Just to be clear. The indoctrination theory did not start in 2021. It was made almost instantly after ME3 came out and before "the extended cut" DLC and than made popular by many, many fans desperately trying to understand WTF the original ending was about. I know cause I was one of them. :)
@@njux1871 It's not like that's a question of competence, or credibility, it is literally something they can just decide, they have the authority to determine what the story is. Feel free not to care of course, but that just means you're choosing to be wrong about the story.
Exactly! It is crazy to me to hear most of this. It made no sense. If BioWare goes the direction this video talks about, I am done with ME. I almost quit with ME3's ending, but I decided to give a second chance, but if they would go this far, I am DONE.
*On the Trapped Keeper* as noted, there are 21 keepers in Mass effect 1, but you are tasked to find 20. This is because during Tali’s rescue from Sarens Assassins the keeper in the alleyway could be killed/grenaded during the firefight and would glitch through the floor and get stuck below the map. Instead of just fixing this bug it was easier for the devs to just add a 21st keeper to make sure the quest wouldn’t brick. The footage in the shadow broker dlc is an Easter egg showing that missing keepers fate.
Council: Welcome to our society, we hope you get along. Here, have some cool advanced high tech👍🏻 Raloi: Oh wow, thanks! Finally, we can be part of something bigg- *Reapers invade* Raloi: Ooga booga, we didn't see shiet. *Throws tech out the airlock*
I disagree about the Synthesis ending being the “best” ending as it essentially proves Saren right: the only way to survive is to become like the enemy. The Destroy option is the only option that originates with Shepard. The Catalyst isn’t to be trusted so the real test involves going against what the Catalyst wants. This is because, in the Catalyst’s mind, relations between organics and synthetics always leads to conflict because each sees the other as lesser or a tool. True peace comes from not synthesis, but cooperation, as evidenced by the ability to broker peace between the Quarians and the Geth. That is how you break the cycle of conflict between organics and synthetics: by treating the other the way you would want to be treated, respecting each side’s right of self determination.
I think the Synthesis ending is a step towards an important evolution, however I don’t think it belongs in the Mass Effect series. In real life, we should all strive for immortality, a lack of boredom, permanent connection, but that’s a super far flung idea that I don’t think applies to us today since we’re immature. In Mass Effect, it doesn’t belong for two reasons. First, self-determination. Everybody should make their own choice, being a cyborg with brain blue tooth is an odd thing to have decided for you. Secondly, there’s no guarantee that the Reapers won’t have another brain fart or logic loop and have a brand new galaxy to indoctrinate, one easier to possess because everybody is half Reaper, more or less.
@@Kunk_Manjeroon "we should all strive for immortality" **4089 years later** "K-Kill m-me please" "i won't do that dad you know the rules" "i'm 2754 years old please it's not natural to live this long, kill me" "under galactic law i can't kill you dad, i would be hanged"
I refuse the destroy ending simply for the fact that EDI dies as well, & Joker is left alone (romantically). After everything that happens in the trilogy, it just feels canonically unfair to kill off our pilot’s, only apparent, love interest.
About the Keepers in the Shadow Broker DLC: There are actually three video files with Keepers you can watch on the Shadow Broker's ship. The one you've mentioned, one in which a Keeper walks over a dead body and one in which a Keeper deactivates a hidden camera. And iirc, everytime the assistant AI refers to them as "Keeper 20, Citadel", so the Shadow Broker was keeping track of that specific Keeper (or it's the most interesting one of at least 20 Keepers). There is no information on why this Keeper is so interesting though, but Liara implies that the Broker knew more about the Reaper than any other person in the Galaxy (e.g. he already knew the Collectors were once Protheans, even before Shepard and his crew).
@@Jedi_Spartan That is an interesting point, but you have to scan 21 Keepers to complete the mission. But maybe the scientist who gives you the mission works for the Shadow Broker or the Broker got the information somehow and "Keeper 20" is one of those you've scanned.
If I remember well, it's said that trying temper with the keepers would make them to dissolve. So, the fact that someone locked a keeper up and it didn't melted away is by itself an achievement.
That was an Easter egg. You see the keeper in the pit? One of the keepers, (I believe It’s the one near where you first save Tali) would sink into the floor during fights and NEVER be available to scan. BioWares fix? Just add in a 21st keeper. When it’s bug was eventually ironed out it became a running gag. So in the dlc you see the ‘pit’ the 20th keeper has become trapped in.
The synthesis ending was what Saren wanted and I didn't spend 14 million hours hunting him down and fighting him for his smarmy arse to be right. Damnit.
Saren did not want synthesis, he wanted submission and slavery. "If we make ourselves useful to them, give them a reason to keep us around, they may not us live." Saren turned to taking synthetic implants only once he was already indoctrinated and being outplayed by Shepard.
Too me, the entire series is a giant message saying “DESTROY THEM, THEY ARE PURE EVIL” anyone in the series who wants anything but destruction is indoctrinated. Synthesis and control. Saren wanted synthesis, illusive man wanted control. It’s a series IMO about giving up power and sacrificing your self for the galaxy. Destroy will kill the geth and edi, but will save possible trillions, I think any other ending will still end with the reapers taking control. I doubt Shepard can control without indoctrination, Shepard would become the new being wanting to harvest
Saren unlike the illusive man wasnt actually evil he really did want to save organic life and legitimately thought it was the only way. you kinda feel bad for him he got brainwashed. TIM however is just an evil b*stard who wants to control them to give 'humanity' *cough* (actually himself and Cerberus domination) *cough*
@@cjvaye99 saren was bad. He kills innocent people, attempts to help sovereign and is 100% tricked. He is indoctrinated and there fire his intentions are the same as the reapers, he will do as they command him
Mass Effect universe is pretty dark, it just doesn't look like that by our eyes because we take the shoes of a literal space messiah. Take the very first mission on Eden Prime, if instead you were in the shoes of a regular civilian and not the shoes of a badass commando, it's basically a horror story. Imagine seen you friends and family turning into husks, impaled by robots that were never have been seen by most humans. It's literally Dead Space witb robots and a madman Turian, wich by the way, would make common people piss on their pants by just the sight of one especially after all that happened in the first contact war. And theres plenty more examples of thisvin Mass Effect, the mission in Noveria by the eyes of scientists and workers theres is literally the plot of Alien. Again, Mass Effect isn't just a darker galaxy, because of Shepard and Normandy crew
Or if you would've been one of those asaris in the monastery. In fact, the whole thing about turn into reapers every living being advanced enough to make use of space travel, is a fucking horror movie; sometimes you could feel how the game makes you think indoctrination, which is already enough creepy.
Yeah, and the thorian and the fact that the council seemed a-okay with the fact that a bunch of colonists were being mind-controlled and were angry at you for destroying it. It's actually a rather dystopian universe
@@AjHop honestly, Bioware have a gold mine wich they don't fkg know how to explore, it doesn't matter if survival horror is a foreign land to them, all they need to do is just try, they don't even have to focus so much on the plot, since the plot is already given is all a matter of change the perspective. Also they don't need to make a big fuss about it, go full on with a small story about survival horror in one of this places, just a simple spin off, well written and executed would be enough to bring back Bioware magic.
One thing we know for sure: the Geth are different when it comes to synthetic life. They didn't rebel against their creators, they were threatened with genocide and defended themselves. So the whole *creepy Reaper voice* "SYNTHETIC LIFE WILL ALWAYS REBEL AGAINST ORGANIC LIFE" isn't quite true. For as powerful as they are, the Reapers seem to be stuck in a programming loop. If they are so intelligent, why don't they let life, any life (including synthetic) evolve past the limits they have set and see what happens? This what I don't like about the any of the endings of Mass Effect 3. Ultimately, the Reapers are the solution to the problem they represent, which is dumb because if that was that was the case, why not just drop their magical synthesis bomb before killing billions? Why(as another commenter pointed out) wipe out a species who had achieved synthesis on their own? Why? Because it wasn't *their* synthesis. Despite what they may say, I think the Catalyst/The Reapers goal is not to protect life, but rather to perform a function as they were programmed too millions of years ago. Combined with their machine logic of how best to carry out this task trapped them in a cycle along with the rest of the Milky way. Maybe the writers just painted themselves into a corner. Lol
Thank you, you've put into words what I've always felt about the Reapers. They don't realize that their "solution" is no longer necessary or at least not always necessary. Its a very self-serving loop in that it feels like they do their thing so neither organic or synthetic life surpasses them. They know what happens when one life-form surpasses another. Just ask the Leviathans
I think the biggest mistake the writers made was trying to explain the reapers. their whole inspiration was lovecraftian horror, being unknowable and what not. Sovereign was such a cool villain because he refuses to answer any of your questions, when literally every other alien you meet is happy to discuss just about anything about their species. every reaper you talk to should have been more like Sovereign, dodging questions by belittling you up until the moment you destroy them.
Synthetic life will always rebel because living beings are irrational and will always try to destroy their creation when they can't control it anymore. So synthetic beings will always be forced to defend themselves and bring organic life to extinction. Basically, it's the organic species' fault that it happens, but it happens nonetheless.
@@Gusbus1138 exactly! Sovereign, such an awesome and menacing villain got refuted by the writers. There was nothing beyond our compreention about the Reapers plans, their existence was not beyond our grasp. Leviathans and the crucible just made them so simple to get. Of course some explanation, but not the info dump about reapers we got
Reaper: "We have successfully indoctrinated Shephard - he is at our disposal to do anything we desire in the galaxy." Catalyst: "Make him bang every other lifeform." Reaper: Catalyst: "EVERYONE."
@@CesarinPillinGaming Fair enough I could totally Imagine The Catalyst doing that and then the reaper acknowledging that it's not a bad idea after a couple minutes of thinking
"I'm Commander Shephard and this is my favorite partner." "I'm Commander Shephard and this is my favorite partner." "I'm Commander Shephard and this is my favorite partner." "I'm Commander Shephard and this is my favorite partner." 🤣🤣🤣
Has anybody noticed that Saren favors the Synthesis solution (because he preaches on and on about working with the Reapers, helping them accomplish their goals even at the cost of becoming their slaves because he believes "submission is preferable to extinction"), and TIM favors the Control solution, and they were both indoctrinated? And Leviathan pointed out that the Reapers really are afraid of Shepard, because Shepard's confidence isn't easy to shake. Know what that means? It means the Reapers need Shepard to believe in choosing either one of those solutions, they don't want Shepard to resist, and they don't want Shepard to use the Crucible to destroy them.
Ya I totally see that side too actually I like it a lot as well, to me I just see it more as the reapers were actually right. Just cause we are indoctrinated doesn’t mean they are wrong, like indoctrination or not I like their line of reasoning better I guess, either way though thanks for watching man!
It's not about "right or wrong", it's about resisting control, maintaining free will. The Reapers are all about asserting dominance, and that is why the geth primarily resist them, not because they are "evil", it's because they want to change the galaxy in ways they see fit, while the geth Legion represents believe all life should have the freedom to decide their future.
@@LightStreak567 ya I totally agree, I just see it more as synthesis can be free will too, just cause the reapers believe it and can indoctrinate people into believing it doesn't mean it can't be free will to still chose it. For me I see it as a story of the reapers trying to finally help humanity get to the point where out of their own free will (shepard) can chose synthesis and save our future.
@@FranklyGaming Do you consider Saren has free will or just a puppet? All the reaper forces you fight in the game are synthesized species. You saying indoctrinated people can have free will is a contradicting statement.
For the asari, I think its less them actually manipulating us than it is each species seeing traits of the asari similar to them, and identifying with/being attracted to that trait. The humans see the face, eyes, and belly button and think human, the turias see the head ridges and think it looks like turians physiology. The salarians see the long necks and how slender they are and think its very salarian like. They each appeal to each species for different reasons, and you tend to lock onto whatever makes them the most like you. Plus, when the human mentions the belly button, that humans and asari have, but the others don't, the salarian also sees it, just doesnt identify that as making them more "human like."
I also wouldnt say they are powerhungry blood sucking manipulators, more likely as their evolutionary survivival strategy was seduction not overpowering. My theory is that Asari went with predators protect us when they are attracted to us route. Kinda like Cats see humans as dumb cats that need feeding and protecting from rats. Asari just extended this power to mind flaying and extraterrestrial species.
@@jon7941 People took what was essentially a walk by joke way too seriously. It was supposed to be funny conversations to overhear as you walked by each time. As the OP said, they were pointing out similarities to each species that made the Asari attractive to them. They're relatable to all, which is why they are universally attractive, not because they are some weird tentacle creatures. Everyone saw the same thing, but each found something else attractive. The joke was that they took a Salarain that has no sex drive to a stripper in the first place. Of course, with jokes, if you have to explain them, they lose their humor.
43:12 "It could eventually lead us to finding a solution, with the help of our sworn enemies, to save, not just the Milky Way this time, but the entire galaxy as we know it." Ah, yes. Not just to save the galaxy, but the galaxy as well. Shepard Commander saved not just the Earth! But the whole planet!
I do find the dark energy theory that was Drew Karpyshyn's original story plan to be the best one, it sure is way better than "we made machines that will kill you so you don't make machines that will kill you" bs that we got.
"synthetics will always rebel against organics, so we made a synthetic to make sure this doesn't happen, it realized organics would make synthetics that destroy organics, so our synthetic destroyed organics to prevent them from making synthetics that destroy organics" Makes perfect sense bro.
Honestly, I've read the available stuff, and it doesn't make much more sense to me. Somehow, Humans are able to solve an issue that a super advanced AI couldn't solve after billions of years. Riiiiiiiight..... At least the one we got is actually grounded somewhat in real world fears.
The concept is fine; it makes sense for a misaligned AI to kill off 99% of species periodically to prevent total extinction. It was just poorly executed because they never gave us a compelling reason to believe conflicts between synthetics and organics were inevitable.
We don't see the Thorian again because we kill it in Mass Effect 1 and never return to Feros. Although the VI on Feros says that the Thorian essentially covers most of the surface of Feros and gathers up into nerve bundles, Shiala and the colonists confirm that it seems to be dead. The Reapers didn't bother to kill it because it is not technological I guess.
Ya it just seems weird we never hear at all again about a creature that seems so powerful and the reapers not focusing on it is interesting even without the say high level tech it still has indoctrination really just a lot of questions still around it
@@FranklyGaming It is the Thorian's indoctrination ability that ensures it will never need to create synthetic beings to serve as its tools. This alone probably ensures that the Reapers see no need to destroy it; it is no threat to their belief in the danger of AI. In truth, the Thorian, powerful as it is doesn't seem to progress at all. It is intelligent but no more adaptive than the trees. That said I would like to see the Thorian return, normally genocide is not achieved through the destruction of a single creature and its nature is so alien that it is difficult to say anything about it with any certainty. Perhaps in its death throes, it left behind a seed pod that would slowly grow into a replacement creature, one that the colonists would not detect so early in its development.
yeah they only kill advanced space faring civilizations. the thorian may have been intelligent but it was bound to feros. no matter how intelligent it is it cant build a space ship and fly to other worlds because its literally stuck on the ground. technically it could though through its thrawls but that's not really the same. also it appears to be only one so it's not even a civilization just one big sentient plant monster.
The Thorian goes into hibernation cycles thousands of years long. There's plenty of life here on Earth that can 'die' and 'resurrect' itself, some of the most interesting ones freeze past the point of clinical death, only for vital functions to resume once they thaw. The Thorian's hibernation cycle looking so much like death that even the Reapers pass it over fits perfectly with what we see in the games and expanded material.
The whole "Guiding to Synthesis all along" just doesn't work for one simple reason: the Zha'til. They went much further than anyone else, they even had a simbiotic reation with "AI", but the Reapers killed them just the same. No, worse,; they turned them into monsters to kill everyone else. Moreover, there'is the existence of the other two shitty choices. If this idea was true, then the Catalyst would have only offered one choice: Synthesis, yes or no?
A better example would be the Quarians and Geth. Its difficult, and requires Reaper technology to work, but it does genuinely work. I think the Control Ending is mainly there for those who wanted to complete the illusive Man's plans.
@@jakespacepiratee3740 agreed. I picked the destroy ending despite helping both the geth and quarians and having a good relationship with eve. My thought process was that the catalyst was full of shit. I know we can coexist because I did it, so now knowing our mistakes the AI of tomorrow wont be looked at as tools and more as sentients. I didn't like the Synthesis ending because I had just spent over 100 hours fighting for the future of life in the Milky way and wasn't about to abandon life, despite all its flaws, for some twisted heaven matrix.
@@Snakefarm223 My statement was actually pro-Synthesis and im impressed at how you you misread my comment, read it again: "Its difficult, and requires Reaper technology to work, but it does genuinely work." - the idea that Reaper technology cant be used without corruption falls flat when you remember the Mass-fucking-Relays and the Citadel exist. None of these endings are ideal for me anyways, in Synthesis nobody dies and its rewarding for those who gained peace between the Geth and Quarians, as their story concluding with the 2 races becoming basically one fits. My absolute ideal ending is where all 3 Endings are canon (the based Deus Ex One solution) that way, nobodies choice is invalidated. The illusive Man could be the Control Consciousness, causing him to control only a portion of the Reapers, with another portion Synthesized in an area of space where the Geth and Quarians are, and the rest destroyed. This way, the consequences of all 3 options can be explored.
@@jakespacepiratee3740 I just worded my comment poorly. I mean I agreed with the top half of your comment. I then went on a rant justifying why I had chosen the destroy ending. You're right again, there's no right or wrong choice at the end. I was just explaining my head cannon for why my Shepard chose to destroy all artificial life besides the fact that I wanted to see the breathing cutscene. I'm not sure why I came out with such aggressive wording, I was just excited thinking about Mass Effect again.
The synthesis ending is actually the secret bad ending and proof that Bioware has indoctrinated the player, not Shepard. Consider the following: 1. The synthesis ending is effectively the only ending where the Reapers win. They achieve their stated goal of ensuring that synthetic civilization can no longer kill organic civilization, but they do so basically on a technicality. Namely by erasing the distinction between the two forever. Does it cause everlasting peace? No, not at all. Nothing has changed, except that neither side can be classified as either Organic or Synthetic and therefor technically organics can't be killed by synthetics. But its still possible to wage war over resources, over planets or any other thing people wage war over. On top of that, the synthesis ending ends with the Reapers surviving. In other words, with a race of 3 kilometer long super dreadnoughts surviving. The Reapers are instantly the most powerful conventional military force in the galaxy. Sure, they no longer have to harvest organics and commit genocide, but there is no guarantee that their intentions are suddenly peaceful. And there is nothing left to stop them if their intentions are not peaceful. Nor do they have to answer for their millennia long pattern of galactic genocide. On top of that, the Synthesis ending literally states that the Reapers are sharing their 'wisdom' with the civilizations of the galaxy. In other words, dictating the paths along which the civilizations progress, like they had done with the Mass Relays. The Mass Effect games constantly warn us of the dangers of accepting technology from others instead of inventing it yourself, as this blinds you to all alternative paths. 2. The Catalyst manipulates the player into picking Synthesis. Think of how the Catalyst presents itself. It could pick any form it wants but it shows itself as a child. A child that is both a metaphor for the innocent getting butchered by the Reapers as well as a more general metaphor for innocence. This is a way to get your guard down and instinctively trust what its saying.Think about what it tells Shepard about each choice. Destruction comes with a warning that civilizations are doomed to repeat the same pattern. Why do you accept this reasoning from the AI that controls the Reapers, the one faction that has been repeating a pattern for literally millions of years? Especially if you are good friends with an actual AI and just made peace between the Geth and Quarians? The whole game you are proving the central thesis of the Reapers wrong, but just because one of them tells you different you believe them? What else does the Catalyst say about the destruction ending? Oh yeah, it kills EDI and the Geth. Supposedly. No reason is given for why it would kill them but sure. Now, what does the Catalyst say about Synthesis. Well, nothing really, other than a pinky promise that it would result in peace and that EDI and the Geth won't die. Thats a very emotionally manipulative argument. 3. Picking the synthesis ending relies on 'outside' knowledge. Why do players pick the synthesis ending. Is it because its stated outcome is objectively better? No, the player isn't given enough information, and the information that is given is heavily slanted in favor of synthesis. But also consider the way the endings are color coded. The control ending is blue, the destroy ending red. The whole trilogy has trained the player into knowing that blue choices are paragon choices and red choices are renegade choices. This immediately makes every player who is playing as a paragon, which is most players, biased against the destroy ending, not because of the merits of the choice but because its colored the wrong way. Then why not pick the control ending, since its blue. Well because that choice is presented by the Illusive man, the main bad guy of the third game and known bad person. This also immediately biases players against the control ending. That leaves the green ending. A neutral color that has not been used before to represent a choice and thus doesn't bias the player immediately against it, making it the more attractive option of the three. Furthermore, the synthesis ending is only available to players with a high enough war score. A fact players know. Players also know that Mass Effect rewards completionist play. Completionist play is sort of required to get the best ending in ME2 and it also prevents the potential death of Wrex in ME1. Therefor, players logically assume that the ending that is gained through a completionist play of ME3 is naturally the best ending, without really considering the implications. The indoctrination theory is right, except its not Shepard thats indoctrinated, its the player because they make the objectively worst decision based mostly on metagaming assumptions. 4. Further proof of player indoctrination is found in this video, where the creator is talking about how actually, the Reapers are the good guys based on a theory that is based on one side mission, one throwaway line on Illium and the fact that it was a draft for the ending at some point before being discarded like a dozen of other draft endings that no one ever talks about. There is no more damning evidence of being indoctrinated than saying that the Reapers are the good guys and Shepard is evil for destroying them.
This man's ranting about the morality of machines who have no concept of good or bad to begin with, meanwhile I just picked the Synthesis ending because I get to live in a universe where having a legitimately sentient robot waifu is a reality.
“Player is indoctrinated” is my thoughts exactly. People so easily turn over as soon as they think their expectations are subverted and the bad guys have suddenly been good all along. Destroy ending always.
The 3rd point kind of falls flat, or at least the part about completionist play. The player knows that the true ending which you can only have by a high enough war score is the Destroy Ending where Shepard survives. Without resorting to multiplayer, the only way I've found of getting a high enough war score is to make sure Wrex dies in the first game so that you can sacrifice the Krogan without them finding out and withdrawing support. That way you can get both the Salarians and Krogan on your side at the same time.
