Amazing documentary on the underappreciated Atari 7800. Great job! Robotron 2084 does however support twin stick control. You can get a arcade twin stick controller on atariage for it. Such a great console for arcade style gameplay when you realize it's two systems in one. So much potential still for this system.
Nice video. A couple of comments. Robotron can be played with two joysticks on the 7800. You just have to plug them both and the system will recognize them for dual control. There are other alternatives nowadays to make it easier as there is no holder for the 7800 joysticks. As for Commando, yes it is one of the two titles that use POKEY from the original game library.
I remember my Dad and I were out at a Toys R Us one day. I was around 18-19 and they had the 7800 on sale. For some odd reason, he bought it? As a kid I had the 2600, and later a 5200. Now I don't remember if Pole Position was a pack-in game or ?? But he had that one game for sure. You probably said which game was included but I jumped the comments before the video......sorry.
Yes the 7800 went with the TIA for sound and it was never clear if it was down to maintaining backwards compatibility or if they ran out of time or motherboard space. But GCC was working on a sound chip called the mini that would be comparable to their competition and it added less than five dollars to the cartridge cost. More can be learned from Steve Golsons speaking events on RUclips or AtariAge. It was dropped when Jack Tramiel took over like many other projects were.
As far as racing games go, there's also Motorpsycho, which is essentially Pole Position but with a motorcycle and the ability to jump. It's a really rare one - I've had my 7800 since 1987 and I have most of the library, and yet I've never seen a copy of Motorpsycho outside of a retro gaming convention. Fatal Run is sort of a racing game, but you also have to contend with other vehicles trying to ram you off the road. It's post-apocalyptic so you get machine guns and armor along with whatever you can afford to equip your car with at each town you stop at. It has a nice little ending, too. One of my 7800 favorites. As far as recommendations go, the late releases near the end of the machine's life tend to be good (well, maybe with the exception of Jinks which is only 'meh'). My absolute favorite is Midnight Mutants. Take the gameplay of Adventure on the 2600, make it isometric, add a very large map, throw in some really large bosses, and the weirdest licensing tie-in possible that does absolutely nothing for the game other that give it another layer of strangeness. It's pretty satisfying to defeat, even though the ending isn't exactly too impressive.
I recommend getting a Seagull 78 Genesis controller adapter. I use it with a Quickshot Conqueror 3 and it feels fantastic. Microswitches make Atari games feel superb.
Motor Psycho was a motorcycle racing game for the 7800. It’s not bad, and while it looks like it’s just Pole Position with a motorcycle, there are some subtle differences making it worth checking out.
It's reported that when Jack Tramiel took over Atari had already manufactured thousands of 7800's and were ready to go. When that was brought up in a meeting Tramiel pounded on the table and shouted, "We're a computer company now!" But once the NES hit it big, he wanted a way to dump all the old 7800 systems, so I question if any new manufacturing was done after he arrived. And by now you know there are two other racing games for the 7800, Motor Psycho and Fatal Run. Also there is at least one flash cart (Cuttle Cart 2) and it includes the High Score cart features. (The CC2 is amazing BTW.)
Heard that 7800 games could be played on an Atari 800, after you somehow get the code out of the 7800 cart and onto a floppy you could then run on the Atari 800.
I actually like the Atari Thrust song better as a piece of music. Also, the song cutting off when you went from the demo to game play was actually what happened when you dropped a quarter into a standup arcade game back in the dawn of video arcades. Aaaah, the golden Age of arcades! It was a different world, a whole new world, and a better one, to replace the defective one that we'd been given by fate or history.
Fantastic coverage of the system. It is one of my favorites. Honestly saying the audio is the same as the 2600 is just not quite accurate. In 7800 mode the system has 100% access to the TIA as it does not need to use it for graphics - so the Audio can be much, much better. Of course it would be better with a Pokey... But compare Ms Pac Man on the 2600 and 7800. And Dig Dug audio compared to the 2600 version. It is massively better, because it has exclusive access to the TIA chip.
If you ever find yourself in DePere, Wisconsin, there is a little store there with lots of different 7800 games for sale. Well, "lots" compared to other retro games stores I have been to. You don't find many 7800 games in the wild.
This was a good review. It would be even better if when mentionig games that are arcade ports, you could show us both the 7800 footage and the arcade footage, so we can see how it differs, or how the sounds are different.
@@SupremeNerd Yes I could, I could even go watch other Atari game console reviews, or I even could by the arcade cabinet and the game console and compare them myself. But my point was, that I liked this particular review/reviewer and it would be EVEN BETTER if there was more game footage. Thanks for the alternative 2 years after the fact.
@@mateuszkwietowicz2470 yeah you can do that....and you're welcome and recognize that Just because you put a comment up 2 years ago doesnt mean anything
If you haven't played Rikki and Vikki it's a pretty decent homebrew for the 7800 with really good graphics and it's own sound chip. I think the lack of mapper chips really hurt the quality of games. It had a lot of potential that was never tapped.
I had two of those nes like Atari controllers, when I was a kid. There probably been at the bottom of a landfill since about 1990 just goes to show, don't throw anything gaming away.
11:46 I like the Atari version better for some reason. I actually enjoy the quiet nature of the original Atari. It is just you and the sound effects. That system was so awesome... I wonder if my parents still have the one I played as a kid and if it works.
Myron Gaines: 1. Controllers horrid - correct 2. No third party support - correct 3. Hardware outdated - incorrect The NES console hardware was not superior to the 7800’s(with the exception of actually possessing a sound chip 😫). The NES added “chips” to their game cartridges, as desired, to boost game quality. The 7800 can move 75 to 100 sprites around the screen, at the same time. The NES can’t come close. Final note: The NES was backed in every way to succeed. The 7800 - not even close!
@@myrongaines5542 Hmm, I somehow loved the original joysticks - I used one with my Atari 800 XL, and believe it or not, it worked fine up until the last day I used my Atari. With the exception of the (left) fire button, where I had to change the original plate-operated switch to a not-so-comfy micro-switch. In fact, I broke multiple SideWinder and other ones, and not out of anger of not being satisfied with them - they just lasted a year or so (each) and then required a comprehensive fix or a replacement. So for me the original Atari ProSystem joystick was (and still would be) THE controller of choice.
