds up if you purchased through these retailers. Thanks for the video.
Well unfortunately the warranty is still determined by ZWO. HPS and AA can choose to help but ultimately it’s up to ZWO, glad you are getting help though! It’s a shame that is the distributor end of covering they have to take a loss on ZWOs behalf to keep the customer happy.
Really appreciate the video and giving shout out to those who were supportive. Watching video also helped confirm my avoidance of ZWO mostly due to failure of the ASIAir to lack support for other platforms.
Yeah, of course the whole point is to help people get the best possible service and avoid any trouble they can so hopefully people will continue to use Agena it will not make sure you get good customer service. But also support the channel so I can continue to make more videos and have more products to review!
Let me start by saying agena is amazing. They’re working with me on a Seestar artifact issue. Yes I’m all zwo and I did have the guide spike issue after receiving the am5 and their CF tripod. They gave me very little support and suggested I change out the power cord as it had a tendency to come loose which could cause the spike. I did this but still had issues which I attributed to the CF mount acting like a tuning fork…so I went to an Avalon tripod and a 90 degree power connector. First time in over a year that I just had a spike so I went to home position and started over which seemed to help. We’ve all spent a ton of $ with zwo and they should be better when it comes to CS. Another story, I’m on my 3rd Vaonis vespera and it took months to have them finally agree the unit was faulty and then to send me a new unit. That was the last time I buy direct from a manufacturer. Agena we love you.
I’m sorry you went through all that as well. I know the struggle as you can see… I felt like so many people feel like they’re the only one going through it and when somebody else sheds light on it, it almost somehow makes it feel better that you’re not the only one. I’m not a big fan of the portable units yet I don’t see them being nearly the same quality as a full rig but for somebody who’s not truly into the full hobby of Astro photography and just kind of wants to see what’s up there. I think they’re OK, but not for me at this point. I think in order to get one that I would actually want to use they would need to price it several thousand dollars more than they currently are but I don’t like the fact that you can’t upgrade anything and you’re basically basically stuck with whatever it comes with. For me building and upgrading, the rig is part of the fund switching stuff out and setting it up for a specific target is really enjoyable and I love to tinker with stuff so all in one unit wouldn’t appeal to me but I do see it’s purpose and the market for which it was created for sure
Just a side note: this was not meant to be targeted towards any single person at ZWO I know I do mention two names that were kind of unavoidable because they signed the email. I do not know these two folks and Simon did actually respond at first until I was transferred off to Kristin who I never interacted with, and never responded. I always make sure to not just respond to them but also to ZWO Support in general so others can pick up if they miss it. Just wanted to make that clear - it’s nothing personal as I don’t know these people individually. I know stuff happens, but somebody else should have also received and been following up on those emails to ensure their completion. Individual people are human and make mistakes as to people who put this stuff together, that’s understandable. But there is a larger accountability to the company at large to make things right with their customers and that’s who this is really towards. It’s of course not meant to be malicious in anyway and I hope when I summarize, it’s clear that I do point out good characteristics as well and clarify that I’m only sharing my own thoughts and experiences. The point of this channel is not to call people out. But to help us all improve our astrophotography and if I can share a very negative experience, I had and perhaps help somebody else avoid it I feel it’s my duty as the creator footage channel. The better part of a year to get this rectified, and having several other situations where I was already flat up to now and had to buy an install the parts I was still going to let it all go if they would’ve came through and responded on this issue with the AM5… I’ve put out roughly 50 videos and mentioned over a dozen companies and this is the first time I’ve really had any feedback that wasn’t almost completely positive.
Yea I’ve had pretty good luck with zwo. However for the amount of money this hobby costs I’d prefer not to rely on luck. Great video and thanks for the honest review!
Thank you for this. You are as reasonable in your bad review as you are in your good, which makes this come across as very honest and professional. When I bought new gear a couple of months back, I went with another brand (Player One actually), mostly because I don't like the monopoly ZWO is trying to establish. Without "real" competition, they have no incentive to provide good customer service or product development. My experiences with Player One so far (both the camera and customer support) has been really great.
I appreciate that, so far this is a couple endorsements for player one I might have to see if they would be willing to work together and combine it with an open source platform that would allow me to run the camera and come up with a different ecosystem. What are you using to run your rig?
I'm using an intel NUC and NINA so basically just regular Windows + software via RDP. interface-wise, it is not as easy as the AsiAir (especially for beginners) but functionality-wise it's about the same. I can remote in both via a tablet or even my phone (Android).
@@Wheeljack678 yeah, I want to go with an even simpler option than that. I think that that is a very commonly used way to do it but for a beginner as you mentioned, it’s going to be challenging. Stellarmate has a software that they have installed on their device which is open source and it looks like the middle ground between Nina and the ASIAIR. Very graphic interface style, but with more capability. The eagle will work very similar to yours, other than the fact that they do have their own “Play” software now that looks VERY similar to the ASIAIR but again a bit more robust. If either of those companies can get an easy to run software set up, it would be lights out. I just need to try both of them or at least one of them. The stellarmate software looks pretty complete.
I had similar results as you...two emails and then ghosted. There is a thread on CN addressing the same frustrations. It won't be long before they are impacted. As much business they do in the US they should have a service center here. Regardless of the price point aftermarket service WILL set you apart. I was in sales along time and there is a saying. "Service, Price, Quality...pick two"
When you get a chance, if you wouldn’t mind, could you send the link either here or to my Instagram with the same name? Yeah, also in sales and I agree. Some of my other hobbies are completely different. I’m also into competitive shooting and the firearms community is totally different. All American made based in America and their warranties are above and beyond even if it’s completely your fault, most firearms and optic manufacturers will stand behind you. Also, been really into cycling for most of my life and same thing. It’s been an interesting adjustment over the last several years with Astro
@@darkrangersinc Impressive that you've been able to balance so many hobbies. I can only really maintain one hobby.. and then have a couple of minor ones. I was into shooting for awhile. Set myself up for FClass.. almost went down that rabbit hole. Then I started astro. That and the fact that the nearest match was 3 hours away and starting early mornings.. I backed off. I occasionally make it out to the range but no where near as often as I use to. I was looking at component costs the other day.. wow.. I can't believe how expensive everything is. A brick of primers use to be $40. Now, $100-$150.. that is insane!
I hope my am5 doesn't bust. Phd2, Nina, ATP and other software we use need to create android and apple apps so we're not trapped into an ecosphere like zwo. I use a surface pro to run everything. Thanks for the info.
I hope people have better luck than I do. I know plenty of others have had issues, but there is a chance you might be totally fine, they have reached out to me since posting this video and I’ve made it very clear that they’re customer service is not acceptable and they need to step it up so we’ll see what happens
Thank you for sharing your experience, and sorry to hear about these issues. I've seen some posts on FB about a procedure to tighten the belts in AM5, which should help with the guiding issues. Perhaps you could try that. Clear skies.
I’m going to see if ZWO can fix it before opening it up and then having them blame me like they tend to. They did reach out finally as a result of this video though not by responding to my emails which is disappointing so we’ll see what happens
@@darkrangersinc When I first contacted ZWO Tech Support via email regarding my malfunctioning AM5, they asked if "I was handy and could do something like adjust belts". I said "SURE, if it won't void my warranty." That was the end of that discussion. Send my mount to them Dec. 6. Still have no solution.
I think it should be noted somewhere that the ASI Air is really just PHD2 software. I just added an antenna to my ASI AIR PRO, hoping that helps but I have the AM5 and 2600MC pro and usb3 camera and guide scope...and most of it came from Agena Astro. I gotta say I'm a bit uneasy and hoping I don't have your issues. But thanks for posting your experience's.
Good video. This mirrors my support experience with the issues I had with my 2600MC Pro. It took forever to get the oil leaks resolved and I was told to use an external HUB when one of my USB2 ports died.
I'm a bit concerned about my AM5 mount after something I saw happen last night. I have occasionally seen large jumps in the tracking over the last year, but last night it started jumping back and forth on every frame. The first time I lost the frame because RA jumped and doubled the stars, then it went into a two-hour oscillation, but the frames were still usable. When I Blink the frames it really looks like it got its bell rung, with an initial large excursion followed by a ring-down over two hours, then it was stable (just regular dithers) the rest of the night. I suspect these mounts accumulate metal particles in the gears over time, and with the tight mesh even tiny bits show up in the guiding. Worm gears tend to be self-cleaning because of the wiping action, but these strain wave drives have no way to clear the debris from normal wear. I'm strongly inclined to tear it down and give it a thorough cleaning. I think we'll be hearing more of this sort of thing as time goes by.
@@darkrangersinc I've bought a lot of Chinese tooling for my home machine shop, and it's invariably filled with metal chips and grinding dust. More of a kit than a usable piece of equipment. While I would expect more care for a precision mechanism like a strain wave drive, I'm not going to be surprised by anything I find if I open it up.
Hi Ryan,on e again a really good re iew. I would like to add my point regarding zwo. We don't have many clear nights so they are precious, on this particular night, using my asiair plus, the mount kept disconnecting so I swapped to my asiair pro, changed all the cables and battery, all to no avail. These clear nights mean so much. Anyway I'm fed up with being letdown by the zwo kit I've decided to investigate other control systems such as Stellarmate.
You've just outlined why I only use their cameras. Also - a NUC running windows and full versions of software along with a pegasus PBA is preferable. Mounts right on your rig too.
Ouch. I just went all in on ZWO but I'm regretting it already. The 2600MC Pro I ordered turned out to be out of stock, although they happily took my money the second I ordered it. 2 weeks later they keep pushing the delivery back... Got a 7x2" filter wheel on its way and also the EAF. Gonna stick to EU resellers from now on. They won't leave you hanging.
Wow, what a nightmare. Gives me a warm fuzzy feeling on my ZWO gear...which everything I have except the main scope is ZWO. I have some minor issue with my ASI Air+ and sent CS an email. And never heard anything back either. I did purchase most everything from Agena...good to know they are a stand up company. Thinking I might start to migrate away now.
Despite all the issues still managed to get a good amount of images. Never thought I would learn how to replace a camera or filter wheel mother board but now I can say I know how 🤷🏻♂️😂
Hopefully I won't have that experience but the Astro community is awesome. I have the AM5 as well and so far no issues but now I know what to watch out for. @@darkrangersinc
Hi Dark, just an FYI I sent CS an inquiry last week about the DC12V outlet on my AA+ and heard back within 2 days and was requested a couple things and received a REM for the unit.
That’s good to hear! Usually on simple stuff it’s pretty quick and I know since the video the people I’ve been in contact with said they’re going to really focus on customer service moving forward so hopefully they have double down on their efforts and it’s starting to pay off!
Great video. I am all in with the ZWO ecosystem (2 AA+, AA mini, AM5, ASI2600MC Pro, ASI294MC Pro, ASI183MC, 2X ASI120MM, 3X EAF. Fortunate that I have not had major issues other than similar guiding issue with AM5. Concerned about future support... Customer service IS the most important factor for customer loyalty. Le'ts CS improves for EVERONE and not just big astro bloggers. Thanks for your honesty. I am from Canada so Agena Astro is not as practical to order from.
Curious is it just the shipping that makes agenda not practical? I’ve ordered from Canadian companies and it only added a couple days. The shipping costs I did negotiate to get waived since I was buying a scope and several accessories but the experience was good cross borders otherwise.
This was a good, honest review of the ZWO ecosystem, Ryan. I've been very fortunate to have only minor problems with my ZWO products and they've all served me well. If you're planning it, though, I'd absolutely LOVE to see you put together the 'alternative' system! In some ways I feel like I'm outgrowing and/or constrained by my ASIAir and I'm starting to explore some alternatives as well. It would be a big (a.k.a. $$) switch for me but would allow more growth in the future without the limitations imposed by a proprietary system like the ZWO products.
I sent Primaluce an Email before making this so I could have the answer but no response. I’ve been told they are tough to get a hold of so it’s probably about time to reach out again especially since we’ve added another 500 subscribers or so but that’s 100% the plan and was my goal before I even released this one They do have a $700 option. I think it’s called the LE and it does everything that you need. It’s still more powerful than the ASI air. You could get a mini computer for three or $400 but then by the time you got the Pegasus power box you’re going to be pretty much right in the same spot as the LAE which is why I’ve just saw it out the eagle besides the fact that they do have their own Raphick interface that they’re developing it’s still functional right now, but it’s getting better and better all of their devices like the auto focus and flat panels have their own Wi-Fi that you can run independently of other apps, so I like the idea of their brand over others because you have a back up way to work some of their accessories Plus the quality is really good. StellarMate is another option. I don’t know as much about them, but they have a System different than Nina. It looks a little easier more like the ASI air and it’s open source and it comes installed on the device and it’s about $500 for their top end one so that could be the back up if the Italians want to ignore us 😢
@@darkrangersinc Thanks so much for that detailed response, Ryan! I appreciate it. I have LOTS of looking before making the leap, since it may also involve another laptop and other ancillaries as well. (I use my iPad/iPhone with my ASIAir and only have an older, slower Surface Pro). Thank you again!
@@gregerianne3880 I did reach out one more time today and hopefully with a little extra nudge we will get somewhere. we just need to get one comprehensive video on how to make the switch. There’s nothing out there with the eagle that really shows you in depth how to set it up. There are some that go very high-level, but not to the extent most people are looking.
@@darkrangersinc Well, the Italians do like their riposo, so who knows?! Haha!! (I can say that since I'm Italian...😁) Seriously, I've found PrimaLuceLab products to be the best, so I wouldn't mind spending a bit more on an Eagle and be confident it will work as it should. Looking forward to hearing more!