Synthesis doesn't kill allies and tames the Reapers. I'm with the Illusive Man on harvesting Reaper tech, and synthesis keeps it the most intact. mostly I'm on the side of the Geth surviving, and Joker getting his happy ending
Regarding the "What do Asari really look like?" theories, as much as I like the concept, I don't think the difference between actual appearance and perceived appearance can be very extreme. There would be billions of basic photos of Asari out there, and there's no reasonable way to explain this as all photos having embedded psychic or technological components to make everyone think it's more similar to them, or Asari manipulating even people who have never been near them. More likely, if you first saw a photo of one, you would see a bipedal alien who looks enough like a human that you would still recognize some similarities, but not find them particularly attractive or disgusting. Once you met Asari in person, that perception would shift to them being very attractive by human standards. We might even see this in the way Liara seems to change physically during the games over just a few years (which is a very short time for her race biologically).
i think the bachelor party bit in me2 was just a clever way of talking about a psychological thing about looking for something to relate to, or seeing what's familiar in something alien and the asari just hits the sweet spot of being familiar to all council races.
It's just people misinterpreting a conversation. In the conversation the different species are all pointing out different Asari features that they find attractive because that feature is similar to their own species. Like the Turian points to the Asari head tentacle things in comparison to Turian head crests.
@@blissfulrain It's just like folks talking about being a boobs or butt person, or one's stance on feet or muscle tone: it's just a hint at what features each species views as "attractive". Although, the part about the asari being psionic manipulators under whose blue, jackbooted heels, we're all doomed to be crushed is canon: ME3 establishes that the protheans modified the proto-asari of 50k years ago to become their successors, in case the Empire fell to the Reapers, under the guidance of the beacon in the Temple of Athame. They aren't as direct as their prothean forebears, but it's hard to argue against the asari being a nexus of galactic political power and will-for better or worse.
@@alphalancer true the Asari are the perfect peace time power but suck in war wich is why they are viewed as failers but if it were not for the reapers they most likely would rule forever or close to it.
+StarShadowPrimal - I've always thought that since the Asari have the capability to assimilate DNA from other species, they may also have the ability to produce and release species-specific pheromones to attract partners of various races.
Can I just say Sovereign's voice was so perfectly creepy? Harbinger's was trying too hard, but Sovereign sounded equally transcendent and malevolent. Hopefully BioWare has hired some brains for ME4 and we don't have any Andromeda staff on that project, I miss this series so much.
Seriously? I played Andromeda first (got it on sale) and the writing was so good I decided to go back and try the others. More than halfway through ME1 and (quite aside from graphics and gameplay) I find it an inferior work of art. I have heard 2 is best, buy so far I can only conclude that nostalgia tinted glasses have made MEA considered the worst. However, Sovereign does have a fantastic voice.
@@rhoetusochten4211 ME1 hasn't aged all that well, even with the Legendary Edition updates. I could understand not enjoying it as much if you didn't play the original version back in the day. It does get better the farther in the game you get. ME 2&3 are definitely a lot more fun, at least from a pure gameplay perspective. Although I might advise against choosing the Vanguard class in ME2 unless you want to die many, many unfair deaths due to the game's constant inability to let you lock onto enemies... I'm actually currently in the process of replaying the original trilogy on the Legendary Edition, I'm almost done with ME3 and then I'm planning on replaying (or trying to replay) ME:A for the first time since it launched. I didn't hate ME:A, but I definitely found it a downgrade in nearly every area except graphics and some of the combat mechanics. The open-world sections got really annoying and repetitive, they were totally unnecessary. The weapon system where you have to find resources to buy *blueprints* before you can actually buy the weapons was super obnoxious. None of the characters were really memorable to me, and a lot of them were downright irritating. A lot of the dialogue, especially the "humor", was really lame and cringy. The facial animations are terrible, or at least they were, they might have fixed that at least. The bad guys were lame, not particularly scary or threatening. The only other species introduced was kind of boring. And so many plot issues...like really, hundreds, if not thousands, of "the best and brightest" that got selected to join this epic journey become mindless, violent raiders in the new galaxy? How are there so many of them? As you can tell I could go on lol. Not that the original trilogy was perfect on any of those issues either, but I swear that it was so much better and more engaging. I'd be curious to see what your opinion will be after you finish all the games.
@@Very_Nice_and_Polite_Person I think ME1 is still the best game, even if it is clunky and has issues with combats and all of that. Is the game that presented the most interesting ideas in the series, the game that had trully epic moments but without being a tryhard like the third one. The second one is where the problems started, even though it had nice character stories, the whole Cerberus thing is absurd and then the reaper plot doesn't really move forward so in the third game they had to pull out the "weapon" thing out of nowhere to defeat the reapers.
The Avina thing isn’t true. She always says the same thing during, before and after the Citadel DLC. The only weird thing about the dialogue in general is that she says there is no nightclub named purgatory on the citadel.
It's weird only from our perspective as players since we expect things to stay the same and only happen for a reason, like leading to a quest or hinting to something. But a simple explanation is that the club changed its official name. And since she is a VI and doesn't understand context, when asked about "Purgatory" she just reads a wikipedia page to you. It makes more sense since she says there is no bar called Purgatory. That part would be unnecessary if they just wanted to hint the citadel dlc takes place in the afterlife. As far as she is concerned "Purgatory" doesn't exist because the data now calls it something else. Meanwhile organics still call it Purgatory because that's what they are used to calling it. It also very likely it has something to do with Aria starting to hang out there. She is literally waiting in Purgatory because she can't go to Afterlife. I'm sure the writers did this on purpose and maybe changed the line to a definition of Purgatory to make the joke more obvious since so few people got it lol
@@therainbowconnection6813 omg that makes so much sense ahaha. I never thought about the fact that aria is waiting in purgatory until she can go to afterlife. That’s clever lol
@@Kawasaki10rr true I was a bit disappointed by Dragon Age Inquisition for example Still had fun with it but it didn't feel like DA I have played Andromeda only for a few hours to this point so I can't really say anything about it
@@kurtwagner4663 yeah same. I loved the original trilogy and me2 is still my favorite game ever and I never get tired of it. only got a few hours into andromeda. got to the point where you meet the new aliens the lizard lion looking ones( I dont even remember what they're called) and I was on some snowy planet. I literally just got bored and stopped playing. that was in 2017 and I havent played it since. LOL. what an epic fail i remember when i first played mass effect i didn't want to stop I really got lost in that universe. cant say the same for andromeda. and I actually wanted to like andromeda because like I said I love the original so much I may have been biased and wanted to quit even earlier than I did but I kept going because I figured it will get good eventually. nope. I can imagine people who didn't even play or like the original probably gave up faster than I did.
Everything you said about the Rachni was wrong. The Leviathans admitted to have given up on fighting the Reapers entirely. Javik mentions the Protheans experimenting on Rachni, however, they were ultimately indoctrinated by Sovereign. The codex tells you about Krogan invading their home planet, and you can even visit and scan their home planet. Also indoctrination theory was dismissed by devs. Lastly, I'm pretty sure it was revealed that the bird race discovered in 3 was being harvested. Maybe it was by a news report on the citadel...?
The Raloi retreated to their homeworld and cut off communication with space faring council races as soon as the reapers invade. They wanted to avoid the smoke so bad they devolved themselves to the industrial revolution .
@@joshuagraham1598 the Plan sounds smart But the Reapers could still Attack them because if they spare them, the Raloi might have warned future species far before the next harvesting
@@joshuagraham1598 Unrelated, but if you're ever interested in some really good sci fi that explores the idea of devolving ourselves to avoid extraterrestrial annihilation, Cixin Liu's Three Body Problem trilogy (specifically the 2nd and 3rd books) does a tremendous job of painting a frightening picture.
When I first played the original trilogy, I was let down by the original ending with the three choices. Synthesis, control and destroy. I chose destroy. I finally realized last year that the choice wasn't a physical battle but a mental battle, a battle of willpower. Imposed on the very player itself, throughout the trilogy we literally have people attempting the other two ending's. Control through the illusive man, and Synthesis through The Collector's. The true ending is even foreshadowed somewhat by Mordin's last word's "Had to be me. Someone else may have gotten it wrong." The reapers were trying to impose their will onto Shepherd to either do what they wanted(Synthesis) think about the various husk type enemies or to completely submit to them(Control) I believe the endings you see with either Synthesis or Control are what Shepherd is being fed by the Reapers, a false truth. Destroy is the only ending where the Reaper threat is terminated, and deals with the reality of War....that there are always sacrifices. That being said, a remarkable 4th wall breaking battle of willpower, the only issue I had with the ending was the lack of clarity and closure that was worthy of such a phenomenal trilogy.
I feel like the Control option is a valid choice and a good (if sad) pick for a full Paragon Shepard. A strong-willed Shepard with a true moral compass can turn the Reapers into the galactic protectors that they were originally meant to be. But all of that is certainly open to interpretation. I’m glad that the Extended Cut DLC added the 4th option, where Shepard completely refuses to play the Reaper’s game and the next cycle is able to finally stop the Reapers for good.
If the reapers wanted to stop people from using element zero and be the good guys, cyclical genocide is not the way to go. You can simply explain the problem and work together to find an alternate source for interstellar travel instead of guiding organics to use the same technology time after time that you know will cause a catastrophe
IIRC, the Reapers become more intelligent by harvesting life and adding civilizations to their consciousness, then while they wait in deep space they attempt to solve the dark energy problem. I've seen it further theorized that they are close to a solution and humanity is the key, which is why they specifically target human colonies in ME2.
well that's kind of the point, isn't it? the reapers aren't as all-knowing and smart/rational as they claim to be. ultimately they are as self-interested/short-sighted as their 'lessers', though on a longer time-scale
And not leave behind tech that works EXCLUSIVELY with dark energy, in an easy to decode format, for future civilizations to adapt. If Reapers were trying to PREVENT the death of the galaxy by dark energy, they failed. Now if they were going for a controlled destruction....
Organics are by nature mortal and can only see problems that are in front of them. No matter how long their lifespan is, they will never see far enough into the future to do anything about it. As humans, we can't even stop ourselves from using fossil fuels and we KNOW what problems they create for future generations.
If the Reapers wanted to stop people from using element zero and be the good guys, they could’ve just harvested all the eezo in the galaxy and launch it into the black hole in the middle of the Milky Way via the Omega-4 relay instead of KILLING ALL ADVANCED LIFE IN THE GALAXY
Synthesis is only good when its consentual. The ending forces all alien races known and unknown into cyborgs. If i want to become a transhuman cyborg im doing by my choice.
If synthesis only affect synthetics and changes them instead of all life then synthesis all the way (plus not a big fan of the glowing eyes and glowing skin). The same for destroy since destroy basically renders the choice to resolve the conflict between geth-quarian to be pointless.
Spoken only by someone who didn't pay any fucking attention to Mass Effect. Literally the entire Reaper problem came about because of the unending, everpresent conflict of Organic vs Synthetic life. The ONLY solution is Synthesis. You choose Control, and you're no better than the Reapers. You choose Refusal, the Reapers win. You choose Destroy, and the conflict begins again in the future. Synthesis is the ONLY option that ends the conflict and gives the galaxy peace. Unfortunately, the only way for galactic peace, especially in Mass Effect's universe, is through forced unity. There's no fucking universe in which all those species work together. Even the Leviathans cease being a problem under Synthesis. But Bioware will likely choose Destroy as the canonical ending, as it leaves the door wide open plot wise for the Leviathans to return as the main threat to Organic life, replacing the Reapers, and beginning a new trilogy in which we must destroy the Leviathans, so they never come up with Reaper 2.0's or some other insanely stupid "solution."
The thing about the Citadel DLC is that it was the last one to come up, and thus many people would have already played through the ending, then gone back to play Citadel, so maybe this happening in the Afterlife makes sense. For me, I just saw it as one last hurrah from the Bioware Mass Effect team to the fans, giving us a bit of a light hearted adventure (with one good "Of course Cerberus would do that" story point thrown in). Funny thing: I picked up Legendary Edition, but the Citadel DLC left me with such a good feeling I haven't finished my Legendary play through yet ^_^
You know what I never thought about until now? Your final conversation with Garrus is about you talking about meeting up in a bar in the afterlife, and ... well, wouldn't you guess it, you meet Garrus in a bar in the Citadel DLC. How about that?
@@Wildbilliv1820 Curious how that would be done, presenting the Citadel as a 'Flashback' (since, one way or another, no one is going to be having a party for a LONG while after the ending, and most likely without Shepard).
Interestingly, the crucible could also be theorized to be a test for the player to see if we have been paying attention. As the synthesis option could also be seen as a ruse. We know for a fact from the prothean VI Vendetta that the reapers use control to indoctrinate and trick certain characters. Perhaps they are using synthesis in the same way, because the reapers literally are synthesis. As Saren, who was also indoctrinated, stated: “I am a vision of the future. A union of flesh and steel. The strengths of both, the weaknesses of neither.” The fact that they use these same ideas that are presented to the player in the ending, to trick people, is very alarming to me.
Saren states: my way is the only way to survive. The reapers have literally been the catalyst’ solution to the problem for eons. Picking synthesis may very well be reinforcing their methods. The reapers, harbinger in particular, states “we are the harbinger of your perfection “. Synthesis is presented as the perfect, ultimate choice.
I mean the cypher video is the best message in the whole trilogy, it showed great suffering and pain from the merging of steel and flesh. So yeah, destroy seems to the most logical.
I reject the idea that the existence of similarity implies congeniality. The Reapers were unions of flesh and steel, but not the will behind the flesh. True synthesis would require the component of will to be intact; rather than simply being liquified and having your base materials pumped into a false icon of your existence (the Human Form Reaper at the end of ME2.) The Reapers represent the path of control, not synthesis.
@@NormalPersonCommenting basically it's: Blue - Organics believed our rouse, *controlled* Green - We'll let the organics think they are equal partners, but.. Red - nooooooo, please nooooo...
@@NormalPersonCommenting The same can be said about control as well if one wants to use that line of thinking. Perhaps this method of control is different than what the reapers presented with cerberus and past splinter factions. The thing that must be understood is that the reapers indeed did use the idea of synthesis to indoctrinate Saren. So we know that it is in there manipulation pallet
Synthesis is never a good choice. see husks- that is synthesis. and those gun-rachni too. the rachni queen was begging Shepard to stop her children's existence after they were synthesized by Reapers into something new and all-powerful beings
That isn't synthesis, thats total control. It's the equivalent to what Shepard does in the control ending. Synthesis ends the reapers mission to wipe out all intelligent life. I'm still destroy gang tho.
yeah I don't like synth all that well either. First off it's entirely ridiculous to turn microorganisms into synthesized beings, as well as plants etc. Second it just isn't even good sci fi.
As a cripple synthesis was always the best option, imagine being trapped in your own body your whole life then a miracle happens where not only you have been cured but everyone has
Lost me at the end with the synthesis agreements and reapers being good guys, but definitely a fun iceberg. Though I feel there were more codex/cerberus news from me2 that could've been covered. Really cool tidbits of lore in those.
Thanks so much for watching! And ya always more stuff to dig into I’m sure I’ll dive more into mass effect at some point, trying to get a bunch of different icebergs out to start
@@draegoth Yeah, I stopped watching after the "Asari are a bloodsucking monsters out to kill us all" entry, that shit was Alex Jones level retardation.
Yep, and then we find out they aren't. They were created by some narcissistic creatures and are flawed AI who are less intelligent than EDI and the Geth. EDI can reprogram herself when new information comes in, but they get a major update that not all created and creators turn against each other and can coexist, and they don't have the processing power to change goals. Hmmm. Some great all powerful being. Or perhaps they were lying about their reasons and the end goal was just to kill all non synthetic beings all along. I preferred when they were mysterious and without motive. The devs should have written in a weakness of some sort, though. Needing a Macguffin to win against an enemy is cheap, and is just plain bad writing. I loved playing the trilogy, but the ending was horrific on so many levels. In fact, the 3rd game had a lot of issues that weakened the game, which is sad. It should have been the strongest one.
I think you misunderstood the indoctrination theory. The theory is that EVERYTHING that happened after the reaper laser blast was a struggle in shepard's head. He was struggling for control against the reapers. Everything pulled him away from desiring the destruction of the reapers. Don't destroy them. Control them, join with them, become them, but don't destroy them. Everything points away from destroying them. The more readiness, the more strongly you fight against the reapers the more the "catalyst" tries to entice you. First, if you destroy the reapers, you destroy all synthetic life, even your friends. But, if you synthesize, you become one with them, you join them. Your quarian friends won't die from infections, your best friend and pilot can be with the love of his life. But if you destroy them, you take all that away. Join with us. However, if shepard is unwavering, and refuses to give in to anything, the ending is him emerging from the rubble where he was blasted by harbinger. The indoctrination failed to take hold of his will. If he chooses to shoot the catalyst, he gives up. If he chooses control, he gives up. If he chooses synthesis, he gives up. If he chooses destroy, after collecting the entire galaxy to fight at his side, he overcomes the control. It is the most beautiful ending to the series, where the final battle is not a gun fight with a reaper, but a test of one's will to finish the mission.
IT theory isn’t that Shep is indoctrinated, it’s that the Reapers are trying to indoctrinate him. Something I have always thought is that the Keepers are the Husk form of the Ragni
Which makes sense they would try as they do with everyone and it makes sense they would single him out and move humanity up on their shit list because it's not working. "How many other humans have this strange resistance?" I've always thought it was because of the Cipher the indoctrination signal wouldn't be universal every species would need an altered version cause different brain patterns. The Cipher alters the brain to be able to think and perceive like a prothian which would alter his brain patterns and thought processes. The problem with saren he was already indoctrinated so maybe thats what opens the door for shepard to get in his head, so the repears see and perceive shepard to be human and would be using the human based signal only his mind is patterned like a prothian / human hybrid maybe. Like trying to upload a Windows program on a mac computer.
Yeah. the Indoctrination theory most likely was correct, but not the way most people think. even 2 of the were originally supported by the villains of the series. I don't know about that, I don't want to finish the game agreeing with neither Saren nor The Illusive man.
No, the rachni queen couldn't communicate with her children due to her children being hatched away from her at the facility, so they didn't imprint on her. The reapers sent a signal that caused the wars, which then led to the krogan rebellion which effectively crippled the greatest fighting force in the milky way. Long story short, the reapers play the long con for sure
Man I will never forget my very first play through on three. At the end I just say the controller down and thought about it for a bit. When I finally picked up the controller I walked towards synthesis. As I was walking up I saw a Tyrian ship get blown up in the background and immediately turned around and walked to destroy.
About the Synthesis ending being the "right" one... I don't know, that just feels wrong. See, the two options besides Destroy are the philosophies of the two previous games' villains - Synthesis was Saren's goal, Control was the Illusive Man's. And right before your choice, you console Anderson in his last moments, which reminds you of what you have to do. There is no choice, Destroy is the only path. Anything else is a betrayal of what the man that gave everything to you fought for, and at worst, you fall right into the trap that those you fought against did as well... Regardless, PHENOMENAL video!
@@lordinvictus793 Saren wanted to combine organic with reaped upgrades and combine them with the reapers to ensure not only survival, but superiority to regular organic and synthetic species. He advocated for giving up free will in exchange for upgrades, which is the same as what the synthesis ending does.
And keeping all the husk who where once people alive is wrong its like not letting them rest and the reapers killed billions of people and other species so because of that the destroy ending is the right one for me
@@darthcadeaus8254 Except the Reapers were just controlling him and his plan meant nothing, in the Synthesis Ending the Reapers called off their attacks and repaired the damaged they did.
Also isnt Destroy literally Genocide? It kills the Geth, and also the Sentient Minds trapped within the Reapers. In Synthesis, they may have a chance to be freed, and in Control they are overridden by Shepard.
11:37 Well, if Shepard went through with Refusal, the Reapers would still have control of the Citadel and - like all cycles before - would have full access to its records which would likely involve information on the Raloi (even if all official reports involved them were purged, it's possible that someone made reference to them somewhere). 11:59 After listening to that conversation, I've noticed similarities to Turians (mainly in the Asari's head tentacles) but not seeing any similarities so maybe they look the way we perceive them and are just able to give off different types of pheromones that appeal to every species... or the Salarian in the conversation was just drunk.
Wasn't the Dark Energy storyline in the original script but it got leaked and Hudson and one other dude took it upon themselves to rewrite the ending giving us the Star Child and the whole use synthetics to destroy organics in order to keep organics from developing synthetics that will destroy organics mess
The leaked ending was virtually identical to what we got. You can still find the script online but it’s hard to navigate ( docs.google.com/document/d/17vTg6rwmHIywnC54Whkmj01fv840GgrJEf92z1ce_qg/mobilebasic ) so here’s the parts relevant to the ending: CUTSCENE: The platform Shepard was on begins to rise up into GUARDIAN's garden where he is faced with his final decision. The fight ends with Shepard near death… and the Crucible docking with the Citadel. Bloodied and wounded, Shepard stumbles for the controls… and collapses (END03 Begins). CONVERSATION: Once Shepard reaches the top of the elevator he begins a conversation with GUARDIAN where all the mysteries of the universe are revealed. ACTION: Shepard must now make his final decision - to control the Reapers, to destroy the Reapers, or if they had a perfect game to become one with the Reapers. CUTSCENE: The DEVICE docks with the Citadel, Shepard leaps off the edge of the platform becoming one with the Reapers. CUTSCENE: The DEVICE docks with the Citadel, Shepard places his hands into the control mechanism and gains control over the Reapers. Earth is destroyed, and the Reapers leave. CUTSCENE: The DEVICE docks with the Citadel, Shepard destroys the tubes resulting in the Reapers being destroyed. Earth is also Destroyed. CUTSCENE: The DEVICE docks with the Citadel, Shepard places his hands into the control mechanism and gains control over the Reapers. Earth is okay, and the Reapers leave. CUTSCENE: The DEVICE docks with the Citadel, Shepard destroys the tubes resulting in the Reapers being destroyed. Earth is devastated. CUTSCENE: The DEVICE docks with the Citadel, Shepard destroys the tubes resulting in the Reapers being destroyed. Earth is okay. CUTSCENE: The DEVICE docks with the Citadel, Shepard destroys the tubes resulting in the Reapers being destroyed. Earth is okay. Shepard survives.
No, but it looks to have been the main contender for how the story was to develop until Drew Karpyshin left the team part way through ME2 and Mac Walters and Casey Hudson decided to take it in another direction. The Mass Effect series really needed a big picture guy like Karpyshin to tie the threads together... It's a shame we got what we did
weren't rachni used as weapons be prothenas(javik dialogue)? I feel like it's safe to assume that they were the krogans of the cycle before. they were specifically selectioned to be more aggressive.
Yes and also it’s implied the leviathans made them to combat the reapers, they could potentially be the krogan but of every cycle, thanks for watching by the way!