You got a sub here lots of information I picked up a lot of 7800 games for cheap and I wanna add the system to my collection.I think it will be fun collecting for this system and playing the games I missed out on.
Thanks Eskimo Joe, I appreciate that! Many of the Atari 7800 games are cheap and fun to collect. I also enjoy that it can play the old Atari 2600 games as well. This makes it my go-to for playing Atari games. Have fun with your collecting.
Hind sight being 20/20, three things that would have made this console MUCH more competitive: 1. Ditch the original sound chip, they should have gone with the 4 channel pokey. 2. Abandon backwards compatibility, perhaps produce an adapter cart later if there is demand. 3. Ditch the joystick style controller in favor of the D pad style. Bonus 4: be less of an arcade replacement and adopt more immersive gameplay (like Zelda or Sonic)
The mistake of the Atari 7800 was its late release and the use of the 2600 sound chip to make it backwards compatible. Leaving the 7800 games with that 2600 air in the sound, graphically being almost an NES. Atari and its mistakes, incidentally, its owners mistakes their root with the company.
God what a flashback I loved the 7800 I had that the 2600 given to me on my 6th birthday along with ET and Super Breakout I did not go to school the next morning I was up all night playing ET mesmerized lol and eventually had the 5200 out of the 3 i have to say the 7800 was my favorite
Great video! I miss the good ol' days of the console wars, with lots of companies creating hardware and a variety of microcomputers facing off. Never owned a 7800 but did own an NES and Master system. I've played a lot of 7800 titles via emulation and while it's a different experience, the library has quite a few gems in it that are still fun today. Dark Chambers is one of my personal favorites.
It's no surprise that Donkey Kong on the 7800 looks amazing. If the 7800 was launched to supplant the Colecovision, than they would know that Donkey Kong on Colecovision was a major selling feature to contend with.
I had a 7800 while growing up, and I remember the colours being much more vivid. They were not dull or faded. Also, the only way to use those controllers were to lay them on the floor for support. Holding it with your hand was just terrible.
Those tech 2600/7800 demos are eye opening and really demonstrate what can be achievable. Oh my that original 7800 controller is actually painful to use. I have a pair of the 7800 control pads you show that I believe were released in Europe/UK and are so much better!
I love your videos. It’s a crime you don’t have a million followers (yet). Also it might sound ageist but I don’t care to watch these teenagers talking about retro games. I’d much rather watch and listen to someone my own age. Keep up the excellent work, you’re by far my favorite retro game youtuber
Being a child of the 80’s I enjoy watching all of the reviews of the different consoles and video games from the late 70’s and 80’s. One common thread I’ve noticed is that the RUclips channels that do these reviews rarely if ever talk about sports titles. Why is that? Even when they’re reviewing consoles and games of this era they never spend much time at all talking about the sports genres.
Jason Cutsforth For one thing, most sports titles are only fun if you’re playing in two player mode, and most retro game reviewers are not sitting around with a bunch of buddies that can play head-to-head like they would’ve been back when they were kids.....I think this goes for sports games and for any head-to-head battle type games
Originally, sound was supposed to be incorporated into the Maria Chip design. GCC states they ran out of time, so they opted for a sound chip on each game cartridge board. They attempted to produce their own low cost/high performance sound chip. Unfortunately, Atari sold in July '84 and the "Mini Gumby" sound chip never came to fruition.
Akari on Atari.... Yeah because we couldn't afford a Nintendo and we had this store called Ames that was going out of business we ended up getting one for Christmas and of course all the 7800 games were cheap and then several years later I was able to get a bunch of these games from big lots for next to nothing.
What's crazy is that there is for Android an updated 3D version of ninja golf.. I don't know if iOS has it. But it takes the concept of ninja golf from the 7800 and puts it in a modern 3D golf game. they've added more features too like you have to collect coins to buy upgrades and stuff but it's a worthy sequel I feel
If you liked arcade games 7800 had some really good ports of what we're even older games back then. Many of them improvements over the home computer versions. It didn't get a whole lot better than that making it difficult to complete with it's rivals. Being a fan of the really good arcade ports because of memories of Chuck E Cheese and playing arcades at the store, malls, and gas stations I think 7800 is a really cool system. It made some of the older titles cool again and gave us some of the better versions also. I liked how they still used a stick also. I was never a fan of gamepads.
I never owned one back in the day. A few years back, though, I played 7800 Asteroids at a Retrogaming Convention and had to add a 7800 to my collection. I bought a Composite-modded unit off EBAY, and have feasted on both classic carts and AtariAge home brews ever since. The 7800 beat the NES on the most meaningful point there is. Namely, it had “real” controllers, and you never had to blow on the carts to make them work. Mario was over-rated.
I use a Genesis pad and the Seagull78 adapter. The adapter is only needed for the 2 button games, all 1 button games work with the Genesis controllers right away. Same with 2600. I've never been a big fan of the joystick controllers, so this is a major plus for me.
“ If you do successfully make it to the top of the tower, you are rewarded with a bonus level where you shoot some fish. “ - Player One Start ...also, this might be the MOST video game thing I’ve ever heard. :)
I know this vid is a couple years old, but I feel the need to comment anyway haha. Loved my 7800, so many good games, with amazing at the time graphics. I played mine to death haha. Love your vid!
Thanks great video well presented, I never had this console but did have an Atari 400 then 800 then 130XE was a serious enthusiast back in the day! Did Lucasfilm port all 4 titles to the 7800 as rescue on Fractalus was a classic
They didn't; the remaining three - Rescue on Fractalus, Koronis Rift and Eidolon - were released for home computers only, as far as I know. And I still clearly remember C64 and SInclair guys (my classmates at the time) shitting their pants in envy, when I was showing them these three hand in hand with Ballblazer. E.g. the C64 version of Eidolon was much slower, and by that I mean by some 30%, making it frustrating to play. BTW I had an Atari 800 XL, later upgraded with 256 kB (for a total of 320 kB), QMeg OS and TT-DOS - all modded / build in and switcheable on the go - which made my Atari extra powerful and usable for almost all tasks (I mean productivity apps here) just fine well past the 8-bit days of computing. If I recall correctly, I gave it up only around '96 / '97 in favour of an IBM PC clone; and yeah, I still miss the old days in some ways.. ;-)
3 games off the top of my head that sound great on the 2600 are Pac-Man 8k, the currently WIP of Galaga, and mappy. The 2600 can produce appealing sounds if they are done right, not everyone can make the 2600 sing.