@@darkrangersinc Well, we Italians do like our riposo, so who knows?! Hahaha! Seriously, though, I've found Primaluce products to be among the best and would be very willing to pay a little more for the quality.
I wish I'd seen this a few weeks ago. I bought (or should I say tried to buy, since the guy on cloudy nights ghosted me and hasn't sent anything and won't reply to me...) a used zwo seestar s50... I would've avoided it altogether had I seen this. Another "too good to be true and I feel for it" story... I just hope paypal good and services helps me out. After this video, no zwo for me unless they up their game quite a bit in the service dept. Please keep us updated if any of these get resolved.
I would watch till the end the middle is a little bit rough going through my experience with their customer service, but I do think as long as you get a good version of the product you will be OK. I’ve had good results with my 2600 MM and 290mm but issues with other products
Watched till the end. Great review man. Can’t blame ya, what happened, happened. Hopefully I’ll get a bit more luckier than you lol. Got my rig 3 months ago. My only complaint so far (aside some random disconnects) is the EAF. Had to sent it back and got a full refund. Really bad product in my opinion. I’ve also purchased D1+D2 Askar color magic BECAUSE YOU SAID SO. Keep it up the great work.
@@leonardoleo5250 awesome glad to hear! I actually gave them a little bit of a break on the EAF. It will miss on auto focus when switching filters sometimes, but I actually didn’t even mention that lol. It really does. Kind of suck to make a video that isn’t mostly. Since you watch my other episodes, you know, that’s the general vibe on this channel but at some point enough is enough.
Thanks for nice video. I really hope it gains many views. I have my second AM5 already. For the first one I was able to test it within 14 days and send it back. No usable guiding at all and big spikes quite often. The second one is better, but by far not as good as others are showing. It can guide between 0.3-0.6 rms for as much as a minute (sometimes) than comes the spike. Total rms for the whole session is not bad, but there is at least a single spike for every image (180s). Ironically, it looks like dithering helps stabilising those spikes. My setup is kind of forgiving so I don't need to delete many images, but still. I would be very interested in your progress with this issue. Good luck!
Just bought a complete ZWO system some $10k USD worth. Thought staying in the eco system would be a plus. This is the first full customer service burn I’ve read. Well documented and not interested to help it seems. I did buy warranties with my electronic “stuff” perhaps not the EFW or EAF. I have two airs and one Am5. Will be separating to power leads to the AA and 2600 after reading this. Sad you have to endure this. To be fair I ended up selling my 2020 Honda Pilot (Made in Alabama) after 3 years of audio repairs that were never solve. Quality control is circling the drain at many companies. I hope you post an update in a year or if a sooner resolution occurs. Sadly my new purchases will be sitting in the case until April when I finish skiing. Mixed feelings about doing that now. Ugh!
That’s about what I spent - 2600mc & 2600mm, EFW, AM5, AA+ and Mini, EAF, 290mm all at once and still not a customer worth helping a guess. If they won’t help a $10,000 customer, imagine how they’ll treat a random person who just bought one thing 🤦🏻♂️. Hopefully you luck out it’s definitely possible. But with that many components from ZWO I would say the likely hood of making it out 12 months with no issues is likely low but hopefully the additional warranties kick in if it does happen
Thanks for your review Ryan. Very helpful and your conclusions are bang on. I only own a couple of ZWO products. The Air Pro which has worked very well for me and really made me achieve much more than I could have hoped for in the 3 short years I’ve been doing this. My 2600MC Pro is a fantastic camera. Had to get ZWO to replace the motherboard. This, including all the upfront troubleshooting with Simon, took less than 2 months. ZWO was fairly prompt in their replies and in the end, just had me ship it in for repairs. I would really hope everyone else would get the same treatment, but it appears to not be the case. Thanks again. Excellent review. Dr B from Manitoba, Canada 🇨🇦
Glad to hear you got better luck than me - 2 months is still longer than acceptable in most industries but better than paying $200+ for the part and having to install it.
Getting ghosted like that.. and having a case marked resolved when it isn't is unacceptable. So frustrating. I just recently picked up an AM3.. hopefully it works out. I did purchase it from Agena.. for all the same reasons you mentioned :) CS!
hire a lawyer, sue the US distributor. Costly? Yes. Sue for damages. Sue for emotional damages. Sue for legal costs. Make them pay. If it hurts them bad enough (and enough people start doing this), they'll drop the US distributorship, which will financially hurt ZWO very badly. Other distributors will be very wary to take their products on too. If ZWO doesn't learn and adapt and improve its customer service/communications/warranty, they will start to lose sales. Losing sales is a great motivator for any business.
What was the cause of the failure of the power circuit output of the ASIAIR, with all your controller board failures and other issues wondering if you had a power issue that caused downstream issues in all your components and they just failed within months of each other.
I did not realize they could void your warranty when opening your device. There is a law in the USA, right to repair and and void warranty when removed stickers are illigal for consumer electronics.
It’s somewhat makes sense if you think about it if somebody does try to “fix it” it makes it worse than it potentially could be somewhat the customers fault. but I’ve seen claims denied when things are opened up, and even if the customer didn’t make it worse, had them blamed for the problem because they opened it up and inspected it
Interesting I’ll try that out, I do have an ASI mini where you have to use USB2 & I found that the transfer times were the same as when I first got the ASIAIR plus, it is 480 MB a second I believe for USB two so on a 50 MB file it still should only take very little time. But lately the plus has slowed down dramatically and I feel like the range and overall connection strain has diminished. I might look at upgrading the antenna but I don’t understand how an antenna or signal strength loses power overtime but maybe there is a shelflife to them?
Literally, the most dependable vehicles on the planet! That’s a great point can’t blame it all on country of origin when you have companies like that, putting out vehicles that do half a million miles regularly
My 2600MC cooler stops working when it can’t reach the temperature. ZWO told me to replace the cables but still the same problem. My Risingcam IMX571 just keeps on working at 100% even if it can’t reach the temperature. The cooler is also way faster, 90s vs 10min+. I payed 1300€ vs 2500€ so that’s a lot of money saved.
I’m hoping to build a relationship with one of these other camera companies, and one of the computer companies that are open source so I can put together a video or two on how to make the transition if people want to. I know there are a couple channels that do it but not many most are either using the ASIair or a computer laptop base system versus a Wi-Fi set up.
You triggered me too, ok, happy new year and well, I refuse to go asiair and I cut the corner theoretically thanks to the forums, I own a Primaluce Eagle LE and come on, they are not that expensive. The thing is that I sleep and they are portable, My EQ6 is not, and I'm now going to take a look to other mount option. Thanks for taking the time to teach and share your experience. I had the same issues with Celestron, just stay away. SkyWatcher and iOptron are for me are doing things right. My next camera may by a QHY or a Player One if they keep prices close to ZWO.
Well, I think if you look at all of the other comments, plus you could see all of the individual messages and emails. I got from people who experienced the same type of thing I would more frequent than it should be. The market is so strong and they do have a pretty big fan primarily of newer Astro photographers who haven’t used their equipment for multiple years so they’re 6 months in and everything is fine and they rave about their stuff online. Also because of the fanboy effect if people speak out against them they often get ridiculed online since so many people use it. So I think a lot of people bite there tongue. Honestly it had to get really bad for me to finally put out an episode like this. There are better options in the same price range. I’ve been having great luck with companies like Stellarvue for scopes, Primaluce for electronics, and Losmandy for mounts. PrimaLuce stuff is a bit more their EAF is $260 instead of $200 for example but it’s got built in wifi it’s made in Italy vs China and if you get their Eagle it can run wireless which is actually more dependable than USB cables. So there are plenty of options out there I’ve found that often and times the most popular option in Astro photography is usually not the best
Did the camera issues fall under warrantee coverage? I have had 1 issue with my 294MC Pro but it was may fault. They had me send it to some address in NJ so I sent it to them and a few weeks later I had it returned. I had an issue with my guide camera - ended up being a bad USB cable - which I purchased upgraded cables. The ASI AIR Pro does go crazy when it guides past the meridian so my solution is that I do not let it hit meridian. I am unsure if I am lucky and you just had bad luck with your units. I did not buy into their mounts - I am happy with my EQ6R-Pro, but I would not want to carry it on a hike. The Customer Service is horrible, but I would try to stick with your vendor. I am not defending them - but your best options is to work with the company who sold it to you and let them talk to their ZWO Reps.
I wonder if communications with ZWO are “lost in translation.” No disrespect intended, but I wonder if it is better to try to translate communications into Chinese when sending it
Yeah, that’s a valid point, but they have so many people purchasing in English-speaking countries. It’s kind of irresponsibility to make sure they have the customer service to handle it. they’re responding in English (when they respond) and the First Gentleman that actually did tell me to send logs in is native English speaker but the folks I was submitting logs to I could tell perhaps were like not born speaking English to your point but their responses were still very understandable. I felt like this was more true earlier on when I was dealing with my electronic filter wheel that was several months before the amount, and I was dealing with “Wu” and his responses all came around midnight so communication took forever because it would be one sentence every other day basically and usually took a couple days between replies only to have my warranted denied. There’s absolutely no trying to reasoning with them so you could be right. But they understand it enough to communicate back-and-forth in a way that makes sense.
Goodness, NOW I see this video. Just dropped al little over $7K on a WO scope but the rest is a ZWO ecosystem. (AM5, Plus, 2600MC, 120). Hoping I hit the equipment lottery Yikes. I did go thru Agena so thats a plus side on the scales. I can be a one & done when it comes my money if Customer service bites me. I emailed a question to their respective CS and it did take over a week to get back with me. Thanks again to your dedication to the hobby and your subscribers which you made a new one today.
I can’t seem to get to the Latest OSC and Narrowband Processing Guide link. When I login to google it says some went wrong try again later. This happens over and over. Would love to get to that guide, thanks.
Funny you should mention the AM5 guide spikes. I'm having the same issue, but I initially thought it was my guiding setup. Now after watching your issues, I think I have a bad copy of the AM5 as well. Same exact issue where the guiding is great and all of the sudden it goes absolutely haywire. I'm interested to see how many other folks are having this issue!
I found a whole group of people so it’s not just us. It seems like some of the updates have helped a bit there was a time the mount was UNUSABLE but I think enough folks complained that they found a way to mitigate it a bit. It’s worst near the meridian for me which is the most valued data unfortunately but I can keep more subs now than I could months back.
@@darkrangersincHow did they mitigate the spiking? Is your AM5 from the first production run with a 430 sec cycle or the 2nd production run with the 288s cycle ?
@@hael8680 I’d have to look at the spec sheet that came with it. I didn’t get it right away when it came out, I wasn’t on the waiting list or anything like that. It had been out for close to six or seven months I think it went to pre-order sales in April if I’m not mistaken, just going from memory. So they had been shipping them for a while before I ordered. I’m assuming the guides spikes have gotten better because of software updates I know they were working on that pretty heavily but I don’t know that for a fact. The spikes aren’t gone. But they are less periodic. And nowhere near the capacity so it shouldn’t be a problem and I do polar align every couple nights even when I’ve had perfect polar alignment, and I do level my tripod with an actual Bubble Level. It still has the issue.
Ouch! So far my ASI2600MC Pro, ASI290mm & 5 position filter wheel have worked great. However if there is ever an issue I am now the wiser. I would love to see a review on the PrimaLuceLab Eagle5 S WiFi computer - especially compared to the ASIAIR Pro/Plus. Great info Ryan...
Me too maybe since I flashed it a couple times they’ll send one 😂❤. The 2600 since I swapped, the motherboard has been fine like I said, I just think it’s mostly quality control issue, and then a lack of help on the flipside.
This has been eye opening and something I had hoped wouldn’t be the case. I have about $2500 in zwo parts in my cart that I want to purchase but am reconsidering now and will research alternatives instead. Shame on them.
It’s tough to make an episode like this and it really took a lot to get to the “final straw” moment, but I felt like I had to share my experience. I’m not telling anybody not to buy from them. I’m just sharing my experience and allowing people to make the decision decision that’s right for them. as you can see from the comments it’s happened to many people, but some people have also been pretty lucky. Having said that I would love to check in with some of those comments that haven’t had any issues in two years and see where they’re at 😬. Hope it was helpful and appreciate you being a part of the channel
As I have been considering an AM3 or 5.mount, I found that vey interesting. My limited experience with ZWO has been good, but I do not use their cameras I only use their focusers, filter wheel, ASIAir mini ( for Canon DSLR ) and a mini guider for the Canon rig. I use an Eagle LE ( this is their cheapest model - can't really afford the 4 or 5) for my other rigs. I have noticed recently that my filter wheel doesn't always change over ( I'm still looking into this ) My ASIAir Mini seems to work fine, but the Eagle is of course far more versatile, I currently run Sharp Cap 4.0 on it but it will just as easily run NINA, APT etc if prefered and will support most astronomy cameras and DSLRs, mounts, rotators etc.
Like I said you could get one that works fine but as you can see from the comments I’m not the only one with issues with the AM5 but if you’re heart is set on it then you can go for it. Just giving you my experience and best I can hope is it doesn’t happen to you. One thing I can say pretty confidently is if something does go wrong it’s not going to be a great experience to fix it. I don’t think that is a matter of luck, or anything else other than the fact that they just don’t prioritize customer service the way they need to
@@darkrangersinc Actually I was thanking you for making me think twice. As my old EQ6-R still works fine I'm in no real hurry to replace it. Thank you again for sharing your experience I will definitely take this on board.