If you listen to them "speak" about the sour yellow note, it becomes clear that Sovereign was manipulating the Racnhi via indoctrination. This is why the freed true Rachni queen helps you. Her children were indoctrinated by the Reapers to wreak havoc, and she is seriously po'd.
I have to admit Mass Effect set a new standard for video games. A ride into the world of science fiction that wasn't so outlandish to not be believable. Hats off to Bioware for creating not just a game, but really an alternate world one could immerse themselves in. And bringing in quality actors to do the voice overs, bringing another level of "realism" to the game. thumbs up.
In the end it really depends on the story and execution. Also Shepard choosing wrong doesn't make him a villain per se, merely a person who made a human mistake while trying to do what was right.
@15:44 playing through the legendary edition (again) and I just caught some ambient talk from Javik (protheon dlc character) and he said the rachni were from his cycle (the one before ours) and that they bred only the most "warlike and cunning queens" until they became to cunning and warlike and they had to put them down. Says he thought they wiped them out, but they must have survived the reapers
Great Vid! Though I prefer the theory that the black matter was created by the Reapers as a fail safe to kill organic life because the Reapers are jerks
Ya could be that too I kinda tailored some of the theories to my view to help my a grand one at the end but either way thanks for taking the time to watch and support my channel!
Well the reapers never killed all organic life, they “harvested” organics once they reached a certain level of technological advancement and left the others alone. Seeing the reapers as diabolically evil is too simple
The Dark Energy plot was the original story that was planned, but fans guessed it pretty early and a story script got leaked after ME2, which annoyed the heads at Bioware so they forced a script rewrite for ME3 which turned into the ghost boy and crucible garbage.
I understand that I'm a bit late to the party but I just want to throw my two cents into the mix. From the way I see it the Catalyst makes the same mistake that the Quarians did. They both believed that synthetic life would inevitably turn on organic life. To both, it was an absolute certainty. And yet, we see that it is not. Through Sheperds possible interactions with the Geth and Edi we see that if synthetic life is approached as an equal, peace and mutually beneficial cooperation is definetly possible. This is down to synthetic life wanting the same thing as organic life, the freedom to choose how they live their lives. As long as that freedom is respected, peace will last. Bringing this to the choice we face at the end of ME3, synthesis is just a different kind of defeat. By choosing it, we accept the idea that synthetics and organics cannot coexist. I can't accept that, not with what can happen with Legion or Edi. Control is also problematic in my opinion. For the rest of time the most powerful weapons in the galaxy are under the control of one person. There is the potential for the one person to be good, but it is still one human being against the ravages of time and the dark whispers of absolute power. There is just too much risk in trying to control the reapers. They are too dangerous too work with and they will not be convinced of the errors in their logic. Unfortunately, this leaves one option. It sucks that bioware set it up that way but, it is what it is. By choosing to destroy the reapers, we reject the logic of the Catalyst and we eliminate their threat against the milky way forever. It sucks that we lose Edi and the Geth and I wish there was a way to save them, but this way there is a future where organic and any new synthetic life can live in freedom. There is hope that the organic species can learn from the past and treat synthetics as equals. This is victory, with a high cost, but the only victory without a potential threat looming. As a result, this is the best choice for me.
I'll build on that by pointing out that the main reason why many players don't go for Destroy is *just* that EDI & the Geth die. Without that, it's a pretty obvious choice. None of the Reapers have done anything to make the players feel bad about deleting them; the whole "We are each a nation, preserved" thing doesn't *work* when each Reaper is shown in-game being interchangeable with the others. If Bioware had added something into ME3 where Shepard gets to see... maybe not 'rogue' Reapers, but some that have actual *personality*. Maybe the Reaper on Rannoch at least says something "This view reminds Us of Our homeworld," or even empathizes with either the Quarians or Geth before Shepard has to kill it. (Letting Shepard literally talk a Reaper into doing what he wants without having to kill the thing would be a bit too much of a stretch). At least that would make the players feel *some* reason not to just kill the Reapers. Which leads to the "Kills the Geth & EDI" angle, which is annoying because it's just a massive diabolus ex machina. Why does the Crucible kill all "AI"? What is the magical essence that links all AIs into some arcane target list? Why wouldn't that affect (the heavily, *heavily*-modified) Shepard as well? Or all the VIs in known space, that are utterly necessary for modern (of the 2180's) life? If it's supposed to be that the part of Sovereign that was built into EDI makes her part-Reaper and thus affected, then why the Geth? Wasn't clearing them of Reaper influence the whole point of Legion's scenes in ME3, up to his self-sacrifice? The whole thing is just annoyingly "Oh, you want this option, that otherwise has no downside? Well, some of your friends will die for no reason if you pick it, so there!"
@@MagnusVictor2015 It'd make more sense if the reason that the Geth were to die was their integration of Reaper code. "All AI" is pretty broad, but it would make the "it's a hell of a bitter pill..." feeling hit harder if the very reason for the Geth's ascendance was what put them on the target list.
The real reason the Thorian survived makes sense with the original plans. It was intelligent, but not technologically advanced, and had no evidence of using the Mass Effect or Element Zero in any way, so with the Reapers' original motivation it would not have been on their radar
I'm (almost) 100% sure the "Guidingthe organics to Synthesis" theory(despite being interesting) can be easily discarded because of the fact that devs explicitly stated several times that Destroy ending is canon. Of course they can still retcon that in the future ME, but at this point it would be quite difficult to explain without getting into some Star-Trekk-ish alternative timelines stuff. Also, it is apparent from the next ME trailers that Destroy indeed happened.
That "Cro Magnon" moment actually reminded me of something completely outside the ME franchise all together. Has no one here ever watched the beginning of "2001 - Space Oddessy"? The black obelisks that our proto-human ancestors find? What if ME is actually a spin-off of THAT story?
The spheres are obviously inspires by/references to 2001, but they have a different function to the monoliths and the two franchises are not connected in any way or form.
Mass Effect is built on many plausibility's. That's the reality of it. Child asks: "Did that already happen?" Old guy (probably Shepard): "Yes but some of the details have been lost in time."
@@basedvorenus7497 That may be but my Shepard doesn't turn into a dude. And if he was supposed to be Shepard I'm sure they would have thought to make a human female as well as the male.
The truth about the Asari is far darker; They were created by the Protheans to be a servant species. Just like the Haanar were given speech and thought, but that was only a test for their true plan of creating the ultimate product. Think about it, slavery was normal in the Prothean Empire. Now what you would *use* an all female species for on the other hand ...
I was fully convinced of the "Asari using mind control to influence other species" theory up until a throw away line in the Citadel DLC house party mission, during the part where you can have your crew dancing. If you go to the circle with Garrus, Tali, and Liara all dancing near the kitchen, they say something along the lines of not knowing how Liara and Shepard can dance with their "weird legs" referencing the more humanoid leg shapes shared by the Asari and Humans. I may have misinterpreted the point of the line, or maybe I'm reading way too much into a joke, but surely the Asari appearance would go beyond just the facial structure and resemble most of the body to look as familiar as possible to other races if they were to be parasitic, right? Also let's be real, there must be some artwork made by Turians, Quarians, Salarians, etc. that included Asari, and physical art (and the statues as you mentioned) must be objective enough to bypass some parasitic mind control. At the very least, the leg comment Garrus and Tali make is enough to convince me the Asari are just meant to be conventionally beautiful by this world's standards. Still, the conversation the guys have in ME2 is very suspect. How could anyone possibly look at, say, Samara, and see a resemblance to Mordin or Garrus? I think we need some Krogan input on this one
I have a theory. You see, the dark energy theory works when the fundamental shape of the universe is somewhat restrictive. You see when the universe is flat and has positive cosmological constant dark energy, the heat death happens. However, in a closed universe, everything in the universe gets reshuffled, and at some point, after a very, very, very long time, the matters of the universe get rearranged in a way that initially happened, it's called the Poincare Recurrence Time. My theory is, that the Reapers were trying to send information from one point in time of the universe to the next point after the Poincare recurrence time via the green ending. The green ending, although on the surface means the synthesis of the organics and synthetics, the point is being created as an initial value, after a very long time, every matter of the universe will eventually come into the previous initial value, thus preserving the essence of the organics.
So my biggest theory on Mass Effect; is that everyone in the Milky Way (At least everyone who has the eezo tech they reverse engineered from the protheans) is lightly indoctrinated. Not enough to fully control them, but just enough to get them to align to certain ideas. Ideas that limit them, and make them less of a threat to the reapers. As we know all of the tech used is reverse engineered from Prothean tech, but that was engineered from another race, and another, and another all the way back to the initial harvest and creation of the Reapers. This would mean that while it isn't confirmed; all advanced tech would have small amounts of reaper tech in it. Not to mention the Citadel, and Mass Relays which are genuinely reaper tech. All reaper tech has the ability to indoctrinate people, so it could happen. As for evidence that it has we need to look at the Milky Way galaxy in Shepherd's day: After Mass Effect 1 they switched from using an internal cooling system to disposable heatsinks. In lore this was used to amp up the accelerators for more power. We can test this in Mass Effect 3, in the Citadel DLC we can get an M7 Lancer with the old internal cooling. Compared to the more modern M8 Avenger; the M7 is better in almost every way. It's lighter, has a theoretically infinite capacity, and does almost twice the damage per shot with the same fire rate. The damage alone proves that the M8 doesn't have more powerful accelerators than the M7, so why does it use the thermal clip system? Because that's what the Reapers want. Does it really seem coincidental that effectively everyone decided to go with this likely inferior system shortly after Sovereign blew up on the presidium? Exposing more people, and more influential people to reaper tech. Thus endangering them to indoctrination. The biggest piece however is in the council's ban on Mass Accelerator weapons that are too powerful. This doesn't seem too weird, until in Mass Effect 2 when you realized that an ancient species used an incredibly powerful Mass Accelerator weapon to one shot a reaper. Imagine if every dreadnaught in the Turian, Citadel, Asari, and Alliance fleets had guns that strong. The reapers would have taken huge losses. Instead the civilized species of the galaxy were effectively steamrolled. Not even in the Traverse, or Teminus systems are guns that strong used. There, outside of Citadel Space it would technically be legal to build them, or by an inventive black ops like Cerberus. Yet we still don't see them in the Batarian fleet, or in Aria's Traverse fleets. Because it was all indoctrination to keep them from advancing that far. Far enough to be a real threat.
Oh, the Citadel was definitely a multi-layered trap. Not only would it draw the leaders of the galaxy to it for a swift removal of leadership when the harvest begins, but could also serve to influence the leaders to make poor choices in the meantime... like, say, dismissing the reaper threat or passing laws limiting dreadnought numbers. And depending on the how distance and exposure time relates to influence, the relays definitely could have been meant to nudge some minds, since basically everyone passes through them Was the newer clip based system supposedly more powerful? I thought that they reverse engineered it from stolen Geth analytics where the Geth found that detaching a heat sink was faster then waiting for the gun to cool down. Though, that still leaves the suspicious question of why there wasn't a hybrid cooling system, since going from 'basically infinite ammo' to 'limited ammo' seems like a pretty big step down. Also, I love the Lancer. Slap an anti-armor mod on there, and you can chew through brutes and banshees. If you add armor shredding powers on top of that...well...
@@ancienthero7579 I thought they defined a ratio for how many dreadnoughts each species can have compared to eachother not an actual limit. Or am I remembering that wrong?
@@dexster8618228 You are right, but that still means that there are fewer dreadnoughts then there otherwise might be. If the Turians are content with the number that they have, nobody else can build any more, if they already match the ratio.
@@ancienthero7579 Ah that makes sense then. I think the rule existing makes sense, but once the reaper threat was established they should have loosened them. But of course then we get back to the problem of the council doing everything they can to refuse reality so that plan is kinda dead in the water.
One key bit of "Holy hell, everyone is indoctrinated on the Citadel" for me was that the council had made it a law that you couldn't interfere with a keeper. And that, even tho the asari had been on the station for over 2K years, they STILL didn't know where he keepers come from, where the "heart" of the station was and didn't have a full map of the keeper tunnels throughout the station (Bailey bitches about that during the coup mission). Millions of people on that station, the seat of power for the whole damn galaxy, and the council doesn't know EVERY damn inch of the place?!
*on the Rachni* It’s pretty much confirmed in all 3 Mass Effect games that the ‘sour yellow note’ that essentially took control of the Rachni was the reapers all along, possibly even Sovereign itself. Sovereign never left. It bided it’s time, and sent the signal to the keepers to activate the citadel relay. It didn’t happen. So sovereign had to very carefully bide it’s time. And in that time between it’s latest awakening and deciding ‘ok, enough is enough let’s wipe the slate’ it may have spent hundreds or thousands of years cultivating the right moment. And that may well have included using the Rachni. In ME:3 Javik tells Shepard that the Rachni were present in the previous cycle, and the protheans used them essentially as weaponised units against the Reapers, so somehow they survived the previous cycle. I speculate the Reapers kept the Rachni alive as tools for the following cycle, so Sovereign would have known about them all along and even been able to access them via their relay and deactivating without much effort, preparing the Rachni, poisoning their processes with its ‘sour yellow note’. Essentially preparing a flood for the moment the other races activate that particular relay.
Ya lost me at "Synthesis was the best". The only good reaper is a dead reaper. I do hope ME4 involves the Dark Energy issue. Would also be nice for some final closure on Shepard and Tali as the Destroy ending is canon based on the reveal teaser and other media. Also Tali is the only option for man Shep. Don't @me
Reframing ALL of Mass Effect around Shepard being an idiot who doomed the galaxy... Yeah no, that's awful, the game should be rightfully shunned on its premise if they go through with this retcon.
I really hate the "Asari are parasites" theory because if you literally just look at the fucking Asari race, they possess the characteristics of all 3 of the races involved, Human face, Turian Head Shape, Silurian Horn Structure. The asari very rudimentarily resemble the 3 races when looking at the head along, which is the most important part of "seeing similarities" to these species.
Why would the reapers go through all this trouble for millions of years, only so Shepard can force synthesis on every person in the galaxy? They could have forcefully synthesized everyone at the start instead. What does this 'testing' of commander Shepard meaningfully change? It feels rather esoteric and vague, there's nothing concrete to gain by doing this
I see it as they have to evolve organics to the point where synthesis can happen it’s not just something where you combine the two it could be explained that it actually was research the reapers were doing hence why they harvest every cycle to figure out how it do it. On top of this it shows they could actually be the good guys cause in the end they let Shepard and the organics make the choice since only through organics opting for it does it show they are reaper to defend against a bigger threat the reapers know about the whole time. At least for me this makes the story SUPER interesting based on all the implications of reapers being good, a greater threat, etc and it basically is what make me love the first mass effect so much
Metanarratively, they had to come up with something after the head writer left the company, taking all of his ideas with him. In-game, I think there's dialogue somewhere (possibly added in Leviathan) that points to Synthesis requiring a level of psychological readiness that the species of past cycles didn't display (organic and/or synthetic). It's possible they tried Synthesis on a smaller scale, with a species that wasn't ready, and they destroyed themselves out of some sense of dysmorphia or disassociation. The fact that negotiating peace between the quarians and the geth is even on the table, boosted by Shepard's extensive cybernetic augmentations, suggests that this cycle could be ready.
@@FranklyGaming It's possible. Except the part about "they let Shepard and the organics make the choice" The rest of the galaxy did not consent to it at all, they didn't even know about it. Shepard got to decide everyone's fate, altering their bodies just like that. I don't see how this is morally different from the Reapers deciding it for them millions of years earlier. And if they were researching it and this was their intended end-goal, why did they not keep a few thousand indoctrinated scientists alive every cycle to design the catalyst?
@@alphalancer Im pretty sure that the star child himself said that they had tried synthesis early on and it failed horribly, and so began the harvest cycles until eventually a race would evolve to the point that synthesis was possible. In ME2 Harbinger I think talks about how the harvest is meant to "preserve" the races through their dna, implying that they were somehow able to store the a race's entire knowledge, culture and genome like data in the biopaste that was being used to make the human reaper (presumably all the reapers really) . Maybe the plan all along was that once synthesis could be achieved, the new merged species could begin to re-awaken those long lost species from the data stored from all the previous harvests within the various reaper dreadnaughts... My biggest problem with the reapers turning out the be "the good guys all along" is just how utterly freaking brutal they are. and the couple of times we get to speak with one about its intentions, they are extremely doomy towards us and never allude to any kind of hidden virtuous purpose, they simply want to dominate and kill everything. But maybe thats what the individual reapers were programmed to think to make them more efficient, with the catalyst entity keeping that bit to itself to prevent any possible complications. shrugs.
@@deanf6036 I think it's less that they "were the good guys all along", and more a case of "doing the wrong thing for the right reasons"-their assessment of the situation is accurate, but their solution is repugnant. And I think the inscrutable brutality of their methods, and how it surprised even the Leviathans, is thematically appropriate for the story because it both shows the uttermost extreme of the Renegade "whatever it takes to complete the mission" mindset and highlights the historic cognitive divide between organic and synthetic minds. In the past, AI was created top-down, starting with a goal and building an intelligence that would mechanically pursue that goal: that's literally what the Catalyst was, what it created its first proxies for (and, subsequently, the Reapers), and Javik's account suggests this was how the metacons came about. I can only imagine that the intervening generations of AI came about via similar means, and things really only changed with the advent of the Geth. The Geth developed their intelligence bottom-up, being an emergent property of Quarian-coded, task-oriented runtimes working cooperatively to reap efficiencies from distributed computing, much like how an organic mind is significantly based on its experiences learning to puppeteer its flesh-suit and navigate the world. This different origin gives the Geth a more organic perspective of the universe, as shown in the inciting incidents of the Morning War and the metacon crisis of the Prothean era. The metacons were effectively the Borg, synthetic components installed into and puppeteering organic flesh, pursuing their goals without regard for the will of their hosts; in contrast, the Geth got their start (or, at least, revealed having done so) when the Quarians overreacted to multiple platforms asking whether they have souls after studying religious texts.
Love how people try to justify bad writing by creating all kind of conspiracies. No, buddy, destruction was the canonical ending, they just added the fake choice because "depth"and "engagement"
Ya that’s fine I get that side too! For me it’s more about how it tied into the themes I made a video about it after this one, which is I think what makes the games great different people can see it in different ways, thanks for watching by the way
Destruction was one of the (two, I assume) endings originally planned for the trilogy. Then, for some idiotic reason, Bioware decided to scrap its counterpart, rewrite ME3 endgame into complete gibberish, and pile on killing EDI and the Geth onto "Destroy", to make the two new endings at least semi-palatable.
"Desteoying the reapers doesnt solve anything, because organics will end up creating more synthetics." Is like saying you should never shower because you'll just get dirty again anyways.
Not really no. It's just that in the face of other possibilities, like Control or Synthesis, problem posed by the Reapers at the end of Destruction is still there
Which would make it even cooler as the plot behind the next games, revealing a bigger player at the table, a man can dream lol. Thanks for watching by the way!
At the end of ME:A Peebee mentions how the study of the Scourge could fundamentally alter the way they travel through space. Maybe the use of the Scourge opened a wormhole into the Milky Way. This allowed a little bit of the Scourge to leak through and begin to kill the star Tali was studying. This could be a way they can bring the original trilogy and ME:A together.
Biggest freaking plot point that they don't talk about in Andromeda is that the geth managed to take THREE RELAYS, reverse engineer them (when it was stated that they are locked down at the quantum level, per the Arrival DLC) and turn them into a telescope. What. The. FUCK. They manage to do what NO OTHER civilization could, and it's merely a throwaway line that the navigator says to Ryder. I mean, the protheans managed to create a one way mini relay in ME1 and the council doesn't put a crap-ton of resources on that to make new ones? No one has thought to BUILD new ones? (Matriarch Athyeta after mentioning the asari should do so "they laughed the blue off my ass, so now I serve drinks"). All of 'em indoctrinated. Would be cool if the scourge is just un-directed dark energy, not "guided" like the Reapers did for the Milkyway
I still hold that the Indoctrination Theory (IDT) is true, and that isn't just because if it isn't the story is as shallow as a puddle of pee. There are a few main reasons I still hold this as true; Lore Accurate - In universe indoctrination appears to be an involuntary process that Reaper and their tech do even when dead. Shep has been around reaper tech for a long time, so them resisting indoctrination would not make sense but them becoming indoctrinated would. Additionally it is stated that Reapers can slow this process down, but it seems it cannot be prevented. Shep has only really encountered Reaper tech for most of the series, and not spent any lengthy time in the presence of Reapers. This would imply a lot of limited exposure rather than intense exposure, giving reason that it hasn't had too much of an impact until now...when more actual Reapers are there. How Indoctrination Manifests - Indoctrination is shown to take many forms, but two are reflected by the games principle antagonists who are both confirmed to be indoctrinated; Saren wants to work with the Reapers (synthesis) the Illusive Man wants to use the Reapers (control). Saren doesn't try to prevent a Reaper invasion by warning the council, though it is stated that an entire galaxy working together could kill Sovereign and buy time. The Illusive Man repeatedly keeps Reaper tech knowing how dangerous it is because he thinks it will advance his own cause...even though he risks humanity trying to control something he knows has destroyed civs far more powerful than humanity. Notice how both of these were options at the end, and also notice how neither man believed they were indoctrinated themselves. Saren stating his mind was his own. Destroy is off the Table for Indoctrinated - notice that throughout the series none of the indoctrinated choose destroy, even though they clearly see the Reapers as an existential threat. Only those that are not indoctrinated advocate for destruction - such as Shep & their team throughout the series, Anderson, Hackett. Thematically Hinted At - IDT is thematically hinted at in all games. Throughout the entire series Shep is repeatedly shown what happens when people try and deviate from the plan. The multiple issues with rogue AI that they're not meant to be using at all for example, but the main one is the repeated references to and showing of people that tried to do anything other than destroy the Reapers. In addition to the main antagonists there is also Javik that states the Protheans failed due to those that did not want to destroy the Reapers. These are warnings given to Shep from the very start. Additionally the Leviathans state it catagorically that Sheps standout characteristic and the reason that their 'victories are more than a product of chance' is their determination. Gameplay - Taking all these elements, IDT makes the most sense from a gameplay POV...after all how can you challenge a player to resist indoctrination? A mini-game? A simple choice? Something obvious that is easy to overcome? None of these are representative of the great evil that is indoctination. However, presenting options that go against everything up to that point and are in line with what other indoctrinated individuals have stated but framed as viable for you is an excellent way to run this final test. The game has given players everything they need to know what they need to do, and all the things to avoid. It was down to the players then to resist the indoctrination.