The 2600 sound chip is literally missing notes. It CAN'T produce necessary pitches to complete a music scale. Additionally, it can only produce two sounds at once. Pacman 8K does an excellent job working around this, as only a couple notes are off key, and only two voices are needed (siren and eating sound) at a time. Some notes are substituted with noise, like the music in Mr. Do's Castle. Galaga, Mappy, and Pitfall II use additional chips on three cartridge. In these cases, the TIA is only handling basic sound effects.
I remember some warehouse in the late 90s having a really basic website (I feel like it had an Irish name?) but they had new shrinkwrapped Atari 7800 games they were selling for just something like 75 cents each. I got one of each (maybe 20 or so games) that they had but then threw the boxes away.
Corby Ziesman Wow, that is insane. Crazy to think that wouldn’t happen today. Don’t feel bad about the boxes, we all did it back then. Thanks for sharing.
naah it was only slighty better. The colecovision and the 5200 were actually sooo much better minus the controller which Ive never had a problem with but Ive noticed the retrogamer community has.
I LOVED digdug,didn't realize what I had with my 7800. I just sold it like 3 years ago when I was string out for 15 bux and had about 15 games and 4 controls. Kinda regret it now
It's awesome seeing a 7800 review. Not something you see all the time. Technically these three systems were the 8 bit war, but you had a lot of crossover with the 16 bit PC Engine starting to beat the Famicom in Japan, and then had the 16 bit Genesis/Mega Drive (I can never get used to saying Mega Drive, it's always a Genesis to me) released, which they damn well let you know with 16 BIT written in Gold or Silver on the console. But the way I look at it is, the 16 bit generation/war didn't start until Nintendo said so, with the release of their Super Famicom/SNES. Another great video though, I'm really enjoying all of these, and looking forward to the 8 Bit war where it looks like you have some comparisons and what not.
It's kind of sad that Atari went from being kings of the industry with the 2600, to this 7800 that quite frankly, especially back in the day, was just like a 5200 with a working controller. They then overcompensated and thought they could do a 64 bit system with the Jaguar, and the even more disappointing CD add-on (and yes I'm a degenerate and own one). As much of a bomb that the Jaguar was, it was pretty much due to the two different CPUs, Tom and Jerry, each with 32 bit capability, being notoriously difficult to program for, so unfortunately no developers took full advantage of their full capabilities, leading to games looking not much different then games that could run on the SNES. At the same time though, Wolfenstein, Doom and Alien vs. Predator, are pretty solid titles, and I play them on the Jaguar from time to time. The big knock on Doom is that there's no music, but other than that it's pretty much a near perfect port, so if you want to play Doom at home, playing it on the Jaguar, while admittedly getting used to the gigantor controller, is the way to go. Just play some music while playing, maybe Metallica or System of a Down in my case, as I feel it suits the game, but people into some more heavy stuff might want to play something like Slayer in the background, but that's just always been a little to heavy for my taste.
in an alternate universe, the Master System, 7800, and NES were all on equal footing in the market, allowing for the 7800 to live on longer with more original games. And in another universe we got the Atari Entertainment System instead. I feel that the system didn't get a chance to truly shine as a great step forward from the 2600 and a revision of the 5200. The homebrew for the 7800 is fantastic as well and I hope to see more of it.
Mario Bros. came out on the 2600 before the NES even existed! Now there's a shocker! Speaking of which, when you say you don't enjoy this game, you may consider trying out the 2600 version if you have not done so. It's actually quite fun! The gameplay is very smooth and streamlined, unlike more authentic versions of the game.
I really think the 5200's lack of backwards compatibility as a complaint is ultimately bogus, not that people didn't say that but rather that there was no basis of comparison to expect it really. Did 8-tracks fit into cassette decks no, did Beta tapes or LDs work in your VHS player no, did most computer software work on newer models from the same company no. Easiest solution for bitd, power strip and AV switch box by Atari, keep both consoles hooked up ijs. Unmodified 7800 design pretty much tells the whole story, seemed like no matter who was in charge this was the typical stance, why we never saw a second joystick design for most of the Atari consoles like the 5200 for example lol. Just baffling how the EU got gamepads and NA didn't when you consider how much more popular the NES was in NA who they were competing with and that the EU heavily used home style joysticks across the board for all their computer platforms and how unpopular the NES was there. O_o??? Kind of seems like a dick move pushing increased RAM onto the cart or developer side rather than just matching the system memory of the previous 5200. Same with the POKEY aspect, you can put thousands to millions of chips into the carts but you can't put one into the console, we need a cart pass-through adapter to fix the 7800 sound for good. I forgive the RF given the time, didn't use Composite on NES till post Y2K era, but Jaguar with RF oof that was bad heh. That aside the graphic chip Maria is pretty good which homebrew developers have shown off and being able to play on 2600 games on it with no fuss is excellent. :D Don't like that style of joystick at all but the 7800 is the most comfortable one imo. I know it was a cost matter but really a high score saving option was really something that should have been there through that whole era of home gaming. No brainer accessory by 1980 minimum. Funny enough in my area I just can't find many original 7800 carts that I might as well get some new homebrew from AtariAge. ;)
Built for fixed screen arcade games which it does best. If it had composite and POKEY on board it would have aged better. Not sure it was fit for modern games with scrolling which will be slow with no hardware support. 7800 Asteroids is superb - best home port ever.
The 7800’s initial release was delayed for several years due to legal issues & mgmt turnover, allowing competitors to catch up graphics-wise. Ultimately it was released with a sound chip designed exclusively for 2600 compatibility, which is why almost all the games sound terrible....plus the controllers were uncomfortable and awkward.
Patsfan 4life GCC the designers of the console were never paid by Warner so they still held the rights to it when Atari Corp was formed. It took two years of legal wrangling between GCC, Atari Corp and Warner before it could be released.