@@KevinRudd-w8s oh, OK I thought you were saying that you were considering it and you’ve had a good experience as far so you were going to go with it and I’m not saying that it’s a bad idea it just didn’t work out for me. I would look at the Pegasus version it’s an extra thousand dollars but it’s also 50% more payload capacity. The EQ6 is a very dependable amount. I would run that until you could go with something with a heavier payload. I also think the SW 350 the next step up from the 6 looks really nice.
What a nightmare Ryan! It would interesting to see now after the post if they get back in touch but I guess you won’t hold your breath I’m hopeful having lots of ZWO equipment that my gear holds out or if I have issues, that company in Sydney come through for me. My skywatcher gti mount failed last year and they sent me a new one No problem Cheers Si
Yeah I mean the mother boards for both issues totaled a little over $300 so it wasn’t horrible but not something I would have ever imagined paying for on brand new stuff with a 2 year warranty. I’m sure you’ll be ok for most of your stuff.
@@darkrangersinc My AM5 had a few of those massive spikes the other night so aim gonna need to keep an eye out I’ve just sent your link to my Astro gear provider in Sydney to ask a few questions just in case o have that problem ongoing. Thanks for posting this Ryan
Ouch! not quite what I was expecting, but great to know. I had a challenge with my first Air and did not get immediate support but the distributor quickly replaced it for me. I thought it was just "one of those things" where the distributor/seller takes on the responsibility as intermediary and people expecting too much from the manufacturer are disillusioned. I wonder what their feelings are about QC and supporting such issues now. Apart from that however, it has been a good journey these past 2+ yrs. My AA+ and 533MC have been tireless workhorses but there are enough red flags out there that I started gathering parts for a second NINA setup to build next year. I was seriously tempted by the AM5 but held off to see what others can do with strain wave tech. Just watching the incredible advancements the last 2 years, the next year will surely see some more competitors. I would love to see a 2024 series of building a NINA rig, I'll follow along :)
Well, I’m glad you got some good help from the distributor. When their stuff works it does fine. I have tons of time on my 2600 MM without any issues it’s just a little bit of luck at the draw. I think a lot of people are not fortunate enough to be able to image as much as I am able to as well so they might not not run into problems as quickly as I do or maybe ever. That could be another contributing factor, but no matter how much you’re using it, there’s no excuse for the lack of Customer Service.
On the camera they just flat out denied coverage and said I could send it in and pay them to fix it and I said it’s well within the two-year warranty and I reported the initial USB hub problem right away so from the second time I’ve used it you know there has been an issue. For the filter wheel, they said the USB 2.0 plug was pushed in too far which made no sense. You can only push them in a certain amount and then they stop. It’s not like I took a hammer to it and smashed the male end it. I gently put it in as I do all cables that have worked fine on the hundreds of electrical devices I own. There really was no explanation. Other than that they just come to the conclusion I asked to speak to somebody above them and they won’t let you. They didn’t have a phone number I could call and I was dealing with somebody responding at midnight and taking a couple days between each response, so the back-and-forth on those two lasted about a month and a half and I finally gave up because it was ruining my entire imaging season. Once you get to about the 25 email mark you realize they’re not going to do anything and they don’t even justify why in a way that’s logical. In all fairness, this review actually took it pretty easy on them. I didn’t go into every customer service issue because they were all pretty much the same they went nowhere.
That’s bs they should have covered it and for the usb on wheel wtf it sounds faulty. I have a lot of zwo stuff including the am5 hopefully they hold up. I have had pretty good customer service from them but it was only communication don’t know about actual service. Well thanks for all your work appreciate it got the quad antlia filter you reviewed can’t wait to use it take care 👍
I haven't gone down the ZWO route as I prefer to have choice plus I do not have a huge budget to begin with. I remember the leak on the sensor people were having & their response was to just clean it off rather than send it for repair. The ASi Air is a great device but as we already know you'll end up being locked into one ecosystem plus from what I've read in the open source communities there's some questionable legalities with it. After watching your video it's definitely another nail in the coffin for ZWO I just wish vendors out there would give us more choice rather than just a handful of CCD's & ZWO everything else as I would like to see more choice out there. Great video to clear skies
Enjoyed the vid, but sorry to hear about your experiences. Mine has been the opposite (fingers crossed it stays that way). I went all in with their ecosystem as I liked the idea of everything running from 1 small box, which makes it better for portability. I have the 294mm and mc pro, 3 different guide cams, 8 position efw, 3 eaf's and 3 asiair +'s, and the am5. For the most part each has worked well. I do have an asiair pro which the usb ports died on, so there's that lol. I really agree with you about wishing they would open up the compatability though.
How did they handle the ASI air pro not working correctly? I mean even though you’ve had several good experiences it’s still not great that the main controller is essentially inoperable but glad most of it is working 💪🏼
Hopefully it stays that way like I said the AM5 worked great for me for about six months. I do also image quite a bit. I’m lucky that I have clear skies a lot, so I probably do get more use out of it having said that six months isn’t acceptable even if you’re imaging every day though.
@@rvoykin Originally I didn't realize the USB's were faulty. I was trying to connect to my other mount (EQ6R-Pro) and no matter what it wouldn't connect. The ASIAIR Pro would power up and work fine other than the USB. The tech support at ZWO were actually pretty helpful, they kept trying to troubleshoot, even sending me a new firmware for the AAP, but after awhile I figured out it was the USB ports, by then the warranty was expired so I let the issue drop. I still have the pro, and might replace the board at some point, but I'm in no rush.
@@darkrangersinc 6 months is not acceptable at all. Hopefully this vid gets their attention. I image as much as I can, but I live in a perpetually cloudy area. From Oct 22 - April 23, I think we had only 1 or 2 clear nights.
If I recall correctly wasn't the Player One brand set up by a former ZWO employee who was unhappy with their practices in there? I recall reading that somewhere when looking at getting my first dedicated astro camera. Ive seen a lot of positive feedback about them online. I ended up going with the Uranus-c Pro as a bit of all rounder and bar a small bit of tilt it performs extremely well. First light went so well I didn't even realise I forgot to turn the cooler on and was imaging at 21 Celsius all night, virtually no noise at all. Still waiting to run it through its paces on planetary as Ireland is buried under clouds for months now but overall it seems they are simply trying to upstage ZWO in terms or price, quality control and customer service for the same equipment. Exactly what a pissed off ex-employee would do 😂
I don’t actually know the backstory, but that would be pretty cool. I know this has happened several times in the past where people leave a company because they don’t agree with how they do things and form a better version of the same brand. I would love to work with a company like Player one in the future so who knows maybe as the channel continues to grow they’ll reach out 🤷🏻♂️
@@darkrangersinc may even be worth your while asking them. If you were to refer them to your video and demonstrate how you want an apples to apples comparison they might be happy to send some equipment for testing etc. If I were part of their team I would say this could be a nice arrow in their quiver for tapping into the market more and driving more competition in the market. Seems like everywhere I look these days its ZWO ecosystems and I'm not a fan of having all my eggs in one basket for the exact reasons you brought up here.
Unfortunately quality control and customer service are always issues with PRC companies (and I say this as someone who lived in the PRC for many, many years). So far (touch wood) I have not had any major issues with my ZWO equipment, which is pretty much all I have. I am a bit tied to them because of my reliance on the ASIAIR, but I hope to migrate to NINA at some point, and that would give me a bit more leeway. I’m surprised Simon hasn’t been more helpful-he’s based not far from me in NZ, and I’ve found him to be very onto it when it comes to helping customers out.
At first it seemed like it was going to workout, he was fairly responsive and said to send logs via the bug system. The problem was after that it took a long time to get a response and when I did from the people in Support, they sent me an update that didn’t do anything, but marked the case “resolved”. When I saw that after I had sent the multiple follow up screenshots showing it wasn’t resolved. I was pretty upset obviously. So when I reached back out via email, and he passed me off to someone else, I was surprised. That’s the last reply I’ve gotten from ZWO several months ago. When I email, I make sure to not just reply directly to one person as well. I try to include the general ZWO email so it catches more than one eye.
To me, having a closed source set up that forces you to buy their product is a pretty cheap way to force further sales. It’s almost like they know they can get away with it because people get stuck on the operating system and then can’t or won’t leave
Yeah I mention in further down in the comments here I’ve been looking at it for a while. Primaluce is going to send me an Eagle 5 and a focuser. I’ll do the same level of in-depth review on the eagle, and then everybody can choose whatever is best for them! I definitely think the stellar is a viable option! I think both are great products one is a little more expensive, and probably a little bit more difficult to set up, but more robust from a software and hardware standpoint, and the other is essentially an ASIair on steroids, which might an easier transition both have pros and cons. I’m a fan of both! The eagle is tried and true for many years. I don’t know what the long-term reviews are like on the stellar mate because it’s still fairly new, but other than that it looks really good.
I just stumbled across your video...first of all: I'm sorry for you and the amount of frustration you had (still have?) to deal with...on the other hand: what do you expect from a company who took open source material and "built their empire on it" without giving credit to whom credit is due or to put it in other words: craping a shitton of BS on licenses and copyright... Anyway, your video convinced me to save up a bit longer and get the Nyx-101. Clear skies
Good choice on the mount. TBH I’m not super techie and up to date in terms of the rules or laws with open source stuff and I wasn’t aware of it when I made the purchase. I just took them at the Word when they said they had a two-year warranty, that they would honor it. For some reason people aren’t super vocal in the Astro community about experiences that aren’t positive. I have since found a guiding spike thread on cloudy nights for the AM5 so it’s out there. But you see all these comments about people having bad experiences. It just seems to get suppressed very well.
So if you could go back and start over again what system would buy? I am trying to decide what mount would be the easiest for me, I am a beginner to astrophotography and my budget is limited. None of these RUclipsrs who do reviews mention this crap. Tu
The EQ6r is pretty tried and true if you’re looking for the same payload. I mention the eagle a couple times as an alternative as well as some different camera options. One of the camera options I mentioned player 1 sells most of the other accessories like filter wheels, guide cameras, etc.
One thing I forgot to say in the video just because there was so much to cover was that I don’t expect companies to be perfect. This is all mass produced in China for the most part so I understand it. But I do expect companies to at least be responsive. I think responsive means less than six months lol
Wow, great video, my own ASIAIR plus just won’t guide, no blue or red lines what so ever. I keep thinking I’m doing something wrong? Crap, time to switch suppliers I guess.
Thanks for the video. Please, could you turn down all these sfx and music blips? They shouldn't be louder than the VO. For folks who listen to your video on proper audio this is quite distracting. 🙏🏻
The problem is the majority of people are not listening to it on anything but their cell phone or computer, so when you turn it down much more, it becomes tough to hear. I listen to my own videos with a pretty nice set of Bose headphones, and don’t experience any issues. I know earlier on several months ago had them all at 0DB. But since turned them down below, my voice and I monitor the volume in Final Cut Pro to ensure that. They are all set to -9 DB so they shouldn’t be louder than my voice which averages between -3 and -6. I can try to turn them down more, but then on mobile devices, that most people listen to this on, you can’t hear the music or effect or it’s very difficult Can you clarify what you are listening to the videos on? I’ve heard them through my Sonos speakers, Harmon Cardin car speakers, just my cell phone, just my iPad, and with a couple different sets of headphones to test the audio and it all sounds normal.
When it seemed like you were trying to give some actual feedback, as you can see, I did respond weeks ago with some follow-up questions to clarify to which you didn’t respond. I do listen to my own videos with all of the gear above that you mentioned you also do when not in your “6-figure audio room” and with the exception of one other person months ago you are the only person who has commented on the volume of my FX of the literal thousands who watch. So I really couldn’t tell if you were just trolling or being genuine, and then your message today, with the heart attack comment on my most recent video seemed either disingenuous or passive aggressive. Telling somebody that a video that they put a decent amount of effort in on their spare time for free that gives you a heart attack because their sound effects are ever so slightly too loud is a bit off putting. Hence my response but it is true that I haven’t changed anything and I don’t hear what you’re saying I asked several of my Patreon members they say it’s fine and when I asked you what you were listening on to try to get an understanding of the issue you didn’t say anything. So it didn’t really seem like the comments were a genuine attempt to help more-so someone being overly nit-picky and after the “6-figure” comment a bit pretentious. To someone who’s at the end of the day making free content for you to consume and improve your astrophotography. Having said that, I’ll look into some of the other sound effects. I’m also available on IG if you’d like to message me as a one off 👍🏼
@@darkrangersinc Hi, I'm sorry I must have missed the first reply but I think everything was said already on the other video, including tips and tricks on how to best tackle this, if you would like to. Again: I was just trying to give back some tips from a field I know inside-out as a thanks for you sharing all this info with us so we can take better astro photos! Maybe I'm the only one that said anything but I doubt people enjoy to get blasted by cinematic riser sound effects (for example on a PI-tutorial of yours), loud sudden whooshes, music stingers etc. We shouldn't have to keep our hands on the volume knobs in case anything loud pops up. Your voice is the bread and butter, the info we subscribed for and want to learn from, everything else should be subtle salt and pepper to spice it up. Never meant for this to cost much of both our time. Thanks for the offer but I don't use social media besides YT.