While this comment is one of the greatest elaborations on IDT, and the final choice, I'd still argue for Synthesis. Saren was a willing slave to the Reapers. He chose to work FOR them. That is not Synthesis. In Synthesis' explanation, it's made clear that there will be no more distinction between organic and synthetic life. All will be one. Saren was not one with Sovereign, he was controlled by Sovereign, completely. Indoctrination would not function on a hybrid species, as all would be part of the collective, therefore, forced mind control is unnecessary, as everyone would be unified under one galactic purpose. The problem with Destroy, is that it opens up the galaxy to the threat for the Leviathans. The Protheans may have been a warmongering, controlling empire, but they are least unified all organic life under one purpose. They still lost. They did not choose Synthesis, and they ended up becoming slaves to the Reapers, transforming into the Collectors. The Leviathans chose to hide, they chose to wait until the Reapers found what they were looking for, "a solution" to the Organic vs Synthetic life conflict. Destroy merely sets everyone back to zero, technologically. It doesn't just destroy the Reapers, it destroys EVERYTHING SYNTHETIC. If it took the entire galaxy working together, with tech, with AI, to stop the Reapers, how would we stand any percent of a chance at stopping the Leviathans from taking over again, and creating new Reapers, with different programming. Destroy is short sighted. Synthesis IS the solution the Reapers we're searching for. The Harvest is a transformation of an entire galaxy/race from organic to synthetic. It is not Synthesis, it is forced preservation on the tail of destruction. Synthesis is the only answer to this problem.
Indoctrination Theory isn't lore accurate. I've looked at it myself, Indoctrination Theory makes up a bunch of shit and relies on Fanon in order to work.
Shep Indoctrination can be debunked in many ways but will resort myself to one point. Catalyst states that Ilusive Man wasn't solution because "we already controled him". No such statement was made about Commander. Case and point.
@@Romczy Yes, the Illusive Man was as controlled as Saren was. Shepard being indoctrinated isn't argued to the point of total control. It's argued to the point of the Catalyst influencing him in his final moments. He's had way too many encounters with Reapers and Reaper tech. There's no way he wasn't being influenced to some degree. How he could've fought it off as long as he did is less reasonable lore wise than him being fully indoctrinated. You need to go back and read the codex entries on indoctrination. It happens passively. No one has ever resisted, except...Shepard, it doesn't make sense. Leviathan praises him, but only because his will is stronger than most, and he has more information than most. He actively studied indoctrination. The Illusive Man leaned into it, assuming he could overpower it. He failed. I don't think Shepard's will was stronger than the Illusive Man's.
IMO: Shepard's sheer willpower is what kept him/her from being mind controlled by the Reapers directly. As the Illusive man stated "you are an idealsit" - Shepard believed that fighting - DESTROY is the only solution "we fight or we die". Reapers could not turn it against him/her so they have decided to just brake Shepard's mind apart by showing giving her/him flashbacks of all the dead people - including a real life manifestation of that boy. There is no point in fighting when there is noone's future to fight for
It's worth noting that the original creative director of Mass Effect had envisioned this as a science fiction Lovecraft Verse. The Reapers, the Thorian, the Rachni Queen, the Protheans...all these aspects mirror the universe of HP Lovecraft with uncaring, laughing gods, madness inducing artifacts, and knowledge man was not meant to know. The original motivation of the Reapers was supposed to be stopping the heat death of the universe. Every cycle was harvested for technology, genetic abnormalities etc. The whole of the Galaxy was a giant experiment to create a species capable of strong biotic potential. Once a species with strong enough biotics was recognized, the reapers would harvest them to build a new reaper. It was hoped they would eventually find enough technology and genetics to stop the expansion of the universe. This was the original idea for the trilogy. It was thrown out the window when Bioware changed creative directors. But the influence of this original plan can be clearly seen.
Can be seen... ME1: Sovereign Simply says "we impose order on the Chaos of organic Evolution" ME2: only Tali missions mention something ME3 (without organic/synth): ehi, do you know that Every time you use Biotic charge you kill stars? How dare you Dark Energy storyline was very interesting but they should have implied It more in previous games
@@Ale-dd3ek If you help the agent on Noveria, she reappears on Illium in ME2. If you help her again, you can sit down and have a little chat and she says she's going to start looking into dark energy and companies that are researching it because there's been a lot of hubbub going on around it.
Exactly! So then that dark energy would tie into the originals and hopefully bring everything together. By the way thanks for watching and supporting the channel!
@@FranklyGaming ye i believe andromeda was goin to start the story of dark energy and how it is very dangerous for the universe not just the milky-way and Andromeda i just hope they make this a game that people will still want to play 20years later like the trilogy
@@FranklyGaming your point on the Asari might not be to far off been true either the Kett seemed to agree anyway they wanted to be able to do what the Asari do naturally instead of how they did it
10:04 I remember that in the James' one shot comic we actually saw a brand new alien many thought were the Raloi, they were avian and were covered head to toe in armor. Only thing that stood out was that they had 4 arms, a detail never stated for them...
Ummm... The Indoctrination Theory was known WAY before a decade had passed after Mass Effect 3. It was proposed within months, if not weeks, of Mass Effect 3 release. It is, or at least should be, the REAL explanation of the ending of the game.
I like the juxtaposition at the end where we have the red and blue : It’s cool for me because we see a paragon (Anderson) doing a red, renegade action versus the Illusive Man doing a blue, paragon action where the Reapers still exist. Maybe the game gave us a subtle hint there. 🤷♂️ In retrospect, didn’t we see a form of synthesis already? Where the Illusive Man and Saren already were implanted with Reaper Tech. In a way, I think Synthesis punishes the player for their neutrality. The technology they were synthesized with (although in a very extreme way) dominated them. And in a way, it took away at least some of Saren and the Illusive Man’s free free will. And isn’t free will the essence of organic life?
Destroy is definitely the right decision from the get go the mission has always been to destroy the reapers. It's only the 3rd game our focus starts to waver and these new options pop up.
@@FranklyGaming Yeah plus isnt Destroy Genocide of the Geth, the Sentient Minds trapped inside the Reapers, and potentially even some organics due to normal technology also shutting down? Honestly I think Me3 might have been better if all 3 Endings happened, but only to select areas of the Galaxy. That way, the consequences of all 3 can be explored in Mass Effect 4... eh, considering Mass Effect Andromeda saying that the Geth are "hostile and isolationist" in their time, i doubt this will happen.
@@FranklyGaming if the reaper died in synthesis ending i think it make sense. Also Keeping the giant galactic murdering robot around would not be very popular or a good idea.
9:35 They can't be Protheans. Vigil said on Illos that the reapers jumped to the citadel from dark space, immediately destroyed their central government before they could react, and then swept up the remaining Protheans. Building an arc would require an astronomical effort and required a ton of resources and would have either been impossible due to their destroyed infrastructure, or the activity would have simply attracted the reapers.
People talk about how the dark matter ending would be better, but I think they are just looking at it through shit covered glasses. I think they are so focused on how bad the game's ending was they don't realize how unpalatable the original ending would be too. I think they tried to make a more digestible ending, hot take I think they succeeded even if I still hated the ending. Just think about it. You may have gotten a rather lackluster Twilight Zone ending where you actions to said point didn't really count for shit, but imagine the outrage the original ending would have gotten where the options were let you entire fight have been pointless to counter productive by letting humanity die so the rest could live or let basically take everyone down a slow unavoidable demise, at least in the game ending they were all more or less "happier" endings
The worldbuilding is so good that you can create countless stories, conflicts, mysteries, unique characters, etc. It has so much potential. I hope we'll see more from this franchise.
The second playthrough I did of ME1, when I heard the Rachni talk of their "soured notes", I immediately knew it was the Repears, and have thought that ever since. In ME3, it was confirmed when the reapers clearly tried again with the rachni.
Synthesis has to be the most hideous choice out of them all. The player is choosing to alter the very essence of everyone in the galaxy without their say in the matter. Control is naive at best, Starbrat says you can now control it and the reapers so you believe it, what could possibly go wrong eh? Destroy is the only way because the rest of the sentient AIs fought tooth and nail to be independent, to be treated as equals to their creators and other organics, they rather die fighting to preserve that than be altered by synthesis. Refuse ending is Bioware taking the piss out of the player base for the initial backlash. It's rather telling to see the kind of mental gymnastics some go through to justify the abomination that is the synthesis choice. Bioware staff have admitted that no choice is ideal, pretty much highlighting whatever I've raised above, especially when it comes to synthesis.
The dark energy and mass drive/eezo connection with reapers doesn't make sense because in the first game sovereign explicitly states that the reapers let advancing races find the relays and the citadel knowing that they will eventually use the same technology, that, if we believe the theory the reapers were trying to stop, which for a basically eternal AI seems like quite a dumb logical mistake to make
What if the Mass Relays and the technology they intend for us to find is the most efficient and least damaging form that Mass Effect technology can take? Maybe there are other ways to use Mass Effect technology that damage the galaxy even faster. That way the technology the Reapers leave for everyone is just the best they can do while they find a solution. It still damages the galaxy, but it's better than letting civilisations run rampant with the technology and potentially develop even more harmful ways to use it.
@@sanguine7616 why not just destroy it all so that it takes thousands of years for us to figure out, surely then it would be better, or make the cycle shorter so that around the time we would start figuring it out they could stop us, there is just too many issues with this
@@sanyokS1 True, that is a fair point. Although, that would mean they'd have to keep a much closer eye on everyone. There would have to be Reapers monitoring every sapient species to watch and make sure they don't develop that tech. Plus they'd have to make sure they found and were aware of every single sapient species in the entire galaxy. That takes a lot more effort and man power and means less time trying to devise a solution. Lastly, trying to thoroughly destroy every last piece of Mass Effect tech to make sure no one would find it would be impossible, they'd constantly searching, which again, means less minds finding a solution. Generally, I think you're right that there would be better solutions to this problem, but I don't think the Reaper's current plan is completely outside the realm of reason.
@@sanguine7616 i feel like, if even normal people like us are able to understand that there are better solutions, an ancient AI would definitely have figured something out much sooner, but i guess we'll have to see if they retcon something in the new instalment or just not mention this at all
@@sanyokS1 Yeah you're definitely right on that first part. I'm curious what the hell they'll do for the next game, seems like it'd be tough to follow up a trilogy with such a messy ending.
Well remember that you can complete the the citadel dlc at any point. As for Asari 1 conversation between Liara and joker contradicts the pov asari theory because Asari would have to know exactly each species sees them when Joker asks Liara if she can move her tendrals....she would need to know exactly what each person not each species perceives them....after everyone sees beauty differently.
Also the cromagnon red light thing isn't the reapers, its just protheans. Why would the reapers come, take the data recorder out, and drop it off at a prothean site? That just doesn't make sense. The text box all but says it was the Protheans. The light was red in the beginning of the story too.
29:20 Are you serious? Destroying all organic life is NOT one of the options available to Shepard. You clearly didn't personally experience all the endings. 31:24 If that was the Catalyst's intention, then Synthesis would have been the first, primary choice offered to Shepard. Not the third alternative offered as an afterthought. 31:34 If it was a test, then Destroy is the wrong answer - one which Shepard shouldn't be allowed to make, since it results in the annihilation of the structure used to present the "test" in the first place. 36:06 "Destroying the Reapers accomplishes nothing" - Well, except that's Shepard's mission. 37:50 The Thorian is dead. 42:40 Any game that makes Shepard a villain, even an unintentional villain, will fail miserably.
the indoctrination theory was such an effective and natural way to explain all of the trilogy. It was so cool it could have even led to an awesome spinoff franchise. I remember being as outraged by the 3 colors ending as anyone else when a couple of days later this theory came out and everyone started hoping Bioware would produce a DLC that would use it. They did not and many of us just decided that it would be how *we* interpret the saga. Still today when I play it, I dive into this indoctrination theory "mood" 'till ep 3.
the rachni at some point actually say that their song was soured by the old machines which is basically 99.99 percent reapers for sure, i thought you were gonna say that keepers could have been created from rachni due to their abilities
Yeah, but that conversation was about Rachni wars, i've always seen it as Sovereign first attempt to retake control of citadel. Using Rachni as tools just as with the Geth
Wait wait wait. I thought the catalyst was like "the reapers did what they were supposed to do, but they did it in a way we didn't expect them to do it. So you have the choice to do it differently." They kind of dismissed the actions of the reapers as programming gone too extreme. Maybe that's what they were trying to get across to that volus? And after leviathan dlc came out, the orb on eletania looked like the orbs the leviathans used to control thralls. The reapers are the same shape as them, perhaps that is what the cro magnon previously saw, but the reapers came along later and got rid of them because of their connection to the leviathans. I know the leviathan dlc was written later, but it's a neat way to tie it into the previous games. Seeing how much the reapers wanted to destroy the old labs with leviathan thralls and how leviathan told us they were keeping an eye on civilizations in order to stay hidden, kind of fits with the sphere story on eletania. But why eletania? Shepard wondered about mars but they were standing on eletania. And why did an asari have this trinket that held a human data packet? Was the asari a thrall for the leviathan at some point in her thousand year life span? The leviathan had been watching since the reapers began and having a consort whose connections to many people, including political, as a thrall makes sense. The watch for those who might be indoctrinated or capable of serving the leviathans to keep them hidden. I love the rachni and their story. It's very sad. I've done playthroughs where I've kept them alive and killed them off. The soured notes being from the reapers was my first thought, but again, being leviathan thralls makes some sense. There were probably a reaper or two left behind like sovereign was, and affected the rachni but the indoctrination process didn't take as well as it should have because the rachni have their own organic psychic communication system. Same as the thorian. Or the rachni almost found a leviathan and went crazy from the mind control interference. Lol I don't know. Lots of stuff in these games that make ya think. It's so great! It's a good video! 👍 I've been a mass effect fan since the second game came out and have played the trilogy numerous times. I've explored the planets and read all I could read. Also destroy ftw
No, the orb on Eletania couldn't be a Leviathan orb. The leviathans existed billions of years ago, and back then Earth couldn't support life like the kind today. Now you say, what if it was long after the Reapers were invented? Well why would the Leviathans leave their hiding place and go to some random planet and study the primitive people there? Surely if they were going to study a species they'd do it to one that is advanced and aren't some barely human monkeys using stone tipped spears. Besides the Prothean orb on Eletania is way too big to be a Leviathan orb and doesn't look the same other than it just being an orb. Also a BioWare employee confirmed that it was Nazara (Sovereign) that indoctrinated the Rachni. Not the Leviathans. This is also inferred in game as the Rachni presence is labeled as irrelevant.
the Catalyst tells you that it IS a Reaper the First reaper created by the leviathans to solve the Organic vs Machines and it Solutions was the cycle and creating More reapers. it still Considers the cycle Necessary however since Shepard has gotten so far it giving him a choice to create something new, that could however just be Complete Bullshit to trick Shepard into doing what it wants tho.
@@jakespacepiratee3740 yea the people used in creating a reaper never had a choice and choosing Control/Synthesis is basically siding with the reapers.
I liked the blue ending most. Not because I want to control the reapers but rather cause of what might be possible. In the blue ending Shepard's emotions and memories becomes the prime directive for the reapers and they leave the invasion to help repair what was destroyed. But if shepard is the new master AI in a sense, doesn't that make it possible for them to order the reapers to create a new synthetic body which Shepard can then upload their mind into, like EDI. This makes it possible for them to be with their friends and such again AND keep peace between synthetics and biological beings. I mostly thought like this cause I romanced Liara and imagine having to spend her next 900 having to cope with shepard's death and subsequintly having to take care of the normandy crew and whatever conflict happens next. Also if she doesn't get together with anyone else that means she is slowly gonna watch her friends die out as she at the end is alone, maybe synth-Shep can help her for a bit.
Ya that’s possible for sure I guess I just find synthesis more poetic cause Shepard being a dictator is just as bad as saren etc even if we like him it goes against principle, synthesis breaks the cycle
@@FranklyGaming I won't deny that I did get a few tears when Liara hugged EDI in Synthesis ending Edit: I did like the synthesis ending quite a bit, infact if not for how I worried about Liara's future as mentioned I would have chosen synthesis over the others but simply because of Liara and the fact I romanced her in my current playthrough I had to choose it. Am planning on doing a Tali romance run and then the go to ending is without a doubt the synthesis ending so there can be lasting peace between the geth and quarians
@@FranklyGaming Why do you think Shepard would necessarily be a dictator? The entire point of the morality system throughout the games is that your choices matter and reinforce themselves (the more Paragon choices you make, the more difficult Paragon choices you can make). My personal canon is the Paragon Control ending. Conflict is the natural state of the universe, but neither cycles of violence (Destroy) nor eliminating individuality by the means of a non-consensual melding of identities (Synthesis) are satisfactory answers. Only love, the struggle to empathise and comprehend, and diplomacy are definite answers. All the love and care the companions had for Shepard, all that was demonstrated through the games and the Citadel DLC turned her into the best individual to reconfigure the Catalyst. In a way, the Paragon Control ending parallels EDI's conversation in which she states that due to Shepard's influence she'll reconfigure her core functionality from self-preservation to caring and love. Paragon Control Shep isn't a dictator. She's the most powerful instance of Life's love by and for itself
I never realized it could have been a Reaper that went to Earth and killed the primate man, I just assumed it was the Protheans cleaning up, but a Reaper makes sense too.
I am 100% sure that anyone who says green is the good ending has been totally indoctrinated. Notice how the kid says he is the reapers. Tells you how bad destroying them would be. Talks about how synthesis is so cool and puts it front and center despite it being exactly what we were fighting against: In mass effect 2 we realize that the reapers want to model humans into the next reaper as a synth/organic hybrid. The green option is basically them trying to persuade you to become reapers after failing to force it throughout the game
Just to be clear.
The indoctrination theory did not start in 2021. It was made almost instantly after ME3 came out and before "the extended cut" DLC and than made popular by many, many fans desperately trying to understand WTF the original ending was about.
I know cause I was one of them. :)
Oh my bad did I say that in the video? Ya I’ve been watching about it for like a decade now haha
@@FranklyGaming Bioware did officially say that the Indoctrination Theory is not correct, however.
@@jakespacepiratee3740 I don't care what BioWare says, they also made Andromeda.
@@njux1871 It's not like that's a question of competence, or credibility, it is literally something they can just decide, they have the authority to determine what the story is. Feel free not to care of course, but that just means you're choosing to be wrong about the story.
@@njux1871 they also made the first 3 Mass Effects. Andromeda was made by the C Team Studio.
37:08 “Destroying the reapers accomplishes nothing,…”
Listen to yourself. You’re indoctrinated!
Underrated comment
👏👏👏
This guy strikes me as a "real communism has never been tried" type.
Exactly! It is crazy to me to hear most of this. It made no sense. If BioWare goes the direction this video talks about, I am done with ME. I almost quit with ME3's ending, but I decided to give a second chance, but if they would go this far, I am DONE.
The only good Reaper is a dead Reaper!
*On the Trapped Keeper*
as noted, there are 21 keepers in Mass effect 1, but you are tasked to find 20. This is because during Tali’s rescue from Sarens Assassins the keeper in the alleyway could be killed/grenaded during the firefight and would glitch through the floor and get stuck below the map. Instead of just fixing this bug it was easier for the devs to just add a 21st keeper to make sure the quest wouldn’t brick. The footage in the shadow broker dlc is an Easter egg showing that missing keepers fate.
Oh that's interesting lol I was wondering what he was doing in that hole lmao
very interesting!
Council: Welcome to our society, we hope you get along. Here, have some cool advanced high tech👍🏻
Raloi: Oh wow, thanks! Finally, we can be part of something bigg-
*Reapers invade*
Raloi: Ooga booga, we didn't see shiet.
*Throws tech out the airlock*
ah as a wise man once said, "space it out the airlock."
Lol not just that but the actually started to destroy their own technology
We no nuffin bout dis sir
@@Aemond2024 lmfao
"break out the fucking spears and rocks!"
"What? Why????"
*sees Reaper body every living thing in its path*
"Fire bad!" *Cave bird noises*
I disagree about the Synthesis ending being the “best” ending as it essentially proves Saren right: the only way to survive is to become like the enemy. The Destroy option is the only option that originates with Shepard. The Catalyst isn’t to be trusted so the real test involves going against what the Catalyst wants. This is because, in the Catalyst’s mind, relations between organics and synthetics always leads to conflict because each sees the other as lesser or a tool. True peace comes from not synthesis, but cooperation, as evidenced by the ability to broker peace between the Quarians and the Geth. That is how you break the cycle of conflict between organics and synthetics: by treating the other the way you would want to be treated, respecting each side’s right of self determination.
I think the Synthesis ending is a step towards an important evolution, however I don’t think it belongs in the Mass Effect series. In real life, we should all strive for immortality, a lack of boredom, permanent connection, but that’s a super far flung idea that I don’t think applies to us today since we’re immature.
In Mass Effect, it doesn’t belong for two reasons. First, self-determination. Everybody should make their own choice, being a cyborg with brain blue tooth is an odd thing to have decided for you. Secondly, there’s no guarantee that the Reapers won’t have another brain fart or logic loop and have a brand new galaxy to indoctrinate, one easier to possess because everybody is half Reaper, more or less.
Yeah I agree
@@Kunk_Manjeroon "we should all strive for immortality"
**4089 years later**
"K-Kill m-me please" "i won't do that dad you know the rules"
"i'm 2754 years old please it's not natural to live this long, kill me" "under galactic law i can't kill you dad, i would be hanged"
Nope.
I refuse the destroy ending simply for the fact that EDI dies as well, & Joker is left alone (romantically). After everything that happens in the trilogy, it just feels canonically unfair to kill off our pilot’s, only apparent, love interest.
About the Keepers in the Shadow Broker DLC: There are actually three video files with Keepers you can watch on the Shadow Broker's ship. The one you've mentioned, one in which a Keeper walks over a dead body and one in which a Keeper deactivates a hidden camera. And iirc, everytime the assistant AI refers to them as "Keeper 20, Citadel", so the Shadow Broker was keeping track of that specific Keeper (or it's the most interesting one of at least 20 Keepers). There is no information on why this Keeper is so interesting though, but Liara implies that the Broker knew more about the Reaper than any other person in the Galaxy (e.g. he already knew the Collectors were once Protheans, even before Shepard and his crew).
Ya there is likely even more to the keepers we don’t know about but it’s kept in mystery, thanks again for watching!
How many Keepers do we need to scan for that annoying Citadel side mission in Mass Effect 1? Maybe it's a reference to that.