For accessories you could mention the roller controller (i.e., the track ball controller). It was the only way to beat or break 1000000 points for the games xvious and Solaris, at least for me.
You never played Dig Dug or Joust before you started collecting? They were extremely common in the arcades here in the UK. On the other hand, Food Fight was very, very, VERY rare here, so much so that I only found it in one arcade. Again, like Congo Bongo, it was in an arcade in Weymouth. It's a personal favourite of mine, and occupies a place in my Top 5 classic arcade games.
I don't remember ever seeing one of these in any of the stores, although when it came out I was either knee-deep in my first Amiga or still hanging on with my C64. Seems like a fairly capable system and many of the arcade ports are quite good!
Hills Dept Store. TOYS R US, and Kay Bee Toys were the places to get Atari post crash oh yeah Sears catalogs in the early 90s may bee liquidators and big lots cleared them out, at 3 to 4 bucks a game and 30 bucks a system
@@petewillson205 I remember the Toys R Us near me had a huge bin when you first walked into the store that had hundreds and hundreds of various cartridges (no boxes) for $3 to $5 each. They were also selling the Coleco Adam Computer System for less than $100. I didn't have much money as a kid, but years later I bought a Vectrex at Service Merchandise (remember those?) for $49 plus tons of games for only $8 each.
Good review. I do enjoy your review. The Nintendo games, Donkey Kong, DK Jr., and Mario Bros, are not arcade accurate at all. They match the NES version more closely, which missed a LOT of arcade nuances. These nuances were not minor either. Scoring, collision detection, enemy movements, and other aspects were all different from the arcade. It's even missing an entire screen on DK. I appreciate preserving the proper enemy names in DK Jr., as many would just call the nitpickers, "birds." I do wish the original Ms Pac-Man names were also used: dots, energizers, and monsters. These were the arcade terminologies. Another cool note is that the 7800 Maria chip was engineered by the company (GCC) that actually created Ms Pac-Man (or Crazy Otto). They were also the programmers of the 7800 version of Ms Pac-Man. With that said, the monster logic is still not arcade accurate. It's just kind of cool. Thanks for your entertaining reviews. I enjoy the insight you offer to the time and context of the competition.
Grrrreat video, i saw an hour play time and was thinking hell no, watched the whole thing. New sub to your channel, keep it up. Excited to see the comparison to the SMS and NES.
I am so curious about this console... I loved my 2600 growing up, and this just feels like that, but better. The homebrew scene on it is interesting, and I feel it's a console that I will get into if the price is right, especially as it can play my 2600 library too... Also, it can be modded not only for composite, but also S-Video (a mod I already did on my 2600jr, amd was SOOOOO worth it!!), but I remember reading it can be modded for RGB, which being in Europe is something I can take full advantage of thanks to the SCART standard. Definitely keeping my eyes open. Great video!!
The Robotron: 2084 two controller matter is better these days with the advent of 3D printers as more cradle brackets can be produced worldwide rather than the DIY tape and block of wood option lol.
I added composite several years ago...it is an easy upgrade when following instructions and I am not good at soldering. I bought one of these in later 80s and thought it was a great machine and still do. The European version controller pad kicks on the North American joystick.
I added composite to mine too...it was too bad that Jack really had little cash for extra RND for this beast and he wanted to keep cartridges as small as possible, so games were skimpier and less detailed than what this console could output. I wish the European controller was released in North America for this machine. It is too bad that they released a sound chip that was released originally in 1977.
This may come as a surprise...the Atari 7800 and NES hardware are evenly matched. Both possess their strengths and weaknesses. The “Power” of the NES, comes from the extra “chips”, added to games, to boost performance. Another huge factor - the NES was fully funded and supported, by Nintendo, in every way. Sounds obvious, right? This is in stark contrast, to how Atari(Corp.) handled the 7800.
I still have my 7800 from when I was a kid. Underrated system as was the jaguar. I really enjoyed both.
Amazing documentary on the underappreciated Atari 7800. Great job! Robotron 2084 does however support twin stick control. You can get a arcade twin stick controller on atariage for it. Such a great console for arcade style gameplay when you realize it's two systems in one. So much potential still for this system.
I came to the comments to say this!
Nice video. A couple of comments. Robotron can be played with two joysticks on the 7800. You just have to plug them both and the system will recognize them for dual control. There are other alternatives nowadays to make it easier as there is no holder for the 7800 joysticks. As for Commando, yes it is one of the two titles that use POKEY from the original game library.
In Robotron 2084 you can use two controllers to play the game on the 7800. It controls very well actually.
Good video. I just started collecting all things Atari, so this was extremely useful
What a wealth of great retro info! I just got a 7800 to experience this underrated blast from the past.
I remember my Dad and I were out at a Toys R Us one day. I was around 18-19 and they had the 7800 on sale. For some odd reason, he bought it? As a kid I had the 2600, and later a 5200. Now I don't remember if Pole Position was a pack-in game or ?? But he had that one game for sure. You probably said which game was included but I jumped the comments before the video......sorry.
Thank you for presenting Atari 7800
Really enjoying your channel so far,being a video game nut for most of my 47 years you offer great information on my favorite hobby.
When we get to our age we will be lucky to live to see the next gen consoles in 2020. Old age sucks ass.
@@barriewilson3052 well maybe not now cause of the beer virus
I hope your channel blows up with subscribers your content is just as good as the likes of the gaming historian
Yes the 7800 went with the TIA for sound and it was never clear if it was down to maintaining backwards compatibility or if they ran out of time or motherboard space. But GCC was working on a sound chip called the mini that would be comparable to their competition and it added less than five dollars to the cartridge cost. More can be learned from Steve Golsons speaking events on RUclips or AtariAge. It was dropped when Jack Tramiel took over like many other projects were.
As far as racing games go, there's also Motorpsycho, which is essentially Pole Position but with a motorcycle and the ability to jump. It's a really rare one - I've had my 7800 since 1987 and I have most of the library, and yet I've never seen a copy of Motorpsycho outside of a retro gaming convention.
Fatal Run is sort of a racing game, but you also have to contend with other vehicles trying to ram you off the road. It's post-apocalyptic so you get machine guns and armor along with whatever you can afford to equip your car with at each town you stop at. It has a nice little ending, too. One of my 7800 favorites.