I think plenty are having success but I’ve been alerted to a thread in cloudy nights since posting this video and there’s a laundry list of people with the same complaint. If it works it’s a feature packed mount but if it doesn’t 🤷🏻♂️. The EQ6r may not be as “sexy” but anyone I know that owns it especially the newest version says it’s a tank and dependable
@darkrangersinc yeah i have been hearing mixed feelings on the am5. Im primarily looking at the ioptron cem40,but the eq6r i havent heard anything negative really
@@turbo80lxcoupe I know several with the sky watcher EQ6r that love it. Maybe not as sexy but it’s very dependable. I went to Dark Sky sites all the time with my CGEM2 it was a heavy beast but it’s possible I’m pretty sure the sky watcher is lighter than that and if you’re using it mostly the backyard, it really doesn’t matter. The cool thing about the CEM is you can get it with an encoder which will make it potentially more accurate auto guiding without having to run an auto guiding set up! It’s an extra chunk of change for sure not cheap they advertise
@darkrangersinc thats good to know about the adapter. Yeah the cem40 is a beast. I should look at the eq6r again harder.i feel like price was a little easier to swallow. So far my cem 26 is running great but im waiting to see how it handles my skywatcher 150p quattro
It is good to call ZWO out on the lack of support. That kind of responsiveness is UNPROFESSIONAL. It kind of makes me cautious about buying one of their telescopes, now.....
Thanks I always want to keep it positive but if simply describing my experience paints a bad picture it kind of is what it is. Even though I did feel a little bad, I would feel worse not being honest. I’ve actually bit my tongue for a long time because I wanted to give them the opportunity to make it right. I did try to put all the good qualities at the end but felt like it was a situation that needed telling.
Sadly this is reflective of the price driven race to the bottom with most Chinese products. I've seen this with tools, electronics, and most of what's offered on Amazon. I second Agena Astro and also Astronomics as good companies to deal with. Losmandy has been my go to for mounts, the product is good, well supported, and the customer service is second to none but they do not offer the grab and go type harmonic mount you're needing. Avalon Zero maybe?
Yeah, unfortunately you have to get a premium brand with premium pricing to get good customer service. It’s a shame because if these Chinese companies could get customer service down, they would be pretty untouchable with a little additional quality control. Even if pricing went up 10% I think people would pay it to get a slightly better product and somebody to actually talk to. I can’t imagine having a team of English speakers full-time would be that detrimental to their bottom line with all of the products they sell. Especially when you factor in the loss of revenue from folks who are sick of dealing with repeated issues. I’ve used astronomics once and had a great experience. It was for my telegizmo 365. It was backordered, but they stayed in touch with me, and when it was ready to ship got it out.
I think what I need to do is just get a more solid mount for home use and then have them fix the AM5 if they ever do and just use that for travel only that way it won’t get a lot of use as I really only shoot a couple days a month on the road.
Man, if I could, I'd give you10,000 likes for this video. I am completely frustrated with a malfunctioning AM3 (used it for about 4 weeks, and only when the skies were clear...), and it has only been 14 days since I emailed their customer (non)support. Immediately, I learned I will NOT be talking to anyone about the issue. Only email, and 1 per day, since they are on the other side of the planet. As I type this, I am looking at the mount, in its case, wishing I had not bought the damn thing in the first place.
Yeah, I had the same thing happened. You maybe are lucky to get communication every other day because they don’t reply until midnight and then by the time you reply they’re gone for the day. Not having a phone number to me. Seems pretty unacceptable in 2023 but unfortunately that’s the only option they have for now. Sorry to hear you’re dealing with the same thing I did hopefully it resolves itself pretty quickly :-/
@@darkrangersincThanks for the reply. Well, there's always milky way core season early next year, so I guess I have something positive to look forward too. Good luck with your quest to get your issue resolved.
My fella believes you may have a power supply issue; he believes this is indicative of the fact that all starts out okay, then goes to 🤬. He has the ZWO parts you have enumerated, with the exception (he says) of the camera, and has n o n e of the issues you’ve encountered. Good luck going forward. Hope this is of benefit to you.
They finally sent a replacement head, after I released a video and the issue went away with the exact same power supply, so it was not a power supply issue. It was clearly mechanical.
It took me taking to their social media telling people to buy gear else where before they even offered via social media messenger to finally fix the camera by that time almost a year passed so I sold my 2600 and went to QHY who is total opposite of ZWO.. Sounds like typical zwo.. I am shocked people still buy their stuff after hearing the horror stories.. the dice roll is not worth it
Lost so much money due to big astro companies not being serious, kinda blows my mind that its so widespread but it sucks. Its not just one region, its world wide. Guess the hobby is so small that they can do w/e they want, i expected more out of fellow nerds but i learned its one of the most deceiving communities / hobby / business. Sry for negative post, its not all bad but there's shockingly amount of bad out there :/ Personally iv'e not had a bad experience with Zwo products, i had one problem but was something i fixed my self to save some time.
Since this video for the last couple months, I’ve been working really hard to find a reputable group of companies to work for, and have built some strong partnerships, and really made some good strides here. Ryan@darkrangersinc.com if you want any recommendations. I’ve found a really good telescope company, one for mounts, and one for the electronic accessories. I’ve met with them and are in contact with them and know that if you get something from anyone of these companies, they will take care of you and if you have any problems, you can let me know as well and I will reach out on your behalf
Well done video. Very professional like. The following is just a spitball: You have a lot of equipment crapping the bed in a short amount of time and maybe that is raising the brows of ZWO thinking it's user error? You have to admit it's unusual to have so much go so wrong from one person. Again, not throwing stones, I'm a problem solver by profession so just trying to find why a company would be so unwilling to just say, "Ok. Let's just replace the mount, the filter wheel and everything else that went wrong." As far as ZWO wanting to be a closed off ecosystem, I see no problem with that. They put the R&D plus costs into it so why not keep it to themselves? Many companies are like that. Nikon comes to mind right away. Third party lenses have to be reversed engineered. People are buying into the ZWO system and are well aware it's closed off. Don't like it? Don't buy it. Again, very professionally made video and you earned a new subscriber.
The issues all happened months apart. The camera happened on the second use I don’t know how you would blame me. I’ve used the same model of camera years prior. The issue with the electronic filter wheel happen a couple months later. The issue with the mount was roughly month 6. Also, the poor treatment started right away with telling me just to get a USB hub rather than replacing it. I’m not the only one that was literally another comment today saying the same thing happened to them with the same response. Look at all of the other comments in this video they are just flat out not good at customer service. Even since the video when they reached out and tried to make it better, there’s been several issues and I’m going to be making a follow up. The head of North America and customer service reached out 48 hours after making the video promising to make it better and wanting to work with me to repair the relationship. She said she would send out amount the following week and 3 1/2 weeks later after checking in three more times they still have not sent it out and finally did after almost a month. I guess I can see where you’re coming from as somebody trying to problems solve, but trying to blame an Astro photographer who’s giving them all the chances in the world to fix it isn’t on me neither is GHOSTING me for months. Also, their software isnt proprietary. It’s fairly well known in the industry to be basically just pirated from other people. They are the only people to do that Primaluce which is a far superior product doesn’t lock down their system I just got my hands on one and I’m updating it now. Neither does Stellarmate. Just because you can do something doesn’t mean you should if your product is actually the best then people will simply choose to get it. They rely on heavy marketing, and that’s why people buy it not quality control, good, customer service, and a good consistently well-made final product. There’s a reason there are dozens of other comments in here with the same experiences mine and now that I switched to other brands the experiences night and day different. They have customer service phone numbers where the owner or somebody who actually knows what they’re talking about pick up right away. If there’s a problem, they will solve it in a timely manner, and actually stand behind the products. As I said, the only reason I got stuck with all of this is because I got it all at once, and I will never buy one of their products again. You’re free to do whatever you think is right, but I can promise you there are better options for the same price or very similar price that you will be much more happy with the longer run. You will see a bigger switch away from them in the future. People just are fearful that they don’t know how to set up a more complicated system, but I just got in an Eagle 5s, camera, EFW, eaf, all from a different brand it will run on Nina. And I will put out a two-part complete series on how to make the switch so everybody can see how easy it is to go an alternative route I’ve also built a relationship with Losmandy who has excellent customer service and is sending out a mount to test and Stellarvue for handmade scopes in the US. The first time I called both companies I got the owner or the head of operations. Anytime you call they pick up the phone and their products are handmade in the US I’ll take that all day. You have to consider I’ve now made over 60 videos, talking about dozens of brands, and I’ve only made one negative comment about one brand. That’s pretty telling when 2-3 dozen other companies all get recommended or at least no negative comments but these guys do. 99.9% of my videos are nothing but positivity. You have to really want to mess up to get something negative said about you by me on this channel. Which you will see as you watch more.
@@yervantparnagian5999 it’s all good, I’m just explaining where I’m coming from. Of course, I immediately try to diagnose any potential errors that could’ve been my fault. Believe me I’d actually much prefer it to be my issue because then I can fix it or I can just take accountability and handle it where I have a problem is when it’s not my fault and I can’t get support from the company that sold me a product with a two-year warranty. They don’t want to back up.
Shame you don't live in the UK. If you have an issue with a product, your contract is with the retailer NOT the manufacturer and the retailer is responsible for sorting any issues for the first year, or within the period of the warranty if they offer an extended warranty. If you have a decent retailer they will usually just ask you to send the product back and give you a new one.
Yeah that would be good for me but bad for the distributor who would just have to eat the costs since the manufacturer won’t honor their own warranty. The real issue is the company not backing their products and not responding to customer service inquiries. Also I bought the mount from ZWO everything that did get fixed was through Agena and they did give me some reconciliation.
So a company hets grief for making a decent product that you can't use on other makers gear!! So of Ford makes an ecu upgrade do yet get annoyed you can't use ot on am audi... really!! I get the QC issues and poor support but you really can't insist they open up to their competition. Plus there are enough forums and Facebook groups that this would become known issues pretty damned quick. Also, did you buy direct from zwo? Always best to buy via a shop who would then be liable to sort out any issues.
That’s such a bad analogy. Every other company that makes some sort of onboard computer design for Astrophotography allows for Open source and the ability to use any type of product you want. This is one of the biggest and most common complaints about the ASIair. Most people who buy the product still wish that you would have the option to buy whatever camera or accessories you want especially considering they don’t even make some of the accessories available like camera rotator, or flat panel. I don’t know if you’re new to the hobby but this is a pretty common issue people have with ZWO.
Join our community for additional help and support and a great group of Astrophotographers
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I was about to buy a whole new ZWO set up like you did and will now have to think about it. You have been very fair in your conclusions. Thank you for your feedback.
Absolutely, let me know if you’d like additional help. I offer 30 minute gear consults now on my webpage. Some of the links and codes I have that nobody else does usually makes it so you actually profit from booking it lol. on top of saving time and frustration trying to figure out the best stuff on your own
A mini PC and Nina is the way to go. Easy to use, open source, not locked in in a system.
100% agree.
Thanks for the review. It's warned me off investing more deeply in ZWO. But that said, my experience has been quite good, although I've only used the ZWO cameras and filter wheel. Aside from my 2600mm developing the dreaded oil leak and the filter wheel which I dropped onto a concrete floor, all my ZWO equipment has worked flawlessly. And they resolved my oil leak issue quickly and without complaint by replacing the camera.
Yeah, it seems like if there is a big known issue, that’s basically like the equivalent of a recall they will take care of it because they know what little reputation they do have would get completely destroyed. If thousands of cameras that went bad weren’t handled appropriately it’s more of the one off issues that seem to get brushed under the rug.
It’s really sad because you have somebody that spent about $10,000 on just their products alone in a two week timeframe. You think that would be somebody you would be working really hard to keep but I guess not.
Terrified now. My AM5 arrives tomorrow, wish I'd seen this earlier. Thanks for your report. Clear skies.
And let me guess. Since you've had it, it works flawlessly.
Fingers crossed, I have a shed load of ZWO gear, mostly still unused due to health issues, so I am hoping that when the AM 5 mount arrives, it will work with the other gear. Sad to hear about your struggles with after sales service (lack of), this can be of top priority for my buyers living in remote locations. Greetings from Tasmania Australia.
P.S. I do think this Video and review will go viral in the astro community, as it should ! If ZWO is a crap company then they need to be called to an accounting.
I do think we need to be honest when things are good and not so good. Almost every Astro review is positive as are mine, and just because one little thing goes wrong doesn’t mean you can make a whole video but when it’s a systemic issue and all of the people are agreeing with the same problem that are commenting and clearly there’s a bigger issue here that needs to be called out.
Except ZWO is NOT a crappy company. One click baiters experience does not tell the tale. You think if everything worked he could have a video?
I just made the jump to ZWO and had to send the AM5 back twice. The first issue was a loose power port, would disconnect if you only wiggled the cord and the second was a clicking noise in the RA while slewing fast. I'm crossing my fingers the rest of the equipment doesn't crap out like you're mentioning here. I did buy through High Point Scientific, who's been amazing with the returns as well as Agena. ZWO's two year warranty holds up if you purchased through these retailers. Thanks for the video.
Well unfortunately the warranty is still determined by ZWO. HPS and AA can choose to help but ultimately it’s up to ZWO, glad you are getting help though! It’s a shame that is the distributor end of covering they have to take a loss on ZWOs behalf to keep the customer happy.
Really appreciate the video and giving shout out to those who were supportive. Watching video also helped confirm my avoidance of ZWO mostly due to failure of the ASIAir to lack support for other platforms.
Yeah, of course the whole point is to help people get the best possible service and avoid any trouble they can so hopefully people will continue to use Agena it will not make sure you get good customer service. But also support the channel so I can continue to make more videos and have more products to review!