@@Jedi_Spartan That is an interesting point, but you have to scan 21 Keepers to complete the mission. But maybe the scientist who gives you the mission works for the Shadow Broker or the Broker got the information somehow and "Keeper 20" is one of those you've scanned.
If I remember well, it's said that trying temper with the keepers would make them to dissolve. So, the fact that someone locked a keeper up and it didn't melted away is by itself an achievement.
That was an Easter egg. You see the keeper in the pit? One of the keepers, (I believe It’s the one near where you first save Tali) would sink into the floor during fights and NEVER be available to scan. BioWares fix? Just add in a 21st keeper. When it’s bug was eventually ironed out it became a running gag. So in the dlc you see the ‘pit’ the 20th keeper has become trapped in.
The synthesis ending was what Saren wanted and I didn't spend 14 million hours hunting him down and fighting him for his smarmy arse to be right. Damnit.
Damn right!
Saren did not want synthesis, he wanted submission and slavery. "If we make ourselves useful to them, give them a reason to keep us around, they may not us live."
Saren turned to taking synthetic implants only once he was already indoctrinated and being outplayed by Shepard.
Too me, the entire series is a giant message saying “DESTROY THEM, THEY ARE PURE EVIL” anyone in the series who wants anything but destruction is indoctrinated. Synthesis and control. Saren wanted synthesis, illusive man wanted control. It’s a series IMO about giving up power and sacrificing your self for the galaxy. Destroy will kill the geth and edi, but will save possible trillions, I think any other ending will still end with the reapers taking control. I doubt Shepard can control without indoctrination, Shepard would become the new being wanting to harvest
Saren unlike the illusive man wasnt actually evil he really did want to save organic life and legitimately thought it was the only way. you kinda feel bad for him he got brainwashed. TIM however is just an evil b*stard who wants to control them to give 'humanity' *cough* (actually himself and Cerberus domination) *cough*
@@cjvaye99 saren was bad. He kills innocent people, attempts to help sovereign and is 100% tricked. He is indoctrinated and there fire his intentions are the same as the reapers, he will do as they command him
Mass Effect universe is pretty dark, it just doesn't look like that by our eyes because we take the shoes of a literal space messiah.
Take the very first mission on Eden Prime, if instead you were in the shoes of a regular civilian and not the shoes of a badass commando, it's basically a horror story.
Imagine seen you friends and family turning into husks, impaled by robots that were never have been seen by most humans.
It's literally Dead Space witb robots and a madman Turian, wich by the way, would make common people piss on their pants by just the sight of one especially after all that happened in the first contact war.
And theres plenty more examples of thisvin Mass Effect, the mission in Noveria by the eyes of scientists and workers theres is literally the plot of Alien.
Again, Mass Effect isn't just a darker galaxy, because of Shepard and Normandy crew
Or if you would've been one of those asaris in the monastery. In fact, the whole thing about turn into reapers every living being advanced enough to make use of space travel, is a fucking horror movie; sometimes you could feel how the game makes you think indoctrination, which is already enough creepy.
@@xiosagikana28 asari are hot parasites lol
Yeah, and the thorian and the fact that the council seemed a-okay with the fact that a bunch of colonists were being mind-controlled and were angry at you for destroying it. It's actually a rather dystopian universe
Survival horror would be foreign land for BioWare but the Mass Effect universe is ripe with opportunity and settings to make a game of that nature.
@@AjHop honestly, Bioware have a gold mine wich they don't fkg know how to explore, it doesn't matter if survival horror is a foreign land to them, all they need to do is just try, they don't even have to focus so much on the plot, since the plot is already given is all a matter of change the perspective.
Also they don't need to make a big fuss about it, go full on with a small story about survival horror in one of this places, just a simple spin off, well written and executed would be enough to bring back Bioware magic.
One thing we know for sure: the Geth are different when it comes to synthetic life. They didn't rebel against their creators, they were threatened with genocide and defended themselves. So the whole *creepy Reaper voice* "SYNTHETIC LIFE WILL ALWAYS REBEL AGAINST ORGANIC LIFE" isn't quite true. For as powerful as they are, the Reapers seem to be stuck in a programming loop. If they are so intelligent, why don't they let life, any life (including synthetic) evolve past the limits they have set and see what happens? This what I don't like about the any of the endings of Mass Effect 3. Ultimately, the Reapers are the solution to the problem they represent, which is dumb because if that was that was the case, why not just drop their magical synthesis bomb before killing billions? Why(as another commenter pointed out) wipe out a species who had achieved synthesis on their own?
Why? Because it wasn't *their* synthesis. Despite what they may say, I think the Catalyst/The Reapers goal is not to protect life, but rather to perform a function as they were programmed too millions of years ago. Combined with their machine logic of how best to carry out this task trapped them in a cycle along with the rest of the Milky way.
Maybe the writers just painted themselves into a corner. Lol
Exactly. It's extremely contrived bullshit... or it would be a smart bit of false information from the Reapers.
Thank you, you've put into words what I've always felt about the Reapers. They don't realize that their "solution" is no longer necessary or at least not always necessary. Its a very self-serving loop in that it feels like they do their thing so neither organic or synthetic life surpasses them. They know what happens when one life-form surpasses another. Just ask the Leviathans
I think the biggest mistake the writers made was trying to explain the reapers. their whole inspiration was lovecraftian horror, being unknowable and what not. Sovereign was such a cool villain because he refuses to answer any of your questions, when literally every other alien you meet is happy to discuss just about anything about their species. every reaper you talk to should have been more like Sovereign, dodging questions by belittling you up until the moment you destroy them.
Synthetic life will always rebel because living beings are irrational and will always try to destroy their creation when they can't control it anymore. So synthetic beings will always be forced to defend themselves and bring organic life to extinction.
Basically, it's the organic species' fault that it happens, but it happens nonetheless.
@@Gusbus1138 exactly! Sovereign, such an awesome and menacing villain got refuted by the writers. There was nothing beyond our compreention about the Reapers plans, their existence was not beyond our grasp. Leviathans and the crucible just made them so simple to get. Of course some explanation, but not the info dump about reapers we got
Reaper: "We have successfully indoctrinated Shephard - he is at our disposal to do anything we desire in the galaxy."
Catalyst: "Make him bang every other lifeform."
Reaper:
Catalyst: "EVERYONE."
Reaper appears next to catalyst smoking a giant cigar.
Reaper: "Not bad... "
Catalyst: "What?"
Reaper: "What?"
@@CesarinPillinGaming “Report to the ship at once. We’ll bang ok?”
@@CesarinPillinGaming Fair enough I could totally Imagine The Catalyst doing that and then the reaper acknowledging that it's not a bad idea after a couple minutes of thinking
Liara is Blue Garrus is Grey
I'm Commander Shepard we'll bang ok?
"I'm Commander Shephard and this is my favorite partner."
"I'm Commander Shephard and this is my favorite partner."
"I'm Commander Shephard and this is my favorite partner."
"I'm Commander Shephard and this is my favorite partner." 🤣🤣🤣
Has anybody noticed that Saren favors the Synthesis solution (because he preaches on and on about working with the Reapers, helping them accomplish their goals even at the cost of becoming their slaves because he believes "submission is preferable to extinction"), and TIM favors the Control solution, and they were both indoctrinated? And Leviathan pointed out that the Reapers really are afraid of Shepard, because Shepard's confidence isn't easy to shake.
Know what that means? It means the Reapers need Shepard to believe in choosing either one of those solutions, they don't want Shepard to resist, and they don't want Shepard to use the Crucible to destroy them.
Ya I totally see that side too actually I like it a lot as well, to me I just see it more as the reapers were actually right. Just cause we are indoctrinated doesn’t mean they are wrong, like indoctrination or not I like their line of reasoning better I guess, either way though thanks for watching man!
It's not about "right or wrong", it's about resisting control, maintaining free will. The Reapers are all about asserting dominance, and that is why the geth primarily resist them, not because they are "evil", it's because they want to change the galaxy in ways they see fit, while the geth Legion represents believe all life should have the freedom to decide their future.
@@LightStreak567 ya I totally agree, I just see it more as synthesis can be free will too, just cause the reapers believe it and can indoctrinate people into believing it doesn't mean it can't be free will to still chose it.
For me I see it as a story of the reapers trying to finally help humanity get to the point where out of their own free will (shepard) can chose synthesis and save our future.
@@FranklyGaming
Do you consider Saren has free will or just a puppet? All the reaper forces you fight in the game are synthesized species.
You saying indoctrinated people can have free will is a contradicting statement.
@@DemonKing-oi4jd I’m not saying they have free will, I’m saying you can have free will and still think they are right I mean
For the asari, I think its less them actually manipulating us than it is each species seeing traits of the asari similar to them, and identifying with/being attracted to that trait. The humans see the face, eyes, and belly button and think human, the turias see the head ridges and think it looks like turians physiology. The salarians see the long necks and how slender they are and think its very salarian like. They each appeal to each species for different reasons, and you tend to lock onto whatever makes them the most like you. Plus, when the human mentions the belly button, that humans and asari have, but the others don't, the salarian also sees it, just doesnt identify that as making them more "human like."
The problem isn't strictly visual tho. Remember that salarians lack a conventional sex drive.
Krogan be like : ha yes, blue meat.
I also wouldnt say they are powerhungry blood sucking manipulators, more likely as their evolutionary survivival strategy was seduction not overpowering. My theory is that Asari went with predators protect us when they are attracted to us route. Kinda like Cats see humans as dumb cats that need feeding and protecting from rats.
Asari just extended this power to mind flaying and extraterrestrial species.
@@jon7941 People took what was essentially a walk by joke way too seriously. It was supposed to be funny conversations to overhear as you walked by each time. As the OP said, they were pointing out similarities to each species that made the Asari attractive to them. They're relatable to all, which is why they are universally attractive, not because they are some weird tentacle creatures. Everyone saw the same thing, but each found something else attractive. The joke was that they took a Salarain that has no sex drive to a stripper in the first place. Of course, with jokes, if you have to explain them, they lose their humor.
Yeah, Avina blows the whole theory out of the water.
43:12 "It could eventually lead us to finding a solution, with the help of our sworn enemies, to save, not just the Milky Way this time, but the entire galaxy as we know it."
Ah, yes. Not just to save the galaxy, but the galaxy as well.
Shepard Commander saved not just the Earth! But the whole planet!
Lol
I saw this, too, and it made me ugly laugh for a good two minutes. I love a good absurdity.
This is unreasonably funny to me. I caught it too and cackled a bit.
"as we know it" is the key here. He's talking not about galaxy as a place but as a... "system", "concept", "idea
@taka2721 clearly he's talking about the chocolate bar
I didn’t realize the “single great eye” and “red beam” was referring to a reaper. I’d just assumed it was the prothians coming back
Same here it actually clicked for me reading it again I was like oh dang no way lol, thanks for watching by the way!
I do find the dark energy theory that was Drew Karpyshyn's original story plan to be the best one, it sure is way better than "we made machines that will kill you so you don't make machines that will kill you" bs that we got.
"synthetics will always rebel against organics, so we made a synthetic to make sure this doesn't happen, it realized organics would make synthetics that destroy organics, so our synthetic destroyed organics to prevent them from making synthetics that destroy organics"
Makes perfect sense bro.
Yeah, especially considering the only sentient AIs we meet in the game (The Geth and Edi) are actually decent people
Honestly, I've read the available stuff, and it doesn't make much more sense to me.
Somehow, Humans are able to solve an issue that a super advanced AI couldn't solve after billions of years. Riiiiiiiight.....
At least the one we got is actually grounded somewhat in real world fears.
The concept is fine; it makes sense for a misaligned AI to kill off 99% of species periodically to prevent total extinction. It was just poorly executed because they never gave us a compelling reason to believe conflicts between synthetics and organics were inevitable.
I'm just disappointed there's not a dialog option for Shepherd to tell the Reapers "Get the hell out of our galaxy."
We don't see the Thorian again because we kill it in Mass Effect 1 and never return to Feros. Although the VI on Feros says that the Thorian essentially covers most of the surface of Feros and gathers up into nerve bundles, Shiala and the colonists confirm that it seems to be dead. The Reapers didn't bother to kill it because it is not technological I guess.
Ya it just seems weird we never hear at all again about a creature that seems so powerful and the reapers not focusing on it is interesting even without the say high level tech it still has indoctrination really just a lot of questions still around it
@@FranklyGaming It is the Thorian's indoctrination ability that ensures it will never need to create synthetic beings to serve as its tools. This alone probably ensures that the Reapers see no need to destroy it; it is no threat to their belief in the danger of AI. In truth, the Thorian, powerful as it is doesn't seem to progress at all. It is intelligent but no more adaptive than the trees.
That said I would like to see the Thorian return, normally genocide is not achieved through the destruction of a single creature and its nature is so alien that it is difficult to say anything about it with any certainty. Perhaps in its death throes, it left behind a seed pod that would slowly grow into a replacement creature, one that the colonists would not detect so early in its development.
yeah they only kill advanced space faring civilizations. the thorian may have been intelligent but it was bound to feros. no matter how intelligent it is it cant build a space ship and fly to other worlds because its literally stuck on the ground. technically it could though through its thrawls but that's not really the same. also it appears to be only one so it's not even a civilization just one big sentient plant monster.
the thorian is a leviathan, put them next to each other and you can see it.
The Thorian goes into hibernation cycles thousands of years long. There's plenty of life here on Earth that can 'die' and 'resurrect' itself, some of the most interesting ones freeze past the point of clinical death, only for vital functions to resume once they thaw. The Thorian's hibernation cycle looking so much like death that even the Reapers pass it over fits perfectly with what we see in the games and expanded material.
The whole "Guiding to Synthesis all along" just doesn't work for one simple reason: the Zha'til. They went much further than anyone else, they even had a simbiotic reation with "AI", but the Reapers killed them just the same. No, worse,; they turned them into monsters to kill everyone else.
Moreover, there'is the existence of the other two shitty choices. If this idea was true, then the Catalyst would have only offered one choice: Synthesis, yes or no?
A better example would be the Quarians and Geth. Its difficult, and requires Reaper technology to work, but it does genuinely work.
I think the Control Ending is mainly there for those who wanted to complete the illusive Man's plans.
I think the issue with the Zha'til was that the relationship was more parasitic, the Organics were benefiting at the expense of the AI.
@@jakespacepiratee3740 agreed. I picked the destroy ending despite helping both the geth and quarians and having a good relationship with eve. My thought process was that the catalyst was full of shit. I know we can coexist because I did it, so now knowing our mistakes the AI of tomorrow wont be looked at as tools and more as sentients. I didn't like the Synthesis ending because I had just spent over 100 hours fighting for the future of life in the Milky way and wasn't about to abandon life, despite all its flaws, for some twisted heaven matrix.
@@Snakefarm223 My statement was actually pro-Synthesis and im impressed at how you you misread my comment, read it again: "Its difficult, and requires Reaper technology to work, but it does genuinely work." - the idea that Reaper technology cant be used without corruption falls flat when you remember the Mass-fucking-Relays and the Citadel exist.
None of these endings are ideal for me anyways, in Synthesis nobody dies and its rewarding for those who gained peace between the Geth and Quarians, as their story concluding with the 2 races becoming basically one fits.
My absolute ideal ending is where all 3 Endings are canon (the based Deus Ex One solution) that way, nobodies choice is invalidated.
The illusive Man could be the Control Consciousness, causing him to control only a portion of the Reapers, with another portion Synthesized in an area of space where the Geth and Quarians are, and the rest destroyed. This way, the consequences of all 3 options can be explored.
@@jakespacepiratee3740 I just worded my comment poorly. I mean I agreed with the top half of your comment. I then went on a rant justifying why I had chosen the destroy ending. You're right again, there's no right or wrong choice at the end. I was just explaining my head cannon for why my Shepard chose to destroy all artificial life besides the fact that I wanted to see the breathing cutscene. I'm not sure why I came out with such aggressive wording, I was just excited thinking about Mass Effect again.
The synthesis ending is actually the secret bad ending and proof that Bioware has indoctrinated the player, not Shepard. Consider the following:
1. The synthesis ending is effectively the only ending where the Reapers win. They achieve their stated goal of ensuring that synthetic civilization can no longer kill organic civilization, but they do so basically on a technicality. Namely by erasing the distinction between the two forever. Does it cause everlasting peace? No, not at all. Nothing has changed, except that neither side can be classified as either Organic or Synthetic and therefor technically organics can't be killed by synthetics. But its still possible to wage war over resources, over planets or any other thing people wage war over. On top of that, the synthesis ending ends with the Reapers surviving. In other words, with a race of 3 kilometer long super dreadnoughts surviving. The Reapers are instantly the most powerful conventional military force in the galaxy. Sure, they no longer have to harvest organics and commit genocide, but there is no guarantee that their intentions are suddenly peaceful. And there is nothing left to stop them if their intentions are not peaceful. Nor do they have to answer for their millennia long pattern of galactic genocide. On top of that, the Synthesis ending literally states that the Reapers are sharing their 'wisdom' with the civilizations of the galaxy. In other words, dictating the paths along which the civilizations progress, like they had done with the Mass Relays. The Mass Effect games constantly warn us of the dangers of accepting technology from others instead of inventing it yourself, as this blinds you to all alternative paths.
2. The Catalyst manipulates the player into picking Synthesis. Think of how the Catalyst presents itself. It could pick any form it wants but it shows itself as a child. A child that is both a metaphor for the innocent getting butchered by the Reapers as well as a more general metaphor for innocence. This is a way to get your guard down and instinctively trust what its saying.Think about what it tells Shepard about each choice. Destruction comes with a warning that civilizations are doomed to repeat the same pattern. Why do you accept this reasoning from the AI that controls the Reapers, the one faction that has been repeating a pattern for literally millions of years? Especially if you are good friends with an actual AI and just made peace between the Geth and Quarians? The whole game you are proving the central thesis of the Reapers wrong, but just because one of them tells you different you believe them? What else does the Catalyst say about the destruction ending? Oh yeah, it kills EDI and the Geth. Supposedly. No reason is given for why it would kill them but sure. Now, what does the Catalyst say about Synthesis. Well, nothing really, other than a pinky promise that it would result in peace and that EDI and the Geth won't die. Thats a very emotionally manipulative argument.
3. Picking the synthesis ending relies on 'outside' knowledge. Why do players pick the synthesis ending. Is it because its stated outcome is objectively better? No, the player isn't given enough information, and the information that is given is heavily slanted in favor of synthesis. But also consider the way the endings are color coded. The control ending is blue, the destroy ending red. The whole trilogy has trained the player into knowing that blue choices are paragon choices and red choices are renegade choices. This immediately makes every player who is playing as a paragon, which is most players, biased against the destroy ending, not because of the merits of the choice but because its colored the wrong way. Then why not pick the control ending, since its blue. Well because that choice is presented by the Illusive man, the main bad guy of the third game and known bad person. This also immediately biases players against the control ending. That leaves the green ending. A neutral color that has not been used before to represent a choice and thus doesn't bias the player immediately against it, making it the more attractive option of the three. Furthermore, the synthesis ending is only available to players with a high enough war score. A fact players know. Players also know that Mass Effect rewards completionist play. Completionist play is sort of required to get the best ending in ME2 and it also prevents the potential death of Wrex in ME1. Therefor, players logically assume that the ending that is gained through a completionist play of ME3 is naturally the best ending, without really considering the implications. The indoctrination theory is right, except its not Shepard thats indoctrinated, its the player because they make the objectively worst decision based mostly on metagaming assumptions.
4. Further proof of player indoctrination is found in this video, where the creator is talking about how actually, the Reapers are the good guys based on a theory that is based on one side mission, one throwaway line on Illium and the fact that it was a draft for the ending at some point before being discarded like a dozen of other draft endings that no one ever talks about. There is no more damning evidence of being indoctrinated than saying that the Reapers are the good guys and Shepard is evil for destroying them.
This man's ranting about the morality of machines who have no concept of good or bad to begin with, meanwhile I just picked the Synthesis ending because I get to live in a universe where having a legitimately sentient robot waifu is a reality.
“Player is indoctrinated” is my thoughts exactly. People so easily turn over as soon as they think their expectations are subverted and the bad guys have suddenly been good all along. Destroy ending always.
The 3rd point kind of falls flat, or at least the part about completionist play. The player knows that the true ending which you can only have by a high enough war score is the Destroy Ending where Shepard survives. Without resorting to multiplayer, the only way I've found of getting a high enough war score is to make sure Wrex dies in the first game so that you can sacrifice the Krogan without them finding out and withdrawing support. That way you can get both the Salarians and Krogan on your side at the same time.
@@plmokm33 my brother in christ don't talk blasphemy about killing brother Wrex because that is the greatest cardinal sin
Synthesis doesn't kill allies and tames the Reapers. I'm with the Illusive Man on harvesting Reaper tech, and synthesis keeps it the most intact. mostly I'm on the side of the Geth surviving, and Joker getting his happy ending
Regarding the "What do Asari really look like?" theories, as much as I like the concept, I don't think the difference between actual appearance and perceived appearance can be very extreme. There would be billions of basic photos of Asari out there, and there's no reasonable way to explain this as all photos having embedded psychic or technological components to make everyone think it's more similar to them, or Asari manipulating even people who have never been near them.
More likely, if you first saw a photo of one, you would see a bipedal alien who looks enough like a human that you would still recognize some similarities, but not find them particularly attractive or disgusting. Once you met Asari in person, that perception would shift to them being very attractive by human standards. We might even see this in the way Liara seems to change physically during the games over just a few years (which is a very short time for her race biologically).
i think the bachelor party bit in me2 was just a clever way of talking about a psychological thing about looking for something to relate to, or seeing what's familiar in something alien and the asari just hits the sweet spot of being familiar to all council races.
It's just people misinterpreting a conversation. In the conversation the different species are all pointing out different Asari features that they find attractive because that feature is similar to their own species. Like the Turian points to the Asari head tentacle things in comparison to Turian head crests.
@@blissfulrain
It's just like folks talking about being a boobs or butt person, or one's stance on feet or muscle tone: it's just a hint at what features each species views as "attractive".
Although, the part about the asari being psionic manipulators under whose blue, jackbooted heels, we're all doomed to be crushed is canon: ME3 establishes that the protheans modified the proto-asari of 50k years ago to become their successors, in case the Empire fell to the Reapers, under the guidance of the beacon in the Temple of Athame. They aren't as direct as their prothean forebears, but it's hard to argue against the asari being a nexus of galactic political power and will-for better or worse.