As far as recommendations go, the late releases near the end of the machine's life tend to be good (well, maybe with the exception of Jinks which is only 'meh'). My absolute favorite is Midnight Mutants. Take the gameplay of Adventure on the 2600, make it isometric, add a very large map, throw in some really large bosses, and the weirdest licensing tie-in possible that does absolutely nothing for the game other that give it another layer of strangeness. It's pretty satisfying to defeat, even though the ending isn't exactly too impressive.
I recommend getting a Seagull 78 Genesis controller adapter. I use it with a Quickshot Conqueror 3 and it feels fantastic. Microswitches make Atari games feel superb.
Motor Psycho was a motorcycle racing game for the 7800. It’s not bad, and while it looks like it’s just Pole Position with a motorcycle, there are some subtle differences making it worth checking out.
It's reported that when Jack Tramiel took over Atari had already manufactured thousands of 7800's and were ready to go. When that was brought up in a meeting Tramiel pounded on the table and shouted, "We're a computer company now!" But once the NES hit it big, he wanted a way to dump all the old 7800 systems, so I question if any new manufacturing was done after he arrived. And by now you know there are two other racing games for the 7800, Motor Psycho and Fatal Run. Also there is at least one flash cart (Cuttle Cart 2) and it includes the High Score cart features. (The CC2 is amazing BTW.)
Heard that 7800 games could be played on an Atari 800, after you somehow get the code out of the 7800 cart and onto a floppy you could then run on the Atari 800.
I actually like the Atari Thrust song better as a piece of music. Also, the song cutting off when you went from the demo to game play was actually what happened when you dropped a quarter into a standup arcade game back in the dawn of video arcades. Aaaah, the golden Age of arcades! It was a different world, a whole new world, and a better one, to replace the defective one that we'd been given by fate or history.
Fantastic coverage of the system. It is one of my favorites. Honestly saying the audio is the same as the 2600 is just not quite accurate. In 7800 mode the system has 100% access to the TIA as it does not need to use it for graphics - so the Audio can be much, much better. Of course it would be better with a Pokey... But compare Ms Pac Man on the 2600 and 7800. And Dig Dug audio compared to the 2600 version. It is massively better, because it has exclusive access to the TIA chip.
If you ever find yourself in DePere, Wisconsin, there is a little store there with lots of different 7800 games for sale. Well, "lots" compared to other retro games stores I have been to. You don't find many 7800 games in the wild.
This was a good review. It would be even better if when mentionig games that are arcade ports, you could show us both the 7800 footage and the arcade footage, so we can see how it differs, or how the sounds are different.
or you could look up both and compare them yourself as those are readily available here on youtube
@@SupremeNerd Yes I could, I could even go watch other Atari game console reviews, or I even could by the arcade cabinet and the game console and compare them myself. But my point was, that I liked this particular review/reviewer and it would be EVEN BETTER if there was more game footage. Thanks for the alternative 2 years after the fact.
@@mateuszkwietowicz2470 😭Wow would you like a towel?😭
😭💦💧💦💧💦😭💧💦💧💦💧🤧💦💧💦💧💦😭
@@EdsterIII Why would I need a towel? Is it because you are crying so much that it splatters on me?
@@mateuszkwietowicz2470 yeah you can do that....and you're welcome and recognize that Just because you put a comment up 2 years ago doesnt mean anything
Another very informative and entertaining comprehensive history lesson of a truly classic system. Thanks for making this.
Pole position ii was close to the arcade game. Loved mount Fugi scrolling in the background on one of the boards.
If you haven't played Rikki and Vikki it's a pretty decent homebrew for the 7800 with really good graphics and it's own sound chip. I think the lack of mapper chips really hurt the quality of games. It had a lot of potential that was never tapped.
I had two of those nes like Atari controllers, when I was a kid. There probably been at the bottom of a landfill since about 1990 just goes to show, don't throw anything gaming away.
Very relatable! I think we've all thrown away something that we now regret.
11:46 I like the Atari version better for some reason. I actually enjoy the quiet nature of the original Atari. It is just you and the sound effects. That system was so awesome... I wonder if my parents still have the one I played as a kid and if it works.
Had Atari not been in a financial mess, and got this console out on time, I think it could have competed much better.
Even if they did, the controllers were horrid, hardware outdated and no 3rd party support. Nintendo was superior on another level.
Myron Gaines:
1. Controllers horrid - correct
2. No third party support - correct
3. Hardware outdated - incorrect
The NES console hardware was not superior to the 7800’s(with the exception of actually possessing a sound chip 😫). The NES added “chips” to their game cartridges, as desired, to boost game quality.
The 7800 can move 75 to 100 sprites around the screen, at the same time. The NES can’t come close.
Final note: The NES was backed in every way to succeed. The 7800 - not even close!
@@myrongaines5542 Hmm, I somehow loved the original joysticks - I used one with my Atari 800 XL, and believe it or not, it worked fine up until the last day I used my Atari. With the exception of the (left) fire button, where I had to change the original plate-operated switch to a not-so-comfy micro-switch. In fact, I broke multiple SideWinder and other ones, and not out of anger of not being satisfied with them - they just lasted a year or so (each) and then required a comprehensive fix or a replacement. So for me the original Atari ProSystem joystick was (and still would be) THE controller of choice.
I doubt it, since it was so inferior to both the master system and nes, there was just no reason to buy it unless you really wanted to play 2600 games
Yep, agree the tarmels were never going to add chips to their games, so nes would always look a generation ahead.
You got a sub here lots of information I picked up a lot of 7800 games for cheap and I wanna add the system to my collection.I think it will be fun collecting for this system and playing the games I missed out on.
Thanks Eskimo Joe, I appreciate that! Many of the Atari 7800 games are cheap and fun to collect. I also enjoy that it can play the old Atari 2600 games as well. This makes it my go-to for playing Atari games. Have fun with your collecting.