Let me start by saying agena is amazing. They’re working with me on a Seestar artifact issue. Yes I’m all zwo and I did have the guide spike issue after receiving the am5 and their CF tripod. They gave me very little support and suggested I change out the power cord as it had a tendency to come loose which could cause the spike. I did this but still had issues which I attributed to the CF mount acting like a tuning fork…so I went to an Avalon tripod and a 90 degree power connector. First time in over a year that I just had a spike so I went to home position and started over which seemed to help. We’ve all spent a ton of $ with zwo and they should be better when it comes to CS. Another story, I’m on my 3rd Vaonis vespera and it took months to have them finally agree the unit was faulty and then to send me a new unit. That was the last time I buy direct from a manufacturer. Agena we love you.
I’m sorry you went through all that as well. I know the struggle as you can see… I felt like so many people feel like they’re the only one going through it and when somebody else sheds light on it, it almost somehow makes it feel better that you’re not the only one.
I’m not a big fan of the portable units yet I don’t see them being nearly the same quality as a full rig but for somebody who’s not truly into the full hobby of Astro photography and just kind of wants to see what’s up there. I think they’re OK, but not for me at this point.
I think in order to get one that I would actually want to use they would need to price it several thousand dollars more than they currently are but I don’t like the fact that you can’t upgrade anything and you’re basically basically stuck with whatever it comes with.
For me building and upgrading, the rig is part of the fund switching stuff out and setting it up for a specific target is really enjoyable and I love to tinker with stuff so all in one unit wouldn’t appeal to me but I do see it’s purpose and the market for which it was created for sure
Just a side note: this was not meant to be targeted towards any single person at ZWO I know I do mention two names that were kind of unavoidable because they signed the email. I do not know these two folks and Simon did actually respond at first until I was transferred off to Kristin who I never interacted with, and never responded. I always make sure to not just respond to them but also to ZWO Support in general so others can pick up if they miss it.
Just wanted to make that clear - it’s nothing personal as I don’t know these people individually. I know stuff happens, but somebody else should have also received and been following up on those emails to ensure their completion. Individual people are human and make mistakes as to people who put this stuff together, that’s understandable.
But there is a larger accountability to the company at large to make things right with their customers and that’s who this is really towards. It’s of course not meant to be malicious in anyway and I hope when I summarize, it’s clear that I do point out good characteristics as well and clarify that I’m only sharing my own thoughts and experiences.
The point of this channel is not to call people out. But to help us all improve our astrophotography and if I can share a very negative experience, I had and perhaps help somebody else avoid it I feel it’s my duty as the creator footage channel.
The better part of a year to get this rectified, and having several other situations where I was already flat up to now and had to buy an install the parts I was still going to let it all go if they would’ve came through and responded on this issue with the AM5…
I’ve put out roughly 50 videos and mentioned over a dozen companies and this is the first time I’ve really had any feedback that wasn’t almost completely positive.
don't worry, that is a conventional english (false) name.
Yea I’ve had pretty good luck with zwo. However for the amount of money this hobby costs I’d prefer not to rely on luck. Great video and thanks for the honest review!
Well, we need to get you some clear skies so you can actually use it in the first place lol 😝
Hy, I had the same issue with my mount and I resolved it by opening the mount and lubricating it and tighten some lose screws.
Thank you for this. You are as reasonable in your bad review as you are in your good, which makes this come across as very honest and professional.
When I bought new gear a couple of months back, I went with another brand (Player One actually), mostly because I don't like the monopoly ZWO is trying to establish. Without "real" competition, they have no incentive to provide good customer service or product development.
My experiences with Player One so far (both the camera and customer support) has been really great.
I appreciate that, so far this is a couple endorsements for player one I might have to see if they would be willing to work together and combine it with an open source platform that would allow me to run the camera and come up with a different ecosystem. What are you using to run your rig?
I'm using an intel NUC and NINA so basically just regular Windows + software via RDP.
interface-wise, it is not as easy as the AsiAir (especially for beginners) but functionality-wise it's about the same. I can remote in both via a tablet or even my phone (Android).
@@Wheeljack678 yeah, I want to go with an even simpler option than that. I think that that is a very commonly used way to do it but for a beginner as you mentioned, it’s going to be challenging. Stellarmate has a software that they have installed on their device which is open source and it looks like the middle ground between Nina and the ASIAIR. Very graphic interface style, but with more capability.
The eagle will work very similar to yours, other than the fact that they do have their own “Play” software now that looks VERY similar to the ASIAIR but again a bit more robust.
If either of those companies can get an easy to run software set up, it would be lights out. I just need to try both of them or at least one of them. The stellarmate software looks pretty complete.
I had similar results as you...two emails and then ghosted. There is a thread on CN addressing the same frustrations. It won't be long before they are impacted. As much business they do in the US they should have a service center here. Regardless of the price point aftermarket service WILL set you apart. I was in sales along time and there is a saying. "Service, Price, Quality...pick two"
When you get a chance, if you wouldn’t mind, could you send the link either here or to my Instagram with the same name?
Yeah, also in sales and I agree. Some of my other hobbies are completely different. I’m also into competitive shooting and the firearms community is totally different. All American made based in America and their warranties are above and beyond even if it’s completely your fault, most firearms and optic manufacturers will stand behind you.
Also, been really into cycling for most of my life and same thing. It’s been an interesting adjustment over the last several years with Astro
@@darkrangersinc Impressive that you've been able to balance so many hobbies. I can only really maintain one hobby.. and then have a couple of minor ones. I was into shooting for awhile. Set myself up for FClass.. almost went down that rabbit hole. Then I started astro. That and the fact that the nearest match was 3 hours away and starting early mornings.. I backed off. I occasionally make it out to the range but no where near as often as I use to. I was looking at component costs the other day.. wow.. I can't believe how expensive everything is. A brick of primers use to be $40. Now, $100-$150.. that is insane!
I hope my am5 doesn't bust. Phd2, Nina, ATP and other software we use need to create android and apple apps so we're not trapped into an ecosphere like zwo. I use a surface pro to run everything. Thanks for the info.
I hope people have better luck than I do. I know plenty of others have had issues, but there is a chance you might be totally fine, they have reached out to me since posting this video and I’ve made it very clear that they’re customer service is not acceptable and they need to step it up so we’ll see what happens
Thank you for sharing your experience, and sorry to hear about these issues. I've seen some posts on FB about a procedure to tighten the belts in AM5, which should help with the guiding issues. Perhaps you could try that. Clear skies.
I’m going to see if ZWO can fix it before opening it up and then having them blame me like they tend to. They did reach out finally as a result of this video though not by responding to my emails which is disappointing so we’ll see what happens
@@darkrangersinc When I first contacted ZWO Tech Support via email regarding my malfunctioning AM5, they asked if "I was handy and could do something like adjust belts". I said "SURE, if it won't void my warranty." That was the end of that discussion. Send my mount to them Dec. 6. Still have no solution.
I think it should be noted somewhere that the ASI Air is really just PHD2 software. I just added an antenna to my ASI AIR PRO, hoping that helps but I have the AM5 and 2600MC pro and usb3 camera and guide scope...and most of it came from Agena Astro. I gotta say I'm a bit uneasy and hoping I don't have your issues. But thanks for posting your experience's.
Good video. This mirrors my support experience with the issues I had with my 2600MC Pro. It took forever to get the oil leaks resolved and I was told to use an external HUB when one of my USB2 ports died.
Sorry to hear unfortunately it seems to be fairly common. I have a full Primaluce/QHY Nina swap coming soon!
I hope my 585mc, 120mm guide camera and asi air mini don't have issues. I've had them about a month now and they are great so far..
I'm a bit concerned about my AM5 mount after something I saw happen last night. I have occasionally seen large jumps in the tracking over the last year, but last night it started jumping back and forth on every frame. The first time I lost the frame because RA jumped and doubled the stars, then it went into a two-hour oscillation, but the frames were still usable. When I Blink the frames it really looks like it got its bell rung, with an initial large excursion followed by a ring-down over two hours, then it was stable (just regular dithers) the rest of the night.
I suspect these mounts accumulate metal particles in the gears over time, and with the tight mesh even tiny bits show up in the guiding. Worm gears tend to be self-cleaning because of the wiping action, but these strain wave drives have no way to clear the debris from normal wear. I'm strongly inclined to tear it down and give it a thorough cleaning. I think we'll be hearing more of this sort of thing as time goes by.
Interesting that would make sense why it happens over time then and not right away. If you do figure anything out let us know and good luck with it
@@darkrangersinc I've bought a lot of Chinese tooling for my home machine shop, and it's invariably filled with metal chips and grinding dust. More of a kit than a usable piece of equipment. While I would expect more care for a precision mechanism like a strain wave drive, I'm not going to be surprised by anything I find if I open it up.
@@jonrbryan anytime I can buy something Made in Japan, Germany, Italy, or the United States. I’m usually very happy with the end result.
Hi Ryan,on e again a really good re iew. I would like to add my point regarding zwo. We don't have many clear nights so they are precious, on this particular night, using my asiair plus, the mount kept disconnecting so I swapped to my asiair pro, changed all the cables and battery, all to no avail. These clear nights mean so much. Anyway I'm fed up with being letdown by the zwo kit I've decided to investigate other control systems such as Stellarmate.
You've just outlined why I only use their cameras. Also - a NUC running windows and full versions of software along with a pegasus PBA is preferable. Mounts right on your rig too.
Yeah a NUC or Something like that is the move for sure
ZWO get your act together !!
Their act is together.
thank you! good to know about the customer services. I'll just stay with old trusty i have.
Ouch. I just went all in on ZWO but I'm regretting it already. The 2600MC Pro I ordered turned out to be out of stock, although they happily took my money the second I ordered it. 2 weeks later they keep pushing the delivery back...
Got a 7x2" filter wheel on its way and also the EAF. Gonna stick to EU resellers from now on. They won't leave you hanging.
Wow, what a nightmare. Gives me a warm fuzzy feeling on my ZWO gear...which everything I have except the main scope is ZWO. I have some minor issue with my ASI Air+ and sent CS an email. And never heard anything back either. I did purchase most everything from Agena...good to know they are a stand up company. Thinking I might start to migrate away now.
Despite all the issues still managed to get a good amount of images. Never thought I would learn how to replace a camera or filter wheel mother board but now I can say I know how 🤷🏻♂️😂
Hopefully I won't have that experience but the Astro community is awesome. I have the AM5 as well and so far no issues but now I know what to watch out for. @@darkrangersinc
I always end up with a dud. I was about to order an AM5 because most people seem to praise it. Glad I saw this. With my luck, it isn't worth the risk.
Dude. Your channel is going to take off. Well spoken and insightful content. Appreciate you.. Happy Holidays
Thank you appreciate the kind words. Happy holidays to you and your family!
Hi Dark, just an FYI I sent CS an inquiry last week about the DC12V outlet on my AA+ and heard back within 2 days and was requested a couple things and received a REM for the unit.
That’s good to hear! Usually on simple stuff it’s pretty quick and I know since the video the people I’ve been in contact with said they’re going to really focus on customer service moving forward so hopefully they have double down on their efforts and it’s starting to pay off!
Great video. I am all in with the ZWO ecosystem (2 AA+, AA mini, AM5, ASI2600MC Pro, ASI294MC Pro, ASI183MC, 2X ASI120MM, 3X EAF. Fortunate that I have not had major issues other than similar guiding issue with AM5. Concerned about future support... Customer service IS the most important factor for customer loyalty. Le'ts CS improves for EVERONE and not just big astro bloggers. Thanks for your honesty. I am from Canada so Agena Astro is not as practical to order from.
Curious is it just the shipping that makes agenda not practical? I’ve ordered from Canadian companies and it only added a couple days. The shipping costs I did negotiate to get waived since I was buying a scope and several accessories but the experience was good cross borders otherwise.
Mainly shipping costs and the potential of paying duties.
This was a good, honest review of the ZWO ecosystem, Ryan. I've been very fortunate to have only minor problems with my ZWO products and they've all served me well. If you're planning it, though, I'd absolutely LOVE to see you put together the 'alternative' system! In some ways I feel like I'm outgrowing and/or constrained by my ASIAir and I'm starting to explore some alternatives as well. It would be a big (a.k.a. $$) switch for me but would allow more growth in the future without the limitations imposed by a proprietary system like the ZWO products.
I sent Primaluce an Email before making this so I could have the answer but no response. I’ve been told they are tough to get a hold of so it’s probably about time to reach out again especially since we’ve added another 500 subscribers or so but that’s 100% the plan and was my goal before I even released this one
They do have a $700 option. I think it’s called the LE and it does everything that you need. It’s still more powerful than the ASI air.
You could get a mini computer for three or $400 but then by the time you got the Pegasus power box you’re going to be pretty much right in the same spot as the LAE which is why I’ve just saw it out the eagle besides the fact that they do have their own Raphick interface that they’re developing it’s still functional right now, but it’s getting better and better all of their devices like the auto focus and flat panels have their own Wi-Fi that you can run independently of other apps, so I like the idea of their brand over others because you have a back up way to work some of their accessories Plus the quality is really good.
StellarMate is another option. I don’t know as much about them, but they have a System different than Nina. It looks a little easier more like the ASI air and it’s open source and it comes installed on the device and it’s about $500 for their top end one so that could be the back up if the Italians want to ignore us 😢
@@darkrangersinc Thanks so much for that detailed response, Ryan! I appreciate it. I have LOTS of looking before making the leap, since it may also involve another laptop and other ancillaries as well. (I use my iPad/iPhone with my ASIAir and only have an older, slower Surface Pro). Thank you again!
@@gregerianne3880 I did reach out one more time today and hopefully with a little extra nudge we will get somewhere. we just need to get one comprehensive video on how to make the switch. There’s nothing out there with the eagle that really shows you in depth how to set it up. There are some that go very high-level, but not to the extent most people are looking.