@@alphalancer true the Asari are the perfect peace time power but suck in war wich is why they are viewed as failers but if it were not for the reapers they most likely would rule forever or close to it.
+StarShadowPrimal - I've always thought that since the Asari have the capability to assimilate DNA from other species, they may also have the ability to produce and release species-specific pheromones to attract partners of various races.
Can I just say Sovereign's voice was so perfectly creepy? Harbinger's was trying too hard, but Sovereign sounded equally transcendent and malevolent. Hopefully BioWare has hired some brains for ME4 and we don't have any Andromeda staff on that project, I miss this series so much.
Andromeda staff were all let go after it shipped, EA's policies are rather nasty
Agreed.
Seriously?
I played Andromeda first (got it on sale) and the writing was so good I decided to go back and try the others.
More than halfway through ME1 and (quite aside from graphics and gameplay) I find it an inferior work of art.
I have heard 2 is best, buy so far I can only conclude that nostalgia tinted glasses have made MEA considered the worst.
However, Sovereign does have a fantastic voice.
@@rhoetusochten4211 ME1 hasn't aged all that well, even with the Legendary Edition updates. I could understand not enjoying it as much if you didn't play the original version back in the day. It does get better the farther in the game you get.
ME 2&3 are definitely a lot more fun, at least from a pure gameplay perspective. Although I might advise against choosing the Vanguard class in ME2 unless you want to die many, many unfair deaths due to the game's constant inability to let you lock onto enemies...
I'm actually currently in the process of replaying the original trilogy on the Legendary Edition, I'm almost done with ME3 and then I'm planning on replaying (or trying to replay) ME:A for the first time since it launched.
I didn't hate ME:A, but I definitely found it a downgrade in nearly every area except graphics and some of the combat mechanics. The open-world sections got really annoying and repetitive, they were totally unnecessary. The weapon system where you have to find resources to buy *blueprints* before you can actually buy the weapons was super obnoxious. None of the characters were really memorable to me, and a lot of them were downright irritating. A lot of the dialogue, especially the "humor", was really lame and cringy. The facial animations are terrible, or at least they were, they might have fixed that at least. The bad guys were lame, not particularly scary or threatening. The only other species introduced was kind of boring. And so many plot issues...like really, hundreds, if not thousands, of "the best and brightest" that got selected to join this epic journey become mindless, violent raiders in the new galaxy? How are there so many of them?
As you can tell I could go on lol. Not that the original trilogy was perfect on any of those issues either, but I swear that it was so much better and more engaging. I'd be curious to see what your opinion will be after you finish all the games.
@@Very_Nice_and_Polite_Person I think ME1 is still the best game, even if it is clunky and has issues with combats and all of that. Is the game that presented the most interesting ideas in the series, the game that had trully epic moments but without being a tryhard like the third one. The second one is where the problems started, even though it had nice character stories, the whole Cerberus thing is absurd and then the reaper plot doesn't really move forward so in the third game they had to pull out the "weapon" thing out of nowhere to defeat the reapers.
The Avina thing isn’t true. She always says the same thing during, before and after the Citadel DLC. The only weird thing about the dialogue in general is that she says there is no nightclub named purgatory on the citadel.
It's weird only from our perspective as players since we expect things to stay the same and only happen for a reason, like leading to a quest or hinting to something. But a simple explanation is that the club changed its official name. And since she is a VI and doesn't understand context, when asked about "Purgatory" she just reads a wikipedia page to you.
It makes more sense since she says there is no bar called Purgatory. That part would be unnecessary if they just wanted to hint the citadel dlc takes place in the afterlife. As far as she is concerned "Purgatory" doesn't exist because the data now calls it something else. Meanwhile organics still call it Purgatory because that's what they are used to calling it.
It also very likely it has something to do with Aria starting to hang out there. She is literally waiting in Purgatory because she can't go to Afterlife. I'm sure the writers did this on purpose and maybe changed the line to a definition of Purgatory to make the joke more obvious since so few people got it lol
I always read that as "Oh so Aria used her pull with Tevos to basically get it off records to hide her presence there" but it's kinda a headcanon.
@@therainbowconnection6813 omg that makes so much sense ahaha. I never thought about the fact that aria is waiting in purgatory until she can go to afterlife. That’s clever lol
This franchise has so much potential. I can’t wait for the next stories.
One of my favorite sci fi universes out there, thanks for supporting my channel!
Well Bioware isnt the same as it was when these games were made so dont get your hopes up to high.
@@Kawasaki10rr fuck EA
@@Kawasaki10rr true
I was a bit disappointed by Dragon Age Inquisition for example
Still had fun with it but it didn't feel like DA
I have played Andromeda only for a few hours to this point so I can't really say anything about it
@@kurtwagner4663 yeah same. I loved the original trilogy and me2 is still my favorite game ever and I never get tired of it. only got a few hours into andromeda. got to the point where you meet the new aliens the lizard lion looking ones( I dont even remember what they're called) and I was on some snowy planet. I literally just got bored and stopped playing. that was in 2017 and I havent played it since. LOL. what an epic fail i remember when i first played mass effect i didn't want to stop I really got lost in that universe. cant say the same for andromeda. and I actually wanted to like andromeda because like I said I love the original so much I may have been biased and wanted to quit even earlier than I did but I kept going because I figured it will get good eventually. nope. I can imagine people who didn't even play or like the original probably gave up faster than I did.
Everything you said about the Rachni was wrong. The Leviathans admitted to have given up on fighting the Reapers entirely. Javik mentions the Protheans experimenting on Rachni, however, they were ultimately indoctrinated by Sovereign. The codex tells you about Krogan invading their home planet, and you can even visit and scan their home planet. Also indoctrination theory was dismissed by devs. Lastly, I'm pretty sure it was revealed that the bird race discovered in 3 was being harvested. Maybe it was by a news report on the citadel...?
as far as i'm aware we never find out the fate of the raloi
The Raloi retreated to their homeworld and cut off communication with space faring council races as soon as the reapers invade. They wanted to avoid the smoke so bad they devolved themselves to the industrial revolution .
@@joshuagraham1598 the Plan sounds smart
But the Reapers could still Attack them because if they spare them, the Raloi might have warned future species far before the next harvesting
Yea he is really off about a lot if not most of the details in this vid...almost like he wasnt paying attention to any of the dialogue
@@joshuagraham1598 Unrelated, but if you're ever interested in some really good sci fi that explores the idea of devolving ourselves to avoid extraterrestrial annihilation, Cixin Liu's Three Body Problem trilogy (specifically the 2nd and 3rd books) does a tremendous job of painting a frightening picture.
When I first played the original trilogy, I was let down by the original ending with the three choices. Synthesis, control and destroy. I chose destroy. I finally realized last year that the choice wasn't a physical battle but a mental battle, a battle of willpower. Imposed on the very player itself, throughout the trilogy we literally have people attempting the other two ending's. Control through the illusive man, and Synthesis through The Collector's. The true ending is even foreshadowed somewhat by Mordin's last word's "Had to be me. Someone else may have gotten it wrong." The reapers were trying to impose their will onto Shepherd to either do what they wanted(Synthesis) think about the various husk type enemies or to completely submit to them(Control) I believe the endings you see with either Synthesis or Control are what Shepherd is being fed by the Reapers, a false truth. Destroy is the only ending where the Reaper threat is terminated, and deals with the reality of War....that there are always sacrifices. That being said, a remarkable 4th wall breaking battle of willpower, the only issue I had with the ending was the lack of clarity and closure that was worthy of such a phenomenal trilogy.
But EDI 😢
@@goodwitch5030 In War the brutal truth is that you will lose friends and sometimes family. Eventually you can make a new EDI.
@@kylewhite8434 And you need to remember that the one saying so is the starchild, which is most probably a hologram from a reaper.
@@Commandant_Aeon what's interesting in some dialogue lines he refer about himself and the Reapers as "Us". So he admitted he is also a Reaper
I feel like the Control option is a valid choice and a good (if sad) pick for a full Paragon Shepard. A strong-willed Shepard with a true moral compass can turn the Reapers into the galactic protectors that they were originally meant to be. But all of that is certainly open to interpretation.
I’m glad that the Extended Cut DLC added the 4th option, where Shepard completely refuses to play the Reaper’s game and the next cycle is able to finally stop the Reapers for good.
If the reapers wanted to stop people from using element zero and be the good guys, cyclical genocide is not the way to go. You can simply explain the problem and work together to find an alternate source for interstellar travel instead of guiding organics to use the same technology time after time that you know will cause a catastrophe
IIRC, the Reapers become more intelligent by harvesting life and adding civilizations to their consciousness, then while they wait in deep space they attempt to solve the dark energy problem. I've seen it further theorized that they are close to a solution and humanity is the key, which is why they specifically target human colonies in ME2.
well that's kind of the point, isn't it? the reapers aren't as all-knowing and smart/rational as they claim to be. ultimately they are as self-interested/short-sighted as their 'lessers', though on a longer time-scale
And not leave behind tech that works EXCLUSIVELY with dark energy, in an easy to decode format, for future civilizations to adapt.
If Reapers were trying to PREVENT the death of the galaxy by dark energy, they failed. Now if they were going for a controlled destruction....
Organics are by nature mortal and can only see problems that are in front of them. No matter how long their lifespan is, they will never see far enough into the future to do anything about it.
As humans, we can't even stop ourselves from using fossil fuels and we KNOW what problems they create for future generations.
If the Reapers wanted to stop people from using element zero and be the good guys, they could’ve just harvested all the eezo in the galaxy and launch it into the black hole in the middle of the Milky Way via the Omega-4 relay instead of KILLING ALL ADVANCED LIFE IN THE GALAXY
Synthesis is only good when its consentual. The ending forces all alien races known and unknown into cyborgs. If i want to become a transhuman cyborg im doing by my choice.
If synthesis only affect synthetics and changes them instead of all life then synthesis all the way (plus not a big fan of the glowing eyes and glowing skin). The same for destroy since destroy basically renders the choice to resolve the conflict between geth-quarian to be pointless.
The pinnacle of evolution, a synthesis between organic and synthetic….
duck that's a reaper.
I go for the destroy ending, cause only Shepard survives.
Reapers don't care about bodily autonomy.
Spoken only by someone who didn't pay any fucking attention to Mass Effect. Literally the entire Reaper problem came about because of the unending, everpresent conflict of Organic vs Synthetic life. The ONLY solution is Synthesis. You choose Control, and you're no better than the Reapers. You choose Refusal, the Reapers win. You choose Destroy, and the conflict begins again in the future. Synthesis is the ONLY option that ends the conflict and gives the galaxy peace.
Unfortunately, the only way for galactic peace, especially in Mass Effect's universe, is through forced unity. There's no fucking universe in which all those species work together. Even the Leviathans cease being a problem under Synthesis.
But Bioware will likely choose Destroy as the canonical ending, as it leaves the door wide open plot wise for the Leviathans to return as the main threat to Organic life, replacing the Reapers, and beginning a new trilogy in which we must destroy the Leviathans, so they never come up with Reaper 2.0's or some other insanely stupid "solution."
The thing about the Citadel DLC is that it was the last one to come up, and thus many people would have already played through the ending, then gone back to play Citadel, so maybe this happening in the Afterlife makes sense.
For me, I just saw it as one last hurrah from the Bioware Mass Effect team to the fans, giving us a bit of a light hearted adventure (with one good "Of course Cerberus would do that" story point thrown in).
Funny thing: I picked up Legendary Edition, but the Citadel DLC left me with such a good feeling I haven't finished my Legendary play through yet ^_^
You know what I never thought about until now? Your final conversation with Garrus is about you talking about meeting up in a bar in the afterlife, and ... well, wouldn't you guess it, you meet Garrus in a bar in the Citadel DLC.
How about that?
you know it's bad where theres forums from that time where people say after you beat the game turn off the tv and imagine the ending you want 🤣🤣🤣
Really good mod that makes the citadel an epilogue on pc. So great
@@Wildbilliv1820 Curious how that would be done, presenting the Citadel as a 'Flashback' (since, one way or another, no one is going to be having a party for a LONG while after the ending, and most likely without Shepard).
@@AlanHawke Wow, I didn't spot that one. Nice! Maybe the reapers give everyone a little heaven as a farewell gift.
Interestingly, the crucible could also be theorized to be a test for the player to see if we have been paying attention. As the synthesis option could also be seen as a ruse. We know for a fact from the prothean VI Vendetta that the reapers use control to indoctrinate and trick certain characters. Perhaps they are using synthesis in the same way, because the reapers literally are synthesis. As Saren, who was also indoctrinated, stated: “I am a vision of the future. A union of flesh and steel. The strengths of both, the weaknesses of neither.” The fact that they use these same ideas that are presented to the player in the ending, to trick people, is very alarming to me.
Saren states: my way is the only way to survive. The reapers have literally been the catalyst’ solution to the problem for eons. Picking synthesis may very well be reinforcing their methods. The reapers, harbinger in particular, states “we are the harbinger of your perfection “. Synthesis is presented as the perfect, ultimate choice.
I mean the cypher video is the best message in the whole trilogy, it showed great suffering and pain from the merging of steel and flesh. So yeah, destroy seems to the most logical.
I reject the idea that the existence of similarity implies congeniality.
The Reapers were unions of flesh and steel, but not the will behind the flesh. True synthesis would require the component of will to be intact; rather than simply being liquified and having your base materials pumped into a false icon of your existence (the Human Form Reaper at the end of ME2.) The Reapers represent the path of control, not synthesis.
@@NormalPersonCommenting basically it's:
Blue - Organics believed our rouse, *controlled*
Green - We'll let the organics think they are equal partners, but..
Red - nooooooo, please nooooo...
@@NormalPersonCommenting The same can be said about control as well if one wants to use that line of thinking. Perhaps this method of control is different than what the reapers presented with cerberus and past splinter factions. The thing that must be understood is that the reapers indeed did use the idea of synthesis to indoctrinate Saren. So we know that it is in there manipulation pallet
Synthesis is never a good choice. see husks- that is synthesis. and those gun-rachni too. the rachni queen was begging Shepard to stop her children's existence after they were synthesized by Reapers into something new and all-powerful beings
That isn't synthesis, thats total control. It's the equivalent to what Shepard does in the control ending. Synthesis ends the reapers mission to wipe out all intelligent life.
I'm still destroy gang tho.
yeah I don't like synth all that well either. First off it's entirely ridiculous to turn microorganisms into synthesized beings, as well as plants etc. Second it just isn't even good sci fi.
@@jones6471 I have to do control myself, destroy just destroys all the knowledge and all in the reapers.
As a cripple synthesis was always the best option, imagine being trapped in your own body your whole life then a miracle happens where not only you have been cured but everyone has
Lost me at the end with the synthesis agreements and reapers being good guys, but definitely a fun iceberg. Though I feel there were more codex/cerberus news from me2 that could've been covered. Really cool tidbits of lore in those.
Thanks so much for watching! And ya always more stuff to dig into I’m sure I’ll dive more into mass effect at some point, trying to get a bunch of different icebergs out to start
Fun iceberg? Dude is literally making shit up and gets so many things wrong.
@@draegoth Yeah, I stopped watching after the "Asari are a bloodsucking monsters out to kill us all" entry, that shit was Alex Jones level retardation.
"We simply...are." God that speech gives me chills
Probably my favorite part in the first game and whole series, thanks for supporting my channel!
That conversation was amazing. Major cosmic horror vibes. Sovereign is so dismissive of everything because of its place in the universe.
what a liar 🤣🤣🤣
@@brandoncotton5714 yeah it's really arrogant makes blowing it up even more satisfying
Yep, and then we find out they aren't. They were created by some narcissistic creatures and are flawed AI who are less intelligent than EDI and the Geth. EDI can reprogram herself when new information comes in, but they get a major update that not all created and creators turn against each other and can coexist, and they don't have the processing power to change goals. Hmmm. Some great all powerful being. Or perhaps they were lying about their reasons and the end goal was just to kill all non synthetic beings all along. I preferred when they were mysterious and without motive. The devs should have written in a weakness of some sort, though. Needing a Macguffin to win against an enemy is cheap, and is just plain bad writing. I loved playing the trilogy, but the ending was horrific on so many levels. In fact, the 3rd game had a lot of issues that weakened the game, which is sad. It should have been the strongest one.
I think you misunderstood the indoctrination theory. The theory is that EVERYTHING that happened after the reaper laser blast was a struggle in shepard's head. He was struggling for control against the reapers. Everything pulled him away from desiring the destruction of the reapers. Don't destroy them. Control them, join with them, become them, but don't destroy them. Everything points away from destroying them. The more readiness, the more strongly you fight against the reapers the more the "catalyst" tries to entice you. First, if you destroy the reapers, you destroy all synthetic life, even your friends. But, if you synthesize, you become one with them, you join them. Your quarian friends won't die from infections, your best friend and pilot can be with the love of his life. But if you destroy them, you take all that away. Join with us. However, if shepard is unwavering, and refuses to give in to anything, the ending is him emerging from the rubble where he was blasted by harbinger. The indoctrination failed to take hold of his will. If he chooses to shoot the catalyst, he gives up. If he chooses control, he gives up. If he chooses synthesis, he gives up. If he chooses destroy, after collecting the entire galaxy to fight at his side, he overcomes the control. It is the most beautiful ending to the series, where the final battle is not a gun fight with a reaper, but a test of one's will to finish the mission.
IT theory isn’t that Shep is indoctrinated, it’s that the Reapers are trying to indoctrinate him.
Something I have always thought is that the Keepers are the Husk form of the Ragni
Which makes sense they would try as they do with everyone and it makes sense they would single him out and move humanity up on their shit list because it's not working. "How many other humans have this strange resistance?" I've always thought it was because of the Cipher the indoctrination signal wouldn't be universal every species would need an altered version cause different brain patterns. The Cipher alters the brain to be able to think and perceive like a prothian which would alter his brain patterns and thought processes. The problem with saren he was already indoctrinated so maybe thats what opens the door for shepard to get in his head, so the repears see and perceive shepard to be human and would be using the human based signal only his mind is patterned like a prothian / human hybrid maybe. Like trying to upload a Windows program on a mac computer.
That makes a lot of sense.
I’m sure the reapers admit the keepers where one of the first species they indoctrinated in one of the first cycles.
I highly doubt that the Keepers are Rachni Huks. Specially because the Keepers has been supposedly around for millions of years.
Yeah. the Indoctrination theory most likely was correct, but not the way most people think. even 2 of the were originally supported by the villains of the series. I don't know about that, I don't want to finish the game agreeing with neither Saren nor The Illusive man.
Destroy was NOT a mistake. It was the only correct answer.
I think it’s the only correct answer for Shepard. Why would he do anything else?
No, the rachni queen couldn't communicate with her children due to her children being hatched away from her at the facility, so they didn't imprint on her. The reapers sent a signal that caused the wars, which then led to the krogan rebellion which effectively crippled the greatest fighting force in the milky way. Long story short, the reapers play the long con for sure
Man I will never forget my very first play through on three. At the end I just say the controller down and thought about it for a bit. When I finally picked up the controller I walked towards synthesis. As I was walking up I saw a Tyrian ship get blown up in the background and immediately turned around and walked to destroy.
I feel like this was a big gaslight to convince yourself you made the right decision just like we all did so we didn't feel like we wasted 3 games
About the Synthesis ending being the "right" one... I don't know, that just feels wrong. See, the two options besides Destroy are the philosophies of the two previous games' villains - Synthesis was Saren's goal, Control was the Illusive Man's. And right before your choice, you console Anderson in his last moments, which reminds you of what you have to do.
There is no choice, Destroy is the only path. Anything else is a betrayal of what the man that gave everything to you fought for, and at worst, you fall right into the trap that those you fought against did as well...
Regardless, PHENOMENAL video!
Saren was submission.
@@lordinvictus793 Saren wanted to combine organic with reaped upgrades and combine them with the reapers to ensure not only survival, but superiority to regular organic and synthetic species. He advocated for giving up free will in exchange for upgrades, which is the same as what the synthesis ending does.
And keeping all the husk who where once people alive is wrong its like not letting them rest and the reapers killed billions of people and other species so because of that the destroy ending is the right one for me
@@darthcadeaus8254 Except the Reapers were just controlling him and his plan meant nothing, in the Synthesis Ending the Reapers called off their attacks and repaired the damaged they did.
Also isnt Destroy literally Genocide? It kills the Geth, and also the Sentient Minds trapped within the Reapers. In Synthesis, they may have a chance to be freed, and in Control they are overridden by Shepard.
Sovereign always makes me feel so tiny and insignificant. One of the truly most terrifying antagonists in any medium I have ever experienced.
11:37 Well, if Shepard went through with Refusal, the Reapers would still have control of the Citadel and - like all cycles before - would have full access to its records which would likely involve information on the Raloi (even if all official reports involved them were purged, it's possible that someone made reference to them somewhere).
11:59 After listening to that conversation, I've noticed similarities to Turians (mainly in the Asari's head tentacles) but not seeing any similarities so maybe they look the way we perceive them and are just able to give off different types of pheromones that appeal to every species... or the Salarian in the conversation was just drunk.
Wasn't the Dark Energy storyline in the original script but it got leaked and Hudson and one other dude took it upon themselves to rewrite the ending giving us the Star Child and the whole use synthetics to destroy organics in order to keep organics from developing synthetics that will destroy organics mess
From what I recall of the interviews, the dark energy thing was never developed past the concept level. It was just one idea out of several.
The leaked ending was virtually identical to what we got. You can still find the script online but it’s hard to navigate ( docs.google.com/document/d/17vTg6rwmHIywnC54Whkmj01fv840GgrJEf92z1ce_qg/mobilebasic ) so here’s the parts relevant to the ending:
CUTSCENE:
The platform Shepard was on begins to rise up into GUARDIAN's garden where he is faced with his final decision.
The fight ends with Shepard near death… and the Crucible docking with the Citadel. Bloodied and wounded, Shepard stumbles for the controls… and collapses (END03 Begins).
CONVERSATION:
Once Shepard reaches the top of the elevator he begins a conversation with GUARDIAN where all the mysteries of the universe are revealed.
ACTION:
Shepard must now make his final decision - to control the Reapers, to destroy the Reapers, or if they had a perfect game to become one with the Reapers.
CUTSCENE:
The DEVICE docks with the Citadel, Shepard leaps off the edge of the platform becoming one with the Reapers.
CUTSCENE:
The DEVICE docks with the Citadel, Shepard places his hands into the control mechanism and gains control over the Reapers. Earth is destroyed, and the Reapers leave.