I lived in LA at the time and remember a friend on my street having a 7800 in 84
Hind sight being 20/20, three things that would have made this console MUCH more competitive:
1. Ditch the original sound chip, they should have gone with the 4 channel pokey.
2. Abandon backwards compatibility, perhaps produce an adapter cart later if there is demand.
3. Ditch the joystick style controller in favor of the D pad style.
Bonus 4: be less of an arcade replacement and adopt more immersive gameplay (like Zelda or Sonic)
Had the one w/ Pole Position II pack in. Def ended up super jelly of my friends with Nintendos.
The mistake of the Atari 7800 was its late release and the use of the 2600 sound chip to make it backwards compatible. Leaving the 7800 games with that 2600 air in the sound, graphically being almost an NES. Atari and its mistakes, incidentally, its owners mistakes their root with the company.
1984 units had laserdisc add on slot ! Props to ninja golf ⛳
Had it and loved it.
God what a flashback I loved the 7800 I had that the 2600 given to me on my 6th birthday along with ET and Super Breakout I did not go to school the next morning I was up all night playing ET mesmerized lol and eventually had the 5200 out of the 3 i have to say the 7800 was my favorite
Great video! I miss the good ol' days of the console wars, with lots of companies creating hardware and a variety of microcomputers facing off.
Never owned a 7800 but did own an NES and Master system. I've played a lot of 7800 titles via emulation and while it's a different experience, the library has quite a few gems in it that are still fun today. Dark Chambers is one of my personal favorites.
Couldn't agree more! Thanks for watching! :)
Dude, this is top tier information and effort. I love it.
It's no surprise that Donkey Kong on the 7800 looks amazing. If the 7800 was launched to supplant the Colecovision, than they would know that Donkey Kong on Colecovision was a major selling feature to contend with.
I had a 7800 while growing up, and I remember the colours being much more vivid. They were not dull or faded. Also, the only way to use those controllers were to lay them on the floor for support. Holding it with your hand was just terrible.
Those tech 2600/7800 demos are eye opening and really demonstrate what can be achievable. Oh my that original 7800 controller is actually painful to use. I have a pair of the 7800 control pads you show that I believe were released in Europe/UK and are so much better!
I think I remember using both joysticks for Robotron on the Atary 7800
I love your videos. It’s a crime you don’t have a million followers (yet). Also it might sound ageist but I don’t care to watch these teenagers talking about retro games. I’d much rather watch and listen to someone my own age. Keep up the excellent work, you’re by far my favorite retro game youtuber
Being a child of the 80’s I enjoy watching all of the reviews of the different consoles and video games from the late 70’s and 80’s. One common thread I’ve noticed is that the RUclips channels that do these reviews rarely if ever talk about sports titles. Why is that? Even when they’re reviewing consoles and games of this era they never spend much time at all talking about the sports genres.
Jason Cutsforth For one thing, most sports titles are only fun if you’re playing in two player mode, and most retro game reviewers are not sitting around with a bunch of buddies that can play head-to-head like they would’ve been back when they were kids.....I think this goes for sports games and for any head-to-head battle type games
Originally, sound was supposed to be incorporated into the Maria Chip design. GCC states they ran out of time, so they opted for a sound chip on each game cartridge board. They attempted to produce their own low cost/high performance sound chip. Unfortunately, Atari sold in July '84 and the "Mini Gumby" sound chip never came to fruition.
Great review. This really is the greatest ultimate review of the Atari 7800.
Another AWESOME video dude! Keep up the great work! These classic video game consoles bring back memories miss the good old days!
Wow tht zelda looked great on the 7800 I got one of these in 86 than the nes in xmass 88 it had a copy of nes power only way I remember the yr lol
Thanks again for this instructive video!
I appreciate that. Thank you very much for watching.0
You have to use two 2600 joysticks with the stick stands for Robotron.
John Hancock's 7800 Robotron double VCS joystick setup is on point: ruclips.net/video/zJ4TT5ZjNwM/видео.html
Amazing deep dive into this weird console. I had no idea the hardware was so "old" when it was mass released.
Nice review Tyler! Even more psyched than ever to be acquiring an Atari 7800 in the not too distant future.
Akari on Atari.... Yeah because we couldn't afford a Nintendo and we had this store called Ames that was going out of business we ended up getting one for Christmas and of course all the 7800 games were cheap and then several years later I was able to get a bunch of these games from big lots for next to nothing.
What's crazy is that there is for Android an updated 3D version of ninja golf.. I don't know if iOS has it.
But it takes the concept of ninja golf from the 7800 and puts it in a modern 3D golf game.
they've added more features too like you have to collect coins to buy upgrades and stuff but it's a worthy sequel I feel
I got a 7800 for Xmas 86. I was only 6 yo but I really enjoyed the system for a few years until NES Action Pack Xmas 88.
If you liked arcade games 7800 had some really good ports of what we're even older games back then. Many of them improvements over the home computer versions.
It didn't get a whole lot better than that making it difficult to complete with it's rivals.
Being a fan of the really good arcade ports because of memories of Chuck E Cheese and playing arcades at the store, malls, and gas stations I think 7800 is a really cool system.
It made some of the older titles cool again and gave us some of the better versions also.
I liked how they still used a stick also. I was never a fan of gamepads.
I never owned one back in the day. A few years back, though, I played 7800 Asteroids at a Retrogaming Convention and had to add a 7800 to my collection. I bought a Composite-modded unit off EBAY, and have feasted on both classic carts and AtariAge home brews ever since.
The 7800 beat the NES on the most meaningful point there is. Namely, it had “real” controllers, and you never had to blow on the carts to make them work.
Mario was over-rated.
I use a Genesis pad and the Seagull78 adapter. The adapter is only needed for the 2 button games, all 1 button games work with the Genesis controllers right away. Same with 2600.
I've never been a big fan of the joystick controllers, so this is a major plus for me.
Good narration. Love your voice. Good stories👍👍
Best review of the console on the whole of RUclips! Kudos to you my friend
“ If you do successfully make it to the top of the tower, you are rewarded with a bonus level where you shoot some fish. “
- Player One Start
...also, this might be the MOST video game thing I’ve ever heard. :)
When I was a kid my small hands were able to use the 7800 joystick perfectly, but as an adult it's difficult
my first gaming system was the 7800. great memories
I know this vid is a couple years old, but I feel the need to comment anyway haha. Loved my 7800, so many good games, with amazing at the time graphics. I played mine to death haha. Love your vid!