@@darkrangersinc Well, the Italians do like their riposo, so who knows?! Haha!! (I can say that since I'm Italian...😁) Seriously, I've found PrimaLuceLab products to be the best, so I wouldn't mind spending a bit more on an Eagle and be confident it will work as it should. Looking forward to hearing more!
@@darkrangersinc Well, we Italians do like our riposo, so who knows?! Hahaha! Seriously, though, I've found Primaluce products to be among the best and would be very willing to pay a little more for the quality.
I wish I'd seen this a few weeks ago. I bought (or should I say tried to buy, since the guy on cloudy nights ghosted me and hasn't sent anything and won't reply to me...) a used zwo seestar s50... I would've avoided it altogether had I seen this. Another "too good to be true and I feel for it" story... I just hope paypal good and services helps me out. After this video, no zwo for me unless they up their game quite a bit in the service dept. Please keep us updated if any of these get resolved.
I’m ZWO fanboy aside the refractor and the filters. Looking forward this video. Let’s goooo!
I would watch till the end the middle is a little bit rough going through my experience with their customer service, but I do think as long as you get a good version of the product you will be OK. I’ve had good results with my 2600 MM and 290mm but issues with other products
Watched till the end. Great review man. Can’t blame ya, what happened, happened.
Hopefully I’ll get a bit more luckier than you lol. Got my rig 3 months ago.
My only complaint so far (aside some random disconnects) is the EAF. Had to sent it back and got a full refund. Really bad product in my opinion.
I’ve also purchased D1+D2 Askar color magic BECAUSE YOU SAID SO.
Keep it up the great work.
@@leonardoleo5250 awesome glad to hear! I actually gave them a little bit of a break on the EAF. It will miss on auto focus when switching filters sometimes, but I actually didn’t even mention that lol. It really does. Kind of suck to make a video that isn’t mostly. Since you watch my other episodes, you know, that’s the general vibe on this channel but at some point enough is enough.
Thanks for nice video. I really hope it gains many views. I have my second AM5 already. For the first one I was able to test it within 14 days and send it back. No usable guiding at all and big spikes quite often. The second one is better, but by far not as good as others are showing. It can guide between 0.3-0.6 rms for as much as a minute (sometimes) than comes the spike. Total rms for the whole session is not bad, but there is at least a single spike for every image (180s). Ironically, it looks like dithering helps stabilising those spikes. My setup is kind of forgiving so I don't need to delete many images, but still. I would be very interested in your progress with this issue. Good luck!
Just bought a complete ZWO system some $10k USD worth. Thought staying in the eco system would be a plus. This is the first full customer service burn I’ve read. Well documented and not interested to help it seems. I did buy warranties with my electronic “stuff” perhaps not the EFW or EAF. I have two airs and one Am5. Will be separating to power leads to the AA and 2600 after reading this. Sad you have to endure this. To be fair I ended up selling my 2020 Honda Pilot (Made in Alabama) after 3 years of audio repairs that were never solve. Quality control is circling the drain at many companies. I hope you post an update in a year or if a sooner resolution occurs. Sadly my new purchases will be sitting in the case until April when I finish skiing. Mixed feelings about doing that now. Ugh!
That’s about what I spent - 2600mc & 2600mm, EFW, AM5, AA+ and Mini, EAF, 290mm all at once and still not a customer worth helping a guess.
If they won’t help a $10,000 customer, imagine how they’ll treat a random person who just bought one thing 🤦🏻♂️. Hopefully you luck out it’s definitely possible. But with that many components from ZWO I would say the likely hood of making it out 12 months with no issues is likely low but hopefully the additional warranties kick in if it does happen
Thanks for your review Ryan. Very helpful and your conclusions are bang on. I only own a couple of ZWO products. The Air Pro which has worked very well for me and really made me achieve much more than I could have hoped for in the 3 short years I’ve been doing this. My 2600MC Pro is a fantastic camera. Had to get ZWO to replace the motherboard. This, including all the upfront troubleshooting with Simon, took less than 2 months. ZWO was fairly prompt in their replies and in the end, just had me ship it in for repairs. I would really hope everyone else would get the same treatment, but it appears to not be the case. Thanks again. Excellent review. Dr B from Manitoba, Canada 🇨🇦
Glad to hear you got better luck than me - 2 months is still longer than acceptable in most industries but better than paying $200+ for the part and having to install it.
Getting ghosted like that.. and having a case marked resolved when it isn't is unacceptable. So frustrating. I just recently picked up an AM3.. hopefully it works out. I did purchase it from Agena.. for all the same reasons you mentioned :) CS!
hire a lawyer, sue the US distributor. Costly? Yes. Sue for damages. Sue for emotional damages. Sue for legal costs. Make them pay. If it hurts them bad enough (and enough people start doing this), they'll drop the US distributorship, which will financially hurt ZWO very badly. Other distributors will be very wary to take their products on too. If ZWO doesn't learn and adapt and improve its customer service/communications/warranty, they will start to lose sales. Losing sales is a great motivator for any business.
What was the cause of the failure of the power circuit output of the ASIAIR, with all your controller board failures and other issues wondering if you had a power issue that caused downstream issues in all your components and they just failed within months of each other.
I did not realize they could void your warranty when opening your device.
There is a law in the USA, right to repair and and void warranty when removed stickers are illigal for consumer electronics.
It’s somewhat makes sense if you think about it if somebody does try to “fix it” it makes it worse than it potentially could be somewhat the customers fault. but I’ve seen claims denied when things are opened up, and even if the customer didn’t make it worse, had them blamed for the problem because they opened it up and inspected it
I have found that camera photos transfer faster from the ASIAir Plus USB2 port than from the USB3 port
Interesting I’ll try that out, I do have an ASI mini where you have to use USB2 & I found that the transfer times were the same as when I first got the ASIAIR plus, it is 480 MB a second I believe for USB two so on a 50 MB file it still should only take very little time.
But lately the plus has slowed down dramatically and I feel like the range and overall connection strain has diminished. I might look at upgrading the antenna but I don’t understand how an antenna or signal strength loses power overtime but maybe there is a shelflife to them?
Thank you for a informative and thought provoking review. I agree...Agena Astro is top notch. ZWO on the other hand, could learn a bit from Toyota.
Literally, the most dependable vehicles on the planet! That’s a great point can’t blame it all on country of origin when you have companies like that, putting out vehicles that do half a million miles regularly
My 2600MC cooler stops working when it can’t reach the temperature. ZWO told me to replace the cables but still the same problem. My Risingcam IMX571 just keeps on working at 100% even if it can’t reach the temperature. The cooler is also way faster, 90s vs 10min+. I payed 1300€ vs 2500€ so that’s a lot of money saved.
I’m hoping to build a relationship with one of these other camera companies, and one of the computer companies that are open source so I can put together a video or two on how to make the transition if people want to. I know there are a couple channels that do it but not many most are either using the ASIair or a computer laptop base system versus a Wi-Fi set up.
You triggered me too, ok, happy new year and well, I refuse to go asiair and I cut the corner theoretically thanks to the forums, I own a Primaluce Eagle LE and come on, they are not that expensive. The thing is that I sleep and they are portable, My EQ6 is not, and I'm now going to take a look to other mount option. Thanks for taking the time to teach and share your experience. I had the same issues with Celestron, just stay away. SkyWatcher and iOptron are for me are doing things right. My next camera may by a QHY or a Player One if they keep prices close to ZWO.
I was seriously considering ZWO. Now I’m holding off. How often does their equipment experience these kinds of failures?
Well, I think if you look at all of the other comments, plus you could see all of the individual messages and emails. I got from people who experienced the same type of thing I would more frequent than it should be.
The market is so strong and they do have a pretty big fan primarily of newer Astro photographers who haven’t used their equipment for multiple years so they’re 6 months in and everything is fine and they rave about their stuff online.
Also because of the fanboy effect if people speak out against them they often get ridiculed online since so many people use it. So I think a lot of people bite there tongue. Honestly it had to get really bad for me to finally put out an episode like this.
There are better options in the same price range. I’ve been having great luck with companies like Stellarvue for scopes, Primaluce for electronics, and Losmandy for mounts. PrimaLuce stuff is a bit more their EAF is $260 instead of $200 for example but it’s got built in wifi it’s made in Italy vs China and if you get their Eagle it can run wireless which is actually more dependable than USB cables.
So there are plenty of options out there I’ve found that often and times the most popular option in Astro photography is usually not the best
@@darkrangersinc Thank you! I'll check them all out. I guess we should just be grateful that we have so many choices. It's a good problem to have!
Did the camera issues fall under warrantee coverage?
I have had 1 issue with my 294MC Pro but it was may fault.
They had me send it to some address in NJ so I sent it to them and a few weeks later I had it returned.
I had an issue with my guide camera - ended up being a bad USB cable - which I purchased upgraded cables.
The ASI AIR Pro does go crazy when it guides past the meridian so my solution is that I do not let it hit meridian.
I am unsure if I am lucky and you just had bad luck with your units.
I did not buy into their mounts - I am happy with my EQ6R-Pro, but I would not want to carry it on a hike.
The Customer Service is horrible, but I would try to stick with your vendor.
I am not defending them - but your best options is to work with the company who sold it to you and let them talk to their ZWO Reps.
If you watch the whole video, all of your questions get answered
I wonder if communications with ZWO are “lost in translation.” No disrespect intended, but I wonder if it is better to try to translate communications into Chinese when sending it
Yeah, that’s a valid point, but they have so many people purchasing in English-speaking countries. It’s kind of irresponsibility to make sure they have the customer service to handle it.
they’re responding in English (when they respond) and the First Gentleman that actually did tell me to send logs in is native English speaker but the folks I was submitting logs to I could tell perhaps were like not born speaking English to your point but their responses were still very understandable.
I felt like this was more true earlier on when I was dealing with my electronic filter wheel that was several months before the amount, and I was dealing with “Wu” and his responses all came around midnight so communication took forever because it would be one sentence every other day basically and usually took a couple days between replies only to have my warranted denied.
There’s absolutely no trying to reasoning with them so you could be right. But they understand it enough to communicate back-and-forth in a way that makes sense.
I've been moving away from ZWO for some time now, I really don't like to be locked in. Hearing about your experience horrifies me 😱
Excellent video! Very informative and high production quality. Keep it up!
Thank you :)
Goodness, NOW I see this video. Just dropped al little over $7K on a WO scope but the rest is a ZWO ecosystem. (AM5, Plus, 2600MC, 120). Hoping I hit the equipment lottery Yikes. I did go thru Agena so thats a plus side on the scales. I can be a one & done when it comes my money if Customer service bites me. I emailed a question to their respective CS and it did take over a week to get back with me. Thanks again to your dedication to the hobby and your subscribers which you made a new one today.
I can’t seem to get to the Latest OSC and Narrowband Processing Guide link. When I login to google it says some went wrong try again later. This happens over and over.
Would love to get to that guide, thanks.
Try the link on the website I just tested it and it works it’s on the astrophotography guides page
Funny you should mention the AM5 guide spikes. I'm having the same issue, but I initially thought it was my guiding setup. Now after watching your issues, I think I have a bad copy of the AM5 as well. Same exact issue where the guiding is great and all of the sudden it goes absolutely haywire. I'm interested to see how many other folks are having this issue!
I found a whole group of people so it’s not just us. It seems like some of the updates have helped a bit there was a time the mount was UNUSABLE but I think enough folks complained that they found a way to mitigate it a bit. It’s worst near the meridian for me which is the most valued data unfortunately but I can keep more subs now than I could months back.
@@darkrangersincHow did they mitigate the spiking? Is your AM5 from the first production run with a 430 sec cycle or the 2nd production run with the 288s cycle ?
@@hael8680 I’d have to look at the spec sheet that came with it. I didn’t get it right away when it came out, I wasn’t on the waiting list or anything like that. It had been out for close to six or seven months I think it went to pre-order sales in April if I’m not mistaken, just going from memory. So they had been shipping them for a while before I ordered. I’m assuming the guides spikes have gotten better because of software updates I know they were working on that pretty heavily but I don’t know that for a fact.
The spikes aren’t gone. But they are less periodic. And nowhere near the capacity so it shouldn’t be a problem and I do polar align every couple nights even when I’ve had perfect polar alignment, and I do level my tripod with an actual Bubble Level. It still has the issue.
I’ve been seeing this issue arise in the Facebook groups, and ZWO is actively blocking the posts
I'm a beginner. Glad I opted for the Skywatcher mount. That would be a Nomo slider in the mix
Ouch! So far my ASI2600MC Pro, ASI290mm & 5 position filter wheel have worked great. However if there is ever an issue I am now the wiser. I would love to see a review on the PrimaLuceLab Eagle5 S WiFi computer - especially compared to the ASIAIR Pro/Plus. Great info Ryan...
Me too maybe since I flashed it a couple times they’ll send one 😂❤. The 2600 since I swapped, the motherboard has been fine like I said, I just think it’s mostly quality control issue, and then a lack of help on the flipside.
This has been eye opening and something I had hoped wouldn’t be the case. I have about $2500 in zwo parts in my cart that I want to purchase but am reconsidering now and will research alternatives instead. Shame on them.
Thank you for your candor, this is really helpful!!
It’s tough to make an episode like this and it really took a lot to get to the “final straw” moment, but I felt like I had to share my experience.
I’m not telling anybody not to buy from them. I’m just sharing my experience and allowing people to make the decision decision that’s right for them. as you can see from the comments it’s happened to many people, but some people have also been pretty lucky.
Having said that I would love to check in with some of those comments that haven’t had any issues in two years and see where they’re at 😬.