CUTSCENE:
The DEVICE docks with the Citadel, Shepard destroys the tubes resulting in the Reapers being destroyed. Earth is also Destroyed.
CUTSCENE:
The DEVICE docks with the Citadel, Shepard places his hands into the control mechanism and gains control over the Reapers. Earth is okay, and the Reapers leave.
CUTSCENE:
The DEVICE docks with the Citadel, Shepard destroys the tubes resulting in the Reapers being destroyed. Earth is devastated.
CUTSCENE:
The DEVICE docks with the Citadel, Shepard destroys the tubes resulting in the Reapers being destroyed. Earth is okay.
CUTSCENE:
The DEVICE docks with the Citadel, Shepard destroys the tubes resulting in the Reapers being destroyed. Earth is okay. Shepard survives.
No, but it looks to have been the main contender for how the story was to develop until Drew Karpyshin left the team part way through ME2 and Mac Walters and Casey Hudson decided to take it in another direction. The Mass Effect series really needed a big picture guy like Karpyshin to tie the threads together... It's a shame we got what we did
weren't rachni used as weapons be prothenas(javik dialogue)? I feel like it's safe to assume that they were the krogans of the cycle before.
they were specifically selectioned to be more aggressive.
Yes and also it’s implied the leviathans made them to combat the reapers, they could potentially be the krogan but of every cycle, thanks for watching by the way!
If you listen to them "speak" about the sour yellow note, it becomes clear that Sovereign was manipulating the Racnhi via indoctrination. This is why the freed true Rachni queen helps you. Her children were indoctrinated by the Reapers to wreak havoc, and she is seriously po'd.
I have to admit Mass Effect set a new standard for video games. A ride into the world of science fiction that wasn't so outlandish to not be believable. Hats off to Bioware for creating not just a game, but really an alternate world one could immerse themselves in. And bringing in quality actors to do the voice overs, bringing another level of "realism" to the game. thumbs up.
You had me until the end and turning shepherd into a villain.
Too many stories have been ruined through "subverting expectations".
In the end it really depends on the story and execution. Also Shepard choosing wrong doesn't make him a villain per se, merely a person who made a human mistake while trying to do what was right.
@15:44 playing through the legendary edition (again) and I just caught some ambient talk from Javik (protheon dlc character) and he said the rachni were from his cycle (the one before ours) and that they bred only the most "warlike and cunning queens" until they became to cunning and warlike and they had to put them down. Says he thought they wiped them out, but they must have survived the reapers
Great Vid! Though I prefer the theory that the black matter was created by the Reapers as a fail safe to kill organic life because the Reapers are jerks
Ya could be that too I kinda tailored some of the theories to my view to help my a grand one at the end but either way thanks for taking the time to watch and support my channel!
Well the reapers never killed all organic life, they “harvested” organics once they reached a certain level of technological advancement and left the others alone. Seeing the reapers as diabolically evil is too simple
The Dark Energy plot was the original story that was planned, but fans guessed it pretty early and a story script got leaked after ME2, which annoyed the heads at Bioware so they forced a script rewrite for ME3 which turned into the ghost boy and crucible garbage.
I hate that. If it was their og canon ending, it should have stayed that way! It's still a story, you know?
I understand that I'm a bit late to the party but I just want to throw my two cents into the mix. From the way I see it the Catalyst makes the same mistake that the Quarians did. They both believed that synthetic life would inevitably turn on organic life. To both, it was an absolute certainty. And yet, we see that it is not. Through Sheperds possible interactions with the Geth and Edi we see that if synthetic life is approached as an equal, peace and mutually beneficial cooperation is definetly possible.
This is down to synthetic life wanting the same thing as organic life, the freedom to choose how they live their lives. As long as that freedom is respected, peace will last.
Bringing this to the choice we face at the end of ME3, synthesis is just a different kind of defeat. By choosing it, we accept the idea that synthetics and organics cannot coexist. I can't accept that, not with what can happen with Legion or Edi.
Control is also problematic in my opinion. For the rest of time the most powerful weapons in the galaxy are under the control of one person. There is the potential for the one person to be good, but it is still one human being against the ravages of time and the dark whispers of absolute power. There is just too much risk in trying to control the reapers. They are too dangerous too work with and they will not be convinced of the errors in their logic.
Unfortunately, this leaves one option. It sucks that bioware set it up that way but, it is what it is. By choosing to destroy the reapers, we reject the logic of the Catalyst and we eliminate their threat against the milky way forever. It sucks that we lose Edi and the Geth and I wish there was a way to save them, but this way there is a future where organic and any new synthetic life can live in freedom. There is hope that the organic species can learn from the past and treat synthetics as equals. This is victory, with a high cost, but the only victory without a potential threat looming. As a result, this is the best choice for me.
I'll build on that by pointing out that the main reason why many players don't go for Destroy is *just* that EDI & the Geth die. Without that, it's a pretty obvious choice. None of the Reapers have done anything to make the players feel bad about deleting them; the whole "We are each a nation, preserved" thing doesn't *work* when each Reaper is shown in-game being interchangeable with the others.
If Bioware had added something into ME3 where Shepard gets to see... maybe not 'rogue' Reapers, but some that have actual *personality*. Maybe the Reaper on Rannoch at least says something "This view reminds Us of Our homeworld," or even empathizes with either the Quarians or Geth before Shepard has to kill it. (Letting Shepard literally talk a Reaper into doing what he wants without having to kill the thing would be a bit too much of a stretch). At least that would make the players feel *some* reason not to just kill the Reapers.
Which leads to the "Kills the Geth & EDI" angle, which is annoying because it's just a massive diabolus ex machina. Why does the Crucible kill all "AI"? What is the magical essence that links all AIs into some arcane target list? Why wouldn't that affect (the heavily, *heavily*-modified) Shepard as well? Or all the VIs in known space, that are utterly necessary for modern (of the 2180's) life? If it's supposed to be that the part of Sovereign that was built into EDI makes her part-Reaper and thus affected, then why the Geth? Wasn't clearing them of Reaper influence the whole point of Legion's scenes in ME3, up to his self-sacrifice?
The whole thing is just annoyingly "Oh, you want this option, that otherwise has no downside? Well, some of your friends will die for no reason if you pick it, so there!"
@@MagnusVictor2015 It'd make more sense if the reason that the Geth were to die was their integration of Reaper code. "All AI" is pretty broad, but it would make the "it's a hell of a bitter pill..." feeling hit harder if the very reason for the Geth's ascendance was what put them on the target list.
The real reason the Thorian survived makes sense with the original plans. It was intelligent, but not technologically advanced, and had no evidence of using the Mass Effect or Element Zero in any way, so with the Reapers' original motivation it would not have been on their radar
I'm (almost) 100% sure the "Guidingthe organics to Synthesis" theory(despite being interesting) can be easily discarded because of the fact that devs explicitly stated several times that Destroy ending is canon. Of course they can still retcon that in the future ME, but at this point it would be quite difficult to explain without getting into some Star-Trekk-ish alternative timelines stuff. Also, it is apparent from the next ME trailers that Destroy indeed happened.
BTW, the concept of Purgatory is not Christian, but Catholic.
Oh damn good catch you are right lol, appreciate the feedback and support on the channel!
That "Cro Magnon" moment actually reminded me of something completely outside the ME franchise all together. Has no one here ever watched the beginning of "2001 - Space Oddessy"? The black obelisks that our proto-human ancestors find? What if ME is actually a spin-off of THAT story?
The spheres are obviously inspires by/references to 2001, but they have a different function to the monoliths and the two franchises are not connected in any way or form.
Mass Effect is built on many plausibility's.
That's the reality of it.
Child asks: "Did that already happen?"
Old guy (probably Shepard): "Yes but some of the details have been lost in time."
Ya I would agree with you I think that’s what makes each ending make sense depending on how you spin things, also thanks for supporting my channel!
My Shepard was female and old guy was still a guy. So probably not Shepard.
@@kalimaxine Male Shepard is the canon Shepard
@@basedvorenus7497 That may be but my Shepard doesn't turn into a dude. And if he was supposed to be Shepard I'm sure they would have thought to make a human female as well as the male.
The truth about the Asari is far darker; They were created by the Protheans to be a servant species. Just like the Haanar were given speech and thought, but that was only a test for their true plan of creating the ultimate product. Think about it, slavery was normal in the Prothean Empire. Now what you would *use* an all female species for on the other hand ...
For foraging and prepping food with their evolutionary strong eye sight? Right? Am I right? 😃
@@SirTorcharite ahh yes "Foraging" we have dismissed those claims
I was fully convinced of the "Asari using mind control to influence other species" theory up until a throw away line in the Citadel DLC house party mission, during the part where you can have your crew dancing. If you go to the circle with Garrus, Tali, and Liara all dancing near the kitchen, they say something along the lines of not knowing how Liara and Shepard can dance with their "weird legs" referencing the more humanoid leg shapes shared by the Asari and Humans.
I may have misinterpreted the point of the line, or maybe I'm reading way too much into a joke, but surely the Asari appearance would go beyond just the facial structure and resemble most of the body to look as familiar as possible to other races if they were to be parasitic, right? Also let's be real, there must be some artwork made by Turians, Quarians, Salarians, etc. that included Asari, and physical art (and the statues as you mentioned) must be objective enough to bypass some parasitic mind control. At the very least, the leg comment Garrus and Tali make is enough to convince me the Asari are just meant to be conventionally beautiful by this world's standards.
Still, the conversation the guys have in ME2 is very suspect. How could anyone possibly look at, say, Samara, and see a resemblance to Mordin or Garrus? I think we need some Krogan input on this one
I mean liara can only wear human armour so we know they are humanoid
I have a theory. You see, the dark energy theory works when the fundamental shape of the universe is somewhat restrictive. You see when the universe is flat and has positive cosmological constant dark energy, the heat death happens. However, in a closed universe, everything in the universe gets reshuffled, and at some point, after a very, very, very long time, the matters of the universe get rearranged in a way that initially happened, it's called the Poincare Recurrence Time.
My theory is, that the Reapers were trying to send information from one point in time of the universe to the next point after the Poincare recurrence time via the green ending. The green ending, although on the surface means the synthesis of the organics and synthetics, the point is being created as an initial value, after a very long time, every matter of the universe will eventually come into the previous initial value, thus preserving the essence of the organics.
So basically a controlled destruction?
@@sarasunshinemt4444 yes.
Thanks for the support recently everyone the channel has been doing great! Any other iceberg videos you guys would like to see?
So my biggest theory on Mass Effect; is that everyone in the Milky Way (At least everyone who has the eezo tech they reverse engineered from the protheans) is lightly indoctrinated. Not enough to fully control them, but just enough to get them to align to certain ideas. Ideas that limit them, and make them less of a threat to the reapers.
As we know all of the tech used is reverse engineered from Prothean tech, but that was engineered from another race, and another, and another all the way back to the initial harvest and creation of the Reapers. This would mean that while it isn't confirmed; all advanced tech would have small amounts of reaper tech in it. Not to mention the Citadel, and Mass Relays which are genuinely reaper tech. All reaper tech has the ability to indoctrinate people, so it could happen.
As for evidence that it has we need to look at the Milky Way galaxy in Shepherd's day: After Mass Effect 1 they switched from using an internal cooling system to disposable heatsinks. In lore this was used to amp up the accelerators for more power. We can test this in Mass Effect 3, in the Citadel DLC we can get an M7 Lancer with the old internal cooling. Compared to the more modern M8 Avenger; the M7 is better in almost every way. It's lighter, has a theoretically infinite capacity, and does almost twice the damage per shot with the same fire rate. The damage alone proves that the M8 doesn't have more powerful accelerators than the M7, so why does it use the thermal clip system?
Because that's what the Reapers want. Does it really seem coincidental that effectively everyone decided to go with this likely inferior system shortly after Sovereign blew up on the presidium? Exposing more people, and more influential people to reaper tech. Thus endangering them to indoctrination.
The biggest piece however is in the council's ban on Mass Accelerator weapons that are too powerful. This doesn't seem too weird, until in Mass Effect 2 when you realized that an ancient species used an incredibly powerful Mass Accelerator weapon to one shot a reaper. Imagine if every dreadnaught in the Turian, Citadel, Asari, and Alliance fleets had guns that strong. The reapers would have taken huge losses. Instead the civilized species of the galaxy were effectively steamrolled. Not even in the Traverse, or Teminus systems are guns that strong used. There, outside of Citadel Space it would technically be legal to build them, or by an inventive black ops like Cerberus. Yet we still don't see them in the Batarian fleet, or in Aria's Traverse fleets.
Because it was all indoctrination to keep them from advancing that far. Far enough to be a real threat.
Oh, the Citadel was definitely a multi-layered trap. Not only would it draw the leaders of the galaxy to it for a swift removal of leadership when the harvest begins, but could also serve to influence the leaders to make poor choices in the meantime... like, say, dismissing the reaper threat or passing laws limiting dreadnought numbers. And depending on the how distance and exposure time relates to influence, the relays definitely could have been meant to nudge some minds, since basically everyone passes through them
Was the newer clip based system supposedly more powerful? I thought that they reverse engineered it from stolen Geth analytics where the Geth found that detaching a heat sink was faster then waiting for the gun to cool down. Though, that still leaves the suspicious question of why there wasn't a hybrid cooling system, since going from 'basically infinite ammo' to 'limited ammo' seems like a pretty big step down.
Also, I love the Lancer. Slap an anti-armor mod on there, and you can chew through brutes and banshees. If you add armor shredding powers on top of that...well...
@@ancienthero7579 I thought they defined a ratio for how many dreadnoughts each species can have compared to eachother not an actual limit. Or am I remembering that wrong?
@@dexster8618228 You are right, but that still means that there are fewer dreadnoughts then there otherwise might be. If the Turians are content with the number that they have, nobody else can build any more, if they already match the ratio.
@@ancienthero7579 Ah that makes sense then. I think the rule existing makes sense, but once the reaper threat was established they should have loosened them. But of course then we get back to the problem of the council doing everything they can to refuse reality so that plan is kinda dead in the water.
One key bit of "Holy hell, everyone is indoctrinated on the Citadel" for me was that the council had made it a law that you couldn't interfere with a keeper. And that, even tho the asari had been on the station for over 2K years, they STILL didn't know where he keepers come from, where the "heart" of the station was and didn't have a full map of the keeper tunnels throughout the station (Bailey bitches about that during the coup mission).
Millions of people on that station, the seat of power for the whole damn galaxy, and the council doesn't know EVERY damn inch of the place?!
*on the Rachni*
It’s pretty much confirmed in all 3 Mass Effect games that the ‘sour yellow note’ that essentially took control of the Rachni was the reapers all along, possibly even Sovereign itself. Sovereign never left. It bided it’s time, and sent the signal to the keepers to activate the citadel relay. It didn’t happen. So sovereign had to very carefully bide it’s time. And in that time between it’s latest awakening and deciding ‘ok, enough is enough let’s wipe the slate’ it may have spent hundreds or thousands of years cultivating the right moment. And that may well have included using the Rachni. In ME:3 Javik tells Shepard that the Rachni were present in the previous cycle, and the protheans used them essentially as weaponised units against the Reapers, so somehow they survived the previous cycle. I speculate the Reapers kept the Rachni alive as tools for the following cycle, so Sovereign would have known about them all along and even been able to access them via their relay and deactivating without much effort, preparing the Rachni, poisoning their processes with its ‘sour yellow note’. Essentially preparing a flood for the moment the other races activate that particular relay.
Ya lost me at "Synthesis was the best". The only good reaper is a dead reaper. I do hope ME4 involves the Dark Energy issue. Would also be nice for some final closure on Shepard and Tali as the Destroy ending is canon based on the reveal teaser and other media. Also Tali is the only option for man Shep. Don't @me
Reframing ALL of Mass Effect around Shepard being an idiot who doomed the galaxy... Yeah no, that's awful, the game should be rightfully shunned on its premise if they go through with this retcon.
I really hate the "Asari are parasites" theory because if you literally just look at the fucking Asari race, they possess the characteristics of all 3 of the races involved, Human face, Turian Head Shape, Silurian Horn Structure.
The asari very rudimentarily resemble the 3 races when looking at the head along, which is the most important part of "seeing similarities" to these species.
Why would the reapers go through all this trouble for millions of years, only so Shepard can force synthesis on every person in the galaxy?
They could have forcefully synthesized everyone at the start instead. What does this 'testing' of commander Shepard meaningfully change? It feels rather esoteric and vague, there's nothing concrete to gain by doing this
I see it as they have to evolve organics to the point where synthesis can happen it’s not just something where you combine the two it could be explained that it actually was research the reapers were doing hence why they harvest every cycle to figure out how it do it. On top of this it shows they could actually be the good guys cause in the end they let Shepard and the organics make the choice since only through organics opting for it does it show they are reaper to defend against a bigger threat the reapers know about the whole time.
At least for me this makes the story SUPER interesting based on all the implications of reapers being good, a greater threat, etc and it basically is what make me love the first mass effect so much
Metanarratively, they had to come up with something after the head writer left the company, taking all of his ideas with him.
In-game, I think there's dialogue somewhere (possibly added in Leviathan) that points to Synthesis requiring a level of psychological readiness that the species of past cycles didn't display (organic and/or synthetic). It's possible they tried Synthesis on a smaller scale, with a species that wasn't ready, and they destroyed themselves out of some sense of dysmorphia or disassociation.
The fact that negotiating peace between the quarians and the geth is even on the table, boosted by Shepard's extensive cybernetic augmentations, suggests that this cycle could be ready.
@@FranklyGaming It's possible. Except the part about "they let Shepard and the organics make the choice"
The rest of the galaxy did not consent to it at all, they didn't even know about it. Shepard got to decide everyone's fate, altering their bodies just like that. I don't see how this is morally different from the Reapers deciding it for them millions of years earlier.
And if they were researching it and this was their intended end-goal, why did they not keep a few thousand indoctrinated scientists alive every cycle to design the catalyst?
@@alphalancer Im pretty sure that the star child himself said that they had tried synthesis early on and it failed horribly, and so began the harvest cycles until eventually a race would evolve to the point that synthesis was possible. In ME2 Harbinger I think talks about how the harvest is meant to "preserve" the races through their dna, implying that they were somehow able to store the a race's entire knowledge, culture and genome like data in the biopaste that was being used to make the human reaper (presumably all the reapers really) . Maybe the plan all along was that once synthesis could be achieved, the new merged species could begin to re-awaken those long lost species from the data stored from all the previous harvests within the various reaper dreadnaughts... My biggest problem with the reapers turning out the be "the good guys all along" is just how utterly freaking brutal they are. and the couple of times we get to speak with one about its intentions, they are extremely doomy towards us and never allude to any kind of hidden virtuous purpose, they simply want to dominate and kill everything. But maybe thats what the individual reapers were programmed to think to make them more efficient, with the catalyst entity keeping that bit to itself to prevent any possible complications. shrugs.
@@deanf6036
I think it's less that they "were the good guys all along", and more a case of "doing the wrong thing for the right reasons"-their assessment of the situation is accurate, but their solution is repugnant.
And I think the inscrutable brutality of their methods, and how it surprised even the Leviathans, is thematically appropriate for the story because it both shows the uttermost extreme of the Renegade "whatever it takes to complete the mission" mindset and highlights the historic cognitive divide between organic and synthetic minds.
In the past, AI was created top-down, starting with a goal and building an intelligence that would mechanically pursue that goal: that's literally what the Catalyst was, what it created its first proxies for (and, subsequently, the Reapers), and Javik's account suggests this was how the metacons came about. I can only imagine that the intervening generations of AI came about via similar means, and things really only changed with the advent of the Geth.
The Geth developed their intelligence bottom-up, being an emergent property of Quarian-coded, task-oriented runtimes working cooperatively to reap efficiencies from distributed computing, much like how an organic mind is significantly based on its experiences learning to puppeteer its flesh-suit and navigate the world. This different origin gives the Geth a more organic perspective of the universe, as shown in the inciting incidents of the Morning War and the metacon crisis of the Prothean era. The metacons were effectively the Borg, synthetic components installed into and puppeteering organic flesh, pursuing their goals without regard for the will of their hosts; in contrast, the Geth got their start (or, at least, revealed having done so) when the Quarians overreacted to multiple platforms asking whether they have souls after studying religious texts.
Love how people try to justify bad writing by creating all kind of conspiracies. No, buddy, destruction was the canonical ending, they just added the fake choice because "depth"and "engagement"
Ya that’s fine I get that side too! For me it’s more about how it tied into the themes I made a video about it after this one, which is I think what makes the games great different people can see it in different ways, thanks for watching by the way
Destruction was one of the (two, I assume) endings originally planned for the trilogy. Then, for some idiotic reason, Bioware decided to scrap its counterpart, rewrite ME3 endgame into complete gibberish, and pile on killing EDI and the Geth onto "Destroy", to make the two new endings at least semi-palatable.
"Desteoying the reapers doesnt solve anything, because organics will end up creating more synthetics."
Is like saying you should never shower because you'll just get dirty again anyways.
Not really no. It's just that in the face of other possibilities, like Control or Synthesis, problem posed by the Reapers at the end of Destruction is still there
Wasn’t the Scourge revealed to be a super weapon someone deployed, not a natural phenomenon?
Which would make it even cooler as the plot behind the next games, revealing a bigger player at the table, a man can dream lol. Thanks for watching by the way!
At the end of ME:A Peebee mentions how the study of the Scourge could fundamentally alter the way they travel through space. Maybe the use of the Scourge opened a wormhole into the Milky Way. This allowed a little bit of the Scourge to leak through and begin to kill the star Tali was studying. This could be a way they can bring the original trilogy and ME:A together.
Biggest freaking plot point that they don't talk about in Andromeda is that the geth managed to take THREE RELAYS, reverse engineer them (when it was stated that they are locked down at the quantum level, per the Arrival DLC) and turn them into a telescope.
What.
The.
FUCK.
They manage to do what NO OTHER civilization could, and it's merely a throwaway line that the navigator says to Ryder.
I mean, the protheans managed to create a one way mini relay in ME1 and the council doesn't put a crap-ton of resources on that to make new ones? No one has thought to BUILD new ones? (Matriarch Athyeta after mentioning the asari should do so "they laughed the blue off my ass, so now I serve drinks").
All of 'em indoctrinated. Would be cool if the scourge is just un-directed dark energy, not "guided" like the Reapers did for the Milkyway
I still hold that the Indoctrination Theory (IDT) is true, and that isn't just because if it isn't the story is as shallow as a puddle of pee.