Thanks great video well presented, I never had this console but did have an Atari 400 then 800 then 130XE was a serious enthusiast back in the day! Did Lucasfilm port all 4 titles to the 7800 as rescue on Fractalus was a classic
They didn't; the remaining three - Rescue on Fractalus, Koronis Rift and Eidolon - were released for home computers only, as far as I know. And I still clearly remember C64 and SInclair guys (my classmates at the time) shitting their pants in envy, when I was showing them these three hand in hand with Ballblazer. E.g. the C64 version of Eidolon was much slower, and by that I mean by some 30%, making it frustrating to play.
BTW I had an Atari 800 XL, later upgraded with 256 kB (for a total of 320 kB), QMeg OS and TT-DOS - all modded / build in and switcheable on the go - which made my Atari extra powerful and usable for almost all tasks (I mean productivity apps here) just fine well past the 8-bit days of computing. If I recall correctly, I gave it up only around '96 / '97 in favour of an IBM PC clone; and yeah, I still miss the old days in some ways.. ;-)
3 games off the top of my head that sound great on the 2600 are Pac-Man 8k, the currently WIP of Galaga, and mappy. The 2600 can produce appealing sounds if they are done right, not everyone can make the 2600 sing.
The 2600 sound chip is literally missing notes. It CAN'T produce necessary pitches to complete a music scale. Additionally, it can only produce two sounds at once. Pacman 8K does an excellent job working around this, as only a couple notes are off key, and only two voices are needed (siren and eating sound) at a time. Some notes are substituted with noise, like the music in Mr. Do's Castle. Galaga, Mappy, and Pitfall II use additional chips on three cartridge. In these cases, the TIA is only handling basic sound effects.
I remember some warehouse in the late 90s having a really basic website (I feel like it had an Irish name?) but they had new shrinkwrapped Atari 7800 games they were selling for just something like 75 cents each. I got one of each (maybe 20 or so games) that they had but then threw the boxes away.
Corby Ziesman Wow, that is insane. Crazy to think that wouldn’t happen today. Don’t feel bad about the boxes, we all did it back then. Thanks for sharing.
Other 7800 racing games: Motorpsycho, Fatal Run (sort of).
Thanks, I learned of those a bit too late for this video, however I will address these in the 8 Bit War video.
The 7800 was SOOOO much better than the 2600. I wish it got more love in the retro nostalgia community.
naah it was only slighty better. The colecovision and the 5200 were actually sooo much better minus the controller which Ive never had a problem with but Ive noticed the retrogamer community has.
Motor Psycho & Fatal Run could also be considered "racing titles" in addition to Pole Position 2...
Good video overall!
Now I know what I will do for the next hour, and I'm excited about it :-)
I LOVED digdug,didn't realize what I had with my 7800. I just sold it like 3 years ago when I was string out for 15 bux and had about 15 games and 4 controls. Kinda regret it now
It's awesome seeing a 7800 review. Not something you see all the time. Technically these three systems were the 8 bit war, but you had a lot of crossover with the 16 bit PC Engine starting to beat the Famicom in Japan, and then had the 16 bit Genesis/Mega Drive (I can never get used to saying Mega Drive, it's always a Genesis to me) released, which they damn well let you know with 16 BIT written in Gold or Silver on the console. But the way I look at it is, the 16 bit generation/war didn't start until Nintendo said so, with the release of their Super Famicom/SNES. Another great video though, I'm really enjoying all of these, and looking forward to the 8 Bit war where it looks like you have some comparisons and what not.
It's kind of sad that Atari went from being kings of the industry with the 2600, to this 7800 that quite frankly, especially back in the day, was just like a 5200 with a working controller. They then overcompensated and thought they could do a 64 bit system with the Jaguar, and the even more disappointing CD add-on (and yes I'm a degenerate and own one). As much of a bomb that the Jaguar was, it was pretty much due to the two different CPUs, Tom and Jerry, each with 32 bit capability, being notoriously difficult to program for, so unfortunately no developers took full advantage of their full capabilities, leading to games looking not much different then games that could run on the SNES. At the same time though, Wolfenstein, Doom and Alien vs. Predator, are pretty solid titles, and I play them on the Jaguar from time to time. The big knock on Doom is that there's no music, but other than that it's pretty much a near perfect port, so if you want to play Doom at home, playing it on the Jaguar, while admittedly getting used to the gigantor controller, is the way to go. Just play some music while playing, maybe Metallica or System of a Down in my case, as I feel it suits the game, but people into some more heavy stuff might want to play something like Slayer in the background, but that's just always been a little to heavy for my taste.
I see like 6 gold carts and at least one blue cart in the background there. lol nice
in an alternate universe, the Master System, 7800, and NES were all on equal footing in the market, allowing for the 7800 to live on longer with more original games. And in another universe we got the Atari Entertainment System instead. I feel that the system didn't get a chance to truly shine as a great step forward from the 2600 and a revision of the 5200. The homebrew for the 7800 is fantastic as well and I hope to see more of it.
Mario Bros. came out on the 2600 before the NES even existed! Now there's a shocker! Speaking of which, when you say you don't enjoy this game, you may consider trying out the 2600 version if you have not done so. It's actually quite fun! The gameplay is very smooth and streamlined, unlike more authentic versions of the game.
I really think the 5200's lack of backwards compatibility as a complaint is ultimately bogus, not that people didn't say that but rather that there was no basis of comparison to expect it really. Did 8-tracks fit into cassette decks no, did Beta tapes or LDs work in your VHS player no, did most computer software work on newer models from the same company no. Easiest solution for bitd, power strip and AV switch box by Atari, keep both consoles hooked up ijs.
Unmodified 7800 design pretty much tells the whole story, seemed like no matter who was in charge this was the typical stance, why we never saw a second joystick design for most of the Atari consoles like the 5200 for example lol. Just baffling how the EU got gamepads and NA didn't when you consider how much more popular the NES was in NA who they were competing with and that the EU heavily used home style joysticks across the board for all their computer platforms and how unpopular the NES was there. O_o???