Hope it was helpful and appreciate you being a part of the channel
As I have been considering an AM3 or 5.mount, I found that vey interesting. My limited experience with ZWO has been good, but I do not use their cameras I only use their focusers, filter wheel, ASIAir mini ( for Canon DSLR ) and a mini guider for the Canon rig. I use an Eagle LE ( this is their cheapest model - can't really afford the 4 or 5) for my other rigs. I have noticed recently that my filter wheel doesn't always change over ( I'm still looking into this )
My ASIAir Mini seems to work fine, but the Eagle is of course far more versatile, I currently run Sharp Cap 4.0 on it but it will just as easily run NINA, APT etc if prefered and will support most astronomy cameras and DSLRs, mounts, rotators etc.
Like I said you could get one that works fine but as you can see from the comments I’m not the only one with issues with the AM5 but if you’re heart is set on it then you can go for it. Just giving you my experience and best I can hope is it doesn’t happen to you. One thing I can say pretty confidently is if something does go wrong it’s not going to be a great experience to fix it.
I don’t think that is a matter of luck, or anything else other than the fact that they just don’t prioritize customer service the way they need to
@@darkrangersinc Actually I was thanking you for making me think twice. As my old EQ6-R still works fine I'm in no real hurry to replace it. Thank you again for sharing your experience I will definitely take this on board.
@@KevinRudd-w8s oh, OK I thought you were saying that you were considering it and you’ve had a good experience as far so you were going to go with it and I’m not saying that it’s a bad idea it just didn’t work out for me. I would look at the Pegasus version it’s an extra thousand dollars but it’s also 50% more payload capacity. The EQ6 is a very dependable amount. I would run that until you could go with something with a heavier payload. I also think the SW 350 the next step up from the 6 looks really nice.
What a nightmare Ryan!
It would interesting to see now after the post if they get back in touch but I guess you won’t hold your breath
I’m hopeful having lots of ZWO equipment that my gear holds out or if I have issues, that company in Sydney come through for me.
My skywatcher gti mount failed last year and they sent me a new one
No problem
Cheers
Si
Yeah I mean the mother boards for both issues totaled a little over $300 so it wasn’t horrible but not something I would have ever imagined paying for on brand new stuff with a 2 year warranty. I’m sure you’ll be ok for most of your stuff.
@@darkrangersinc My AM5 had a few of those massive spikes the other night so aim gonna need to keep an eye out
I’ve just sent your link to my Astro gear provider in Sydney to ask a few questions just in case o have that problem ongoing.
Thanks for posting this Ryan
Ouch! not quite what I was expecting, but great to know. I had a challenge with my first Air and did not get immediate support but the distributor quickly replaced it for me. I thought it was just "one of those things" where the distributor/seller takes on the responsibility as intermediary and people expecting too much from the manufacturer are disillusioned. I wonder what their feelings are about QC and supporting such issues now. Apart from that however, it has been a good journey these past 2+ yrs. My AA+ and 533MC have been tireless workhorses but there are enough red flags out there that I started gathering parts for a second NINA setup to build next year. I was seriously tempted by the AM5 but held off to see what others can do with strain wave tech. Just watching the incredible advancements the last 2 years, the next year will surely see some more competitors. I would love to see a 2024 series of building a NINA rig, I'll follow along :)
Well, I’m glad you got some good help from the distributor. When their stuff works it does fine. I have tons of time on my 2600 MM without any issues it’s just a little bit of luck at the draw.
I think a lot of people are not fortunate enough to be able to image as much as I am able to as well so they might not not run into problems as quickly as I do or maybe ever. That could be another contributing factor, but no matter how much you’re using it, there’s no excuse for the lack of Customer Service.
Thanks for your video I’m curious why zwo said it was your fault for equipment failure what did they say you did wrong?
On the camera they just flat out denied coverage and said I could send it in and pay them to fix it and I said it’s well within the two-year warranty and I reported the initial USB hub problem right away so from the second time I’ve used it you know there has been an issue.
For the filter wheel, they said the USB 2.0 plug was pushed in too far which made no sense. You can only push them in a certain amount and then they stop. It’s not like I took a hammer to it and smashed the male end it. I gently put it in as I do all cables that have worked fine on the hundreds of electrical devices I own.
There really was no explanation. Other than that they just come to the conclusion I asked to speak to somebody above them and they won’t let you. They didn’t have a phone number I could call and I was dealing with somebody responding at midnight and taking a couple days between each response, so the back-and-forth on those two lasted about a month and a half and I finally gave up because it was ruining my entire imaging season. Once you get to about the 25 email mark you realize they’re not going to do anything and they don’t even justify why in a way that’s logical.
In all fairness, this review actually took it pretty easy on them. I didn’t go into every customer service issue because they were all pretty much the same they went nowhere.
That’s bs they should have covered it and for the usb on wheel wtf it sounds faulty. I have a lot of zwo stuff including the am5 hopefully they hold up. I have had pretty good customer service from them but it was only communication don’t know about actual service. Well thanks for all your work appreciate it got the quad antlia filter you reviewed can’t wait to use it take care 👍
@@danksolo6183get Orion with it while you still can! It’s the only color filter I’ve used that keeps the majority of the good color and Orion
I haven't gone down the ZWO route as I prefer to have choice plus I do not have a huge budget to begin with. I remember the leak on the sensor people were having & their response was to just clean it off rather than send it for repair. The ASi Air is a great device but as we already know you'll end up being locked into one ecosystem plus from what I've read in the open source communities there's some questionable legalities with it. After watching your video it's definitely another nail in the coffin for ZWO I just wish vendors out there would give us more choice rather than just a handful of CCD's & ZWO everything else as I would like to see more choice out there.
Great video to clear skies
Enjoyed the vid, but sorry to hear about your experiences. Mine has been the opposite (fingers crossed it stays that way). I went all in with their ecosystem as I liked the idea of everything running from 1 small box, which makes it better for portability. I have the 294mm and mc pro, 3 different guide cams, 8 position efw, 3 eaf's and 3 asiair +'s, and the am5. For the most part each has worked well. I do have an asiair pro which the usb ports died on, so there's that lol. I really agree with you about wishing they would open up the compatability though.
How did they handle the ASI air pro not working correctly? I mean even though you’ve had several good experiences it’s still not great that the main controller is essentially inoperable but glad most of it is working 💪🏼
Hopefully it stays that way like I said the AM5 worked great for me for about six months. I do also image quite a bit. I’m lucky that I have clear skies a lot, so I probably do get more use out of it having said that six months isn’t acceptable even if you’re imaging every day though.
@@rvoykin Originally I didn't realize the USB's were faulty. I was trying to connect to my other mount (EQ6R-Pro) and no matter what it wouldn't connect. The ASIAIR Pro would power up and work fine other than the USB. The tech support at ZWO were actually pretty helpful, they kept trying to troubleshoot, even sending me a new firmware for the AAP, but after awhile I figured out it was the USB ports, by then the warranty was expired so I let the issue drop. I still have the pro, and might replace the board at some point, but I'm in no rush.
@@darkrangersinc 6 months is not acceptable at all. Hopefully this vid gets their attention. I image as much as I can, but I live in a perpetually cloudy area. From Oct 22 - April 23, I think we had only 1 or 2 clear nights.
If I recall correctly wasn't the Player One brand set up by a former ZWO employee who was unhappy with their practices in there?
I recall reading that somewhere when looking at getting my first dedicated astro camera. Ive seen a lot of positive feedback about them online. I ended up going with the Uranus-c Pro as a bit of all rounder and bar a small bit of tilt it performs extremely well. First light went so well I didn't even realise I forgot to turn the cooler on and was imaging at 21 Celsius all night, virtually no noise at all. Still waiting to run it through its paces on planetary as Ireland is buried under clouds for months now but overall it seems they are simply trying to upstage ZWO in terms or price, quality control and customer service for the same equipment. Exactly what a pissed off ex-employee would do 😂
I don’t actually know the backstory, but that would be pretty cool. I know this has happened several times in the past where people leave a company because they don’t agree with how they do things and form a better version of the same brand.
I would love to work with a company like Player one in the future so who knows maybe as the channel continues to grow they’ll reach out 🤷🏻♂️
@@darkrangersinc may even be worth your while asking them. If you were to refer them to your video and demonstrate how you want an apples to apples comparison they might be happy to send some equipment for testing etc. If I were part of their team I would say this could be a nice arrow in their quiver for tapping into the market more and driving more competition in the market. Seems like everywhere I look these days its ZWO ecosystems and I'm not a fan of having all my eggs in one basket for the exact reasons you brought up here.
Unfortunately quality control and customer service are always issues with PRC companies (and I say this as someone who lived in the PRC for many, many years). So far (touch wood) I have not had any major issues with my ZWO equipment, which is pretty much all I have. I am a bit tied to them because of my reliance on the ASIAIR, but I hope to migrate to NINA at some point, and that would give me a bit more leeway. I’m surprised Simon hasn’t been more helpful-he’s based not far from me in NZ, and I’ve found him to be very onto it when it comes to helping customers out.
At first it seemed like it was going to workout, he was fairly responsive and said to send logs via the bug system.
The problem was after that it took a long time to get a response and when I did from the people in Support, they sent me an update that didn’t do anything, but marked the case “resolved”. When I saw that after I had sent the multiple follow up screenshots showing it wasn’t resolved. I was pretty upset obviously.
So when I reached back out via email, and he passed me off to someone else, I was surprised. That’s the last reply I’ve gotten from ZWO several months ago.
When I email, I make sure to not just reply directly to one person as well. I try to include the general ZWO email so it catches more than one eye.
To me, having a closed source set up that forces you to buy their product is a pretty cheap way to force further sales. It’s almost like they know they can get away with it because people get stuck on the operating system and then can’t or won’t leave
Have you seen Cuiv’s latest video review of the Stellermate Pro? Looks like a viable option…
Yeah I mention in further down in the comments here I’ve been looking at it for a while. Primaluce is going to send me an Eagle 5 and a focuser. I’ll do the same level of in-depth review on the eagle, and then everybody can choose whatever is best for them! I definitely think the stellar is a viable option!
I think both are great products one is a little more expensive, and probably a little bit more difficult to set up, but more robust from a software and hardware standpoint, and the other is essentially an ASIair on steroids, which might an easier transition both have pros and cons. I’m a fan of both!
The eagle is tried and true for many years. I don’t know what the long-term reviews are like on the stellar mate because it’s still fairly new, but other than that it looks really good.
I just stumbled across your video...first of all: I'm sorry for you and the amount of frustration you had (still have?) to deal with...on the other hand: what do you expect from a company who took open source material and "built their empire on it" without giving credit to whom credit is due or to put it in other words: craping a shitton of BS on licenses and copyright...
Anyway, your video convinced me to save up a bit longer and get the Nyx-101. Clear skies
Good choice on the mount. TBH I’m not super techie and up to date in terms of the rules or laws with open source stuff and I wasn’t aware of it when I made the purchase. I just took them at the Word when they said they had a two-year warranty, that they would honor it. For some reason people aren’t super vocal in the Astro community about experiences that aren’t positive. I have since found a guiding spike thread on cloudy nights for the AM5 so it’s out there. But you see all these comments about people having bad experiences. It just seems to get suppressed very well.
So if you could go back and start over again what system would buy? I am trying to decide what mount would be the easiest for me, I am a beginner to astrophotography and my budget is limited. None of these RUclipsrs who do reviews mention this crap. Tu
The EQ6r is pretty tried and true if you’re looking for the same payload. I mention the eagle a couple times as an alternative as well as some different camera options. One of the camera options I mentioned player 1 sells most of the other accessories like filter wheels, guide cameras, etc.
Anyone wondering aboust asiair/nina, im a complete noob but nina seems pretty amazing so far. Just doing 3ppa and basivc sequences
I'm seeing a very profitable class action law suit possibly happening to this company.
I hope ZWO is listening. I have been lucky so far to have had no issues but now wonder if I'm going to suffer the consequences should I run into any.
One thing I forgot to say in the video just because there was so much to cover was that I don’t expect companies to be perfect. This is all mass produced in China for the most part so I understand it. But I do expect companies to at least be responsive.
I think responsive means less than six months lol
What other brands are coming out with strain wave mounts?
I’ve actually just reached out to Pegasus they have one that’s actually a little more robust and can handle 66lbs
Wow, great video, my own ASIAIR plus just won’t guide, no blue or red lines what so ever. I keep thinking I’m doing something wrong? Crap, time to switch suppliers I guess.
Sorry to hear that dot I wonder if there is something else going on as well, does it connect to the guide camera?
Thanks for the video. Please, could you turn down all these sfx and music blips? They shouldn't be louder than the VO. For folks who listen to your video on proper audio this is quite distracting. 🙏🏻
The problem is the majority of people are not listening to it on anything but their cell phone or computer, so when you turn it down much more, it becomes tough to hear. I listen to my own videos with a pretty nice set of Bose headphones, and don’t experience any issues. I know earlier on several months ago had them all at 0DB. But since turned them down below, my voice and I monitor the volume in Final Cut Pro to ensure that.
They are all set to -9 DB so they shouldn’t be louder than my voice which averages between -3 and -6. I can try to turn them down more, but then on mobile devices, that most people listen to this on, you can’t hear the music or effect or it’s very difficult
Can you clarify what you are listening to the videos on? I’ve heard them through my Sonos speakers, Harmon Cardin car speakers, just my cell phone, just my iPad, and with a couple different sets of headphones to test the audio and it all sounds normal.