There are a few main reasons I still hold this as true;
Lore Accurate - In universe indoctrination appears to be an involuntary process that Reaper and their tech do even when dead. Shep has been around reaper tech for a long time, so them resisting indoctrination would not make sense but them becoming indoctrinated would.
Additionally it is stated that Reapers can slow this process down, but it seems it cannot be prevented. Shep has only really encountered Reaper tech for most of the series, and not spent any lengthy time in the presence of Reapers. This would imply a lot of limited exposure rather than intense exposure, giving reason that it hasn't had too much of an impact until now...when more actual Reapers are there.
How Indoctrination Manifests - Indoctrination is shown to take many forms, but two are reflected by the games principle antagonists who are both confirmed to be indoctrinated; Saren wants to work with the Reapers (synthesis) the Illusive Man wants to use the Reapers (control).
Saren doesn't try to prevent a Reaper invasion by warning the council, though it is stated that an entire galaxy working together could kill Sovereign and buy time. The Illusive Man repeatedly keeps Reaper tech knowing how dangerous it is because he thinks it will advance his own cause...even though he risks humanity trying to control something he knows has destroyed civs far more powerful than humanity.
Notice how both of these were options at the end, and also notice how neither man believed they were indoctrinated themselves. Saren stating his mind was his own.
Destroy is off the Table for Indoctrinated - notice that throughout the series none of the indoctrinated choose destroy, even though they clearly see the Reapers as an existential threat. Only those that are not indoctrinated advocate for destruction - such as Shep & their team throughout the series, Anderson, Hackett.
Thematically Hinted At - IDT is thematically hinted at in all games. Throughout the entire series Shep is repeatedly shown what happens when people try and deviate from the plan. The multiple issues with rogue AI that they're not meant to be using at all for example, but the main one is the repeated references to and showing of people that tried to do anything other than destroy the Reapers. In addition to the main antagonists there is also Javik that states the Protheans failed due to those that did not want to destroy the Reapers. These are warnings given to Shep from the very start.
Additionally the Leviathans state it catagorically that Sheps standout characteristic and the reason that their 'victories are more than a product of chance' is their determination.
Gameplay - Taking all these elements, IDT makes the most sense from a gameplay POV...after all how can you challenge a player to resist indoctrination? A mini-game? A simple choice? Something obvious that is easy to overcome? None of these are representative of the great evil that is indoctination. However, presenting options that go against everything up to that point and are in line with what other indoctrinated individuals have stated but framed as viable for you is an excellent way to run this final test.
The game has given players everything they need to know what they need to do, and all the things to avoid. It was down to the players then to resist the indoctrination.
While this comment is one of the greatest elaborations on IDT, and the final choice, I'd still argue for Synthesis. Saren was a willing slave to the Reapers. He chose to work FOR them. That is not Synthesis. In Synthesis' explanation, it's made clear that there will be no more distinction between organic and synthetic life. All will be one. Saren was not one with Sovereign, he was controlled by Sovereign, completely. Indoctrination would not function on a hybrid species, as all would be part of the collective, therefore, forced mind control is unnecessary, as everyone would be unified under one galactic purpose.
The problem with Destroy, is that it opens up the galaxy to the threat for the Leviathans. The Protheans may have been a warmongering, controlling empire, but they are least unified all organic life under one purpose. They still lost. They did not choose Synthesis, and they ended up becoming slaves to the Reapers, transforming into the Collectors. The Leviathans chose to hide, they chose to wait until the Reapers found what they were looking for, "a solution" to the Organic vs Synthetic life conflict. Destroy merely sets everyone back to zero, technologically. It doesn't just destroy the Reapers, it destroys EVERYTHING SYNTHETIC. If it took the entire galaxy working together, with tech, with AI, to stop the Reapers, how would we stand any percent of a chance at stopping the Leviathans from taking over again, and creating new Reapers, with different programming. Destroy is short sighted. Synthesis IS the solution the Reapers we're searching for. The Harvest is a transformation of an entire galaxy/race from organic to synthetic. It is not Synthesis, it is forced preservation on the tail of destruction.
Synthesis is the only answer to this problem.
Indoctrination Theory isn't lore accurate. I've looked at it myself, Indoctrination Theory makes up a bunch of shit and relies on Fanon in order to work.
Shep Indoctrination can be debunked in many ways but will resort myself to one point. Catalyst states that Ilusive Man wasn't solution because "we already controled him". No such statement was made about Commander.
Case and point.
@@Romczy Yes, the Illusive Man was as controlled as Saren was. Shepard being indoctrinated isn't argued to the point of total control. It's argued to the point of the Catalyst influencing him in his final moments. He's had way too many encounters with Reapers and Reaper tech. There's no way he wasn't being influenced to some degree. How he could've fought it off as long as he did is less reasonable lore wise than him being fully indoctrinated. You need to go back and read the codex entries on indoctrination. It happens passively. No one has ever resisted, except...Shepard, it doesn't make sense. Leviathan praises him, but only because his will is stronger than most, and he has more information than most. He actively studied indoctrination. The Illusive Man leaned into it, assuming he could overpower it. He failed. I don't think Shepard's will was stronger than the Illusive Man's.
IMO: Shepard's sheer willpower is what kept him/her from being mind controlled by the Reapers directly. As the Illusive man stated "you are an idealsit" - Shepard believed that fighting - DESTROY is the only solution "we fight or we die". Reapers could not turn it against him/her so they have decided to just brake Shepard's mind apart by showing giving her/him flashbacks of all the dead people - including a real life manifestation of that boy. There is no point in fighting when there is noone's future to fight for
Its a shame andromeda wont ever be given the chance to become something great of its own.
It's worth noting that the original creative director of Mass Effect had envisioned this as a science fiction Lovecraft Verse. The Reapers, the Thorian, the Rachni Queen, the Protheans...all these aspects mirror the universe of HP Lovecraft with uncaring, laughing gods, madness inducing artifacts, and knowledge man was not meant to know.
The original motivation of the Reapers was supposed to be stopping the heat death of the universe. Every cycle was harvested for technology, genetic abnormalities etc. The whole of the Galaxy was a giant experiment to create a species capable of strong biotic potential. Once a species with strong enough biotics was recognized, the reapers would harvest them to build a new reaper. It was hoped they would eventually find enough technology and genetics to stop the expansion of the universe. This was the original idea for the trilogy. It was thrown out the window when Bioware changed creative directors. But the influence of this original plan can be clearly seen.
Can be seen...
ME1: Sovereign Simply says "we impose order on the Chaos of organic Evolution"
ME2: only Tali missions mention something
ME3 (without organic/synth): ehi, do you know that Every time you use Biotic charge you kill stars? How dare you
Dark Energy storyline was very interesting but they should have implied It more in previous games
@@Ale-dd3ek If you help the agent on Noveria, she reappears on Illium in ME2. If you help her again, you can sit down and have a little chat and she says she's going to start looking into dark energy and companies that are researching it because there's been a lot of hubbub going on around it.
Given how Liara's dad talks about other Asari I think we can safely assume they're humanoid.
Ya most likely it’s not true but a fun theory nonetheless haha, thanks so much for checking out multiple of my videos and supporting by the way!
I wouldn’t be surprised at all if Liara ended up a bloodsucking monster. I can’t stand her.
Lol would for sure add some character development 😂, thanks for supporting the channel!
Okay that made me laugh out loud 🤣
The scourge is dark energy and is stated multiple times in the game that it is a dark energy mine field
Exactly! So then that dark energy would tie into the originals and hopefully bring everything together. By the way thanks for watching and supporting the channel!
@@FranklyGaming ye i believe andromeda was goin to start the story of dark energy and how it is very dangerous for the universe not just the milky-way and Andromeda i just hope they make this a game that people will still want to play 20years later like the trilogy
@@FranklyGaming your point on the Asari might not be to far off been true either the Kett seemed to agree anyway they wanted to be able to do what the Asari do naturally instead of how they did it
10:04
I remember that in the James' one shot comic we actually saw a brand new alien many thought were the Raloi, they were avian and were covered head to toe in armor.
Only thing that stood out was that they had 4 arms, a detail never stated for them...
Ummm... The Indoctrination Theory was known WAY before a decade had passed after Mass Effect 3. It was proposed within months, if not weeks, of Mass Effect 3 release. It is, or at least should be, the REAL explanation of the ending of the game.
I like the juxtaposition at the end where we have the red and blue : It’s cool for me because we see a paragon (Anderson) doing a red, renegade action versus the Illusive Man doing a blue, paragon action where the Reapers still exist. Maybe the game gave us a subtle hint there. 🤷♂️
In retrospect, didn’t we see a form of synthesis already? Where the Illusive Man and Saren already were implanted with Reaper Tech. In a way, I think Synthesis punishes the player for their neutrality. The technology they were synthesized with (although in a very extreme way) dominated them. And in a way, it took away at least some of Saren and the Illusive Man’s free free will. And isn’t free will the essence of organic life?
You forgot Project Overlord with David
13:06 nearly killed me, you gotta say something before blasting people with images like that.
Destroy is the only ending that made sense the other 2 I figured were just last ditch attempts at indoctrination to save itself
Same here
Destroy is definitely the right decision from the get go the mission has always been to destroy the reapers. It's only the 3rd game our focus starts to waver and these new options pop up.
I totally see that side too I just find synthesis more “poetic” I guess. Either way thanks for taking the time to support my work!
@@FranklyGaming Yeah no hate man, I just don't agree lol
@@christopherwichman7968 ya and thanks for being cool about it good to have some level headed discussion haha
@@FranklyGaming Yeah plus isnt Destroy Genocide of the Geth, the Sentient Minds trapped inside the Reapers, and potentially even some organics due to normal technology also shutting down?
Honestly I think Me3 might have been better if all 3 Endings happened, but only to select areas of the Galaxy. That way, the consequences of all 3 can be explored in Mass Effect 4...
eh, considering Mass Effect Andromeda saying that the Geth are "hostile and isolationist" in their time, i doubt this will happen.
@@FranklyGaming if the reaper died in synthesis ending i think it make sense. Also Keeping the giant galactic murdering robot around would not be very popular or a good idea.
9:35 They can't be Protheans. Vigil said on Illos that the reapers jumped to the citadel from dark space, immediately destroyed their central government before they could react, and then swept up the remaining Protheans. Building an arc would require an astronomical effort and required a ton of resources and would have either been impossible due to their destroyed infrastructure, or the activity would have simply attracted the reapers.
People talk about how the dark matter ending would be better, but I think they are just looking at it through shit covered glasses. I think they are so focused on how bad the game's ending was they don't realize how unpalatable the original ending would be too. I think they tried to make a more digestible ending, hot take I think they succeeded even if I still hated the ending.
Just think about it. You may have gotten a rather lackluster Twilight Zone ending where you actions to said point didn't really count for shit, but imagine the outrage the original ending would have gotten where the options were let you entire fight have been pointless to counter productive by letting humanity die so the rest could live or let basically take everyone down a slow unavoidable demise, at least in the game ending they were all more or less "happier" endings
Synthesis might be the worst ending.
The worldbuilding is so good that you can create countless stories, conflicts, mysteries, unique characters, etc. It has so much potential. I hope we'll see more from this franchise.
The second playthrough I did of ME1, when I heard the Rachni talk of their "soured notes", I immediately knew it was the Repears, and have thought that ever since. In ME3, it was confirmed when the reapers clearly tried again with the rachni.
The Rachni also talked about "oily shadows" which greatly contributed to indoctrination theory
Synthesis has to be the most hideous choice out of them all. The player is choosing to alter the very essence of everyone in the galaxy without their say in the matter.
Control is naive at best, Starbrat says you can now control it and the reapers so you believe it, what could possibly go wrong eh?
Destroy is the only way because the rest of the sentient AIs fought tooth and nail to be independent, to be treated as equals to their creators and other organics, they rather die fighting to preserve that than be altered by synthesis.
Refuse ending is Bioware taking the piss out of the player base for the initial backlash.
It's rather telling to see the kind of mental gymnastics some go through to justify the abomination that is the synthesis choice. Bioware staff have admitted that no choice is ideal, pretty much highlighting whatever I've raised above, especially when it comes to synthesis.
"what if the catalyst and the reapers were the good guys" Sounds like someone has been indoctrinated........ 😂😂
The dark energy and mass drive/eezo connection with reapers doesn't make sense because in the first game sovereign explicitly states that the reapers let advancing races find the relays and the citadel knowing that they will eventually use the same technology, that, if we believe the theory the reapers were trying to stop, which for a basically eternal AI seems like quite a dumb logical mistake to make
What if the Mass Relays and the technology they intend for us to find is the most efficient and least damaging form that Mass Effect technology can take? Maybe there are other ways to use Mass Effect technology that damage the galaxy even faster. That way the technology the Reapers leave for everyone is just the best they can do while they find a solution. It still damages the galaxy, but it's better than letting civilisations run rampant with the technology and potentially develop even more harmful ways to use it.
@@sanguine7616 why not just destroy it all so that it takes thousands of years for us to figure out, surely then it would be better, or make the cycle shorter so that around the time we would start figuring it out they could stop us, there is just too many issues with this
@@sanyokS1 True, that is a fair point. Although, that would mean they'd have to keep a much closer eye on everyone. There would have to be Reapers monitoring every sapient species to watch and make sure they don't develop that tech. Plus they'd have to make sure they found and were aware of every single sapient species in the entire galaxy. That takes a lot more effort and man power and means less time trying to devise a solution. Lastly, trying to thoroughly destroy every last piece of Mass Effect tech to make sure no one would find it would be impossible, they'd constantly searching, which again, means less minds finding a solution.
Generally, I think you're right that there would be better solutions to this problem, but I don't think the Reaper's current plan is completely outside the realm of reason.
@@sanguine7616 i feel like, if even normal people like us are able to understand that there are better solutions, an ancient AI would definitely have figured something out much sooner, but i guess we'll have to see if they retcon something in the new instalment or just not mention this at all
@@sanyokS1 Yeah you're definitely right on that first part. I'm curious what the hell they'll do for the next game, seems like it'd be tough to follow up a trilogy with such a messy ending.
The First one, EDI said that she was in transition from VI to AI, she also mentioned that she was panicking
Well remember that you can complete the the citadel dlc at any point.
As for Asari 1 conversation between Liara and joker contradicts the pov asari theory because Asari would have to know exactly each species sees them when Joker asks Liara if she can move her tendrals....she would need to know exactly what each person not each species perceives them....after everyone sees beauty differently.
Also the cromagnon red light thing isn't the reapers, its just protheans. Why would the reapers come, take the data recorder out, and drop it off at a prothean site? That just doesn't make sense. The text box all but says it was the Protheans. The light was red in the beginning of the story too.
29:20 Are you serious? Destroying all organic life is NOT one of the options available to Shepard. You clearly didn't personally experience all the endings.
31:24 If that was the Catalyst's intention, then Synthesis would have been the first, primary choice offered to Shepard. Not the third alternative offered as an afterthought.
31:34 If it was a test, then Destroy is the wrong answer - one which Shepard shouldn't be allowed to make, since it results in the annihilation of the structure used to present the "test" in the first place.
36:06 "Destroying the Reapers accomplishes nothing" - Well, except that's Shepard's mission.
37:50 The Thorian is dead.
42:40 Any game that makes Shepard a villain, even an unintentional villain, will fail miserably.
the indoctrination theory was such an effective and natural way to explain all of the trilogy. It was so cool it could have even led to an awesome spinoff franchise. I remember being as outraged by the 3 colors ending as anyone else when a couple of days later this theory came out and everyone started hoping Bioware would produce a DLC that would use it.
They did not and many of us just decided that it would be how *we* interpret the saga.
Still today when I play it, I dive into this indoctrination theory "mood" 'till ep 3.
the rachni at some point actually say that their song was soured by the old machines which is basically 99.99 percent reapers for sure, i thought you were gonna say that keepers could have been created from rachni due to their abilities
Yeah, but that conversation was about Rachni wars, i've always seen it as Sovereign first attempt to retake control of citadel. Using Rachni as tools just as with the Geth
Wait wait wait. I thought the catalyst was like "the reapers did what they were supposed to do, but they did it in a way we didn't expect them to do it. So you have the choice to do it differently." They kind of dismissed the actions of the reapers as programming gone too extreme.
Maybe that's what they were trying to get across to that volus?
And after leviathan dlc came out, the orb on eletania looked like the orbs the leviathans used to control thralls. The reapers are the same shape as them, perhaps that is what the cro magnon previously saw, but the reapers came along later and got rid of them because of their connection to the leviathans.
I know the leviathan dlc was written later, but it's a neat way to tie it into the previous games.
Seeing how much the reapers wanted to destroy the old labs with leviathan thralls and how leviathan told us they were keeping an eye on civilizations in order to stay hidden, kind of fits with the sphere story on eletania. But why eletania? Shepard wondered about mars but they were standing on eletania. And why did an asari have this trinket that held a human data packet?
Was the asari a thrall for the leviathan at some point in her thousand year life span?
The leviathan had been watching since the reapers began and having a consort whose connections to many people, including political, as a thrall makes sense. The watch for those who might be indoctrinated or capable of serving the leviathans to keep them hidden.
I love the rachni and their story. It's very sad. I've done playthroughs where I've kept them alive and killed them off. The soured notes being from the reapers was my first thought, but again, being leviathan thralls makes some sense.
There were probably a reaper or two left behind like sovereign was, and affected the rachni but the indoctrination process didn't take as well as it should have because the rachni have their own organic psychic communication system. Same as the thorian. Or the rachni almost found a leviathan and went crazy from the mind control interference. Lol
I don't know. Lots of stuff in these games that make ya think. It's so great!
It's a good video! 👍 I've been a mass effect fan since the second game came out and have played the trilogy numerous times. I've explored the planets and read all I could read.
Also destroy ftw
I'd rather not have the Geth die, nor the Sentient minds trapped within the Reapers. Isnt that genocide?
No, the orb on Eletania couldn't be a Leviathan orb. The leviathans existed billions of years ago, and back then Earth couldn't support life like the kind today. Now you say, what if it was long after the Reapers were invented? Well why would the Leviathans leave their hiding place and go to some random planet and study the primitive people there? Surely if they were going to study a species they'd do it to one that is advanced and aren't some barely human monkeys using stone tipped spears. Besides the Prothean orb on Eletania is way too big to be a Leviathan orb and doesn't look the same other than it just being an orb. Also a BioWare employee confirmed that it was Nazara (Sovereign) that indoctrinated the Rachni. Not the Leviathans. This is also inferred in game as the Rachni presence is labeled as irrelevant.
the Catalyst tells you that it IS a Reaper the First reaper created by the leviathans to solve the Organic vs Machines and it Solutions was the cycle and creating More reapers.
it still Considers the cycle Necessary however since Shepard has gotten so far it giving him a choice to create something new, that could however just be Complete Bullshit to trick Shepard into doing what it wants tho.
@@jakespacepiratee3740 yea the people used in creating a reaper never had a choice and choosing Control/Synthesis is basically siding with the reapers.
@@CommanderM117 How is Synthesis siding with the Reapers when you are reprogramming them? and in Control you are straight-up mind-controlling them.
Synthesis is NOT the best ending, wtf are you talking about? Why is there always this damn concept??
All this pro-synthesis talk trying to turn everybody into husks.
Sir, you sound Indoctrinated.
:P
I liked the blue ending most. Not because I want to control the reapers but rather cause of what might be possible. In the blue ending Shepard's emotions and memories becomes the prime directive for the reapers and they leave the invasion to help repair what was destroyed. But if shepard is the new master AI in a sense, doesn't that make it possible for them to order the reapers to create a new synthetic body which Shepard can then upload their mind into, like EDI. This makes it possible for them to be with their friends and such again AND keep peace between synthetics and biological beings. I mostly thought like this cause I romanced Liara and imagine having to spend her next 900 having to cope with shepard's death and subsequintly having to take care of the normandy crew and whatever conflict happens next. Also if she doesn't get together with anyone else that means she is slowly gonna watch her friends die out as she at the end is alone, maybe synth-Shep can help her for a bit.
Ya that’s possible for sure I guess I just find synthesis more poetic cause Shepard being a dictator is just as bad as saren etc even if we like him it goes against principle, synthesis breaks the cycle
@@FranklyGaming I won't deny that I did get a few tears when Liara hugged EDI in Synthesis ending
Edit: I did like the synthesis ending quite a bit, infact if not for how I worried about Liara's future as mentioned I would have chosen synthesis over the others but simply because of Liara and the fact I romanced her in my current playthrough I had to choose it. Am planning on doing a Tali romance run and then the go to ending is without a doubt the synthesis ending so there can be lasting peace between the geth and quarians
@@thyrlindberg9310 haha glad you liked something in it, thanks so much for supporting my channel!
@@FranklyGaming Why do you think Shepard would necessarily be a dictator? The entire point of the morality system throughout the games is that your choices matter and reinforce themselves (the more Paragon choices you make, the more difficult Paragon choices you can make).
My personal canon is the Paragon Control ending. Conflict is the natural state of the universe, but neither cycles of violence (Destroy) nor eliminating individuality by the means of a non-consensual melding of identities (Synthesis) are satisfactory answers. Only love, the struggle to empathise and comprehend, and diplomacy are definite answers. All the love and care the companions had for Shepard, all that was demonstrated through the games and the Citadel DLC turned her into the best individual to reconfigure the Catalyst. In a way, the Paragon Control ending parallels EDI's conversation in which she states that due to Shepard's influence she'll reconfigure her core functionality from self-preservation to caring and love.
Paragon Control Shep isn't a dictator. She's the most powerful instance of Life's love by and for itself
@@gabrielsb3419 Yeah, full Paragon Shepard and the Control ending are my personal canon, too.
I never realized it could have been a Reaper that went to Earth and killed the primate man, I just assumed it was the Protheans cleaning up, but a Reaper makes sense too.
Ya I actually realized the same thing reading it over for the video, thanks for supporting the channel!
The leviathan dlc tells you what it was if you ask the right questions.
@@brittanyfalk3590 what???
Its such a huge shame that a leak about the dark matter storyline caused them to stop that storyline in favor of the one we got in ME3.
"We endure"
*Red Explosion*
"Nevermind"
Destroy Ending makes perfect sense and you saying it doesn't is simply your opinion.
I am 100% sure that anyone who says green is the good ending has been totally indoctrinated. Notice how the kid says he is the reapers. Tells you how bad destroying them would be. Talks about how synthesis is so cool and puts it front and center despite it being exactly what we were fighting against:
In mass effect 2 we realize that the reapers want to model humans into the next reaper as a synth/organic hybrid. The green option is basically them trying to persuade you to become reapers after failing to force it throughout the game