Kind of seems like a dick move pushing increased RAM onto the cart or developer side rather than just matching the system memory of the previous 5200. Same with the POKEY aspect, you can put thousands to millions of chips into the carts but you can't put one into the console, we need a cart pass-through adapter to fix the 7800 sound for good.
I forgive the RF given the time, didn't use Composite on NES till post Y2K era, but Jaguar with RF oof that was bad heh. That aside the graphic chip Maria is pretty good which homebrew developers have shown off and being able to play on 2600 games on it with no fuss is excellent. :D Don't like that style of joystick at all but the 7800 is the most comfortable one imo.
I know it was a cost matter but really a high score saving option was really something that should have been there through that whole era of home gaming. No brainer accessory by 1980 minimum.
Funny enough in my area I just can't find many original 7800 carts that I might as well get some new homebrew from AtariAge. ;)
Built for fixed screen arcade games which it does best. If it had composite and POKEY on board it would have aged better. Not sure it was fit for modern games with scrolling which will be slow with no hardware support. 7800 Asteroids is superb - best home port ever.
The 7800’s initial release was delayed for several years due to legal issues & mgmt turnover, allowing competitors to catch up graphics-wise. Ultimately it was released with a sound chip designed exclusively for 2600 compatibility, which is why almost all the games sound terrible....plus the controllers were uncomfortable and awkward.
Patsfan 4life GCC the designers of the console were never paid by Warner so they still held the rights to it when Atari Corp was formed. It took two years of legal wrangling between GCC, Atari Corp and Warner before it could be released.
@@JesterEric solid info!
For accessories you could mention the roller controller (i.e., the track ball controller). It was the only way to beat or break 1000000 points for the games xvious and Solaris, at least for me.
Enjoy watching your old school gaming vids 👍
You never played Dig Dug or Joust before you started collecting? They were extremely common in the arcades here in the UK. On the other hand, Food Fight was very, very, VERY rare here, so much so that I only found it in one arcade. Again, like Congo Bongo, it was in an arcade in Weymouth. It's a personal favourite of mine, and occupies a place in my Top 5 classic arcade games.
I don't remember ever seeing one of these in any of the stores, although when it came out I was either knee-deep in my first Amiga or still hanging on with my C64. Seems like a fairly capable system and many of the arcade ports are quite good!
Hills Dept Store. TOYS R US, and Kay Bee Toys were the places to get Atari post crash oh yeah Sears catalogs in the early 90s may bee liquidators and big lots cleared them out, at 3 to 4 bucks a game and 30 bucks a system
@@petewillson205 I remember the Toys R Us near me had a huge bin when you first walked into the store that had hundreds and hundreds of various cartridges (no boxes) for $3 to $5 each. They were also selling the Coleco Adam Computer System for less than $100. I didn't have much money as a kid, but years later I bought a Vectrex at Service Merchandise (remember those?) for $49 plus tons of games for only $8 each.
I'm not a huge fan of the game, but the 7800 version of Xevious is so much better than the NES version.
If the PAL controller had been the one used in non-PAL regions I believe the console might have had better luck.
Good review. I do enjoy your review. The Nintendo games, Donkey Kong, DK Jr., and Mario Bros, are not arcade accurate at all. They match the NES version more closely, which missed a LOT of arcade nuances. These nuances were not minor either. Scoring, collision detection, enemy movements, and other aspects were all different from the arcade. It's even missing an entire screen on DK. I appreciate preserving the proper enemy names in DK Jr., as many would just call the nitpickers, "birds." I do wish the original Ms Pac-Man names were also used: dots, energizers, and monsters. These were the arcade terminologies.
Another cool note is that the 7800 Maria chip was engineered by the company (GCC) that actually created Ms Pac-Man (or Crazy Otto). They were also the programmers of the 7800 version of Ms Pac-Man. With that said, the monster logic is still not arcade accurate. It's just kind of cool.
Thanks for your entertaining reviews. I enjoy the insight you offer to the time and context of the competition.
Grrrreat video, i saw an hour play time and was thinking hell no, watched the whole thing. New sub to your channel, keep it up. Excited to see the comparison to the SMS and NES.
Awesome, thank you!
I love this channel!!!
You can use both controllers on Robotron to get the dual stick action.
I am so curious about this console... I loved my 2600 growing up, and this just feels like that, but better. The homebrew scene on it is interesting, and I feel it's a console that I will get into if the price is right, especially as it can play my 2600 library too... Also, it can be modded not only for composite, but also S-Video (a mod I already did on my 2600jr, amd was SOOOOO worth it!!), but I remember reading it can be modded for RGB, which being in Europe is something I can take full advantage of thanks to the SCART standard. Definitely keeping my eyes open. Great video!!
Andrea Woodvine the French 7800 has a scart output
The Robotron: 2084 two controller matter is better these days with the advent of 3D printers as more cradle brackets can be produced worldwide rather than the DIY tape and block of wood option lol.
I added composite several years ago...it is an easy upgrade when following instructions and I am not good at soldering. I bought one of these in later 80s and thought it was a great machine and still do. The European version controller pad kicks on the North American joystick.
Nice! Thanks for sharing
Great Content, Really enjoyed the in depth info and nostalgia! Thanks and keep up the good work.
Man I loved that 2600 song way better
I added composite to mine too...it was too bad that Jack really had little cash for extra RND for this beast and he wanted to keep cartridges as small as possible, so games were skimpier and less detailed than what this console could output. I wish the European controller was released in North America for this machine. It is too bad that they released a sound chip that was released originally in 1977.
This may come as a surprise...the Atari 7800 and NES hardware are evenly matched. Both possess their strengths and weaknesses. The “Power” of the NES, comes from the extra “chips”, added to games, to boost performance. Another huge factor - the NES was fully funded and supported, by Nintendo, in every way. Sounds obvious, right? This is in stark contrast, to how Atari(Corp.) handled the 7800.
There was a motorbike racing game on the 7800. Also a racer called Fatal run.
Excellent review! Loved it.
Centipede (also Astroids) on 7800 also have the option to play 2 player alternating/co-op/counter-op
This was Atari's Sega Neptune. So cool.
Ron Hubbard made the Thrust theme song? THE Ron Hubbard?!? Lol
The tabs holding the RF shield are twisted by the factory.