When it seemed like you were trying to give some actual feedback, as you can see, I did respond weeks ago with some follow-up questions to clarify to which you didn’t respond. I do listen to my own videos with all of the gear above that you mentioned you also do when not in your “6-figure audio room” and with the exception of one other person months ago you are the only person who has commented on the volume of my FX of the literal thousands who watch.
So I really couldn’t tell if you were just trolling or being genuine, and then your message today, with the heart attack comment on my most recent video seemed either disingenuous or passive aggressive. Telling somebody that a video that they put a decent amount of effort in on their spare time for free that gives you a heart attack because their sound effects are ever so slightly too loud is a bit off putting. Hence my response but it is true that I haven’t changed anything and I don’t hear what you’re saying I asked several of my Patreon members they say it’s fine and when I asked you what you were listening on to try to get an understanding of the issue you didn’t say anything.
So it didn’t really seem like the comments were a genuine attempt to help more-so someone being overly nit-picky and after the “6-figure” comment a bit pretentious. To someone who’s at the end of the day making free content for you to consume and improve your astrophotography.
Having said that, I’ll look into some of the other sound effects. I’m also available on IG if you’d like to message me as a one off 👍🏼
@@darkrangersinc Hi, I'm sorry I must have missed the first reply but I think everything was said already on the other video, including tips and tricks on how to best tackle this, if you would like to. Again: I was just trying to give back some tips from a field I know inside-out as a thanks for you sharing all this info with us so we can take better astro photos!
Maybe I'm the only one that said anything but I doubt people enjoy to get blasted by cinematic riser sound effects (for example on a PI-tutorial of yours), loud sudden whooshes, music stingers etc. We shouldn't have to keep our hands on the volume knobs in case anything loud pops up. Your voice is the bread and butter, the info we subscribed for and want to learn from, everything else should be subtle salt and pepper to spice it up. Never meant for this to cost much of both our time.
Thanks for the offer but I don't use social media besides YT.
Man this is concerning. Fingers crossed my 2600 lasts like my 183 has been. Guess the am5 is knocked off my list now.thank you for a honest review
I think plenty are having success but I’ve been alerted to a thread in cloudy nights since posting this video and there’s a laundry list of people with the same complaint. If it works it’s a feature packed mount but if it doesn’t 🤷🏻♂️.
The EQ6r may not be as “sexy” but anyone I know that owns it especially the newest version says it’s a tank and dependable
@darkrangersinc yeah i have been hearing mixed feelings on the am5. Im primarily looking at the ioptron cem40,but the eq6r i havent heard anything negative really
@@turbo80lxcoupe I know several with the sky watcher EQ6r that love it. Maybe not as sexy but it’s very dependable. I went to Dark Sky sites all the time with my CGEM2 it was a heavy beast but it’s possible I’m pretty sure the sky watcher is lighter than that and if you’re using it mostly the backyard, it really doesn’t matter.
The cool thing about the CEM is you can get it with an encoder which will make it potentially more accurate auto guiding without having to run an auto guiding set up! It’s an extra chunk of change for sure not cheap they advertise
@darkrangersinc thats good to know about the adapter. Yeah the cem40 is a beast. I should look at the eq6r again harder.i feel like price was a little easier to swallow. So far my cem 26 is running great but im waiting to see how it handles my skywatcher 150p quattro
Damn! Glad I didn't go with an AM5. Might not look at their cameras either in the future
For the same price I would check out QHY or Morovian for a more premium option.
I have a 294 mc and the usb 2.0 stop working now I'm concerned what is going to fail next
Sorry to hear that unfortunately seems to be the theme did you try a new cable? Sometimes cables do go bad
It is good to call ZWO out on the lack of support. That kind of responsiveness is UNPROFESSIONAL. It kind of makes me cautious about buying one of their telescopes, now.....
Thanks I always want to keep it positive but if simply describing my experience paints a bad picture it kind of is what it is. Even though I did feel a little bad, I would feel worse not being honest. I’ve actually bit my tongue for a long time because I wanted to give them the opportunity to make it right. I did try to put all the good qualities at the end but felt like it was a situation that needed telling.
Sadly this is reflective of the price driven race to the bottom with most Chinese products. I've seen this with tools, electronics, and most of what's offered on Amazon. I second Agena Astro and also Astronomics as good companies to deal with. Losmandy has been my go to for mounts, the product is good, well supported, and the customer service is second to none but they do not offer the grab and go type harmonic mount you're needing. Avalon Zero maybe?
Yeah, unfortunately you have to get a premium brand with premium pricing to get good customer service. It’s a shame because if these Chinese companies could get customer service down, they would be pretty untouchable with a little additional quality control.
Even if pricing went up 10% I think people would pay it to get a slightly better product and somebody to actually talk to. I can’t imagine having a team of English speakers full-time would be that detrimental to their bottom line with all of the products they sell. Especially when you factor in the loss of revenue from folks who are sick of dealing with repeated issues.
I’ve used astronomics once and had a great experience. It was for my telegizmo 365. It was backordered, but they stayed in touch with me, and when it was ready to ship got it out.
I think what I need to do is just get a more solid mount for home use and then have them fix the AM5 if they ever do and just use that for travel only that way it won’t get a lot of use as I really only shoot a couple days a month on the road.
Man, if I could, I'd give you10,000 likes for this video. I am completely frustrated with a malfunctioning AM3 (used it for about 4 weeks, and only when the skies were clear...), and it has only been 14 days since I emailed their customer (non)support. Immediately, I learned I will NOT be talking to anyone about the issue. Only email, and 1 per day, since they are on the other side of the planet. As I type this, I am looking at the mount, in its case, wishing I had not bought the damn thing in the first place.
Yeah, I had the same thing happened. You maybe are lucky to get communication every other day because they don’t reply until midnight and then by the time you reply they’re gone for the day.
Not having a phone number to me. Seems pretty unacceptable in 2023 but unfortunately that’s the only option they have for now.
Sorry to hear you’re dealing with the same thing I did hopefully it resolves itself pretty quickly :-/
@@darkrangersincThanks for the reply. Well, there's always milky way core season early next year, so I guess I have something positive to look forward too. Good luck with your quest to get your issue resolved.
My fella believes you may have a power supply issue; he believes this is indicative of the fact that all starts out okay, then goes to 🤬. He has the ZWO parts you have enumerated, with the exception (he says) of the camera, and has n o n e of the issues you’ve encountered. Good luck going forward. Hope this is of benefit to you.
They finally sent a replacement head, after I released a video and the issue went away with the exact same power supply, so it was not a power supply issue. It was clearly mechanical.
Companies do the minimum cs local laws allow. Usa has little in consumer protection laws, but it still sounds pretty cynical cs from zwo.
ZWO really do rush to get products to market we saw that with the 2600 oil leaks and now the overpriced AM5s. Shocking customer service really
$8000..reasonably priced?
@@SonnyPruitt-q1s unfortunately in this hobby it is.
@darkrangersinc I'm finding that out.🤣
It took me taking to their social media telling people to buy gear else where before they even offered via social media messenger to finally fix the camera by that time almost a year passed so I sold my 2600 and went to QHY who is total opposite of ZWO.. Sounds like typical zwo.. I am shocked people still buy their stuff after hearing the horror stories.. the dice roll is not worth it
NINA
Yeah, I’m reaching out to see if there are any companies that want to send a unit to test and use with NINA
I’ll never buy another zwo product. Every product they come out with has some kind of issue. Yes they’re cheap but their products don’t work
ZWOe is me?
Haha I see what you did there ;)
Lost so much money due to big astro companies not being serious, kinda blows my mind that its so widespread but it sucks. Its not just one region, its world wide. Guess the hobby is so small that they can do w/e they want, i expected more out of fellow nerds but i learned its one of the most deceiving communities / hobby / business. Sry for negative post, its not all bad but there's shockingly amount of bad out there :/ Personally iv'e not had a bad experience with Zwo products, i had one problem but was something i fixed my self to save some time.
Since this video for the last couple months, I’ve been working really hard to find a reputable group of companies to work for, and have built some strong partnerships, and really made some good strides here. Ryan@darkrangersinc.com if you want any recommendations. I’ve found a really good telescope company, one for mounts, and one for the electronic accessories. I’ve met with them and are in contact with them and know that if you get something from anyone of these companies, they will take care of you and if you have any problems, you can let me know as well and I will reach out on your behalf
Well done video. Very professional like. The following is just a spitball: You have a lot of equipment crapping the bed in a short amount of time and maybe that is raising the brows of ZWO thinking it's user error? You have to admit it's unusual to have so much go so wrong from one person. Again, not throwing stones, I'm a problem solver by profession so just trying to find why a company would be so unwilling to just say, "Ok. Let's just replace the mount, the filter wheel and everything else that went wrong." As far as ZWO wanting to be a closed off ecosystem, I see no problem with that. They put the R&D plus costs into it so why not keep it to themselves? Many companies are like that. Nikon comes to mind right away. Third party lenses have to be reversed engineered. People are buying into the ZWO system and are well aware it's closed off. Don't like it? Don't buy it. Again, very professionally made video and you earned a new subscriber.
The issues all happened months apart. The camera happened on the second use I don’t know how you would blame me. I’ve used the same model of camera years prior. The issue with the electronic filter wheel happen a couple months later. The issue with the mount was roughly month 6. Also, the poor treatment started right away with telling me just to get a USB hub rather than replacing it. I’m not the only one that was literally another comment today saying the same thing happened to them with the same response.
Look at all of the other comments in this video they are just flat out not good at customer service. Even since the video when they reached out and tried to make it better, there’s been several issues and I’m going to be making a follow up. The head of North America and customer service reached out 48 hours after making the video promising to make it better and wanting to work with me to repair the relationship. She said she would send out amount the following week and 3 1/2 weeks later after checking in three more times they still have not sent it out and finally did after almost a month.
I guess I can see where you’re coming from as somebody trying to problems solve, but trying to blame an Astro photographer who’s giving them all the chances in the world to fix it isn’t on me neither is GHOSTING me for months.
Also, their software isnt proprietary. It’s fairly well known in the industry to be basically just pirated from other people. They are the only people to do that Primaluce which is a far superior product doesn’t lock down their system I just got my hands on one and I’m updating it now. Neither does Stellarmate.
Just because you can do something doesn’t mean you should if your product is actually the best then people will simply choose to get it. They rely on heavy marketing, and that’s why people buy it not quality control, good, customer service, and a good consistently well-made final product.
There’s a reason there are dozens of other comments in here with the same experiences mine and now that I switched to other brands the experiences night and day different. They have customer service phone numbers where the owner or somebody who actually knows what they’re talking about pick up right away. If there’s a problem, they will solve it in a timely manner, and actually stand behind the products. As I said, the only reason I got stuck with all of this is because I got it all at once, and I will never buy one of their products again.
You’re free to do whatever you think is right, but I can promise you there are better options for the same price or very similar price that you will be much more happy with the longer run.
You will see a bigger switch away from them in the future. People just are fearful that they don’t know how to set up a more complicated system, but I just got in an Eagle 5s, camera, EFW, eaf, all from a different brand it will run on Nina.
And I will put out a two-part complete series on how to make the switch so everybody can see how easy it is to go an alternative route
I’ve also built a relationship with Losmandy who has excellent customer service and is sending out a mount to test and Stellarvue for handmade scopes in the US. The first time I called both companies I got the owner or the head of operations. Anytime you call they pick up the phone and their products are handmade in the US I’ll take that all day.
You have to consider I’ve now made over 60 videos, talking about dozens of brands, and I’ve only made one negative comment about one brand. That’s pretty telling when 2-3 dozen other companies all get recommended or at least no negative comments but these guys do.
99.9% of my videos are nothing but positivity. You have to really want to mess up to get something negative said about you by me on this channel. Which you will see as you watch more.
Well, like I said, I wasn’t blaming you. I made it clear I was spitballing.
@@yervantparnagian5999 it’s all good, I’m just explaining where I’m coming from. Of course, I immediately try to diagnose any potential errors that could’ve been my fault. Believe me I’d actually much prefer it to be my issue because then I can fix it or I can just take accountability and handle it where I have a problem is when it’s not my fault and I can’t get support from the company that sold me a product with a two-year warranty. They don’t want to back up.
Well, I saw this too late. Wish me luck.
I’ve had a couple products make it all the way it’s possible!
Shame you don't live in the UK. If you have an issue with a product, your contract is with the retailer NOT the manufacturer and the retailer is responsible for sorting any issues for the first year, or within the period of the warranty if they offer an extended warranty. If you have a decent retailer they will usually just ask you to send the product back and give you a new one.
Yeah that would be good for me but bad for the distributor who would just have to eat the costs since the manufacturer won’t honor their own warranty. The real issue is the company not backing their products and not responding to customer service inquiries.
Also I bought the mount from ZWO everything that did get fixed was through Agena and they did give me some reconciliation.
So a company hets grief for making a decent product that you can't use on other makers gear!!
So of Ford makes an ecu upgrade do yet get annoyed you can't use ot on am audi... really!!
I get the QC issues and poor support but you really can't insist they open up to their competition.
Plus there are enough forums and Facebook groups that this would become known issues pretty damned quick.
Also, did you buy direct from zwo?
Always best to buy via a shop who would then be liable to sort out any issues.
That’s such a bad analogy. Every other company that makes some sort of onboard computer design for Astrophotography allows for Open source and the ability to use any type of product you want. This is one of the biggest and most common complaints about the ASIair. Most people who buy the product still wish that you would have the option to buy whatever camera or accessories you want especially considering they don’t even make some of the accessories available like camera rotator, or flat panel. I don’t know if you’re new to the hobby but this is a pretty common issue people have with ZWO.